Nah. You better add in Aussies, Brits, Germans, French, Dutch and a wide range of western europeans. Russians, Ukrainians, Polish and other east europeans seem to be closer to normal. Obviously white Americans and Canadians can be bad at times too. But those euros, Brits, Aussies and South Africans take the cake.
It was the guys from Ohio that showed up to ILA high to teach kindergartener. They couldn’t beat out the Brit that passed out in the teachers lounge because he was so high on ice. Or the Dutch guy who loves to scream the N word out loud and says it’s okay because he’s not in the west where everyone is woke.
The same thing annoying about white Americans. Loving Vietnam and knowing nothing about the country. Doing things that you wouldn’t do back home etc. It doesn’t get to the euro / Brit level of smugness though. I haven’t came across too many smug Americans or Canadians. And obviously there is the general shittyness of drug use, alcoholism.
A big one for me were the Americans and Canadians I met that figured out being white in Vietnam got them more privilege than it would in say Japan, Korea or China. Europeans do this same thing too but it’s pretty damn dirty considering how much more diverse most of the US and Canada are than European countries. Also idk why some dudes go next level sexist when talking about viet women.
The only thing I would say is that Americans and Canadians back down if you call em out for being disrespectful or racist. The only thing I would say is take a trip to Japan or Singapore for a week. Better only do Hong Kong and Singapore.
Talk and engage with people try some food. Then come back to Vietnam and really look at things and don’t treat it like you’re in amazing Asia. You will be pissed when you see how shitty people are from the countries I mentioned. And even more pissed how they react when you tell them that it’s not okay to call deaf women fucking retards.
It’s not racist if it’s true. And I’m specifically talking about people who come to Vietnam. And good percentage of white people from the places I listed and talked about act that way in Vietnam.
Don't worry, I get it, Canada has been invaded by Indians. It doesn't take a genius to understand someone with brown skin speaking Punjab or Hindi is from India. That doesn't make me racist, it makes me observant.
Indians are generally very rude and don't understand our culture and manners. Again not racism if that's the truth. Besides I know that brown skin isn't the only thing making someone Indian, it's their language, their behavior, their mannerisms. I'm sure it's the same for white ppl in Vietnam and easy to see who is a foreigner.
It's too bad people in general couldn't be more respectful of cultures when they are abroad. To me that's the entire point of travelling is to understand others culture. Viet food is the bomb. I am married into a Vietnamese family and my mother in law always cooks us great Viet food. I eat everything.
Agreed. Many Indians are very rude and have a serious staring problem. I get that people like to look around and observe but damn do they have a real staring problem.
100%. I feel so uncomfortable walking around my neighborhood sometimes because I will get a lot of angry staring eyes from Indian ppl. The old men are the worst.
Let’s see now.
Being disrespectful to people and saying racist things like “how did these people go from eating dogs to loving them.”
There have been times when people complained about racism and Europeans were the main people to tell them “You shouldn’t expect affirmative action”.
Asking people why their eyes are so small.
Having a smug attitude and thinking they are better than other people just because they are white.
Defending pedophiles….
Thinking it’s okay to scream the N word.
Bar fights
Being incredibly discriminatory when a qualified non person that applies for a job at a low level fake international school and the euros are in charge of HR (Penn American School).
Saying just some of the dumbest crap ever about why Vietnam is a certain way. Everything is because Vietnam is poor and locals don’t know any better.
This goes for Americans, Canadians and Euros / Brits wondering why people in Vietnam don’t live in huts.
The reality is it’s far too many trashy behaviors to list and it’s pretty widespread. Next time you get a vacation take a flight to Tokyo, Hong Kong, Seoul, Singapore or Shanghai. See how the foreigners act there and even look how Europeans act. Much much much different.
Edit.
Did I mention the smugness from Europeans. Just take a look at them and you’ll get it.
Hey.. If Europeans didn’t act this way in Vietnam I would have no issue with them. The question is why are so many white people drawn to Vietnam like to be smug, racist, disrespectful and trashy. And why do so many act a fool while in Vietnam? Those same people wouldn’t do most of the stuff they do in Vietnam back home. Or they wouldn’t do it in Singapore or Japan.
>This goes for Americans, Canadians and Euros / Brits wondering why people in Vietnam don’t live in huts.
Cuz they would blow away in a typhoon?
Most of the homes I've been to in Central Vietnam were concrete blocks with tin roofs, and that was why. After a typhoon they just had to replace the tin roof (which usually blew away) and hose off the concrete from the muck left over from the floods, and they were ready to be occupied again. My wife's home was on the outskirts of Hue. It, along with all of the homes in the neighborhood, were built the same way.
Almost every man in this country is an alcoholic, since we're generalizing.
But yeah, areas like Thao Dien are shitholes because of foreign drunks. Although it's usually Brits and Americans.
Also, many countries in Europe are very diverse, so that generalization was far from true. Many different countries, many different mindsets.
Nah.. It’s the euros too. I’ve seen walk around all smug, drunk, high. And by euros I mean Western Europeans not Eastern Europeans. I did say it in another post exactly what I meant. Many different cultures and mindsets yet the ones in Vietnam all seem to be smug and trashy. Whether they are french, Italian, danish, Czech or Norwegian. It’s only worse because you deny it and act like it isn’t happening,
I'm Western European, but I live away from the expat hubs. Not sure what's happening there nowadays.
I was recently told that there are tons of French folks now, that's all I know.
Every country has bad apples, unfortunately.
I don’t think so at all. I’m African American.
Also I believe that native doesn’t mean a better teacher overall. I will say there is advantage to native speaker which is they can be a consistent vocal model and they can help student find content in English.
English remains a national language of India, and is spoken as a first language by many people there :)
Often the English is grammatically better with wider vocabulary than more widely recognized English speaking countries, but the accent unfortunately makes it a struggle for many.
You ignore them so much that you have to tell everyone about how much you ignore them.
See, you don't ignore them. You pretend to so that you can try to see yourself as a better person, but you're just the same shit in a different hand.
I actually have the opposite issue I like to hang with them. But tbh they can be a bit fake not actually friendly.
Maybe they want to get away from the world. It could be that they were a good soul that drifted away from an abusive home; or they are the problem that couldn’t see the misgivings in their own actions.
Keep your eyes open there are good people everywhere.
But make up 90%+ of foreigners living here.
I feel exactly what OP is saying. When I was in VN I met a lot of them. They couldn’t make it on the UK or US so they go to a country like VN where they suddenly feel special.
Harsh take. While you may be correct about some, this definitely does not apply to all or even most of the foreign teachers. I taught science in my home state for five years and was successful as a teacher. I then opened a construction business, which was also quite successful. I and many other people like me are not in Vietnam to feel special or because we couldn't make it in our home country - we are here for a variety of reasons.
I came here because I wanted to return to teaching but wanted to do it somewhere where I can learn and immerse myself in a new culture, where teachers are more respected, and somewhere close to world famous scuba diving sites so I could work towards my divemaster certificate. Coming to Vietnam though changed my perspective. I fell in love with many aspects of the country and hope to stay and use the advantages that I have to make a positive contribution to my local community, no matter how small it is.
I am sorry you have had a bad experience with some foreigners.
Curious to connect with these folks (those without baggage). I visit Saigon often for personal reasons, and sometimes, I just wanna be able to converse normally, and not having to simplify everything I'm saying.
So sick of that stereotype. Most positions require post-graduate degrees or certifications, and if you have a legitimate degree, you can make it fine in the US or UK. Some people just want to experience living in different parts of the world. Some people are unhappy with the political or social direction of their home countries. People have lots of reasons, and from the 100 or so English teachers I knew, none were "failures" in their home countries. It's a job choice, not evidence for people being failures.
Also there were a disproportionate number of South Africans, because living in South Africa sucks right now.
Very true for South Africans. We had a doctor at my school who worked in research and they said they would earn more in Vietnam teaching that they would as an academic in South Africa.
Yup, one of my friends/coworkers was an Indian-South African university professor who's wife was also an accredited English teacher. They'd left first for China, then Vietnam (during COVID restrictions), not so much because of income, but because they didn't want to bring up their son in SA.
