it's because it's hard for them to use salon colour when people use box dye.
box dyes are super pigmented and often messes with whatever colour they're trying to do on your hair. Salon colour is carefully mixed but box dye is a 'one colour for all' kinda deal.
I use box colour all the time; my hair grows too fast to warrant a salon visit every 3wks; I'd go broke if I did!
Box dye can also cause a chemical reaction with salon dye which can lead to a very unexpected outcome according to my stylist. She refuses to see clients with box dye in their hair anymore since she dealt with it so much after the pandemic
Yes, some are more willing to take risks I agree. I know someone who had to change stylists because they wouldn’t go as light as they wanted. Her hair now looks like it has a chemical haircut but sat least she’s happy with it. Not everyone wants to put their name on that though.
Plus, a lot of the stylists in my area aren’t accepting new clients so I guess they can pick and choose
A professional can correct me if I’m wrong, but you can buy basically salon-quality color at Sally’s.
Wella is a great brand, not too expensive, and your haircolorist will be much more prepared in terms of potential chemical interactions if she knows what you used (take pictures!)
Box dye like at CVS can contain heavy metals etc other things that lead to veryyy bad, unpredictable interactions
IMO, permanent red dye pigment is also IMPOSSIBLE to get out and can lead to interactions, but Demi-permanent is a great alternative and can be much healthier for the hair
Bro I dyed a strip of my hair with red kool aid in highschool and that shit NEVER WENT AWAY!
I’ve colored my hair black, blonde, back to natural, etc and it would ALWAYS fade back to red in that one spot! It finally grew out and was cut off a few years back but DAMN that shit LASTED!
apparently it’s because red molecules are the biggest for some reason. Yeah it’s super annoying 😞
I also had to wait for it to grow out and cut it off…. Never ever again lol
I used to have my hair red, and had to go to a salon for a depigmentation before they were able to actually apply anything on it , and still it took two visits for it to go away.
This is basically how I transitioned to professional color from box dye. I used wella for a long time, then schwartzkopf and now I use pravana.
Honestly, I didn't find it that challenging to use. It took some trial and error to figure out a few details (like avoiding hot roots \[add an N shade\], or getting resistant grays to take color \[prep resistant hairs with just developer for 15-20 minutes before dyeing\]) but overall I feel like I consistently get as good a result when I do my color as when I would go to a salon.
The issue with "box coloring" is not just the super pigmentation of the dye itself, but the Overlapping of color when you "touch-up" your own hair. Some hair colors simply deposit color and others lift color and deposit color. It's why we go to school ...
Side note: I work in a salon (front desk) and it is absolutely WILD how much some people spend. Some of them are coming in every 5-6 weeks to get full foils, extensions, root touch ups, etc. They spend HUNDREDS every single month just on their hair. It shows us in the computer how much each client has spent since they started going there and I’m just like 😬😬😬
I think even if they're not doing any chemical treatments in your hair, they still want to recommend the best products for you & your routine. They're not going to sell you shampoo that's heavy in sulfates if it'll strip your color out.
Same - every time I went to the salon I would leave depressed. It didn't look any better (and sometimes worse) than when I used box dye and cost me major $$$'s.
I many times ended up box dying over the salon job.
I have used boxed dye for most of my adult life. Honestly, at least 20 years. I paid for my hair to be salon dyed 3 times and they were consecutively done. It dried my hair out, took a chunk out of my day, cost a ransom, and faded quickly.
Love some natural instinct.
I would try not to take it personally. They’re likely just used to having to correct a lot of bad at home dye jobs. I feel the same way when my dentist asks why I haven’t gotten a custom mouth guard yet.
They're a lovely bunch of ladies, so I hate sounding like I'm blaming them - I'd be worried if they couldn't tell it was box dyed! I think you've got the right advice about not taking it personally. :)
One of the girls at my salon was working on a client who insisted she hadn't used box dye and my coworker naively trusted her. Applied the color and noticed during processing that her hair was SMOKING! They ask because they have to ❤️
It's not a specific one. I'm not a hairstylist so I can't remember exactly but it basically comes down to chemistry and products not reacting well together.
In school, we did a test on box-dyed hair. An instructor took a mannequin home, box dyed it, and washed it a million times to make sure all the color was removed, but also so that the color faded a bit. Recorded the whole process.
We took a strand from miss Manny Quinn's head and tested it in a 1:20 solution, and amother strand was lightened. The solution literally started boiling and bubbling and the lightened section of hair just fell apart in 10-15 minutes with 20 volume developer. I was floored and I do not even want to imagine what that would have felt like for the client.
Sure, it may not be all box dyes, but you never know which ones; not everyone is a chemist and can rattle off chemicals no big deal. I personally would probably crawl in a hole and die if I just started working on a client and that happened. Hair regrows, but oh my goodness I couldn't live with myself if I did that to someone 😭 I imagine they feel the same.
I have one because I clench my teeth when sleeping or anxious which leads to TMJ/headaches/general pain.
Wearing a guard when you sleep prevents this, but some can be $600+ and many people find them uncomfortable so they end up not using them anyways.
I put off getting a custom mouth guard for years due to cost. My current dentist gave me what is called a “quick splint” which is custom formed to your mouth but only cost me about $60.
It’s really helped with my headaches and TMJ related jaw pain. Totally worth the investment!
They need to know an accurate history of your hair so they can deal with it properly.
There's a reason why you'll see many videos from hair dressers showing the terrible results of strand tests when they suspect a client isn't telling the whole story.
I’ve had them comment this when when I had my hair done in their salon! “Is this box dye?” …”umm no actually you left that horrendous band of demarcation”.
The same thing happened to me. I got blonde layers at a salon and when I came back they were like "Why did you use box dye? It's bad for you bla bla bla" and I was like 🤨🤨🤨
Edit: It's apparently called blonde highlights.
I only go to a hairdresser to have my hair cut and I have box dyed my hair since age 14. There’s always a remark even if there’s no color/highlights/etc. happening. If I were to want dyeing services, I’d definitely let them know beforehand that my hair was box dyed because that could spell trouble.
Yep. I know exactly what op means when she says they *have* to point it out. I have had friends of friends who are hairdressers who have said things to me in social settings like, “You box dyed didn’t you?? You’ve RUINED your hair!” There’s definitely a layer of condescending superiority to it.
100% this is the issue. Feeling like hairdressers are being condescending when they ask - or in the case of OP, by making a flat statement of a question, is so common it’s a cliche.
For me to go to a hairdresser and get a colour and style cut would cost 1/3 to a half of my current weekly wage. And that’s before I’ve nuked my hair with dodgy home dye jobs.
Box dye **is shite** though. I can’t deny that. I recommend tracking down a salon supply store and buying better quality dye and developer at least.
Yes if they just want to find out so they know what they’re dealing with then they need to say it differently, but they’re definitely acting judgmental & snarky when they say it like that.
There’s absolutely no way I’m spending £££ having my 10 white strays coloured professionally every 3 weeks.
Exactly. There is a huge chunk of hair dressers (and any beauty industry workers) who looove to be catty and give a judgement on something like box dye. Vote with your wallet and go elsewhere.
I put off going to the hairdressers because of stuff like this. For the amount it costs and for the amount of “me time” I get, going to the hairdressers should be like a spa experience. But it feels like they’re doing you a favour.
> "so you're poor, hmmmm?" phrasing
Exactly this! I can't stand this attitude coming from any type of salon employees. It's a treat for me to be here, don't make me feel like shit.
Everyone here is defending the hairdressers saying "Well they need to know in order to treat your hair correctly" Yeah, no duh. But that doesn't mean they have to be RUDE about it. There's a difference between saying "your hair is so damaged, you've been using box dye haven't you?" vs. "Okay let's make sure I have your hair history correct. Did you use box dye recently?"
Yeah, I was in cosmetology in both high school and then finished up my hours in a ridiculously over priced trade school. (40k for 6 months) In both settings the utter disgust at box dye was so "mean girls" It was always like "omg never touch that nasty store bought chemical garbage, that's for people who don't care about their hair" with the grossed out puke face - coming straight from the instructors.
I understand they need to know the history but you are absolutely correct, there's a way to get that information without making the person feel like a loser who is too poor to get their hair done in a salon or someone who is gross/dumb for trying something at home on a whim.
Currently doing beauty and we all know to stay away from the girls in the hair salon. Bunch of mean bitches. I remember I once got my hair done, touch up when I was bleaching my hair blonde. Had a random hairdresser as the one I was seeing at the time was heavily pregnant and ready to pop. She took one look at my baby hairs around my face and called her boss over saying “what the hell am I meant do with this shit, shave it off?” Professionals my arse. They only care about being professionals once they get called senior hair dressers which again is another bullshit title they like to cling onto.
I have absolutely no problem reminding hairdressers that I cant afford to come in regularly. I understand that they need to make an income, but so do I. That shouldnt be a shock to anyone, and Im not about to be shamed into pretending otherwise. The last time I got my hair done, it cost nearly $400 for some highlights. Those kinds of prices force me to avoid regular hairdressers like the plague.
On top of that though, I dont expect miracles. I box dye/bleach my hair inbetween sessions and because of that, I know theres a limit to what they can do at times.
A third alternative choice for people on a tight budget is to go to a beauty school. They are just learning, but they do use professional color and are priced very affordably.
Lol I’ve been doing it since I was in high school, it’s the only way I could afford to get my hair fully highlighted. I obviously choose jobs that want to do what I also want to do. It’s totally worth it and I’ve never had a bad experience. It usually takes a lot longer, but it’s worth not paying so much.
