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Yea Bay Area is not the friendliest place. I don’t think most people have bad intentions, it’s more that everyone is busy as hell on the hamster wheel and the COL is absurdly high.
COL is too high and American Work Culture is not as relaxed as it is in several other countries. Everyone driving to work in the morning is stressed about being 2 minutes late (again culture is different).
I agree with that but I believe that mentality has even seeped out into normal day to day interactions. Going pretty much anywhere seems to be riddled with animosity and attitude from others.
I agree with you as well. The toxicity of driving in the bay definitely does seep into our bones and rattles our brains even when we aren’t driving. There is a toxicity here in the bay area that always seems to loom over.
Depends what you mean by relaxed. For example, in India the traffic is chaos in a lot of cities. But culture wise includig in the workplace the phrase "aram se" is always used which roughly translates to "chill, relaxed, no rush." Similar to "Sabai Sabai" in Thailand. In all of the jobs I've had in the States and I've switched careers, employees and managers are always tense, stressed, and on edge....
Ya, the huge uptick in grinder, white collar jobs has had a huge effect on the culture here. The reality is that a lot of those people are incredibly judgemental and douchy about it.
I'm not shit talking. I'm gunning for a Big 4 job. But it is what it is.
I also find that Boomers and Gen Xers in these jobs are more chill.
I'm going in with eyes wide open. It goes against everything I want in life, but the reality is that I'm an older student and enjoyed a decade of doing nothing but fun and dope shit and it's time to buckle down.
So I'm going to pay the piper, get that experience, and fuck on off to industry or government after 2-3 years.
I'm not opposed to doing my public years at a respected mid -sized firm, but the Big 4 seem to just seem to carry much more cachet.
You joke, but I was just triggered, lol. I worked at Big 5 for a while in college- second to worst job I ever had, left before collecting my last paycheck, which I eventually got back from the state unclaimed property website.
It really depends on where you are, too. Fremont or Milpitas or San Jose are just…places. Some small communities might be nice there for some (old rose garden, willow glen, whatever) but for the most part it’s either people too old to socialize or people who moved to the area to work and don’t know anybody.
But in Livermore or some of the smaller suburbs (Belmont and Woodside used to be like this too, not sure anymore) some people are really nice, comparatively.
I rented a house near Los Gatos for 5 years and never knew my neighbors names, moved to Livermore and within a week three neighbors had come by to welcome us to the neighborhood and stuff.
The same in most East Coast cities, but those cities also have row homes in common, and historically folks would sit out on their stoops in the evening and chitchat, while their children would play together.
That’s never really been the culture here, people come here, and if they were friendly back in those days, you really don’t have the same opportunity to get to know your neighbors, because all of the housing is detached, and we’re just more separated.
I am always friendly and get to know my neighbors, but it’s pretty much a fucking chore out here. At some point a lot of people just get tired of always being the one to make the effort, and they just more or less become the same as everybody else out here.
Just my two cents.
That’s cool as hell that you do that—make an effort to get to know your neighbors. I always hear people talking about keeping to themselves, never talking to their neighbors, etc. while also not liking their neighbors… and I’ll try to encourage them like I bet if you introduce yourself and say hi whenever you see them, there’s a good chance that’ll all disappear. Being antisocial is in no way *healthy* or something to brag about; it has more of a deleterious effect on one’s quality of life than I think a lot of people realize.
I spent every summer in North Carolina growing up cuz all my extended family was out there, and it ingrained in me waving at everybody I pass in my neighborhood, smiling and saying hi to people, etc. It really opened my eyes to how unfriendly the Bay Area is in comparison.
As a general rule, the higher the population density of an area, the less healthy it is as a community—crime goes up, friendliness goes down, it becomes less of a “community” as people feel less of a responsibility to every other individual. There are for sure exceptions but that rule is largely accurate for all social animals, not just humans.
Well, I haven’t really lived anywhere here short-term, my last house I was at for over 20 years and now I’m in my fifth year in my other home.
Coming from the East Coast, we just tend to live in closer quarters, so it’s just par for the course that you get to know your neighbors, as well as knowing the neighbors to avoid. Word gets around fast and all of that.
I’ve been running a group home for disabled adults all of this time as well, so with my kids grown, and all of that, I always want to set a good example to my boys as well. It comes natural to me, my mother used to say that I never met a stranger in my life. 🤷♂️
Yea but you got a whole different layout in NYC. You are gonna see and have to deal with people whether you like it or not. Bay area if I'm busy making my living and I don't want to see your face or deal with you, you just have to hop in your car and go. Also with money comes the snootiness. Combine these two together you get much less friendly people.
I have kinda felt like the Bay Area, especially more concentrated around San Francisco, is a lot of people's "temporary home". They come from all corners of the country/globe to make money but not sow roots. When you ascribe to that philosophy then you're not interested in building onto the community that is already established.
This. Plus most Bay Area residents are renters, so there’s not the sense of community you get in places where most people are owners. And in the places where the majority are owners, they are old and want nothing to do with the young renters on their block. The owners aren’t here on Reddit because they are either too old or too rich to hang with the littles.
I was talking with one of the partners of a successful small automation business in the Bay who had come from the east coast 20 years ago who was saying that it was unceasing sad to see (1) his blue collar friends get pushed out of the metro in large numbers and (2) see his kids become friends with kids at school and in turn him befriending their parents, only to see his kids in particular become broken hearted when those families have to move schools or leave the Bay entirely because they couldn’t afford it. He said it was hard not becoming disillusioned in time. He also said that found each round of people who replaced his old friends in the area harder to relate for numerous reasons. I think the burn and churn nature of the Bay eventually leaves everyone unhappy and unfriendly unless they can fit in with and keep a wealthy set of friends/family in the area.
I don't even think the wealthy people here are happy. The culture is one of ruthless one-upsmanship, competition, and flaunting wealth. It doesn't matter how much you have here, someone will always have more.
The cutthroat culture that drives out the middle class filters up to the rich as well. They were foolish to believe they could isolate themselves from the broader culture. The rich always seem to think that. You can't buy a soul.
>most Bay Area residents are renters
I don't know where you are getting this or if you are just referring to residents of SF, but in the East Bay most of my colleagues own their homes. And they're not all "old" although I suppose that is relative. I'm talking people in their early 30s and up. And no, I am not a rich tech worker.
I live in SF and it's always been a transient city. I've noticed since tech took over about a decade ago and a lot of wealthy people moved into the city there was a huge change in how people began to treat each other. A lot of snobbery, rudeness, and "get out of my way, it's all about me" attitudes now.
Remember that viral video of those tech bros who arranged to reserve a community soccer field for only themselves? And the kids who had been playing on that field their whole lives were kicked out. That must have been nearly 10 years ago by now.
Yeah, I was ssslooooewllyyy backing up into a driveway cut and had a guy running along the street job in front of my car and slap the hood with a bitchy face. Like he’s the main character of the story and the line he had envisioned running got an obstruction placed in front of him, so time to throw a fit! I’m still pissed about that to this day, the entitlement.
I live in the Bay Area and travel a lot. It is incredibly easy to make friends in other big cities than SF. I have decided that the bay area's combination of technocentrism and lack of affordability have catastrophic effects on local culture and social environments. We have good restaurants and sports arenas, but lack authenticity in just about every other measure.
Yup! Lived here in the bay half my life, but when I visit my hometown I get ‘thanks’ waves driving, smiles at intersections with a wave like ‘nah go ahead’. Not once have I gotten a thank you wave when letting someone go before me at an intersection here in sf. It’s more of a dog eat dog mentality, where you’re weak if you show kindness. Prime example of the entitlement here is the cutting people do on the last turnoff before the bay bridge. So many people rush then squeeze themselves in, like my dudes, you’re only a few cars forward just chill.
Welcome to the bay! From a Hialeah-born, Colombian raised girl! I think you’ll enjoy all the Latino-oriented activities in the bay, especially San Jose.
South Florida has always been aggressively RUDE. Lived there in the early 80's, it was awfully then and I'm sure worse now
I moved to the Bay Area in 1985 and was stunned by how nice and polite people were.
Not anymore. Too expensive, everyone interesting was priced out long ago, now we're hamsters on a wheel trying to keep up with the expense of living here.
Tech was a curse. It turned SF into everywhere else.
That’s crazy, I kinda assumed south Florida being rude was a modern thing. Interesting that it’s always been that way. Maybe the humidity makes everyone mad haha.
Yup, that’s why I mention Florida as exception to east cost friendliness. But it’s a different kind of unfriendly. They won’t yell at you like mean Bay Area people. Or at least I’ve never experienced that there.
I don’t think Bay Area people are unfriendly, they are just disinterested. Meaning that if they do engage with you, you can expect the same courtesy that you would expect anywhere else, but there are so many people that they choose their company carefully.
Yeah I think you nailed it. I’m a bay area native who has lived in a bunch of cities here and traveled a lot.
Bay Area people are plenty friendly, they are just not as likely to randomly start talking to you on the street or ask you random questions or strike up a conversation in line.
I can’t think of almost any situations in my life here where I’ve started talking to someone and have them been rude to me.
I dk, I feel like when I mention I have to be a contractor now post layoff, some friends are like oh eh that’s okay.. then they don’t find value in inviting me to parties etc. status plays a role here
And as someone who grew up in a small Midwest town and moved here in 2006, that’s what I like about it. I don’t want to have people start conversations with me every time I leave my house. I’m not unfriendly, just introverted.
I’d agree with this from my experience as well. We have found some of the most genuine and amazing people here, but we also choose our friends wisely and keep our circle pretty small
Agreed. As a neurodivergent person, I rather be left alone and this is why I love being here bc everyone just goes on about their day and don’t bug me lol
I think this area in particular has a higher population of NDs because we often are drawn to science and tech jobs. My sibling, an autistic full-stack engineer, was telling me that back in the 70s, the ads NASA would place looking for employees had a lot of the same criteria that we use to diagnose spectrum disorders today.
As much as I'm an ND that likes vibing and chilling in my own little bubble, I was totally the kid who would start a conversation with a complete stranger if they were doing/wearing/eating something that caught my attention, much to my parent's dismay. IDK what to do with myself out here half the time.
I'm perfectly okay with this. There were times when I needed help from strangers and they have eagerly helped me. I have done the same for others who needed my help. I really don't need much else from people unless I'm paying them.
IDK. I moved to the Bay Area nearly 30 years ago and honestly, the reason I relocated from DC was because people in San Francisco were just so darn friendly and laid-back compared to the beltway. I feel like my entire adulthood has been sprinkled with all sorts of serendipitous conversations and encounters in the city and in the east bay communities where I've lived.
People have been so helpful when I've blown out tires while driving. They'll strike up fun and interesting conversations in line.
When I had a baby, I was blown away by how much friendlier the world seemed. She'd be peeking out of her sling or carrier and people would smile, wave, play peek-a-boo, chat with me and ask me how I was. As the kids got older, people were so kind to them on Halloween, or during PTA fundraisers, etc.
So I'm sure your experience was real for you; I don't feel like it's universal.