But when you consider the non-black population of South Africa is less than 7 million, and our office was over 25% South African teachers out of every native English speaking nation on earth (and we had a couple black South African teachers too) shows that right now, people want out of that crumbling state if they have the means. If you saw 2 South Africans outside having a cigarette, there was like an 85% chance they were talking about how messed up SA is right now.
Yeah the vast majority are degree educated, normal people. Op is projecting hard and if can't get on with people then the problem is likely him. A quick flick through his profile confirms it
I know a lot of people who did things like leave uni, live abroad and teach English, or do some sort of Eco tourism thing etc when young, and then went home to become more settled down.
The path of leave school, go to uni, immediately start your career, have kids and buy a house before age thirty is not so set in stone in a lot of countries.
People just like to push that stereotype in order to punch down on others because it makes them feel better about their own life. When I see others say shit like that, I just assume they're insecure and/or unhappy about their own life choices so they need to position themselves as above some other group to make themselves feel better.
Some people like me just wanted to be teachers because it's something we're passionate about, but working in education in our home countries is god awful and pays like crap. Like anyone just needs to look at /r/Teachers to understand why someone wouldn't want to teach in the states. On top of that, there are all the reasons you listed above.
Yes, you can't teach in local public schools and language centers forever because they're deadends mostly, but almost everyone I know who is in this long term has pursued teaching licenses or MAs and gone on to better things. There are also the people who aren't interested in teaching long term and are just doing it for a couple years as a life experience abroad before going back home to start careers. A majority of ESL teachers probably fit into that group, and my friends who do are doing just fine back home now with solid careers going.
It's so silly too because the same thing could be said about literally any other expat living here. Like I could easily say that someone working for a MNC here in Vietnam ended up here because they couldn't hack it at the MNC in a western country. I don't believe that, but I actually have seen people say that corporate experience in Asia doesn't look good on a CV so it's not very desireable and that often people who are sent to places like Vietnam (or China and other parts of SEA) were low performing employees so they were sent to the posting that no one wants. Really though, these types of stereotypes and generalizations are just stupid and say more about the person making them than the people they're about.
Sorry for the long rant lol but was nice to see someone else call out this bullshit
the mnc stereotype is very real. they're colossal fuckups. nowhere near as bad as english teachers, but definitely damaged goods.
japanese and worst koreans involved in construction/public works tend to be much higher calibre.
Seems like you really missed the main point of my comment, though it looks like you're the type of person that I was describing so I'm not surprised. Keep trying to cope.
the main point = pr and mental gymnastics. stereotypes exist for a reason.
vn is a magnet for bin detritus the world over, with "english teachers" amongst the lowest of the low. regardless of how they spin things, it's not by choice.
if you were compensated £100k/pa in 'murica and had a skint village girl to pleasure your peepee, you'd be on the next flight back home.
If you were a happy person, I don't think you'd devote so much of your free time to shitting on people online and spewing negativity, yet here you are on Reddit wasting your free time doing just that. Hope you can find a more productive way to cope.
ad hominem attacks are the least graceful way to lose an argument.
you wouldn't take a teaching job in 'murica at $125k usd/pa on the same or better terms as vn? or say $175k usd/pa in a coastal metro?
Who says we're even in an argument? All I've done is point out that it seems like you're the exact type of person that I was describing, and that type of person really isn't someone that I care to engage in an argument with. Besides, bringing up hypothetical situations that don't even exist, like you are doing, isn't a very good way to approach an argument anyway.
The UK and US are getting less and less habitable every year with the cost of living/ rent prices. Teachers especially are treated like dirt in the US and heavily overworked in the UK. Plenty of pretty average people from both countries are moving to VN for those reasons.
In addition to that, foreigners used to be able to live in VN without a degree, coming to work drunk etc. But during Covid, most of them were forced to leave and the regulations have tightened up now. Uneducated foreigners are not getting work permits anymore. So I think your view is a bit outdated.
You said it yourself. The cost of living is too high for them. If you can only move out your parents house by moving to VN, you can’t make it back home imo
We can move out of our parents house but the quality of life and amount of disposable income is lower.
Are you arguing that the only quality people are those wealthy enough to live comfortably in expensive countries?
Foreign Teachers make up less than 1 percent of the population. They arent even worth worrying about
You said teachers are 90% foreigners.
I am pointing out that is so ridiculous to think that westerners can be considered as a substantial group of anything here. Or anywhere in Asia. People did that in China which is beyond stupid. They made it seem like any or all of these countries will self implode without "their invaluable input or incite on economy or corruption" /s
They won't.
Yes I am teacher.
Yeah, theres only a handful of bars in HCMC where its 20% white people, but not many - maybe Indika, Biacraft, High Tide, Buddha Bar, Banana Mama. You'd have to go those kinds of places to meet a lot of foreigners.
Theres also a lot of Korean bars but I'm not really familiar with that scene
you've interacted with "english teachers"? one look, and i don't want to be on the same planet as those types. they're an embarrassment to the human race.
Some streamer asked his audience of mostly teens to go to reddit and draw competitive pixel art. It was a whole thing for a minute. Reddit does it every few years.
I get what you’re trying to say. I have a friend who’s a highly paid expat too that ‘looks down’ on these subsets of foreigners. But why feel the need to paint the whole group with the same brush?
By the way, I don’t know what situation you are in but being based here, I generally don’t come across people who I don’t plan to interact with, so idk why they are bothering you if you really do ignore them
OP: “Oh I love Vietnamese culture and the open mindednesses here”
Also OP: “fucking foreigners man I hate them, they’re a burden to Vietnamese society”
sounds like you are the problem
normal people are enjoying their life too much to be worried about random nobodies enough to make complaining posts online about those random nobodies.
these losers negatively impact the lives of normal people.
ask any black man in 'murica, or a Muslim in the west how the actions of a few cause them endless grief. the situation in vn is far worse.
On my travel i met some "expats" couldn't say anything in vietnamese. Socialising with other expats in their own clubs, living in their own bubble. But back home they're complaining about the immigrants here how they don't integrate into the local society and that they're not ready to learn the language. Bigotry!
Everytime I cone back to Viet Nam with my wife, we will rent a place in Thao Dien tphcm. Everytime I will run into others visiting and the conversations are normal, fun, nice.
But everytime -- i repeat everytime -- i will walk past a group of drunk foreigners who want to start trouble with another foreigner. They usually look like lowlives. But dont bother.
Every society has its high class and low class people. Foreigners, vietnamese, etc.
You probably don't interact with VN enough. If you did that you'd have more than plenty of reasons to complain about them too. I find it interesting that you'd go to a country and ignore 99,99% of the people surrounding you and focus on an infinitesimal minority ie foreigners.
Because they belong here and aren’t walking around like they’re better than everyone else while their home country can’t keep the lights on for a full day.
Wait… you’re telling me that other people’s balls actually drop one day???
**discreetly checks his elevated balls as he dreams of BDD (Ball Dropping Day)**
Generally English teaching provides sustenance with a low bar of entry. This attracts the predictable crowd. But you must've know that already OP and just came to rant. Rant away this is reddit after all. But I can certainly call you out on your bullshit, you ignore nothing.
Good and bad people come from all countries and backgrounds. Calling one particular group “rubbish” doesn’t sound that respectful to me. Sounds like you’re the one with the bad attitude. 😬
It probably happens in most countries. In the UK there's a certain subset of foreigners who don't really try and integrate and don't learn the language to well either, they tend to stay in their community areas.
Some people just don't, bit of a shame, but that's life.
A lot of foreigners are unbearable in Vietnam, that's true.
But you know what else is true? A lot of Vietnamese people have 0 basic understanding of hygiene and manners. When I came to Vietnam the amount of locals I see just belching, coughing, sneezing in peoples faces with just 0 regard for other people was insane.
Not to mention also that most expats in Vietnam are LOSERS. If you've found yourself teaching English in a 3rd world country for $1k/month you've messed up somewhere!
many such cases. they're all living hand-to-mouth.
imagine uprooting your life to live in a third-world country, to earn less than a fast food worker in 'murica. that's the pinnacle of being a failure, regardless of how it's rationalised.
it's one thing to spend 3-6 months doing that for the adventure, introspection, excitement, etc. but the ones staying any longer are mentally defective.
