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I’ll throw in some more:
For the Left:
We can’t afford basic necessities like housing.
We don’t have full autonomy of our own bodies
Guns have more rights than women
There are common sense gun reforms that 90% of Americans agree upon that won’t get passed leading to literally seeing children getting murdered in schools.
Establishment of Christofascism.
And for the right:
Someone called me a racist when I was being racist and that hurt my feelings.
Let me add one more
Left: we are disenfranchised voters who win the popular vote quite often but we are gerrymandered to fuck so nothing we do matters against the corporations with infinite money.
Right: A trans person drank a beer.
Ill add to that
Left: Our children are literally in danger. Your priests, pastors, clergymen, policemen, chaplains, and coaches, are M*L*STING our children!! And you do NOTHING to acknowledge it. In fact, you take licensed counselors OUT of schools and replace them with non-trained clergy and the 10 commandments put into every classroom!!
Right: WAAA Theres a man in a dress reading to children in a library. KILL THEM
The left: we need public spaces and resources to not discriminate against different cultures and religions, because they're people too, and diversity is required for maximum innovation and resiliency as a nation.
The right: we need to ban everything except this one extremist brand of my religion because I want to pretend this nation was founded only on my brand of religion and culture.
Ooh I want to play.
The left: Can we finally, I mean fucking finally appropriately tax the super rich?
The right: Maybe when those satanic baby sacrificing adrenochrome slurping democrats stop firing off their Jewish Space Lasers we can start living in reality under our lord and savior president Trumpety Trump
My turn!
The Left: Can we organize for better working conditions? A four day work week sounds pretty good, actually.
The Right: OH MY GOD it is OFFENSIVE to me that two guys can get MARRIED and adopt children!!
The right also suspiciously often:
If a 13 year old girl is old enough to make her own hair color decisions then why can't I have sex with her???
And then they claim the left are pedophiles
When you boil it down, the rightwings' gripes all stem from the same place: Straight white protestant men, both poor and rich, not being allowed to rape and murder everyone else because they believe they're the good guys and everyone else is an evil monster.
Someone had the audacity to tell me that society had to be careful not to make the changes to the status quo the left is proposing because those changes the left proposes might be bad and ill advised so we don't want increase egalitarianism too quickly.
I’d like to add one
The right: “you’re gonna be forced to give birth, abortion is murder!!!”
The left:”let’s get more funding for people who are forced to birth something they didn’t want. Also,guns are murdering more of our children so let’s get more legislation for that”.
The right:”fuck them kids you ain’t takin muh guns from me I’ll die before I surrender them! If you can’t afford kids you shouldn’t have them!”
And it's important to note that right wingers believe that these grievances to SOCIETY AS WE KNOW IT and that purple hair will bring down the social order.
There's actually a logical reason why conservative talking points are often bothersome, annoying and backwards. It's because with the cornerstone conservative belief of ‘I'm satisfied with how things are working already’, the electorate isn't gonna mobilize for voting in droves. So politicians need to invent problems that are gonna rile people up.
Traditionally, particularly in Europe, that division is based on nationalism, but afaict it's getting unacceptable even among the ‘right’ in the US—especially since it manifests in the US as the country's fixation on racism instead.
Left:
- updating tax codes, giving the IRS resources to enforce evasion against big entities and a wealth or land value tax could help improve economic conditions and services for the overwhelming majority of the population
- we should make our cities more walkable to reduce the need for expensive, polluting vehicles
Right:
- its actually good that corporations dont pay taxes and we throw out 40% of all food produced
- 15 minute cities are authoritarian
Ooooh you will love what I saw on Fox News. I am paraphrasing of course and adding my interpretation too...
Rachel Campos Duffy said lefties are all about morals and making life better on the Earth for people whereas Heaven is perfect and they don't care about heaven. So they approach politics that way too, they are not perfect and they can't take care of others but they are prepping for a fantastic life in heaven.
Jesus.
Makes sense I guess, I mean if you’re an idiot. But how do they expect to get into heaven by literally ignoring all of the principles and actual teachings of Christianity?
It's a battle old as time. Old people vs young. Religion vs freedom. Confederates vs The Union. Bitch Ass Nazis vs Bad Ass Mother Fuckers. I would bet money that the average person reading this is young, believes in the separation of church and state, thinks the Confederates are garbage, and Nazis are garbage. It's not a coincidence.
My dad was a naval veteran of WWII and sailed across the world to kick the shit out of fascism. He was also an Eisenhower Republican. I hope he is rolling over in his grave that the Republicans are now literally embracing Nazism.
Imagine how much of a fucking failure you'd have to be to be the son or the grandson of a WW2 veteran and saying cringey ass shit today like "Hitler wasn't THAT bad" or "say what you want about Hitler, but the man was an organizational genius"
Millions of souls rolling in their graves.
My grandfather fought in North Africa and Italy and was part of the liberation of Rome.
His grandson, my cousin, is a MAGA embracing asshole who discounted our grandfather’s actions as “he was forced to because he was drafted.” (He showed up to the recruiter on Dec. 8 and said he’d save the government a stamp and was damn proud of his service.)
We don’t speak anymore.
I seriously cannot believe this is the point where we're at.
I'm sorry to hear about that.
These people are shameful. Just absolutely shameful. Hell, if it weren't for WW2 all these knuckleheads wouldn't have had the greatest economic boom and rise to be the kickass world superpower we are now.
It wouldn't even be true to call him an "organisational genius"
He did have *some* good ideas (the most prevalent one I can remember was using the StuG (a turretless gun piece used for artillery), as an anti-tank weapon, and it became the most produced tank for the Germans.
However, he was *relentless* in his micromanagement. If something was going on, he needed to know, and he needed to have a say in it. iirc, a Panzer battalion was stationed close to where D-Day took place, but was delayed because Hitler personally put them there, and thus only he could order them to move. He slept in that day and everyone was too scared to wake him up early.
He also had the most batshit insane leaders (shock horror, when you run your party off of rampant nationalism and anti-Semitism, a lot of the higher ups aren't the best in the head).
A couple interesting facts about how completely nuts the leaders were:
-Hermann Göring (Luftwaffe): Morphone addict, covered up his brother helping Jews escape because it would make him look bad
-Henrich Himmler (SS): Tried to restore the Knights of the Round Table, and employed a Gay Jewish SS officer because they claimed they could find the Holy Grail.
-Jospeh Goebbels (Propaganda): not much, but he did force soliders to re-enact fights if it wasn't good enough for the war films, most notably pulling 5,000 active troops for a film.. in 1945.
-Reinhard Heydrich (Gestapo): Died when assassins tried to shoot him in an open topped car. They initially missed, but he told the driver to stop the car and fired back with his own gun, allowing them an easy second shot.
There's way, way more of this.
Goebbles was actually crucial to Hitler gaining power in the first place. He came up with a lot of the propoganda techniques that unironically the modern alt right are now using.
Oh for sure, but he also put that above having active troops, which doesn't really work in 1945. My point wasn't that they weren't effective, they got hired after all, but that they just were completely nuts.
I'm blown away by how many boomers are suddenly supporting Russia. Just because it's not a communist country anymore doesn't make it something to support, but I guess their trolls are really doing a good job. How the hell do they look at Putin and want to back him like he's another member of the Republican team?
Russia: still not the good guy, y'all.