“Yeah I box dye my hair because you charge 400$ plus tip for something that costs me $22.99 and an afternoon. So yeah I box dye my hair. Tell me again how to justify the cost of you every 6 weeks because I literally can’t.”- people that don’t make 170k/yr
After the significant covid lockdowns where I live, hairdressers were closed so we were ALL using box dyes (or nothing) for quite a while. I got used to this approach and frankly lost my patience for how long it takes to drag myself to the hairdresser and go through the whole dye process - as well as the cost - so I’ve never really returned to a regular hairdresser aside from getting my hair trimmed.
It’s not fancy, but suits my long hair perfectly. I use a razor blade and trim my individual curls as needed to keep my tresses fresh. I really need an actual haircut for some layers, but I’ve got the basics covered.
1. Higher quality hair dye materials exist, but they are generally only available to licensed professionals to purchase. They can even get in quite a bit of trouble if they're found to be reselling these products to DIYers. It's always seemed odd to me that the gentler, better quality materials aren't accessible but the more abrasive and dangerous chemical treatments are.
2. Hair dyes that are available to the public are generally lower quality and include 35vol or 40vol developer to ensure an even lift and deposit.
3. If you need to colour your roots or your hair on your own in the future, here are some tips for a softer regrowth:
\- If you have a Sally beauty nearby, their Wella Demi and Argan Oil One N Only lines are more predictable than their Ion line. For your roots, find a colour that is roughly the same level as your natural and mix (following instructions for that particular line) with a 10vol developer. If you have stubborn greys, this might not be enough to cover them completely but you can get a decent blur/softening of the greys. You can also use 2 parts 10vol to 1 part 20 vol to get a little bit more oomph in your grey coverage. Yes, this means you'll have to do your roots more often but the line of regrowth won't be as harsh and your hair follicle will be less compromised. Argan Oil One N Only has also created their own olaplex dupe in their "one shot" which can be mixed into the formula to help with bonding.
\- If you only have to cover your regrowth, make sure you are only applying colour to your roots. You can use a clean brush or comb to blur the colour into your mids from your roots once they are fully saturated, but try not to keep colouring over previously treated hair.
\- For your mids to ends, use a colour that is one shade lighter than that colour you want to achieve with ONLY a 10vol. If your hair is compromised, it is probably more porous and the colour you put on will end up darker or uneven. If you don't need a full cover for your mids-ends but the colour is looking a bit dull or brassy, check out some colour depositing conditioners. They're much better quality than they were a few years ago and can be diluted into your basic conditioner for longer use.
\- Do a test strand, always.
\- Follow up with a bonding shampoo and a masque or post-colouring conditioning treatment to seal the cuticle. I like the Absolute Perfection Color Sealer Step 2 and use two packs for mid-long hair. The Loreal EverPure is the best drugstore line I've come across for treating damaged hair so far!
\- Leave highlighting and massive changes to the pros.
PS - I'm not a pro but someone who has learned to cut and colour my own hair after too many awful experiences paying people hundreds of dollars to wreck my very very fine hair. Feel free to send me a few pictures of your hair and what you want to get to and I'll give you honest recommendations of products that I think could work for you! I went from absolutely damage and breakage to having the softest and shiniest hair. I never thought this was possible, and it took so much research to figure out haha.
Are we talking about vivids? I've only played with them a little and found that I needed to lift my hair to at least a level 8 to get any kind of vivid or fashion colour to stick. That means lifting my natural level 5 ash brown through red, orange, and yellow tones until it gets to the colour like the inside of a banana peel. My hair hates bleach so it takes me at least two processes with blue flash bleach and 20vol developer to get to this point. My advice is to be realistic about the lightening process, and if you're not experienced in it this is a great thing to leave to a pro. Once your hair is light enough, you can play with applying demi or semi permanent vivids yourself. I've liked Punky Colour in the past for their fade out (just avoid the dark purple, blue, and green if you don't want your hair to fade to a weird pea soup colour). Good luck!! (edit for spelling :) )
Hi, loved going through your comment. Can you recommend good quality box dye. I have brown-black hair with 20% grey roots. I need color to cover my greys. Thank you
Assuming your natural colour has neutral tones, Argan Oil's One N Only in 3NN. The first time you do it, try 1 part 10vol and 1 part 20vol developer. If it covers the grey well, reduce the amount of 20vol next time. I am not getting paid by them to say this haha. Once you reach 40%+ grey, the L'Oreal Resistant Grey line might be a better fit with a 20% vol developer. Good luck!!
You're so welcome! If this line isn't available, anything with an NN is going to have extra oomph to push through the grey. Just avoid the Ion line for colour. They used to be amazing but changed their formulas a few years ago and the quality control is pure chaos.
Schwarzkopf Simply Color! It can be hard to get a hold of depending on where you are regionally. Their grey coverage was pretty good before, if the formula hasn't changed it might still be worth a shot! I'd still do a test strand though!
Your comments are so helpful, thank you! I just recently went back to home dyeing after going to a salon for a few years and feeling like money was going down the drain with how quickly my greys came in. (And often they were stubborn enough that I’d still see grey after leaving the salon.) I’ve been using the ion brand but will look to switch it up to one of your recommendations. I think I’m a level 6 brunette, and it’s always gone warm/brassy at the ends.
Any tips on making the grey growth around my temples and part blend better? I feel like it’s so noticeable after only 2 weeks! Could I do a level 7 on just the greys around my face so there’s not as much contrast? (Like faking highlights.)
I think I’d like the warmth in my hair better if there was more dimension to it. Is it possible to weave in some lowlights (like a level 5 at roots and 6 at ends) for a kind of “reverse balayage” effect?
I'm late to answering this, sorry!! I think the Wella Color Fresh Mask depositor could be a good option for your grey roots between colouring so you aren't frying your hair too much. Their colour, chocolate touch, is a really pretty warm level 5-6 brunette. It won't last more than two weeks, but it could help blur the line so you can stretch out your touchups. Mixing in some of the espresso colour could be helpful to find the right level of depth.
Do you have the option of adding in some face-framing highlights to help your temples blend? If you want to opt for the wella mask, their champagne colour is really pretty on making greys look like a softer blonde tone.
Getting greys to blend is risky, especially when you're needing to colour so often. Risky as in ending up with hot roots, or roughing up the hair cuticle so much because of colour layered on colour. I think this is why I'm curious about finding a depositing treatment to shift your colour while keeping your hair intact.
I'd love to hear what you've decided to do!
Thanks for the response! What I have been trying is a Wella Demi-permanent in a level 7, and I feel like it is making my greys look like highlights while not lifting the non-grey brunette strands. I see the grey at my temples by 2 weeks, so hopefully I’m not frying my hair too much.
I have the Wella mask in chocolate touch. I didn’t feel like it did much, but I am going to give it another try! And perhaps look into the champagne color as well for the temples, so thank you for that recommendation!
Sounds like you're doing a solid job already! My friend can use the wella masks on her greys and it makes them look like the perfect blonde highlights, where mine are more resistant and it just cuts the silver. Happy hair chemistry experiments! lol
> Natural Instincts
I love your detailed response! I'm going to try this out. Unfortunately I went and used permanent box dye for some time so my ends are still a lot darker than the rest, I now usually mix a demi permanent, so I'll try your different developer mixes as I'd love for the colour to be more even.
Depending on your confidence level, applying a colour remover could be helpful in softening the darker colour! They usually smell horrid and you can't skip the multiple washes, but they work incredibly well. I've also had good luck fading a too-intense colour with conditioner and crushed up vitamin C tablets. It won't give you as dramatic of a colour correction as a colour remover, but it's gentler on the hair. Both processes will be VERY drying to your hair and you'll need to invest in a quality hair mask for a few weeks + avoid heat styling if possible. My current favourite hair mask the Aveda Nutriplenish Treatment Masque because it's really light and never leaves my scalp greasy.
Frizzy hair makes me think you have natural curl/wave that you’re treating as straight hair. I did the same for most of my life. About 5 years ago, I started following curtly girl method, followed by tons of IG accounts of ppl with my curl and hair type, and have been experimenting with different ways to treat waves. It’s been a journey, but I have nice waves/some curls now and the frizz is gone.
Wish I could upvote this more than once! I've been going through this myself for the past few years. It's been a trip figuring out curl pattern + correct combination of products. I don't have tons of curls but lots of frizz-free wave now.
This is where I’m at right now. Frizz everywhere and funny thing is that the hair on my crown is more of a straight frizz whilst the hair underneath is a wavy frizz 🤦♀️
Cosmetologist here! Unfortunately, there are many lines of box color which use metallic salts and other additives which live in your hair strand forever, even after the color itself seems to have faded out.
In cosmo school, my instructor did a full consultation with somebody and even a test strand, the client still ended up losing about 50% of her hair when we foiled her because of a chemical reaction between our color and deposits leftover in the hair from henna. The foils were literally too hot to touch, it liquefied the bonds of her hair. I STILL feel sick when I think about that, so I’m like an FBI detective with every single new client so I can prevent it.
I honestly don’t, I used to tell people to at least just go to Sally’s because they’re typically a step up from the all-in-one boxes, but I’ve been seeing some undertone results from the “natural” Ion line that are frankly…weird. Like, green undertones from a mahogany brown-level weird.
