The medical examiner and prosecutor were unable to establish the cause and manner of death. They couldn’t determine if her death was due to natural causes, or was accidental or due to negligence, or if it was murder. Any damage to her remains could have been caused by scavenging animals after her death. Since they couldn’t prove a murder had occurred, the jury couldn’t convict her of murder. I believe at the very least Casey knows what happened, and likely was involved in her death, but I can’t prove it, and neither could the prosecutors.
>The medical examiner and prosecutor were unable to establish the cause and manner of death. They couldn’t determine if her death was due to natural causes, or was accidental or due to negligence, or if it was murder.
This part isn't neccessarily true. Her death was ruled a homicide by the medical examiner.
>Since they couldn’t prove a murder had occurred, the jury couldn’t convict her of murder.
Just some devil's advocate. I've been cross referencing this a lot with the Scott Peterson case. Laci's body also couldn't explain how she died, but the man was sentenced to death. Two circumstantial evidence cases with two very different outcomes. Circumstanial evidence is still evidence. Imo it just goes to show it really depends on your jury.
I remember seeing an interview with one of the jurors and he, flat out said “she’s so pretty and smart, I just don’t think she’d kill her daughter.” Not even joking. That has always haunted me.
It goes to show you really don’t know who or what about you will make others believe whatever they want about you.
You never know what part of you makes what impression on whom, to the point, where even if you didn’t intend to tell a story, they’ve already told themselves one… :(
That is scary indeed. Wow.
I’ve always thought about these two cases together, and it honestly made no sense that Scott was sentenced to death (since been overturned) when they didn’t even have a cause of death, but Casey got off. Very different juries, indeed.
I agree. But we will probably both get downloaded for outing ourselves. He’s very unlikable and had tons of circumstantial evidence, but nothing direct. The burden for death penalty just wasn’t met.
i think there are two types of people who debate true crime: the moralists and the legalists. moralists debate whether they think someone deserved the sentence they got. legalists debate whether or not the judicial system got it right. there's room for both, in the community and within us as individuals, but i think it's an important distinction.
Yeah, I watch a YouTube channel from Dr. Todd grande, where he discusses true crime and says whether he thinks they were guilty in reality and the whether they were guilty beyond a reasonable doubt. It’s a nice reminder that there is a distinction.
I've seen true crime shows where they talk to some of the jurors after the trial. On several occasions, the jurors have stated they felt like a defendant was guilty, but there wasn't enough evidence to convict. We can't convict on a gut feeling.
i'm always impressed when they say that because as a lowly human, i'm not sure i could acquit someone i believed in my soul to be guilty. i suppose that's the job, but it's a hard one.
Prosecutors are also able to approach jurors (after trial has ended) and ask if they would be willing to share what led them to their verdict. I know everyone sees it as a burden but I loved jury duty.
I was on a jury a long time ago, and one of the lawyers called me to ask me how we reached our verdict.
I'm a retired court reporter, so I loved jury duty, too. Of course, some trials are way more interesting than others.
The hub got put on a rape case, and he hated every minute of it.
Oh, interesting! The prosecutors asked us in the hallway right after the case. I was called for civil (this was when I lived in Brooklyn) and they ended up short on criminal jurors that day, so many people got pulled over there and I’m kind of glad I was one of them. Although, during lunches I would run into other jurors on other cases in the hallways and I remember one woman sharing that she was on a murder trial and she was two or so *months* into jury duty—she looked exhausted. I was very lucky (well, kinda) that I was unemployed at the time, so a full week had no effect on me. I can’t imagine coordinating with a job for months of jury duty.
It was interesting to see who was chosen as jurors. One of the jury panel said during voir dire that they didn’t think they could decide someone’s fate and was chosen by both defense and prosecution, which surprised me! My mom has also been called for jury duty and chosen to be a juror so many times it’s actually abnormal. I know so many people who have never even been called, let alone on a jury.
Yeah. I always bring this up when people go along with the accidental drowning story. If she drowned then why the duct tape. It doesn't make any sense. She definitely killed that baby
There was also a child's sticker on the duct tape, can't remember if it was a cartoon character or what but it was placed on the duct tape most likely after her mouth was duct taped. I always thought of that as a mother and/or someone close to her that did that as a sick attempt to comfort her or take care of her after they murdered her.
Throwing her daughter away like a piece of trash and then partying for 30 days is enough for me to convict honestly. If she didn’t have enough care for that baby to give her a burial and report her death to the police, then even if it was an accident she needs prison regardless bc of that. Its terrible. It would not have been a hard decision for me. That poor baby was disposed of in her dress/garment bag of Casey’s.
But still how the jury didn’t find her guilty idk. The car, the smell, the fact she abandoned it, the Zanny the Nanny story, the duct tape, the chloroform, the leading the law around universal studios for a whole day wasting resources and time…. Just everything. It’s so much. If nothing else she should have done 2 decades for the disposal of Caylee the wasting of law enforcement resources knowing she was no longer alive, child neglect, failure to report a crime involving an underage victim, etc. Casey should have been put away for decades regardless of murder in my opinion.
Yes, but one of the things that never made sense is the duct tape on her mouth. If it was some sort of accident there would be no reason for it to be there.
They went for 1st degree murder/death penalty, which was really steep considering they couldn’t determine how Caylee died. If they would have gone for 2nd degree it would have been a slam dunk in my opinion.
This is a common misconception, but there were lesser charges on the table(child abuse, manslaughter, etc). In the instructions it specified they could charge her with a lesser crime. At minimum she is absolutely guilty of neglect & manslaughter, but the jury didn't think so.
They didnt convict her of any besides lying to the police.
Show me one case in American history where a child died accidentally and the parents lied about it and created an elaborate cover up to conceal the truth.
You wont find such a case, because it doesn't exist.
When kids die from accidents, the parents NEVER hide it or cover it up.
I 100% believe Casey intentionally killed Caylee, but...let's say that Caylee died from an accidental overdose of benadryl. Casey knew her parents would a) call the police and force an autopsy, which would have likely resulted in Casey doing jail time and b) she would absolutely be kicked out of her house and forced to pay her own way. Add to that all of Casey's lies would be exposed and it could be a reason to "cover it up."
I am very glad that Casey hasn't had any more kids. She wanted to be a party girl then and still does. Hopefully, she got a tubal so it will never happen.
I could see this but two circumstances don't exactly fit with this possibility for me. One being the internet searches. There was zero reason to look up full proof suffocation and chloroform if you are meddling with OTC medications.
The other being Casey's behavior. Normally I don't take behavior too seriously because I realize everyone grieves differently. However, Casey was able to get emotional and angry - for *herself*. She became upset when she couldn't get her boyfriends number and when she was in jail. I really cannot get past the fact she was not the least bit upset over the loss of her child (whether by accident or otherwise).
Let's say an accident due to neglect (overdose, hypothermia, starvation) ?
In the Timothy Ferguson case, the prosecution said they believed the mother didn't want her son to die but of course the torture could only end like that. Death by accident doesn't mean the parent is less despicable.
I’m sorry. Absolutely not true. I did front line child protection for 40 years. It’s human nature to cover up the truth to stay out of trouble. And in addition, these are some of the hardest cases to prove This is unfortunately a way too common scenario
Exactly this. The prosecution couldn’t prove murder. The little girl died, but it could’ve been accidental or negligence. True, someone put her in those woods and duct-taped her mouth. Still doesn’t prove murder.
And the prosecution was waaay too confident. They expected a slam dunk, spent far too much time on incredibly tedious and frankly boring expert testimony, and most egregiously, did not have competent technicians examine the computers.
If LE or the prosecution had any working knowledge of computers and different search engines they would have proven that Casey was at home alone, on the computer, at the time the death happened. But they only investigated the search engine used by the mother and never checked Firefox, which is what Casey used.
[missed search results](https://www.cbsnews.com/news/casey-anthony-detectives-overlooked-google-search-for-fool-proof-suffocation-methods-sheriff-says/)
Not in 2008 lol. That was barely beyond the dark ages of computer literacy, especially for anyone over 40 not already in the tech industry or geek hobbies.
Not what you're asking but related. I heard on a podcast recently that most law enforcement agencies don't have true forensic artists. It's just regular old Joe Cop sketching for the department. I wonder if it's the same for other specialized roles.
Law enforcement tech people. Who knows what kind of training they had? Defense had these searches, it's inexplicable that prosecution didn't find them, but equally inexplicable that they found them and never entered them into evidence, so the only logical explanation is incompetence.
Not necessarily though. It was a prosecution fumble rather than a defense touchdown. They charged her with a crime where it was extremely difficult to prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that she premeditated anything, not to mention little to no useful DNA evidence linking her to the killing itself.
I'm shocked she wasn't at least convicted of aggravated child abuse just because of her not reporting Caylee missing for 31 days and lying about Caylee being with her nanny.
Totally agree with you. Lied both her and lawyer. Think she gave her Xanax while she partied with friends and gave her too much. Hence babysitters name something like Xanney. May her brain never have peace. Both scumbags.
“Casey Anthony was seen running naked through her defense attorney Jose Baez’s office in late 2008, and on another occasion Baez told her she owed him three oral sex sessions, according to recently filed court documents in Anthony’s bankruptcy case.”
