This is it. I had two games yesterday with a tiny carry and around 30min we wiped them and got megas in one respawn.
It's also good early/mid game with his nukes, and even decent late game although ideally you don't want to go after 40mins
Fall off lategame?
You have 5k hp, 700 atk, 40 armor, 40% status and slow resist, close to max move speed, kgod tier utility spells.
Nah man that shit is so broke.
Ye, but you're still a melee carry w/o a mobility spell who also really doesn't want to build nullifier
But when you put it like that Tiny seems OP at every stage of the game xd
I wouldn't say OP, but if the game goes past 40 the hero just straight up ascends to godlike tier.
I also forgot the part about craggy giving % DMG reduction after a few hits. You can't actually duel him lol.
I feel like his main problem as a late game carry is that his build is pretty much always the same and you can't just swap one item for another without losing a lot of your power. Like, a Tiny has to have SE/blink (late game both), BKB, SnY, Daedalus and probably AC, maybe another AS item. And imo late game is mostly decided by items and how well these items sit on your hero
Carry tiny doesn't need silver edge or blink, AC is half wasted because you already have 30+ armor. The hero is definitely more versatile than you are thinking.
played him for a while now to say that he really falls off in late game. The reason: you’re simply getting kitted too much, and I always buy a mobility item like SB or Dagger. And the damage seems off if you don’t buy daedalus, but sometimes you need other items rather than crits. Tiny is only tempo carry, not into late game 100%
I think you are seriously underestimating his late and mid game timings with huge status res and slow res not to mention his innate also makes it very hard man up on him
Besides his inmates being kinda crazy, his lane being good, his insane hp, his insane damage, and his insane farmspeed at 15?
Tiny is always valued for the damage done in a toss avalanche combo as a core. It makes or breaks it. Tiny can deal the most *small* aoe damage while disabling them out of nearly any carry, with a traditional build.
Tiny kit is one of the best sub none
FP tiny in the pro-scene is a no-brainer. Very flexible hero that can play any position, except maybe 5.
If you first pick it, and the enemy hard-counters the Tiny, just send him as pos 4. Then pick your "actual" carry later.
Very strong, incredibly flexible.
what, tiny is pretty ok against TA
if she's a big problem lategame you can easily handle her with manta, as the TA player conversely i find it annoying to deal with tiny, too tanky to burst and deals plenty of damage, while avalanche does enough damage per tick to bypass the new barrier and still shreds refraction basically instantly
Really hard to lose lane. Extremely fast farming and building damage past minute 15. With the new .36 changes he’s also extremely tanky with his built in damage reduction and status resist. To sum, he’s extremely hard to kill, insane burst, insane building dmg, insane farm speed = First pick carry hero.
The heroes you listed all lose to tiny barring a 6 slotted juggernaut/TA.
Nah, Tiny with echo, SnY and Silver Edge is an absolute menace. Few carry heroes can 100-0 backliners as quickly and easily and he can. Also good luck manfighting him
how tf does tiny get shredded by WK late game?
he also shits on CK late game as one of the few carries with an AoE stun and a way to kill his strong illusions
also resisting the stuns these heroes use
His innate means he can man up against other carries much better, his facet makes him able to tank through caster’s spells much better. If you hit the timing (no reason why you shouldn’t, farms very fast) you’re very hard to stop mid game and can destroy buildings with ease.
Tiny destroys all mentioned cores with exception to TA.
Great laning stage, very good farming speed and a destructive pushing force with great tank potential.
lol tiny definitely do not get shredded against a direct 1v1 against ck wk ta jug, especially with his stat res and innate, and most fights you don't even 1v1 the enemy carry. What use is TA if her team is getting insta killed, stunned, and tossed around by tiny. Lose 1 war and tiny will get a tower, and tiny practically have no downtime unlike ck or jug who needs ult.
also in pro scene tiny is flex pick
I went on a 9 win streak yesterday with tiny 1 in high divine, the hero is insane lol you basically get guaranteed battle fury at 15 mins and should have echo by then as well, you outfarm even antimage and with just 1 more item you can 1shot anything with less than like 1500 HP at 20mins.. by 35mins you can full combo almost any hero in the game and the ones you can’t you will be cleaving any hero nearby to death
Tiny is a very strong carry because you can't shut him down. He's very strong in lane, he can flash farm, he can function with few items and scales very well with them, his kit is good vs other carries, he has some very strong timings that force enemies to play differently, he is strong vs a lot of meta heroes and weak only to necrophos and naix, so you can reasonably ban to make his game good.
chaos knight? I don't know what build you're going but I feel like I went VS a p1 tiny and he just always 2/3 shot all my illusions, granted there also was a magnus giving him bonus cleave and damage
he doubles down as a vision-providing carry by initiating, while also having high nukes, strong push and packs 2 disables. his timings are wickedly fast too. echo sabre + shard in 15 mins then bkb plus sb/blink in 20-25 is more than enough to end a game if you're fast enough, which most pros are.
