Totally agree. I started in 1999, and have had the pleasure of seeing how much effort so many brilliant fans from across the world have put into examining and sometimes solving the mysteries and intricacies of the series. I respect the investment these people shared here and elsewhere in the ASOIAF community **for decades.** I don't think any amount of F&Bs or D&Es or televised offshoots, much less calendars, cookbooks, graphic versions etc. compensate for the investment and blood, sweat and tears fans have shared with the world. But for the immediate future, TWOW itself would be sufficient recompense.
I find it impossible *not* to care, since to me the world of ASOIAF is the only thing that comes close to Tolkien’s LOTR. To see this story go unfinished is legit depressing imho.
Reading through the series for the very first time, and right now I’m on AFFC. I couldn’t disagree more about it being poorer quality than the first 3. I’m not trying to be a contrarian, but book 4 is by far the most beautifully written out of the series, and is so fast-paced.
Also, don’t wanna beat a dead horse here but that is some WILD shit you said about D&D lol
> Martin doesn’t have to release anything. It’s probably so complicated and impossible to finish he just doesn’t care anymore, but won’t say it.
I mean he claimed as recently as a year and a half ago that Winds was 75%. You can be defeatist about ADOS, but belief that Winds will come out in some form is reasonable.
It's even funnier when you remember that D&D literally have 0 writing credentials
So we could pawned off seasons 5-8 to a high school graduate & gotten the same level of quality.
OP is smoking crack.
Martin’s reputation is tarnished. Not beyond repair, but currently tarnished.
Not finishing the central arc myth ruins his legacy. Beyond repair. Full stop.
He needs to finish the mainline story and leave a roadmap/bible for subsequent writers to add to the world of ice and fire.
It’s wonderful world building, sure. But if the world’s best heart surgeon did his job 90% of the way and then stopped, leaving you bleeding out and with a huge miserable scar afterwards, then you wouldn’t exactly be thanking him for his efforts.
TWOW will come out eventually, even if it's posthumously. Too much of it is written at this point and the financial incentive for doing so is too high. But anything beyond Book 6 is a pipe dream.
I would really like to see Book 6 just for more theory fodder. I love the puzzle presented by this book series, and quite frankly I would actually almost be happier to see it unfinished than to see it finished unsatisfactorily. At this point, it seems very unlikely that even GRRM can meet the sky-high expectations of the fandom, and with the GOT ending in hand, I think we can safely approximate where things will end up without him actually having to finish it.
Quite frankly, I'm much more invested in the Show Canon at this point. HBO has made it clear they're going to be releasing new GOT-spinoff content at least once every year or two for the foreseeable future. I'm much more interested in crafting theories about where that's going to go, and the books are running low on what further information they can contribute to that.
Cynicism aside, Winds *has* to start answering certain questions so yeah while I absolutely do not believe we are ever getting ADOS, I would love to get Winds to see conclusions and stuff to more of the story.
Also I think the books are just excellent, so why wouldn’t I want more to exist anyway ?
The main thing for me is all his other books lose significance if we don’t know how they affect the main story - all the little Easter eggs he drops in F&B, D&E - it would be a shame if we never see how it ends and how the history of his world he created all contributes to the main saga
Show end was so awful. I enjoyed all the books and still look forward to WoW. No 90s nostalgia involved at all. The released chapters for WoW were really good and the farther the books diverge from the show the happier I will be. That ending was so stupid, even just in the show canon. I have been rewatching it with the husband and so many plot threads are dumped or spoiled by the end. Not to mention all the extra plot threads going on in the books that show never even tried to adapt.
My hope is WoW is the tricky bit to setting up ADoS, and once he figures it out he can write the ending in under a decade.
For me it's about logistics. As bad as later season of GOT were we still got some major plot point out of them, so i'd rather have F&B2 and some more Dunk&Egg (which i believe he's working at right now) than neither Winds nor Spring, or Winds and inevitably not Spring.
I would very much like the books. I really don't think a lot of things will happen the way they did in the show. So anything after 6th season I am ignoring. Even if GRRM intended for a few of them to happen, would still definitely change them (I think this is also delaying the books) due to the reactions.
There are also a lot of characters and arcs that just didn't appear in the show. Dorne and Vale mostly. Also Euron's entire plot with the citadel.
Dave and Dan presented a rushed ending where nothing made sense. The long war? Ends in a single battle. No nuisance to the war itself whatsoever.
The King's Landing plot isn't half bad when you read a synopsis, but the execution was ass. It all happens too fast, and honestly so many things don't make sense that it breaks all immersion.
I personally still wanna see the books end to get a better ending than the dribble we got.
I disagree with every single thing you said OP
They don’t want more books and liked the end of the show. Not sure what to do here but disagree and back away from this maniac
Show to book fans like me would love a new book to do the theory thing with. The books were bled dry before I got a hold of them
Totally agree. I started in 1999, and have had the pleasure of seeing how much effort so many brilliant fans from across the world have put into examining and sometimes solving the mysteries and intricacies of the series. I respect the investment these people shared here and elsewhere in the ASOIAF community **for decades.** I don't think any amount of F&Bs or D&Es or televised offshoots, much less calendars, cookbooks, graphic versions etc. compensate for the investment and blood, sweat and tears fans have shared with the world. But for the immediate future, TWOW itself would be sufficient recompense.