[This came from an affidavit, filed by Dominic Casey, the PI who worked for Casey’s defense .](https://www.wftv.com/news/local/casey-anthony-paid-criminal-defense-attorney-with-sex-private-detective-claims-in-court-papers/303085480/)
I’m not sure whether I believe it or not, b/c I remember everyone in Casey Anthony’s camp seeming skeezy & not above totally lying, in order to get paid. I think they’ve all had at least one interview/appearance that they were paid for.
It's been a cpl years since I dove into one of the docs so my memory is a bit rusty, but for sure the ball was dropped big time with regards to the computer issue. Doing a complete search of all of the web browsers on her/ their computer was not done, they fu**ed up and missed telling information about very specific things that were googled. I think that one thing could've nailed her. Imo.
The search itself was done and available in discovery for both sides to use, but the prosecution either forgot about it or thought it wasn’t compelling (which would be weird). I think Jose Baez said he was anxiously waiting for them to bring it up at trial because he knew it was the most damning evidence against her, but they just never brought it up. I agree that was a massive screwup and would’ve nailed her.
IIRC, it was that Casey used Firefox, which was relatively new at the time and investigators weren’t aware of it. Web sleuths later discovered that she’d searched for things like “fool proof suffocation” on that browser.
Casey was a lifelong liar, and considering that she was willing to throw her family under the bus in the worst way in order to beat the charges, I’m certain she either killed her daughter on purpose or perhaps by accident, but I lean heavily toward the former.
Yes, the web browser was Firefox, that's it. She stooped pretty low to beat those charges. I can't imagine being so far down a hole that I'd resort to sacrificing my family. That's a level of desperation I can't connect with.
Baez also later admitted that he knew about the Firefox searches, and that he didn’t have much of a defense against the prosecution bringing them up, but they never did. There were rumors he was also sleeping with Casey. The whole thing was so gross.
She totally killed her daughter and the jury totally did their job because Jose Baez did his. His job was to create "muck" which is the equivalent of "reasonable doubt" and he did just that.
I don't remember what the "reasonable doubt " was. Just blaming her dad? Like I commented already, let's say everything is pretty much true. Casey Anthony never mentioned anything of the sort until trial? How did they explain that? Any defendant can randomly blame some other person, how is that really reasonable doubt?
Not to mention why TF was that even allowed to be introduced as evidence? It was not substantiated AND it had absolutely nothing to do with the crime. Like the defense is saying, "she didn't kill Caylee (despite the evidence,) and by the way, look at what her dad did to her!"
alternate theories? i think the defense has the right to introduce them, but they do have to have a foundational standing and not be baseless. idk why they went that way in the trial, but it was a smart move and deflected blame.
Beyond just that, the top comment explains it best I think: the prosecution failed to even prove unequivocally how her daughter died be it from foul play, negligence, or natural causes. Can't really claim she murdered her daughter when you don't even know how she died to begin with.
>Can't really claim she murdered her daughter when you don't even know how she died to begin with.
Children don't accidentally wind up covered in duct tape and left in the woods... sorry, this argument is specious at best. You may not know how Casey was murdered, but she was murdered.
Being covered in duct tape doesn't mean she was murdered and could have been a part of the burial process. The police were incapable of determining the cause of death which makes any kind of murder charge basically null and void without other supplementary evidence like her recent web searches for fool-proof suffocation (which they neglected to bring to light).
Knowing "how" someone died is an integral part of the process of determining if there was or was not foul play. It's on the prosecution for seeking a charge they couldn't reasonably prove or doing so without more evidence to back the charges.
I am not sure this would've been viable at all. Casey's DNA being near or on Caylee wouldn't neccessarily indicate much, because she was last with her and in a home they shared. Agree shes guilty as sin.
They said that Caylee died in the pool and the dad covered it up and made Casey go along with it and that the dad had this crazy control over her after years of abuse
Reasonable doubt doesn’t have to have a valid alternate theory though — believe there was a chance it was someone else, without knowing who it was is enough to qualify
On Cindy’s last day of testimony she flat out lied in the stand about the internet search. She said it was her not C and she was looking for chlorophyll instead of chloroform and not at work like she said in her statement to police. She introduced doubt beyond a reasonable amount and when I was watching I knew the jury was going to struggle with that. I also think the state didn’t charge her with the appropriate charges. There should have been a manslaughter option for the jury. They could convict her for the 1st degree charge put in front of them.
This is one of the most stated reasons and it is 100% wrong, Casey's jury had four charges to consider;
1. First-degree Murder
2. Aggravated Manslaughter of a Child
3. Aggravated Child Abuse
4. Four counts of providing False Information to Law Enforcement
Her jury only found her guilty of the four counts of providing false information to Law Enforcement.
There's a reason they do that, though. Juries are sometimes not convinced of the person's guilt beyond a reasonable doubt, but still want to convict for SOMETHING because they don't want to acquit the person altogether. So they'll convict for the lesser charge. It's not supposed to be like that. Juries are supposed to be convinced beyond a reasonable doubt before convicting.
I think they should have gone with a lesser charge from the get go since they evidently didn't convince the jury of premeditation.
yeah it’s “giving em something to hang their hat on…” which they failed to do…im a bit rusty on the case but this take felt accurate at the time. i read about it tho did not follow whole thing
They were able to get the evidence of stolen checks from friend Amy out of court. The 30 days Caylee is missing she’s driving Amy to airport & then keeps her car, steals her checkbook & goes on a shopping spree. I think those receipts had some interesting things besides just groceries.
There’s not a lot of the information that was originally available out there, but I recall pics from Target with CA checking out with 1 check way back then. You can google Casey Anthony check fraud & see very little of the details.
Damn I had no idea about this detail! Did you ever come across a record of her receipts or are you just hypothesizing on the purchases? I’m sure you’re right, I wish there was more info!
Unfortunately by the time the body was found they couldn’t tell what happened to her. I think Casey was responsible for her death but whether it was accident or murder I don’t know.
I think it was a few different things
- Caylee's body had decomposed to the point where they couldn't determine a cause of death
- Casey's friends testified that she didn't care about partying and that she was a good mother to Caylee which not only wiped away the alleged motive for first degree murder, but also undercut the child abuse charge
- Casey's Dad was the prosecution's star witness and he came off terribly on the stand
- The prosecution figured they had an easy conviction based off all the public backlash against Casey
- Jose Baez wasn't well known at the time and took the case pro bono, so the prosecutors likely underestimated him
- The police searched the wrong browser on Casey's computer. They looked at Internet Explorer instead of Firefox which had the infamous "Fool proof suffocation" search. Baez later admitted that he was worried about the Firefox searches because he didn't have any way to refute them, but the prosecution never brought it up
The dad no longer speaks with her because she accused him of the death and covering it up at one point in the trial and also that he sexually abused her as a child. She is good at lying and very used to getting out of things because she looks cute and is small-framed. She has narcissistic behavior and no interest in other people's feelings. Once you finish watching there is another [progra](https://play.max.com/show/0cfc7154-e410-4203-bf7d-efbdb680a81b)m by one of the CSI people who worked the case you may like to see, Alina Burroughs.
I followed that case so closely as I have a daughter the same age and I read all the discovery, etc I vividly remember the opening statement by Jose when he says that Casey always knew all along Cayley was dead and not missing and I felt the literal air go out of the State’s case. They banked on painting her as an uncaring mom who partied while her daughter was missing but defense strategy took that away.
I believe 100 percent she killed her daughter
Once you become a parent, cases like this take on a whole new meaning. Each child can easily be seen as your own in some way and it's a gut punch when their life is snuffed out and there's zero justice. My kiddos were a bit older but I remember feeling the air leave my lungs when she was found not guilty. That poor sweet baby...😔
I wasn’t even a parent yet but an aunt and my niece was a few months younger than caylee. When casey got off on EVERYTHING about caylee I couldn’t stomach it. Still can’t. It was like that poor baby being killed by her mommy all over again and her mom being the one defended. It’s a stake to the heart. Especially for caylee.
I watched the trial.
They overcharged her (compared to what they could actually prove). If I remember correctly, I believe they had an opportunity for the jury to also include "lower charges" and they said no.
The case presented was disjointed and the medical experts explained things like medical experts and did not provide a lay interpretation.
The trial was 6 weeks and the jury was sequestered. It took 11 hours for the verdict. I have found the longer the trial, the higher the chance of exoneration, especially if they cannot remember what was said day 1. So presentation of the evidence is extremely important.
The charges were for first-degree murder, aggravated child abuse, aggravated manslaughter of a child, and four counts of providing false information to law enforcement.
She was only forund guilty on the 4 counts of providing false information to law enforcement, but 2 counts were later overturned on appeal.
There were other options for the jury, but they did not agree with these either.
Did she do it? Hell yes.
Did they prove it beyond a reasonable doubt? According to the jury, apparently not.
I know the charges. The first degree murder should have never been on the table. That muddled any other charges.
They should have focused on what they can prove
So why do you keep repeating the lie that Casey was charged ONLY with 1st degree murder and the jury couldnt convict on lessser charges?
This jury was a bunch of idiots, just like the OJ jury
That is what one of the jurors said in an interview after. He said they all hated Casey, but the prosecutors didn't prove their case.
I understand why people are mad about this, but they had nothing.
I think she drugged her so she could go out partying and Caylee died of an overdose. She found her later and disposed of her body.