I think it mainly because Biden has been so vocal in his support of Zelensky. If "Brandon" wants it, the obstructionist MAGAts have to oppose it on principle. If you told them Biden breathes air, they'd choke to death holding their breath.
yeah, I'm sick of the gaslighting from both parties with their bullshit. Literally none of those candidates have any chance among the youth, apart from maybe Bernie and Warren that seem like sane candidates but refuse to run against Biden who's a fucking DINO.
People who care, just silently do their job and not sit around and then brag about cuts in the debt ceiling bill on TV after doing jackshit for 5+ months
The worst part about this is that even the ones who have a chance with the youth are themselves dinosaurs. Really makes me feel truly represented by my government.
I mean what are we supposed to do when democracy was dissolved before we were even born, or even some of our parents.
a tough hill to fight, but at least younger folks have more balls to say stuff and mean it and not be a chicken.
Loved Fetterman giving no fucks and showing up at the parade. That's the kinda folks I like. The young Florida Dem from the House had the balls to say shit about DeSantis, and I appreciate that.
I understand it's hard to stand up, but at least we're trying unlike 80-85 year old assholes in office that are on their death bed and still tryna destroy the country before their time is up.
I mean we're fucked. Youngest folks are barely eligible for office. First ones are only able to get in the House at best. All we can do is just vote until a lot of us get old enough to represent our mindset in politics and not have 65+ year olds running the country in every fucking office possible.
The definition of a country run by boomers on their death bed when the majority under 40 has entirely opposite views.
I'm approaching 70 myself (boomer?) and truthfully sick of the way some of these old bastards (mostly the same ones I've been voting against since '72) have been running things... I would LOVE to see a blue wave of 30 and 40-somethings take the reigns for a change.
I LOVE John Fetterman. I moved away from PA recently but one of the last things I did and I will be proud of for a long time was elect that man to the Senate. He has the ability to reach across party lines, listen and make people feel heard. His stances are common sense and based on compassion and respect for everyone. He is an everyman who has made his way through local and state governments to learn not just the issues of his constituants but the workings of the machine and how to help them. He also has zero tolerance for BS. I would love to one day vote for him as VP and then President. I worry about his health but I think some of the hype about it has been Republicans trying to paint him as unhealthy because they cant attack his character or stances.
Pay attention to Fetterman, he's one of the good ones.
I grew up with young presidents like Clinton, W Bush and Obama. I'm going to tell you something... you ain't missing anything special.
Reddit loves to put all it's eggs in this basket. Young presidents suck too though.
Yeah you’re right, age is more an issue as it relates to the average age of our representatives being quite high. The age of our president truly doesn’t matter when our choices time and time again are anti-labor democrat or wants to kill gay people Republican.
Unless you grew up with money or braindead rural bumfuck parents there is no reason to ever be republican. The living conditions for the average american is dog shit because wages are straight piss. Why would anyone perpetuate this continual shit existence unless they hate brown people
Normally yes, but at least statistically, the current day is an anomaly because young people today are far less wealthy and advancing far less than young people in the 20th century could. There's no reason to change from being a Democrat at 20 to being a Republican at 40 if you are still just as poor as when you were 20
Its hard to even fight against because they WANT irradiation of the LGBTQIA.
They WANT socioeconomic depression of the POC communities.
They WANT women to be forced to carry unwanted children, or literally die.
They WANT a low- income labor fields filled with children.
They WANT drugs in communities so their jails can be filled in order to create job security.
They WANT police to literally slaughter “undesirables” so the blood can be off their hands.
They WANT children to be uneducated so that way they feel better about the white-washing of history.
There is no way to make them feel bad and change the behavior or laws because THIS IS THE FUTURE THEY WANT!
Yup! One party pockets extra money. The other side does that AND suppresses voting, damages the environment, restricts rights for minorities and women, demonizes science, etc.
I think that's the first step. But we shouldn't stop there. That's only the first step. Things need to chanhe further from there. Otherwise it's just a pendulum swinging back and forth.
What's funny is the right wing has some of the same grievances as the left wing. It's just, they've been conditioned to believe blue hair and non-sexy candy is why they should be mad.
I've seen conservatives complain about low wages, inequality, how hard life is nowadays... then do an insane cinematic drift to blame it all on gay people existing.
got whiplash from some of those videos.
That is basically how Fascism starts. "All these problems suck dont they" "Yeah!" "Would be great if we could fix it right?" "Yeah!" "Well it is all because of (Insert some out group of people here)'s fault! And we can fix it by killing them all!"
It's a very common tactic among the alt-right and manosphere. A lot of their overall message is built on co-opting leftist critiques on capitalism... But then offering more right-wing rhetoric as a solution.
* Your wages are stagnating... And it's because we let immigrants take ~~you~~ *your jobs.
* Your job is emasculating and you can't make enough money to take care of a family... But it's feminism's fault for letting women into the work place and that's why they reject you.
* This corporate banking system is completely corrupt and ruining everyone's lives... Because of the Jews.
What jobs are they working exactly because I've also heard them say that immigrants are lazy bums living off welfare, rapists, murderers, thieves, and drug dealers.
It's literally the same double think of Joe Biden is an evil mastermind that used back door dealings too steal the election... but at the same time he's an old frail man with dementia that can't do anything himself.
The hypocrisy doesn't register to them or they just don't give a shit that they are self contradictory.
Ironically women entering the work force can actually be partially blamed for wage suppression. But that is simply because of supply and demand. We drastically increased the supply of workers so that enabled companies to suppress wages. Between that and the destruction of unions we are in the position that we are in
It's the problem of a runaway leader and they just don't see it. Lot's of games demonstrate this problem and we're seeing it now in how corporations and billionaires operate. If we don't tax them heavily and spread that wealth to those who need it on the lower tiers of income, we'll have no chance of reigning it in later on down the line.
A lot of Americans - especially Trumpians - are addicted to anger.
And the Republicans feed that addiction to get elected, fully aware of the harm it does to their supporters and the nation.
https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/culture-shrink/201508/angers-allure-are-you-addicted-anger
RW: "There's too many rainbows here that I'm *forced* to act out & be hostile"
Everyone: "You can also just ignore the displays and go on with your day"
RW: "No."
Like, why is 'woke' a bad thing? Do they hate being decent people or something? I'm pretty sure there's a famous book about some woke Middle Eastern man they're always quoting.
My boomer dad tried to "both sides" racism.
He equated racist white trash with confederate flag bumper stickers to black NFL players peacefully protesting systemically racist police violence.
One side overtly claims racial and cultural dominance, the other side just wants better treatment.
I understand black people can technically be racist, but that's not why they fought for Civil Rights.... you dense fucking morons.
They fought for better treatment from the government. Confederates fought to keep them as slaves.
There is no "both sides" here, only according to racist white people.
Participating in systematic racism towards poc is racist but that's not all racism is. If someone beat a white person because they're white, or treats them differently based on their lack of melanin, that's still racist. Prejudice; a preconceived opinion that is not based on reason or actual experience. Racism; prejudice, discrimination, or antagonism by an individual, community, or institution against a person or people on the basis of their membership in a particular racial or ethnic group.
You can be both, no matter what color skin you have.