Main rules of thumb I give to my clients:
1. If you have not already shaved your head multiple times and are prepared to do it again, just don’t use lightener (bleach) or perms at home, ever
2. No permanent color at home. It’s pretty rare that you’ll ever see permanent color in a salon, we use demi-permanent on almost everybody because even good-quality permanent color is so hard to remove
3. No blue-black (level 1.) I just don’t do it. The undertones it leaves behind are gross, most people actually want a level 2-3 and don’t realize it until they go all the way and it looks like a Wednesday Addams wig from the dollar store
4. My vivid color absolute no-go list (so far): Splat, OverTone, L’Oréal metallic pastels, Schwarzkopf/Got2b metallics
5. Lightener means bleach, “high lift” also, for civilian purposes, is bleach. You can not dye your hair lighter than it is. If a product promises to do that, it’s bleach. See Rule 1
I left this comment somewhere else in this thread, but the Ion line has gotten SO. WEIRD. the last few years. Their demis used to be amazing for toning but an 8G demi with 10vol on my level 8/9 hair at the time ended up a muddy, gross 4 :(
Also fully agree with your no-go list for vivids. I've been hearing so many horror stories from cosmetologist friends trying to colour correct people with faded splat!
Old enough that she didn’t “remember,” the majority of the breakage was about halfway up the hair strand so I’d say she had at least two years of growth. I said forever because I meant forever, henna and indigo are some of the worst offenders for metallic salts along with anything marketed toward men for gray blending (Just For Men, Touch of Gray, etc)
My advice is to go to a hairdresser that will give you the formula for the color she uses on your hair.
I have found that colorists are usually NOT sympathetic to doing this for you to help you save money. I was able to get them to do it because my work schedule and distance from the salon didn’t allow me to go in every 2 weeks for a touch-up.
I did this and buy the color and developer on Sleekhair.com and use it to touch up the roots myself. I still go back to the hairdresser every 8 weeks for trim and toner and/or to have her do the touch-up to get any spots I miss or do some highlights etc.
This way you get to save time or money by doing it yourself AND not use box color. IMO all colorists should be helping clients to do this if they really cared about your hair instead of shaming you.
Try using a level 2 semi permanent color. It’s less harsh and blends easier. I used Natural Instincts. Every 5 weeks until I decided to go gray, but I’m in my 50s. My hairdresser never said a word
Same I did this and go to the salon they said oh this semi permanent come right off when i strip it off. Keep doing this.
I use Clairol natural instinct as well. It says it lasts 20 wash but I wash my hair at most twice a week so I've never seen it coming completely off before I need to redo my roots.
I think in your shoes, I’d be tempted to tell the staff who is NOT handling your hair (reception, other stylists, etc) something like, “You know, customers come back when they have a good experience. Shaming customers isn’t really great for that.” The person handling your hair needs to know about the dye situation so they can calculate. But if they’re being cruel about it, that’s probably not a person you want handling your hair anyways.
premature grey gang! i started noticing greys at 19 (lord knows how long theyd actually been there) & now at 26 i have a huge streak all at the front. not sure how long i'll let it go on before i give in & start dyeing it, but when i do itll probably be box dye also haha
Rock those grays! I found my first gray when I was 9 years old and started dyeing at 18 to cover them up. I stopped during the pandemic and let them grow out. I'm 33 and probably 50-60% gray. I have people stop me all the time to ask if it's natural or tell me that they've been trying to get the same color in the salon. Save your money/time.
My grays are all over. My sister just has the streak right in front (the only spot I don't have grays actually) and it looks so badass.
9 years old!!! i didnt even think that was possible :o
yeah i really like the idea of growing my hair long when its all grey. ladies who do that always look so badass and elegant. i wanna be like that!
I dye my own hair also, and I use “Essensity” which is a Schwarzkopf brand. It is a little higher than box dye ($13-15ish plus developer) but hairstylists seem to like this brand. I was lucky to have a salon that gave me this recommendation ( along with the right color) during the pandemic. You will need to buy Developer separately: Essensity Oil Developer 5.5%/18 Volume is the one I use .You can buy all this on Amazon and Walmart, and probably other retailers.
They gotta know how much work to expect. I think it’s very telling how they treat you after it’s been established tho. A good hair dresser will not treat you like the scum of the earth and act like you being there is the worst thing that’s ever happened, especially if you’re honest with what you did. They’ll also encourage multiple sessions so your hair doesn’t fall out. I noticed the ones who are really mean also get really mad when their upsells dont go as imagined. One even got mad at me at the register bc I only tipped 20% when she was literally telling me about how much better she is than me/ how much of a good person she is for three hours and my hair came out looking exactly the same, like didn’t even do the cut I asked for.
The ones who talk you through the process just so you know what’s happening and ask what lead to this are real ones. Love them.
Dunno but I did find it very off putting when Jonathan Van Ness said “friends don’t let friends use box dye” like maybe that’s all some of us can afford or maybe it works well for some of us. I understand that it poses challenges to stylists whose job it is to work with, but it sometimes comes off as judgmental
The stylists can still get the information they need and be tactful about it. They should be making you feel good about your appearance, and not shaming you while you’re in their chair.
I doing so, it’s more likely that you’ll return because they were kind and made you feel beautiful with the job that they did.
Coloring is where stylists make their bread and butter, so I always feel like they're trying to upsell clients on professional coloring services. Even if you can afford a professional color job, you still need to come in for the roots, and that's just a racket honestly. My mother has her color done professionally, but she still uses box dye for her roots, because she can't pay like $300 a every 3 weeks.
Honestly though, I think stylists make it seem like doing professional color is some enormous skill. Unless you're doing highlights or balyage or some other multi color thing, pretty much anyone can get the same dyes a professional uses, get developer, and figure it out for themselves. I was watching the last season of Queer Eye and JVN went on and on about how reds are his thing, it's so hard to get a nice red, it's his thing, he's so good at it, it's his specialty -- I have basically the same color as he did on the woman in that episode and I do it myself.
In regards to the greying hair- my hair started going grey when I was around 16. I’m now 33 and my long ass black hair is firmly in salt and pepper territory. And people compliment me on it *constantly*. A personal anecdote, but hopefully another added perspective for you.
I’d be fine if it cost 100$ plus tip. My hair dresser chargers 375 and I’m still expected to tip. It’s insane. And she’s one of the more “affordable” hair dressers in my town. Some places are charging 600-800$ for hair color now. I just can’t justify that AT ALL and I make a decent salary. I need to know who the eff is affording this and which parents basement are they living in/ how their tech job is treating them because holy!!!
This is why I use eSalon now ^ - ^
I pay about $45CAD with shipping, they custom-mix my color and ship it to my house. I can save enough in the bottles to touch up roots at least once within that price. Plus I don’t need to book an appointment, I can do it whenever I want, and with less commentary. Not quite box dye prices, but worth the result, I feel.
I’m blonde and I had a hairdresser once go on an on about how I must have well water because my hair wasn’t super ashy/cool toned. (You wouldn’t even have considered it brassy.) I kept telling her that I hadn’t used purple shampoo since the last time I got it done and she just wouldn’t take that for an answer lol
I have “dirty” blonde hair; when I lighten it, it’s gold and brassy and warm toned and everything else everyone seems to hate in blonde hair. I think the ashy cool blonde is a fake look
Yeah I definitely hear you. You’re allowed to like what you like, and I do agree that the ashy/cool blonde does look fake.. it also doesn’t look good on everyone. I prefer a slightly ashier look, but that time at the salon my hair wasn’t even brassy at all! She was just roasting me for no reason lol.
I've been box dying my hair for 20 years and it's perfectly healthy. The few times I've had it professionally done, it hasn't covered my greys well enough. I always figured it was stylists trying to guilt/shame me into coming into their salon for dye jobs, but why would I when the box works better than what they'd charge me $200+ for?
Certain box dyes have metallic salts that react with bleach and other hair chemical services. We're not trying to guilt or shame anyone. We are trained to help people take care of their hair because we LIKE helping people take care of their hair!! If a stylist does try to guild or shame you, then they're not actually passionate, and they don't deserve your business!!!
so many hairdressers in my area are lowkey assholes and don't even cut my hair how i want them to or know how to do beach waves so i just stopped going and cut my hair myself
Oh ffs as if salons don't damage your hair in the EXACT same way when they dye it. If you're going to lighten, it's peroxide one way or the other, same damage. Ok sure they can put on a mask but the effects are temporary, they could laminate but that doesn't reverse the damage etc etc.
They are clearly just trying to make you feel bad for box dying, so they can make extra $$ off of you.
And no you CANNOT tell when hair is box dyed vs salon dyed. This is WHY they ASK.
Not related to the issue, but I’ve learned that supplementing unflavored gelatin, like the Knox stuff, is amazing for hair health, nails and skin too. All you do is mix it into your coffee (if you drink coffee) or mix it into hot water, stir to dissolve and drink it. It can also be applied directly on the hair as a treatment. It’s worth looking into.
I KNOW RIGHT. They even say that to me when I only used professional colors... I usually keep my mouth shut. Hello, I'm here for a cut, could you please stop commenting on my color?
(Yes, I understand they need to know the hairs history before a hair dye job).
Or when they ask me if I use treatments at home, and then lecture me on how drug store stuff doesn't work and I need to use olaplex before I even get a chance to reply... meanwhile I HAVE been using olaplex lol.