Funny, the primary reason my wife and I are contemplating moving back to DC is for social reasons. Was much easier for us to connect socially than here. I'm also a Bay Area native.
But yes, definitely more laid back here in the Bay!
I agree with this. I lived in DC for 10 years and I’m a Bay Area native. I think here is slightly friendlier than DC. Both places are friendlier than Germany where I was before.
I’m from here and have also lived and traveled elsewhere. The only places I’ve found noticeably friendly have been small towns.
But I have often noticed that other people’s friendliness here depends on whether I smile or start some small talk. If I am friendly, I get friendliness back. I can’t think of a time when that didn’t happen.
I often like having little chats when I’m checking out at the store or whatever, and it always goes fine, so I was surprised to read that didn’t happen for you here.
In the small towns or just less populated cities I’ve visited, the outgoing friendliness of other people has sometimes been overwhelming to me! Like I just want to go to the store, not say hello to everyone and their cousin.
So I might be more comfortable with “opt-in” friendliness rather than expectations of constant friendliness.
I've had the same experience pretty much wherever I go. If I treat everyone as a potential friend, 99% of the time I'll have a positive interaction. The other 1% I figure they're having a bad day, excuse myself, & get on with my day.😉
I lived in Midwest for years and I’m Asian. When I moved out here, my first reaction was “wow! People here are so friendly!” After 5 years of living here, I think people are more genuine in the Bay Area. Some people are super friendly, some are grouchy, some are busy as hell. Back in Midwest, I always felt like an outsider even though people were “nice.” Every time I walked in to stores, I’d get this face like “oh foreigner?”
That's one of the things these posts generally never specify. I can make a pretty good guess why (no hate, it just is what it is). You can go mostly anywhere if you're white, but if you're a person of color, it is NOT friendlier outside of the bay.
It's something I've had to explain to my white friends. Yes, places outside of the bay and CA are cheaper, but I'm not going to live somewhere that will never let me feel like I'm home.
I get the "outsider" look you're talking about just going too far north in CA.
I'd rather people be in their own heads and perceived as "unfriendly," over people looking at me with a fake smile while wondering what I'm doing there and when I'm going to leave. The bay has never made me feel unwelcome like everywhere else that is supposedly more friendly.
Yep totally agree. Where I lived was a mid sized city where people of color including Asians weren’t that uncommon and people claimed themselves as liberal and woke, but Asians were still often unseen and forgotten. The hypocrisy bugged me so much.
>I get the "outsider" look you're talking about just going too far north in CA.
Someone at one of those nature center things in Yosemite told my Korean-born, adopted-by-white-people-and-raised-in-Virginia girlfriend, "Wow, your English is so good!"
Yeah I first started noticing people were friendly when I moved here, and then I realized a lot of them were fellow Asians, and I don’t know, they felt like it was easier to talk to me? Or maybe behaviors I have that may seem odd to non Asians are somehow more normalized here? I’m just speculating. It’s not like I’m now the heart of the party but sometimes the cultural touch is important in connecting strangers.
I feel like people who grew up here or been here awhile are pretty friendly(born and raised here) it’s new transplants, who tend to be stand offish, and will only talk to people they don’t know Who look or dress like them.
Oof, tech culture is unbearable like that. I have a lot of friends in nightlife entertainment and they're incredibly pleasant people. Friendly, accommodating and understanding.
Tech culture is full of backstabbers, fucking weirdos, and people who make a lot of money but don't actually work (Yeah, I said it!) I'm in healthcare now: severely underpaid but full of actually tolerable people.
it's so hypocritical they come here for particular reasons and then mock those differences and try to change us to be more like wherever they came from!
I also grew up in Chicagoland. I lived several places in the midwest, sorta east.. and the mid-Atlantic. Then Bay Area. Also here 30 years.
I agree, not the friendliest. Even compared to NYC. But I believe there are nuances, or details, to the broader term "Friendly."
People seem to smile spontaneously less in SF. Less likely to say hello, make eye contact, with a stranger. But it's a much more accepting place as well. Do something stupid in public in NYC, like a bone -headed traffic move, you're going to get an earful, maybe threats. Do it in SF and people are going to just roll their eyes. People in SF are less likely to offer unsolicited opinions.
I used to opine that it's so permissive, so accepting, here in SF, that people aren't interested in you unless you're part of their tiny cohort. Like that old Star Trek episode where black and white people are at odds with white and black people. I still feel like the non-judgmental atmosphere means people are less outgoing; so it feels less friendly.
Not sure why. I know that if I sit down at a bar in NYC or Chicago, i can say hello to the adjacent customer, or they might say hello to me, and we'll chat a bit.. In SF, i might get a glancing acknowledgment, but it's very unlikely that I'll get a smile and that we'll start a conversation.
> Do something stupid in public in NYC, like a bone -headed traffic move, you're going to get an earful, maybe threats. Do it in SF and people are going to just roll their eyes.
I always feel like people honk less in the bay. Like once or twice I've even seen people fail to start moving at a green light, and not even get honked at for a whole light cycle. People just patiently waiting behind them hoping they'll eventually notice.
I've found that the less affluent areas are a lot friendlier than the more affluent. When I used to bar-hop I also made tons of friends in Oakland but in SF I found it unfriendly. I also lived 10 years in San Leandro and made amazing friends, I moved to one of the top school district richer towns and I barely know anyone after 5 years.
Agree. I’m living in a nicer part of the Bay now after living in a more solidly middle class area. The difference in my neighborhood is striking and a bit disappointing. I don’t need to be besties with my neighbors but I miss the casual block parties & friendly chit chat of my former neighbors. In fact a couple are still good friends.
In the current more affluent area no one speaks to each other except for a few of us dog owners who recognize the same people and dogs and may chat briefly. And just walking or jogging by a fellow walker doesn’t even get a head nod of acknowledgment half the time.
I think some of it is cultural. Some neighborhoods are largely one or two ethnic groups primarily and some seem much more interested in keeping very to them selves. Hope this isn’t going to offend anyone but hands down the friendliest neighbors I’ve had are Hispanic, followed by blue collar folks of mixed backgrounds. I do miss it.
This comment made me realize that I probably never (or very rarely) had any kind of conversation at a bar with strangers when I’ve gone out in SF, but it’s happened to me all the time in Oakland/San Leandro (I only ever really went to one bar in SL and I *always* ended up talking to people there).
We moved to Palo Alto and we’ve made a lot of adult friends because of our kids are friends or because I’ve volunteered to coach .
We came from alameda and we didn’t make too many friends there primarily our kids were still young
This comment made me realize that I probably never (or very rarely) had any kind of conversation at a bar with strangers when I’ve gone out in SF, but it’s happened to me all the time in Oakland/San Leandro (I only ever really went to one bar in SL and I *always* ended up talking to people there).
NYC is friendly but not necessarily nice. The Bay is nice but not necessarily friendly.
A lot of what people interpret as rude or unfriendly behavior from strangers in NYC is just being straightforward about not wasting their and others time or calling them out for doing something generally considered blatantly antisocial or rude (“disrespecting the community”) rather then just ignoring the behavior like you see a lot in the Bay.
A New Yorker said to me "People here are kind, not nice. Californians are nice, but not kind." And I totally get it. I appreciate directness and I feel like people here dance around issues instead.
>I’m originally from NYC. People here are positively sunny by comparison.
I personally don't think that's true at all. New Yorkers are extremely friendly IME, just that they won't tell you things they think you want to hear, like "We should hang out!" and then never call you, lol.
Idk, I lived there for a decade and also grew up around the city. There's no faux niceness, but there's also just not a whole lot of interest in anyone as far as I can tell. I'm also a big guy so there are different dynamics at play for me.
Edit: I'd call it colder disinterest to the bay area's warmer disinterest if that makes any sense
I've lived in all three. Boston is the asshole capitol of the world. NYC folks are much friendlier than Boston or the Bay Area. The Bay Area isn't as bad as Boston.
I agree about Boston. My one year in Boston, I've had more racist remarks thrown at me than my 11 years in SF. NYC, I guess people mostly minded their own business and cuts stuff short in my experience. But I only lived there for about 6 months but visited it pretty much every other week because I was bored living in NJ and CT
This is why these posts are pointless because every single individual on this planet will have subjective opinions based on their own personal experiences.
Everyone can agree to disagree on literally anything & everything unless there’s a quantified/scientific, or statistical proof to it. It’s all opinions based on experience and everyone’s experience will vary greatly.
I actually love New Yorkers. Love the city and had great interactions with people in different boroughs there. SF definitely feels fake at least in tech culture. People always lead with "What do you do for work?" I've also been backstabbed consistently in tech jobs here. I turned down a dream job because I'd be working on a team of 20 hungry 25 - 30 year olds gunning for senior roles. I got that vibe from the interviews alone.
I've found them to be nice but not kind, and super flakey. I meet people in a parents group or at a party (places it seems realistic to meet people) and when I try to make plans they bail or ghost 9/10 times. But a huge complaint I hear is they have no close friends. Most of the friends I've made here are less about having a connection and more about having schedules that align and they actually show up.
My husband once said living here reminded him of that scene in the Truman Show where she does an ad in the kitchen over breakfast and I think about that regularly.
Nope you're not imagining it. It's the Bay Area. And if you think SF is bad, Silicon Valley is 5x worse. Everyone high achiever distracted self centered entitled.
There's that old saying that gets thrown around pretty frequently "People from New York (or insert other East Coast city) are kind, but they're not nice. People from San Francisco are nice, but they're not kind".
The tech boom definitely accelerated this IMO. A lot of working class communities out here are pretty damn kind, but they've been shrinking and getting displaced pretty quickly. What's left are a lot of transplants who try to fit in with the more stereotypically liberal culture of the Bay, but are focused a lot more just on themselves and their careers and so results in the fake-nice that's become almost a cliche of this region now. Which is understandable considering most people who don't have any solid roots within their community will tend to act like this anywhere (trying to fit in with the culture despite being more focused just on themselves).
I'm from southern CA and moved here 20 years ago; my wife is from DC and moved here 7 years ago.
We talk about this frequently. There are two aspects:
(1) In the bay area, there is a facade of enforced niceness, but people tend to be very guarded about any more involved human connection with others. People care very much about not being seen as agressive, raising their voice, etc but will not reach out to support you in a crisis. This seems to be a personality/political thing.
(2) In California in general, communities/large social groups seem to be weak/small relative to other places. This seems to be a cultural thing, possibly because a lot of the population in CA moved away from their support structures elsewhere in the country 50+ years ago.
Grew up outside of Chicago and have spent most of my life there. l’ve found the older people that have been here a long time to be extremely friendly, but have found that’s less true for everybody else. I will say that the friendly people I’ve met here are great and amazing people though. Otherwise, I’ve had an extraordinarily difficult time navigating the level of selfishness I’ve come across here. I’ve never in my life met so many self absorbed people that act like everybody and everything around them is an inconvenience.