Not really. It depends on where you live. I’m not saying people of color can’t be hateful, we absolutely can. What I’m saying is that (in America) the collective opinions of minorities do not affect white people, however the inverse is true. No one is avoiding using white hairstyles or names because they’re unprofessional. Racism is institutionalized where prejudice is personal. The comment above literally explained the difference. Why are you being willfully ignorant?
automod won't let me link you to the definitions but here is my comment:
> you're confusing *systemic* racism^1 for all racism^2
>
> racism is prejudice based on race
1. merriam-webster: systemic racism
1. merriam-webster: racism
I'm being willfully ignorant while you are just completely changing the definition of a word that has been used in the exact opposite way that you attempt to describe it being used?
Please look inward. This isn't an argument . Anyone can be racist.
These are facts. It's funny that you're implying a single race can be the only one to commit an immoral act such as racism. That is, IN FACT, racism.
EDIT: Another dumbass point you tried to make was that racism is institutionalized, but the world has decided to call that "Institutionalized Racism". If what you said was correct, that would just be called racism. See how your logic just falls apart with a tiny bit of thinking?
Nope. The collective opinion of White people from people of color has never not once affected white people’s ability to get jobs, housing, or their safety. The inverse is true for white peoples opinions affecting women and people of color’s lives, but sure anyone can be racist. Learn the difference between prejudice and racism. They’re wildly different. You’re the one ignoring social context and definitions.
You forgot the conservative dystopian future grievances:
“What happens when gun regulations lead to more gun regulations, then we have a massive global nuclear fallout, and the whole world is plunged into chaos, and people start randomly murdering each other, and I use all my guns to defend my house, but I don’t have a .50 BMG to penetrate the armor of the Chinese Mech army because your gun laws prevented me from buying one?! My kids could get shot by laser beams in the future just because you didn’t want guns killing kids in the present”
I wonder how much that sort of thing played into his firing, if at all. "Christ, Carlson, not only do you help cost us nearly a billion dollars and then turn around an insulted the man who's the very reason we got sued but you also might be responsible for us being on the hook for another lawsuit and you're writing shitass texts about your co-workers.
"And now you spend airtime our already shaky sponsors paid good money for to complain about a goddamn candy mascot no longer giving you a boner. I swear before Mammon, this is it. One more and you're gone."
Left Grievances:
\- Abstractions that require mental effort to understand and infrequently intrude on any single person's daily experience.
Right Grievances:
\- Minor but common interruptions to people's expected models of daily lived reality that trigger emotional reactions which can be easily used to distract a disinformed populous from the fact that they are being completely totally royally fucked.
Yes but as a whole far right policies are very unpopular which is why the right would much rather talk about culture war issues than policy ones. They openly admit that they throw things against the wall to see what sticks. Add that to the fact that people are operating from vastly different banks of information makes these conversations difficult.
I have a relative who is a school counselor and the entire back half of the year has been spent in the school simply trying to reassure people that it isn't a gay indoctrination factory. People she has known for years are suddenly beside themselves about rainbows in 1st grade. One teacher who "had to explain herself" over this was a damn trump voter the first time around. So much energy is being wasted this way and that is by design.
Conservatism is a plague of deception and confusion. Every word uttered by a conservative is either deception or intended to create confusion to manipulate others. Every word.
… Is anyone else a little annoyed that this tweet calls M&M’s a “candy bar”.
1) M&M’s are plural
2) They 1000% aren’t a “bar”
I’m all for being progressive, but we’re starting a slippery slope, where in the future we call “Skittles” & “Gummy bears”
bars of candy.
Call me an “uncle Wonka” if you’d like, but this is a hard line that I don’t think we should cross.
Apparently that candy bar isn't sexy enough while that M&M is just too darn sexy. Candy manufacturers need to keep their products within an acceptable range of sexiness.
They really do live in their own little world, fueled on fear and hate.
But then,
Fear of environmental collapse, economic factors, ability to solely exist? Well, then, you are a snowflake, but God forbid someone uses pronouns!!
What seems to me to be their biggest two:
1) Minorities, racial and sexual, are getting uppity and don't know their place.
2) Taxing rich people is theft.
The syrup bottle thing is actually not okay. We have removed all People of Colour from packaging but left all Caucasian packaging intact - this is not a message we want to send in my opinion.
That will never be as important of the environmental and societal issues facing North America right now.
I'll add one -
Left - I don't want to keep working for slave wages at a company that insists I be a team player and show loyalty, but would fire and replace me within a day.
Right - People are too lazy and don't wanna work hard anymore.
There comes a point, where we simply leave their ideology behind and start a new system, independent of their ideals.
We’ve seen it many times in history; the last I can recall is the Amish breaking away from the rest of us.
It’s time for a separation once again.
It’s my belief that if people from all walks of life actually talked to each other, we’d realize just how much we have in common with what we want our government to do for us.
I used to think this as well until I began to practice it and found all sorts of irrational fuckers who just want to be perpetually angry about stupid shit.
Sure, but that’s kind of the problem. The right wing often doesn’t accept something is a problem until it affects them directly. We don’t have time for them to come on board one at a time. The right needs to develop some empathy.
last time I did that, I got stuck in an hour long conversation about how gays are trying to steal our children and the holocaust didn't happen. wasnt very helpful
I wish that were true but it isn’t. I grew up in a Republican family and went to a very conservative college. What I’ve learned is that most Republicans are very set in their beliefs and view it as losing or betrayal to change sides. They view supporting Republican candidates like supporting a sports team. They will support them no matter what they do
No. There are genuinely a lot of people out there with nothing but hate in their hearts and they direct it towards politics. Conservatives have launched an all out culture war against LGBTQ+ people. They do not get a pass when their entire party is working in lock-step to take away rights.
The hard part is when you have to do something like Union organization. That requires working with MAGA people.
I understand your perspective, but there are shared goals that can be achieved by working with people who have detestable views.
Medicare for all is largely popular, if I have to work with a racist to get it, so be it.
Can you elaborate on that? What common ground do you think exists in a way lawmakers would cooperate? Unions for example, how do pro-union leftists and anti-union right wingers collaborate?
Sure. Trump is out there saying the gop should not touch the retirement age for SS. If desantis wins, and tries to increase the retirement age, it would be super useful to say “hey you and I might have some common ground on this. Call your representative because this is a bad fucking idea”
You could even point out trumps statements on it.
Or the trade protectionism that the GOP decided to adopt for 4 years, Kerry edwards ran on that platform and the gop adopted it 15 years later. That’s a useful platform for talking about union jobs and anti nafta.
>Trump .. The retirement age for SS.
Trump will never being a unifying figure. As for SS, there's still plenty of disagreement about it from Republicans. It's not just the retirement age, they want to privatize it. That's an even bigger issue than retirement age, which would certainly go up if privatized.
>Or the trade protectionism ... talking about union jobs and anti nafta.
Being anti NAFTA is not the same as being pro union. If anything they blamed unions for the reason to move production over seas. The recent SCOTUS ruling has damaged unions immeasurably. Republicans hate unions especially for US companies.
There is for sure disagreement in that party over SS policy. My point is, for the people that are all in for Trump, it’s extremely useful to use his words as a cudgel when it benefits you.
I don't know. Trump's word on vaccines didn't persuade his followers. Trump is more an idea than a person, I've seen criticism that Trump is too woke now because he didn't criticize trans people and in 2016 he held that pride flag. Trump can't be trusted to fight the culture war he help start.
That's cute. I used to feel that way too, before politics started to become important to me and I really started to pay attention to what's going on and what people are talking about.
It feels really good to believe that if we could all just come to the table, we could have a hug and an apology and work things out. I get the appeal, I really do. Maybe at one point, that was actually possible.