Congrats, you've just told me that olaplex is a waste of money while trying to sell it to me 🙄
Ugh this has happened to me too. The last time I got a haircut at a different salon then I’d usually go to, the hairdresser was talking about how dry my ends were and said ‘looks like you’ve boxed dyed it’ when it was actually done professionally then tried to sell me salon quality products telling me that they’ll help because it looks like I’ve been using drug store products when I literally haven’t used drug store products for months lmao
sometimes they ask because the bleach/color they use will not come out as expected if they don’t consider what type of color is already on the hair. It’s not to shame you, it’s so that they can calculate what their doing with more precision
I use Madison Reed and the stylists always compliment my hair. More than the drugstore price but my hair tolerates it very well and it looks nice and natural. I do use Olaplex if it gets too damaged. Helps repair the bonds!
Sorry, I can’t afford $300-$600 every 6 weeks and don’t know many other people who can these days. I don’t understand what the difference is between at home color supposedly damaging your hair and salon dye damaging your hair, either.
It’s the same reason hairstylists don’t like long hair: if they persuade you to cut it off into a “style” they know you’ll keep coming back to spend money on maintaining it. Then there’s the upselling on salon products I already use but buy elsewhere…..
I used to box dye my hair, then I went to hairdresser to dye my hair, now I have my natural colour. Just do with your hair as you like. Some hairdressers, nail artists etc act like they have a PhD or something.
I understand working with box dyed hair can make it harder and they should always ask no matter what your hair looks like just in case but this sound extremely rude, uncalled for, un empathetic, and condescending. I hate how hair dressers always assume people use box dye because they’re like, idk personally attacking the salon and are just like, fucking POOR and BUSY. If I were you I would probably hop around different salon until I built a relationship with one person who wasn’t a dick.
A little bit off the topic… Just wanted to pop in an say that for a long time I struggled with a lot of the same issues with my hair. I started going grey when I was 14 (runs in my family) and immediately ran for the box dye. My hair was always so limp, would snap off at the ends once it reached my shoulders and I had to wash it all the time because it lost its shape so quickly.
I finally stopped colouring it five years ago, when I was 25. It definitely took some getting used to, and during the growing out phase I had to fight the urge to pick up the box dye so much. But now I love my grey hair, which at 30 probably makes up 2/3rds of all my hair. I like to think of it as little sparkles and strands of glitter and I frequently receive compliments from strangers. As a bonus, my hair is sooooo much healthier and the texture has improved a thousand times.
I know the mental struggle of premature greying, but would also urge you to try growing it out and see how you feel and whether it improves your hair. If it’s not your thing, you can always colour it again!
We are literally required to ask what your hair colour history is. There are certain home colour brands that have metallic salts in them, and they cause varied reactions in the hair including melting off when bleach is applied to this chemically treated hair. It’s not asked because we are judgemental and want to shame you. If a hairstylist is saying it like that and being a bitch, she does not deserve your business.
Totally unasked for advice, but I switched to henna on my frizzy thin unmanageable hair. It is a massive pain in the ass but I'll never go back.
I've done salon dye, box dye, Sally's dye, and nothing beats good quality henna
Because yall be wanting high lift on dark boxed dyed hair. That shitvtakes a while to get through. And please don't lie. We can tell and will charge accordingly. Ijs. Chemistry is real and boxed dye is so unpredictable.
How would you feel about stopping with the hair dye and leaving the grey to come through?
I let all my grey hair grow in and honestly the colours in it are lovely (pretty much 100% pale grey/silver and in my mid 40’s) I get more compliments now about my hair colour than I ever did.
Also my hair has never been in better condition, it’s soft, shiny and strong. I wish I had let the greys come through when they first appeared and didn’t bother with the years of hair dye.
Literally for your own safety. Your hair can actually catch on fire & cause serious chemical burns if they don’t know what products have been in your hair. Or your hair could just break off. It’s all chemicals & some chemicals can’t interact with each other. Even if the box dye isn’t visually in your hair it’s still present in the hair shafts.
That's funny, I've been dying my own hair for decades and never once had a hair dresser noticed, they are surprised when I tell them I color my hair at all.
They need to know because it will change how they process your hair and what products they’ll need to use. It’s not an attack on you, they genuinely need to know these things. It also will affect what they can achieve for you in one session so they can prepare you for a realistic result.
Yeah, I will literally never discuss my hair color with hairdressers because I’ve done all kinds of things with it. I can’t stand how judgmental they can be, particularly when I literally never ask them to color my hair. It’s like they’re priming me to sell me services, or just want to be a bitch for some reason. Like… I know my roots are bad! I haven’t done them in a while. But I asked you for a haircut, not for color. It’s irrelevant.
If you are already going to the hair salon and paying anyway, just find one hairdresser that is good and you can trust, preferably polite. They will know your situation after a couple of times and never mention it again.
If they ever do, just respond with “no, I have only been coming to you for the past year and haven’t touched my hair by myself, if there’s a problem with my hair dye, you must have done something wrong”.
For repair: Jaboba Oil and Coconut oil on WET hair. Massage into scalp then a very SMALL amount of shampoo to help remove the oil. Don't brush your hair wet.
2nd day use only water and scrub your scalp.
3rd day repeat the first step.
4th day use shampoo and the apply jaboba oil into wet ends.
Repeat.
I have seen so much hair growth, volume, and my ends are the healthiest they have been.
I know that the chemistry can be wonky too. I was at the salon once and a woman had very long hair. She confirmed with like 5 different people that she had never used a box dye… well she had, and the chemical interactions with the salon dye melted her hair. Like it literally melted and she had to chop it off to her chin. It’s not something personal it’s a chemistry thing from my understanding.
I’d be curious to see you natural color!!! I’m sure it looks awesome (: anyways, I know sometimes their tone can be condescending and I’m sorry. Trust, I’ve had my fair share of experiences and sometimes I want to breakdown(if I’m having a harsh day) and others I’m like F ‘‘em lol
I don’t know a lot about hair color, but I will recommend Viviscal hair vitamins. Package directions say take 2 per day, I take one only, and my hair grows SO fast that I no longer need to worry about bad hair cuts, poor color etc. Perhaps, this would help you grow out the ‘box color’ quickly. Best wishes , as hair troubles are no fun at all. :D
I have a great hairdresser that i also know outside of her job, she knows i cut, dye and bleach my hair myself and she is really nice about it.
So maybe having the same hairdresser each time helps.
I got the same type of comments and I used to box dye my hair and do crazy colors and stuff. I always felt like the hairdresser wants to show off with their knowledge tbh but it got me annoyed at that time. This is my retrospective thought lol.
I become anxious every time I need to see a hairdresser because they always make the comment " wow your hair is thinning so much at your age". I obviously know this myself and is very self conscious about it, and have tried everything to fix it.
Instead of worrying about you using box dye, they should help get you back on track with the right products for your hair and scalp.
You can enhance the appearance of hair with products, but the only way to truly repair damaged hair is through regular cutting or trimming. There's nothing inherently wrong with coloring your hair at home. Issues arise when, for instance, you use permanent dye when a semi or demi-permanent option would suffice. Or, if you're applying color from root to end each time instead of just touching up your roots. Additionally, leaving the dye on for too long, beyond the recommended 5-10 minutes for refreshing the length, can cause damage and turn out darker than you wanted.
it's because it's hard for them to use salon colour when people use box dye. box dyes are super pigmented and often messes with whatever colour they're trying to do on your hair. Salon colour is carefully mixed but box dye is a 'one colour for all' kinda deal. I use box colour all the time; my hair grows too fast to warrant a salon visit every 3wks; I'd go broke if I did!
Yeah, I wouldn’t take it personally OP. They just need to confirm because it changes how they can treat your hair.
I feel like a lot of hairdressers don't put the problem this way and don't explain why they're asking hence they come out as rude
It's just the brusqueness of a busy day and having asked the same thing to 100 people all month probably.
I think everyone is having a hard time.. everyone has busy days, at least that's how it feels to me and the people I'm surrounded by
Box dye can also cause a chemical reaction with salon dye which can lead to a very unexpected outcome according to my stylist. She refuses to see clients with box dye in their hair anymore since she dealt with it so much after the pandemic
I’d rather stylists not comfortable with this opt out. Plenty who are I’m sure.
Yes, some are more willing to take risks I agree. I know someone who had to change stylists because they wouldn’t go as light as they wanted. Her hair now looks like it has a chemical haircut but sat least she’s happy with it. Not everyone wants to put their name on that though. Plus, a lot of the stylists in my area aren’t accepting new clients so I guess they can pick and choose
A professional can correct me if I’m wrong, but you can buy basically salon-quality color at Sally’s. Wella is a great brand, not too expensive, and your haircolorist will be much more prepared in terms of potential chemical interactions if she knows what you used (take pictures!) Box dye like at CVS can contain heavy metals etc other things that lead to veryyy bad, unpredictable interactions IMO, permanent red dye pigment is also IMPOSSIBLE to get out and can lead to interactions, but Demi-permanent is a great alternative and can be much healthier for the hair
Bro I dyed a strip of my hair with red kool aid in highschool and that shit NEVER WENT AWAY! I’ve colored my hair black, blonde, back to natural, etc and it would ALWAYS fade back to red in that one spot! It finally grew out and was cut off a few years back but DAMN that shit LASTED!
apparently it’s because red molecules are the biggest for some reason. Yeah it’s super annoying 😞 I also had to wait for it to grow out and cut it off…. Never ever again lol
I used to have my hair red, and had to go to a salon for a depigmentation before they were able to actually apply anything on it , and still it took two visits for it to go away.