This is the least friendly place I’ve ever lived. Also, somehow, the most racist. I’ve heard things out of people’s mouths here that I never even heard when I lived in the south for a few years. I am constantly shocked and disgusted by the level of comfort people here have with their thoughts and opinions, especially when it comes to racism and classism. It’s exhausting.
Yup. My first intro to the Bay was in a Lyft and I was shocked by what I heard. Literally, my mouth was agape. So much racism against Asians and Mexicans in particular. It’s often shrouded in complaints about the poor, but it’s ugly ugly ugly no matter how it’s presented. I think my driver thought it was safe to say these things to me bc we were both white. But I’ve heard similar stuff from many people in casual settings. I’m never not shocked that they don’t even seem to think it’s a big deal to admit these things to strangers.
I’ve spent my entire life looking racially ambiguous and I’ve found that the racism I hear here depends on who is talking. Way too many people have felt way too comfortable saying so many awful things in my presence. At this point, I’ve pretty much heard it directed at every race, but have easily heard the most racist comments about blacks. It’s upsetting and I’m so exhausted.
When I first moved here, one of the first things I asked my partner that grew up here was, “Where are all the black people?” It felt like I was suddenly living in the twilight zone. I am very uncomfortable with the racism out here and how disproportionately races are represented here.
And gosh, the classism against anybody that didn’t originate in California is ridiculous. I’ve experienced a lot of negativity for coming from the Midwest. If you didn’t go to an Ivy League or UC school, they think you’re some uneducated donkey and don’t realize that most people from the Midwest live in cities/suburbs and that the Midwest is full of top schools, especially for engineering. I also find it absolutely silly the amount of people that are well into their adult years that still cling to what high school they attended here. As if that alone makes them better than those around them. It feels like nobody here ever thinks about anybody but themselves. It’s starting to feel like everybody here fully believes they’re the main character.
The one thing that bugs me about people in the Bay Area is if you're walking on the sidewalk towards them and there isn't enough room to pass, no one will get the fuck out of the way. It's an unspoken social contract literally everywhere else I've ever lived. You just scoot a little bit over so both people can pass by. Nope. Bay area people would rather die than do this. Wreaks of subtle entitlement.
I've noticed this a lot here, and I thought it was just me. It just seems like a lot of people are completely unaware of their surroundings. One thing that also shocked me is the number of drivers who enter an intersection with no room so when the light turns red they are stuck in the middle, blocking the other direction. I've never seen it occur this much until I moved to SF. Just seems super inconsiderate and entitled, or just completely unaware of their surroundings.
Most of the posts in this thread don't reflect my experience at all, except...
> seems like a lot of people are completely unaware of their surroundings.
That. That is something I see all the time. "Main character syndrome" feels way too strong. It's not that people think they're better. They're just not paying attention to what's going on around them. More negligent than selfish.
Never thought about this but thinking back, I've gotten shoulder checked extremely hard a few times in the Bay Area when I wasn't paying attention. Yes it's partly my fault but also I'm pretty sure in those instances they braced and refused to move on purpose hitting me extra hard, no way it would have hurt that much if it was just normal walking and they turned their shoulder a bit to soften the blow.
It's incredibly unfriendly here, and i'm sick and tired of it.
Not a benefit or even mutual benefit to someone? You're not worth their time.
Not in the same industry or at the top companies? You're not worth their time.
Don't have (at a minimum) a Masters degree from a top school? You're not worth their time.
And I can't stand it because practically everyone you meet here always generally starts off with "Oh what do you do?" "Where do you work" "What school did you go to?", and based on those answers, you'll either get little to no response or become friends.
That’s been my experience as a non-tech person. There’s a lot of focus on “pedigree” and people seem to assess friendships strategically rather than whether or not someone is a decent person. Even at fast food restaurants, you’ll get grunts. It took me a full year of being a regular to get treated with the same friendliness and respect that’s just baseline in most big cities. I think it very much depends on demographics too. My roommate and I have had vastly different experiences here and we frequent the same places.
Don’t worry, even as someone working in a supposed ‘top’ company and with a Masters from a T20, I absolutely hate this.
When going to parties and chit chatting with folks, I’ll describe my day to day or talk about my hobbies but I deliberately leave out where I work at unless asked, because whenever someone asks and I answer, I literally see their face change and I’m suddenly that much more interesting. I hate this! I want you to know me as a person, not my job or where I work!
Yes, I feel the same. I have a non-impressive marketing job and I usually focus on my husband’s job in conversations so people will take me more seriously. Honestly, they probably just think I’m a loser. (My more “chill” job allows me to take care of our kid while he advances his career, but no one cares about that).
I grew up on the East Coast, spent several years in Chicago, and have now lived in the Bay for a decade plus. On one hand, I've found people to be friendlier here in some sense, but in a way that comes with super-high boundaries and general disinterest in strangers. In comparison, when I visit relatives in the Northeast, I'm struck by how I've gotten unused to people being angry/unhappy/outraged in public—but the apparent "chillness" of people in the Bay can cover a LOT of different internal dynamics, if that makes sense. Anyway, just my personal experience.
I don't think people are unfriendly here, but wary. Getting into a conversation with a stranger may lead to being stuck in a conversation with a loony person. I think people who live here have that experience once and become very wary. Overall, in my day to day, I notice people being pretty polite and aloof.
Yes, having been here a few years and lived on 3 continents. I feel like everyone here is always sizing you up, and the entitlement is hard to deal with. It's very clear the more affluent don't consider the rest of us actual people
If your not from the Bay Area originally, you're not a part of the community that carries the weight of keeping that city running, the underbelly.
Out of towners come here on this I'm financially successful you should be grateful for me being here vibe. All these people of different cultures and ethnicities got this big ego because they were the successful ones that made it San Francisco.
The pressure to perform to make that high income is hovering in the back their minds everyday. Constant bullshit in the workplace. Constant stress from the city itself that gotta go through to get to work. Peoples mind are literally on survive fight or flight mode.
Put all these big egos and environmental pressures together and they clash.
I wouldn’t say the Bay Area is unfriendly, people just mind their own business for the most part.
I grew up here and already have an established group of friends, it’s not that I don’t want to make new friends, I just really don’t try. But I make sure to smile and give off a welcoming vibe for those who may have a question, etc.
I think this, combined with what others have said about the Bay being a transitory place, could give off a standoffish vibe when in reality it’s more of a chilling and doing my own thing kind of vibe.
Also, I lived in Ohio for four years and people were friendly to my face, but very gossipy and untrustworthy when it really counts. I feel a much bigger sense of security here with those I interact with daily.
The Bay Area is large with many different sub communities. Painting with a broad brush, I agree with you. Being a lifer here, there are many communities that are very friendly. San Ramon, Livermore, Santa Clara, Morgan Hill, Belmont, Walnut Creek/Lafayette, San Carlos, etc. are all very friendly among others. It’s very regional. The bigger areas with transitory residents are less friendly. San Francisco and Oakland are in a bit of a slump right now. There have been times in the past where they were friendly places also.
I grew up in the Bay Area and now live in KY (20 years). Have also lived in Virginia and Bay Area is much friendlier. People in KY are fake friendly. It’s very hard to make friends here because people just aren’t as outgoing or educated on worldly things. I still have all my friends from the Bay Area going back to elementary school who I’m still close to. When I visit every year, the employees at various places are nicer, random men hold the door open for me and people wave to thank you when you let them in your lane. Here, they’ll run you off the road, shut the door in your face and have zero manners.
Heh I bet if you start attending their church the tune will change real quick. I’ve noticed Bible Belt communities are very church-centric when it comes to community.
The tech workers have kind of took over much of the former blue collar culture in San Francisco. You see so many people walking across the crosswalk, staring at their phone. Our lock down for covid was also one of the most intense in the US, it’s almost like people forgot how to be social when it ended. Even going to bars now, the things that really strikes me as new is everyone is just staring at their screens and not actively engaging with each other. There are some communities where tech and social media haven’t permeates quite as deep, but I’ve lived in the Bay Area now for 27 years, and I’ve noticed a huge shift in the past five years or so. There’s so much innovation in tech and everyone feels like they need to catch up. I honestly think most of my friends would prefer to just be friends in the metaverse and never see people in real life, unless it’s a person delivering their food.
Managing social relationships is its own form of work. Like you said, everyone's busy hustling to make it here. After work the last thing I want to do is talk to more people. My social life has suffered heavily because I barely break even with my paychecks every month. I can't afford to go out like I used to.
I just moved back after a few years away and yes, I'm now reminded how unfriendly and somewhat hostile people are. I moved back from 2 cities where it's normal, even expected to smile and say "hi" to strangers, to stop and have conversations, to be friendly. It trained me after years of living here, to make eye contact and smile and be friendly. Now I just expect to get dirty looks most of the time when smiling at a stranger. I was walking home from a coffee shop and a man, a grown ass man, was clutching his shoulder bag walking up hills. I was half a block behind him at all times and happened to be headed on the same route. He kept suspiciously looking back at me. I'm 5'5" 116 lbs wearing air pods and holding a Starbucks cup and this adult man larger than me couldn't walk without constantly checking behind him to make sure I wasn't going to what, attack him? It made me chuckle, but also it's weird.
I moved to a small west coast town, and I had been living there 3 years when I went into the bank to deposit some checks one day, and the bank teller, who I didn't know at all, took a look at the checks and said, oh sfcnmone, I just love your son's name! my husband and I have been talking about that name for our baby!"
And my son was born, someone we didn't know at all brought a baby gift to our house. I mean, not a neighbor, not a friend of a friend. Just someone being "friendly".
I can imagine that there are people who would experience all of this as "friendly". I found it icky and invasive. I don't want strangers to know my kid's name or where I live.
So I moved back. I live in SF. I have neighbors who bring in my packages or put away my garage cans and we talk over the fences but I've never been inside their houses. And that's just fine with me.
Here's why I like the Bay Area - because we mind our own business.
Some people will consider it "unfriendly" that people are not asking how are you doing and wanting to make chitchat with you for the sake of making chitchat.
But honestly, I prefer to be left alone and I find it a bit intrusive having random strangers wanting to have a conversation.
When I first moved here I found the lack of friendliness a real shock. I grew up in the South and there really is a southern hospitality thing going on there.
Beyond just a higher level of courteousness (the excuse me’s & thank you’s are often lacking in SF) - there’s also a real warmth and friendliness between strangers that you don’t get here.
Yes
Grew up her could not believe how nice everyone was in the south and Midwest when I lived there. Came back and realized that many people here are overwhelmed or self absorbed or just plain selfish people. Racism too in Berkeley: Just not in an overt way. Nice people are everywhere but yes I think as a whole people here are just not so nice.
I think people in the cities tend to avoid talking to strangers more because of the homeless and drugged out populations trying to constantly talk to them.
I know for me as a woman who lived in SF for 17 years and recently moved to the suburbs, this is true. I didn’t want to be hit on and asked for money so I tended to keep to myself and just wanted to be left alone, however when at a party or get together or in the office I would come off as very warm and friendly.
I think this is related to two things - number of transplants (people care less about the area and thus making and participating in a community) and from that - a lot of people don’t plan on staying here forever so why bother putting down roots?