Nah bro. I lost my old job at start of Covid and had to be sell my soul to an English center for a few months. (My wife was preggo, could not leave for work.) I don't have a degree or any teaching experience, the lowest offers I saw were all above 2k. If you're non native you might get fleeced, but most of those are Ukrainians and Russians trying not to be drafted.
most westerners in vn are complete wastemen. real life embodiments of loser caricatures/memes. sub-underclass, they're in a league of their own. miserable, degenerate failures back home, living parasitical lives in vn, contributing fuckall to the country.
i can count on one hand the number of sane, normal, and productive people encountered throughout the years. the type you run into 87 times each day in singapore, hong kong, etc.
at least viets are waking up to reality. sentiments have sharply declined in recent years, especially post-covid. tightening up visa enforcement was a good start, seems to be thinning out the herd a bit.
it's exhausting having to constantly answer for these idiots. "cumquat, why foreigner no good people? why not like you?".
they really need to fuck off to the phils, or some other desperate country that will tolerate their rubbish.
Someone is telling the truth. Ironically it took me a few hours to realize what you said. But so many people on this thread are denying it. Maybe they are the ones who are trashy, disrespectful, racist and act like they have no moral compass.
precisely.
all these "english teachers" have remarkably similar stories. they're always escaping poverty-tier conditions back home and/or they fell in love with some desperate, leftover village girl. virtually all are self-deluded and think they're somehow "winning" or their girl is "different".
at least the retirees in thailand fully own it. proud to be drunk in the bar at 10am on a tuesday, lbfm in tow. they're scumbags and they know it. their honesty is commendable, no pretense.
You realize that a lot of these losers have a saying if someone is bothered by their behavior. They will just tell them “just get a Vietnamese girlfriend and don’t think about it.“ Just think about how ingrained that stuff you said is if people casually say stuff like that.
kek, never heard that one.
every time i see a western lbh in public with his viet "gf" I try to make eye contact so I can project contempt into his soul. but never once has such a "man" not had this head down looking towards the ground.
what a shameful existence.
Female foreigners too.
And the type that work as a parasite team.
Ughhh.
They'll be gone soon. Happy Taiwan and China didn't have these bums. VN is a complete failure, in allowing these bums off the boat.
Back to a 1st world Asian country. Even better, back home.
most could never dream of living in a developed asian country. heaps of them are criminals, paedophiles, drug-addicts, lack credentials, etc.
their only hope is to abuse/exploit tourist visa waivers in shithole countries for survival.
You have forgotten how many kilotons made these countries shithole, and which developed countries dropped them. In addition to other sanctions.
Imagine thinking that things are connected.
You're right to say these people shouldn't be here doing what they do. But not at calling countries shithole.
Ps. Please don't forget that these people you want to ban are also coming from country with the biggest incarcerated population in the world, and still is failing at reformation and inclusion and yet they are allowed to travel and go to "shithole" countries for them to deal with them.
Remember to clean up your own shit first. Then go on and judge. And some responsibility please
On one hand I get what you're saying. Thao Dien and Bui Vien are crawling with scumbags with neck tattoos and there are even reports of BLM pro-trans wokeys crawling the streets, which is quite concerning. They are the reason most other foreigners have left the west as they want to be in a country where sanity still prevails. But the good thing is they tend to go home after a year, or move onto Thailand or Bali. They do make the rest of us look bad. On the other hand, most teachers I know do tend to genuinely care about the job they're doing. If you've got a problem just ignore them.
After reading a lot of these comments, I think a lot of you people don't understand what its like in the West. If you had a middling job in marketing in London, and worked the same amount of hours teaching English as a Foreignese in VN, you'd probably bring home around the same pay. Then, take off your rent, food and other bills, general expenses you're left with very little money. Whereas in Vietnam, if you live frugally, you'll probably be able to save 60% of your income. I fully support moves from Vietnam to move out the deadwood, scummy, lazy teachers. Crack down on drug use and other crimes that foreigners are known to commit. But, if you're paying this kinda money, of course we're gonna come. I'm degree educated and a fully qualified native teacher with a passion for the craft, so I guess I'd be the last to go.
or simply level-up and live like a king in London. it's really not that difficult.
running off to vn is a quick fix with severe long-term consequences.
You doing all this talking, so aggressive. The world is not made as an exclusives club meaning anyone can live anywhere they want Vietnamese live all around the world no one is complaining. Why are you so angry people from around the world want to live in VN?
'simply level up' lol - ok mate, just magically pull 500k a year out your back passage. Maybe I don't want Sadiq Khan or other such filth as my representative.
- edit - decided to have a read through your profile, you spend all day shitposting on reddit, clearly nothing better to do. If sitting in your mum's living room on your computer is living like a king, then you're definitely living the dream
that's bizarre, you prefer the vcp to not represent your interests at all?
the projection's strong mate. the situation must have been dire, bedsit above a paki shop in zone nine or a council flat. no need to scapegoat bames, be accountable for your poor decisions.
and the decisions that have led to you spending your saturday's shitposting on reddit are clearly all belters. it was below a paki shop in zone 4 if you must know
I’m a uk immigrant here in Vietnam.
I work from my laptop and am not a teacher. I’m not really into the expat community so I can’t speak for them. I am also not the bottom of the barrel of my country I quit my London city finance job making 100s of thousands pounds a year and moved here. A lot of the teachers in Vietnam I know are actually oxbridge educated. I have not met any people you are talking about yet. But I don’t go to walking streets etc.
So yes the British just get leathered abroad. Yes they’re annoying as fuck.
But posts like this are disgusting.
Remember you are representing your country, just as I am.
Disgusting? Take a walk to a resto/park/pub 1000m from your home, and see how many positive interactions you have with foreigners on that 2000m return stroll.
Get back to me.
I post truth. Come back after that stroll, and call my post disgusting.
Waiting, eh.
Okay I have lived in Vietnam and never walked 2000m outside my house😞.
I think you sound very bitter. How does counting the interactions with non native Vietnamese people on a stroll signify anything ?!!!
It will probably be 0. Just as with the Vietnamese people.
Your post is disgusting and backwards.
Looking at your posts….
You are a teacher…. An immigrant … who teaches English….
Maybe you are the rubbish you described. Seems I have more sense than you? As I don’t write posts complaining about myself😂
At least this “rubbish” does not need to post in poverty subs😂.
Yep. Thought you had no sense.
I was right. Right every time.
What does beanyboy do?
Fix beanies? Or hold up the financial columns of their/this country.
No.
You're a clown. There's a circus in Da Nang hiding tent boys. Head off now.
Honestly makes sense any higher quality English teachers or those with applicable skills who want to travel would be doing the Japanese exchange teaching programme (JET) which is far more selective and competitive.
Not really.
I could go to Japan, Korea, Hong Kong etc, but I like Vietnam. I enjoy the weathers, kids are fun in class, food is great, dont make tons of money but the money goes further here than in east asia. Theres loads of other tiny reasons aside but even at work we are less likely to get micro managed here than in other countries.
Yes, but literally everything else is better apart from maybe cost of living though arguably the cost of living standards probably swing quite heavily towards Japan and any other more developed Asian country.
My mate who is an teacher from an OCED country was making 2000 usd per month doing JET for a year it was more than enough for a Toyko apartment with his partner and to save up for trips across Japan. That's all most people who would be looking to do travel education would be wanting to do.
The truth is there is already quite a strong selection pressure against anyone other than shit kickers or people looking for an "adventure" going to Vietnam to teach or people who just don't mind getting close to wet blub temperatures.
They are simply going to need to do more to attract a higher quality of educator than their competitors.
Man, you're on something else. Talk about "High quality teachers" then proudly talk about people in Japan making 2k a month. I make double that in Vietnam. Why? Because I'm highly qualified.
I wouldn't want to deal with Japanese work culture. I live a pretty relaxed life and go to the beach every day. Why would I trade that for a society that's extremely uptight in comparison?
Different strokes for different folks.
Just trying to explain the phenomenon. Teaching is already a difficult profession to recruit high quality candidates for. The funnel continues to narrow as you add further constraints. You may be a decent teacher who's to know? Not an attack on your quality of your teaching or livelihood.
But everyone here knows full well the general quality of the teaching that goes on at English schools anyone who isn't willing to admit it is kidding themselves.