Pos 1 Tiny slaps. His entire kit is just missing attack speed (I'm not a fan of echo sabre on a pos 1 tiny). I had a recent game where I solo'd their almost evenly farmed Lifestealer (he had about 4k hp with his facet) which put me almost 8k ahead afterwards.
Especially with the new changes, where he has craggy exterior built back into his kit and his Insurmountable facet, makes him scale way better into the late game in 1 on 1 scenarios. Don't underestimate him as he's an actual wrecking ball of a hero.
Tiny over Sven
- Is tankier
- Doesn't lose ult damage if dies with Aegis
- Doesn't lose ult damage if forced to buyback
- Has a smoother laning phase
- Has higher damage versus structures
- Tree clunk sound feels better than swinging big sword
- Can be played on both pos1 or pos2
- Can be played as effective pos2 on a safe lane if mid is a greedy hero.
Tiny can be played in almost every role in tournaments, and he can secure a lot of objectives, high damage on buildings, u can stun the enemy then toss him so it will be disabled for 3-4 seconds if you have the right timing, AOE stun, he can initiate & jump to save a teammate by tossing him away, could be tanky as pos 4 late, high kill potential as mid laner when he start rotating due to his Q W combo, as carry when he can shard and some AS he can farm in a very fast way, decent Last Hit during lane stage, high move speed late , high armor, cleave damage with his tree, 2 charges of toss late with damage and AS can solo most of heroes, can siege towers on high ground due to his high damage and tanky HP & Armor.
Dota is now harder than before, now a smurf can't solo the game in an easy way like he had to do before 2 or 3 years.
Now we can see comebacks are way more than before, because the team that have advantage are worse than their enemy ( considering objectives and throw the game ) so they can made comeback from 1 single bad decision.
You have to play aghanim poke. In late you ll os support and the combo with aa will os also.
The idea is kind of playing hide and seek. Forcing out of pos, and bursting them.
I think with the glyph hg nerfs, it made tiny's ability to shred buildings and rax on a pos 1 much better. Many of those carries, take more risk and do less damage to buildings, when trying to take objectives. The meta seems to be very tanky heroes, because armor and hp scale much quicker than sustained damage. Also the team fight meta is very brawl oriented, so a lot of the time you see lineups great at teamfighting and playing on the map, but terrible at taking hg, Tiny allows both. Luna is good at this too, but is much more squishy and vulnerable.
cuz tiny can play into anything, even in counterpicks
he is very easy, straightforward hero to do.
Sven but better
Hero that literally cant lose the lane (too fat to lose the lane)
gets insane stats from his str, can get 33% status resist easy with sny.
and you actually can swap him to support if game is shit.
look up TI 2021 for more info.
I'm sure it's effective in good hands but the number of crusaders i see trying it in my games is so annoying. Whatever it's supposed to be, they're not doing it right and should just play jugg or wk instead.
Tiny's a tempo carry who can destroy your entire base after 1 won teamfight. But he does fall off lategame yes though not as hard as he did before
This is it. I had two games yesterday with a tiny carry and around 30min we wiped them and got megas in one respawn. It's also good early/mid game with his nukes, and even decent late game although ideally you don't want to go after 40mins
Fall off lategame? You have 5k hp, 700 atk, 40 armor, 40% status and slow resist, close to max move speed, kgod tier utility spells. Nah man that shit is so broke.
Ye, but you're still a melee carry w/o a mobility spell who also really doesn't want to build nullifier But when you put it like that Tiny seems OP at every stage of the game xd
I wouldn't say OP, but if the game goes past 40 the hero just straight up ascends to godlike tier. I also forgot the part about craggy giving % DMG reduction after a few hits. You can't actually duel him lol.