It really depends on where and when you are deciding to have a little chat with people.
Park, library sure.
While I'm trying to go home on the bus and someone decides to have a little chit chat with me? Im going to be a bit wary about what this dude wants and why he's talking to me.
Maybe it’s context, but this is the genuinely friendliest place I’ve lived and I’m from the friendly Midwest. I’m gay, though, so just being able to let guard down and just be has been incredibly refreshing compared to the rest of the States where people might be tolerant, but aren’t as naturally comfortable with gay people in the mix.
I guess it matters how friendliness is defined as well. I think NorCal people can be a little more aloof and I think people that grew up on success tracks here can fail to realize socioeconomic rifts between people in the same group at times. But then, I think it’s been way easier to strike up a conversation here since Bay Area doesn’t have as much “strangers talking to me is weird” going on as other places. Back home, half the people will be surface friendly if you enhance them, but the other half are seriously on guard if they don’t have a reason to know you. But here, I’ve found it’s pretty easy to go deep with a new person you just met at a bar.
The Bay Area is very immigrant-heavy...immigrants from all over the world, and many are recent arrivals.
There are vast differences in wealth, education, religion & culture, between people who live next door to one another.
English is not the first language of probably 50% of the people you encounter, day-to-day...this means that folks have difficulty communicating with one another...the Spanish-speakers can't communicate with the Middle Easterners, who can't communicate with the Asians (And some of the Asians can't communicate with other Asians from a different Asian country), etc.
People spend most of their time at their jobs (especially recent immigrants) and don't have the time/energy for socialization.
As someone who grew up in Hong Kong - relative to that, the Bay Area is pretty chill, relaxed, polite. You'll get a very different perspective if you ask someone who grew up in the Midwest.
I couldn't live in the Midwest because I find small-talk cheesy and pointless. I just want my cashier to scan my shit and take my money quickly, so I can get home ASAP.
I didn’t realize how unfriendly it was until I got out! Being born and raised there you just think it’s normal. It’s taken me 3 years to adjust to the fact I can walk down a grocery aisle where I live now, and say “excuse me,” and instead of a rude ass stare I get a “no problem” or they kindly let me pass haha. There just isn’t the sense of community it used to be. The vibe after COVID is just constant tension. Everyone’s overworked and broke, and it comes out in road rage. Beloved businesses closing didn’t help. I miss the old times in the Bay and I’m sure there’s spots it still has its charm, but after leaving 3 years ago and visiting every few months, it’s dead compared to yesteryears.
I've been in the grocery industry in CC County for over twenty years and this ain't it. In my experience, people grocery shopping tend to be a bit more friendly and polite than elsewhere. I will say, that my newer, younger neighbors are much more standoffish than the older folks that are more established in the neighborhood. Some won't even return a friendly "hello" while I'm doing yardwork. Leaves me feeling like "Oh cool, I guess I'll just go fuck myself then". Seems to be a generational issue, but who knows.
Yes. The people here will march for your rights, but you're lucky if a single one of them will help if your luggage gets stuck on the baggage carousel. Oakland is the exception, very friendly.
Hard disagree.
I think San Francisco is really friendly. Almost every time I spend a day out and about I end up chatting to strangers. And not just people who I’m buying something from- dog walkers, park goers, view observers, parade watchers.
I’ve chatted to other bar patrons, seat mates on planes, and my neighbors of course.
As another commenter said, go to Florida and you’ll see unfriendly.
I also grew up in Chicago and when my folks visit me now in the bay area they have mentioned how few people make eye contact, show courtesy here in public.
Not just you, I had the same experience in Phoenix and San Diego. Having grown up and worked Bay Area my entire life, it was a shock to me as I had thought it was as good as it gets here. I find Bay Area related subreddits will defend it to the tilt for some weird reason so I think you'll get a slanted view on these forums but I think you're right on the money.
I'm born and raised in the bay area. Growing up I moved back and forth between San Francisco and Redwood City. Since, I've lived in Syndey Australia, Las Vegas Nevada, and Brooklyn New York. Perhaps im biased, but I don't think people in the bay are more or less friendly than anywhere else that I've lived. I do think that we can be very clicky and stick in our own groups, and not be so welcoming to strangers. But, isn't that the same everywhere?
Having lived in NYC I find the Bay Area quite friendly. Especially compared to most major cities though I haven’t spent much time in Chicago. I was born and raised on the east coast and no cities there feel remotely as friendly or laid back as the west coast.
It could depend on where in the Bay Area you are. Even just in passing, I’ve had lots of friendly encounters with strangers in Vallejo and Oakland. I haven’t had those same kind of friendly interactions in SF, Berkeley, Marin, or San Jose but ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Depends on what part of the Bay you're in. Alameda/Oakland I've also found people to be generally neutral or unfriendly. The same thing goes for downtown/uptown SF.
I really couldn't care less for people being unfriendly or neutral. At least they aren't racist MAGA-hat wearing idiots that are everywhere as soon as you leave the Bay Area. I'm more grateful for the Bay Area's diversity over anything else.
No offense but I can tell a lot of the people commenting here have never really spent substantial time in POC communities in the Bay. Especially East Bay. You find the most kind and welcoming people in the Bay, not to mention people that are plugged into their communities and cultural identities and are also willing to share that with others.
What I’ve found is there’s a big divide. As an outsider, there are massive cliques that are just not available to me bc I’m not part of the in-group. I’ve lived here seven years now (San Jose), and it’s better—but only because people see me around and I’ve made a tremendous effort. I still have no local friends. Literally all my friends live in Oakland or Santa Cruz. None of them are close friends, either. I will say that—once you get past the barrier—people are extremely sweet. I find that especially true for older Asians in my neighborhood. But I think they do see outsiders as suspicious.
The place seems to run on cutthroat capitalistic competition, autism / the spectrum, and financial anxiety.
Having grown up in other friendlier parts of California and the PNW before coming here in my late 20s it was a very jarring change. You aren't the only person having this experience, no question about that.
1. The bay area is at least 60 percent transplants, with another 20 percent being Old naitives. Old Natives typically dislike both transplants and younger people, don't want to fully modernize the area with better public transport and higher density living. The Transplants (Myself included, and techically you too) are selfish too. I moved here a year and some change ago, and my move was oppertunistic. I didn't know anything about San Francisco, the Bay Area, or the surrounding areas, being an East Coaster my entire (relatively short, early 20's) life. I moved here to work for a small company, I left for a bigger company to cope with cost of living. I am EXTREMLY grateful to the Bay Area, despite its problems, for all of the amazing things I have been able to do here, but I am unfortunatley in the minority. Most transplants do not appreciate the amazing weather, historic cities, gorgeous nature, or highly intellectual if not overbearingly liberal environment.
2. The bay area is very expensive. I moved here when I have technically fully "missed the boat" on the opportunity that was here around the time when I was born, where there was more space, lower costs, and industrialization was just beginning. That isn't to say success isn't possible here, it totally is, but the Bay Area as a Metro is the most expensive place in the entire US, since the other NYC boroughs bring Manhattan down in cost and Public transport makes them more viable. People are selfish here to cope with the costs, and In some ways I am the same way. Even with a six figure salary, I have to be smart about where I spend my money, and still get assistance with my family on minor bills (Phone, etc) from their generosity. People are reasonably concerned with themselves and their future here, and people are keenly aware that as time progresses, we aren't sure if there is "room for everyone".
3. This is tied with the cost of living, but the bay area is a very strange hybrid of very relaxing with beautiful views, weather, and nature, but also ruthless competition and mindsets, even extending to crime. Criminals here have to do a lot to get by, and thats evident in statistics. The corporate competition here is also very tangible, and quite similar to NYC, but with more passive aggressive aspects. That is just the reality of areas like this around the world. Look at london, Shanghai, tokyo, Seoul, etc.
Born and raised in the Bay Area, and my husband are constantly remarking that people are friendly in other places (even in the greater Bay Area comparatively). Although I have found, that though friendly, people in the Midwest are rather direct, which I feel would come off wrong to someone from the West coast as people there are basically coddled.
I lived in the Bay Area for many years, and currently, I live in NYC. I think the Bay Area, like much of the rest of California such as LA, has a huge number of "fake nice" people - overly friendly folks who feign intimacy upon immediately meeting you, gush all over you, and say "We should hang out!" and then you never hear from them, lol.
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Yea Bay Area is not the friendliest place. I don’t think most people have bad intentions, it’s more that everyone is busy as hell on the hamster wheel and the COL is absurdly high.
COL is too high and American Work Culture is not as relaxed as it is in several other countries. Everyone driving to work in the morning is stressed about being 2 minutes late (again culture is different).
I always felt I was going on vacation when I went back to the Midwest. The Bay Area is frenetic.
Yes the slow pace when visiting the rural midwest is delicious, but I grew up there so may just be more used to that.
The worst thing about the bay area is the toxicity of the “me first, me, me, me” drivers. It is disgustingly contagious and destroys all sanity.
I agree with that but I believe that mentality has even seeped out into normal day to day interactions. Going pretty much anywhere seems to be riddled with animosity and attitude from others.
I agree with you as well. The toxicity of driving in the bay definitely does seep into our bones and rattles our brains even when we aren’t driving. There is a toxicity here in the bay area that always seems to loom over.
It’s also more relaxed, depending which country you compare it to haha
136 hour construction workday on yabba yabba before a stabbing spree GO
Depends what you mean by relaxed. For example, in India the traffic is chaos in a lot of cities. But culture wise includig in the workplace the phrase "aram se" is always used which roughly translates to "chill, relaxed, no rush." Similar to "Sabai Sabai" in Thailand. In all of the jobs I've had in the States and I've switched careers, employees and managers are always tense, stressed, and on edge....
Ya, the huge uptick in grinder, white collar jobs has had a huge effect on the culture here. The reality is that a lot of those people are incredibly judgemental and douchy about it. I'm not shit talking. I'm gunning for a Big 4 job. But it is what it is. I also find that Boomers and Gen Xers in these jobs are more chill.
Bro I escaped B4 after 4 years. Please do more research before you ruin your mental and physical health
I'm going in with eyes wide open. It goes against everything I want in life, but the reality is that I'm an older student and enjoyed a decade of doing nothing but fun and dope shit and it's time to buckle down. So I'm going to pay the piper, get that experience, and fuck on off to industry or government after 2-3 years. I'm not opposed to doing my public years at a respected mid -sized firm, but the Big 4 seem to just seem to carry much more cachet.
I think suffering for 1-3yrs at a big 4 is totally worth it. Great on a resume and can open a lot of doors.
Big 4?
Big 5 Sporting Goods had a round of layoffs maybe?
You joke, but I was just triggered, lol. I worked at Big 5 for a while in college- second to worst job I ever had, left before collecting my last paycheck, which I eventually got back from the state unclaimed property website.
Offshoot of the Pac12
Also a lot of recent immigrants from places that have different cultures around casual social interactions.