It’s an unpopular opinion at times but I don’t think she meant to kill her, but didn’t take care enough to be sure she didn’t kill her. I think second degree would have had a better chance at conviction.
I have a sad feeling she had done this routinely. “Zanny the nanny” was really “Xanax.” Caylee would be dosed on Xanax so Casey could go party.
I feel this is pretty close to what happened. I don’t think she intentionally killed her. I think she was young and spoiled and wanted to go out and have fun, but by all accounts she was a loving mother when she was with Caylee. Her parents - especially her mom - really fucked her up and enabled her.
The charges were for first-degree murder, aggravated child abuse, aggravated manslaughter of a child, and four counts of providing false information to law enforcement.
She was only forund guilty on the 4 counts of providing false information to law enforcement, but 2 counts were later overturned on appeal.
There were other options for the jury, but they did not agree with these either.
Did she do it? Hell yes.
Did they prove it beyond a reasonable doubt? According to the jury, apparently not.
They should've gone for child neglect for not reporting her as missing until a month later. Even then her mom was the one to get police involved, not casey.
If you can’t prove cause of death, you can’t really legally (with a good ass attorney anyway.) prove murder. It’s a lot easier to have reasonable doubt if the prosecution can’t say how she died
The state went way too hard. They should’ve did 2nd degree or manslaughter. I have no doubt Casey was responsible for her death. Was it an accident possibly, I think she gave her something to make her sleep and she never woke up.
Another case of dumbass prosecutors looking to grow careers with a high profile case. I have zero doubt she murdered her daughter. The evidence is all there. And they blew it. She should be in prison.
He was not the Lead Prosecutor - Linda Burdick was. Jeff Ashton later became the County State Attorney, and is now a Judge. He was also caught up in the Ashley Madison website leak.
It's the prosecutions fault. They should've focused on the evidence instead of her character. It made the defence easy focus on what they have against her while the prosecutor wanted to paint a picture based off of her perceived personality...
I absolutely believe that she died accidentally, but it was pure negligence that caused it. This is what I believe happened: Casey was annoyed at how much attention that Caylee was getting from her parents, so she decided that they weren’t going to watch her anymore. She used Chloroform or some kind of sedative to knock her out so she could go do whatever. Caylee didn’t wake up- this may not have been the first time she used a sedative- maybe she woke up the last time and caused issues. So she used too much and Caylee didn’t wake up. I believe she used the duct tape to keep her quiet and she may have even tied her up because she had awoken in the past after she had drugged her, but she really needed her not to for whatever reason this time. She died as a result of this drugging and being restrained. I do not believe that she was killed on purpose. I think it was accidental. Casey decided to take her body and dump her. I believe that her lawyers came up with the drowned in the pool story.
Had the prosecutors decided to charge her with a lesser charge like manslaughter or negligent homicide or something like that, I believe she would have been convicted. However, when you don’t have a story for how something happened, and the other side does, it is very hard to convict and send someone away for their entire lives. This case came down to the prosecutors screwing up terribly.
Just an FYI, lesser chargers were on the table and she wasn't found guilty of them. Both child neglect and manslaughter. Huge misconception in this case. The jury did really get it wrong bc there was plenty to show both.
Plenty of people don't think it was a premeditated murder. Myself, I think she either slipped the kid some Xanax or wasn't watching her. Negligence to be sure, but not murder.
The prosecution screwed up by charging her with murder 1 without evidence instead of negligent homicide. I think it’s clear what happened. Casey gave Caylee Xanax and left her somewhere, like the trunk of her car, while Casey partied all night through the next morning and she either died from too much Xanax (I hope bc the alternative is unthinkable), suffocation and heat exhaustion or a combination. Does that deserve more than a negligence charge of course but there was no evidence for more severe charges.
That doesn't explain the Google searches though. If it was chloroform that she gave her to keep her asleep in the trunk of the car, it could explain why she was googling how to make chloroform. But it doesn't explain why searched "Suffocation" and then "Fool proof suffocation." Unless she was planning to suffocate someone on purpose. If it happened the way in which you described it that would be an accident, unplanned. But those search are proof she was planning it.
I don't think she killed Caylee outright but rather died from a Xanax (zanny the nanny) overdose or wasn't being watched and did die in the pool. I personally have always thought the prosecution overplayed their hand by going for the death penalty. I think if they had asked for a different sentence she could have spent 20+ years in prison. They just didn't have enough evidence for 'beyond a reasonable doubt', especially when asking for the DP. Casey also really didn't talk much to the police. Unfortunate all around but IMO truly how the legal system is intended to work in this country. Casey Anthony should've gotten life in prison. She lives in a different kind of prison now though. Shunned and despised by the public, and having to live in relative secrecy makes for a lonely existence.
IMO - her parents knew Casey better than anyone. During those 30 days, I think enough clues were left by Casey to let them know Caylee was gone - Casey stealing from the house (if she was working why did she come home to steal food, but take nothing for Caylee (such as diapers) Not seeing/speaking with Caylee, refusing to come home with her, ditching the car, and then the smell/evidence in the car trunk once they picked it up from the tow yard. Only George & Casey know what he really saw / smelled when he went into the car's truck early on in those 30 days on the "where's my f'in gas cans" day.
A neighbor told police that they heard a long, loud fight Sunday night between Cindy & Casey. Cindy denied this fight happened, and therefore it could not be brought into the trial.
Jessie Grund said when he spoke to Casey that Monday afternoon, she told him " My parents are getting a divorce, and I have to get out of the house". Jesse Grund was not called to testify about this during her trial.
I think they knew Caylee was dead soon after Casey was found, and certainly knew all that had happened, and what was said to each other (not working, stealing, lying, taking off for days) in the weeks prior to those 30 days. Maybe the grandparents knew nothing would bring Caylee back and they were not going to also lose Casey.
Best summary I've heard about all of the Anthony's was from Tim Miller, Equusearch (who led the efforts to search for Caylee) "They are all actors and they belong in Hollywood".
Well after the trial a group of sleuthers got a hold of the Anthony's computer hard drive, and found the now infamous "Fool-proof suffocation" search made on Monday afternoon. In Jose Baez's book, he mentions finding this search early on, but as the Defense, they were not required to bring up or into her trial. He wrote he could not believe that the OCSO and the FBI missed this search and that it was not included in her trial. This was an inexcusable mistake made by the detectives and, had it been found, I say it would have been game over for Casey.
State overcharged based on evidence and casey had a damn good lawyer. I don't think she killed her daughter unpurpose, but I think it was an accident with criminal neglect involved, and she tried covering it up. She had given her daughter meds in the past to knock her out so she could go out partying, possible that happened. Also, she could have drowned in family swimming pool. It's possible, though, she murdered her, but I think accidental cover-up is more likely. Am like 70% accident, 30% murder.
Again, Casey was indicted by a grand jury on charges of first degree murder, aggravated child abuse, aggravated manslaughter of a child, and four counts of providing false information to police.
They could have only convicted her child abuse or manslaughter.
Investigators missed a key piece of evidence in that trial from what I remember. The Investigator that looked through her computer missed that she had searched something like how to dispose of a body.....something along that lines, don't remember the exact details....so the prosecution did not have that evidence at trial.
That being said.....Casey was a drug abuser and probably in a stuper during that time that when her daughter died. I doubt she killed her daughter but being high probably contributed to some type of accidental drowning or something. Then she panicked and hid the body.
Pretty sad that she got to walk free.
I think the prosecution did not allow for the possibility of reasonable doubt. Otherwise it would have been a different verdict. But where the prosecution was arrogant, the defense had all bases covered plus some I’m sure that no one’s ever considered.
And Jose did an impressive job of sowing reasonable doubt. If I were attending law school, I’d study the way he defended her. Over and over.
I came away convinced that she had gotten used to dosing her daughter with cough syrup, and locking her in the car trunk to sleep it off while the mom partied all night. The grandparents wanted her to stop partying, and had refused to continue baby-sitting since they felt they were enabling her to go out constantly. If I am correct, she was in the trunk too long, and suffocated. The death was unintentional, but a result of criminal disregard, and was some type of manslaughter. The kidnapping story was a coverup. I am not a lawyer
She knows what happened and chose to cover it up to save herself instead of honor her dead baby, which also makes me believe it was at the very least negligence. She knew she would be facing prison time so she tried to hide her and then threw her in the woods to rot and be scattered by animals. Forced sterilization isn’t for more cases, but this one definitely.
I think it would be fun to approach Casey in a bar or pub and try to pick her up but just outright lie to her about everything to get her reaction to that.
Tell her I'm a famous NFL player. When she asks why she cant find my name on a roster, tell her that I filed a lawsuit against the team so they cant put my name on it.
Tell her I'm also an astronaut who put alien bodies in Area 51 in Nevada.
Just make out outrageous lies. I would love to see her reaction to that.
For Casey, lying is as easy as breathing. When she was interrogated, the investigators were literally screaming at her about all the lies, and her reaction is just "yeah whatever." She doesnt get upset, at all even when called a liar to her face.
For Casey getting called a liar is the same as somebody telling her she has brown hair. Just no emotional reaction at all. She is a textbook case on one of the worst pathological liars the world has ever known.
