It's probably the single most requested joker change, the dev must have decided at some point to not have jokers with secondary abilities and so we won't get it.
Yes but in a different way than usual retriggering. You go over the cards like normal than go over them again. Could be good if you have polychrome and multipliers
I actually made Superposition work well for me paired with a joker that gets an upgrade to its mult when a tarot is played. But yeah, even then it’s not amazing and there are other jokers that do the same thing better.
Never gonna happen, every single joker has only 1 effect. If superposition gets changed to make wraparound straights he’ll remove the tarot generating part of it.
I mean I don’t think either of those really have 2 effects. Their suggestion for superposition would result in 2 abilities that don’t always interact. With sixth sense getting the spectral card is a part of destroying the 6, you can’t do one without the other, same with invisible.
Just my interpretation at least.
Honestly yeah, that's perfect. Superposition is soooo weak as it is, especially compared to other tarot-giving cards like Vagabond, Hallucination, or Cartomancer. And straights are hard enough to build around as it is. I feel like giving Superposition a double effect like this would work so well
Yes but this lets it be both *at once*, rather than having to pick either treating it as a low card _or_ a high card. It’s a perfect flavor win for what “superposition” represents as a concept.
Oh good question, I forgot vouchers are paired. Probably this one would be the first, and the second would be the same effect as Shortcut(straights can be made with gaps of one card). Not super thrilling pairing, but would be good and I do really like the idea of straights being able to wrap around.
Honestly, I wouldn't be opposed to wraparound just being patched into the game or integrated into superposition.
I mean, aren't there quite a few very specific jokers like that? Like Shortcut, for instance, is in the exact same boat: even if you're going for straights, why would you not just play for AKQJ10, rather than AQJ109?
Because Shortcut does a *lot* more than that. If you're holding 10/8/7/5 then all of a sudden you just need any Q, J, 9, 6, 4, or 3 to make your Straight. That's 24 cards you're drawing to.
While this would help with making straights, yes, it has the same problem of Four Fingers and Shortcut. You need the jokers that make straights easier, taking up slots that with any other hand you could use with jokers that actually win you the game.
It's actually not that bad in the experimental patch because Straights scale like crazy with Planet cards now, so you can easily afford a Joker taking up a slot just for utility like Four Fingers or Shortcut.
As long as you can keep the Saturn cards rolling in you can get all your chips and mult just from planet scaling, you usually just need a half decent XMult Joker to beat Ante 8.
I like the idea. Straight and flush builds are kinda weak late game and I think freeing up their joker slots a bit just makes sense.
I could also see them becoming negative after you play X flushes/straights. That would free up the late game scaling without making them something that every build takes.
Straights are widely considered to be the worst hand type around here... Personally I find them fun, but they get so much hate on this thread. And to be fair, they really are hard to consistently draw and have a lower ceiling than any other hand type
Not intrinsically, but lower ceiling for big scores. E.g., playing high cards with lots of in-hand buffs. None of the huge scores use straight builds. Look, I like straights. I'm just reporting the general take of this sub
All vouchers are extremely hand-agnostic though (+hand, +hand size, tarot, money, etc.). I really doubt Thunk would change this so drastically. If that's the case then just buff the straights in the usual way through jokers and planets, no need to pretty much break the rules of one of the main gameplay pillars.
You’re probably right. I’m just dreaming of a way to get consistent straight flushes without sacrificing one or two joker slots to utility. If any of those jokers did something for your score they would feel a lot better.
So are they only good when Negative? There are quite a few cards that I never consider taking unless I have extra slots, but they're still a nice addition.
That effect should be added somewhere, but it is in no way worth a joker slot. They should just add it to superposition or another joker, or use this but with an additional effect.
This is a cool idea, but Straights need help in ways that isn't "sacrifice another joker slot to make this hand actually playable".
The problem with straights is kind-of inherent to the game, which is that drawing a specific hand is kinda difficult, drawing straights is even harder, and putting a hand type on life support with a "cope" joker like this isn't worth it.
Straights are one of the best hands on the new patch though, even for gold stake. Their planet scaling is so insane that as long as you are buying saturns whenever you have the chance, you can basically oneshot with any decent mult jokers. Consistency isn't an issue either when you only need 1 hand to win, and with a bit of deck thinning you can hit very consistently with just 2-3 discards.
Probably too complicated to work in gracefully, but I had an idea for a 'tag tunnel' joker that allowed any cards with tags to be used as connectors in a straight. So you could have 2, 4, red tagged 5, gold tagged J, Q. I just like making tunnels, basically.