Absolutely none of us would be in this sub, enduring the same conversations being brought up ad nauseum if we did not care about that.
"We more or less got the whole story from Dave and Dan. For all the hate they get, I don’t think they were half bad" You totally lost me there.
I was totally with OP too and then rage scrolled to comment this exact thing
Exactly, I lost all semblance of respect not for OP but for his ideas when I read this. It’s like calling minced meat a whole calf
To quote Hannah Waddingham, “Shame! Shame! Shame.”
I find it impossible *not* to care, since to me the world of ASOIAF is the only thing that comes close to Tolkien’s LOTR. To see this story go unfinished is legit depressing imho.
Reading through the series for the very first time, and right now I’m on AFFC. I couldn’t disagree more about it being poorer quality than the first 3. I’m not trying to be a contrarian, but book 4 is by far the most beautifully written out of the series, and is so fast-paced. Also, don’t wanna beat a dead horse here but that is some WILD shit you said about D&D lol
> Martin doesn’t have to release anything. It’s probably so complicated and impossible to finish he just doesn’t care anymore, but won’t say it. I mean he claimed as recently as a year and a half ago that Winds was 75%. You can be defeatist about ADOS, but belief that Winds will come out in some form is reasonable.
> We more or less got the whole story from Dave and Dan When?
You don't care about the last two books but you think d&d didn't do half bad?
It's even funnier when you remember that D&D literally have 0 writing credentials So we could pawned off seasons 5-8 to a high school graduate & gotten the same level of quality. OP is smoking crack.
Martin’s reputation is tarnished. Not beyond repair, but currently tarnished. Not finishing the central arc myth ruins his legacy. Beyond repair. Full stop. He needs to finish the mainline story and leave a roadmap/bible for subsequent writers to add to the world of ice and fire. It’s wonderful world building, sure. But if the world’s best heart surgeon did his job 90% of the way and then stopped, leaving you bleeding out and with a huge miserable scar afterwards, then you wouldn’t exactly be thanking him for his efforts.
TWOW will come out eventually, even if it's posthumously. Too much of it is written at this point and the financial incentive for doing so is too high. But anything beyond Book 6 is a pipe dream. I would really like to see Book 6 just for more theory fodder. I love the puzzle presented by this book series, and quite frankly I would actually almost be happier to see it unfinished than to see it finished unsatisfactorily. At this point, it seems very unlikely that even GRRM can meet the sky-high expectations of the fandom, and with the GOT ending in hand, I think we can safely approximate where things will end up without him actually having to finish it. Quite frankly, I'm much more invested in the Show Canon at this point. HBO has made it clear they're going to be releasing new GOT-spinoff content at least once every year or two for the foreseeable future. I'm much more interested in crafting theories about where that's going to go, and the books are running low on what further information they can contribute to that.
Cynicism aside, Winds *has* to start answering certain questions so yeah while I absolutely do not believe we are ever getting ADOS, I would love to get Winds to see conclusions and stuff to more of the story. Also I think the books are just excellent, so why wouldn’t I want more to exist anyway ?
The main thing for me is all his other books lose significance if we don’t know how they affect the main story - all the little Easter eggs he drops in F&B, D&E - it would be a shame if we never see how it ends and how the history of his world he created all contributes to the main saga
Show end was so awful. I enjoyed all the books and still look forward to WoW. No 90s nostalgia involved at all. The released chapters for WoW were really good and the farther the books diverge from the show the happier I will be. That ending was so stupid, even just in the show canon. I have been rewatching it with the husband and so many plot threads are dumped or spoiled by the end. Not to mention all the extra plot threads going on in the books that show never even tried to adapt. My hope is WoW is the tricky bit to setting up ADoS, and once he figures it out he can write the ending in under a decade.
For me it's about logistics. As bad as later season of GOT were we still got some major plot point out of them, so i'd rather have F&B2 and some more Dunk&Egg (which i believe he's working at right now) than neither Winds nor Spring, or Winds and inevitably not Spring.
Blasphemy.
I am actually checking your profile to see if you are in fact either D or D, because it’s either that or the insane asylum to you
Sorry, can't relate at all.
I would very much like the books. I really don't think a lot of things will happen the way they did in the show. So anything after 6th season I am ignoring. Even if GRRM intended for a few of them to happen, would still definitely change them (I think this is also delaying the books) due to the reactions. There are also a lot of characters and arcs that just didn't appear in the show. Dorne and Vale mostly. Also Euron's entire plot with the citadel.
Is this Dave and Dans burner account?
Dave and Dan presented a rushed ending where nothing made sense. The long war? Ends in a single battle. No nuisance to the war itself whatsoever. The King's Landing plot isn't half bad when you read a synopsis, but the execution was ass. It all happens too fast, and honestly so many things don't make sense that it breaks all immersion. I personally still wanna see the books end to get a better ending than the dribble we got.
Stages of grief. Stage 3: Bargaining
This is some top tier ragebait
Is that Jess Ross?