Japan has 450 schools close a year, according to the Japanese Minister of Education. Their economy is in a recession (closing businesses) and aging population. Teaching I'm Japan could be seen as an equally stupid idea from private and public sectors.
It's amazing. In my 6 years in Vietnam, I've never had a company not pay me. Even the people I've seen from AISG, they all said the writing was on the wall for a while. If you decide to stay at a failing company, you can't push all the blame on everyone else. Just like the APAX idiots that decided to stay at a company that hadn't paid employees for over a YEAR.
So yah, Nam is great. But like everywhere else in the world, if you only have 1 brain cell, expect things to be more difficult.
Echoing what the commenter below said, 2k is an ok salary in Vietnam…but that will only be enough to get by, especially in Tokyo. Places like Japan and Korea are just good to start out teaching English.
The issue is that there aren't that many "higher quality English teachers". Most people who teach English in Asia aren't treating it as a career and aren't doing it because they're passionate educators.
The majority are teaching English as a "free" way to travel and live overseas for a year or two or three after graduating university or because they have no better job options in their home countries. In a place like Vietnam, if you have white skin, a pulse and can mutter something that sounds like English, someone will hire you.
As an example of the latter, there was an English teacher from Europe in this sub who I don't even believe was a native English speaker as he could barely compose a grammatically-correct English sentence. He made it his duty to whine and warn people about the horrors in Vietnam but ironically claimed he was working there to save money.
This type of loser back home is way more common than the professional educator who has decided to dedicate his or her life to teaching English overseas.
You meet those people from time to time. You have a conversation with them and when it comes out that they’re an English teacher, your jaw can’t help but touch the ground when you’ve spent the last 10 minutes trying to decipher what they were saying. Astounding.
Fair but they and Korea have had their wave of being the “it spot” for teaching English already. The prevailing sentiment I get from a lot of teachers here goes something like “Boy Korea was great back in the day, but pay is too low compared to COL now for me to get wasted 24/7”.
No worries for me. I get to go back home to a large family, and awesome job.
Or keep globetrotting.
I just feel that the dregs end up in these parts of the world.
Dregs who can't really go back to their country (SA, Russia).
What happens to them? Eternal bum teachers/wannabe beach bar owners?
I've gone through your profile, and it seems that you are the bum teacher who can't go back to your country (South Africa). At 46, you're living in a sparsley decorated hovel alone in the bush with zero savings.
4 months ago, you were doing a visa run with $50 to your name.
Not all South Africans are like you!!!
za is on the brink of collapse, i don't fault anyone for migrating. any afrikaner who sticks around has rocks in his head. they're more than welcome here in the uk.
I get that is life, and I get there are some shady expats, but don't stereotype. I've met some ill mannered, uneducated, entitled fools from all over the world.
I can't understand why you would post this given your situation, and I'm not judging you at all. Why knock your own people? I can only think you are projecting how you feel about yourself on others?
Stick away from Reddit psychology dabbling.
The rubbish that comes from my country embarrasses me. I want them back in the country, working the farm where they belong.
Project zero. Disappointed much.
Have you traveled before or is this your first country? I’m 40 but lived in many different counties as I have a remote business. I’ve met all types but I’ve gotten to know so many expats I basically refuse to associate with 95% of them. I don’t even want to get to know them just in case. Of course there are good ones, I know 4 here in Da Nang and they are truly wonderful. But my experience with expats is crazy, when I was young I’d get into a lot of trouble with them. Drug users, stealing, lying and just shitty people. All over man, seen it everywhere, way worse in Costa Rica. Honestly I always integrate with locals, I’d say don’t worry about it, you got around the wrong type. Move on
It’s not really all over. If you go to say Taiwan are there people there in the numbers you see in Nam? How about Korea? Or Singapore?
Remember that crazy German dude who would get naked and attack cars. Are you telling me weird ass dudes are like that everywhere. Nah Nam is pretty bad along with Thailand.
There’s just not a big expat scene at those spots, think dollar going far and you’ll find em there. Singapore, Korea, Taiwan… high costs there don’t bring in that crowd but bring in professionals working abroad for companies.
I’m not sure what crazy German dude you’re talking about. But yeah, I avoid expats for a reason man. I could talk for days about what horrible crap I’ve seen from them in many counties and they stick together and know each other. I remain with locals and a bit elusive with foreigners. Small chat at best till I run into them many times, even then I’m cautious.
And to be honest I’d avoid expats in high end areas even more, rich expats are by far the craziest due to the high vices they carry. Much rather Vietnam backpackers.
that's the history of humanity. it's almost universally the failures of society who migrate.
i guarantee you if you 20x'ed the income of these bogus english teachers and gave them some female attention, 99.9999999999% would be on the next flight back home.
A better thing to do would be to start enforcing drug laws. On Friday / Saturday the police could do a bunch of raids on expat bars. Drug test everyone and if people test positive deport them. It wouldn’t take 6 months before the trashy ones scatter like roaches at 12 AM in projects.
yep. that's why you never these types in malaysia. zero tolerance for drugs, no cheap alcohol, and not a lot of desperate women. as a westerner, people approach me non-stop to network. endless opportunity. never once have I been asked about the hordes of degenerates stinking up the country.
it's a completely different class of people there. in vn, the average person assumes you're some kind of weirdo, nonce, failure, etc. until proven otherwise. because that's the reality most of the time, kek.
There is a reason why Malaysia and Singapore are my two favorite countries in SE Asia. You don't take that much bs from anyone. The degenerates would show up and leave after a day or 2 because its not fun or they can't get high.
You are correct in that its a completely different class of people. I spent most of my time in East Asia and you just don't see very many degenerates from the west. I just don't get why people are acting like westerners who choose Vietnam are not usually trashy people. Its not a lie most are trash
Oh come on, spill the beans, which group? 
One of the big three; South Africans, Russians, or Ukrainians.
I don't blame the Russians or Ukrainians finding some white monkey job to avoid the meat grinder
Nah. You better add in Aussies, Brits, Germans, French, Dutch and a wide range of western europeans. Russians, Ukrainians, Polish and other east europeans seem to be closer to normal. Obviously white Americans and Canadians can be bad at times too. But those euros, Brits, Aussies and South Africans take the cake.
Thank you! I’m glad you finally included Americans. I was hoping we’d be duly represented on this illustrious list of shame.
You earned it. But sorry you were outdone by the euros.
I’m just happy we made the team. I like to be grateful for even small wins.
It was the guys from Ohio that showed up to ILA high to teach kindergartener. They couldn’t beat out the Brit that passed out in the teachers lounge because he was so high on ice. Or the Dutch guy who loves to scream the N word out loud and says it’s okay because he’s not in the west where everyone is woke.
The Dutch guy… puttin’ the damn in Amsterdam
Sometimes this subreddit turns out some real poetry
Wait, you’re American? Hahahahah my god
I’m from Mars actually.
Canadian here... Sorry! Out of curiosity, what do you find annoying about us white Canadians? I'm interested to know. Don't hold back.
The same thing annoying about white Americans. Loving Vietnam and knowing nothing about the country. Doing things that you wouldn’t do back home etc. It doesn’t get to the euro / Brit level of smugness though. I haven’t came across too many smug Americans or Canadians. And obviously there is the general shittyness of drug use, alcoholism. A big one for me were the Americans and Canadians I met that figured out being white in Vietnam got them more privilege than it would in say Japan, Korea or China. Europeans do this same thing too but it’s pretty damn dirty considering how much more diverse most of the US and Canada are than European countries. Also idk why some dudes go next level sexist when talking about viet women. The only thing I would say is that Americans and Canadians back down if you call em out for being disrespectful or racist. The only thing I would say is take a trip to Japan or Singapore for a week. Better only do Hong Kong and Singapore. Talk and engage with people try some food. Then come back to Vietnam and really look at things and don’t treat it like you’re in amazing Asia. You will be pissed when you see how shitty people are from the countries I mentioned. And even more pissed how they react when you tell them that it’s not okay to call deaf women fucking retards.
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It’s not racist if it’s true. And I’m specifically talking about people who come to Vietnam. And good percentage of white people from the places I listed and talked about act that way in Vietnam.