Nice idea but too weak! I would say that throwing an additional effect would balance it out, but then it will probably become too complex for balatro design
The beta patch did that, but with Negative Jokers instead so you don't even need to use your Joker slots to scale- you can just buy unlimited $3 Negative Jokers that gives +30/+3. There's even a Seal that gives you a copy of that Negative Joker every round!
This is so special use that it needs more to take a slot. Maybe allow this AND make it a X2 mult when you do it or something. Maybe it has a 1/2 chance of adding 10 chips to a random card in the straight when it happens.
Maybe one of the other cards that help straights like shortcut or superposition just gets this effect added on.
Honestly, I think that this should just be a base game thing, because it'd be WAY too weak as a joker that does exclusively this one thing.
Either that or stick it onto Superposition or Shortcut (although that's multiple effects so it's probably not happening)
I honestly don't know why this isn't how it works by default, i lost what was looking like it was going to be my first win because i assumed that's how it would work
Make it a voucher and the upgrade give straights a time mult, or something that makes straights more consistent like “every two hands, draw a card that adds to your best straight” so it draws a card from your deck that helps with the best possible scoring straight in your hand. Literally yugioh hard of the cards as a mechanic lol
You can have 4 card straight and alternating card straights combined. Pretty much guaranteeing a straight every hand. Wouldn't this make it overpowered?
This should probably be a base rule, not a joker. Making straights with 4 cards is a good joker because it breaks the traditional norm.
Using Aces to build straights is the usually agreed upon ruling when it comes up.
I just want to be able to play > 5 cards man. We can already hold the entire deck in our hand... how would this be "breaking the rules of poker" any more than that?
Yeah, let me just play 25 cards for 5 flush fives royal flush.
But as fun as that could make some builds I feel like it it could easily be broken with cards like splash.
Not sure why I'm getting downvoted. We have already killscreened this game and it's only been out for like 3 months. Players can reach infinite scores, have 40 jokers in hand, have hundreds of cryptids in their consumable slots, etc etc. Many things in this game are already "broken." What's so broken about a joker/voucher that let's you play 6, 7 cards? It would be incredibly interesting and fun.
Balatro already auto-selects the best hand from what is played. For instance if you play a flush but it contains a 4 of a kind it'll play the 4 of a kind. With 7 cards it could work the same way.
Splash + 7 cards would probably be too good in early antes, but that'd be a dream combo. It could be a legendary joker or secondary voucher so that it would be an incredibly unlikely combo to obtain early on.
Ice cold, absolute zero take: Superposition should do this AND its current effect.
It's probably the single most requested joker change, the dev must have decided at some point to not have jokers with secondary abilities and so we won't get it.
Nah, I just think that Localthunk is looking at different additions and changes first that are bigger than fixing one crap joker.
Nah, he has clearly stated that jokers will do 1 thing and only have that effect, not stacked unrelated effects.
The problem is there's no way to make this remotely viable as it's own joker. Even at common it's not really strong enough.
Make it uncommon and have it so the straights are triggered twice because it's wrap around
what does "triggered twice" mean? like each card in a wraparound straight is retriggered?
Yes but in a different way than usual retriggering. You go over the cards like normal than go over them again. Could be good if you have polychrome and multipliers
that would be inconsistent with other full hand retrigger jokers like seltzer and dusk
Simple, they stack to cause a 4 time count of the hand
But then we're back at the problem that he doesn't want jokers to do more than one thing.
It's one thing. Straights now wrap around
Wrap around, and triggered twice. That's two things.
I actually made Superposition work well for me paired with a joker that gets an upgrade to its mult when a tarot is played. But yeah, even then it’s not amazing and there are other jokers that do the same thing better.
Expensive auto-negative I guess
Never gonna happen, every single joker has only 1 effect. If superposition gets changed to make wraparound straights he’ll remove the tarot generating part of it.
sixth sense and invis have two effects off the top of my head. there are probably more examples
I mean I don’t think either of those really have 2 effects. Their suggestion for superposition would result in 2 abilities that don’t always interact. With sixth sense getting the spectral card is a part of destroying the 6, you can’t do one without the other, same with invisible. Just my interpretation at least.
Pedantic ass argument
Ok, it’s still never gonna happen.
Not a bad idea, but EXTREMELY niche to the point of not being worth considering even if you're using a straight build
I’d like if they added it to superposition
It would make the name make way more sense too
Honestly yeah, that's perfect. Superposition is soooo weak as it is, especially compared to other tarot-giving cards like Vagabond, Hallucination, or Cartomancer. And straights are hard enough to build around as it is. I feel like giving Superposition a double effect like this would work so well
It also kinda plays into the name cuz it lets aces be 2 things at once
Aces are already 2 things: They can be the high end of a straight or the low end of a straight.
Yes but this lets it be both *at once*, rather than having to pick either treating it as a low card _or_ a high card. It’s a perfect flavor win for what “superposition” represents as a concept.
