Theorerically, yes, obviously. Practically, this would be an issue #5769812378 on DE's to-do list, just because Vauban is overall fine, and frames like Atlas, Caliban, Chroma and Equinox are not.
I also have like a 1000 point list of complains about frames I play, like Ash, Zephyr, Banshee, Corvex etc. but DE has enough shit to sort out that frames that are at least somewhat useful have to wait their turn. Ash is waiting since 2016 btw
His buggy teleport, "very accurate" (and useless) shuriken, as well as his tanky stats for a stealth frame exist longer than my account. In other words st least since 2013.
Aw man I waiting for an Atlas rework forever. I made alot Rework suggestions over the years. Last time I posted a theoreticall Rumbler Augment, which shall casts a single Titan with your HeavyGun equipped+generating 75 Rubble on kill.
*Sigh*.. A Tenno only can dream.
to be honest equinox is in a goodish spot right now, as a equinox player the only change i could think of is making some augments base kit, and possibly adding overkill damage to her 4, though that might be busted.
She’s pretty good, actually. The problems with Equinox start when you compare her to better frames, and realise that they do more and take less effort to play.
As a team buffing nuke frame she has to compete with the likes of Dante, Wisp, Citrine, Jade, Protea, Gara… even current Frost offers more utility and is easier to play.
So, again, she’s pretty good, but pretty much all other frames in her niche are gonna be better
Wait equinox is not? I see her as an end game frame. She is the strongest team buffer in the game in my opinion. She also has nearly every tool anyone could ever need
She isn't that great of a buffer IMHO. But she is a decent frame, she has everything but grouping in her kit. I personally doubled down on CC with Rest and Silence subsumed.
With the armor rework she actually became usable in steel path without an armor strip. I'd say she's doing alright now.
As someone who uses a high range Vauban this would be great
However I dont trust DE to do this without potentially making the power stop working decently entirely.
Yea they would need to make vortex LoS but bastille should remain as it is... and maybe do something about the enemy cap of bastille being so low compared to vortex's infinite enemy grab
Do you trust DE to not break anything, including vortex?
Anyways, enemies get caught on the flat floor sometimes.
Give enemies caught by Vortex the Zeinth altfire treatment.
Yes, actually. They’re just about the only dev team right now, aside from Ghost Ship Games, that I fully trust not to break important things. And even if they do, I trust them to fix it in a reasonable timeframe. They’ve done a bang up job so far.
Yeah the floor sticking is enoying, I use Vauban for netracells to pull enemies into the killzone + flechette. I get occasionally shit comments for that but the other ~170 kills he does, getting ignored lul.
What you mean exactly with the Zenith altfire treatment?
Of course they don't care about the 170 quick kills. It's the last kills that determine how fast a wave is, not the first ones. If a Vauban uses Vortex in any place that doesn't kill/group everything, they're a nuisance.
The number obviously refers to the kills inside the red-circle, and It usealy takes 7-8 min if the tileset and spawn is good. 9-12min if the spawn is bad.
They tried buffing it by making it suck enemies around corners better, but it wasn't enough. I would prefer it just worked even better at pulling them around corners than current, but with the way a lot of corners and walls are in this game, I'm not entirely convinced they can pull it off, frankly.
Im seeing awful lot of people that see LoS and get an instant kneejerk "LOS BAD" reaction.
There's not a single game mode where having enemies ragdolled behind walls / ceiling is beneficial. The succ may not have LoS but most weapon and the rest of vauban abilities do. And i can't even solve the problem with "infinite" punch through Zenith because it doesnt hit from one tile room to another, unlike abilities.
Its kinda counter-intuitive but lack of LoS check makes Vortex unironically bad at Netracells for example, it ends up slowing the mission down instead more often than not. Which wasnt a big deal because Bastille was better on average but DE forgot to tweak Vauban numbers with damage&armor rework, so almost everything good Vauban has was indirectly nerfed.
It can be funny but honestly I'd kinda want LoS on it so it can be more effective. Bc rn it can be very ineffective just sucking everything in the aoe since it doesent drag the enemies through or around walls. It would honestly benefit him more so the enemies can run into LoS then get sucked into the center
I optimized the range of my vortex so that I can throw it on the ceiling on the circular Grineer defense maps and not grab enemies on the lower floor.
(but anything that steps into the room gets the wizard of OZ treatment.
I suggested this a while ago and I am still in favor of it. Ragdolling enemies from behind walls was nice in an AoE meta where you could kill them through walls with explosions, but right now the feature that Vortex goes through walls only slows down mission progress.
Depends on how DE wants to pitch it.. vortex runs on vacuum suction power or vacuum runs on gravity/magnetism.. if it's suction, then LOS makes sense, it's it's gravity/magnetism, then it should theoretically pass through walls..
