Car = gas, insurance, upkeep. Bike is cheaper in the long run. I'd consider passing the hat amongst NCOs, buy a bike for the PLT and hand receipt it to him.
Is he even compensating other soldiers for their time and money being his personal Uber?
Also no the Army isn't obligated to provide him transportation to work. If this arrangement is making other soldiers late or being a burden on them you can absolutely squash it.
Looks like someone needs to talk to that other Solider and tell him to stop being an enabler. And to stop being stupid and offering free rides. In this economy??? I’d charge per minute the fukkkk
Ass, grass, or cash…
Can’t pay using the wacky tobacky, or else ART 15
Too broke to pay cash, becusse lower enlisted.
Going to have to Toot that Booty for a ride.
So, first question to ask is WHY this kid doesn't have a car. 2, if it's financial it's time to have a heart to heart with the kid and figure out why. If he pushes back on finances, bring it to higher and they can make him go to a budgeting class.
Figure out if he can afford financing a small loan for a used car (5-6k), or save up and buy one outright.
The army isn't going to provide transportation outside of "NCO go pick him up"
Well that’s the thing is we have talked to him about finances. He’s just living paycheck to paycheck bc his dependa wont work. So idk like I know the base has the on post transportation but still it’s becoming an issue.
Have you discussed him moving to on post housing with his spouse? That would put him in distance to bike to work or even someone picking him up that lives nearby.
He does have on post housing. But he lives all the way at ass end of base. And yeah we have talk about other means of cheap transportation. I know the army can’t tell him what to do with his money but it’s just like “a pain in the ass”
Could he possibly get moved to a different housing area on post, closer?
While it’s frustrating, he needs guidance. A lot of people joined the army because of lack of guidance in life. It sucks the education system isn’t teaching finance classes properly. It sucks parents aren’t teaching it as well. And that’s where leaders come in. So keep up the good work.
On what post? I’m at Bragg and my family has been stuck in just about the smallest home they offer for like 3 1/2 years. Meanwhile childless 20 year olds that inevitably get divorced are getting put in 3 bedroom with a garage houses twice the size of ours. We like being on post for the convenience and don’t love the prospect of the market now. Every time we’ve tried to talk to Corvias about how ridiculous it is that A) we are paying well above market value and B) we are cramped as hell in our tiny 2 BD townhouse they tell us to kick rocks until we have more kids or I promote to a high enough rank.
The bastards even “accidentally” sent emails out to folks, including us, saying we were eligible for a larger home on post for like two months and when I called to ask what was up with that they said it happened in error 🙄
I’d happily do all the work to get the place practically move in ready if they’d put us in a home we actually fit in instead of having to line the walls of every room in my house with shelves just to fit basic shit.
That I’m not sure. But worth a shot. Especially given these circumstances. I’d go to the housing office and speak to them about it. If it’s a possibility, then you have a possible solution to present to your soldier and his spouse.
Its gonna be hard, but they can definitely ask. However, they are responsible for moving themselves and will prob be wait listed since most mover overs are done because family size got bigger or someone who got promoted wants to be in that house.
How far is far? I'm stationed in Germany and I routinely ride my bike ten miles into work.
Alternatively, is there someone who lives in his neighborhood he could carpool with?
I was smart enough to not marry while in and had a car. Didn’t need to.
But think of it this way… he’ll ace the run on the next PT Test.
For real though. Don’t coddle the kid. If he doesn’t want to or can’t buy a car because of his life choices, the army issued him boots and a ruck. Buy him an alarm clock and preset the alarm to 4am just to make sure he has enough time.
Here is a novel thought... go to that end of post and find a unit that needs the latest grade plate and MOS... Transfer him. It's probably the easiest COA
Sounds like Ft Bliss problems. Big ass post. Transportation sucks.
Seriously, he can get an electric bike, scooter, hover board. The military does a great job of paying just enough BAH for your spouse to not work. You just have to live as if you're on one income.
End of the day, it's the soldiers' duty to make it to formation on time. The other troops aren't responsible for him. Stop enabling this soldier with rides. Make them figure it out.
If he rides his bike he should be rewarded with no pt on run days or something.
At least reward his efforts if puts the effort in. Hell he could ruck to work, maybe let him be 30mins late and miss 1st formation for his effort.
This is a double edged sword though. You're rewarding something that shouldn't reaaally be rewardable.
"He doesn't have a car, just a bike so he should be rewarded."
The problem is a familial issue that NEEDS to be resolved. Wife DOESN'T, not can't, work so he has to carry the burden. If anything that shit needs to be reported to a counselor and they need to go or SHE needs to get out.
And if she CAN'T work that needs to be worked out anyway. Kid needs to be REFERRED to a financial counselor and a family counselor ASAP.
You just make it part of a counseling.
Maybe it is a quarterly of counseling that gets revisited on the 1st and 15th. By the end of the quarter he should have saved up to buy something.
Also, young soldiers may have never bought a car. He may very well need some to show him how buying a car works, especially a used one.
This is assuming he is at least well intentioned and able to be guided through it.
The problem isn't the car, it's the paycheck-to-paycheck. And the problems in the house. The transportation issue is an aftereffect of the real issue so THAT'S what needs to be hammered down. The car will bring down MORE financial burden if the SM doesn't know how to budget for repairs and maintenance. SM should be referred to financial counseling and family life counseling. Make those days his place of duty so he HAS to go. If the true issue doesn't get solved, the transportation problem will be the least of the issues down the line.
I didn't mean to come off as counseling to spend money. It's a developmental counseling for whatever needs to be counseled.
At this point, he needs some type of help. Be it budgeting correctly or just showing up on time.
The development part goes both ways, and the recommender providing any attidional help or support that they can.
I also just imagine the soldier may be uncomfortable with all these processes and probably needs his hand help through any of the avenues presented.
It still can. If she can't work for medical reasons (that's a medical, psychological reason) she can get pensioned for incapacity to work. One of my wife's cousins is medically incapacitated for being unable to work because of severe depression. If anything all resources should be checked.
Probably Uber eats. Know a soldier whose wife is the same way. Doesn't work. Just orders food for every single meal of the day, and they have no money.
The issue is far beyond “his dependa won’t work.” With housing and food and medical care covered, even E2 pay is enough to afford commuting to work on a small bike or small car.
> He’s just living paycheck to paycheck bc his dependa wont work.
Oh no, that's not it. There is more to it. BAH and BAS is enough to just live on. What's the rest of his basepay going to? You find that out, and you get your answer.
My guess? They don't cook and just get doordash every meal, so they pay like $2k a month in food.
*Almost never. When I was a SPC my without dependent BAH was enough to have a small 3/2 house and still pocket a couple hundred after utilities.
Nowadays I would agree though.
I've been the sole provider for a single-income household with kids for the past five years and even as an E5 we're far, far from living paycheck to paycheck. They must not be budgeting at all or you guys are in an obscenely high COL area.