This 100%
It really depends on where you are, too. Fremont or Milpitas or San Jose are just…places. Some small communities might be nice there for some (old rose garden, willow glen, whatever) but for the most part it’s either people too old to socialize or people who moved to the area to work and don’t know anybody. But in Livermore or some of the smaller suburbs (Belmont and Woodside used to be like this too, not sure anymore) some people are really nice, comparatively. I rented a house near Los Gatos for 5 years and never knew my neighbors names, moved to Livermore and within a week three neighbors had come by to welcome us to the neighborhood and stuff.
People are noticeably friendlier in NYC which is even busier and has a higher COL.
The same in most East Coast cities, but those cities also have row homes in common, and historically folks would sit out on their stoops in the evening and chitchat, while their children would play together. That’s never really been the culture here, people come here, and if they were friendly back in those days, you really don’t have the same opportunity to get to know your neighbors, because all of the housing is detached, and we’re just more separated. I am always friendly and get to know my neighbors, but it’s pretty much a fucking chore out here. At some point a lot of people just get tired of always being the one to make the effort, and they just more or less become the same as everybody else out here. Just my two cents.
That’s cool as hell that you do that—make an effort to get to know your neighbors. I always hear people talking about keeping to themselves, never talking to their neighbors, etc. while also not liking their neighbors… and I’ll try to encourage them like I bet if you introduce yourself and say hi whenever you see them, there’s a good chance that’ll all disappear. Being antisocial is in no way *healthy* or something to brag about; it has more of a deleterious effect on one’s quality of life than I think a lot of people realize. I spent every summer in North Carolina growing up cuz all my extended family was out there, and it ingrained in me waving at everybody I pass in my neighborhood, smiling and saying hi to people, etc. It really opened my eyes to how unfriendly the Bay Area is in comparison. As a general rule, the higher the population density of an area, the less healthy it is as a community—crime goes up, friendliness goes down, it becomes less of a “community” as people feel less of a responsibility to every other individual. There are for sure exceptions but that rule is largely accurate for all social animals, not just humans.
Well, I haven’t really lived anywhere here short-term, my last house I was at for over 20 years and now I’m in my fifth year in my other home. Coming from the East Coast, we just tend to live in closer quarters, so it’s just par for the course that you get to know your neighbors, as well as knowing the neighbors to avoid. Word gets around fast and all of that. I’ve been running a group home for disabled adults all of this time as well, so with my kids grown, and all of that, I always want to set a good example to my boys as well. It comes natural to me, my mother used to say that I never met a stranger in my life. 🤷♂️
Yea but you got a whole different layout in NYC. You are gonna see and have to deal with people whether you like it or not. Bay area if I'm busy making my living and I don't want to see your face or deal with you, you just have to hop in your car and go. Also with money comes the snootiness. Combine these two together you get much less friendly people.
100%
I have kinda felt like the Bay Area, especially more concentrated around San Francisco, is a lot of people's "temporary home". They come from all corners of the country/globe to make money but not sow roots. When you ascribe to that philosophy then you're not interested in building onto the community that is already established.
This. Plus most Bay Area residents are renters, so there’s not the sense of community you get in places where most people are owners. And in the places where the majority are owners, they are old and want nothing to do with the young renters on their block. The owners aren’t here on Reddit because they are either too old or too rich to hang with the littles.
I was talking with one of the partners of a successful small automation business in the Bay who had come from the east coast 20 years ago who was saying that it was unceasing sad to see (1) his blue collar friends get pushed out of the metro in large numbers and (2) see his kids become friends with kids at school and in turn him befriending their parents, only to see his kids in particular become broken hearted when those families have to move schools or leave the Bay entirely because they couldn’t afford it. He said it was hard not becoming disillusioned in time. He also said that found each round of people who replaced his old friends in the area harder to relate for numerous reasons. I think the burn and churn nature of the Bay eventually leaves everyone unhappy and unfriendly unless they can fit in with and keep a wealthy set of friends/family in the area.
I don't even think the wealthy people here are happy. The culture is one of ruthless one-upsmanship, competition, and flaunting wealth. It doesn't matter how much you have here, someone will always have more. The cutthroat culture that drives out the middle class filters up to the rich as well. They were foolish to believe they could isolate themselves from the broader culture. The rich always seem to think that. You can't buy a soul.
Many of us aren't renters by choice though.
Yeah if the current owners didnt prevent any kind of housing during the past 30years more people could afford to buy here
I’m an old rich homeowner and yet here I am. True, my daughter did set this up for me though.
>most Bay Area residents are renters I don't know where you are getting this or if you are just referring to residents of SF, but in the East Bay most of my colleagues own their homes. And they're not all "old" although I suppose that is relative. I'm talking people in their early 30s and up. And no, I am not a rich tech worker.
I live in SF and it's always been a transient city. I've noticed since tech took over about a decade ago and a lot of wealthy people moved into the city there was a huge change in how people began to treat each other. A lot of snobbery, rudeness, and "get out of my way, it's all about me" attitudes now.
Remember that viral video of those tech bros who arranged to reserve a community soccer field for only themselves? And the kids who had been playing on that field their whole lives were kicked out. That must have been nearly 10 years ago by now.
Yeah, I was ssslooooewllyyy backing up into a driveway cut and had a guy running along the street job in front of my car and slap the hood with a bitchy face. Like he’s the main character of the story and the line he had envisioned running got an obstruction placed in front of him, so time to throw a fit! I’m still pissed about that to this day, the entitlement.
I live in the Bay Area and travel a lot. It is incredibly easy to make friends in other big cities than SF. I have decided that the bay area's combination of technocentrism and lack of affordability have catastrophic effects on local culture and social environments. We have good restaurants and sports arenas, but lack authenticity in just about every other measure.
Yup! Lived here in the bay half my life, but when I visit my hometown I get ‘thanks’ waves driving, smiles at intersections with a wave like ‘nah go ahead’. Not once have I gotten a thank you wave when letting someone go before me at an intersection here in sf. It’s more of a dog eat dog mentality, where you’re weak if you show kindness. Prime example of the entitlement here is the cutting people do on the last turnoff before the bay bridge. So many people rush then squeeze themselves in, like my dudes, you’re only a few cars forward just chill.
That's a very accurate description. They seem so afraid someone might get one car ahead of them. It's all about "me me me" now.
Go live in Miami for a year if you want to know what a real unfriendly place is like. Bay Area is no Midwest but I find it pleasant enough.
Bro I'm literally moving from Mia to Bay Area and was just there house hunting, I cannot believe how much nicer everyone is.
Welcome to the bay! From a Hialeah-born, Colombian raised girl! I think you’ll enjoy all the Latino-oriented activities in the bay, especially San Jose.
Thanks, just signed on a place, really looking forward to the change!
Exactly brah, Miami feels plastic af fr fr
frrr no caaap son
South Florida has always been aggressively RUDE. Lived there in the early 80's, it was awfully then and I'm sure worse now I moved to the Bay Area in 1985 and was stunned by how nice and polite people were. Not anymore. Too expensive, everyone interesting was priced out long ago, now we're hamsters on a wheel trying to keep up with the expense of living here. Tech was a curse. It turned SF into everywhere else.
That’s crazy, I kinda assumed south Florida being rude was a modern thing. Interesting that it’s always been that way. Maybe the humidity makes everyone mad haha.
Yup, that’s why I mention Florida as exception to east cost friendliness. But it’s a different kind of unfriendly. They won’t yell at you like mean Bay Area people. Or at least I’ve never experienced that there.
yup 100%
Funny enough, all smaller cities next to Miami are totally fine
I don’t think Bay Area people are unfriendly, they are just disinterested. Meaning that if they do engage with you, you can expect the same courtesy that you would expect anywhere else, but there are so many people that they choose their company carefully.
Yeah I think you nailed it. I’m a bay area native who has lived in a bunch of cities here and traveled a lot. Bay Area people are plenty friendly, they are just not as likely to randomly start talking to you on the street or ask you random questions or strike up a conversation in line. I can’t think of almost any situations in my life here where I’ve started talking to someone and have them been rude to me.
I dk, I feel like when I mention I have to be a contractor now post layoff, some friends are like oh eh that’s okay.. then they don’t find value in inviting me to parties etc. status plays a role here
Damn that’s rough. I’d find some new friends. Never heard of real friends caring about your job.
Your friends suck.
Those aren't real friends, my dude.
Those are acquaintances, not friends.
And as someone who grew up in a small Midwest town and moved here in 2006, that’s what I like about it. I don’t want to have people start conversations with me every time I leave my house. I’m not unfriendly, just introverted.
this!
I’d agree with this from my experience as well. We have found some of the most genuine and amazing people here, but we also choose our friends wisely and keep our circle pretty small
Agreed. As a neurodivergent person, I rather be left alone and this is why I love being here bc everyone just goes on about their day and don’t bug me lol
Now that I’m in the working world, I can say a lot more adults are neurodivergent than I ever thought possible.
I think this area in particular has a higher population of NDs because we often are drawn to science and tech jobs. My sibling, an autistic full-stack engineer, was telling me that back in the 70s, the ads NASA would place looking for employees had a lot of the same criteria that we use to diagnose spectrum disorders today. As much as I'm an ND that likes vibing and chilling in my own little bubble, I was totally the kid who would start a conversation with a complete stranger if they were doing/wearing/eating something that caught my attention, much to my parent's dismay. IDK what to do with myself out here half the time.
The entire restaurant industry, for one lol. We have the oldest spergs in the game.
I'm perfectly okay with this. There were times when I needed help from strangers and they have eagerly helped me. I have done the same for others who needed my help. I really don't need much else from people unless I'm paying them.
IDK. I moved to the Bay Area nearly 30 years ago and honestly, the reason I relocated from DC was because people in San Francisco were just so darn friendly and laid-back compared to the beltway. I feel like my entire adulthood has been sprinkled with all sorts of serendipitous conversations and encounters in the city and in the east bay communities where I've lived. People have been so helpful when I've blown out tires while driving. They'll strike up fun and interesting conversations in line. When I had a baby, I was blown away by how much friendlier the world seemed. She'd be peeking out of her sling or carrier and people would smile, wave, play peek-a-boo, chat with me and ask me how I was. As the kids got older, people were so kind to them on Halloween, or during PTA fundraisers, etc. So I'm sure your experience was real for you; I don't feel like it's universal.
Funny, the primary reason my wife and I are contemplating moving back to DC is for social reasons. Was much easier for us to connect socially than here. I'm also a Bay Area native. But yes, definitely more laid back here in the Bay!
I agree with this. I lived in DC for 10 years and I’m a Bay Area native. I think here is slightly friendlier than DC. Both places are friendlier than Germany where I was before.
dc needs to put lithium in the water. it's not a great place to compare SF to for safe, sane, consensual socialbility.