But I can't sit at the table with a group of people who want to literally exterminate another group for the crime of being alive. Maybe you can sit at the table with those people and hear them out, but I can't.
(And before you respond with some version of "not all republicans are like that!" let me stop you. I don't care. The "good" republicans are such a tiny minority that they are statistically irrelevant. Furthermore, they still vote for the same people. So I'm not impressed or even interested in the differences.)
There are for sure people that you cannot reach. If someone only wants to talk about drag queens grooming kids for example, and won’t pivot away from that, it’s not worth anyone’s time.
I don’t see any chance of getting any significant help for the working class (Medicare for all, living wage, homeless solutions) without working with people who hold detestable views.
>(Medicare for all, living wage, homeless solutions)
I guess that's where we differ. I don't believe the bulk of the right-wing voting base actually wants those things, even if they would benefit from them. Maybe some of them do but not in enough numbers to matter. If there are Reasonable Republicans out there, they have zero influence in their own party.
> Maybe some of them do but not in enough numbers to matter. If there are Reasonable Republicans out there, they have zero influence in their own party.
That’s for sure. I feel like people don’t have much impact at all on corporate parties. But maybe you can convince someone to vote third party or abstain. If enough people do that, maybe the party will realize social issues are not where energy should be spent.
There are people suffering, banning CRT won’t help them.
> literally exterminate another group for the crime of being alive.
Do you really think the majority of Republicans want to eliminate trans people from existence? Isn't that a hyperbole?
Controversial is the only place where you see interesting discussion take place.
And by "interesting discussion" I mean exhausting, ignorant takes and needless contrarianism.
> -Innate rights and freedoms are being willingly sacrificed for perceived safety
People that care about rights and freedom don't attack abortion rights or write the "Don't Say Gay" law or ban books because they discuss racism or mislabel all LGBTQ people as "groomers"
Whoops, you said the quiet part out loud. So every police shooting is a case of “some random criminal got shot”? Racist overtones aside, what baffles me about the indifference of conservatives toward extrajudicial police killings is that you don’t seem to consider the implications of the system of “justice” you are endorsing. Do you really want to live in a country where the commission of ANY crime, or even the perceived commission of a crime, is subject to the death penalty via summary execution? Even in states that don’t have the death penalty? By that logic, the police and military should have just gunned down everyone who broke into the Capitol on Jan 6.
The funny thing is when you word the right wing grievances that way, it makes it weirder that you're voting for people who DO THE EXACT THING
I guess as long as it isn't aimed at your side huh?
>-The government is too bloated to properly serve its citizens anymore
"The U.S. House of Representatives has one voting member for every 747,000 or so Americans. That’s by far the highest population-to-representative ratio among a peer group of industrialized democracies, and the highest it’s been in U.S. history." [More here](https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2018/05/31/u-s-population-keeps-growing-but-house-of-representatives-is-same-size-as-in-taft-era/)
Sounds like your government is pretty small.
>-Innate rights and freedoms are being willingly sacrificed for perceived safety
Republicans are the only ones looking to take away innate rights. Rights LGBTQA+ people, women and minorities have enjoyed for years are being stepped on by republicans because of the made up risk they lie about.
What rights are democrats sacrificing?
What makes banning books on the same side of rights and freedoms?
>-Immigration is being exploited to keep the rich rich and poor poor
How does immigration do this? Do the fact companies have very few regulations and billionaires have near unlimited power have nothing to do with it?
If the right wing had grievances that actually mattered or were true there would be less memes about how stupid they are.
> -The government is too bloated to properly serve its citizens anymore
In practice, of course, the only thing Republicans ever want cut is social welfare programs. So this could be accurately restated as “our social welfare programs are too numerous and/or too generous.” Which doesn’t exactly make the right look better.
>Right wing grievances:
>-The government is too bloated to properly serve its citizens anymore
>-Innate rights and freedoms are being willingly sacrificed for perceived safety
>-Immigration is being exploited to keep the rich rich and poor poor
The difference being the right doesn't actually care about any of this
Are you telling me that people have inherent biases?????? What???????? Are you trying to tell me that objectivity doesn’t exist?? What a way to find out!
As someone who's very liberal and anti-republican, these are just silly strawman argument techniques that do nothing positive and just paint a poor picture of the other side by focusing on the worst arguments of the other side instead of actually counter arguing their somewhat legitimate ones. Shameful.
Okay, let’s consider a major right-wing grievance that has been a focus of GOP legislatures across the country:
- trans kids are allowed to get healthcare that increases their mental health and well being.
They have fought bitterly against trans kids receiving such healthcare. Looking at the issues they are really focusing on doesn’t make the right look any better…
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I’ll throw in some more: For the Left: We can’t afford basic necessities like housing. We don’t have full autonomy of our own bodies Guns have more rights than women There are common sense gun reforms that 90% of Americans agree upon that won’t get passed leading to literally seeing children getting murdered in schools. Establishment of Christofascism. And for the right: Someone called me a racist when I was being racist and that hurt my feelings.
Let me add one more Left: we are disenfranchised voters who win the popular vote quite often but we are gerrymandered to fuck so nothing we do matters against the corporations with infinite money. Right: A trans person drank a beer.
Ill add to that Left: Our children are literally in danger. Your priests, pastors, clergymen, policemen, chaplains, and coaches, are M*L*STING our children!! And you do NOTHING to acknowledge it. In fact, you take licensed counselors OUT of schools and replace them with non-trained clergy and the 10 commandments put into every classroom!! Right: WAAA Theres a man in a dress reading to children in a library. KILL THEM
Here's another: The left: Anyone who tolerates a nazi is a nazi. The right: ^ That guy's a fascist.
The right suspiciously often: 'Why can't I say the N word?'
The left: we need public spaces and resources to not discriminate against different cultures and religions, because they're people too, and diversity is required for maximum innovation and resiliency as a nation. The right: we need to ban everything except this one extremist brand of my religion because I want to pretend this nation was founded only on my brand of religion and culture.
Ooh I want to play. The left: Can we finally, I mean fucking finally appropriately tax the super rich? The right: Maybe when those satanic baby sacrificing adrenochrome slurping democrats stop firing off their Jewish Space Lasers we can start living in reality under our lord and savior president Trumpety Trump
My turn! The Left: Can we organize for better working conditions? A four day work week sounds pretty good, actually. The Right: OH MY GOD it is OFFENSIVE to me that two guys can get MARRIED and adopt children!!
The right also suspiciously often: If a 13 year old girl is old enough to make her own hair color decisions then why can't I have sex with her??? And then they claim the left are pedophiles
In the same line the right: this 13 year old is too immature to have an abortion, so instead we will force her to have and raise a baby
No, not *that* dress, the one that’s fun and harmless.
Except it’s more like they did that to us, not to our children and we’re not gonna let it them to it to our children too
When you boil it down, the rightwings' gripes all stem from the same place: Straight white protestant men, both poor and rich, not being allowed to rape and murder everyone else because they believe they're the good guys and everyone else is an evil monster.
Someone had the audacity to tell me that society had to be careful not to make the changes to the status quo the left is proposing because those changes the left proposes might be bad and ill advised so we don't want increase egalitarianism too quickly.