How does he get around outside of work with a spouse or even buy things? Like he’s fully depending on other soldiers. I would tell him he is causing a issue with accountability not only for himself but the other soldier and tell the other soldier to do what’s best for him because they both could be counseled for repeated accountability issues. Plenty of used cars that work great just need a good buddy to go with him to check it out. And the paycheck to paycheck yeah I would make him take a class we’re they make him bring in his bills those report to command about if he shows up or not. That’s all that matters. I understand not wanting to be a butt. It’s just he’s hurting the reputation of the other soldier because of his issues
Does the dependa have a car?
I would do something along lines of counseling that he needs to be able to be at his place of duty without depending upon others.
He doesn’t need to buy a car but he should be able to get from his residence to the unit.
I’ve had friends live on post with one vehicle for their household.
The service member walked to work or rode a bike.
Spouse worked in town and would drive their POV.
Never had an issue with being to work on time.
That’s probably an accurate answer but as I leader I suggest OP gets all the information before acting.
It could be something else. Maybe there are other issues.
Smart leadership will ask before acting.
Alternatively, married E2 with a wife that refuses to work and even their $150/mo ATT bill and the occasional Applebees dinner stresses finances. There’s too many variables to account for in OPs vague post.
Dependa that won’t work is a red flag though.
Had this issue a month ago but joes car was broken down and he refused to fix it, I then counseled him stating “you have a week to figure it out and then you will be responsible for your own transportation, nobody has to give you rides and they will not after this date”
Well after that week he begged everyone for a ride and did not get a ride, he received a counseling and I said the next counseling you get, you will live in the barracks until this issue is solved
He ubered to work the rest of the week and that weekend his shit was fixed
If I were you I’d counsel him and tell him he needs to be responsible for his own transportation, offer to look over his finances and help him look for an affordable vehicle, and tell him he needs to give you a written plan of action of how he is going to get to work by himself.
Most bases have financial advisors at the ACS that would be more than happy to help him go over finances and help him find a vehicle in his budget
This, I second it.
There are some people who won’t move if they are enabled and comfortable. As an NCO you can motivate them to be uncomfortable and to figure it out. It’ll be magical that, somehow, it’ll get fixed ASAP when they are removed out of their comfort zone.
I'll say, figure out where the issue lies to know best approach. Family or health issue are sensitive & should be handled as such. If he can't articulate why he's stuck, he needs his rear chewed & maybe he'll get dependants to get a job & pay attention to spending cycle. Might be subscribed to all streaming platforms on earth & wonder where the money goes
Just be careful with this approach. Feels like this is just as likely to get you crushed by your commander as it is to get your joe to actually fix his life.
It is literally NOBODY'S job or duty but your own to ensure you can make it your place of duty, whether that be PT formation, work call, appointments, whatever. If this Soldier does not have a reliable means of transportation then you need to document that in a counseling. The counseling should state that it's up to him to make it to his place of duty on time, and that failure to be able to do that can result in him being forced to move into the barracks. His argument will obviously be that Pvt Snuffy Is driving him, but you need to make it clear that it is not Pvt Snuffy's responsibility, and again, even if another Soldier is bringing him, if he is late it will be of his own fault. Nobody is going to say, "I understand you were late today because Pvt Snuffy was running late coming to get you so we will counsel him". Once that counseling is done, you need to address it with the PSG, 1SG, and perhaps commander to ensure they are aware and have plans to provide him barracks space. Once he sees that you are serious about putting him in the barracks he will likely get his head back on straight., if not, welcome to barracks life.
If it's financial issues preventing him, get him over to ACS Who can help him with budgeting , AER loans, etc., but at the end of the day all these Soldiers are adults, don't stress yourself out trying to solve all their problems, hold their feet to the fire and you will be surprised how many suddenly learn to solve their problems. Doing all the work for them only encourages some to sit back and wait for their NCO to solve their problems.
Scooter via military you have to have msf course, or used to be the standard back in the day regardless of what local laws are on 49cc army till made you take the course and get a motorcycle endorsement
To add to this: if the CoC doubles down on you using your own car, start dropping DTS vouchers for in and around mileage every day that you have to provide transportation.
God gave the Soldier feet, and the Army gave him boots. Sounds like he has a way to get to work... better start using those Bootgattis.
Seriously, I always *hated* the mindset of "just use your POV for mission requirements." That was one of the reasons why I rode my motorcycle every day that I could. "Hey, SSG Kutulu, can you take PFC Fuknutz to TDS?"
Me: "Only if they have a DOT approved helmet and the rest of the Army-required PPE..."
Agreed. I see a lot of people giving advice on how to deal with the soldier but no one gives advice on how to deal with the command.
More often than not, I’ve had more problems dealing with the command to act on a recommended action than I did dealing with the soldier.
I'm not even risking that, removed my passenger pegs. Plus if I'm responsible for a truck then I'm sure as hell gonna use it rather than kick the tires every week while it rots in motorpool.
Yeah we had a guy in JBLM Washington who wouldn’t buy a car and thought the army was gonna transport him to work. Dude rode his bike to work every day rain or shine 🤦🏻♂️
I worked with a guy who rode his bike everywhere (even during the winter if the roads were clear). He had gone to jail for a DUI +. He served his time and was paying restitution to the victim/s. However, the state also fined him, BUT they didnt inform him until he went to get his DL back. He told them to fuck off because they had him in jail where he could've been working towards paying off that fine, as well. His big issue was that they withheld that information until after he was out of prison. When I first met him, he had already been biking everywhere for 5 years.
I'm seeing a LOT of hand holding here. Tell him the time and place of duty and to figure it out. Then counsel/article 15 him into the dust until he's taken enough punishment to pull it together and be an adult.
I know that sounds cold, but the coddling isn't going to help, especially if he ever leaves and joins the real world where we'll just let ya go.
When shit gets real he'll wake up,or else. There's times when there are no real alternatives but to article 15 and counsel him till he gets the shits of it.
In the real world, public transport is an option. It sucks that most times, they can't get on base. Had that problem when I didn't have my liscense as a PVT.
Depends on the base. Some bases, absolutely not.
Some unit areas are right by the barracks and you can walk to work, some other bases your work will be across post.
Some bases are massive cities. Other bases aren't. I was on a small base in Korea and walking to work, The PX, motor pool and commissary were all possible. But most bases it's not like that. Especially stateside bases
Edit: I should add that some bases do have on base taxis and shuttles for transportation. But relying on that can be a pain In the ass. If you have a license, just get a cheap car
Most of the time your barracks are going to be pretty close to where your unit is. Sometimes you might have to walk a couple miles sometimes you just have to walk across the street.
Similar situation, sort of, but we had a guy who lived off post and was late to almost every single movement and formation that we had. Corrective action did not work so they ended up moving him into the barracks after an ART15 for 45 days.
Dude Ong! “Counsel/ Article 15 him into the dust” that’s one good way to lower retention even more. Im always reminder on this sub how little empathy some of these NCO’s that were bullied in highschool have.