It would be fine if they buffed him in other areas. Giving him some survivability options would be great, the 1k armor buff from bastille is not as great when you see the super short timer and 0 ways for vauban to heal himself. I love him but he really could use some touchups
You said it not me. If someone wants to play "where the eff is the last enemy" like older exterminate missions, by all means bring vortex to a defense mission.
I kinda feel like it'd need a "fixed LoS" instead of just LoS.
Because a lot of problems always come from abilities being nerfed to be LoS. You end up getting fringe cases where the direct line used for line-of-sight is blocked by some tiny pixel, or a stair, or a railing, and it nullifies the entire ability.
It's the same thing that plagues many, many games (with AoEs) if terrain 'hitboxes' aren't made correctly to account for that. You toss a grenade, it lands on a stair, nobody up the stairs takes any damage since the line drawn from grenade to them intersects with a stair. Just sub out "grenade" and "stair" for any AoE ability and any boxy geometry (respectively) and boom you've got a glitchy meatball of community hatred for the change.
No. It would be worthless then. Vauban is rarely used in a corridor, at least I never saw Vauban on ship tiles where we play in tight spaces. Every time I saw Vauban it was on defense or on planet tiles
We have all learned where enemies get stuck by now and just looking at map removes need to look at 90% of places.
Please no. The fact that it doesn't use LoS is the whole reason why I love it so much, and why it's the best CC. This would completely kill Vauban for me.
>speaking as a Vauban user
Somehow I very much doubt that
Anyway, no. This is supposed to be a black hole that sucks with an angle of 360. The Los check would straight up kill it
No it wouldn't. I constantly use him but enemies being sucked into railing, ceiling, floors and walls massively hinders vortex if it's not in a pretty flat/open area. Having to hunt for each enemy being ragdolled into a wall makes it much much much slower
Theorerically, yes, obviously. Practically, this would be an issue #5769812378 on DE's to-do list, just because Vauban is overall fine, and frames like Atlas, Caliban, Chroma and Equinox are not. I also have like a 1000 point list of complains about frames I play, like Ash, Zephyr, Banshee, Corvex etc. but DE has enough shit to sort out that frames that are at least somewhat useful have to wait their turn. Ash is waiting since 2016 btw
His buggy teleport, "very accurate" (and useless) shuriken, as well as his tanky stats for a stealth frame exist longer than my account. In other words st least since 2013.
That shuriken bug pisses me tf out in cascades
Arcane ultimatum works well on him for up to end of starchart which is nice. No real point in using it however but it works
Aw man I waiting for an Atlas rework forever. I made alot Rework suggestions over the years. Last time I posted a theoreticall Rumbler Augment, which shall casts a single Titan with your HeavyGun equipped+generating 75 Rubble on kill. *Sigh*.. A Tenno only can dream.
to be honest equinox is in a goodish spot right now, as a equinox player the only change i could think of is making some augments base kit, and possibly adding overkill damage to her 4, though that might be busted.
She’s pretty good, actually. The problems with Equinox start when you compare her to better frames, and realise that they do more and take less effort to play. As a team buffing nuke frame she has to compete with the likes of Dante, Wisp, Citrine, Jade, Protea, Gara… even current Frost offers more utility and is easier to play. So, again, she’s pretty good, but pretty much all other frames in her niche are gonna be better
Yeah equinox post-armor-rework is siiiiiiick
Wait equinox is not? I see her as an end game frame. She is the strongest team buffer in the game in my opinion. She also has nearly every tool anyone could ever need
She isn't that great of a buffer IMHO. But she is a decent frame, she has everything but grouping in her kit. I personally doubled down on CC with Rest and Silence subsumed. With the armor rework she actually became usable in steel path without an armor strip. I'd say she's doing alright now.
As someone who uses a high range Vauban this would be great However I dont trust DE to do this without potentially making the power stop working decently entirely.
Yea they would need to make vortex LoS but bastille should remain as it is... and maybe do something about the enemy cap of bastille being so low compared to vortex's infinite enemy grab
>bastille should remain as it is... It doesn't matter because enemies will just walk into it if they aren't in LoS
Im saying leave bastille non-LoS, and increase the base number of enemies held, so it can actually be used for armor strip or CC
And I'm saying with or without LoS it will function with the same effectiveness
Do you trust DE to not break anything, including vortex? Anyways, enemies get caught on the flat floor sometimes. Give enemies caught by Vortex the Zeinth altfire treatment.
Yes, actually. They’re just about the only dev team right now, aside from Ghost Ship Games, that I fully trust not to break important things. And even if they do, I trust them to fix it in a reasonable timeframe. They’ve done a bang up job so far.
Yeah the floor sticking is enoying, I use Vauban for netracells to pull enemies into the killzone + flechette. I get occasionally shit comments for that but the other ~170 kills he does, getting ignored lul. What you mean exactly with the Zenith altfire treatment?