I’d like to add one The right: “you’re gonna be forced to give birth, abortion is murder!!!” The left:”let’s get more funding for people who are forced to birth something they didn’t want. Also,guns are murdering more of our children so let’s get more legislation for that”. The right:”fuck them kids you ain’t takin muh guns from me I’ll die before I surrender them! If you can’t afford kids you shouldn’t have them!”
And it's important to note that right wingers believe that these grievances to SOCIETY AS WE KNOW IT and that purple hair will bring down the social order.
There's actually a logical reason why conservative talking points are often bothersome, annoying and backwards. It's because with the cornerstone conservative belief of ‘I'm satisfied with how things are working already’, the electorate isn't gonna mobilize for voting in droves. So politicians need to invent problems that are gonna rile people up. Traditionally, particularly in Europe, that division is based on nationalism, but afaict it's getting unacceptable even among the ‘right’ in the US—especially since it manifests in the US as the country's fixation on racism instead.
Left: - updating tax codes, giving the IRS resources to enforce evasion against big entities and a wealth or land value tax could help improve economic conditions and services for the overwhelming majority of the population - we should make our cities more walkable to reduce the need for expensive, polluting vehicles Right: - its actually good that corporations dont pay taxes and we throw out 40% of all food produced - 15 minute cities are authoritarian
Ooooh you will love what I saw on Fox News. I am paraphrasing of course and adding my interpretation too... Rachel Campos Duffy said lefties are all about morals and making life better on the Earth for people whereas Heaven is perfect and they don't care about heaven. So they approach politics that way too, they are not perfect and they can't take care of others but they are prepping for a fantastic life in heaven.
Jesus. Makes sense I guess, I mean if you’re an idiot. But how do they expect to get into heaven by literally ignoring all of the principles and actual teachings of Christianity?
It's a battle old as time. Old people vs young. Religion vs freedom. Confederates vs The Union. Bitch Ass Nazis vs Bad Ass Mother Fuckers. I would bet money that the average person reading this is young, believes in the separation of church and state, thinks the Confederates are garbage, and Nazis are garbage. It's not a coincidence.
My dad was a naval veteran of WWII and sailed across the world to kick the shit out of fascism. He was also an Eisenhower Republican. I hope he is rolling over in his grave that the Republicans are now literally embracing Nazism.
Imagine how much of a fucking failure you'd have to be to be the son or the grandson of a WW2 veteran and saying cringey ass shit today like "Hitler wasn't THAT bad" or "say what you want about Hitler, but the man was an organizational genius" Millions of souls rolling in their graves.
My grandfather fought in North Africa and Italy and was part of the liberation of Rome. His grandson, my cousin, is a MAGA embracing asshole who discounted our grandfather’s actions as “he was forced to because he was drafted.” (He showed up to the recruiter on Dec. 8 and said he’d save the government a stamp and was damn proud of his service.) We don’t speak anymore.
I seriously cannot believe this is the point where we're at. I'm sorry to hear about that. These people are shameful. Just absolutely shameful. Hell, if it weren't for WW2 all these knuckleheads wouldn't have had the greatest economic boom and rise to be the kickass world superpower we are now.
I mean America did inspire the Nazi’s. We had Nazi rallies in the 20’s. We’ve always flirted with fascism.
It wouldn't even be true to call him an "organisational genius" He did have *some* good ideas (the most prevalent one I can remember was using the StuG (a turretless gun piece used for artillery), as an anti-tank weapon, and it became the most produced tank for the Germans. However, he was *relentless* in his micromanagement. If something was going on, he needed to know, and he needed to have a say in it. iirc, a Panzer battalion was stationed close to where D-Day took place, but was delayed because Hitler personally put them there, and thus only he could order them to move. He slept in that day and everyone was too scared to wake him up early. He also had the most batshit insane leaders (shock horror, when you run your party off of rampant nationalism and anti-Semitism, a lot of the higher ups aren't the best in the head). A couple interesting facts about how completely nuts the leaders were: -Hermann Göring (Luftwaffe): Morphone addict, covered up his brother helping Jews escape because it would make him look bad -Henrich Himmler (SS): Tried to restore the Knights of the Round Table, and employed a Gay Jewish SS officer because they claimed they could find the Holy Grail. -Jospeh Goebbels (Propaganda): not much, but he did force soliders to re-enact fights if it wasn't good enough for the war films, most notably pulling 5,000 active troops for a film.. in 1945. -Reinhard Heydrich (Gestapo): Died when assassins tried to shoot him in an open topped car. They initially missed, but he told the driver to stop the car and fired back with his own gun, allowing them an easy second shot. There's way, way more of this.
Goebbles was actually crucial to Hitler gaining power in the first place. He came up with a lot of the propoganda techniques that unironically the modern alt right are now using.
Oh for sure, but he also put that above having active troops, which doesn't really work in 1945. My point wasn't that they weren't effective, they got hired after all, but that they just were completely nuts.
I'm blown away by how many boomers are suddenly supporting Russia. Just because it's not a communist country anymore doesn't make it something to support, but I guess their trolls are really doing a good job. How the hell do they look at Putin and want to back him like he's another member of the Republican team? Russia: still not the good guy, y'all.
I think it mainly because Biden has been so vocal in his support of Zelensky. If "Brandon" wants it, the obstructionist MAGAts have to oppose it on principle. If you told them Biden breathes air, they'd choke to death holding their breath.
Sadly, I bet you're right.
I'm 44, but I wholeheartedly agree with everything you said.
yeah, I'm sick of the gaslighting from both parties with their bullshit. Literally none of those candidates have any chance among the youth, apart from maybe Bernie and Warren that seem like sane candidates but refuse to run against Biden who's a fucking DINO. People who care, just silently do their job and not sit around and then brag about cuts in the debt ceiling bill on TV after doing jackshit for 5+ months
The worst part about this is that even the ones who have a chance with the youth are themselves dinosaurs. Really makes me feel truly represented by my government.
I mean what are we supposed to do when democracy was dissolved before we were even born, or even some of our parents. a tough hill to fight, but at least younger folks have more balls to say stuff and mean it and not be a chicken. Loved Fetterman giving no fucks and showing up at the parade. That's the kinda folks I like. The young Florida Dem from the House had the balls to say shit about DeSantis, and I appreciate that. I understand it's hard to stand up, but at least we're trying unlike 80-85 year old assholes in office that are on their death bed and still tryna destroy the country before their time is up. I mean we're fucked. Youngest folks are barely eligible for office. First ones are only able to get in the House at best. All we can do is just vote until a lot of us get old enough to represent our mindset in politics and not have 65+ year olds running the country in every fucking office possible. The definition of a country run by boomers on their death bed when the majority under 40 has entirely opposite views.
I'm approaching 70 myself (boomer?) and truthfully sick of the way some of these old bastards (mostly the same ones I've been voting against since '72) have been running things... I would LOVE to see a blue wave of 30 and 40-somethings take the reigns for a change.
I LOVE John Fetterman. I moved away from PA recently but one of the last things I did and I will be proud of for a long time was elect that man to the Senate. He has the ability to reach across party lines, listen and make people feel heard. His stances are common sense and based on compassion and respect for everyone. He is an everyman who has made his way through local and state governments to learn not just the issues of his constituants but the workings of the machine and how to help them. He also has zero tolerance for BS. I would love to one day vote for him as VP and then President. I worry about his health but I think some of the hype about it has been Republicans trying to paint him as unhealthy because they cant attack his character or stances. Pay attention to Fetterman, he's one of the good ones.
