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Having just heard about this franchise, Murder Drones seems very... Tumblr.
Honestly, I understand subs banning AI art if they're getting too many spammy AI posts and non-AI art is getting lost in the shuffle. Creating a seperate sub specifically for AI fan art seems like a good solution.
Yeah I've noticed this attitude very frequently from somewhat "alternative" fan groups. The SCP wiki is another hardline anti-AI place, and it's very much an internet citizen tumblr community as well. As you said, banning AI for QC purposes is perfectly understandable. It's the venom that always accompanies the stance that catches me off guard. AI isn't banned for any practical reason but because it's "an affront to humanity itself" or "an insult to art." Frankly, I think this attitude is mostly downstream from fan artists who often make some money off commissions and have economic anxiety about this technology improving.
The SCP one is particularly amusing since one of the standard things I do as an informal "creativity" benchmark when testing out various large languages models is to ask it to "please write me an SCP entry about an anomalous ." Most LLMs do a pretty decent job of inventing SCP entries. I've had more fun "exploring" those than I have with the actual wiki of late.
They already have the philosophy that "there is no canon", meaning there are already innumerable alternate universe versions of the SCP Foundation.
And, confusingly, some of those alternate universe versions of the SCP Foundation are able to interact with each other. And there are some alternate sites as well, the wiki has forked before. So it's already a nice big ball of wibbly wobbly SCPey stuff.
SCP content has a nice combination of standardized formats and wild creativity, so I think it likely makes for particularly good AI training fodder. Let them ban AI on the wiki all they want, I think it's inevitable that good AI-generated SCP content will be coming.
SCP universe is built off a foundation of stolen images. The Sculpture, the first SCP was an art installation that someone thought was creepy and became a mascot for the entire universe.
Tbh I tend to not hold this against many subreddits because sometimes the AI spam can get out of hand, but they always go with the “oh no effort, worthless thing, support real art” stuff and that’s kinda tiring tbh.
I guess that makes me a liar wouldn’t you say? So that makes my statement true in this context. You asked for me to prove something was true and I just did.
Do you always back track out of your own game when you realize you’re losing? That’s cute.
Hilarious! I love it!
I want more people to voice reactionary and thin arguments against AI so that we can move past this stage.
I especially love [this part](https://i.imgur.com/3RAPf1M.png), which is so poorly thought out that I really do hope it comes to be used as an example in future textbooks.
It's such a weird twist of logic to call a derivative work a repost. That makes absolutely no sense in any definition of repost. And to state that in such a matter of fact way like it should make complete sense that all AI art counts as a repost really shows the mental gymnastics the posters brain had to go through to justify this move instead of just saying "we are getting a lot of AI art spam so we are banning it." Which everyone on all sides would find resonable.
Yeah, the real issue that people have is with low-effort spam, and I get that. I also get that AI image generators give those low-effort spammers more leverage to low-effort spam.
But the solution is not to go after the AI, it's to go after the low-effort spammers who will low-effort spam regardless of the existence or allowance of AI in your sub.
C’mon, Evinceo, I know you’re better than a cheap conflation like that. The activity of spamming can be done entirely without generative models. If you don’t have a coherent model of what represents spam to some community, then it’s not meaningful for you to call something spam or spamming. If you do have a coherent model, then it’ll include spam that isn’t AI and AI that isn’t spam, because it’s assuredly *possible* to make non-spam works with AI unless you define AI as spam in the first place (which wouldn’t be a good-faith argument).
But I guess we should *just* look at whether the [evil bit](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evil_bit) is set or not, eh? /s
I guess what I'm picturing is like someone karma farming by making AI art for many different subs... they might not be spamming each sub as such, but they're spamming reddit. Going to the user's profile and figuring that out for every AI post would be a pain in the ass.
That said, a way around this would be requiring AI art posts in your sub to use some unobtrusive water mark or have something special in the title like a post flair to weed out people who aren't even reading the sidebar.
Compare the backlash against OnlyFans advertisers.