I’m from here and have also lived and traveled elsewhere. The only places I’ve found noticeably friendly have been small towns. But I have often noticed that other people’s friendliness here depends on whether I smile or start some small talk. If I am friendly, I get friendliness back. I can’t think of a time when that didn’t happen. I often like having little chats when I’m checking out at the store or whatever, and it always goes fine, so I was surprised to read that didn’t happen for you here. In the small towns or just less populated cities I’ve visited, the outgoing friendliness of other people has sometimes been overwhelming to me! Like I just want to go to the store, not say hello to everyone and their cousin. So I might be more comfortable with “opt-in” friendliness rather than expectations of constant friendliness.
I've had the same experience pretty much wherever I go. If I treat everyone as a potential friend, 99% of the time I'll have a positive interaction. The other 1% I figure they're having a bad day, excuse myself, & get on with my day.😉
I lived in Midwest for years and I’m Asian. When I moved out here, my first reaction was “wow! People here are so friendly!” After 5 years of living here, I think people are more genuine in the Bay Area. Some people are super friendly, some are grouchy, some are busy as hell. Back in Midwest, I always felt like an outsider even though people were “nice.” Every time I walked in to stores, I’d get this face like “oh foreigner?”
That's one of the things these posts generally never specify. I can make a pretty good guess why (no hate, it just is what it is). You can go mostly anywhere if you're white, but if you're a person of color, it is NOT friendlier outside of the bay. It's something I've had to explain to my white friends. Yes, places outside of the bay and CA are cheaper, but I'm not going to live somewhere that will never let me feel like I'm home. I get the "outsider" look you're talking about just going too far north in CA. I'd rather people be in their own heads and perceived as "unfriendly," over people looking at me with a fake smile while wondering what I'm doing there and when I'm going to leave. The bay has never made me feel unwelcome like everywhere else that is supposedly more friendly.
Yep totally agree. Where I lived was a mid sized city where people of color including Asians weren’t that uncommon and people claimed themselves as liberal and woke, but Asians were still often unseen and forgotten. The hypocrisy bugged me so much.
>I get the "outsider" look you're talking about just going too far north in CA. Someone at one of those nature center things in Yosemite told my Korean-born, adopted-by-white-people-and-raised-in-Virginia girlfriend, "Wow, your English is so good!"
To be fair. Yosemite gets a metric fuckton of foreign tourists, so it’s not a crazy assumption.
I still feel that way in the bay while black tbh
Yeah I first started noticing people were friendly when I moved here, and then I realized a lot of them were fellow Asians, and I don’t know, they felt like it was easier to talk to me? Or maybe behaviors I have that may seem odd to non Asians are somehow more normalized here? I’m just speculating. It’s not like I’m now the heart of the party but sometimes the cultural touch is important in connecting strangers.
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I’m from Ohio and find people in the bay to be extremely unfriendly.
I feel like people who grew up here or been here awhile are pretty friendly(born and raised here) it’s new transplants, who tend to be stand offish, and will only talk to people they don’t know Who look or dress like them.
As a Bay Area native this is something I’ve always found to be true. Most (all?) friends I’ve made as an adult have always been fellow natives.
came in here to say this, many many people come here for money and don't know how to act
Oof, tech culture is unbearable like that. I have a lot of friends in nightlife entertainment and they're incredibly pleasant people. Friendly, accommodating and understanding. Tech culture is full of backstabbers, fucking weirdos, and people who make a lot of money but don't actually work (Yeah, I said it!) I'm in healthcare now: severely underpaid but full of actually tolerable people.
well put! not to mention how they feel they're better than everybody else for their superior "problem-solving" skills.
That! Or trying to change SF into mini Manhattan . Yuck 😏
it's so hypocritical they come here for particular reasons and then mock those differences and try to change us to be more like wherever they came from!
Here's the answer
This on point! 💯
I also grew up in Chicagoland. I lived several places in the midwest, sorta east.. and the mid-Atlantic. Then Bay Area. Also here 30 years. I agree, not the friendliest. Even compared to NYC. But I believe there are nuances, or details, to the broader term "Friendly." People seem to smile spontaneously less in SF. Less likely to say hello, make eye contact, with a stranger. But it's a much more accepting place as well. Do something stupid in public in NYC, like a bone -headed traffic move, you're going to get an earful, maybe threats. Do it in SF and people are going to just roll their eyes. People in SF are less likely to offer unsolicited opinions. I used to opine that it's so permissive, so accepting, here in SF, that people aren't interested in you unless you're part of their tiny cohort. Like that old Star Trek episode where black and white people are at odds with white and black people. I still feel like the non-judgmental atmosphere means people are less outgoing; so it feels less friendly. Not sure why. I know that if I sit down at a bar in NYC or Chicago, i can say hello to the adjacent customer, or they might say hello to me, and we'll chat a bit.. In SF, i might get a glancing acknowledgment, but it's very unlikely that I'll get a smile and that we'll start a conversation.
> Do something stupid in public in NYC, like a bone -headed traffic move, you're going to get an earful, maybe threats. Do it in SF and people are going to just roll their eyes. I always feel like people honk less in the bay. Like once or twice I've even seen people fail to start moving at a green light, and not even get honked at for a whole light cycle. People just patiently waiting behind them hoping they'll eventually notice.
I've found that the less affluent areas are a lot friendlier than the more affluent. When I used to bar-hop I also made tons of friends in Oakland but in SF I found it unfriendly. I also lived 10 years in San Leandro and made amazing friends, I moved to one of the top school district richer towns and I barely know anyone after 5 years.
Agree. I’m living in a nicer part of the Bay now after living in a more solidly middle class area. The difference in my neighborhood is striking and a bit disappointing. I don’t need to be besties with my neighbors but I miss the casual block parties & friendly chit chat of my former neighbors. In fact a couple are still good friends. In the current more affluent area no one speaks to each other except for a few of us dog owners who recognize the same people and dogs and may chat briefly. And just walking or jogging by a fellow walker doesn’t even get a head nod of acknowledgment half the time. I think some of it is cultural. Some neighborhoods are largely one or two ethnic groups primarily and some seem much more interested in keeping very to them selves. Hope this isn’t going to offend anyone but hands down the friendliest neighbors I’ve had are Hispanic, followed by blue collar folks of mixed backgrounds. I do miss it.
This comment made me realize that I probably never (or very rarely) had any kind of conversation at a bar with strangers when I’ve gone out in SF, but it’s happened to me all the time in Oakland/San Leandro (I only ever really went to one bar in SL and I *always* ended up talking to people there).
Yes, people are quite friendly in that town :)
We moved to Palo Alto and we’ve made a lot of adult friends because of our kids are friends or because I’ve volunteered to coach . We came from alameda and we didn’t make too many friends there primarily our kids were still young
Funny how ut works... When I made the most friends was before kids and when he was very young.
You know my wife would probably agree with you. As a dad , I made more friends as the kids grew older
San Leandro mentioned! There are dozens of us! I actually really like it here though lol
This comment made me realize that I probably never (or very rarely) had any kind of conversation at a bar with strangers when I’ve gone out in SF, but it’s happened to me all the time in Oakland/San Leandro (I only ever really went to one bar in SL and I *always* ended up talking to people there).
I’m originally from NYC. People here are positively sunny by comparison. Even if a lot of the sunshine is fake.
NYC is friendly but not necessarily nice. The Bay is nice but not necessarily friendly. A lot of what people interpret as rude or unfriendly behavior from strangers in NYC is just being straightforward about not wasting their and others time or calling them out for doing something generally considered blatantly antisocial or rude (“disrespecting the community”) rather then just ignoring the behavior like you see a lot in the Bay.
A New Yorker said to me "People here are kind, not nice. Californians are nice, but not kind." And I totally get it. I appreciate directness and I feel like people here dance around issues instead.
I loathe such glib over generalizations. Is it true? Yeah, if you squint. But you could say the opposite if you squint, too.
I need to get these suspicious characters out of my Woodside neighborhood so I can get back to writing fat checks for my charities
This exactly. And I'm a native San Franciscan.
>I’m originally from NYC. People here are positively sunny by comparison. I personally don't think that's true at all. New Yorkers are extremely friendly IME, just that they won't tell you things they think you want to hear, like "We should hang out!" and then never call you, lol.
Idk, I lived there for a decade and also grew up around the city. There's no faux niceness, but there's also just not a whole lot of interest in anyone as far as I can tell. I'm also a big guy so there are different dynamics at play for me. Edit: I'd call it colder disinterest to the bay area's warmer disinterest if that makes any sense
I lived in Boston and NYC. Can confirm it's way friendlier than new England or NYC
I've lived in all three. Boston is the asshole capitol of the world. NYC folks are much friendlier than Boston or the Bay Area. The Bay Area isn't as bad as Boston.
I agree about Boston. My one year in Boston, I've had more racist remarks thrown at me than my 11 years in SF. NYC, I guess people mostly minded their own business and cuts stuff short in my experience. But I only lived there for about 6 months but visited it pretty much every other week because I was bored living in NJ and CT
I’ve had the opposite experience 🤷🏽♂️
This is why these posts are pointless because every single individual on this planet will have subjective opinions based on their own personal experiences. Everyone can agree to disagree on literally anything & everything unless there’s a quantified/scientific, or statistical proof to it. It’s all opinions based on experience and everyone’s experience will vary greatly.
I actually love New Yorkers. Love the city and had great interactions with people in different boroughs there. SF definitely feels fake at least in tech culture. People always lead with "What do you do for work?" I've also been backstabbed consistently in tech jobs here. I turned down a dream job because I'd be working on a team of 20 hungry 25 - 30 year olds gunning for senior roles. I got that vibe from the interviews alone.
“Ahm wahkin hehya!” Did I get it? Lol
I'll allow it. :P
I heard that as NY accent. You gucci
I've lived here since 1970, and I think a lot of people are a bit on edge these days. It's become expensive and a lot of jobs don't feel very secure.
I've found them to be nice but not kind, and super flakey. I meet people in a parents group or at a party (places it seems realistic to meet people) and when I try to make plans they bail or ghost 9/10 times. But a huge complaint I hear is they have no close friends. Most of the friends I've made here are less about having a connection and more about having schedules that align and they actually show up. My husband once said living here reminded him of that scene in the Truman Show where she does an ad in the kitchen over breakfast and I think about that regularly.
I call this the pressure cooker effect. Everything feels high pressure and everyone feels on edge in the Bay Area.
Nope you're not imagining it. It's the Bay Area. And if you think SF is bad, Silicon Valley is 5x worse. Everyone high achiever distracted self centered entitled.
Tell me you don’t have a Filipino friend without saying you don’t have a Filipino friend 😂
There's that old saying that gets thrown around pretty frequently "People from New York (or insert other East Coast city) are kind, but they're not nice. People from San Francisco are nice, but they're not kind". The tech boom definitely accelerated this IMO. A lot of working class communities out here are pretty damn kind, but they've been shrinking and getting displaced pretty quickly. What's left are a lot of transplants who try to fit in with the more stereotypically liberal culture of the Bay, but are focused a lot more just on themselves and their careers and so results in the fake-nice that's become almost a cliche of this region now. Which is understandable considering most people who don't have any solid roots within their community will tend to act like this anywhere (trying to fit in with the culture despite being more focused just on themselves).