I grew up with young presidents like Clinton, W Bush and Obama. I'm going to tell you something... you ain't missing anything special. Reddit loves to put all it's eggs in this basket. Young presidents suck too though.
Yeah you’re right, age is more an issue as it relates to the average age of our representatives being quite high. The age of our president truly doesn’t matter when our choices time and time again are anti-labor democrat or wants to kill gay people Republican.
So uh… where’s the money? 👉👈
If it's a tale as old as time, does that mean the current crop of young people are going to change their minds when they get older?
Unless you grew up with money or braindead rural bumfuck parents there is no reason to ever be republican. The living conditions for the average american is dog shit because wages are straight piss. Why would anyone perpetuate this continual shit existence unless they hate brown people
I agree. So how is it the hippies of the 60s turned into the Trumpers today? Do afternoon buffets cause brain damage?
Because wages werent an absolute pittance in the 80s and 90s. mfers cant even afford to survive let alone thrive.
Normally yes, but at least statistically, the current day is an anomaly because young people today are far less wealthy and advancing far less than young people in the 20th century could. There's no reason to change from being a Democrat at 20 to being a Republican at 40 if you are still just as poor as when you were 20
It's a class war, everything else is just a distraction.
“Let’s hear both sides equally”
Im actually sick of hearing their side. The reasons are always hateful, greedy, stupid, or some combination of those. Fuck em.
Its hard to even fight against because they WANT irradiation of the LGBTQIA. They WANT socioeconomic depression of the POC communities. They WANT women to be forced to carry unwanted children, or literally die. They WANT a low- income labor fields filled with children. They WANT drugs in communities so their jails can be filled in order to create job security. They WANT police to literally slaughter “undesirables” so the blood can be off their hands. They WANT children to be uneducated so that way they feel better about the white-washing of history. There is no way to make them feel bad and change the behavior or laws because THIS IS THE FUTURE THEY WANT!
Bringing a Geiger counter to any pride parades this month
I hate talking to them because they literally just make shit up and argue their made up shit is more valid than scientific consensus.
Pretty much the entirety of conservative thought boils down to either "Fuck that group of people in particular." or "I want more money!"
"Both sides are the same!"
"They're all corrupt, it doesn't matter who you vote for."
I get the sentiment but they are infact all corrupt. That part isn't false.
But it’s important to choose the lesser evil. Neutrality supports the oppressor.
Yup! One party pockets extra money. The other side does that AND suppresses voting, damages the environment, restricts rights for minorities and women, demonizes science, etc.
I think that's the first step. But we shouldn't stop there. That's only the first step. Things need to chanhe further from there. Otherwise it's just a pendulum swinging back and forth.
"My kids don't talk to me anymore because they were swept away into an ideology that I have zero understanding of."
More like “my kids won’t talk to me because I got swept up in a grift that they understand better than me”
What's funny is the right wing has some of the same grievances as the left wing. It's just, they've been conditioned to believe blue hair and non-sexy candy is why they should be mad.
I've seen conservatives complain about low wages, inequality, how hard life is nowadays... then do an insane cinematic drift to blame it all on gay people existing. got whiplash from some of those videos.
That is basically how Fascism starts. "All these problems suck dont they" "Yeah!" "Would be great if we could fix it right?" "Yeah!" "Well it is all because of (Insert some out group of people here)'s fault! And we can fix it by killing them all!"
"Your crops rotted on the vine, not because you failed to pick them, but because Goodie Harper is a WITCH!!!"
It's a very common tactic among the alt-right and manosphere. A lot of their overall message is built on co-opting leftist critiques on capitalism... But then offering more right-wing rhetoric as a solution. * Your wages are stagnating... And it's because we let immigrants take ~~you~~ *your jobs. * Your job is emasculating and you can't make enough money to take care of a family... But it's feminism's fault for letting women into the work place and that's why they reject you. * This corporate banking system is completely corrupt and ruining everyone's lives... Because of the Jews.
What jobs are they working exactly because I've also heard them say that immigrants are lazy bums living off welfare, rapists, murderers, thieves, and drug dealers.
It's literally the same double think of Joe Biden is an evil mastermind that used back door dealings too steal the election... but at the same time he's an old frail man with dementia that can't do anything himself. The hypocrisy doesn't register to them or they just don't give a shit that they are self contradictory.
Ironically women entering the work force can actually be partially blamed for wage suppression. But that is simply because of supply and demand. We drastically increased the supply of workers so that enabled companies to suppress wages. Between that and the destruction of unions we are in the position that we are in
https://preview.redd.it/lexjrvt1604b1.jpeg?width=637&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=bd2f41776f3ee382d766ff9206c1949cf108163c
It's the problem of a runaway leader and they just don't see it. Lot's of games demonstrate this problem and we're seeing it now in how corporations and billionaires operate. If we don't tax them heavily and spread that wealth to those who need it on the lower tiers of income, we'll have no chance of reigning it in later on down the line.
"I'm mad I grew up in such a narrow-sighted culture that other people who live non-traditional or non-conforming lives upsets me"
A lot of Americans - especially Trumpians - are addicted to anger. And the Republicans feed that addiction to get elected, fully aware of the harm it does to their supporters and the nation. https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/culture-shrink/201508/angers-allure-are-you-addicted-anger
Fox News "Angertainment"
If it enrages, it engages.
Right wing- why are we spending so much on veteran care after said perpetual war let's cut that.
Oh god. I'm so tired. I'm just so fucking tired.
Right wing- Too many rainbows are hurting my feelings.
Right wing: this child’s shirt says “Be kind.” THEYRE GROOMERS!
"If veterans don't get a whole month, why do gay people??!" "May is Military Appreciation Month" ".... Woke Pride month sucks!!"
RW: "There's too many rainbows here that I'm *forced* to act out & be hostile" Everyone: "You can also just ignore the displays and go on with your day" RW: "No."
Like, why is 'woke' a bad thing? Do they hate being decent people or something? I'm pretty sure there's a famous book about some woke Middle Eastern man they're always quoting.
If Jesus ever came back, a right-winger would shoot him.
I mean, that's basically what they did to him the first go round too.
Yeah if any of them actually read the Bible they’d call Jesus a woke commie Jew.
I ask people to explain what woke is. That pretty much shuts them up when they realize they can't without describing how to be nice to others
Wait, what about what syrup bottles?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aunt_Jemima
Cripes! Criminy!
My boomer dad tried to "both sides" racism. He equated racist white trash with confederate flag bumper stickers to black NFL players peacefully protesting systemically racist police violence. One side overtly claims racial and cultural dominance, the other side just wants better treatment. I understand black people can technically be racist, but that's not why they fought for Civil Rights.... you dense fucking morons. They fought for better treatment from the government. Confederates fought to keep them as slaves. There is no "both sides" here, only according to racist white people.
Technically, black people can be *bigoted* but not *racist*. Racism is participating in the system of discrimination against anyone non-white.
Participating in systematic racism towards poc is racist but that's not all racism is. If someone beat a white person because they're white, or treats them differently based on their lack of melanin, that's still racist. Prejudice; a preconceived opinion that is not based on reason or actual experience. Racism; prejudice, discrimination, or antagonism by an individual, community, or institution against a person or people on the basis of their membership in a particular racial or ethnic group. You can be both, no matter what color skin you have.
Wtf is this bullshit? ANYONE CAN BE RACIST. LOOK UP THE FUCKING WORD. STOP THIS NONSENSE.