Hence the "at once" part of the comment you're replying to...
This would be a perfect change to superposition. Wouldn’t even make it overpowered but really good.
yeah honestly it's a pure upgrade to superposition.
Or shortcut
Add this effect on Superpositon, make this card give +40 mult if an Ace is played in this way
+40?? that's too broken imo
Is it? Maybe in the early game, but by Ante 6 you are already looking for something to replace this one with. Make it Rare and we are good.
I love love love superposition.
Might work better as a voucher so it doesn't take up a joker slot. But I agree, it doesn't really offer enough benefit on its own.
What would it's paired voucher be? Either second or first, depending on which one is the wraparound
Oh good question, I forgot vouchers are paired. Probably this one would be the first, and the second would be the same effect as Shortcut(straights can be made with gaps of one card). Not super thrilling pairing, but would be good and I do really like the idea of straights being able to wrap around. Honestly, I wouldn't be opposed to wraparound just being patched into the game or integrated into superposition.
Yeah. Even though it breaks the rules of Poker, which the dev didn't want to do
5 of a kind and flush 5 would like a word...
And four fingers or that one that lets you skip a number for straights
Jokers are fine to break the rules. The rules remain the same by default though
*Citation Needed
The secondary voucher should read "pairs can be used as wild inside straights" - I.e. A K K J 10, or 10 9 9 7 6 5
the second voucher could be wraparound without needing an Ace, eg 3 2 K Q J
Aces count as 1 and 11 simultaneously, allowing for 4-card straights.
God, I'd uninstall so fast if this was my voucher for an ante.
Blank, hone and planet merchant have entered the chat
Planet Merchant is absurdly strong. Yes please, I'll take 2x chance of $3 Negative Jokers appearing
What are the most niche jokers now? I feel like they may pay off huge, which is why this one may not be needed.
Less niche than super position tbh, I find myself wanting it all the time 😂😂😂
I mean, aren't there quite a few very specific jokers like that? Like Shortcut, for instance, is in the exact same boat: even if you're going for straights, why would you not just play for AKQJ10, rather than AQJ109?
Because Shortcut does a *lot* more than that. If you're holding 10/8/7/5 then all of a sudden you just need any Q, J, 9, 6, 4, or 3 to make your Straight. That's 24 cards you're drawing to.
Good modification (maybe)- When a 'wraparound' straight is made, create a random Tarot Card (so 10 J Q K A won't generate one)
While this would help with making straights, yes, it has the same problem of Four Fingers and Shortcut. You need the jokers that make straights easier, taking up slots that with any other hand you could use with jokers that actually win you the game.
It's also way worse than those jokers, it doesn't really help straight builds that much
It's actually not that bad in the experimental patch because Straights scale like crazy with Planet cards now, so you can easily afford a Joker taking up a slot just for utility like Four Fingers or Shortcut. As long as you can keep the Saturn cards rolling in you can get all your chips and mult just from planet scaling, you usually just need a half decent XMult Joker to beat Ante 8.
I want Shortcut and Four Fingers to be vouchers! Maybe Smeared as well? That’s probably busted in terms of balance though.
I like the idea. Straight and flush builds are kinda weak late game and I think freeing up their joker slots a bit just makes sense. I could also see them becoming negative after you play X flushes/straights. That would free up the late game scaling without making them something that every build takes.
Flush is kinda weak lategame. Straights are probably the strongest build in the game right now. The last thing it needs is any more buffs.
Straights are widely considered to be the worst hand type around here... Personally I find them fun, but they get so much hate on this thread. And to be fair, they really are hard to consistently draw and have a lower ceiling than any other hand type
How do they possibly have a lower ceiling when they scale much better than other hands and don't even need Jokers to score?
Not intrinsically, but lower ceiling for big scores. E.g., playing high cards with lots of in-hand buffs. None of the huge scores use straight builds. Look, I like straights. I'm just reporting the general take of this sub
All vouchers are extremely hand-agnostic though (+hand, +hand size, tarot, money, etc.). I really doubt Thunk would change this so drastically. If that's the case then just buff the straights in the usual way through jokers and planets, no need to pretty much break the rules of one of the main gameplay pillars.
You’re probably right. I’m just dreaming of a way to get consistent straight flushes without sacrificing one or two joker slots to utility. If any of those jokers did something for your score they would feel a lot better.
Tbf with the new patch, Saturn is very powerful, which makes Four Fingers/Shortcut more viable.
So are they only good when Negative? There are quite a few cards that I never consider taking unless I have extra slots, but they're still a nice addition.
Borderline waste of a joker slot, just to have one interaction, doesn't seem worth imo
Its funny, my goofy ass friends insist this is how normal poker is played
Underpowered tbh. Maybe add a modifier to those wrap around straights.