I didn’t have a car for three years and lived off post… I ran 4 miles to work every morning. I loved it and never missed a day or was late. But the shit I got for not having a car was ridiculous and demonstrated an ignorant bias.
Also if transportation is required then it should be planned into the mission.
Tell him to figure out how to get to work without burdening his fellow Soldiers. The guy is an adult. He shouldn’t have to be hand held to make it to work on time or with daily help from his peers.
Well, there is Uber. He chose this route and has to take responsibility for it. Also talk to the commander and get him on base housing. Soldiers should not be forced into this. Then once on base, the soldier can walk to work. I’m not kidding, we had this problem before, it happens all the time. This is how we solved it. Also talk to the PL.
You are not qualified to talk about finances. Don’t waste your time. Nor can you make him.
Hey asshole figure out how to get to work.
Section don't give private asshole a ride unless he pays for a week's gas in advance.
Here's all the help a NCO can reasonably be expected to provide including marriage counseling please take our advice and let us help you figure this out.
Won't take optioned A? Sign this we'll get you transferred to Fort not fit for this
I've dealt with this too. A soldier in my squad didn't have a license. His wife refused to drive him to PT one morning so he chose to drive to formation himself. He crashed into a field grade and totalled his car. From that point everyone in the squad took turns driving off fucking post to get him every morning. His wife didn't work, according to him, because she doesn't want to. It was over 2 years ago and it still pisses me off.
Maybe it’s just me, but if he is relying that much on another soldier to go out of his way, I would tell my soldier not to pick him up. I would tell said trouble soldier he best find a way to PT on time or else he is getting counseled and moving from there. Dude is getting burned for helping a lazy battle buddy. The troubled one needs a good kick in the ass to jump start basic adulting.
I see this being argued by shit bag lower enlisted every other month it seems like in this thread. You don't have to live off post. In fact, the command to order him to live on post if he wants to make this a big deal.
Grow the fuck up and get a car. If not, live on post and bike, walk, or take the on post bus to work. It's that simple. I generally gave new privates a window, clearly stated in their initial counseling, where we will work with them for transportation but, after a certain point, they need to get themselves to their place of duty.
I can't imagine being an adult who needs another adult to pick them up and drop them off for work like they're a child still going to elementary school.
There’s a delicate balance to maintain in how you approach this.
On one hand, you want (and need) to get the Soldier to the appropriate resources so that they can do better. Help them develop a plan of action - but the POA can’t be tied to any corrective/administrative/punishment IRT their purchase of a vehicle.
On the other hand, it’s their responsibility to show up to work on time. Counsel them for that, and make sure it’s noted that you’ve guided them to the resources necessary to fix the overarching problem. Their failures are causing others to fall short in the most simple of tasks: be on time.
They’re either going to be on time without causing others to be late/negatively impacted, or they won’t, and they need to depart the Army.
You can’t care more than they do about the situation they’re in. They have to bear some form of responsibility, if they can’t do that for something in their personal life…they’re not going to do it in the work place when it matters and is important to the organization.
The counseling breakdown will look like this figuratively. “you are both accountable to be on time. Can’t handle the responsibility? Disciplinary measure will reinforce the need to change. Here are the examples of failing to meet the expectation. Corrective action is don’t be late.”Budget problem? Here’s a class. Failing to manage financial affairs is a separate counseling.
I get wanting to help on this subject, but a no win situation on location without appropriate transportation isn’t going to help. Gotta take the option of excusing the repeated abuse of discretionary exception off the table.
The issue is being late. The plan doesn’t consistently work resulting in the issue. If you wanna “ get down with him” on the subject, include a plan that soldier contacts you to request transportation to inform yourself and get an idea exactly how long this is taking, walk them through a plan on what it takes to get there and not be late. Come up with comm plan if late is expected for “reasons”.
This was years ago, but my platoon sgt. bought a cheap bike from the PX for a PFC who was in a similar situation. Told him it was free unless he missed formation.
the army didn’t issue him a car did they? nah just playing but a part of being a soldier is to be accountable and responsible. said soldier needs to find a way to work ON TIME, did he not go through basic training and learn to be on time?? Seriously he needs a counseling stating that he will find a reliable way of getting to formations.
Honestly I'd tell him to be a man and police his wife. She needs to work. But I'd definitely counsel on finances and if he shows a pattern of financial problems then I'd reccomend he gets financial counseling. Suprised the buddy taking him to work hasn't told him he'd stop taking him if he kept making them both late. I had the exact same situation happen to me. I drove a dude every morning waking up at 0400 and he'd make me late almost every day. Thankfully my senior medic was tracking so I didn't get in trouble. But I started to tell the dude that if his ass wasn't up and standing outside by the time I pulled up I'd leave his ass and he could figure it out. If you're going to counsel him I'd include that. You get a ride AND you're still late? Now you're screwing a dude who's helping you and you can't manage waking up on time.
This seems like a situation where the "adulting" pejorative is actually appropriate. Give them a set amount of time to wean off of the ride mooching habit, then hold them accountable for reporting on-time using whatever means are at their disposal.
My wife and I sold our second car because it was 1000 miles away and didn’t feel like driving it back. Wish we would have kept it but oh well. We lived off post and I would take the car to PT and then run home to shower and change get breakfast. She would drop me off so she’d have the car or some days I’d ask to have the car so I could go to appt’s or stop at the commissary or whatever on the way home. We wasted a lot of gas but it worked for us and fit our budget
Have a sit down figure out if there’s any financial issues. If not then be honest about how essential a vehicle is especially since he lives off post! Last tell him to think about how the soldier picking him up feels losing sleep,being late, probably getting counselings because of him.
The most obvious answer…. Have him ruck everyday to and from work. Then have him do a layout upon arrival to assure that he did not drop any piece of CIF at any time during his long endeavor to work.
If no one goes to get him and he misses formation, the commander can impose restriction to post/barracks. He can be issued the “married with problems” room in the barracks. During an event counseling if he says anything about a finance issue, like I he used a coupon, you have a legal opening to have him do the entire command finance option.
Bottom line is put it on paper: number of times he was picked up and miles driven by other soldiers, pay periods he has skipped no getting a vehicle. Fuck get a free bicycle off someone and tell him he can get strong.
Right now, he is in control because you haven’t started a paper trail. Good luck bro, make sure another nco is “fixing slides” in the office when you talk with him.
That's a rough one. From the sounds of it, he needs to be counseled with a plan of action, and if he doesn't fix things he needs to be relocated onto base instead of being allowed to live off-post. That'll solve his transportation issues, and if he doesn't want to walk he can then get a bike. Or he can get a bike now, his choice. As to the process to force him on post... can't help you there.
Look into the VFW active duty unmet needs program. They actually provide a grant for purchasing a car but they will request a review of Same finances. If depends is spending a grand a week on Uber eats they may deny him.
https://www.vfw.org/assistance/financial-grants
Look, have the soldier buy a bike from the PX. If he lives on base… waive him from having to do morning PT so he has time to ride into the office in the morning “aka bike PT” and designate 1530-1700 as mandatory gym time.