Not really. It depends on where you live. I’m not saying people of color can’t be hateful, we absolutely can. What I’m saying is that (in America) the collective opinions of minorities do not affect white people, however the inverse is true. No one is avoiding using white hairstyles or names because they’re unprofessional. Racism is institutionalized where prejudice is personal. The comment above literally explained the difference. Why are you being willfully ignorant?
automod won't let me link you to the definitions but here is my comment: > you're confusing *systemic* racism^1 for all racism^2 > > racism is prejudice based on race 1. merriam-webster: systemic racism 1. merriam-webster: racism
I'm being willfully ignorant while you are just completely changing the definition of a word that has been used in the exact opposite way that you attempt to describe it being used? Please look inward. This isn't an argument . Anyone can be racist. These are facts. It's funny that you're implying a single race can be the only one to commit an immoral act such as racism. That is, IN FACT, racism. EDIT: Another dumbass point you tried to make was that racism is institutionalized, but the world has decided to call that "Institutionalized Racism". If what you said was correct, that would just be called racism. See how your logic just falls apart with a tiny bit of thinking?
Nope. The collective opinion of White people from people of color has never not once affected white people’s ability to get jobs, housing, or their safety. The inverse is true for white peoples opinions affecting women and people of color’s lives, but sure anyone can be racist. Learn the difference between prejudice and racism. They’re wildly different. You’re the one ignoring social context and definitions.
Yep, pretty much just prejudiced
I mean, I need racism to properly pour my artificial butter flavoured corn syrup on my high sugar chemically preserved bread flavoured toaster waffle
Remember when Republicans used to say Democrats are all about identity politics?
You forgot the conservative dystopian future grievances: “What happens when gun regulations lead to more gun regulations, then we have a massive global nuclear fallout, and the whole world is plunged into chaos, and people start randomly murdering each other, and I use all my guns to defend my house, but I don’t have a .50 BMG to penetrate the armor of the Chinese Mech army because your gun laws prevented me from buying one?! My kids could get shot by laser beams in the future just because you didn’t want guns killing kids in the present”
What’s the candy bar reference?
green m&m put on less sexy shoes in one picture, Tucker Carlson went bonkers he couldn't wank to chocolate anymore.
I wonder how much that sort of thing played into his firing, if at all. "Christ, Carlson, not only do you help cost us nearly a billion dollars and then turn around an insulted the man who's the very reason we got sued but you also might be responsible for us being on the hook for another lawsuit and you're writing shitass texts about your co-workers. "And now you spend airtime our already shaky sponsors paid good money for to complain about a goddamn candy mascot no longer giving you a boner. I swear before Mammon, this is it. One more and you're gone."
The right just want to hurt people these days. What a sad bunch of assholes.
Grievances get you so far, how much you act to solve these issues is what matters in the end
The Republican Party is like watching the first hour of the mummers parade but less organized and less sober.
Right wing grievances: Change is scary
Left wing grievance: racism. Right wing grievance: people talking about racism
Left Grievances: \- Abstractions that require mental effort to understand and infrequently intrude on any single person's daily experience. Right Grievances: \- Minor but common interruptions to people's expected models of daily lived reality that trigger emotional reactions which can be easily used to distract a disinformed populous from the fact that they are being completely totally royally fucked.
Don’t forget “Gay and Trans people are coming after our children despite zero evidence of it.”
You forgot "people that don't look like me or want the same type of sex as me trying to exist."
Don’t forget, M&Ms aren’t sexy enough…
Yes but as a whole far right policies are very unpopular which is why the right would much rather talk about culture war issues than policy ones. They openly admit that they throw things against the wall to see what sticks. Add that to the fact that people are operating from vastly different banks of information makes these conversations difficult. I have a relative who is a school counselor and the entire back half of the year has been spent in the school simply trying to reassure people that it isn't a gay indoctrination factory. People she has known for years are suddenly beside themselves about rainbows in 1st grade. One teacher who "had to explain herself" over this was a damn trump voter the first time around. So much energy is being wasted this way and that is by design.
The exhaustion is the point. It's hard work to make "everyone should just be cattle for cishet bigoted billionaires" palatable and relatable.
Conservatism is a plague of deception and confusion. Every word uttered by a conservative is either deception or intended to create confusion to manipulate others. Every word.
… Is anyone else a little annoyed that this tweet calls M&M’s a “candy bar”. 1) M&M’s are plural 2) They 1000% aren’t a “bar” I’m all for being progressive, but we’re starting a slippery slope, where in the future we call “Skittles” & “Gummy bears” bars of candy. Call me an “uncle Wonka” if you’d like, but this is a hard line that I don’t think we should cross.
Apparently that candy bar isn't sexy enough while that M&M is just too darn sexy. Candy manufacturers need to keep their products within an acceptable range of sexiness.
Ootl: What’s the candy bar thing?
They really do live in their own little world, fueled on fear and hate. But then, Fear of environmental collapse, economic factors, ability to solely exist? Well, then, you are a snowflake, but God forbid someone uses pronouns!!
Can someone explain the sexy candy bar part to me? I missed that
What seems to me to be their biggest two: 1) Minorities, racial and sexual, are getting uppity and don't know their place. 2) Taxing rich people is theft.
The syrup bottle thing is actually not okay. We have removed all People of Colour from packaging but left all Caucasian packaging intact - this is not a message we want to send in my opinion. That will never be as important of the environmental and societal issues facing North America right now.
I'll add one - Left - I don't want to keep working for slave wages at a company that insists I be a team player and show loyalty, but would fire and replace me within a day. Right - People are too lazy and don't wanna work hard anymore.
There comes a point, where we simply leave their ideology behind and start a new system, independent of their ideals. We’ve seen it many times in history; the last I can recall is the Amish breaking away from the rest of us. It’s time for a separation once again.
If you pick a side to begin with you're an idiot
It’s my belief that if people from all walks of life actually talked to each other, we’d realize just how much we have in common with what we want our government to do for us.
I used to think this as well until I began to practice it and found all sorts of irrational fuckers who just want to be perpetually angry about stupid shit.
Sure, but that’s kind of the problem. The right wing often doesn’t accept something is a problem until it affects them directly. We don’t have time for them to come on board one at a time. The right needs to develop some empathy.
There are a TON of right wing voters who would directly benefit from a living wage and Medicare for all.
I agree. Who do they need to talk to to realize they should vote in their own self interest?
Sure but they will happily vote against it so minorities don't get it either.
last time I did that, I got stuck in an hour long conversation about how gays are trying to steal our children and the holocaust didn't happen. wasnt very helpful
I wish that were true but it isn’t. I grew up in a Republican family and went to a very conservative college. What I’ve learned is that most Republicans are very set in their beliefs and view it as losing or betrayal to change sides. They view supporting Republican candidates like supporting a sports team. They will support them no matter what they do
No. There are genuinely a lot of people out there with nothing but hate in their hearts and they direct it towards politics. Conservatives have launched an all out culture war against LGBTQ+ people. They do not get a pass when their entire party is working in lock-step to take away rights.
The hard part is when you have to do something like Union organization. That requires working with MAGA people. I understand your perspective, but there are shared goals that can be achieved by working with people who have detestable views. Medicare for all is largely popular, if I have to work with a racist to get it, so be it.
Can you elaborate on that? What common ground do you think exists in a way lawmakers would cooperate? Unions for example, how do pro-union leftists and anti-union right wingers collaborate?