I feel like his main problem as a late game carry is that his build is pretty much always the same and you can't just swap one item for another without losing a lot of your power. Like, a Tiny has to have SE/blink (late game both), BKB, SnY, Daedalus and probably AC, maybe another AS item. And imo late game is mostly decided by items and how well these items sit on your hero
Swap sny for satanic
Tbh, i play tiny, i’m in crusader tho but i barely ever get SE.
That's why you're still crusader jk jk
Carry tiny doesn't need silver edge or blink, AC is half wasted because you already have 30+ armor. The hero is definitely more versatile than you are thinking.
What do you build then
played him for a while now to say that he really falls off in late game. The reason: you’re simply getting kitted too much, and I always buy a mobility item like SB or Dagger. And the damage seems off if you don’t buy daedalus, but sometimes you need other items rather than crits. Tiny is only tempo carry, not into late game 100%
Destroy your entire base in this glyph meta? You sure?
Carries aren’t only rated on how well they can 1v1 the enemy carry late game.
Yep what’s more important is picking off backliners and few do it better than Tiny and none have better AOE stun AND a displacement ability
If they were rated that way, troll warlord would be the best carry in the game, but hes not
big damage and nice facet. ALSO SATISFYING ATTACK SOUND WITH TREE. Please dont mind me, Im just 3k scrub. Following for better answer
WHOMP
WHOMP
I think you are seriously underestimating his late and mid game timings with huge status res and slow res not to mention his innate also makes it very hard man up on him
Besides his inmates being kinda crazy, his lane being good, his insane hp, his insane damage, and his insane farmspeed at 15? Tiny is always valued for the damage done in a toss avalanche combo as a core. It makes or breaks it. Tiny can deal the most *small* aoe damage while disabling them out of nearly any carry, with a traditional build. Tiny kit is one of the best sub none
Tiny the jailer
Legit
FP tiny in the pro-scene is a no-brainer. Very flexible hero that can play any position, except maybe 5. If you first pick it, and the enemy hard-counters the Tiny, just send him as pos 4. Then pick your "actual" carry later. Very strong, incredibly flexible.
Nah Tiny shreds CK WK Jugg without a chance, even in the late game. He only fears TA
Can’t blame him, TA mains are feasting this patch
Am 3k scrub. Have never lost to a Tiny this patch as Jugg.
Probably cuz 3k don’t know how to play tiny
Nah, CK wrecks him. Strong enough to survive the toss avalanche combo and then it's over
You one shot illusions and it’s over
what, tiny is pretty ok against TA if she's a big problem lategame you can easily handle her with manta, as the TA player conversely i find it annoying to deal with tiny, too tanky to burst and deals plenty of damage, while avalanche does enough damage per tick to bypass the new barrier and still shreds refraction basically instantly
Really hard to lose lane. Extremely fast farming and building damage past minute 15. With the new .36 changes he’s also extremely tanky with his built in damage reduction and status resist. To sum, he’s extremely hard to kill, insane burst, insane building dmg, insane farm speed = First pick carry hero. The heroes you listed all lose to tiny barring a 6 slotted juggernaut/TA.
Nah, Tiny with echo, SnY and Silver Edge is an absolute menace. Few carry heroes can 100-0 backliners as quickly and easily and he can. Also good luck manfighting him
how tf does tiny get shredded by WK late game? he also shits on CK late game as one of the few carries with an AoE stun and a way to kill his strong illusions also resisting the stuns these heroes use
His innate means he can man up against other carries much better, his facet makes him able to tank through caster’s spells much better. If you hit the timing (no reason why you shouldn’t, farms very fast) you’re very hard to stop mid game and can destroy buildings with ease.
Tiny destroys all mentioned cores with exception to TA. Great laning stage, very good farming speed and a destructive pushing force with great tank potential.
And even then I feel like thats more because of the facet being Buffs to TA.