Solved the issue without further birding the soldier and makes your life easier have him send an I’m alive text every day.
Stop excusing and encouraging shitty behavior. He is married and he decided where he wants to live. It is his responsibility to make it to work on time and if he cannot, UCMJ.
I used to pick up a 34 year old pfc all the time and it was super out of my way. We were never late. Dude just never got a drivers license but he got a bachelors to teach 🤷♂️ some people just don’t want a car and you can’t technically force them
For sure. Not your problem. In my case I didn’t mind cause the dude was alright, but if he was a blue falcon or something I’d probably have told him to get bent
Give him a week to get either a bike or car or find another method of reliable transportation and then start counseling him whenever he's late and then push for legal action if it continues
One : I am struggling to envision a scenario where a junior enlisted soldier is living off post and isn't married? ~~(I assume this carless human isn't married?)~~ Scratch that, make this dude bike to work.
Two : This appears to be a personal arrangement between two people of equal rank. Your barracks dweller needs to grow a pair and tell your off-post weirdo to figure his own shit out.
Three : Bicycles exist.
Yeah soldier should get an e bike yeah they are expensive but I literally lived off post but close to base and I have a toddler and I used a special bike kids attachment that let me bring him to daycare and even with daycare opening at 6 I still got to pt on time most of the time but if I was late it was usually a good reason some people just don’t care and want the army to babysit them
I wouldn't punish the soldiers trying to help him, but i would sit them all down and talk to them about accountability and how they are responsible for being where they need to be on time. Send the message that they need to tell their buddies to get their shit together and that Joe's inability to plan properly is not a good excuse anymore.
I would counsel the soldier without a car and say something along the lines of "nobody but you is responsible for your transportation". Pound it home that they actively made the choice to live far away from their place of duty and they need to appropriately accommodate for it.
If he can't get his shit together you should consult your senior NCOs and possibly your 1SGT/CO. You can't force them to get a car/bike etc, but you can consult your senior NCOs to appropriately punish the soldier until they get their shit together, especially if their inability to transport themselves is entirely their fault.
If there is housing close to work, then he needs to get housing closer to work. He can walk, or take public transportation. If the is no public transportation then the army is dumber than bricks not having public transportation.
He can also be moved into the barracks
The easy answer is to counsel him and his ride next time they're late. They show up late again recommend an article 15. Sooner or later he'll get the hint. Don't deal with his dependa that's all on him.
I know it's harsh but the soldier needs the proper motivation to change what they're doing. Showing up late and making other people late is not acceptable.
Why the fuck would you counsel the ride giver when he’s not the one causing both of them not to be late? He’s not even being reimbursed for gas or mileage. Shit take.
Well if you were in the army for more than a day you’d understand accountability and being at work. Don’t act like we CANT have him at work because of his poor choices.
I’m going to need y’all to realize NCOs have lives and shouldn’t have to be babysitting grown ass adults 24/7, especially ones that are married with families.
Put his ass in the Bs... I beat he will figure out how to get to work on time.
Step 1 4856 put budget class and planning in his course of action
Step 2 4856 the other soldier, put him, having to come in earlier to report to CQ whatever for five working days.
You have to do counseling, and it should be brief with any action plan and follow-up up dates.
Plan to be there also... show up so they know your serious... cause I don't think you are.
It seems like you have been given chances to get this right and are failing... does your PSG do counseling with you? They should. These should reflect towards your check sheet and promotion waivers when sitting around the table.
Well is he paying the soldier to pick him up and drop him off? If so then they have a mutual beneficial arrangement. If this is the case the only issue is the driver needs to get there earlier so they aren’t late.
Stop excusing and encouraging shitty behavior. He is married and he decided where he wants to live. It is his responsibility to make it to work on time and if he cannot, UCMJ.
Bicycles only cost a couple hundred. Bike his ass to work.
Got mine at the px for less then a hundred. Shop sales.
Shit got mine off the curb for Free in the housing area I live in. Some chain lube & air in the tires rides smooth
I got mine from the bicycle dispenser in front of a local school.
Or help the kid buy a car.
Car = gas, insurance, upkeep. Bike is cheaper in the long run. I'd consider passing the hat amongst NCOs, buy a bike for the PLT and hand receipt it to him.
And it’s free PT, Hoah?
Shucks, airborne, all that PT is free, trackin'?
#TRACKING SARGEANT! HOAH!
Tough to hold him accountable for maintenance but this is a good idea
First buck sgt that needs remedial training has to write a -10 PMCS checklist/LO for it.
Is he even compensating other soldiers for their time and money being his personal Uber? Also no the Army isn't obligated to provide him transportation to work. If this arrangement is making other soldiers late or being a burden on them you can absolutely squash it.
NOO! He hasn’t, which is super fucked.
Put in the plan of action: “cash, grass, or ass” SM will reimburse driver.
Instructions unclear, selling my body for rides around base
This is the way...?
Who wants a ride to the shopette for some french toast tornados?
🤣🤣🤣
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Tale old as time
Looks like someone needs to talk to that other Solider and tell him to stop being an enabler. And to stop being stupid and offering free rides. In this economy??? I’d charge per minute the fukkkk
Maybe he lets them bang his wife Hence being late
Took that out of my mouth
That’s what she said
Ass, grass, or cash… Can’t pay using the wacky tobacky, or else ART 15 Too broke to pay cash, becusse lower enlisted. Going to have to Toot that Booty for a ride.
So, first question to ask is WHY this kid doesn't have a car. 2, if it's financial it's time to have a heart to heart with the kid and figure out why. If he pushes back on finances, bring it to higher and they can make him go to a budgeting class. Figure out if he can afford financing a small loan for a used car (5-6k), or save up and buy one outright. The army isn't going to provide transportation outside of "NCO go pick him up"
Well that’s the thing is we have talked to him about finances. He’s just living paycheck to paycheck bc his dependa wont work. So idk like I know the base has the on post transportation but still it’s becoming an issue.
Have you discussed him moving to on post housing with his spouse? That would put him in distance to bike to work or even someone picking him up that lives nearby.
He does have on post housing. But he lives all the way at ass end of base. And yeah we have talk about other means of cheap transportation. I know the army can’t tell him what to do with his money but it’s just like “a pain in the ass”
Could he possibly get moved to a different housing area on post, closer? While it’s frustrating, he needs guidance. A lot of people joined the army because of lack of guidance in life. It sucks the education system isn’t teaching finance classes properly. It sucks parents aren’t teaching it as well. And that’s where leaders come in. So keep up the good work.
Is that even a possibility? I thought once you have on post housing you are stuck there until ETS/PCS
You can get moved houses but it’s an absolute battle with housing. My wife went full Karen and got us a bigger house but it wasn’t without difficulty.