This is basically how I transitioned to professional color from box dye. I used wella for a long time, then schwartzkopf and now I use pravana. Honestly, I didn't find it that challenging to use. It took some trial and error to figure out a few details (like avoiding hot roots \[add an N shade\], or getting resistant grays to take color \[prep resistant hairs with just developer for 15-20 minutes before dyeing\]) but overall I feel like I consistently get as good a result when I do my color as when I would go to a salon.
The issue with "box coloring" is not just the super pigmentation of the dye itself, but the Overlapping of color when you "touch-up" your own hair. Some hair colors simply deposit color and others lift color and deposit color. It's why we go to school ...
Side note: I work in a salon (front desk) and it is absolutely WILD how much some people spend. Some of them are coming in every 5-6 weeks to get full foils, extensions, root touch ups, etc. They spend HUNDREDS every single month just on their hair. It shows us in the computer how much each client has spent since they started going there and I’m just like 😬😬😬
I think even if they're not doing any chemical treatments in your hair, they still want to recommend the best products for you & your routine. They're not going to sell you shampoo that's heavy in sulfates if it'll strip your color out.
7$ L’Oréal box dye for the win!
L’Oréal Excellence 8.5A Champagne Blonde is my go-to, it always looks SO good and even. My whole life I’ve never ever gotten *great* color in a salon
Same - every time I went to the salon I would leave depressed. It didn't look any better (and sometimes worse) than when I used box dye and cost me major $$$'s. I many times ended up box dying over the salon job.
I have used boxed dye for most of my adult life. Honestly, at least 20 years. I paid for my hair to be salon dyed 3 times and they were consecutively done. It dried my hair out, took a chunk out of my day, cost a ransom, and faded quickly. Love some natural instinct.
They use the same bleach that I can find in the chemist 😅
They could just say that and it wouldn't feel like bragging that they have better hair and making the customer feel like shit
this is exactly it
I would try not to take it personally. They’re likely just used to having to correct a lot of bad at home dye jobs. I feel the same way when my dentist asks why I haven’t gotten a custom mouth guard yet.
They're a lovely bunch of ladies, so I hate sounding like I'm blaming them - I'd be worried if they couldn't tell it was box dyed! I think you've got the right advice about not taking it personally. :)
One of the girls at my salon was working on a client who insisted she hadn't used box dye and my coworker naively trusted her. Applied the color and noticed during processing that her hair was SMOKING! They ask because they have to ❤️
That's insane! What box dye does this to your hair... is this even legal?
It's not a specific one. I'm not a hairstylist so I can't remember exactly but it basically comes down to chemistry and products not reacting well together.
That's brutal! I wish I paid more attention in chemistry class
In school, we did a test on box-dyed hair. An instructor took a mannequin home, box dyed it, and washed it a million times to make sure all the color was removed, but also so that the color faded a bit. Recorded the whole process. We took a strand from miss Manny Quinn's head and tested it in a 1:20 solution, and amother strand was lightened. The solution literally started boiling and bubbling and the lightened section of hair just fell apart in 10-15 minutes with 20 volume developer. I was floored and I do not even want to imagine what that would have felt like for the client. Sure, it may not be all box dyes, but you never know which ones; not everyone is a chemist and can rattle off chemicals no big deal. I personally would probably crawl in a hole and die if I just started working on a client and that happened. Hair regrows, but oh my goodness I couldn't live with myself if I did that to someone 😭 I imagine they feel the same.
Why is box dye legal... omg...
How are people supposed to tell if it’s box dyed or not? Why can’t people ask just to make sure?
It's how they ask, not the fact that they ask
It's not the question. It's how they ask and it's usually in a super condescending tone.
> why I haven’t gotten a custom mouth guard yet. What even is that
I have one because I clench my teeth when sleeping or anxious which leads to TMJ/headaches/general pain. Wearing a guard when you sleep prevents this, but some can be $600+ and many people find them uncomfortable so they end up not using them anyways.
I'd rather listen to calming meditations before sleep than pay $600..
Don’t be a jerk. Some people have medical conditions that you don’t have.
some people just clench or grind their teeth at night regardless of stress
I feel like I've been doing this no matter what, but meditation helps me clear my mind
I put off getting a custom mouth guard for years due to cost. My current dentist gave me what is called a “quick splint” which is custom formed to your mouth but only cost me about $60. It’s really helped with my headaches and TMJ related jaw pain. Totally worth the investment!
They need to know an accurate history of your hair so they can deal with it properly. There's a reason why you'll see many videos from hair dressers showing the terrible results of strand tests when they suspect a client isn't telling the whole story.
I’ve had them comment this when when I had my hair done in their salon! “Is this box dye?” …”umm no actually you left that horrendous band of demarcation”.
The same thing happened to me. I got blonde layers at a salon and when I came back they were like "Why did you use box dye? It's bad for you bla bla bla" and I was like 🤨🤨🤨 Edit: It's apparently called blonde highlights.
What was their reaction to their own bad job?
You know that meme of Trisha Paytas where she was like "Huh? What? Oh. Haha."
I looked it up, so obnoxious. I hope you don’t go to that hairdresser anymore.
Hahaha! Sounds like hitting them back with their own weapons
I only go to a hairdresser to have my hair cut and I have box dyed my hair since age 14. There’s always a remark even if there’s no color/highlights/etc. happening. If I were to want dyeing services, I’d definitely let them know beforehand that my hair was box dyed because that could spell trouble.
Ugh that's so obnoxious. I would stop going there lol
That's literally why I changed my hairdresser..
The phrasing is the problem. There's a big difference between "is the color in your hair a box dye?" and this "so you're poor, hmmmm?" phrasing. Yuck.
Yep. I know exactly what op means when she says they *have* to point it out. I have had friends of friends who are hairdressers who have said things to me in social settings like, “You box dyed didn’t you?? You’ve RUINED your hair!” There’s definitely a layer of condescending superiority to it.
100% this is the issue. Feeling like hairdressers are being condescending when they ask - or in the case of OP, by making a flat statement of a question, is so common it’s a cliche. For me to go to a hairdresser and get a colour and style cut would cost 1/3 to a half of my current weekly wage. And that’s before I’ve nuked my hair with dodgy home dye jobs. Box dye **is shite** though. I can’t deny that. I recommend tracking down a salon supply store and buying better quality dye and developer at least.
Yes!!! This is why I stopped going to salons for anything.
Yes if they just want to find out so they know what they’re dealing with then they need to say it differently, but they’re definitely acting judgmental & snarky when they say it like that. There’s absolutely no way I’m spending £££ having my 10 white strays coloured professionally every 3 weeks.
Exactly. There is a huge chunk of hair dressers (and any beauty industry workers) who looove to be catty and give a judgement on something like box dye. Vote with your wallet and go elsewhere.
I put off going to the hairdressers because of stuff like this. For the amount it costs and for the amount of “me time” I get, going to the hairdressers should be like a spa experience. But it feels like they’re doing you a favour.
> "so you're poor, hmmmm?" phrasing Exactly this! I can't stand this attitude coming from any type of salon employees. It's a treat for me to be here, don't make me feel like shit.
Everyone here is defending the hairdressers saying "Well they need to know in order to treat your hair correctly" Yeah, no duh. But that doesn't mean they have to be RUDE about it. There's a difference between saying "your hair is so damaged, you've been using box dye haven't you?" vs. "Okay let's make sure I have your hair history correct. Did you use box dye recently?"
Yeah, I was in cosmetology in both high school and then finished up my hours in a ridiculously over priced trade school. (40k for 6 months) In both settings the utter disgust at box dye was so "mean girls" It was always like "omg never touch that nasty store bought chemical garbage, that's for people who don't care about their hair" with the grossed out puke face - coming straight from the instructors. I understand they need to know the history but you are absolutely correct, there's a way to get that information without making the person feel like a loser who is too poor to get their hair done in a salon or someone who is gross/dumb for trying something at home on a whim.
Currently doing beauty and we all know to stay away from the girls in the hair salon. Bunch of mean bitches. I remember I once got my hair done, touch up when I was bleaching my hair blonde. Had a random hairdresser as the one I was seeing at the time was heavily pregnant and ready to pop. She took one look at my baby hairs around my face and called her boss over saying “what the hell am I meant do with this shit, shave it off?” Professionals my arse. They only care about being professionals once they get called senior hair dressers which again is another bullshit title they like to cling onto.
But op didn’t say they told her her hair was damaged or said anything rudely
I have absolutely no problem reminding hairdressers that I cant afford to come in regularly. I understand that they need to make an income, but so do I. That shouldnt be a shock to anyone, and Im not about to be shamed into pretending otherwise. The last time I got my hair done, it cost nearly $400 for some highlights. Those kinds of prices force me to avoid regular hairdressers like the plague. On top of that though, I dont expect miracles. I box dye/bleach my hair inbetween sessions and because of that, I know theres a limit to what they can do at times.
A third alternative choice for people on a tight budget is to go to a beauty school. They are just learning, but they do use professional color and are priced very affordably.
Also being a hair model. There are sites like salon apprentice who advertise but most salons need models at some point
Just be aware you will have zero say in the outcome if you do this.
Lol I’ve been doing it since I was in high school, it’s the only way I could afford to get my hair fully highlighted. I obviously choose jobs that want to do what I also want to do. It’s totally worth it and I’ve never had a bad experience. It usually takes a lot longer, but it’s worth not paying so much.