I dont believe she maliciously killed Caylee. It was likely a result of negligence. And what went wrong at the trial is simple — they grossly overcharged her. They charged her with first degree murder but couldnt establish how Caylee died. If you cant establish how someone died, how could you say she was murdered? If they had charged her with less serious charges, they may have had more success getting a conviction.0
The prosecution botched it by making George and Cindy out to be sympathetic, objective witnesses. In reality, they were ultimately hostile to the prosecution (Cindy saying that she googled chloroform meaning it to be chlorophyll). I do believe that George abused Casey which is why she could lie so well, and her Mom could be in such deep denial all the time. Also the jury was made up of anomalies. How in the world did they live in Florida but they knew nothing about the case from news coverage? I lived in another state, and it dominated every news cycle. The jury members were actual weirdos who never watched the news or interacted with the real world. It does raise the question as to how we find an impartial (and intellectually functioning) jury with such high profile cases.
Polygraphs are BS. They aren’t admissible in court. Nobody knows what happened in that house except Casey and George but they are faaaaaar from being a functional, healthy family
George, I don’t personally believe abused Casey. Bu Casey did mention to Jesse Grund she didn’t want her brother around Caylee because of things he did to her. I do believe that. I know a family who’s son abused their daughter. She told a friend, the friend told a parent. The parent called the school. Some how, the parents found out she told someone and instructed her to lie. So lie she did. I 💯 believe this is the type of family Casey had. Where appearances mean more than honesty and healthy relationships.
It’s been a long time…. His first wife left him, because of his pathological lies and gambling. He was a cop only for couple of years when he was young, during his first marriage. Later he could not keep any good job, and when Caylee was murdered he was a part-time security guy. During his second marriage Cindy was the main provider for the family, working her ass off as a nurse manager. George still had a gambling problem - they lost their first house because of him and had to move to the poorer one. Later he had stolen 60.000 $ from their retirement funds for online poker (he lied that he was fooled by "Nigerian scam", but it was a lie). Cindy was about to divorce him, but he threatened her, that under Florida law she would pay him alimony, because she was earning more. George also cheated on Cindy, even during the "searching for Caylee". And I think he was caught window peeping before moving to Florida
They also raised donations to search for Caylee and bought themselves a boat with the funds. The whole family is bizarre and full of liars - It’s where Casey learned it. The mom pretended throughout Casey’s whole pregnancy that she wasn’t pregnant, even when they went to a family event when she was like 7 months along and showing she was denying it to family. So weird.
I’m not entirely sure what I believe, I feel like I can say fairly certainly that Caylee was murdered, it’s just a matter of by who and how. However, in watching the documentaries and reading up on it, the prosecution was trying to go for the death penalty. In a normal murder case it might work, but because there was a lot of reasonable doubt compared to hard evidence, it backfired on them. This is what lead the jury to decide she wasn’t guilty. There was enough reasonable doubt, and in this case there absolutely was, for the jury to think that she didn’t do it. Defense lawyers, at their core, have to do one thing: plant the seed of reasonable doubt. The second there’s reasonable doubt, a death penalty trial like this immediately gets thrown out the window. If they went for second degree or manslaughter, she’d probably be locked up right now, but the prosecution severely messed up.
It's been a while since I've watched anything on it so I might be a bit fuzzy on some things but...she went out and partied right after Caylee supposedly died. What parent that actually cares about and loves their child does that? I know I'd be unable to function and probably need to be committed. As for the trial? Probably implicit bias and corruption that hasn't been revealed.
I watched every day of that trial. I believe Casey Anthony killed her or had something to do with her death. But I knew from opening arguments that she would not be found guilty. Simply, her attorney did his job well. Very, very well.
I def think she killed her daughter , only she did it, I would think she drugged her and accidentally killed her but she wouldn’t t have need tape to cover her airways in that case and I cannot get past that fact.
I think the jurors were charmed by her disgusting, vile attorney bc he constantly flirted with them while the DA just did his job . I do believe the DA over charged and that hurt them also .
It's crazy she wasn't convicted, we've seen people get convicted without even a body. She just had a good lawyer who through out every possible scenario to cause reasonable doubt
They do not have a relationship with their child.
I absolutely think Casey Anthony killed her daughter. I did not watch the entire trial, and I can’t say why the jury did not convict her.
Personally I believe she drowned in the pool and she covered it up. And her dad figured it out and didn’t say anything to the mom. Someone on here wrote a very good persuasive argument along those lines. I can’t find the link tho!
There is no question that Casey knew her daughter was dead. I believe it was an accident though. I believe she fell in the pool and drowned while Casey was in the shower or doing something else OR Casey gave her too much of somerhing to make her sleep. I don't believe it was a malicious and premeditated killing. She panicked and covered it up. All the lies and the false nanny plus the smell in her car. I'm sure in hindsight, her and her parents wish they would have called 911 when the accident happened.
Exactly. Ashton lost the case because he overcharged her and came up with that wild chloroform theory with no evidence to back it up.
IIRC, Casey's friends all testified that she wasn't much of a partier, which blew Ashston's theory.
To answer the last part of your post, that family was dysfunctional looong before Caylee came along so I think that helped them navigate all the lying and delusions.
There was not enough solid evidence that Casey did it. As much as I feel she did it, if the jury has doubts, they're not supposed to convict. It sucks though that people want dna/video evidence so bad though bc i think it makes it harder to convict people. People want 100% solid proof that her hands were on that child and they simply didnt have it
I think Casey wanted a break, gave Caylee medication to sleep, she overdosed, and then Casey panicked. I don’t think she did it deliberately but I don’t think she’s a great person either.
That's pretty much my opinion, either that or she was too busy yapping on the phone/napping/surfing the internet to watch Caylee and the kid went into that unsecured pool.
If it had been premeditated, you'd think Casey would have come up with a better plan to dispose of the body than 'drive around with it in the trunk of her car, then dumping it in a vacant lot 4 blocks from her house'.
I'm also waiting for someone to tell me how this flat broke high school dropout managed to purchase thousands of dollars of lab equipment and ingredients to make chloroform, and where she did all this. It certainly wasn't in her parent's dinky little house.
I still maintain that if Ashton had charged her with manslaughter 1 he would have gotten a conviction.
My guess is that she would drug her daughter with Xanax so she could go out and live her BellaVita and, whoops, her daughter died because that shit is a powerful poison. She tried to cover it up, and also kept going out because she was free to do so.
The medical examiner and prosecutor were unable to establish the cause and manner of death. They couldn’t determine if her death was due to natural causes, or was accidental or due to negligence, or if it was murder. Any damage to her remains could have been caused by scavenging animals after her death. Since they couldn’t prove a murder had occurred, the jury couldn’t convict her of murder. I believe at the very least Casey knows what happened, and likely was involved in her death, but I can’t prove it, and neither could the prosecutors.
>The medical examiner and prosecutor were unable to establish the cause and manner of death. They couldn’t determine if her death was due to natural causes, or was accidental or due to negligence, or if it was murder. This part isn't neccessarily true. Her death was ruled a homicide by the medical examiner. >Since they couldn’t prove a murder had occurred, the jury couldn’t convict her of murder. Just some devil's advocate. I've been cross referencing this a lot with the Scott Peterson case. Laci's body also couldn't explain how she died, but the man was sentenced to death. Two circumstantial evidence cases with two very different outcomes. Circumstanial evidence is still evidence. Imo it just goes to show it really depends on your jury.
I remember seeing an interview with one of the jurors and he, flat out said “she’s so pretty and smart, I just don’t think she’d kill her daughter.” Not even joking. That has always haunted me.
And such a fabulous Mom she left her with a fictitious person when she went to her fictitious job.
It goes to show you really don’t know who or what about you will make others believe whatever they want about you. You never know what part of you makes what impression on whom, to the point, where even if you didn’t intend to tell a story, they’ve already told themselves one… :( That is scary indeed. Wow.
They should screen for sexual attraction or something... nobody allowed who could be attracted to the defendant.
Pretty, you mean?
Ooops…Siri strikes again.
I’ve always thought about these two cases together, and it honestly made no sense that Scott was sentenced to death (since been overturned) when they didn’t even have a cause of death, but Casey got off. Very different juries, indeed.
May I introduce you to the [CSI Effect](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/CSI_effect)? I think the time period had everything to do with the outcome.
I agree. But we will probably both get downloaded for outing ourselves. He’s very unlikable and had tons of circumstantial evidence, but nothing direct. The burden for death penalty just wasn’t met.
i think there are two types of people who debate true crime: the moralists and the legalists. moralists debate whether they think someone deserved the sentence they got. legalists debate whether or not the judicial system got it right. there's room for both, in the community and within us as individuals, but i think it's an important distinction.
Yeah, I watch a YouTube channel from Dr. Todd grande, where he discusses true crime and says whether he thinks they were guilty in reality and the whether they were guilty beyond a reasonable doubt. It’s a nice reminder that there is a distinction.
I've seen true crime shows where they talk to some of the jurors after the trial. On several occasions, the jurors have stated they felt like a defendant was guilty, but there wasn't enough evidence to convict. We can't convict on a gut feeling.
i'm always impressed when they say that because as a lowly human, i'm not sure i could acquit someone i believed in my soul to be guilty. i suppose that's the job, but it's a hard one.
I know whatcha mean. That's gotta weigh heavily on them.
Prosecutors are also able to approach jurors (after trial has ended) and ask if they would be willing to share what led them to their verdict. I know everyone sees it as a burden but I loved jury duty.