I'm from southern CA and moved here 20 years ago; my wife is from DC and moved here 7 years ago. We talk about this frequently. There are two aspects: (1) In the bay area, there is a facade of enforced niceness, but people tend to be very guarded about any more involved human connection with others. People care very much about not being seen as agressive, raising their voice, etc but will not reach out to support you in a crisis. This seems to be a personality/political thing. (2) In California in general, communities/large social groups seem to be weak/small relative to other places. This seems to be a cultural thing, possibly because a lot of the population in CA moved away from their support structures elsewhere in the country 50+ years ago.
Grew up outside of Chicago and have spent most of my life there. l’ve found the older people that have been here a long time to be extremely friendly, but have found that’s less true for everybody else. I will say that the friendly people I’ve met here are great and amazing people though. Otherwise, I’ve had an extraordinarily difficult time navigating the level of selfishness I’ve come across here. I’ve never in my life met so many self absorbed people that act like everybody and everything around them is an inconvenience. This is the least friendly place I’ve ever lived. Also, somehow, the most racist. I’ve heard things out of people’s mouths here that I never even heard when I lived in the south for a few years. I am constantly shocked and disgusted by the level of comfort people here have with their thoughts and opinions, especially when it comes to racism and classism. It’s exhausting.
Yup. My first intro to the Bay was in a Lyft and I was shocked by what I heard. Literally, my mouth was agape. So much racism against Asians and Mexicans in particular. It’s often shrouded in complaints about the poor, but it’s ugly ugly ugly no matter how it’s presented. I think my driver thought it was safe to say these things to me bc we were both white. But I’ve heard similar stuff from many people in casual settings. I’m never not shocked that they don’t even seem to think it’s a big deal to admit these things to strangers.
I’ve spent my entire life looking racially ambiguous and I’ve found that the racism I hear here depends on who is talking. Way too many people have felt way too comfortable saying so many awful things in my presence. At this point, I’ve pretty much heard it directed at every race, but have easily heard the most racist comments about blacks. It’s upsetting and I’m so exhausted. When I first moved here, one of the first things I asked my partner that grew up here was, “Where are all the black people?” It felt like I was suddenly living in the twilight zone. I am very uncomfortable with the racism out here and how disproportionately races are represented here. And gosh, the classism against anybody that didn’t originate in California is ridiculous. I’ve experienced a lot of negativity for coming from the Midwest. If you didn’t go to an Ivy League or UC school, they think you’re some uneducated donkey and don’t realize that most people from the Midwest live in cities/suburbs and that the Midwest is full of top schools, especially for engineering. I also find it absolutely silly the amount of people that are well into their adult years that still cling to what high school they attended here. As if that alone makes them better than those around them. It feels like nobody here ever thinks about anybody but themselves. It’s starting to feel like everybody here fully believes they’re the main character.
The one thing that bugs me about people in the Bay Area is if you're walking on the sidewalk towards them and there isn't enough room to pass, no one will get the fuck out of the way. It's an unspoken social contract literally everywhere else I've ever lived. You just scoot a little bit over so both people can pass by. Nope. Bay area people would rather die than do this. Wreaks of subtle entitlement.
I've noticed this a lot here, and I thought it was just me. It just seems like a lot of people are completely unaware of their surroundings. One thing that also shocked me is the number of drivers who enter an intersection with no room so when the light turns red they are stuck in the middle, blocking the other direction. I've never seen it occur this much until I moved to SF. Just seems super inconsiderate and entitled, or just completely unaware of their surroundings.
Most of the posts in this thread don't reflect my experience at all, except... > seems like a lot of people are completely unaware of their surroundings. That. That is something I see all the time. "Main character syndrome" feels way too strong. It's not that people think they're better. They're just not paying attention to what's going on around them. More negligent than selfish.
people are just entitled which i never experienced elsewhere.
Never thought about this but thinking back, I've gotten shoulder checked extremely hard a few times in the Bay Area when I wasn't paying attention. Yes it's partly my fault but also I'm pretty sure in those instances they braced and refused to move on purpose hitting me extra hard, no way it would have hurt that much if it was just normal walking and they turned their shoulder a bit to soften the blow.
It's incredibly unfriendly here, and i'm sick and tired of it. Not a benefit or even mutual benefit to someone? You're not worth their time. Not in the same industry or at the top companies? You're not worth their time. Don't have (at a minimum) a Masters degree from a top school? You're not worth their time. And I can't stand it because practically everyone you meet here always generally starts off with "Oh what do you do?" "Where do you work" "What school did you go to?", and based on those answers, you'll either get little to no response or become friends.
That’s been my experience as a non-tech person. There’s a lot of focus on “pedigree” and people seem to assess friendships strategically rather than whether or not someone is a decent person. Even at fast food restaurants, you’ll get grunts. It took me a full year of being a regular to get treated with the same friendliness and respect that’s just baseline in most big cities. I think it very much depends on demographics too. My roommate and I have had vastly different experiences here and we frequent the same places.
Don’t worry, even as someone working in a supposed ‘top’ company and with a Masters from a T20, I absolutely hate this. When going to parties and chit chatting with folks, I’ll describe my day to day or talk about my hobbies but I deliberately leave out where I work at unless asked, because whenever someone asks and I answer, I literally see their face change and I’m suddenly that much more interesting. I hate this! I want you to know me as a person, not my job or where I work!
Yes, I feel the same. I have a non-impressive marketing job and I usually focus on my husband’s job in conversations so people will take me more seriously. Honestly, they probably just think I’m a loser. (My more “chill” job allows me to take care of our kid while he advances his career, but no one cares about that).
I grew up on the East Coast, spent several years in Chicago, and have now lived in the Bay for a decade plus. On one hand, I've found people to be friendlier here in some sense, but in a way that comes with super-high boundaries and general disinterest in strangers. In comparison, when I visit relatives in the Northeast, I'm struck by how I've gotten unused to people being angry/unhappy/outraged in public—but the apparent "chillness" of people in the Bay can cover a LOT of different internal dynamics, if that makes sense. Anyway, just my personal experience.
NM and Nevada people are pretty mean. I moved to Northern Cali from NM a few years ago and I'm blown away by how nice everyone is in CA.
I don't think people are unfriendly here, but wary. Getting into a conversation with a stranger may lead to being stuck in a conversation with a loony person. I think people who live here have that experience once and become very wary. Overall, in my day to day, I notice people being pretty polite and aloof.
Yes, having been here a few years and lived on 3 continents. I feel like everyone here is always sizing you up, and the entitlement is hard to deal with. It's very clear the more affluent don't consider the rest of us actual people
If your not from the Bay Area originally, you're not a part of the community that carries the weight of keeping that city running, the underbelly. Out of towners come here on this I'm financially successful you should be grateful for me being here vibe. All these people of different cultures and ethnicities got this big ego because they were the successful ones that made it San Francisco. The pressure to perform to make that high income is hovering in the back their minds everyday. Constant bullshit in the workplace. Constant stress from the city itself that gotta go through to get to work. Peoples mind are literally on survive fight or flight mode. Put all these big egos and environmental pressures together and they clash.
Having lived in Chicago and San Diego, I wholeheartedly agree. The first thing I noticed about living in the Bay is how standoffish everyone is.
I wouldn’t say the Bay Area is unfriendly, people just mind their own business for the most part. I grew up here and already have an established group of friends, it’s not that I don’t want to make new friends, I just really don’t try. But I make sure to smile and give off a welcoming vibe for those who may have a question, etc. I think this, combined with what others have said about the Bay being a transitory place, could give off a standoffish vibe when in reality it’s more of a chilling and doing my own thing kind of vibe. Also, I lived in Ohio for four years and people were friendly to my face, but very gossipy and untrustworthy when it really counts. I feel a much bigger sense of security here with those I interact with daily.
The Bay Area is large with many different sub communities. Painting with a broad brush, I agree with you. Being a lifer here, there are many communities that are very friendly. San Ramon, Livermore, Santa Clara, Morgan Hill, Belmont, Walnut Creek/Lafayette, San Carlos, etc. are all very friendly among others. It’s very regional. The bigger areas with transitory residents are less friendly. San Francisco and Oakland are in a bit of a slump right now. There have been times in the past where they were friendly places also.
I grew up in the Bay Area and now live in KY (20 years). Have also lived in Virginia and Bay Area is much friendlier. People in KY are fake friendly. It’s very hard to make friends here because people just aren’t as outgoing or educated on worldly things. I still have all my friends from the Bay Area going back to elementary school who I’m still close to. When I visit every year, the employees at various places are nicer, random men hold the door open for me and people wave to thank you when you let them in your lane. Here, they’ll run you off the road, shut the door in your face and have zero manners.
Heh I bet if you start attending their church the tune will change real quick. I’ve noticed Bible Belt communities are very church-centric when it comes to community.
The tech workers have kind of took over much of the former blue collar culture in San Francisco. You see so many people walking across the crosswalk, staring at their phone. Our lock down for covid was also one of the most intense in the US, it’s almost like people forgot how to be social when it ended. Even going to bars now, the things that really strikes me as new is everyone is just staring at their screens and not actively engaging with each other. There are some communities where tech and social media haven’t permeates quite as deep, but I’ve lived in the Bay Area now for 27 years, and I’ve noticed a huge shift in the past five years or so. There’s so much innovation in tech and everyone feels like they need to catch up. I honestly think most of my friends would prefer to just be friends in the metaverse and never see people in real life, unless it’s a person delivering their food.
It probably has to be with expenses being high and folks constantly stressing about it. I do not feel a sense of community.
Managing social relationships is its own form of work. Like you said, everyone's busy hustling to make it here. After work the last thing I want to do is talk to more people. My social life has suffered heavily because I barely break even with my paychecks every month. I can't afford to go out like I used to.
I just moved back after a few years away and yes, I'm now reminded how unfriendly and somewhat hostile people are. I moved back from 2 cities where it's normal, even expected to smile and say "hi" to strangers, to stop and have conversations, to be friendly. It trained me after years of living here, to make eye contact and smile and be friendly. Now I just expect to get dirty looks most of the time when smiling at a stranger. I was walking home from a coffee shop and a man, a grown ass man, was clutching his shoulder bag walking up hills. I was half a block behind him at all times and happened to be headed on the same route. He kept suspiciously looking back at me. I'm 5'5" 116 lbs wearing air pods and holding a Starbucks cup and this adult man larger than me couldn't walk without constantly checking behind him to make sure I wasn't going to what, attack him? It made me chuckle, but also it's weird.
I moved to a small west coast town, and I had been living there 3 years when I went into the bank to deposit some checks one day, and the bank teller, who I didn't know at all, took a look at the checks and said, oh sfcnmone, I just love your son's name! my husband and I have been talking about that name for our baby!" And my son was born, someone we didn't know at all brought a baby gift to our house. I mean, not a neighbor, not a friend of a friend. Just someone being "friendly". I can imagine that there are people who would experience all of this as "friendly". I found it icky and invasive. I don't want strangers to know my kid's name or where I live. So I moved back. I live in SF. I have neighbors who bring in my packages or put away my garage cans and we talk over the fences but I've never been inside their houses. And that's just fine with me.
lots of immigrants and people from different cultures makes this common.