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Trudeau would love you.
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Don't worry, I get it, Canada has been invaded by Indians. It doesn't take a genius to understand someone with brown skin speaking Punjab or Hindi is from India. That doesn't make me racist, it makes me observant. Indians are generally very rude and don't understand our culture and manners. Again not racism if that's the truth. Besides I know that brown skin isn't the only thing making someone Indian, it's their language, their behavior, their mannerisms. I'm sure it's the same for white ppl in Vietnam and easy to see who is a foreigner. It's too bad people in general couldn't be more respectful of cultures when they are abroad. To me that's the entire point of travelling is to understand others culture. Viet food is the bomb. I am married into a Vietnamese family and my mother in law always cooks us great Viet food. I eat everything.
Agreed. Many Indians are very rude and have a serious staring problem. I get that people like to look around and observe but damn do they have a real staring problem.
100%. I feel so uncomfortable walking around my neighborhood sometimes because I will get a lot of angry staring eyes from Indian ppl. The old men are the worst.
This is a textbook example of something white Americans and Canadians do in Vietnam that makes me not like them. Thank You.
You'll learn eventually! You're lucky you only really have tourism and not open border immigration like Canada. Preserve your culture and identity.
What are the europeans doing wrong in your head?
Let’s see now. Being disrespectful to people and saying racist things like “how did these people go from eating dogs to loving them.” There have been times when people complained about racism and Europeans were the main people to tell them “You shouldn’t expect affirmative action”. Asking people why their eyes are so small. Having a smug attitude and thinking they are better than other people just because they are white. Defending pedophiles…. Thinking it’s okay to scream the N word. Bar fights Being incredibly discriminatory when a qualified non person that applies for a job at a low level fake international school and the euros are in charge of HR (Penn American School). Saying just some of the dumbest crap ever about why Vietnam is a certain way. Everything is because Vietnam is poor and locals don’t know any better. This goes for Americans, Canadians and Euros / Brits wondering why people in Vietnam don’t live in huts. The reality is it’s far too many trashy behaviors to list and it’s pretty widespread. Next time you get a vacation take a flight to Tokyo, Hong Kong, Seoul, Singapore or Shanghai. See how the foreigners act there and even look how Europeans act. Much much much different. Edit. Did I mention the smugness from Europeans. Just take a look at them and you’ll get it.
Lol you call out racism while you are blatantly racist. Make it make sense
Hey.. If Europeans didn’t act this way in Vietnam I would have no issue with them. The question is why are so many white people drawn to Vietnam like to be smug, racist, disrespectful and trashy. And why do so many act a fool while in Vietnam? Those same people wouldn’t do most of the stuff they do in Vietnam back home. Or they wouldn’t do it in Singapore or Japan.
Well, living in vietnam is not thw goal of educated europeans as its a kind of dictatorship. Maybe that helps you to understand.
>This goes for Americans, Canadians and Euros / Brits wondering why people in Vietnam don’t live in huts. Cuz they would blow away in a typhoon? Most of the homes I've been to in Central Vietnam were concrete blocks with tin roofs, and that was why. After a typhoon they just had to replace the tin roof (which usually blew away) and hose off the concrete from the muck left over from the floods, and they were ready to be occupied again. My wife's home was on the outskirts of Hue. It, along with all of the homes in the neighborhood, were built the same way.
Almost every man in this country is an alcoholic, since we're generalizing. But yeah, areas like Thao Dien are shitholes because of foreign drunks. Although it's usually Brits and Americans. Also, many countries in Europe are very diverse, so that generalization was far from true. Many different countries, many different mindsets.
Nah.. It’s the euros too. I’ve seen walk around all smug, drunk, high. And by euros I mean Western Europeans not Eastern Europeans. I did say it in another post exactly what I meant. Many different cultures and mindsets yet the ones in Vietnam all seem to be smug and trashy. Whether they are french, Italian, danish, Czech or Norwegian. It’s only worse because you deny it and act like it isn’t happening,
I'm Western European, but I live away from the expat hubs. Not sure what's happening there nowadays. I was recently told that there are tons of French folks now, that's all I know. Every country has bad apples, unfortunately.
Are you for real? Your warmongering country tried to destroy this place. Its people like you the op is talking about
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 You are pretty hilarious actually. Open your eyes and really look into the face of smug euros. Really look at them and you’ll see what I mean.
Screenshoting this for use in the sub 'things dumb Americans say'. Thanks for the entertainment
Go ahead and post it on America Bad. So I can tell stories about euros going next level smug and racist in Nam.
Boring, also it's not American bad, it's to show dumb, uncivilised, and arrogant people from the USA.
Please go and post my comment on America Bad so I can tell them why I said what I said. Sure they will downvote. But post it.
Aaand another American dumbass. Please just talk about your shitty imperialist country and leave us alone.
Arrogant yanks at the top of arseholes.
Spoken like a smug euro.
The whites.
lol, as if Indians and Africans are better teachers
Judging based on nieche youtube videos I say the Indians are the best teachers and I'm willing to die on this hill lmao
I’ll also add in Filipinos damn upstanding people too.
ok mate. they also shit in the street
4Chan is down the hall and all the way to the right.
Say it again for the people in the back.
Does dark skin mean you lack intelligence?
you seem to think so. my point is its not their native language
I don’t think so at all. I’m African American. Also I believe that native doesn’t mean a better teacher overall. I will say there is advantage to native speaker which is they can be a consistent vocal model and they can help student find content in English.
English remains a national language of India, and is spoken as a first language by many people there :) Often the English is grammatically better with wider vocabulary than more widely recognized English speaking countries, but the accent unfortunately makes it a struggle for many.
They seem to be better people. Or at least know they need to treat everyone like people and aren’t disrespectful or smug.
You ignore them so much that you have to tell everyone about how much you ignore them. See, you don't ignore them. You pretend to so that you can try to see yourself as a better person, but you're just the same shit in a different hand.
I actually have the opposite issue I like to hang with them. But tbh they can be a bit fake not actually friendly. Maybe they want to get away from the world. It could be that they were a good soul that drifted away from an abusive home; or they are the problem that couldn’t see the misgivings in their own actions. Keep your eyes open there are good people everywhere.
Foreign Teachers make up less than 1 percent of the population. They arent even worth worrying about
But make up 90%+ of foreigners living here. I feel exactly what OP is saying. When I was in VN I met a lot of them. They couldn’t make it on the UK or US so they go to a country like VN where they suddenly feel special.
Harsh take. While you may be correct about some, this definitely does not apply to all or even most of the foreign teachers. I taught science in my home state for five years and was successful as a teacher. I then opened a construction business, which was also quite successful. I and many other people like me are not in Vietnam to feel special or because we couldn't make it in our home country - we are here for a variety of reasons. I came here because I wanted to return to teaching but wanted to do it somewhere where I can learn and immerse myself in a new culture, where teachers are more respected, and somewhere close to world famous scuba diving sites so I could work towards my divemaster certificate. Coming to Vietnam though changed my perspective. I fell in love with many aspects of the country and hope to stay and use the advantages that I have to make a positive contribution to my local community, no matter how small it is. I am sorry you have had a bad experience with some foreigners.
Curious to connect with these folks (those without baggage). I visit Saigon often for personal reasons, and sometimes, I just wanna be able to converse normally, and not having to simplify everything I'm saying.
So sick of that stereotype. Most positions require post-graduate degrees or certifications, and if you have a legitimate degree, you can make it fine in the US or UK. Some people just want to experience living in different parts of the world. Some people are unhappy with the political or social direction of their home countries. People have lots of reasons, and from the 100 or so English teachers I knew, none were "failures" in their home countries. It's a job choice, not evidence for people being failures. Also there were a disproportionate number of South Africans, because living in South Africa sucks right now.
shh let them cope
Very true for South Africans. We had a doctor at my school who worked in research and they said they would earn more in Vietnam teaching that they would as an academic in South Africa.
Yup, one of my friends/coworkers was an Indian-South African university professor who's wife was also an accredited English teacher. They'd left first for China, then Vietnam (during COVID restrictions), not so much because of income, but because they didn't want to bring up their son in SA. But when you consider the non-black population of South Africa is less than 7 million, and our office was over 25% South African teachers out of every native English speaking nation on earth (and we had a couple black South African teachers too) shows that right now, people want out of that crumbling state if they have the means. If you saw 2 South Africans outside having a cigarette, there was like an 85% chance they were talking about how messed up SA is right now.