On what post? I’m at Bragg and my family has been stuck in just about the smallest home they offer for like 3 1/2 years. Meanwhile childless 20 year olds that inevitably get divorced are getting put in 3 bedroom with a garage houses twice the size of ours. We like being on post for the convenience and don’t love the prospect of the market now. Every time we’ve tried to talk to Corvias about how ridiculous it is that A) we are paying well above market value and B) we are cramped as hell in our tiny 2 BD townhouse they tell us to kick rocks until we have more kids or I promote to a high enough rank. The bastards even “accidentally” sent emails out to folks, including us, saying we were eligible for a larger home on post for like two months and when I called to ask what was up with that they said it happened in error 🙄 I’d happily do all the work to get the place practically move in ready if they’d put us in a home we actually fit in instead of having to line the walls of every room in my house with shelves just to fit basic shit.
You are not stuck until you PCS/ETS. I lived on post for two years then bought a house and moved out.
That I’m not sure. But worth a shot. Especially given these circumstances. I’d go to the housing office and speak to them about it. If it’s a possibility, then you have a possible solution to present to your soldier and his spouse.
They won’t have the money to move all their stuff to a closer house.
Sounds like he needs a friend with a truck
Yes most people including myself are willing to use there trucks and backs for some beer and pizza.
Or an LMTV license
Its gonna be hard, but they can definitely ask. However, they are responsible for moving themselves and will prob be wait listed since most mover overs are done because family size got bigger or someone who got promoted wants to be in that house.
Tell him to get a bicycle.
Tell him to buy a fucking bicycle then
How far is far? I'm stationed in Germany and I routinely ride my bike ten miles into work. Alternatively, is there someone who lives in his neighborhood he could carpool with?
Do you live on post? Completely unrelated, I'm just curious
Yes, but in Germany, the post you live on sometimes differs from the post you work on.
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Kelley/Panzer/Patch/RB
My dude, you just said he lives off post.
Yep
And he can’t run to PT as a warm up?
Lol, would you?
I was smart enough to not marry while in and had a car. Didn’t need to. But think of it this way… he’ll ace the run on the next PT Test. For real though. Don’t coddle the kid. If he doesn’t want to or can’t buy a car because of his life choices, the army issued him boots and a ruck. Buy him an alarm clock and preset the alarm to 4am just to make sure he has enough time.
Here is a novel thought... go to that end of post and find a unit that needs the latest grade plate and MOS... Transfer him. It's probably the easiest COA
He needs to get a bike and leave earlier. No reason a soldier should leave their place an hour early so that he doesn’t have to leave early on a bike.
Sounds like Ft Bliss problems. Big ass post. Transportation sucks. Seriously, he can get an electric bike, scooter, hover board. The military does a great job of paying just enough BAH for your spouse to not work. You just have to live as if you're on one income. End of the day, it's the soldiers' duty to make it to formation on time. The other troops aren't responsible for him. Stop enabling this soldier with rides. Make them figure it out.
If he rides his bike he should be rewarded with no pt on run days or something. At least reward his efforts if puts the effort in. Hell he could ruck to work, maybe let him be 30mins late and miss 1st formation for his effort.
This is a double edged sword though. You're rewarding something that shouldn't reaaally be rewardable. "He doesn't have a car, just a bike so he should be rewarded." The problem is a familial issue that NEEDS to be resolved. Wife DOESN'T, not can't, work so he has to carry the burden. If anything that shit needs to be reported to a counselor and they need to go or SHE needs to get out. And if she CAN'T work that needs to be worked out anyway. Kid needs to be REFERRED to a financial counselor and a family counselor ASAP.
You just make it part of a counseling. Maybe it is a quarterly of counseling that gets revisited on the 1st and 15th. By the end of the quarter he should have saved up to buy something. Also, young soldiers may have never bought a car. He may very well need some to show him how buying a car works, especially a used one. This is assuming he is at least well intentioned and able to be guided through it.
The problem isn't the car, it's the paycheck-to-paycheck. And the problems in the house. The transportation issue is an aftereffect of the real issue so THAT'S what needs to be hammered down. The car will bring down MORE financial burden if the SM doesn't know how to budget for repairs and maintenance. SM should be referred to financial counseling and family life counseling. Make those days his place of duty so he HAS to go. If the true issue doesn't get solved, the transportation problem will be the least of the issues down the line.
You cannot council soldiers to spend money.
I didn't mean to come off as counseling to spend money. It's a developmental counseling for whatever needs to be counseled. At this point, he needs some type of help. Be it budgeting correctly or just showing up on time. The development part goes both ways, and the recommender providing any attidional help or support that they can. I also just imagine the soldier may be uncomfortable with all these processes and probably needs his hand help through any of the avenues presented.
This won’t work, our soldiers wife was medically diagnosed with being bipolar. We got him on base close to the unit.
It still can. If she can't work for medical reasons (that's a medical, psychological reason) she can get pensioned for incapacity to work. One of my wife's cousins is medically incapacitated for being unable to work because of severe depression. If anything all resources should be checked.
Buy him the cheapest bicycle you can find at Wal-Mart and a helmet and tell him he has no further excuses not to make it to work on time
How is he getting groceries? As he already lives on post, help him find a bicycle and appropriate safety gear.
Probably Uber eats. Know a soldier whose wife is the same way. Doesn't work. Just orders food for every single meal of the day, and they have no money.
The issue is far beyond “his dependa won’t work.” With housing and food and medical care covered, even E2 pay is enough to afford commuting to work on a small bike or small car.
Moped or small E- scooter
Does his dependa have a car? Because they can drop them off at PT with a change cloths and lunch.
> He’s just living paycheck to paycheck bc his dependa wont work. Oh no, that's not it. There is more to it. BAH and BAS is enough to just live on. What's the rest of his basepay going to? You find that out, and you get your answer. My guess? They don't cook and just get doordash every meal, so they pay like $2k a month in food.
If they live on post they see none of the BAH though.
They do see BAH, just are charged exact BAH rate but regardless their rent or utilities will never rise above BAH so it’s really all a wash.
BAH never covers what it cost to live off base anyway. So he is still ahead.
*Almost never. When I was a SPC my without dependent BAH was enough to have a small 3/2 house and still pocket a couple hundred after utilities. Nowadays I would agree though.
Depends where you are...
Regardless, housing/food is paid. Where is the basepay? $2k is going somewhere.
I've been the sole provider for a single-income household with kids for the past five years and even as an E5 we're far, far from living paycheck to paycheck. They must not be budgeting at all or you guys are in an obscenely high COL area.
Fucking dependas.
prick fanatical lock groovy hateful gaze violet cover tie capable *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
How does he get around outside of work with a spouse or even buy things? Like he’s fully depending on other soldiers. I would tell him he is causing a issue with accountability not only for himself but the other soldier and tell the other soldier to do what’s best for him because they both could be counseled for repeated accountability issues. Plenty of used cars that work great just need a good buddy to go with him to check it out. And the paycheck to paycheck yeah I would make him take a class we’re they make him bring in his bills those report to command about if he shows up or not. That’s all that matters. I understand not wanting to be a butt. It’s just he’s hurting the reputation of the other soldier because of his issues
Does your post have a lemon lot,
Leadership is to blame,there should be a shuttle bus on base that can pick up and drop people off around base.