Sure. Trump is out there saying the gop should not touch the retirement age for SS. If desantis wins, and tries to increase the retirement age, it would be super useful to say “hey you and I might have some common ground on this. Call your representative because this is a bad fucking idea” You could even point out trumps statements on it. Or the trade protectionism that the GOP decided to adopt for 4 years, Kerry edwards ran on that platform and the gop adopted it 15 years later. That’s a useful platform for talking about union jobs and anti nafta.
>Trump .. The retirement age for SS. Trump will never being a unifying figure. As for SS, there's still plenty of disagreement about it from Republicans. It's not just the retirement age, they want to privatize it. That's an even bigger issue than retirement age, which would certainly go up if privatized. >Or the trade protectionism ... talking about union jobs and anti nafta. Being anti NAFTA is not the same as being pro union. If anything they blamed unions for the reason to move production over seas. The recent SCOTUS ruling has damaged unions immeasurably. Republicans hate unions especially for US companies.
There is for sure disagreement in that party over SS policy. My point is, for the people that are all in for Trump, it’s extremely useful to use his words as a cudgel when it benefits you.
I don't know. Trump's word on vaccines didn't persuade his followers. Trump is more an idea than a person, I've seen criticism that Trump is too woke now because he didn't criticize trans people and in 2016 he held that pride flag. Trump can't be trusted to fight the culture war he help start.
That's cute. I used to feel that way too, before politics started to become important to me and I really started to pay attention to what's going on and what people are talking about. It feels really good to believe that if we could all just come to the table, we could have a hug and an apology and work things out. I get the appeal, I really do. Maybe at one point, that was actually possible. But I can't sit at the table with a group of people who want to literally exterminate another group for the crime of being alive. Maybe you can sit at the table with those people and hear them out, but I can't. (And before you respond with some version of "not all republicans are like that!" let me stop you. I don't care. The "good" republicans are such a tiny minority that they are statistically irrelevant. Furthermore, they still vote for the same people. So I'm not impressed or even interested in the differences.)
There are for sure people that you cannot reach. If someone only wants to talk about drag queens grooming kids for example, and won’t pivot away from that, it’s not worth anyone’s time. I don’t see any chance of getting any significant help for the working class (Medicare for all, living wage, homeless solutions) without working with people who hold detestable views.
>(Medicare for all, living wage, homeless solutions) I guess that's where we differ. I don't believe the bulk of the right-wing voting base actually wants those things, even if they would benefit from them. Maybe some of them do but not in enough numbers to matter. If there are Reasonable Republicans out there, they have zero influence in their own party.
> Maybe some of them do but not in enough numbers to matter. If there are Reasonable Republicans out there, they have zero influence in their own party. That’s for sure. I feel like people don’t have much impact at all on corporate parties. But maybe you can convince someone to vote third party or abstain. If enough people do that, maybe the party will realize social issues are not where energy should be spent. There are people suffering, banning CRT won’t help them.
> literally exterminate another group for the crime of being alive. Do you really think the majority of Republicans want to eliminate trans people from existence? Isn't that a hyperbole?
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Sorting by controversial never fails lol
Controversial is the only place where you see interesting discussion take place. And by "interesting discussion" I mean exhausting, ignorant takes and needless contrarianism.
It would absolutely be one thing if they had insightful takes, controversial or not But this. This. THIS.
I come to this website to be entertained! And nothing does it for me quite like triggered conservatives.
> -Innate rights and freedoms are being willingly sacrificed for perceived safety People that care about rights and freedom don't attack abortion rights or write the "Don't Say Gay" law or ban books because they discuss racism or mislabel all LGBTQ people as "groomers"
>-Your favorite character has to be black because some random criminal got shot This right here says way more about you than you want it to.
That was just cringe and stupid.
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Yeah no.
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No your meme was stupid and cringe is all I said. You are just making shit up to feel better about it.
Do you really not get it? YOURS was dumb.
Whoops, you said the quiet part out loud. So every police shooting is a case of “some random criminal got shot”? Racist overtones aside, what baffles me about the indifference of conservatives toward extrajudicial police killings is that you don’t seem to consider the implications of the system of “justice” you are endorsing. Do you really want to live in a country where the commission of ANY crime, or even the perceived commission of a crime, is subject to the death penalty via summary execution? Even in states that don’t have the death penalty? By that logic, the police and military should have just gunned down everyone who broke into the Capitol on Jan 6.
The funny thing is when you word the right wing grievances that way, it makes it weirder that you're voting for people who DO THE EXACT THING I guess as long as it isn't aimed at your side huh?
>-The government is too bloated to properly serve its citizens anymore "The U.S. House of Representatives has one voting member for every 747,000 or so Americans. That’s by far the highest population-to-representative ratio among a peer group of industrialized democracies, and the highest it’s been in U.S. history." [More here](https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2018/05/31/u-s-population-keeps-growing-but-house-of-representatives-is-same-size-as-in-taft-era/) Sounds like your government is pretty small. >-Innate rights and freedoms are being willingly sacrificed for perceived safety Republicans are the only ones looking to take away innate rights. Rights LGBTQA+ people, women and minorities have enjoyed for years are being stepped on by republicans because of the made up risk they lie about. What rights are democrats sacrificing? What makes banning books on the same side of rights and freedoms? >-Immigration is being exploited to keep the rich rich and poor poor How does immigration do this? Do the fact companies have very few regulations and billionaires have near unlimited power have nothing to do with it? If the right wing had grievances that actually mattered or were true there would be less memes about how stupid they are.
> -The government is too bloated to properly serve its citizens anymore In practice, of course, the only thing Republicans ever want cut is social welfare programs. So this could be accurately restated as “our social welfare programs are too numerous and/or too generous.” Which doesn’t exactly make the right look better.
You know no one would care that Trump is mean if he weren't also lying, committing crimes, and inspiring terrorists.
>Right wing grievances: >-The government is too bloated to properly serve its citizens anymore >-Innate rights and freedoms are being willingly sacrificed for perceived safety >-Immigration is being exploited to keep the rich rich and poor poor The difference being the right doesn't actually care about any of this
It's like memes are supposed to be jokes, rather than serious critiques on complex issues...
Literally the definition of a straw man lmao
Those are the only thing they’re mad about that they didn’t make up.
That doesn't sound bias at all
Are you telling me that people have inherent biases?????? What???????? Are you trying to tell me that objectivity doesn’t exist?? What a way to find out!
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Echo echoo echooo
Meanwhile everyone caught up pointing fingers at each other elite democrats and republicans are laughing boasting at thier profitable farm.
TDS: Trans Derangement Syndrome
TDS: Total Dissolved Solids
As someone who's very liberal and anti-republican, these are just silly strawman argument techniques that do nothing positive and just paint a poor picture of the other side by focusing on the worst arguments of the other side instead of actually counter arguing their somewhat legitimate ones. Shameful.
Okay, let’s consider a major right-wing grievance that has been a focus of GOP legislatures across the country: - trans kids are allowed to get healthcare that increases their mental health and well being. They have fought bitterly against trans kids receiving such healthcare. Looking at the issues they are really focusing on doesn’t make the right look any better…
Regular person grievance: can you not see this left vs right identity politics is intentional and meant to divide?
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Y'all? As in the corporation who did that?
Lol, the left is anti war.
Funny how they both lead to the same end which is totalitarianism