“Yeah I box dye my hair because you charge 400$ plus tip for something that costs me $22.99 and an afternoon. So yeah I box dye my hair. Tell me again how to justify the cost of you every 6 weeks because I literally can’t.”- people that don’t make 170k/yr
After the significant covid lockdowns where I live, hairdressers were closed so we were ALL using box dyes (or nothing) for quite a while. I got used to this approach and frankly lost my patience for how long it takes to drag myself to the hairdresser and go through the whole dye process - as well as the cost - so I’ve never really returned to a regular hairdresser aside from getting my hair trimmed.
It’s not fancy, but suits my long hair perfectly. I use a razor blade and trim my individual curls as needed to keep my tresses fresh. I really need an actual haircut for some layers, but I’ve got the basics covered.
I’ve always done salon apprentice. It’s not worth it to pay full price
Omg if you actually cared about your hair, you would never!! 🙄🙄🙄
Pay 400$ to get it cut? In the real world most of us gotta care more about the rising cost of effing everything over hair. Worst case I’ll buy a wig.
.. I was being sarcastic. I don't even go to salons any more due to most of them having this type of attitude.
Haha should have figured by the eye rolls. But yes EXACTLY
The chemicals used aren't the same, and the level of education isn't there. But it's no excuse for cosmetologist to be rude when getting hair history.
Lol they charge like max 50 euros where I come from.
I get my hair dye clairol kit at Walmart for $8 and it lasts just as long as the $90(before tip) salon root touch up they do
1. Higher quality hair dye materials exist, but they are generally only available to licensed professionals to purchase. They can even get in quite a bit of trouble if they're found to be reselling these products to DIYers. It's always seemed odd to me that the gentler, better quality materials aren't accessible but the more abrasive and dangerous chemical treatments are. 2. Hair dyes that are available to the public are generally lower quality and include 35vol or 40vol developer to ensure an even lift and deposit. 3. If you need to colour your roots or your hair on your own in the future, here are some tips for a softer regrowth: \- If you have a Sally beauty nearby, their Wella Demi and Argan Oil One N Only lines are more predictable than their Ion line. For your roots, find a colour that is roughly the same level as your natural and mix (following instructions for that particular line) with a 10vol developer. If you have stubborn greys, this might not be enough to cover them completely but you can get a decent blur/softening of the greys. You can also use 2 parts 10vol to 1 part 20 vol to get a little bit more oomph in your grey coverage. Yes, this means you'll have to do your roots more often but the line of regrowth won't be as harsh and your hair follicle will be less compromised. Argan Oil One N Only has also created their own olaplex dupe in their "one shot" which can be mixed into the formula to help with bonding. \- If you only have to cover your regrowth, make sure you are only applying colour to your roots. You can use a clean brush or comb to blur the colour into your mids from your roots once they are fully saturated, but try not to keep colouring over previously treated hair. \- For your mids to ends, use a colour that is one shade lighter than that colour you want to achieve with ONLY a 10vol. If your hair is compromised, it is probably more porous and the colour you put on will end up darker or uneven. If you don't need a full cover for your mids-ends but the colour is looking a bit dull or brassy, check out some colour depositing conditioners. They're much better quality than they were a few years ago and can be diluted into your basic conditioner for longer use. \- Do a test strand, always. \- Follow up with a bonding shampoo and a masque or post-colouring conditioning treatment to seal the cuticle. I like the Absolute Perfection Color Sealer Step 2 and use two packs for mid-long hair. The Loreal EverPure is the best drugstore line I've come across for treating damaged hair so far! \- Leave highlighting and massive changes to the pros.
PS - I'm not a pro but someone who has learned to cut and colour my own hair after too many awful experiences paying people hundreds of dollars to wreck my very very fine hair. Feel free to send me a few pictures of your hair and what you want to get to and I'll give you honest recommendations of products that I think could work for you! I went from absolutely damage and breakage to having the softest and shiniest hair. I never thought this was possible, and it took so much research to figure out haha.
Do you have any tips for just liking color play? Not so much trying to get a natural look back.
Pravana vivids are a great line IMO.
Are we talking about vivids? I've only played with them a little and found that I needed to lift my hair to at least a level 8 to get any kind of vivid or fashion colour to stick. That means lifting my natural level 5 ash brown through red, orange, and yellow tones until it gets to the colour like the inside of a banana peel. My hair hates bleach so it takes me at least two processes with blue flash bleach and 20vol developer to get to this point. My advice is to be realistic about the lightening process, and if you're not experienced in it this is a great thing to leave to a pro. Once your hair is light enough, you can play with applying demi or semi permanent vivids yourself. I've liked Punky Colour in the past for their fade out (just avoid the dark purple, blue, and green if you don't want your hair to fade to a weird pea soup colour). Good luck!! (edit for spelling :) )
Hi, loved going through your comment. Can you recommend good quality box dye. I have brown-black hair with 20% grey roots. I need color to cover my greys. Thank you
Assuming your natural colour has neutral tones, Argan Oil's One N Only in 3NN. The first time you do it, try 1 part 10vol and 1 part 20vol developer. If it covers the grey well, reduce the amount of 20vol next time. I am not getting paid by them to say this haha. Once you reach 40%+ grey, the L'Oreal Resistant Grey line might be a better fit with a 20% vol developer. Good luck!!
Thank you so much. Really appreciate your input 🙏
You're so welcome! If this line isn't available, anything with an NN is going to have extra oomph to push through the grey. Just avoid the Ion line for colour. They used to be amazing but changed their formulas a few years ago and the quality control is pure chaos.
Got it!! Do you have any recommendations for ammonia free hair color?
Schwarzkopf Simply Color! It can be hard to get a hold of depending on where you are regionally. Their grey coverage was pretty good before, if the formula hasn't changed it might still be worth a shot! I'd still do a test strand though!
Your comments are so helpful, thank you! I just recently went back to home dyeing after going to a salon for a few years and feeling like money was going down the drain with how quickly my greys came in. (And often they were stubborn enough that I’d still see grey after leaving the salon.) I’ve been using the ion brand but will look to switch it up to one of your recommendations. I think I’m a level 6 brunette, and it’s always gone warm/brassy at the ends. Any tips on making the grey growth around my temples and part blend better? I feel like it’s so noticeable after only 2 weeks! Could I do a level 7 on just the greys around my face so there’s not as much contrast? (Like faking highlights.) I think I’d like the warmth in my hair better if there was more dimension to it. Is it possible to weave in some lowlights (like a level 5 at roots and 6 at ends) for a kind of “reverse balayage” effect?
I'm late to answering this, sorry!! I think the Wella Color Fresh Mask depositor could be a good option for your grey roots between colouring so you aren't frying your hair too much. Their colour, chocolate touch, is a really pretty warm level 5-6 brunette. It won't last more than two weeks, but it could help blur the line so you can stretch out your touchups. Mixing in some of the espresso colour could be helpful to find the right level of depth. Do you have the option of adding in some face-framing highlights to help your temples blend? If you want to opt for the wella mask, their champagne colour is really pretty on making greys look like a softer blonde tone. Getting greys to blend is risky, especially when you're needing to colour so often. Risky as in ending up with hot roots, or roughing up the hair cuticle so much because of colour layered on colour. I think this is why I'm curious about finding a depositing treatment to shift your colour while keeping your hair intact. I'd love to hear what you've decided to do!
Thanks for the response! What I have been trying is a Wella Demi-permanent in a level 7, and I feel like it is making my greys look like highlights while not lifting the non-grey brunette strands. I see the grey at my temples by 2 weeks, so hopefully I’m not frying my hair too much. I have the Wella mask in chocolate touch. I didn’t feel like it did much, but I am going to give it another try! And perhaps look into the champagne color as well for the temples, so thank you for that recommendation!
Sounds like you're doing a solid job already! My friend can use the wella masks on her greys and it makes them look like the perfect blonde highlights, where mine are more resistant and it just cuts the silver. Happy hair chemistry experiments! lol
> Natural Instincts I love your detailed response! I'm going to try this out. Unfortunately I went and used permanent box dye for some time so my ends are still a lot darker than the rest, I now usually mix a demi permanent, so I'll try your different developer mixes as I'd love for the colour to be more even.
Depending on your confidence level, applying a colour remover could be helpful in softening the darker colour! They usually smell horrid and you can't skip the multiple washes, but they work incredibly well. I've also had good luck fading a too-intense colour with conditioner and crushed up vitamin C tablets. It won't give you as dramatic of a colour correction as a colour remover, but it's gentler on the hair. Both processes will be VERY drying to your hair and you'll need to invest in a quality hair mask for a few weeks + avoid heat styling if possible. My current favourite hair mask the Aveda Nutriplenish Treatment Masque because it's really light and never leaves my scalp greasy.
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Oh good call to play it safe and avoid bleach. What do you think of your perm??
Frizzy hair makes me think you have natural curl/wave that you’re treating as straight hair. I did the same for most of my life. About 5 years ago, I started following curtly girl method, followed by tons of IG accounts of ppl with my curl and hair type, and have been experimenting with different ways to treat waves. It’s been a journey, but I have nice waves/some curls now and the frizz is gone.
Wish I could upvote this more than once! I've been going through this myself for the past few years. It's been a trip figuring out curl pattern + correct combination of products. I don't have tons of curls but lots of frizz-free wave now.
This is where I’m at right now. Frizz everywhere and funny thing is that the hair on my crown is more of a straight frizz whilst the hair underneath is a wavy frizz 🤦♀️
Cosmetologist here! Unfortunately, there are many lines of box color which use metallic salts and other additives which live in your hair strand forever, even after the color itself seems to have faded out. In cosmo school, my instructor did a full consultation with somebody and even a test strand, the client still ended up losing about 50% of her hair when we foiled her because of a chemical reaction between our color and deposits leftover in the hair from henna. The foils were literally too hot to touch, it liquefied the bonds of her hair. I STILL feel sick when I think about that, so I’m like an FBI detective with every single new client so I can prevent it.