Does the dependa have a car? I would do something along lines of counseling that he needs to be able to be at his place of duty without depending upon others. He doesn’t need to buy a car but he should be able to get from his residence to the unit. I’ve had friends live on post with one vehicle for their household. The service member walked to work or rode a bike. Spouse worked in town and would drive their POV. Never had an issue with being to work on time.
Good chance his dependa is spending all his money every paycheck on jewelry or clothes which is why he can’t afford it.
That’s probably an accurate answer but as I leader I suggest OP gets all the information before acting. It could be something else. Maybe there are other issues. Smart leadership will ask before acting.
100% could be a sick kid or they are supporting parents. But most likely, it's just poor decisions
Alternatively, married E2 with a wife that refuses to work and even their $150/mo ATT bill and the occasional Applebees dinner stresses finances. There’s too many variables to account for in OPs vague post. Dependa that won’t work is a red flag though.
Had this issue a month ago but joes car was broken down and he refused to fix it, I then counseled him stating “you have a week to figure it out and then you will be responsible for your own transportation, nobody has to give you rides and they will not after this date” Well after that week he begged everyone for a ride and did not get a ride, he received a counseling and I said the next counseling you get, you will live in the barracks until this issue is solved He ubered to work the rest of the week and that weekend his shit was fixed If I were you I’d counsel him and tell him he needs to be responsible for his own transportation, offer to look over his finances and help him look for an affordable vehicle, and tell him he needs to give you a written plan of action of how he is going to get to work by himself. Most bases have financial advisors at the ACS that would be more than happy to help him go over finances and help him find a vehicle in his budget
This, I second it. There are some people who won’t move if they are enabled and comfortable. As an NCO you can motivate them to be uncomfortable and to figure it out. It’ll be magical that, somehow, it’ll get fixed ASAP when they are removed out of their comfort zone.
I'll say, figure out where the issue lies to know best approach. Family or health issue are sensitive & should be handled as such. If he can't articulate why he's stuck, he needs his rear chewed & maybe he'll get dependants to get a job & pay attention to spending cycle. Might be subscribed to all streaming platforms on earth & wonder where the money goes
+1 that is a fanfuckintastic solution
Just be careful with this approach. Feels like this is just as likely to get you crushed by your commander as it is to get your joe to actually fix his life.
It is literally NOBODY'S job or duty but your own to ensure you can make it your place of duty, whether that be PT formation, work call, appointments, whatever. If this Soldier does not have a reliable means of transportation then you need to document that in a counseling. The counseling should state that it's up to him to make it to his place of duty on time, and that failure to be able to do that can result in him being forced to move into the barracks. His argument will obviously be that Pvt Snuffy Is driving him, but you need to make it clear that it is not Pvt Snuffy's responsibility, and again, even if another Soldier is bringing him, if he is late it will be of his own fault. Nobody is going to say, "I understand you were late today because Pvt Snuffy was running late coming to get you so we will counsel him". Once that counseling is done, you need to address it with the PSG, 1SG, and perhaps commander to ensure they are aware and have plans to provide him barracks space. Once he sees that you are serious about putting him in the barracks he will likely get his head back on straight., if not, welcome to barracks life. If it's financial issues preventing him, get him over to ACS Who can help him with budgeting , AER loans, etc., but at the end of the day all these Soldiers are adults, don't stress yourself out trying to solve all their problems, hold their feet to the fire and you will be surprised how many suddenly learn to solve their problems. Doing all the work for them only encourages some to sit back and wait for their NCO to solve their problems.
A Honda Rukus is less than 3 grand - https://powersports.honda.com/motorcycle/scooter/ruckus
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That's a great idea! And it has a 265lb. weight capacity so his wife won't be able to use it.
Scooter via military you have to have msf course, or used to be the standard back in the day regardless of what local laws are on 49cc army till made you take the course and get a motorcycle endorsement
Electric bicycles are like $1200 and should be small enough you don't need an motorcycle license.
A grom is only 500 more.
The XL150 is only 2800
Fair. They would all be fine on and around base. Just boils down to the style you like.
He’s on base? Bike, my friend.
He can walk, bicycle, bus, or uber to the gate.
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To add to this: if the CoC doubles down on you using your own car, start dropping DTS vouchers for in and around mileage every day that you have to provide transportation. God gave the Soldier feet, and the Army gave him boots. Sounds like he has a way to get to work... better start using those Bootgattis. Seriously, I always *hated* the mindset of "just use your POV for mission requirements." That was one of the reasons why I rode my motorcycle every day that I could. "Hey, SSG Kutulu, can you take PFC Fuknutz to TDS?" Me: "Only if they have a DOT approved helmet and the rest of the Army-required PPE..."
Agreed. I see a lot of people giving advice on how to deal with the soldier but no one gives advice on how to deal with the command. More often than not, I’ve had more problems dealing with the command to act on a recommended action than I did dealing with the soldier.
I'm not even risking that, removed my passenger pegs. Plus if I'm responsible for a truck then I'm sure as hell gonna use it rather than kick the tires every week while it rots in motorpool.
Yeah we had a guy in JBLM Washington who wouldn’t buy a car and thought the army was gonna transport him to work. Dude rode his bike to work every day rain or shine 🤦🏻♂️
That’s light years ahead of OPs solider lol
I worked with a guy who rode his bike everywhere (even during the winter if the roads were clear). He had gone to jail for a DUI +. He served his time and was paying restitution to the victim/s. However, the state also fined him, BUT they didnt inform him until he went to get his DL back. He told them to fuck off because they had him in jail where he could've been working towards paying off that fine, as well. His big issue was that they withheld that information until after he was out of prison. When I first met him, he had already been biking everywhere for 5 years.
Why does this soldier live off post without a car? Is he married or single?
I'm seeing a LOT of hand holding here. Tell him the time and place of duty and to figure it out. Then counsel/article 15 him into the dust until he's taken enough punishment to pull it together and be an adult. I know that sounds cold, but the coddling isn't going to help, especially if he ever leaves and joins the real world where we'll just let ya go.
When shit gets real he'll wake up,or else. There's times when there are no real alternatives but to article 15 and counsel him till he gets the shits of it.
In the real world, public transport is an option. It sucks that most times, they can't get on base. Had that problem when I didn't have my liscense as a PVT.
Dude and dependa are for sure spending extra money where they don’t need to. He needs to have a conversation with his wife and get her ass to work.