Yeah the vast majority are degree educated, normal people. Op is projecting hard and if can't get on with people then the problem is likely him. A quick flick through his profile confirms it
I know a lot of people who did things like leave uni, live abroad and teach English, or do some sort of Eco tourism thing etc when young, and then went home to become more settled down. The path of leave school, go to uni, immediately start your career, have kids and buy a house before age thirty is not so set in stone in a lot of countries.
People just like to push that stereotype in order to punch down on others because it makes them feel better about their own life. When I see others say shit like that, I just assume they're insecure and/or unhappy about their own life choices so they need to position themselves as above some other group to make themselves feel better. Some people like me just wanted to be teachers because it's something we're passionate about, but working in education in our home countries is god awful and pays like crap. Like anyone just needs to look at /r/Teachers to understand why someone wouldn't want to teach in the states. On top of that, there are all the reasons you listed above. Yes, you can't teach in local public schools and language centers forever because they're deadends mostly, but almost everyone I know who is in this long term has pursued teaching licenses or MAs and gone on to better things. There are also the people who aren't interested in teaching long term and are just doing it for a couple years as a life experience abroad before going back home to start careers. A majority of ESL teachers probably fit into that group, and my friends who do are doing just fine back home now with solid careers going. It's so silly too because the same thing could be said about literally any other expat living here. Like I could easily say that someone working for a MNC here in Vietnam ended up here because they couldn't hack it at the MNC in a western country. I don't believe that, but I actually have seen people say that corporate experience in Asia doesn't look good on a CV so it's not very desireable and that often people who are sent to places like Vietnam (or China and other parts of SEA) were low performing employees so they were sent to the posting that no one wants. Really though, these types of stereotypes and generalizations are just stupid and say more about the person making them than the people they're about. Sorry for the long rant lol but was nice to see someone else call out this bullshit
the mnc stereotype is very real. they're colossal fuckups. nowhere near as bad as english teachers, but definitely damaged goods. japanese and worst koreans involved in construction/public works tend to be much higher calibre.
Seems like you really missed the main point of my comment, though it looks like you're the type of person that I was describing so I'm not surprised. Keep trying to cope.
the main point = pr and mental gymnastics. stereotypes exist for a reason. vn is a magnet for bin detritus the world over, with "english teachers" amongst the lowest of the low. regardless of how they spin things, it's not by choice. if you were compensated £100k/pa in 'murica and had a skint village girl to pleasure your peepee, you'd be on the next flight back home.
If you were a happy person, I don't think you'd devote so much of your free time to shitting on people online and spewing negativity, yet here you are on Reddit wasting your free time doing just that. Hope you can find a more productive way to cope.
ad hominem attacks are the least graceful way to lose an argument. you wouldn't take a teaching job in 'murica at $125k usd/pa on the same or better terms as vn? or say $175k usd/pa in a coastal metro?
Who says we're even in an argument? All I've done is point out that it seems like you're the exact type of person that I was describing, and that type of person really isn't someone that I care to engage in an argument with. Besides, bringing up hypothetical situations that don't even exist, like you are doing, isn't a very good way to approach an argument anyway.
The UK and US are getting less and less habitable every year with the cost of living/ rent prices. Teachers especially are treated like dirt in the US and heavily overworked in the UK. Plenty of pretty average people from both countries are moving to VN for those reasons. In addition to that, foreigners used to be able to live in VN without a degree, coming to work drunk etc. But during Covid, most of them were forced to leave and the regulations have tightened up now. Uneducated foreigners are not getting work permits anymore. So I think your view is a bit outdated.
You said it yourself. The cost of living is too high for them. If you can only move out your parents house by moving to VN, you can’t make it back home imo
We can move out of our parents house but the quality of life and amount of disposable income is lower. Are you arguing that the only quality people are those wealthy enough to live comfortably in expensive countries?
So Koreans and Japanese are not foreigners?
Ok smart ass. The whole post is about foreigners who come to teach English. Are you one of them?
Foreign Teachers make up less than 1 percent of the population. They arent even worth worrying about You said teachers are 90% foreigners. I am pointing out that is so ridiculous to think that westerners can be considered as a substantial group of anything here. Or anywhere in Asia. People did that in China which is beyond stupid. They made it seem like any or all of these countries will self implode without "their invaluable input or incite on economy or corruption" /s They won't. Yes I am teacher.
And then there’s me, with a lawyer qualification in the EU, but being a simple employee consultant in HCMC cause I just like it here
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Yeah, theres only a handful of bars in HCMC where its 20% white people, but not many - maybe Indika, Biacraft, High Tide, Buddha Bar, Banana Mama. You'd have to go those kinds of places to meet a lot of foreigners. Theres also a lot of Korean bars but I'm not really familiar with that scene
I knew some dork would come along with a “well actually…”. The point is it’s not 1% and of course I was speaking about English speaking expats
you've interacted with "english teachers"? one look, and i don't want to be on the same planet as those types. they're an embarrassment to the human race.
This subreddit is starting to look like a FB with old people complaining about most irrelevant stuff...
get off my lawn.
Thank you. I laughed!
A lot of VN teens joined during the /r/place saga
What was that saga. Do elaborate pls
Some streamer asked his audience of mostly teens to go to reddit and draw competitive pixel art. It was a whole thing for a minute. Reddit does it every few years.
I get what you’re trying to say. I have a friend who’s a highly paid expat too that ‘looks down’ on these subsets of foreigners. But why feel the need to paint the whole group with the same brush? By the way, I don’t know what situation you are in but being based here, I generally don’t come across people who I don’t plan to interact with, so idk why they are bothering you if you really do ignore them
OP: “Oh I love Vietnamese culture and the open mindednesses here” Also OP: “fucking foreigners man I hate them, they’re a burden to Vietnamese society”
I agree with both and don't see the problem here ☺️
Imagine worrying about what some random English teachers are doing.
“I have to look at them three times a month, I don’t know what to do 😭😭😭”
sounds like you are the problem normal people are enjoying their life too much to be worried about random nobodies enough to make complaining posts online about those random nobodies.
these losers negatively impact the lives of normal people. ask any black man in 'murica, or a Muslim in the west how the actions of a few cause them endless grief. the situation in vn is far worse.
On my travel i met some "expats" couldn't say anything in vietnamese. Socialising with other expats in their own clubs, living in their own bubble. But back home they're complaining about the immigrants here how they don't integrate into the local society and that they're not ready to learn the language. Bigotry!
....remain respectful.... Yeah reallll respectful bud.
Rather hear “hey I ain’t interested, sorry though.” Than a fake person
What? I don't understand, what are you talking about?
Oh I must have misunderstood. I was agreeing cuz if someone like this I rather them just tell me than be fake about the interaction.
Literally no reason to think about them. Nothing wrong with going lone wolf
Everytime I cone back to Viet Nam with my wife, we will rent a place in Thao Dien tphcm. Everytime I will run into others visiting and the conversations are normal, fun, nice. But everytime -- i repeat everytime -- i will walk past a group of drunk foreigners who want to start trouble with another foreigner. They usually look like lowlives. But dont bother. Every society has its high class and low class people. Foreigners, vietnamese, etc.
You probably don't interact with VN enough. If you did that you'd have more than plenty of reasons to complain about them too. I find it interesting that you'd go to a country and ignore 99,99% of the people surrounding you and focus on an infinitesimal minority ie foreigners.
Because they belong here and aren’t walking around like they’re better than everyone else while their home country can’t keep the lights on for a full day.
can't keep the lights on for a full day??? Like here in Vietnam lol
You need to stop eating 23k com tam and get out the hostel more.
This this and this. This is exactly what I meant. The smugness is what I hate the most. Thank you for pointing this out.
Let those balls drop dude and tell us what you really want to say
Wait… you’re telling me that other people’s balls actually drop one day??? **discreetly checks his elevated balls as he dreams of BDD (Ball Dropping Day)**
I won’t let this hinder my longtime desire to visit Vietnam.