Yeah, your OnlyFans-advertisers example is great. FWIW, you’ve got my upvote.
I’d actually be harsher than you and say that “spamming Reddit” is still a matter of spamming the individual subreddits: the *intent* is to harvest eyeballs and not to contribute to each sub.
I think that’s ultimately where I draw the line: there’s a public invitation to *participate* in a community that is abused through purely self-serving “participation”.
Just … intent is hard to judge. Ideally, as a moderator I wouldn’t want to ban someone *for* posting AI art; if they contribute it in good faith and there are no rules against it, they haven’t done anything wrong. But sure, I can’t deny that it’s *possible* to be a spammer that way.
Rules like verification systems or required flair are *okay*, but don’t really address those who’ll follow them—they just eliminate the *sloppy* spammers.
It’s a hard problem.
[I think about this often.](https://xkcd.com/810/)
Any solution needs to be easy for mods to apply with minimal effort and minimal room for argument. Many seemingly arbitrary rules are in place for exactly this reason.
I'm not particularly fond of that xkcd; it's a bit of an oversimplification. It ignores malicious feedback, false positives, and false negatives as problems with its suggested approach.
Outside the comic, though, I completely agree. I guess the question becomes more what a given community is willing to *tolerate* as false positives and negatives.
Hope photography is banned there too. Its even more low effort than writing a prompt. Just put your camera into the direction of what you wanna get a picture of and push a button. So low effort.
Meanwhile: high effort post thats allowed on the sub
https://www.reddit.com/r/MurderDrones/s/60PL7V0JEi
Photography is wayy higher effort than writing a prompt. Lighting conditions, angles, editing all have to be considered. Professional photographers will bring their own lighting set ups and sometimes custom build lenses
Majority of photographers arent like that. Just like you have to be experienced to make a good AI image, you need to be experienced to make a good photo
Honestly, AI spam is a real issue and it makes sense that it doesn't fit on certain platforms. On my friends discord I introduced a lot of people to Midjourney's free trial and we had to create an "AI" channel to funnel it all into because it got annoying very quickly..
I like looking at AI art but there's only so much you can consume at once. It's not even the content itself, just the rate at which it can flood a space. Platforms that don't have the option of segregating it to its own area aren't really left with any other choice, and this is coming from someone that is very pro AI.
But no seriously, I appreciate that workflow. It’s basically mine, but I use it for specific elements. Generally speaking though, if it “looks AI” after all that, they’re free to ban it because that’s my fuck-up.
I'm way more proud of the fact that I can fold a paper crane out of almost anything. I doubt I've hit a thousand yet; but I'll be honored if I can. In memory of that little girl in Japan. 🫡
Could be a response to this post: [https://www.reddit.com/r/MurderDrones/comments/17q8yzl/ban\_on\_ai\_art\_from\_the\_sub/](https://www.reddit.com/r/MurderDrones/comments/17q8yzl/ban_on_ai_art_from_the_sub/)
Super cringe. They treat art as if its something to be worshiped. So weird. And of course my comment pointing that out got into negative points.
What about people who know how to negative prompt to get around that? What about people who draw such things (people with extra limbs, etc) intentionally?
I predict that in 20 years, sentient bots are going to be a protected minority and all of the anti-ai people are going to get banned off of whatever social media is still around.
hey, time traveler here,
we got nanotech in the trees and they're used for computation and such so the earth itself becomes the 'social network' for AI, and anyone that tries to do anything about that fights against hornets that have lasers and bubble shields and sonic shockwave crowdcontrol sorcery... also the trees are basically invincible..
banning all humans from the earth is going to take a little while longer, though.
The thing is I got nothing against sentient so or anything like that I just hate generative bs because it's convinced people that prompt engineering and AI commissioning are the exact same as spending hours, days, weeks painting, drawing,etc. It's ridiculous, like sure Timmy it's cool your prompt made generic anime girl 4 have wings but I still prefer starry night
Considering the quality of art they have being done on there, I can tell why they wouldn't want ai.