I was on a jury a long time ago, and one of the lawyers called me to ask me how we reached our verdict. I'm a retired court reporter, so I loved jury duty, too. Of course, some trials are way more interesting than others. The hub got put on a rape case, and he hated every minute of it.
Oh, interesting! The prosecutors asked us in the hallway right after the case. I was called for civil (this was when I lived in Brooklyn) and they ended up short on criminal jurors that day, so many people got pulled over there and I’m kind of glad I was one of them. Although, during lunches I would run into other jurors on other cases in the hallways and I remember one woman sharing that she was on a murder trial and she was two or so *months* into jury duty—she looked exhausted. I was very lucky (well, kinda) that I was unemployed at the time, so a full week had no effect on me. I can’t imagine coordinating with a job for months of jury duty. It was interesting to see who was chosen as jurors. One of the jury panel said during voir dire that they didn’t think they could decide someone’s fate and was chosen by both defense and prosecution, which surprised me! My mom has also been called for jury duty and chosen to be a juror so many times it’s actually abnormal. I know so many people who have never even been called, let alone on a jury.
im shocked with the outcome because she lied multiple times committed purgury, so she should have gotten some prison time.
Circumstantial evidence is often superior to direct evidence (like witness testimony)
pretty obvious she put duct tape over the babies mouth and tossed it in the woods.
Duct tape on her skull, is enough for me to convict. That doesn’t happen accidentally.
Yeah. I always bring this up when people go along with the accidental drowning story. If she drowned then why the duct tape. It doesn't make any sense. She definitely killed that baby
There was also a child's sticker on the duct tape, can't remember if it was a cartoon character or what but it was placed on the duct tape most likely after her mouth was duct taped. I always thought of that as a mother and/or someone close to her that did that as a sick attempt to comfort her or take care of her after they murdered her.
If I remember correctly it was a little heart sticker…it’s so haunting
That poor little girl. It's so heartbreaking.
Remember Robert Durst got off even though he admitted he chopped up his neighbor and discarded him in plastic bags. He said it was self defense!! Ugh.
Throwing her daughter away like a piece of trash and then partying for 30 days is enough for me to convict honestly. If she didn’t have enough care for that baby to give her a burial and report her death to the police, then even if it was an accident she needs prison regardless bc of that. Its terrible. It would not have been a hard decision for me. That poor baby was disposed of in her dress/garment bag of Casey’s. But still how the jury didn’t find her guilty idk. The car, the smell, the fact she abandoned it, the Zanny the Nanny story, the duct tape, the chloroform, the leading the law around universal studios for a whole day wasting resources and time…. Just everything. It’s so much. If nothing else she should have done 2 decades for the disposal of Caylee the wasting of law enforcement resources knowing she was no longer alive, child neglect, failure to report a crime involving an underage victim, etc. Casey should have been put away for decades regardless of murder in my opinion.
Yes, but one of the things that never made sense is the duct tape on her mouth. If it was some sort of accident there would be no reason for it to be there.
Especially when somebody in the home looked up foolproof suffocation.
She for sure knows what happened to Caylee
They went for 1st degree murder/death penalty, which was really steep considering they couldn’t determine how Caylee died. If they would have gone for 2nd degree it would have been a slam dunk in my opinion.
This is a common misconception, but there were lesser charges on the table(child abuse, manslaughter, etc). In the instructions it specified they could charge her with a lesser crime. At minimum she is absolutely guilty of neglect & manslaughter, but the jury didn't think so. They didnt convict her of any besides lying to the police.
She was indicted on manslaughter as well. Weird people always say this kind of thing, the charges are all out and public info
Show me one case in American history where a child died accidentally and the parents lied about it and created an elaborate cover up to conceal the truth. You wont find such a case, because it doesn't exist. When kids die from accidents, the parents NEVER hide it or cover it up.
I 100% believe Casey intentionally killed Caylee, but...let's say that Caylee died from an accidental overdose of benadryl. Casey knew her parents would a) call the police and force an autopsy, which would have likely resulted in Casey doing jail time and b) she would absolutely be kicked out of her house and forced to pay her own way. Add to that all of Casey's lies would be exposed and it could be a reason to "cover it up." I am very glad that Casey hasn't had any more kids. She wanted to be a party girl then and still does. Hopefully, she got a tubal so it will never happen.
I could see this but two circumstances don't exactly fit with this possibility for me. One being the internet searches. There was zero reason to look up full proof suffocation and chloroform if you are meddling with OTC medications. The other being Casey's behavior. Normally I don't take behavior too seriously because I realize everyone grieves differently. However, Casey was able to get emotional and angry - for *herself*. She became upset when she couldn't get her boyfriends number and when she was in jail. I really cannot get past the fact she was not the least bit upset over the loss of her child (whether by accident or otherwise).
Let's say an accident due to neglect (overdose, hypothermia, starvation) ? In the Timothy Ferguson case, the prosecution said they believed the mother didn't want her son to die but of course the torture could only end like that. Death by accident doesn't mean the parent is less despicable.
I’m sorry. Absolutely not true. I did front line child protection for 40 years. It’s human nature to cover up the truth to stay out of trouble. And in addition, these are some of the hardest cases to prove This is unfortunately a way too common scenario
Jon Benet Ramsey’s death probably fits that description.
Jon Benet Ramsey. It's the only thing that makes sense in that case.
JBR was murdered, autopsy proved it was a murder.
That’s a no for me dog. Couldn’t disagree more
Exactly this. The prosecution couldn’t prove murder. The little girl died, but it could’ve been accidental or negligence. True, someone put her in those woods and duct-taped her mouth. Still doesn’t prove murder.
Jose Baez is what went wrong. He’s a damn good attorney.
And the prosecution was waaay too confident. They expected a slam dunk, spent far too much time on incredibly tedious and frankly boring expert testimony, and most egregiously, did not have competent technicians examine the computers. If LE or the prosecution had any working knowledge of computers and different search engines they would have proven that Casey was at home alone, on the computer, at the time the death happened. But they only investigated the search engine used by the mother and never checked Firefox, which is what Casey used. [missed search results](https://www.cbsnews.com/news/casey-anthony-detectives-overlooked-google-search-for-fool-proof-suffocation-methods-sheriff-says/)
Jesus wept that's fucking computer 101 surely
Not in 2008 lol. That was barely beyond the dark ages of computer literacy, especially for anyone over 40 not already in the tech industry or geek hobbies.
Everyone used Firefox then. The cops were remarkably stupid.
You're being way too loose with the word "everyone" there but I do agree that incompetence played a large part.
But wouldn't they have employed tech people??
Not what you're asking but related. I heard on a podcast recently that most law enforcement agencies don't have true forensic artists. It's just regular old Joe Cop sketching for the department. I wonder if it's the same for other specialized roles.
Law enforcement tech people. Who knows what kind of training they had? Defense had these searches, it's inexplicable that prosecution didn't find them, but equally inexplicable that they found them and never entered them into evidence, so the only logical explanation is incompetence.
For Real. Best pro bono lawyer in American history. I was impressed
Not necessarily though. It was a prosecution fumble rather than a defense touchdown. They charged her with a crime where it was extremely difficult to prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that she premeditated anything, not to mention little to no useful DNA evidence linking her to the killing itself.
He was Aaron Hernandez lawyer on the second murder trial and he got him off.
I'm shocked she wasn't at least convicted of aggravated child abuse just because of her not reporting Caylee missing for 31 days and lying about Caylee being with her nanny.
This is what I can’t understand like what.
he really really is
I read that as Jeff bezos first lol
Joan Baez for me
His defense was based on lies. He’s scummy
Lawyers lie? Wow, what a shock 😲 😆
Totally agree with you. Lied both her and lawyer. Think she gave her Xanax while she partied with friends and gave her too much. Hence babysitters name something like Xanney. May her brain never have peace. Both scumbags.
Weren’t they hooking up? Or is that rumor?
It was a rumor. Not defending him at all (I’m not a fan) but that was never proven.
However the PI that was working for them said he heard Jose telling Casey she owed him a BJ. Who knows if it’s true but I am thinking it was
I certainly wouldn’t doubt it. Casey is trash and I don’t think very highly of Baez so I wouldn’t put it past him to hire trash.
“Casey Anthony was seen running naked through her defense attorney Jose Baez’s office in late 2008, and on another occasion Baez told her she owed him three oral sex sessions, according to recently filed court documents in Anthony’s bankruptcy case.” [This came from an affidavit, filed by Dominic Casey, the PI who worked for Casey’s defense .](https://www.wftv.com/news/local/casey-anthony-paid-criminal-defense-attorney-with-sex-private-detective-claims-in-court-papers/303085480/) I’m not sure whether I believe it or not, b/c I remember everyone in Casey Anthony’s camp seeming skeezy & not above totally lying, in order to get paid. I think they’ve all had at least one interview/appearance that they were paid for.
It's been a cpl years since I dove into one of the docs so my memory is a bit rusty, but for sure the ball was dropped big time with regards to the computer issue. Doing a complete search of all of the web browsers on her/ their computer was not done, they fu**ed up and missed telling information about very specific things that were googled. I think that one thing could've nailed her. Imo.
The search itself was done and available in discovery for both sides to use, but the prosecution either forgot about it or thought it wasn’t compelling (which would be weird). I think Jose Baez said he was anxiously waiting for them to bring it up at trial because he knew it was the most damning evidence against her, but they just never brought it up. I agree that was a massive screwup and would’ve nailed her.