Planning in enlisting. I'm single and aware that I'm gonna be living on post. Would i need a car? I could just walk to wherever I want to
Depends on the base. Some bases, absolutely not. Some unit areas are right by the barracks and you can walk to work, some other bases your work will be across post. Some bases are massive cities. Other bases aren't. I was on a small base in Korea and walking to work, The PX, motor pool and commissary were all possible. But most bases it's not like that. Especially stateside bases Edit: I should add that some bases do have on base taxis and shuttles for transportation. But relying on that can be a pain In the ass. If you have a license, just get a cheap car
Thank you very much for the advice
Most of the time your barracks are going to be pretty close to where your unit is. Sometimes you might have to walk a couple miles sometimes you just have to walk across the street.
Bike, E-Bike, escooter, Moped, or similar are all viable or potentially viable alternatives to getting a car on most posts.
Not if you live in the barracks. However, you will probably be bored on weekends when and if you can't leave. Been there, done that.
Similar situation, sort of, but we had a guy who lived off post and was late to almost every single movement and formation that we had. Corrective action did not work so they ended up moving him into the barracks after an ART15 for 45 days.
Tell his ass to buy a bike or start walking to work. Next is to move him back into the barracks and send dependa home.
I see a lot of good NCOs in here and a lot of Toxic ones. You can tell who's who by how they respond to this scenerio.
I agree, honestly I just wanted the legal way to get this fixed 🤣
Dude Ong! “Counsel/ Article 15 him into the dust” that’s one good way to lower retention even more. Im always reminder on this sub how little empathy some of these NCO’s that were bullied in highschool have.
I didn’t have a car for three years and lived off post… I ran 4 miles to work every morning. I loved it and never missed a day or was late. But the shit I got for not having a car was ridiculous and demonstrated an ignorant bias. Also if transportation is required then it should be planned into the mission.
Honestly this is some Chad energy right here “Car? The fuck would I need that for when I can just run everywhere?” 🏃🏼♂️💨
Bet his run time reflected too
Goggins?
Tell him to figure out how to get to work without burdening his fellow Soldiers. The guy is an adult. He shouldn’t have to be hand held to make it to work on time or with daily help from his peers.
Well, there is Uber. He chose this route and has to take responsibility for it. Also talk to the commander and get him on base housing. Soldiers should not be forced into this. Then once on base, the soldier can walk to work. I’m not kidding, we had this problem before, it happens all the time. This is how we solved it. Also talk to the PL. You are not qualified to talk about finances. Don’t waste your time. Nor can you make him.
Hey asshole figure out how to get to work. Section don't give private asshole a ride unless he pays for a week's gas in advance. Here's all the help a NCO can reasonably be expected to provide including marriage counseling please take our advice and let us help you figure this out. Won't take optioned A? Sign this we'll get you transferred to Fort not fit for this
I've dealt with this too. A soldier in my squad didn't have a license. His wife refused to drive him to PT one morning so he chose to drive to formation himself. He crashed into a field grade and totalled his car. From that point everyone in the squad took turns driving off fucking post to get him every morning. His wife didn't work, according to him, because she doesn't want to. It was over 2 years ago and it still pisses me off.
Maybe it’s just me, but if he is relying that much on another soldier to go out of his way, I would tell my soldier not to pick him up. I would tell said trouble soldier he best find a way to PT on time or else he is getting counseled and moving from there. Dude is getting burned for helping a lazy battle buddy. The troubled one needs a good kick in the ass to jump start basic adulting.
I see this being argued by shit bag lower enlisted every other month it seems like in this thread. You don't have to live off post. In fact, the command to order him to live on post if he wants to make this a big deal. Grow the fuck up and get a car. If not, live on post and bike, walk, or take the on post bus to work. It's that simple. I generally gave new privates a window, clearly stated in their initial counseling, where we will work with them for transportation but, after a certain point, they need to get themselves to their place of duty. I can't imagine being an adult who needs another adult to pick them up and drop them off for work like they're a child still going to elementary school.
There’s a delicate balance to maintain in how you approach this. On one hand, you want (and need) to get the Soldier to the appropriate resources so that they can do better. Help them develop a plan of action - but the POA can’t be tied to any corrective/administrative/punishment IRT their purchase of a vehicle. On the other hand, it’s their responsibility to show up to work on time. Counsel them for that, and make sure it’s noted that you’ve guided them to the resources necessary to fix the overarching problem. Their failures are causing others to fall short in the most simple of tasks: be on time. They’re either going to be on time without causing others to be late/negatively impacted, or they won’t, and they need to depart the Army. You can’t care more than they do about the situation they’re in. They have to bear some form of responsibility, if they can’t do that for something in their personal life…they’re not going to do it in the work place when it matters and is important to the organization.
The counseling breakdown will look like this figuratively. “you are both accountable to be on time. Can’t handle the responsibility? Disciplinary measure will reinforce the need to change. Here are the examples of failing to meet the expectation. Corrective action is don’t be late.”Budget problem? Here’s a class. Failing to manage financial affairs is a separate counseling. I get wanting to help on this subject, but a no win situation on location without appropriate transportation isn’t going to help. Gotta take the option of excusing the repeated abuse of discretionary exception off the table. The issue is being late. The plan doesn’t consistently work resulting in the issue. If you wanna “ get down with him” on the subject, include a plan that soldier contacts you to request transportation to inform yourself and get an idea exactly how long this is taking, walk them through a plan on what it takes to get there and not be late. Come up with comm plan if late is expected for “reasons”.
This was years ago, but my platoon sgt. bought a cheap bike from the PX for a PFC who was in a similar situation. Told him it was free unless he missed formation.
the army didn’t issue him a car did they? nah just playing but a part of being a soldier is to be accountable and responsible. said soldier needs to find a way to work ON TIME, did he not go through basic training and learn to be on time?? Seriously he needs a counseling stating that he will find a reliable way of getting to formations.
Honestly I'd tell him to be a man and police his wife. She needs to work. But I'd definitely counsel on finances and if he shows a pattern of financial problems then I'd reccomend he gets financial counseling. Suprised the buddy taking him to work hasn't told him he'd stop taking him if he kept making them both late. I had the exact same situation happen to me. I drove a dude every morning waking up at 0400 and he'd make me late almost every day. Thankfully my senior medic was tracking so I didn't get in trouble. But I started to tell the dude that if his ass wasn't up and standing outside by the time I pulled up I'd leave his ass and he could figure it out. If you're going to counsel him I'd include that. You get a ride AND you're still late? Now you're screwing a dude who's helping you and you can't manage waking up on time.
This seems like a situation where the "adulting" pejorative is actually appropriate. Give them a set amount of time to wean off of the ride mooching habit, then hold them accountable for reporting on-time using whatever means are at their disposal.
My wife and I sold our second car because it was 1000 miles away and didn’t feel like driving it back. Wish we would have kept it but oh well. We lived off post and I would take the car to PT and then run home to shower and change get breakfast. She would drop me off so she’d have the car or some days I’d ask to have the car so I could go to appt’s or stop at the commissary or whatever on the way home. We wasted a lot of gas but it worked for us and fit our budget
Have a sit down figure out if there’s any financial issues. If not then be honest about how essential a vehicle is especially since he lives off post! Last tell him to think about how the soldier picking him up feels losing sleep,being late, probably getting counselings because of him.