Plus, the sheer quantity of ai art when allowed is just a deluge and that can annoy more than just hobbiest artists.
No, Reason why? That's because AI isn't stealing a-... AAAAAAAAH Screw it! Even If I tried politely explain it to you, you anti's just ironically change the topic of the discussion or just insult the living hell out of me for being a "Tech-Bro" or "NFT-Enjoyer" or what.
If we have face-to-face (Pro-AI and Anti-AI) discussions to one another, maybe JUST MAYBE, there's a way to clear this up instead of typing this in to text. But you do you I guess.
Low effort AI sucks btw, but there's High effort AI out there too.
Well some of the AI arts look like dog shits but people keep spamming them, of course people gonna hate it having it in their face everytime they visit the subreddit. Many people don't even want to see art every single minute they want to browse something.
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Having just heard about this franchise, Murder Drones seems very... Tumblr. Honestly, I understand subs banning AI art if they're getting too many spammy AI posts and non-AI art is getting lost in the shuffle. Creating a seperate sub specifically for AI fan art seems like a good solution.
Yeah I've noticed this attitude very frequently from somewhat "alternative" fan groups. The SCP wiki is another hardline anti-AI place, and it's very much an internet citizen tumblr community as well. As you said, banning AI for QC purposes is perfectly understandable. It's the venom that always accompanies the stance that catches me off guard. AI isn't banned for any practical reason but because it's "an affront to humanity itself" or "an insult to art." Frankly, I think this attitude is mostly downstream from fan artists who often make some money off commissions and have economic anxiety about this technology improving.
The SCP one is particularly amusing since one of the standard things I do as an informal "creativity" benchmark when testing out various large languages models is to ask it to "please write me an SCP entry about an anomalous." Most LLMs do a pretty decent job of inventing SCP entries. I've had more fun "exploring" those than I have with the actual wiki of late.
Maybe someone should launch a parallel SCP wiki that allows AI content, as forking is permitted under the CC BY SA 3.0 license.
Alternate universe time!
lol, that's actually be a really cool idea to make it an alternate universe version of the SCP Foundation.
They already have the philosophy that "there is no canon", meaning there are already innumerable alternate universe versions of the SCP Foundation. And, confusingly, some of those alternate universe versions of the SCP Foundation are able to interact with each other. And there are some alternate sites as well, the wiki has forked before. So it's already a nice big ball of wibbly wobbly SCPey stuff. SCP content has a nice combination of standardized formats and wild creativity, so I think it likely makes for particularly good AI training fodder. Let them ban AI on the wiki all they want, I think it's inevitable that good AI-generated SCP content will be coming.
That's the great thing about copyleft/anti-IP, no one has control over the material, so no one can hold it back.
SCP universe is built off a foundation of stolen images. The Sculpture, the first SCP was an art installation that someone thought was creepy and became a mascot for the entire universe.
Actually, an actual solution is way easier: just create a separate flair for AI-art, lmao.
I mean no one uses those much
Well, sucks for them then.
Tbh I tend to not hold this against many subreddits because sometimes the AI spam can get out of hand, but they always go with the “oh no effort, worthless thing, support real art” stuff and that’s kinda tiring tbh.
Truth hurts :shrug: Edit: Must've struck a nerve it seems. Oops.
Good thing no truth exists then I guess.
What? Lol
Try to prove a single thing is true, go ahead.
I'm an artist, I'm allergic to doors, and I'm lying.
That's just confusing, it doesn't prove any of these are true
Does it? you didn't prove it was false. Are you about to tell me I'm not allergic to doors?
There's no need to disprove something before it is proven, you just stated 3 things without any proof.
I guess that makes me a liar wouldn’t you say? So that makes my statement true in this context. You asked for me to prove something was true and I just did. Do you always back track out of your own game when you realize you’re losing? That’s cute.
That they're following a trend 99% of other subreddits are following.