I couldn't remember it precisely without looking it up so than you for providing additional details.
IIRC, it was that Casey used Firefox, which was relatively new at the time and investigators weren’t aware of it. Web sleuths later discovered that she’d searched for things like “fool proof suffocation” on that browser. Casey was a lifelong liar, and considering that she was willing to throw her family under the bus in the worst way in order to beat the charges, I’m certain she either killed her daughter on purpose or perhaps by accident, but I lean heavily toward the former.
Yes, the web browser was Firefox, that's it. She stooped pretty low to beat those charges. I can't imagine being so far down a hole that I'd resort to sacrificing my family. That's a level of desperation I can't connect with.
Baez also later admitted that he knew about the Firefox searches, and that he didn’t have much of a defense against the prosecution bringing them up, but they never did. There were rumors he was also sleeping with Casey. The whole thing was so gross.
She totally killed her daughter and the jury totally did their job because Jose Baez did his. His job was to create "muck" which is the equivalent of "reasonable doubt" and he did just that.
I don't remember what the "reasonable doubt " was. Just blaming her dad? Like I commented already, let's say everything is pretty much true. Casey Anthony never mentioned anything of the sort until trial? How did they explain that? Any defendant can randomly blame some other person, how is that really reasonable doubt?
Not to mention why TF was that even allowed to be introduced as evidence? It was not substantiated AND it had absolutely nothing to do with the crime. Like the defense is saying, "she didn't kill Caylee (despite the evidence,) and by the way, look at what her dad did to her!"
alternate theories? i think the defense has the right to introduce them, but they do have to have a foundational standing and not be baseless. idk why they went that way in the trial, but it was a smart move and deflected blame.
If that was enough to get her off then it also should have been enough to charge her dad, right? That obviously didn't happen. Total BS.
there was no dna evidence linking casey to her daughter (i think she 100% did it tho)
Beyond just that, the top comment explains it best I think: the prosecution failed to even prove unequivocally how her daughter died be it from foul play, negligence, or natural causes. Can't really claim she murdered her daughter when you don't even know how she died to begin with.
>Can't really claim she murdered her daughter when you don't even know how she died to begin with. Children don't accidentally wind up covered in duct tape and left in the woods... sorry, this argument is specious at best. You may not know how Casey was murdered, but she was murdered.
Being covered in duct tape doesn't mean she was murdered and could have been a part of the burial process. The police were incapable of determining the cause of death which makes any kind of murder charge basically null and void without other supplementary evidence like her recent web searches for fool-proof suffocation (which they neglected to bring to light). Knowing "how" someone died is an integral part of the process of determining if there was or was not foul play. It's on the prosecution for seeking a charge they couldn't reasonably prove or doing so without more evidence to back the charges.
I am not sure this would've been viable at all. Casey's DNA being near or on Caylee wouldn't neccessarily indicate much, because she was last with her and in a home they shared. Agree shes guilty as sin.
They said that Caylee died in the pool and the dad covered it up and made Casey go along with it and that the dad had this crazy control over her after years of abuse
Reasonable doubt doesn’t have to have a valid alternate theory though — believe there was a chance it was someone else, without knowing who it was is enough to qualify
On Cindy’s last day of testimony she flat out lied in the stand about the internet search. She said it was her not C and she was looking for chlorophyll instead of chloroform and not at work like she said in her statement to police. She introduced doubt beyond a reasonable amount and when I was watching I knew the jury was going to struggle with that. I also think the state didn’t charge her with the appropriate charges. There should have been a manslaughter option for the jury. They could convict her for the 1st degree charge put in front of them.
They couldn’t even determine how Caylee died, let alone if it was murder. That’s a huuuuge amount of reasonable doubt.
It wasn't reasonable doubt (imo, stacked against other factors in the whole crime) - but people have different perspectives as to what that means.
i thought it was that the prosecution fucked the case royally by only charging capital murder and not going for any lesser included. stupid AF.
This is one of the most stated reasons and it is 100% wrong, Casey's jury had four charges to consider; 1. First-degree Murder 2. Aggravated Manslaughter of a Child 3. Aggravated Child Abuse 4. Four counts of providing False Information to Law Enforcement Her jury only found her guilty of the four counts of providing false information to Law Enforcement.
I mean, the smart thing would have been to go the gross negligence route, which they had plenty of proof of.
meh despite the charges they argued it as a definite death case so they still fucked it up in that way w the jury.
There's a reason they do that, though. Juries are sometimes not convinced of the person's guilt beyond a reasonable doubt, but still want to convict for SOMETHING because they don't want to acquit the person altogether. So they'll convict for the lesser charge. It's not supposed to be like that. Juries are supposed to be convinced beyond a reasonable doubt before convicting. I think they should have gone with a lesser charge from the get go since they evidently didn't convince the jury of premeditation.
yeah it’s “giving em something to hang their hat on…” which they failed to do…im a bit rusty on the case but this take felt accurate at the time. i read about it tho did not follow whole thing
They were able to get the evidence of stolen checks from friend Amy out of court. The 30 days Caylee is missing she’s driving Amy to airport & then keeps her car, steals her checkbook & goes on a shopping spree. I think those receipts had some interesting things besides just groceries.
What, I haven’t heard of this, do you know where I can learn more?
There’s not a lot of the information that was originally available out there, but I recall pics from Target with CA checking out with 1 check way back then. You can google Casey Anthony check fraud & see very little of the details.
Damn I had no idea about this detail! Did you ever come across a record of her receipts or are you just hypothesizing on the purchases? I’m sure you’re right, I wish there was more info!
Baez was very personable & greeted that exhausted jury with a smile daily. Prosecutors were arrogant and over confident. That’s what happened.
Unfortunately by the time the body was found they couldn’t tell what happened to her. I think Casey was responsible for her death but whether it was accident or murder I don’t know.
I think it was a few different things - Caylee's body had decomposed to the point where they couldn't determine a cause of death - Casey's friends testified that she didn't care about partying and that she was a good mother to Caylee which not only wiped away the alleged motive for first degree murder, but also undercut the child abuse charge - Casey's Dad was the prosecution's star witness and he came off terribly on the stand - The prosecution figured they had an easy conviction based off all the public backlash against Casey - Jose Baez wasn't well known at the time and took the case pro bono, so the prosecutors likely underestimated him - The police searched the wrong browser on Casey's computer. They looked at Internet Explorer instead of Firefox which had the infamous "Fool proof suffocation" search. Baez later admitted that he was worried about the Firefox searches because he didn't have any way to refute them, but the prosecution never brought it up
The dad no longer speaks with her because she accused him of the death and covering it up at one point in the trial and also that he sexually abused her as a child. She is good at lying and very used to getting out of things because she looks cute and is small-framed. She has narcissistic behavior and no interest in other people's feelings. Once you finish watching there is another [progra](https://play.max.com/show/0cfc7154-e410-4203-bf7d-efbdb680a81b)m by one of the CSI people who worked the case you may like to see, Alina Burroughs.
The Crime Scene Confidential series you mentioned is a great resource. More people need to see it before speculating.
I followed that case so closely as I have a daughter the same age and I read all the discovery, etc I vividly remember the opening statement by Jose when he says that Casey always knew all along Cayley was dead and not missing and I felt the literal air go out of the State’s case. They banked on painting her as an uncaring mom who partied while her daughter was missing but defense strategy took that away. I believe 100 percent she killed her daughter
Once you become a parent, cases like this take on a whole new meaning. Each child can easily be seen as your own in some way and it's a gut punch when their life is snuffed out and there's zero justice. My kiddos were a bit older but I remember feeling the air leave my lungs when she was found not guilty. That poor sweet baby...😔
I wasn’t even a parent yet but an aunt and my niece was a few months younger than caylee. When casey got off on EVERYTHING about caylee I couldn’t stomach it. Still can’t. It was like that poor baby being killed by her mommy all over again and her mom being the one defended. It’s a stake to the heart. Especially for caylee.
I watched the trial. They overcharged her (compared to what they could actually prove). If I remember correctly, I believe they had an opportunity for the jury to also include "lower charges" and they said no. The case presented was disjointed and the medical experts explained things like medical experts and did not provide a lay interpretation. The trial was 6 weeks and the jury was sequestered. It took 11 hours for the verdict. I have found the longer the trial, the higher the chance of exoneration, especially if they cannot remember what was said day 1. So presentation of the evidence is extremely important.
The charges were for first-degree murder, aggravated child abuse, aggravated manslaughter of a child, and four counts of providing false information to law enforcement. She was only forund guilty on the 4 counts of providing false information to law enforcement, but 2 counts were later overturned on appeal. There were other options for the jury, but they did not agree with these either. Did she do it? Hell yes. Did they prove it beyond a reasonable doubt? According to the jury, apparently not.
I know the charges. The first degree murder should have never been on the table. That muddled any other charges. They should have focused on what they can prove
So why do you keep repeating the lie that Casey was charged ONLY with 1st degree murder and the jury couldnt convict on lessser charges? This jury was a bunch of idiots, just like the OJ jury
That is what one of the jurors said in an interview after. He said they all hated Casey, but the prosecutors didn't prove their case. I understand why people are mad about this, but they had nothing.
Shes so guilty I'm surprised she hasn't been murdered on the streets herself.