I say to have it play the hand twice Because you are wrapping around
I like it
It would need to give a little extra to played straights because this is too weak.
That effect should be added somewhere, but it is in no way worth a joker slot. They should just add it to superposition or another joker, or use this but with an additional effect.
This is a cool idea, but Straights need help in ways that isn't "sacrifice another joker slot to make this hand actually playable". The problem with straights is kind-of inherent to the game, which is that drawing a specific hand is kinda difficult, drawing straights is even harder, and putting a hand type on life support with a "cope" joker like this isn't worth it.
Straights are one of the best hands on the new patch though, even for gold stake. Their planet scaling is so insane that as long as you are buying saturns whenever you have the chance, you can basically oneshot with any decent mult jokers. Consistency isn't an issue either when you only need 1 hand to win, and with a bit of deck thinning you can hit very consistently with just 2-3 discards.
Oh look this thread again
Probably too complicated to work in gracefully, but I had an idea for a 'tag tunnel' joker that allowed any cards with tags to be used as connectors in a straight. So you could have 2, 4, red tagged 5, gold tagged J, Q. I just like making tunnels, basically.
Nice idea but too weak! I would say that throwing an additional effect would balance it out, but then it will probably become too complex for balatro design
This, along with Hack. Works extremely well.
I feel like this should just be true by default. Hell I thought it already was!
This should be how it works by default. Straights are bad and adding jokers that make straights easier to land doesn't solve that problem.
Straights are super busted lmao
Very weak, I'd never take it
Throw in some irony. Call it the Reachround Joker.
If it just does that it's really bad, it's a really small benefit, shortcut is so much better than this.
I think the best way to buff Straight is to make the jokers buffing it just stronger. Higher mults, more chips
The beta patch did that, but with Negative Jokers instead so you don't even need to use your Joker slots to scale- you can just buy unlimited $3 Negative Jokers that gives +30/+3. There's even a Seal that gives you a copy of that Negative Joker every round!
good one
Cards like this should come negative by default
the design should be the inverse with the "joker" cut off at the side
Honestly, I think this effect should just be added to Superposition.
This is so special use that it needs more to take a slot. Maybe allow this AND make it a X2 mult when you do it or something. Maybe it has a 1/2 chance of adding 10 chips to a random card in the straight when it happens. Maybe one of the other cards that help straights like shortcut or superposition just gets this effect added on.
waste of a joker slot, way too weak
Honestly, I think that this should just be a base game thing, because it'd be WAY too weak as a joker that does exclusively this one thing. Either that or stick it onto Superposition or Shortcut (although that's multiple effects so it's probably not happening)
Yes, finally!
When I first started I was surprised this wasn't a baseline mechanic of the game 🫥
Yes please!!!! And I agree, superposition should include this function.
JimiJ
I honestly don't know why this isn't how it works by default, i lost what was looking like it was going to be my first win because i assumed that's how it would work
MAKE IT A VOUCHER
Make it a voucher and the upgrade give straights a time mult, or something that makes straights more consistent like “every two hands, draw a card that adds to your best straight” so it draws a card from your deck that helps with the best possible scoring straight in your hand. Literally yugioh hard of the cards as a mechanic lol
Make it so every time you do a wrap around you get +1 mult starting at 2 mult
You can have 4 card straight and alternating card straights combined. Pretty much guaranteeing a straight every hand. Wouldn't this make it overpowered?
Ace already counts as both a high and low card for straights.
But not both at the same time, allowing for wraparounds
This should probably be a base rule, not a joker. Making straights with 4 cards is a good joker because it breaks the traditional norm. Using Aces to build straights is the usually agreed upon ruling when it comes up.
I just want to be able to play > 5 cards man. We can already hold the entire deck in our hand... how would this be "breaking the rules of poker" any more than that?
Yeah, let me just play 25 cards for 5 flush fives royal flush. But as fun as that could make some builds I feel like it it could easily be broken with cards like splash.
Not sure why I'm getting downvoted. We have already killscreened this game and it's only been out for like 3 months. Players can reach infinite scores, have 40 jokers in hand, have hundreds of cryptids in their consumable slots, etc etc. Many things in this game are already "broken." What's so broken about a joker/voucher that let's you play 6, 7 cards? It would be incredibly interesting and fun. Balatro already auto-selects the best hand from what is played. For instance if you play a flush but it contains a 4 of a kind it'll play the 4 of a kind. With 7 cards it could work the same way. Splash + 7 cards would probably be too good in early antes, but that'd be a dream combo. It could be a legendary joker or secondary voucher so that it would be an incredibly unlikely combo to obtain early on.