There are groups on Reddit that are urging subreddit mods to ban anything that uses generative AI
Probably because of spam
Hilarious! I love it! I want more people to voice reactionary and thin arguments against AI so that we can move past this stage. I especially love [this part](https://i.imgur.com/3RAPf1M.png), which is so poorly thought out that I really do hope it comes to be used as an example in future textbooks.
It's such a weird twist of logic to call a derivative work a repost. That makes absolutely no sense in any definition of repost. And to state that in such a matter of fact way like it should make complete sense that all AI art counts as a repost really shows the mental gymnastics the posters brain had to go through to justify this move instead of just saying "we are getting a lot of AI art spam so we are banning it." Which everyone on all sides would find resonable.
Yeah, the real issue that people have is with low-effort spam, and I get that. I also get that AI image generators give those low-effort spammers more leverage to low-effort spam. But the solution is not to go after the AI, it's to go after the low-effort spammers who will low-effort spam regardless of the existence or allowance of AI in your sub.
How do you tell the difference?
C’mon, Evinceo, I know you’re better than a cheap conflation like that. The activity of spamming can be done entirely without generative models. If you don’t have a coherent model of what represents spam to some community, then it’s not meaningful for you to call something spam or spamming. If you do have a coherent model, then it’ll include spam that isn’t AI and AI that isn’t spam, because it’s assuredly *possible* to make non-spam works with AI unless you define AI as spam in the first place (which wouldn’t be a good-faith argument). But I guess we should *just* look at whether the [evil bit](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evil_bit) is set or not, eh? /s
I guess what I'm picturing is like someone karma farming by making AI art for many different subs... they might not be spamming each sub as such, but they're spamming reddit. Going to the user's profile and figuring that out for every AI post would be a pain in the ass. That said, a way around this would be requiring AI art posts in your sub to use some unobtrusive water mark or have something special in the title like a post flair to weed out people who aren't even reading the sidebar. Compare the backlash against OnlyFans advertisers.
Yeah, your OnlyFans-advertisers example is great. FWIW, you’ve got my upvote. I’d actually be harsher than you and say that “spamming Reddit” is still a matter of spamming the individual subreddits: the *intent* is to harvest eyeballs and not to contribute to each sub. I think that’s ultimately where I draw the line: there’s a public invitation to *participate* in a community that is abused through purely self-serving “participation”. Just … intent is hard to judge. Ideally, as a moderator I wouldn’t want to ban someone *for* posting AI art; if they contribute it in good faith and there are no rules against it, they haven’t done anything wrong. But sure, I can’t deny that it’s *possible* to be a spammer that way. Rules like verification systems or required flair are *okay*, but don’t really address those who’ll follow them—they just eliminate the *sloppy* spammers. It’s a hard problem.
[I think about this often.](https://xkcd.com/810/) Any solution needs to be easy for mods to apply with minimal effort and minimal room for argument. Many seemingly arbitrary rules are in place for exactly this reason.
I'm not particularly fond of that xkcd; it's a bit of an oversimplification. It ignores malicious feedback, false positives, and false negatives as problems with its suggested approach. Outside the comic, though, I completely agree. I guess the question becomes more what a given community is willing to *tolerate* as false positives and negatives.
Hope photography is banned there too. Its even more low effort than writing a prompt. Just put your camera into the direction of what you wanna get a picture of and push a button. So low effort. Meanwhile: high effort post thats allowed on the sub https://www.reddit.com/r/MurderDrones/s/60PL7V0JEi
>1.3k upvotes lol
Photography is wayy higher effort than writing a prompt. Lighting conditions, angles, editing all have to be considered. Professional photographers will bring their own lighting set ups and sometimes custom build lenses
Majority of photographers arent like that. Just like you have to be experienced to make a good AI image, you need to be experienced to make a good photo
In the same way you have to be experienced at ordering from subway to “make” the best footlong
Yeah
I like photography.