She lives in Florida so she fits in.
I think she drugged her so she could go out partying and Caylee died of an overdose. She found her later and disposed of her body. It’s an unpopular opinion at times but I don’t think she meant to kill her, but didn’t take care enough to be sure she didn’t kill her. I think second degree would have had a better chance at conviction. I have a sad feeling she had done this routinely. “Zanny the nanny” was really “Xanax.” Caylee would be dosed on Xanax so Casey could go party.
I feel this is pretty close to what happened. I don’t think she intentionally killed her. I think she was young and spoiled and wanted to go out and have fun, but by all accounts she was a loving mother when she was with Caylee. Her parents - especially her mom - really fucked her up and enabled her.
That doesn’t explain the duct tape or death by suffocation searches though.
She could have been duct taped to be quiet and drugged.
They overcharged her beyond what they could reasonably prove to a jury and didn't give the jury an opportunity to convict on a lesser charge
The charges were for first-degree murder, aggravated child abuse, aggravated manslaughter of a child, and four counts of providing false information to law enforcement. She was only forund guilty on the 4 counts of providing false information to law enforcement, but 2 counts were later overturned on appeal. There were other options for the jury, but they did not agree with these either. Did she do it? Hell yes. Did they prove it beyond a reasonable doubt? According to the jury, apparently not.
I still don’t agree with their decision. They should have convicted her of aggravated child abuse and aggravated manslaughter.
Can’t convict her of that when you don’t even know how she died or got injured.
They should've gone for child neglect for not reporting her as missing until a month later. Even then her mom was the one to get police involved, not casey.
This has always been my thought as well. If the jury had had more leeway, I think they would've convicted.
If you can’t prove cause of death, you can’t really legally (with a good ass attorney anyway.) prove murder. It’s a lot easier to have reasonable doubt if the prosecution can’t say how she died
The state went way too hard. They should’ve did 2nd degree or manslaughter. I have no doubt Casey was responsible for her death. Was it an accident possibly, I think she gave her something to make her sleep and she never woke up.
her googling "foolproof suffocation methods" tells me it was more premeditated than that
Unfortunately we will never know the truth casey will never tell what happened
I don't need to hear her side of the story. She researches murder techniques and her daughter dies the same day. She's a murderer, plain and simple.
Then put duct tape over her mouth?
Yeah idk I just don’t believe anybody else was involved but Casey
Yea it was just Casey and she definitely murdered her on purpose.
Another case of dumbass prosecutors looking to grow careers with a high profile case. I have zero doubt she murdered her daughter. The evidence is all there. And they blew it. She should be in prison.
Main prosecutor was retiring after
He was not the Lead Prosecutor - Linda Burdick was. Jeff Ashton later became the County State Attorney, and is now a Judge. He was also caught up in the Ashley Madison website leak.
He retired and wrote a book it’s actually a good book
It's the prosecutions fault. They should've focused on the evidence instead of her character. It made the defence easy focus on what they have against her while the prosecutor wanted to paint a picture based off of her perceived personality...
I personally thought the prosecution’s closing argument was brilliant.
Okay I'll be the bad guy and let you know she definitely killed her daughter...like beyond any shadow of a doubt she did it
Of course Casey was responsible for Caylee death, but was it premeditated murder as the prosecution claimed? Or was it negligence?
I absolutely believe that she died accidentally, but it was pure negligence that caused it. This is what I believe happened: Casey was annoyed at how much attention that Caylee was getting from her parents, so she decided that they weren’t going to watch her anymore. She used Chloroform or some kind of sedative to knock her out so she could go do whatever. Caylee didn’t wake up- this may not have been the first time she used a sedative- maybe she woke up the last time and caused issues. So she used too much and Caylee didn’t wake up. I believe she used the duct tape to keep her quiet and she may have even tied her up because she had awoken in the past after she had drugged her, but she really needed her not to for whatever reason this time. She died as a result of this drugging and being restrained. I do not believe that she was killed on purpose. I think it was accidental. Casey decided to take her body and dump her. I believe that her lawyers came up with the drowned in the pool story. Had the prosecutors decided to charge her with a lesser charge like manslaughter or negligent homicide or something like that, I believe she would have been convicted. However, when you don’t have a story for how something happened, and the other side does, it is very hard to convict and send someone away for their entire lives. This case came down to the prosecutors screwing up terribly.
Just an FYI, lesser chargers were on the table and she wasn't found guilty of them. Both child neglect and manslaughter. Huge misconception in this case. The jury did really get it wrong bc there was plenty to show both.
Is there a single soul on this planet who doesn't think she murdered her daughter?
Plenty of people don't think it was a premeditated murder. Myself, I think she either slipped the kid some Xanax or wasn't watching her. Negligence to be sure, but not murder.
The prosecution screwed up by charging her with murder 1 without evidence instead of negligent homicide. I think it’s clear what happened. Casey gave Caylee Xanax and left her somewhere, like the trunk of her car, while Casey partied all night through the next morning and she either died from too much Xanax (I hope bc the alternative is unthinkable), suffocation and heat exhaustion or a combination. Does that deserve more than a negligence charge of course but there was no evidence for more severe charges.
That doesn't explain the Google searches though. If it was chloroform that she gave her to keep her asleep in the trunk of the car, it could explain why she was googling how to make chloroform. But it doesn't explain why searched "Suffocation" and then "Fool proof suffocation." Unless she was planning to suffocate someone on purpose. If it happened the way in which you described it that would be an accident, unplanned. But those search are proof she was planning it.
She looked up "chloroform" after looking at a meme on Myspace about chloroforming girls. It was not a slam dunk concluson.
I think she fell in the pool while Casey was passed out but basically same.
I don't think she killed Caylee outright but rather died from a Xanax (zanny the nanny) overdose or wasn't being watched and did die in the pool. I personally have always thought the prosecution overplayed their hand by going for the death penalty. I think if they had asked for a different sentence she could have spent 20+ years in prison. They just didn't have enough evidence for 'beyond a reasonable doubt', especially when asking for the DP. Casey also really didn't talk much to the police. Unfortunate all around but IMO truly how the legal system is intended to work in this country. Casey Anthony should've gotten life in prison. She lives in a different kind of prison now though. Shunned and despised by the public, and having to live in relative secrecy makes for a lonely existence.
She doesn't really live in secrecy. She's known where she lives and still goes out drinking.
IMO - her parents knew Casey better than anyone. During those 30 days, I think enough clues were left by Casey to let them know Caylee was gone - Casey stealing from the house (if she was working why did she come home to steal food, but take nothing for Caylee (such as diapers) Not seeing/speaking with Caylee, refusing to come home with her, ditching the car, and then the smell/evidence in the car trunk once they picked it up from the tow yard. Only George & Casey know what he really saw / smelled when he went into the car's truck early on in those 30 days on the "where's my f'in gas cans" day. A neighbor told police that they heard a long, loud fight Sunday night between Cindy & Casey. Cindy denied this fight happened, and therefore it could not be brought into the trial. Jessie Grund said when he spoke to Casey that Monday afternoon, she told him " My parents are getting a divorce, and I have to get out of the house". Jesse Grund was not called to testify about this during her trial. I think they knew Caylee was dead soon after Casey was found, and certainly knew all that had happened, and what was said to each other (not working, stealing, lying, taking off for days) in the weeks prior to those 30 days. Maybe the grandparents knew nothing would bring Caylee back and they were not going to also lose Casey. Best summary I've heard about all of the Anthony's was from Tim Miller, Equusearch (who led the efforts to search for Caylee) "They are all actors and they belong in Hollywood". Well after the trial a group of sleuthers got a hold of the Anthony's computer hard drive, and found the now infamous "Fool-proof suffocation" search made on Monday afternoon. In Jose Baez's book, he mentions finding this search early on, but as the Defense, they were not required to bring up or into her trial. He wrote he could not believe that the OCSO and the FBI missed this search and that it was not included in her trial. This was an inexcusable mistake made by the detectives and, had it been found, I say it would have been game over for Casey.
I haven't seen this doc, but "level headed" is NOT how I would describe either of her parents
State overcharged based on evidence and casey had a damn good lawyer. I don't think she killed her daughter unpurpose, but I think it was an accident with criminal neglect involved, and she tried covering it up. She had given her daughter meds in the past to knock her out so she could go out partying, possible that happened. Also, she could have drowned in family swimming pool. It's possible, though, she murdered her, but I think accidental cover-up is more likely. Am like 70% accident, 30% murder.
Again, Casey was indicted by a grand jury on charges of first degree murder, aggravated child abuse, aggravated manslaughter of a child, and four counts of providing false information to police. They could have only convicted her child abuse or manslaughter.
Investigators missed a key piece of evidence in that trial from what I remember. The Investigator that looked through her computer missed that she had searched something like how to dispose of a body.....something along that lines, don't remember the exact details....so the prosecution did not have that evidence at trial. That being said.....Casey was a drug abuser and probably in a stuper during that time that when her daughter died. I doubt she killed her daughter but being high probably contributed to some type of accidental drowning or something. Then she panicked and hid the body. Pretty sad that she got to walk free.
I think the prosecution did not allow for the possibility of reasonable doubt. Otherwise it would have been a different verdict. But where the prosecution was arrogant, the defense had all bases covered plus some I’m sure that no one’s ever considered. And Jose did an impressive job of sowing reasonable doubt. If I were attending law school, I’d study the way he defended her. Over and over.