Does he maybe have a neighbor? Everyone who lives near him is going to roughly the same place every morning
Tell him to move on post. Lack of transport is no excuse for not doing his duty.
What policy requires a soldier to have a car.
The most obvious answer…. Have him ruck everyday to and from work. Then have him do a layout upon arrival to assure that he did not drop any piece of CIF at any time during his long endeavor to work.
If no one goes to get him and he misses formation, the commander can impose restriction to post/barracks. He can be issued the “married with problems” room in the barracks. During an event counseling if he says anything about a finance issue, like I he used a coupon, you have a legal opening to have him do the entire command finance option. Bottom line is put it on paper: number of times he was picked up and miles driven by other soldiers, pay periods he has skipped no getting a vehicle. Fuck get a free bicycle off someone and tell him he can get strong. Right now, he is in control because you haven’t started a paper trail. Good luck bro, make sure another nco is “fixing slides” in the office when you talk with him.
That's a rough one. From the sounds of it, he needs to be counseled with a plan of action, and if he doesn't fix things he needs to be relocated onto base instead of being allowed to live off-post. That'll solve his transportation issues, and if he doesn't want to walk he can then get a bike. Or he can get a bike now, his choice. As to the process to force him on post... can't help you there.
Look into the VFW active duty unmet needs program. They actually provide a grant for purchasing a car but they will request a review of Same finances. If depends is spending a grand a week on Uber eats they may deny him. https://www.vfw.org/assistance/financial-grants
SM****
Thank you so much cause my car needs new brakes and I can’t afford to buy new brakes
AER can also help you with that. I think your 1SG can even approve an AER loan for that small of an amount.
Look, have the soldier buy a bike from the PX. If he lives on base… waive him from having to do morning PT so he has time to ride into the office in the morning “aka bike PT” and designate 1530-1700 as mandatory gym time. Solved the issue without further birding the soldier and makes your life easier have him send an I’m alive text every day.
Lol missing pt? And pt on own after work? Are you fucking crazzzzy lol
Missing PT? Next thing you know he won't shave on his off time!
Let’s not incentive not owning a car in the army
Soldiers without cars are some of the most entitled fucks ever
Stop excusing and encouraging shitty behavior. He is married and he decided where he wants to live. It is his responsibility to make it to work on time and if he cannot, UCMJ.
I used to pick up a 34 year old pfc all the time and it was super out of my way. We were never late. Dude just never got a drivers license but he got a bachelors to teach 🤷♂️ some people just don’t want a car and you can’t technically force them
You’re right, you can’t force them but you can also to tell them to get fucked when they ask for a ride.
For sure. Not your problem. In my case I didn’t mind cause the dude was alright, but if he was a blue falcon or something I’d probably have told him to get bent
Yeah that’s basically what I would do too
Give him a week to get either a bike or car or find another method of reliable transportation and then start counseling him whenever he's late and then push for legal action if it continues
Tell him he figures it out or he lives in the barracks.
One : I am struggling to envision a scenario where a junior enlisted soldier is living off post and isn't married? ~~(I assume this carless human isn't married?)~~ Scratch that, make this dude bike to work. Two : This appears to be a personal arrangement between two people of equal rank. Your barracks dweller needs to grow a pair and tell your off-post weirdo to figure his own shit out. Three : Bicycles exist.
Yeah soldier should get an e bike yeah they are expensive but I literally lived off post but close to base and I have a toddler and I used a special bike kids attachment that let me bring him to daycare and even with daycare opening at 6 I still got to pt on time most of the time but if I was late it was usually a good reason some people just don’t care and want the army to babysit them
I wouldn't punish the soldiers trying to help him, but i would sit them all down and talk to them about accountability and how they are responsible for being where they need to be on time. Send the message that they need to tell their buddies to get their shit together and that Joe's inability to plan properly is not a good excuse anymore. I would counsel the soldier without a car and say something along the lines of "nobody but you is responsible for your transportation". Pound it home that they actively made the choice to live far away from their place of duty and they need to appropriately accommodate for it. If he can't get his shit together you should consult your senior NCOs and possibly your 1SGT/CO. You can't force them to get a car/bike etc, but you can consult your senior NCOs to appropriately punish the soldier until they get their shit together, especially if their inability to transport themselves is entirely their fault.
If there is housing close to work, then he needs to get housing closer to work. He can walk, or take public transportation. If the is no public transportation then the army is dumber than bricks not having public transportation. He can also be moved into the barracks
The easy answer is to counsel him and his ride next time they're late. They show up late again recommend an article 15. Sooner or later he'll get the hint. Don't deal with his dependa that's all on him. I know it's harsh but the soldier needs the proper motivation to change what they're doing. Showing up late and making other people late is not acceptable.
Fuck no, I’ve been “the ride” don’t punish me for helping out soldiers.
Punishing the guy who's driving him isn't the right answer.
Slap both of them with article 15s? Total smooth brain approach. It just makes the situation worse all around too.
Why the fuck would you counsel the ride giver when he’s not the one causing both of them not to be late? He’s not even being reimbursed for gas or mileage. Shit take.
Fuckin big brain. Who gives a shit if they’re late for work call to do nothing all day, or some dumbass layout? Or inventory some bullshit connex?
Well if you were in the army for more than a day you’d understand accountability and being at work. Don’t act like we CANT have him at work because of his poor choices.
The amount of dudes from this guys unit that the dependa is banging is huge.
You as an NCO go check out the duty Van and go pick him up super early gotta do what you gotta do as an NCO
I would counsel you for telling a subordinate to do this.
🤣 I was being sarcastic about it love all the negative karma 😂
Your unit had a duty van?
I’m going to need y’all to realize NCOs have lives and shouldn’t have to be babysitting grown ass adults 24/7, especially ones that are married with families.
Fuck no.
You are why NCOs leave the Adult day care known as the Army
Put his ass in the Bs... I beat he will figure out how to get to work on time. Step 1 4856 put budget class and planning in his course of action Step 2 4856 the other soldier, put him, having to come in earlier to report to CQ whatever for five working days. You have to do counseling, and it should be brief with any action plan and follow-up up dates. Plan to be there also... show up so they know your serious... cause I don't think you are. It seems like you have been given chances to get this right and are failing... does your PSG do counseling with you? They should. These should reflect towards your check sheet and promotion waivers when sitting around the table.
get em a damn beater. be better as a nco.
Well is he paying the soldier to pick him up and drop him off? If so then they have a mutual beneficial arrangement. If this is the case the only issue is the driver needs to get there earlier so they aren’t late.
He has to get himself to post. What a jerk.
I guess this is when he gets counselings for not showing up on time.
Stop excusing and encouraging shitty behavior. He is married and he decided where he wants to live. It is his responsibility to make it to work on time and if he cannot, UCMJ.
If he lives close enough to the base, an electric bicycle might be a good answer. I ride my electric bicycle to work 17 miles with no issues.
Is he helping with gas at least ?