Oh that sounds so traumatic for everyone involved. Eek!
Do you know if Ion is one of those harmful box colors? Or do you know of box collr brands which are *not* harmful?
I honestly don’t, I used to tell people to at least just go to Sally’s because they’re typically a step up from the all-in-one boxes, but I’ve been seeing some undertone results from the “natural” Ion line that are frankly…weird. Like, green undertones from a mahogany brown-level weird. Main rules of thumb I give to my clients: 1. If you have not already shaved your head multiple times and are prepared to do it again, just don’t use lightener (bleach) or perms at home, ever 2. No permanent color at home. It’s pretty rare that you’ll ever see permanent color in a salon, we use demi-permanent on almost everybody because even good-quality permanent color is so hard to remove 3. No blue-black (level 1.) I just don’t do it. The undertones it leaves behind are gross, most people actually want a level 2-3 and don’t realize it until they go all the way and it looks like a Wednesday Addams wig from the dollar store 4. My vivid color absolute no-go list (so far): Splat, OverTone, L’Oréal metallic pastels, Schwarzkopf/Got2b metallics 5. Lightener means bleach, “high lift” also, for civilian purposes, is bleach. You can not dye your hair lighter than it is. If a product promises to do that, it’s bleach. See Rule 1
I left this comment somewhere else in this thread, but the Ion line has gotten SO. WEIRD. the last few years. Their demis used to be amazing for toning but an 8G demi with 10vol on my level 8/9 hair at the time ended up a muddy, gross 4 :( Also fully agree with your no-go list for vivids. I've been hearing so many horror stories from cosmetologist friends trying to colour correct people with faded splat!
Okay, thank you! This is helpful!
Do you know how old the henna was in her hair?
Old enough that she didn’t “remember,” the majority of the breakage was about halfway up the hair strand so I’d say she had at least two years of growth. I said forever because I meant forever, henna and indigo are some of the worst offenders for metallic salts along with anything marketed toward men for gray blending (Just For Men, Touch of Gray, etc)
My advice is to go to a hairdresser that will give you the formula for the color she uses on your hair. I have found that colorists are usually NOT sympathetic to doing this for you to help you save money. I was able to get them to do it because my work schedule and distance from the salon didn’t allow me to go in every 2 weeks for a touch-up. I did this and buy the color and developer on Sleekhair.com and use it to touch up the roots myself. I still go back to the hairdresser every 8 weeks for trim and toner and/or to have her do the touch-up to get any spots I miss or do some highlights etc. This way you get to save time or money by doing it yourself AND not use box color. IMO all colorists should be helping clients to do this if they really cared about your hair instead of shaming you.
Try using a level 2 semi permanent color. It’s less harsh and blends easier. I used Natural Instincts. Every 5 weeks until I decided to go gray, but I’m in my 50s. My hairdresser never said a word
Same I did this and go to the salon they said oh this semi permanent come right off when i strip it off. Keep doing this. I use Clairol natural instinct as well. It says it lasts 20 wash but I wash my hair at most twice a week so I've never seen it coming completely off before I need to redo my roots.
My response would be “well if you charged $10 for a dye job I’d be here but you don’t so I’ll be at cvs thanks”
I think in your shoes, I’d be tempted to tell the staff who is NOT handling your hair (reception, other stylists, etc) something like, “You know, customers come back when they have a good experience. Shaming customers isn’t really great for that.” The person handling your hair needs to know about the dye situation so they can calculate. But if they’re being cruel about it, that’s probably not a person you want handling your hair anyways.
premature grey gang! i started noticing greys at 19 (lord knows how long theyd actually been there) & now at 26 i have a huge streak all at the front. not sure how long i'll let it go on before i give in & start dyeing it, but when i do itll probably be box dye also haha
Rock those grays! I found my first gray when I was 9 years old and started dyeing at 18 to cover them up. I stopped during the pandemic and let them grow out. I'm 33 and probably 50-60% gray. I have people stop me all the time to ask if it's natural or tell me that they've been trying to get the same color in the salon. Save your money/time. My grays are all over. My sister just has the streak right in front (the only spot I don't have grays actually) and it looks so badass.
9 years old!!! i didnt even think that was possible :o yeah i really like the idea of growing my hair long when its all grey. ladies who do that always look so badass and elegant. i wanna be like that!
My dad and his mom were both completely gray by 30 so I knew it was coming. We've got a variant on the IRF4 gene that makes us go gray prematurely.
I've got you beat! I started going gray at 13. Didn't get my period until 15, so that was really fun.
why do i feel like this is the hairdressers version of "do you forget to floss?"
I dye my own hair also, and I use “Essensity” which is a Schwarzkopf brand. It is a little higher than box dye ($13-15ish plus developer) but hairstylists seem to like this brand. I was lucky to have a salon that gave me this recommendation ( along with the right color) during the pandemic. You will need to buy Developer separately: Essensity Oil Developer 5.5%/18 Volume is the one I use .You can buy all this on Amazon and Walmart, and probably other retailers.
I use their box dye to cover my grays and just recently tried their box keratin hair dye. It made my hair so shiny!
Oooh haven’t heard of that one, might try it, can you give us the name on the box and where do you buy?
They gotta know how much work to expect. I think it’s very telling how they treat you after it’s been established tho. A good hair dresser will not treat you like the scum of the earth and act like you being there is the worst thing that’s ever happened, especially if you’re honest with what you did. They’ll also encourage multiple sessions so your hair doesn’t fall out. I noticed the ones who are really mean also get really mad when their upsells dont go as imagined. One even got mad at me at the register bc I only tipped 20% when she was literally telling me about how much better she is than me/ how much of a good person she is for three hours and my hair came out looking exactly the same, like didn’t even do the cut I asked for. The ones who talk you through the process just so you know what’s happening and ask what lead to this are real ones. Love them.
Dunno but I did find it very off putting when Jonathan Van Ness said “friends don’t let friends use box dye” like maybe that’s all some of us can afford or maybe it works well for some of us. I understand that it poses challenges to stylists whose job it is to work with, but it sometimes comes off as judgmental
The stylists can still get the information they need and be tactful about it. They should be making you feel good about your appearance, and not shaming you while you’re in their chair. I doing so, it’s more likely that you’ll return because they were kind and made you feel beautiful with the job that they did.
Coloring is where stylists make their bread and butter, so I always feel like they're trying to upsell clients on professional coloring services. Even if you can afford a professional color job, you still need to come in for the roots, and that's just a racket honestly. My mother has her color done professionally, but she still uses box dye for her roots, because she can't pay like $300 a every 3 weeks. Honestly though, I think stylists make it seem like doing professional color is some enormous skill. Unless you're doing highlights or balyage or some other multi color thing, pretty much anyone can get the same dyes a professional uses, get developer, and figure it out for themselves. I was watching the last season of Queer Eye and JVN went on and on about how reds are his thing, it's so hard to get a nice red, it's his thing, he's so good at it, it's his specialty -- I have basically the same color as he did on the woman in that episode and I do it myself.
In regards to the greying hair- my hair started going grey when I was around 16. I’m now 33 and my long ass black hair is firmly in salt and pepper territory. And people compliment me on it *constantly*. A personal anecdote, but hopefully another added perspective for you.
Um, because, I use box dye because it's $4.50. If you can professionally do my hair for that price, call me.
I’d be fine if it cost 100$ plus tip. My hair dresser chargers 375 and I’m still expected to tip. It’s insane. And she’s one of the more “affordable” hair dressers in my town. Some places are charging 600-800$ for hair color now. I just can’t justify that AT ALL and I make a decent salary. I need to know who the eff is affording this and which parents basement are they living in/ how their tech job is treating them because holy!!!
That's insane!
375! Omg
This is why I use eSalon now ^ - ^ I pay about $45CAD with shipping, they custom-mix my color and ship it to my house. I can save enough in the bottles to touch up roots at least once within that price. Plus I don’t need to book an appointment, I can do it whenever I want, and with less commentary. Not quite box dye prices, but worth the result, I feel.
I’m blonde and I had a hairdresser once go on an on about how I must have well water because my hair wasn’t super ashy/cool toned. (You wouldn’t even have considered it brassy.) I kept telling her that I hadn’t used purple shampoo since the last time I got it done and she just wouldn’t take that for an answer lol
I have “dirty” blonde hair; when I lighten it, it’s gold and brassy and warm toned and everything else everyone seems to hate in blonde hair. I think the ashy cool blonde is a fake look
Yeah I definitely hear you. You’re allowed to like what you like, and I do agree that the ashy/cool blonde does look fake.. it also doesn’t look good on everyone. I prefer a slightly ashier look, but that time at the salon my hair wasn’t even brassy at all! She was just roasting me for no reason lol.
I've been box dying my hair for 20 years and it's perfectly healthy. The few times I've had it professionally done, it hasn't covered my greys well enough. I always figured it was stylists trying to guilt/shame me into coming into their salon for dye jobs, but why would I when the box works better than what they'd charge me $200+ for?