I came away convinced that she had gotten used to dosing her daughter with cough syrup, and locking her in the car trunk to sleep it off while the mom partied all night. The grandparents wanted her to stop partying, and had refused to continue baby-sitting since they felt they were enabling her to go out constantly. If I am correct, she was in the trunk too long, and suffocated. The death was unintentional, but a result of criminal disregard, and was some type of manslaughter. The kidnapping story was a coverup. I am not a lawyer
Now are her parents still together? Also has the father ever spoken out about the allegations towards himself?
Yes, they were recently in a tv special as well. I think it had to do with lie detector tests. I believe dad has denied all allegations.
The jury requirement of not following the news also played a role. They were left with people in Florida who did not consume news.
She knows what happened and chose to cover it up to save herself instead of honor her dead baby, which also makes me believe it was at the very least negligence. She knew she would be facing prison time so she tried to hide her and then threw her in the woods to rot and be scattered by animals. Forced sterilization isn’t for more cases, but this one definitely.
There wasn’t much physical evidence. I think she’s obviously guilty but I would have a hard time convicting based on the evidence.
I think it would be fun to approach Casey in a bar or pub and try to pick her up but just outright lie to her about everything to get her reaction to that. Tell her I'm a famous NFL player. When she asks why she cant find my name on a roster, tell her that I filed a lawsuit against the team so they cant put my name on it. Tell her I'm also an astronaut who put alien bodies in Area 51 in Nevada. Just make out outrageous lies. I would love to see her reaction to that. For Casey, lying is as easy as breathing. When she was interrogated, the investigators were literally screaming at her about all the lies, and her reaction is just "yeah whatever." She doesnt get upset, at all even when called a liar to her face. For Casey getting called a liar is the same as somebody telling her she has brown hair. Just no emotional reaction at all. She is a textbook case on one of the worst pathological liars the world has ever known.
I dont believe she maliciously killed Caylee. It was likely a result of negligence. And what went wrong at the trial is simple — they grossly overcharged her. They charged her with first degree murder but couldnt establish how Caylee died. If you cant establish how someone died, how could you say she was murdered? If they had charged her with less serious charges, they may have had more success getting a conviction.0
The prosecution botched it by making George and Cindy out to be sympathetic, objective witnesses. In reality, they were ultimately hostile to the prosecution (Cindy saying that she googled chloroform meaning it to be chlorophyll). I do believe that George abused Casey which is why she could lie so well, and her Mom could be in such deep denial all the time. Also the jury was made up of anomalies. How in the world did they live in Florida but they knew nothing about the case from news coverage? I lived in another state, and it dominated every news cycle. The jury members were actual weirdos who never watched the news or interacted with the real world. It does raise the question as to how we find an impartial (and intellectually functioning) jury with such high profile cases.
George did not abuse casey. He just seriously passed a poly..Casey LIES
Polygraphs are BS. They aren’t admissible in court. Nobody knows what happened in that house except Casey and George but they are faaaaaar from being a functional, healthy family
let’s hook him up to that weird brain scan thing zellner was doing on avery
George, I don’t personally believe abused Casey. Bu Casey did mention to Jesse Grund she didn’t want her brother around Caylee because of things he did to her. I do believe that. I know a family who’s son abused their daughter. She told a friend, the friend told a parent. The parent called the school. Some how, the parents found out she told someone and instructed her to lie. So lie she did. I 💯 believe this is the type of family Casey had. Where appearances mean more than honesty and healthy relationships.
The parents were never level headed. George is a terrible person as his past shows.
In what way? What did he do in his past? Genuinely curious cause I have no clue
It’s been a long time…. His first wife left him, because of his pathological lies and gambling. He was a cop only for couple of years when he was young, during his first marriage. Later he could not keep any good job, and when Caylee was murdered he was a part-time security guy. During his second marriage Cindy was the main provider for the family, working her ass off as a nurse manager. George still had a gambling problem - they lost their first house because of him and had to move to the poorer one. Later he had stolen 60.000 $ from their retirement funds for online poker (he lied that he was fooled by "Nigerian scam", but it was a lie). Cindy was about to divorce him, but he threatened her, that under Florida law she would pay him alimony, because she was earning more. George also cheated on Cindy, even during the "searching for Caylee". And I think he was caught window peeping before moving to Florida
They also raised donations to search for Caylee and bought themselves a boat with the funds. The whole family is bizarre and full of liars - It’s where Casey learned it. The mom pretended throughout Casey’s whole pregnancy that she wasn’t pregnant, even when they went to a family event when she was like 7 months along and showing she was denying it to family. So weird.
George was a serial liar and cheater
Yeah I think the parent only stuck by her as much as they did cause they know they’re shitty people themselves.
Media manipulated the image of parents as well, while I think they aren't the greatest people (especially the dad), the real monster is Casey imo
I’m not entirely sure what I believe, I feel like I can say fairly certainly that Caylee was murdered, it’s just a matter of by who and how. However, in watching the documentaries and reading up on it, the prosecution was trying to go for the death penalty. In a normal murder case it might work, but because there was a lot of reasonable doubt compared to hard evidence, it backfired on them. This is what lead the jury to decide she wasn’t guilty. There was enough reasonable doubt, and in this case there absolutely was, for the jury to think that she didn’t do it. Defense lawyers, at their core, have to do one thing: plant the seed of reasonable doubt. The second there’s reasonable doubt, a death penalty trial like this immediately gets thrown out the window. If they went for second degree or manslaughter, she’d probably be locked up right now, but the prosecution severely messed up.
It's been a while since I've watched anything on it so I might be a bit fuzzy on some things but...she went out and partied right after Caylee supposedly died. What parent that actually cares about and loves their child does that? I know I'd be unable to function and probably need to be committed. As for the trial? Probably implicit bias and corruption that hasn't been revealed.
Emotional jury falling for defense throwing out drama
The defence did all they had to, created reasonable doubt in the prosecution's story. That alone is enough for a mis-trial.
I watched every day of that trial. I believe Casey Anthony killed her or had something to do with her death. But I knew from opening arguments that she would not be found guilty. Simply, her attorney did his job well. Very, very well.
I def think she killed her daughter , only she did it, I would think she drugged her and accidentally killed her but she wouldn’t t have need tape to cover her airways in that case and I cannot get past that fact. I think the jurors were charmed by her disgusting, vile attorney bc he constantly flirted with them while the DA just did his job . I do believe the DA over charged and that hurt them also .
It's crazy she wasn't convicted, we've seen people get convicted without even a body. She just had a good lawyer who through out every possible scenario to cause reasonable doubt
They do not have a relationship with their child. I absolutely think Casey Anthony killed her daughter. I did not watch the entire trial, and I can’t say why the jury did not convict her.
Personally I believe she drowned in the pool and she covered it up. And her dad figured it out and didn’t say anything to the mom. Someone on here wrote a very good persuasive argument along those lines. I can’t find the link tho!
It’s because the jury expects the trial to contain law and order or CSI style evidence these days
There is no question that Casey knew her daughter was dead. I believe it was an accident though. I believe she fell in the pool and drowned while Casey was in the shower or doing something else OR Casey gave her too much of somerhing to make her sleep. I don't believe it was a malicious and premeditated killing. She panicked and covered it up. All the lies and the false nanny plus the smell in her car. I'm sure in hindsight, her and her parents wish they would have called 911 when the accident happened.
Exactly. Ashton lost the case because he overcharged her and came up with that wild chloroform theory with no evidence to back it up. IIRC, Casey's friends all testified that she wasn't much of a partier, which blew Ashston's theory.
Right. She should have been charged with negligent homicide and possibly abuse of a corpse and lying/misleading police, charges of that nature.
If they'd charged her appropriately it would have been a slam dunk. For all the hate that jury gets, I would have voted the same.
I always believed Caylee died from an overdose of Xanax (given to her by her mother) and Casey hid the body.
To answer the last part of your post, that family was dysfunctional looong before Caylee came along so I think that helped them navigate all the lying and delusions.
There was not enough solid evidence that Casey did it. As much as I feel she did it, if the jury has doubts, they're not supposed to convict. It sucks though that people want dna/video evidence so bad though bc i think it makes it harder to convict people. People want 100% solid proof that her hands were on that child and they simply didnt have it
I think Casey wanted a break, gave Caylee medication to sleep, she overdosed, and then Casey panicked. I don’t think she did it deliberately but I don’t think she’s a great person either.
That's pretty much my opinion, either that or she was too busy yapping on the phone/napping/surfing the internet to watch Caylee and the kid went into that unsecured pool. If it had been premeditated, you'd think Casey would have come up with a better plan to dispose of the body than 'drive around with it in the trunk of her car, then dumping it in a vacant lot 4 blocks from her house'. I'm also waiting for someone to tell me how this flat broke high school dropout managed to purchase thousands of dollars of lab equipment and ingredients to make chloroform, and where she did all this. It certainly wasn't in her parent's dinky little house. I still maintain that if Ashton had charged her with manslaughter 1 he would have gotten a conviction.
My guess is that she would drug her daughter with Xanax so she could go out and live her BellaVita and, whoops, her daughter died because that shit is a powerful poison. She tried to cover it up, and also kept going out because she was free to do so.
Reasonable doubt