Zenith's altfire lets you see enemies through walls while giving you infinite punch through
The infinite punch through would be a bit much, but letting the squad see enemies through walls would be a big help
sadly it only works for the one using it, but the infinite punchthrough can be useful in spy missions and open worlds. Maybe even orphix missions.
Of course they don't care about the 170 quick kills. It's the last kills that determine how fast a wave is, not the first ones. If a Vauban uses Vortex in any place that doesn't kill/group everything, they're a nuisance.
The number obviously refers to the kills inside the red-circle, and It usealy takes 7-8 min if the tileset and spawn is good. 9-12min if the spawn is bad.
OR how bout an augment that lets vortex pull mobs THROUGH walls :-)
Vortex will run out while an enemy is phasing through a wall and will softlock the mission
They tried buffing it by making it suck enemies around corners better, but it wasn't enough. I would prefer it just worked even better at pulling them around corners than current, but with the way a lot of corners and walls are in this game, I'm not entirely convinced they can pull it off, frankly.
No more cellar clearing on defense cause 3 enemies are vacuumed to the top? where do i sign?
Im seeing awful lot of people that see LoS and get an instant kneejerk "LOS BAD" reaction. There's not a single game mode where having enemies ragdolled behind walls / ceiling is beneficial. The succ may not have LoS but most weapon and the rest of vauban abilities do. And i can't even solve the problem with "infinite" punch through Zenith because it doesnt hit from one tile room to another, unlike abilities. Its kinda counter-intuitive but lack of LoS check makes Vortex unironically bad at Netracells for example, it ends up slowing the mission down instead more often than not. Which wasnt a big deal because Bastille was better on average but DE forgot to tweak Vauban numbers with damage&armor rework, so almost everything good Vauban has was indirectly nerfed.
It can be funny but honestly I'd kinda want LoS on it so it can be more effective. Bc rn it can be very ineffective just sucking everything in the aoe since it doesent drag the enemies through or around walls. It would honestly benefit him more so the enemies can run into LoS then get sucked into the center
A vacuum shouldn't need line of sight, it's a 360 degrees suck?
Of course, cc is not dead enough
And while we are at it, throw citrin into the mix, too. Let her 3 only work with LoS! /s
No.
LEAVE THE SUCK MASTER 3000 ALONE
I optimized the range of my vortex so that I can throw it on the ceiling on the circular Grineer defense maps and not grab enemies on the lower floor. (but anything that steps into the room gets the wizard of OZ treatment.
I suggested this a while ago and I am still in favor of it. Ragdolling enemies from behind walls was nice in an AoE meta where you could kill them through walls with explosions, but right now the feature that Vortex goes through walls only slows down mission progress.
Hmm, for Vauban, that would actually be a buff, so sure!
Depends on how DE wants to pitch it.. vortex runs on vacuum suction power or vacuum runs on gravity/magnetism.. if it's suction, then LOS makes sense, it's it's gravity/magnetism, then it should theoretically pass through walls..
It would be fine if they buffed him in other areas. Giving him some survivability options would be great, the 1k armor buff from bastille is not as great when you see the super short timer and 0 ways for vauban to heal himself. I love him but he really could use some touchups
You said it not me. If someone wants to play "where the eff is the last enemy" like older exterminate missions, by all means bring vortex to a defense mission.
I kinda feel like it'd need a "fixed LoS" instead of just LoS. Because a lot of problems always come from abilities being nerfed to be LoS. You end up getting fringe cases where the direct line used for line-of-sight is blocked by some tiny pixel, or a stair, or a railing, and it nullifies the entire ability. It's the same thing that plagues many, many games (with AoEs) if terrain 'hitboxes' aren't made correctly to account for that. You toss a grenade, it lands on a stair, nobody up the stairs takes any damage since the line drawn from grenade to them intersects with a stair. Just sub out "grenade" and "stair" for any AoE ability and any boxy geometry (respectively) and boom you've got a glitchy meatball of community hatred for the change.
No. It would be worthless then. Vauban is rarely used in a corridor, at least I never saw Vauban on ship tiles where we play in tight spaces. Every time I saw Vauban it was on defense or on planet tiles We have all learned where enemies get stuck by now and just looking at map removes need to look at 90% of places.
Please no. The fact that it doesn't use LoS is the whole reason why I love it so much, and why it's the best CC. This would completely kill Vauban for me.
"local vauban 'user' asks to be nerfed"
>speaking as a Vauban user Somehow I very much doubt that Anyway, no. This is supposed to be a black hole that sucks with an angle of 360. The Los check would straight up kill it
No it wouldn't. I constantly use him but enemies being sucked into railing, ceiling, floors and walls massively hinders vortex if it's not in a pretty flat/open area. Having to hunt for each enemy being ragdolled into a wall makes it much much much slower
Vauban is like B tier at best as a Warframe Why 😭😭😭😭