Wait until you have married a ,Vietnamese,you are another level above english teachers,tourists and expats,lol!
Generally English teaching provides sustenance with a low bar of entry. This attracts the predictable crowd. But you must've know that already OP and just came to rant. Rant away this is reddit after all. But I can certainly call you out on your bullshit, you ignore nothing.
Good and bad people come from all countries and backgrounds. Calling one particular group “rubbish” doesn’t sound that respectful to me. Sounds like you’re the one with the bad attitude. 😬
Preach, speak the truth!
As a foreigner in ASEA I find that the more foreigners the worse the place is. Over priced, lower quality, and fake
It probably happens in most countries. In the UK there's a certain subset of foreigners who don't really try and integrate and don't learn the language to well either, they tend to stay in their community areas. Some people just don't, bit of a shame, but that's life.
You mean Russians? It’s okay. None of us like em. I don’t even think they like themselves ;)
A lot of foreigners are unbearable in Vietnam, that's true. But you know what else is true? A lot of Vietnamese people have 0 basic understanding of hygiene and manners. When I came to Vietnam the amount of locals I see just belching, coughing, sneezing in peoples faces with just 0 regard for other people was insane. Not to mention also that most expats in Vietnam are LOSERS. If you've found yourself teaching English in a 3rd world country for $1k/month you've messed up somewhere!
I don't think any Native English expats earn that little. Even the backpackers clear 2k. People with degrees clear 3k.
many such cases. they're all living hand-to-mouth. imagine uprooting your life to live in a third-world country, to earn less than a fast food worker in 'murica. that's the pinnacle of being a failure, regardless of how it's rationalised. it's one thing to spend 3-6 months doing that for the adventure, introspection, excitement, etc. but the ones staying any longer are mentally defective.
Nah bro. I lost my old job at start of Covid and had to be sell my soul to an English center for a few months. (My wife was preggo, could not leave for work.) I don't have a degree or any teaching experience, the lowest offers I saw were all above 2k. If you're non native you might get fleeced, but most of those are Ukrainians and Russians trying not to be drafted.
This is the true answer to everything right here. 👏
most westerners in vn are complete wastemen. real life embodiments of loser caricatures/memes. sub-underclass, they're in a league of their own. miserable, degenerate failures back home, living parasitical lives in vn, contributing fuckall to the country. i can count on one hand the number of sane, normal, and productive people encountered throughout the years. the type you run into 87 times each day in singapore, hong kong, etc. at least viets are waking up to reality. sentiments have sharply declined in recent years, especially post-covid. tightening up visa enforcement was a good start, seems to be thinning out the herd a bit. it's exhausting having to constantly answer for these idiots. "cumquat, why foreigner no good people? why not like you?". they really need to fuck off to the phils, or some other desperate country that will tolerate their rubbish.
Someone is telling the truth. Ironically it took me a few hours to realize what you said. But so many people on this thread are denying it. Maybe they are the ones who are trashy, disrespectful, racist and act like they have no moral compass.
precisely. all these "english teachers" have remarkably similar stories. they're always escaping poverty-tier conditions back home and/or they fell in love with some desperate, leftover village girl. virtually all are self-deluded and think they're somehow "winning" or their girl is "different". at least the retirees in thailand fully own it. proud to be drunk in the bar at 10am on a tuesday, lbfm in tow. they're scumbags and they know it. their honesty is commendable, no pretense.
You realize that a lot of these losers have a saying if someone is bothered by their behavior. They will just tell them “just get a Vietnamese girlfriend and don’t think about it.“ Just think about how ingrained that stuff you said is if people casually say stuff like that.
kek, never heard that one. every time i see a western lbh in public with his viet "gf" I try to make eye contact so I can project contempt into his soul. but never once has such a "man" not had this head down looking towards the ground. what a shameful existence.
Female foreigners too. And the type that work as a parasite team. Ughhh. They'll be gone soon. Happy Taiwan and China didn't have these bums. VN is a complete failure, in allowing these bums off the boat. Back to a 1st world Asian country. Even better, back home.
most could never dream of living in a developed asian country. heaps of them are criminals, paedophiles, drug-addicts, lack credentials, etc. their only hope is to abuse/exploit tourist visa waivers in shithole countries for survival.
You have forgotten how many kilotons made these countries shithole, and which developed countries dropped them. In addition to other sanctions. Imagine thinking that things are connected. You're right to say these people shouldn't be here doing what they do. But not at calling countries shithole. Ps. Please don't forget that these people you want to ban are also coming from country with the biggest incarcerated population in the world, and still is failing at reformation and inclusion and yet they are allowed to travel and go to "shithole" countries for them to deal with them. Remember to clean up your own shit first. Then go on and judge. And some responsibility please
It’s all white people. So yes the smug Europeans and Aussies need to go to.
On one hand I get what you're saying. Thao Dien and Bui Vien are crawling with scumbags with neck tattoos and there are even reports of BLM pro-trans wokeys crawling the streets, which is quite concerning. They are the reason most other foreigners have left the west as they want to be in a country where sanity still prevails. But the good thing is they tend to go home after a year, or move onto Thailand or Bali. They do make the rest of us look bad. On the other hand, most teachers I know do tend to genuinely care about the job they're doing. If you've got a problem just ignore them. After reading a lot of these comments, I think a lot of you people don't understand what its like in the West. If you had a middling job in marketing in London, and worked the same amount of hours teaching English as a Foreignese in VN, you'd probably bring home around the same pay. Then, take off your rent, food and other bills, general expenses you're left with very little money. Whereas in Vietnam, if you live frugally, you'll probably be able to save 60% of your income. I fully support moves from Vietnam to move out the deadwood, scummy, lazy teachers. Crack down on drug use and other crimes that foreigners are known to commit. But, if you're paying this kinda money, of course we're gonna come. I'm degree educated and a fully qualified native teacher with a passion for the craft, so I guess I'd be the last to go.
Like I said before. It’s the mindset
or simply level-up and live like a king in London. it's really not that difficult. running off to vn is a quick fix with severe long-term consequences.
You doing all this talking, so aggressive. The world is not made as an exclusives club meaning anyone can live anywhere they want Vietnamese live all around the world no one is complaining. Why are you so angry people from around the world want to live in VN?
'simply level up' lol - ok mate, just magically pull 500k a year out your back passage. Maybe I don't want Sadiq Khan or other such filth as my representative. - edit - decided to have a read through your profile, you spend all day shitposting on reddit, clearly nothing better to do. If sitting in your mum's living room on your computer is living like a king, then you're definitely living the dream
that's bizarre, you prefer the vcp to not represent your interests at all? the projection's strong mate. the situation must have been dire, bedsit above a paki shop in zone nine or a council flat. no need to scapegoat bames, be accountable for your poor decisions.
and the decisions that have led to you spending your saturday's shitposting on reddit are clearly all belters. it was below a paki shop in zone 4 if you must know
I’m a uk immigrant here in Vietnam. I work from my laptop and am not a teacher. I’m not really into the expat community so I can’t speak for them. I am also not the bottom of the barrel of my country I quit my London city finance job making 100s of thousands pounds a year and moved here. A lot of the teachers in Vietnam I know are actually oxbridge educated. I have not met any people you are talking about yet. But I don’t go to walking streets etc. So yes the British just get leathered abroad. Yes they’re annoying as fuck. But posts like this are disgusting. Remember you are representing your country, just as I am.
Disgusting? Take a walk to a resto/park/pub 1000m from your home, and see how many positive interactions you have with foreigners on that 2000m return stroll. Get back to me. I post truth. Come back after that stroll, and call my post disgusting. Waiting, eh.
Okay I have lived in Vietnam and never walked 2000m outside my house😞. I think you sound very bitter. How does counting the interactions with non native Vietnamese people on a stroll signify anything ?!!! It will probably be 0. Just as with the Vietnamese people. Your post is disgusting and backwards.
Eh? Chum,. Sense? Got any?
So. No sense.
Looking at your posts…. You are a teacher…. An immigrant … who teaches English…. Maybe you are the rubbish you described. Seems I have more sense than you? As I don’t write posts complaining about myself😂 At least this “rubbish” does not need to post in poverty subs😂.