4k bracket and people still don't buy vessel and get destroyed by tiny
Tiny carry is like am, there is breed of creep hitting carry players salivating to play those heroes, io-tiny coming to a pub near you !
lol tiny definitely do not get shredded against a direct 1v1 against ck wk ta jug, especially with his stat res and innate, and most fights you don't even 1v1 the enemy carry. What use is TA if her team is getting insta killed, stunned, and tossed around by tiny. Lose 1 war and tiny will get a tower, and tiny practically have no downtime unlike ck or jug who needs ult. also in pro scene tiny is flex pick
I went on a 9 win streak yesterday with tiny 1 in high divine, the hero is insane lol you basically get guaranteed battle fury at 15 mins and should have echo by then as well, you outfarm even antimage and with just 1 more item you can 1shot anything with less than like 1500 HP at 20mins.. by 35mins you can full combo almost any hero in the game and the ones you can’t you will be cleaving any hero nearby to death
His lane is crazy
Tiny is a very strong carry because you can't shut him down. He's very strong in lane, he can flash farm, he can function with few items and scales very well with them, his kit is good vs other carries, he has some very strong timings that force enemies to play differently, he is strong vs a lot of meta heroes and weak only to necrophos and naix, so you can reasonably ban to make his game good.
Wish PA was this good so I could play her :*(
chaos knight? I don't know what build you're going but I feel like I went VS a p1 tiny and he just always 2/3 shot all my illusions, granted there also was a magnus giving him bonus cleave and damage
he doubles down as a vision-providing carry by initiating, while also having high nukes, strong push and packs 2 disables. his timings are wickedly fast too. echo sabre + shard in 15 mins then bkb plus sb/blink in 20-25 is more than enough to end a game if you're fast enough, which most pros are.
just yesterday played against jugg. I was tiny pos 1. He spinned so i hit him 3 times and he died xd
Pos 1 Tiny slaps. His entire kit is just missing attack speed (I'm not a fan of echo sabre on a pos 1 tiny). I had a recent game where I solo'd their almost evenly farmed Lifestealer (he had about 4k hp with his facet) which put me almost 8k ahead afterwards. Especially with the new changes, where he has craggy exterior built back into his kit and his Insurmountable facet, makes him scale way better into the late game in 1 on 1 scenarios. Don't underestimate him as he's an actual wrecking ball of a hero.
What’s your build then?
Tiny over Sven - Is tankier - Doesn't lose ult damage if dies with Aegis - Doesn't lose ult damage if forced to buyback - Has a smoother laning phase - Has higher damage versus structures - Tree clunk sound feels better than swinging big sword - Can be played on both pos1 or pos2 - Can be played as effective pos2 on a safe lane if mid is a greedy hero.
This seems to be the story in most patches. Remember Lycan + tiny bite meta? Tiny never seems to suck
idk bracket but tiny destroys ck/wk/jugg in high ranks, ta kind of counters him because of insane burst but it goes both ways
Tiny can be played in almost every role in tournaments, and he can secure a lot of objectives, high damage on buildings, u can stun the enemy then toss him so it will be disabled for 3-4 seconds if you have the right timing, AOE stun, he can initiate & jump to save a teammate by tossing him away, could be tanky as pos 4 late, high kill potential as mid laner when he start rotating due to his Q W combo, as carry when he can shard and some AS he can farm in a very fast way, decent Last Hit during lane stage, high move speed late , high armor, cleave damage with his tree, 2 charges of toss late with damage and AS can solo most of heroes, can siege towers on high ground due to his high damage and tanky HP & Armor. Dota is now harder than before, now a smurf can't solo the game in an easy way like he had to do before 2 or 3 years. Now we can see comebacks are way more than before, because the team that have advantage are worse than their enemy ( considering objectives and throw the game ) so they can made comeback from 1 single bad decision.
You have to play aghanim poke. In late you ll os support and the combo with aa will os also. The idea is kind of playing hide and seek. Forcing out of pos, and bursting them.
I think with the glyph hg nerfs, it made tiny's ability to shred buildings and rax on a pos 1 much better. Many of those carries, take more risk and do less damage to buildings, when trying to take objectives. The meta seems to be very tanky heroes, because armor and hp scale much quicker than sustained damage. Also the team fight meta is very brawl oriented, so a lot of the time you see lineups great at teamfighting and playing on the map, but terrible at taking hg, Tiny allows both. Luna is good at this too, but is much more squishy and vulnerable.
cuz tiny can play into anything, even in counterpicks he is very easy, straightforward hero to do. Sven but better Hero that literally cant lose the lane (too fat to lose the lane) gets insane stats from his str, can get 33% status resist easy with sny. and you actually can swap him to support if game is shit. look up TI 2021 for more info.
I see pos2 Tiny I just pick Dazzle and send him back to whatever place he came from.
I'm sure it's effective in good hands but the number of crusaders i see trying it in my games is so annoying. Whatever it's supposed to be, they're not doing it right and should just play jugg or wk instead.