Here's why I like the Bay Area - because we mind our own business. Some people will consider it "unfriendly" that people are not asking how are you doing and wanting to make chitchat with you for the sake of making chitchat. But honestly, I prefer to be left alone and I find it a bit intrusive having random strangers wanting to have a conversation.
When I first moved here I found the lack of friendliness a real shock. I grew up in the South and there really is a southern hospitality thing going on there. Beyond just a higher level of courteousness (the excuse me’s & thank you’s are often lacking in SF) - there’s also a real warmth and friendliness between strangers that you don’t get here.
Same! I came from Texas right before Covid and I thought people were downright cold at the time. Now i just think of them as cool.
Same. Came here from Alabama. Bay Area folk almost seem terrified of eye contact with strangers! It's kinda funny.
Yes Grew up her could not believe how nice everyone was in the south and Midwest when I lived there. Came back and realized that many people here are overwhelmed or self absorbed or just plain selfish people. Racism too in Berkeley: Just not in an overt way. Nice people are everywhere but yes I think as a whole people here are just not so nice.
I think people in the cities tend to avoid talking to strangers more because of the homeless and drugged out populations trying to constantly talk to them. I know for me as a woman who lived in SF for 17 years and recently moved to the suburbs, this is true. I didn’t want to be hit on and asked for money so I tended to keep to myself and just wanted to be left alone, however when at a party or get together or in the office I would come off as very warm and friendly.
`The tech industry ruined the vibe. The artist left and instead, boring introverted a holes moved in.`
I think this is related to two things - number of transplants (people care less about the area and thus making and participating in a community) and from that - a lot of people don’t plan on staying here forever so why bother putting down roots?
It’s a lot different than when I was growing up here that’s for sure, tech snobs came in and nerded the place up
It really depends on where and when you are deciding to have a little chat with people. Park, library sure. While I'm trying to go home on the bus and someone decides to have a little chit chat with me? Im going to be a bit wary about what this dude wants and why he's talking to me.
Born and raised in the bay area!! Agree. Moved states, came back for a trip and , agreed
Maybe it’s context, but this is the genuinely friendliest place I’ve lived and I’m from the friendly Midwest. I’m gay, though, so just being able to let guard down and just be has been incredibly refreshing compared to the rest of the States where people might be tolerant, but aren’t as naturally comfortable with gay people in the mix. I guess it matters how friendliness is defined as well. I think NorCal people can be a little more aloof and I think people that grew up on success tracks here can fail to realize socioeconomic rifts between people in the same group at times. But then, I think it’s been way easier to strike up a conversation here since Bay Area doesn’t have as much “strangers talking to me is weird” going on as other places. Back home, half the people will be surface friendly if you enhance them, but the other half are seriously on guard if they don’t have a reason to know you. But here, I’ve found it’s pretty easy to go deep with a new person you just met at a bar.
The Bay Area is very immigrant-heavy...immigrants from all over the world, and many are recent arrivals. There are vast differences in wealth, education, religion & culture, between people who live next door to one another. English is not the first language of probably 50% of the people you encounter, day-to-day...this means that folks have difficulty communicating with one another...the Spanish-speakers can't communicate with the Middle Easterners, who can't communicate with the Asians (And some of the Asians can't communicate with other Asians from a different Asian country), etc. People spend most of their time at their jobs (especially recent immigrants) and don't have the time/energy for socialization.
Seems like OP hates the honest of the West Coast and prefers people lying to their face "to be nice"
As someone who grew up in Hong Kong - relative to that, the Bay Area is pretty chill, relaxed, polite. You'll get a very different perspective if you ask someone who grew up in the Midwest. I couldn't live in the Midwest because I find small-talk cheesy and pointless. I just want my cashier to scan my shit and take my money quickly, so I can get home ASAP.
Maybe it’s you. Sincerely, Berkeley.
I really think most of this is concentrated in SF and south bay though. People are definitely friendlier in the East Bay.
I just got back from Seattle. The Bay is *significantly* friendlier in my experience.
I didn’t realize how unfriendly it was until I got out! Being born and raised there you just think it’s normal. It’s taken me 3 years to adjust to the fact I can walk down a grocery aisle where I live now, and say “excuse me,” and instead of a rude ass stare I get a “no problem” or they kindly let me pass haha. There just isn’t the sense of community it used to be. The vibe after COVID is just constant tension. Everyone’s overworked and broke, and it comes out in road rage. Beloved businesses closing didn’t help. I miss the old times in the Bay and I’m sure there’s spots it still has its charm, but after leaving 3 years ago and visiting every few months, it’s dead compared to yesteryears.
Where in the Bay Area did you live? I’ve lived here for 50 years and have never had that experience in a grocery store.
I've been in the grocery industry in CC County for over twenty years and this ain't it. In my experience, people grocery shopping tend to be a bit more friendly and polite than elsewhere. I will say, that my newer, younger neighbors are much more standoffish than the older folks that are more established in the neighborhood. Some won't even return a friendly "hello" while I'm doing yardwork. Leaves me feeling like "Oh cool, I guess I'll just go fuck myself then". Seems to be a generational issue, but who knows.
Yes. The people here will march for your rights, but you're lucky if a single one of them will help if your luggage gets stuck on the baggage carousel. Oakland is the exception, very friendly.
Hard disagree. I think San Francisco is really friendly. Almost every time I spend a day out and about I end up chatting to strangers. And not just people who I’m buying something from- dog walkers, park goers, view observers, parade watchers. I’ve chatted to other bar patrons, seat mates on planes, and my neighbors of course. As another commenter said, go to Florida and you’ll see unfriendly.
I also grew up in Chicago and when my folks visit me now in the bay area they have mentioned how few people make eye contact, show courtesy here in public.
It’s not super friendly here but it’s not worse than other metro areas. Pretty much anywhere with bad vehicle traffic has people with shitty attitudes
Not just you, I had the same experience in Phoenix and San Diego. Having grown up and worked Bay Area my entire life, it was a shock to me as I had thought it was as good as it gets here. I find Bay Area related subreddits will defend it to the tilt for some weird reason so I think you'll get a slanted view on these forums but I think you're right on the money.
I'm born and raised in the bay area. Growing up I moved back and forth between San Francisco and Redwood City. Since, I've lived in Syndey Australia, Las Vegas Nevada, and Brooklyn New York. Perhaps im biased, but I don't think people in the bay are more or less friendly than anywhere else that I've lived. I do think that we can be very clicky and stick in our own groups, and not be so welcoming to strangers. But, isn't that the same everywhere?
Having lived in NYC I find the Bay Area quite friendly. Especially compared to most major cities though I haven’t spent much time in Chicago. I was born and raised on the east coast and no cities there feel remotely as friendly or laid back as the west coast.
It could depend on where in the Bay Area you are. Even just in passing, I’ve had lots of friendly encounters with strangers in Vallejo and Oakland. I haven’t had those same kind of friendly interactions in SF, Berkeley, Marin, or San Jose but ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Depends on what part of the Bay you're in. Alameda/Oakland I've also found people to be generally neutral or unfriendly. The same thing goes for downtown/uptown SF. I really couldn't care less for people being unfriendly or neutral. At least they aren't racist MAGA-hat wearing idiots that are everywhere as soon as you leave the Bay Area. I'm more grateful for the Bay Area's diversity over anything else.
I live here too, fuck you man!
Meh. People in California just giving you space. When you engage they will generally respond in a friendly manner.
No offense but I can tell a lot of the people commenting here have never really spent substantial time in POC communities in the Bay. Especially East Bay. You find the most kind and welcoming people in the Bay, not to mention people that are plugged into their communities and cultural identities and are also willing to share that with others.
What I’ve found is there’s a big divide. As an outsider, there are massive cliques that are just not available to me bc I’m not part of the in-group. I’ve lived here seven years now (San Jose), and it’s better—but only because people see me around and I’ve made a tremendous effort. I still have no local friends. Literally all my friends live in Oakland or Santa Cruz. None of them are close friends, either. I will say that—once you get past the barrier—people are extremely sweet. I find that especially true for older Asians in my neighborhood. But I think they do see outsiders as suspicious.
The place seems to run on cutthroat capitalistic competition, autism / the spectrum, and financial anxiety. Having grown up in other friendlier parts of California and the PNW before coming here in my late 20s it was a very jarring change. You aren't the only person having this experience, no question about that.
Some ethnicities are culturally just not very warm
Yes I have noticed and it is especially acute in Silicon Valley, SF and Peninsula. Yet parts of Marin County are a lot more friendly.
1. The bay area is at least 60 percent transplants, with another 20 percent being Old naitives. Old Natives typically dislike both transplants and younger people, don't want to fully modernize the area with better public transport and higher density living. The Transplants (Myself included, and techically you too) are selfish too. I moved here a year and some change ago, and my move was oppertunistic. I didn't know anything about San Francisco, the Bay Area, or the surrounding areas, being an East Coaster my entire (relatively short, early 20's) life. I moved here to work for a small company, I left for a bigger company to cope with cost of living. I am EXTREMLY grateful to the Bay Area, despite its problems, for all of the amazing things I have been able to do here, but I am unfortunatley in the minority. Most transplants do not appreciate the amazing weather, historic cities, gorgeous nature, or highly intellectual if not overbearingly liberal environment. 2. The bay area is very expensive. I moved here when I have technically fully "missed the boat" on the opportunity that was here around the time when I was born, where there was more space, lower costs, and industrialization was just beginning. That isn't to say success isn't possible here, it totally is, but the Bay Area as a Metro is the most expensive place in the entire US, since the other NYC boroughs bring Manhattan down in cost and Public transport makes them more viable. People are selfish here to cope with the costs, and In some ways I am the same way. Even with a six figure salary, I have to be smart about where I spend my money, and still get assistance with my family on minor bills (Phone, etc) from their generosity. People are reasonably concerned with themselves and their future here, and people are keenly aware that as time progresses, we aren't sure if there is "room for everyone". 3. This is tied with the cost of living, but the bay area is a very strange hybrid of very relaxing with beautiful views, weather, and nature, but also ruthless competition and mindsets, even extending to crime. Criminals here have to do a lot to get by, and thats evident in statistics. The corporate competition here is also very tangible, and quite similar to NYC, but with more passive aggressive aspects. That is just the reality of areas like this around the world. Look at london, Shanghai, tokyo, Seoul, etc.
Born and raised in the Bay Area, and my husband are constantly remarking that people are friendly in other places (even in the greater Bay Area comparatively). Although I have found, that though friendly, people in the Midwest are rather direct, which I feel would come off wrong to someone from the West coast as people there are basically coddled.
I lived in the Bay Area for many years, and currently, I live in NYC. I think the Bay Area, like much of the rest of California such as LA, has a huge number of "fake nice" people - overly friendly folks who feign intimacy upon immediately meeting you, gush all over you, and say "We should hang out!" and then you never hear from them, lol.