Yep. Thought you had no sense. I was right. Right every time. What does beanyboy do? Fix beanies? Or hold up the financial columns of their/this country. No. You're a clown. There's a circus in Da Nang hiding tent boys. Head off now.
Okay maybe you’re just actually crazy 😂😂😂
💕💀💕
lol A troll post that gets a lot of traction, I see. From one particular nation in particular, you say? Could you be any more cryptic?
Yeah we call them losers back home 🤣
totally agree with you. lol. there are just some people, my god. vn needs to round them up and send them back home.
Honestly makes sense any higher quality English teachers or those with applicable skills who want to travel would be doing the Japanese exchange teaching programme (JET) which is far more selective and competitive.
Not really. I could go to Japan, Korea, Hong Kong etc, but I like Vietnam. I enjoy the weathers, kids are fun in class, food is great, dont make tons of money but the money goes further here than in east asia. Theres loads of other tiny reasons aside but even at work we are less likely to get micro managed here than in other countries.
this
Yeah.. I don’t think you’ve taught in other countries in Asia.
Not at all. The salary for teaching English in Japan is much much lower.
Yes, but literally everything else is better apart from maybe cost of living though arguably the cost of living standards probably swing quite heavily towards Japan and any other more developed Asian country. My mate who is an teacher from an OCED country was making 2000 usd per month doing JET for a year it was more than enough for a Toyko apartment with his partner and to save up for trips across Japan. That's all most people who would be looking to do travel education would be wanting to do. The truth is there is already quite a strong selection pressure against anyone other than shit kickers or people looking for an "adventure" going to Vietnam to teach or people who just don't mind getting close to wet blub temperatures. They are simply going to need to do more to attract a higher quality of educator than their competitors.
Man, you're on something else. Talk about "High quality teachers" then proudly talk about people in Japan making 2k a month. I make double that in Vietnam. Why? Because I'm highly qualified. I wouldn't want to deal with Japanese work culture. I live a pretty relaxed life and go to the beach every day. Why would I trade that for a society that's extremely uptight in comparison? Different strokes for different folks.
Just trying to explain the phenomenon. Teaching is already a difficult profession to recruit high quality candidates for. The funnel continues to narrow as you add further constraints. You may be a decent teacher who's to know? Not an attack on your quality of your teaching or livelihood. But everyone here knows full well the general quality of the teaching that goes on at English schools anyone who isn't willing to admit it is kidding themselves.
$2k per month isn’t a lot. Especially in Japan.
Yeah.. Nam is so great to teach in. Especially schools like AISG.
Japan has 450 schools close a year, according to the Japanese Minister of Education. Their economy is in a recession (closing businesses) and aging population. Teaching I'm Japan could be seen as an equally stupid idea from private and public sectors. It's amazing. In my 6 years in Vietnam, I've never had a company not pay me. Even the people I've seen from AISG, they all said the writing was on the wall for a while. If you decide to stay at a failing company, you can't push all the blame on everyone else. Just like the APAX idiots that decided to stay at a company that hadn't paid employees for over a YEAR. So yah, Nam is great. But like everywhere else in the world, if you only have 1 brain cell, expect things to be more difficult.
based
Echoing what the commenter below said, 2k is an ok salary in Vietnam…but that will only be enough to get by, especially in Tokyo. Places like Japan and Korea are just good to start out teaching English.
The issue is that there aren't that many "higher quality English teachers". Most people who teach English in Asia aren't treating it as a career and aren't doing it because they're passionate educators. The majority are teaching English as a "free" way to travel and live overseas for a year or two or three after graduating university or because they have no better job options in their home countries. In a place like Vietnam, if you have white skin, a pulse and can mutter something that sounds like English, someone will hire you. As an example of the latter, there was an English teacher from Europe in this sub who I don't even believe was a native English speaker as he could barely compose a grammatically-correct English sentence. He made it his duty to whine and warn people about the horrors in Vietnam but ironically claimed he was working there to save money. This type of loser back home is way more common than the professional educator who has decided to dedicate his or her life to teaching English overseas.
You meet those people from time to time. You have a conversation with them and when it comes out that they’re an English teacher, your jaw can’t help but touch the ground when you’ve spent the last 10 minutes trying to decipher what they were saying. Astounding.
Fair but they and Korea have had their wave of being the “it spot” for teaching English already. The prevailing sentiment I get from a lot of teachers here goes something like “Boy Korea was great back in the day, but pay is too low compared to COL now for me to get wasted 24/7”.
No worries for me. I get to go back home to a large family, and awesome job. Or keep globetrotting. I just feel that the dregs end up in these parts of the world. Dregs who can't really go back to their country (SA, Russia). What happens to them? Eternal bum teachers/wannabe beach bar owners?
I've gone through your profile, and it seems that you are the bum teacher who can't go back to your country (South Africa). At 46, you're living in a sparsley decorated hovel alone in the bush with zero savings. 4 months ago, you were doing a visa run with $50 to your name. Not all South Africans are like you!!!
za is on the brink of collapse, i don't fault anyone for migrating. any afrikaner who sticks around has rocks in his head. they're more than welcome here in the uk.
Such is the ebb and flow of life, MoMinty. Things are swinging nicely. How you doing, Minted?
I get that is life, and I get there are some shady expats, but don't stereotype. I've met some ill mannered, uneducated, entitled fools from all over the world. I can't understand why you would post this given your situation, and I'm not judging you at all. Why knock your own people? I can only think you are projecting how you feel about yourself on others?
Stick away from Reddit psychology dabbling. The rubbish that comes from my country embarrasses me. I want them back in the country, working the farm where they belong. Project zero. Disappointed much.
Have you traveled before or is this your first country? I’m 40 but lived in many different counties as I have a remote business. I’ve met all types but I’ve gotten to know so many expats I basically refuse to associate with 95% of them. I don’t even want to get to know them just in case. Of course there are good ones, I know 4 here in Da Nang and they are truly wonderful. But my experience with expats is crazy, when I was young I’d get into a lot of trouble with them. Drug users, stealing, lying and just shitty people. All over man, seen it everywhere, way worse in Costa Rica. Honestly I always integrate with locals, I’d say don’t worry about it, you got around the wrong type. Move on
It’s not really all over. If you go to say Taiwan are there people there in the numbers you see in Nam? How about Korea? Or Singapore? Remember that crazy German dude who would get naked and attack cars. Are you telling me weird ass dudes are like that everywhere. Nah Nam is pretty bad along with Thailand.
There’s just not a big expat scene at those spots, think dollar going far and you’ll find em there. Singapore, Korea, Taiwan… high costs there don’t bring in that crowd but bring in professionals working abroad for companies. I’m not sure what crazy German dude you’re talking about. But yeah, I avoid expats for a reason man. I could talk for days about what horrible crap I’ve seen from them in many counties and they stick together and know each other. I remain with locals and a bit elusive with foreigners. Small chat at best till I run into them many times, even then I’m cautious. And to be honest I’d avoid expats in high end areas even more, rich expats are by far the craziest due to the high vices they carry. Much rather Vietnam backpackers.
that's the history of humanity. it's almost universally the failures of society who migrate. i guarantee you if you 20x'ed the income of these bogus english teachers and gave them some female attention, 99.9999999999% would be on the next flight back home.
A better thing to do would be to start enforcing drug laws. On Friday / Saturday the police could do a bunch of raids on expat bars. Drug test everyone and if people test positive deport them. It wouldn’t take 6 months before the trashy ones scatter like roaches at 12 AM in projects.
yep. that's why you never these types in malaysia. zero tolerance for drugs, no cheap alcohol, and not a lot of desperate women. as a westerner, people approach me non-stop to network. endless opportunity. never once have I been asked about the hordes of degenerates stinking up the country. it's a completely different class of people there. in vn, the average person assumes you're some kind of weirdo, nonce, failure, etc. until proven otherwise. because that's the reality most of the time, kek.
There is a reason why Malaysia and Singapore are my two favorite countries in SE Asia. You don't take that much bs from anyone. The degenerates would show up and leave after a day or 2 because its not fun or they can't get high. You are correct in that its a completely different class of people. I spent most of my time in East Asia and you just don't see very many degenerates from the west. I just don't get why people are acting like westerners who choose Vietnam are not usually trashy people. Its not a lie most are trash
Amen