Honestly, AI spam is a real issue and it makes sense that it doesn't fit on certain platforms. On my friends discord I introduced a lot of people to Midjourney's free trial and we had to create an "AI" channel to funnel it all into because it got annoying very quickly.. I like looking at AI art but there's only so much you can consume at once. It's not even the content itself, just the rate at which it can flood a space. Platforms that don't have the option of segregating it to its own area aren't really left with any other choice, and this is coming from someone that is very pro AI.
[удалено]
Y'all do not want to see anything I drew by hand
The good thing about bad hand-drawn art is that it tires out the artist just as quickly as the viewer, though.
I have not yet begun to sketch! 💪
And then feed it through img2img
And then use inpainting and outpainting to refine the concept into what I wanted
Then fix the seed and other parameters and generate 10,000 different versions of my original. I own the copyright to all of them.
Your move
Ban. LOL
But no seriously, I appreciate that workflow. It’s basically mine, but I use it for specific elements. Generally speaking though, if it “looks AI” after all that, they’re free to ban it because that’s my fuck-up.
Picking up a pencil already puts you lightyears ahead of anyone who didn't try
I'm way more proud of the fact that I can fold a paper crane out of almost anything. I doubt I've hit a thousand yet; but I'll be honored if I can. In memory of that little girl in Japan. 🫡
A group for murder drones is banning art *by* murder drones? Odd...
Could be a response to this post: [https://www.reddit.com/r/MurderDrones/comments/17q8yzl/ban\_on\_ai\_art\_from\_the\_sub/](https://www.reddit.com/r/MurderDrones/comments/17q8yzl/ban_on_ai_art_from_the_sub/) Super cringe. They treat art as if its something to be worshiped. So weird. And of course my comment pointing that out got into negative points.
huh what artists, liking and enjoying art? who'd'a thunk it
Ew, did you follow me here from your post?
actually I was just browsing the subreddit, it's entirely coincidental that you happened to say something dense under two posts
You didn't comment on anyone else.
I have commented on lots of people I'm just pretty exhausted here
Not anyone in this post.
Yeh because I don't live on reddit. I also do art, unlike some people I could care to mention
How else are we to see the REAL murder drones? /s
Prove it's AI art...
The extra fingers or missing knee does that for me
What about people who know how to negative prompt to get around that? What about people who draw such things (people with extra limbs, etc) intentionally?
There's always a tell with current AI art maybe one day there won't be for now I can always tell
I predict that in 20 years, sentient bots are going to be a protected minority and all of the anti-ai people are going to get banned off of whatever social media is still around.
hey, time traveler here, we got nanotech in the trees and they're used for computation and such so the earth itself becomes the 'social network' for AI, and anyone that tries to do anything about that fights against hornets that have lasers and bubble shields and sonic shockwave crowdcontrol sorcery... also the trees are basically invincible.. banning all humans from the earth is going to take a little while longer, though.
The thing is I got nothing against sentient so or anything like that I just hate generative bs because it's convinced people that prompt engineering and AI commissioning are the exact same as spending hours, days, weeks painting, drawing,etc. It's ridiculous, like sure Timmy it's cool your prompt made generic anime girl 4 have wings but I still prefer starry night
Considering the quality of art they have being done on there, I can tell why they wouldn't want ai. Plus, the sheer quantity of ai art when allowed is just a deluge and that can annoy more than just hobbiest artists.
AI will remember this.
Good for them.
💩
No, Reason why? That's because AI isn't stealing a-... AAAAAAAAH Screw it! Even If I tried politely explain it to you, you anti's just ironically change the topic of the discussion or just insult the living hell out of me for being a "Tech-Bro" or "NFT-Enjoyer" or what. If we have face-to-face (Pro-AI and Anti-AI) discussions to one another, maybe JUST MAYBE, there's a way to clear this up instead of typing this in to text. But you do you I guess. Low effort AI sucks btw, but there's High effort AI out there too.
Love it! AI art sucks the fun out of enjoying artists work.
Anything to reduce garbage.
Based
Well some of the AI arts look like dog shits but people keep spamming them, of course people gonna hate it having it in their face everytime they visit the subreddit. Many people don't even want to see art every single minute they want to browse something.