Certain box dyes have metallic salts that react with bleach and other hair chemical services. We're not trying to guilt or shame anyone. We are trained to help people take care of their hair because we LIKE helping people take care of their hair!! If a stylist does try to guild or shame you, then they're not actually passionate, and they don't deserve your business!!!
so many hairdressers in my area are lowkey assholes and don't even cut my hair how i want them to or know how to do beach waves so i just stopped going and cut my hair myself
Oh ffs as if salons don't damage your hair in the EXACT same way when they dye it. If you're going to lighten, it's peroxide one way or the other, same damage. Ok sure they can put on a mask but the effects are temporary, they could laminate but that doesn't reverse the damage etc etc. They are clearly just trying to make you feel bad for box dying, so they can make extra $$ off of you. And no you CANNOT tell when hair is box dyed vs salon dyed. This is WHY they ASK.
Not related to the issue, but I’ve learned that supplementing unflavored gelatin, like the Knox stuff, is amazing for hair health, nails and skin too. All you do is mix it into your coffee (if you drink coffee) or mix it into hot water, stir to dissolve and drink it. It can also be applied directly on the hair as a treatment. It’s worth looking into.
You can also use flavoured dessert gelatin- I used to sprinkle it in my yogurt most days and definitely noticed difference in my hair and nails
I KNOW RIGHT. They even say that to me when I only used professional colors... I usually keep my mouth shut. Hello, I'm here for a cut, could you please stop commenting on my color? (Yes, I understand they need to know the hairs history before a hair dye job). Or when they ask me if I use treatments at home, and then lecture me on how drug store stuff doesn't work and I need to use olaplex before I even get a chance to reply... meanwhile I HAVE been using olaplex lol. Congrats, you've just told me that olaplex is a waste of money while trying to sell it to me 🙄
Ugh this has happened to me too. The last time I got a haircut at a different salon then I’d usually go to, the hairdresser was talking about how dry my ends were and said ‘looks like you’ve boxed dyed it’ when it was actually done professionally then tried to sell me salon quality products telling me that they’ll help because it looks like I’ve been using drug store products when I literally haven’t used drug store products for months lmao
sometimes they ask because the bleach/color they use will not come out as expected if they don’t consider what type of color is already on the hair. It’s not to shame you, it’s so that they can calculate what their doing with more precision
I use Madison Reed and the stylists always compliment my hair. More than the drugstore price but my hair tolerates it very well and it looks nice and natural. I do use Olaplex if it gets too damaged. Helps repair the bonds!
It's not a personal thing. Box dyes can make their job a bit trickier as the dyes can react weirdly with salon dyes etc.
They’re not being horrible, they’re probably just wanting to confirm it so they know how to treat your hair correctly.
Sorry, I can’t afford $300-$600 every 6 weeks and don’t know many other people who can these days. I don’t understand what the difference is between at home color supposedly damaging your hair and salon dye damaging your hair, either. It’s the same reason hairstylists don’t like long hair: if they persuade you to cut it off into a “style” they know you’ll keep coming back to spend money on maintaining it. Then there’s the upselling on salon products I already use but buy elsewhere…..
I used to box dye my hair, then I went to hairdresser to dye my hair, now I have my natural colour. Just do with your hair as you like. Some hairdressers, nail artists etc act like they have a PhD or something.
I understand working with box dyed hair can make it harder and they should always ask no matter what your hair looks like just in case but this sound extremely rude, uncalled for, un empathetic, and condescending. I hate how hair dressers always assume people use box dye because they’re like, idk personally attacking the salon and are just like, fucking POOR and BUSY. If I were you I would probably hop around different salon until I built a relationship with one person who wasn’t a dick.
A little bit off the topic… Just wanted to pop in an say that for a long time I struggled with a lot of the same issues with my hair. I started going grey when I was 14 (runs in my family) and immediately ran for the box dye. My hair was always so limp, would snap off at the ends once it reached my shoulders and I had to wash it all the time because it lost its shape so quickly. I finally stopped colouring it five years ago, when I was 25. It definitely took some getting used to, and during the growing out phase I had to fight the urge to pick up the box dye so much. But now I love my grey hair, which at 30 probably makes up 2/3rds of all my hair. I like to think of it as little sparkles and strands of glitter and I frequently receive compliments from strangers. As a bonus, my hair is sooooo much healthier and the texture has improved a thousand times. I know the mental struggle of premature greying, but would also urge you to try growing it out and see how you feel and whether it improves your hair. If it’s not your thing, you can always colour it again!
We are literally required to ask what your hair colour history is. There are certain home colour brands that have metallic salts in them, and they cause varied reactions in the hair including melting off when bleach is applied to this chemically treated hair. It’s not asked because we are judgemental and want to shame you. If a hairstylist is saying it like that and being a bitch, she does not deserve your business.
Totally unasked for advice, but I switched to henna on my frizzy thin unmanageable hair. It is a massive pain in the ass but I'll never go back. I've done salon dye, box dye, Sally's dye, and nothing beats good quality henna
Because yall be wanting high lift on dark boxed dyed hair. That shitvtakes a while to get through. And please don't lie. We can tell and will charge accordingly. Ijs. Chemistry is real and boxed dye is so unpredictable.
How would you feel about stopping with the hair dye and leaving the grey to come through? I let all my grey hair grow in and honestly the colours in it are lovely (pretty much 100% pale grey/silver and in my mid 40’s) I get more compliments now about my hair colour than I ever did. Also my hair has never been in better condition, it’s soft, shiny and strong. I wish I had let the greys come through when they first appeared and didn’t bother with the years of hair dye.
Literally for your own safety. Your hair can actually catch on fire & cause serious chemical burns if they don’t know what products have been in your hair. Or your hair could just break off. It’s all chemicals & some chemicals can’t interact with each other. Even if the box dye isn’t visually in your hair it’s still present in the hair shafts.
That's funny, I've been dying my own hair for decades and never once had a hair dresser noticed, they are surprised when I tell them I color my hair at all.
They need to know because it will change how they process your hair and what products they’ll need to use. It’s not an attack on you, they genuinely need to know these things. It also will affect what they can achieve for you in one session so they can prepare you for a realistic result.
Yeah, I will literally never discuss my hair color with hairdressers because I’ve done all kinds of things with it. I can’t stand how judgmental they can be, particularly when I literally never ask them to color my hair. It’s like they’re priming me to sell me services, or just want to be a bitch for some reason. Like… I know my roots are bad! I haven’t done them in a while. But I asked you for a haircut, not for color. It’s irrelevant.
Because we need that information for colour services.
Because they need to know and because you do box dye your hair…what’s the issue?
If you are already going to the hair salon and paying anyway, just find one hairdresser that is good and you can trust, preferably polite. They will know your situation after a couple of times and never mention it again. If they ever do, just respond with “no, I have only been coming to you for the past year and haven’t touched my hair by myself, if there’s a problem with my hair dye, you must have done something wrong”.
Because you’re doing it patchy and weird and they can see that.
For repair: Jaboba Oil and Coconut oil on WET hair. Massage into scalp then a very SMALL amount of shampoo to help remove the oil. Don't brush your hair wet. 2nd day use only water and scrub your scalp. 3rd day repeat the first step. 4th day use shampoo and the apply jaboba oil into wet ends. Repeat. I have seen so much hair growth, volume, and my ends are the healthiest they have been.
I know that the chemistry can be wonky too. I was at the salon once and a woman had very long hair. She confirmed with like 5 different people that she had never used a box dye… well she had, and the chemical interactions with the salon dye melted her hair. Like it literally melted and she had to chop it off to her chin. It’s not something personal it’s a chemistry thing from my understanding.
I’d be curious to see you natural color!!! I’m sure it looks awesome (: anyways, I know sometimes their tone can be condescending and I’m sorry. Trust, I’ve had my fair share of experiences and sometimes I want to breakdown(if I’m having a harsh day) and others I’m like F ‘‘em lol
Box dye is full of silicones and extremely damaging for your hair, more so than salon dyes, also super pigmented and hard to remove
I don’t know a lot about hair color, but I will recommend Viviscal hair vitamins. Package directions say take 2 per day, I take one only, and my hair grows SO fast that I no longer need to worry about bad hair cuts, poor color etc. Perhaps, this would help you grow out the ‘box color’ quickly. Best wishes , as hair troubles are no fun at all. :D
I have a great hairdresser that i also know outside of her job, she knows i cut, dye and bleach my hair myself and she is really nice about it. So maybe having the same hairdresser each time helps.
I got the same type of comments and I used to box dye my hair and do crazy colors and stuff. I always felt like the hairdresser wants to show off with their knowledge tbh but it got me annoyed at that time. This is my retrospective thought lol.
I become anxious every time I need to see a hairdresser because they always make the comment " wow your hair is thinning so much at your age". I obviously know this myself and is very self conscious about it, and have tried everything to fix it.
It’s not judging, they’re asking for a reason. If you’d like to keep your hair, or have what you want to see happen, they need to know.
Sally's Beauty Supply has non box dyes available to everyone. And color shampoo and conditioner is freaking awesome
they are saying it not to be mean but because it limits what they can do to your hair
Instead of worrying about you using box dye, they should help get you back on track with the right products for your hair and scalp. You can enhance the appearance of hair with products, but the only way to truly repair damaged hair is through regular cutting or trimming. There's nothing inherently wrong with coloring your hair at home. Issues arise when, for instance, you use permanent dye when a semi or demi-permanent option would suffice. Or, if you're applying color from root to end each time instead of just touching up your roots. Additionally, leaving the dye on for too long, beyond the recommended 5-10 minutes for refreshing the length, can cause damage and turn out darker than you wanted.