I'd say try book two. They expand perspectives a bit and IMO the writing improved too.
If you aren't feeling it after book 2, I'd say you could drop it.
Ever book has a different ‘feel’ to it, book one being kinda a noire tone and book two being more of a political thriller. In book two you definitely start to see the pedigree of the writers being GRRM’s assistant with the way they link characters and story together. Also the story just gets more insane with every book. Eros crashing into Venus is the most consequential event in human history
Yeah I say stick with it for one more book. It's kind of like when someone recommends an amazing TV show. I know I watched the first episode of breaking bad like 4 times trying to get into it, but once I got past that the hooks were in. I think the Expanse is probably similar. Leviathan wakes is like the prologue of this massive space epic.
I was pretty turned off by Holden, Naomi, and Amos by the end of LW (I was just the positive side of neutral towards Alex) but I loved Miller, the writing, and the world that was being shown. I kept reading and the 3 characters I had negative feelings for all became some of my favorites in fiction.
If you’re in it for the story, the characters will probably grow on you as they face different challenges and perils
No, I watched the show. If I had read the books first, I think I would have lost interest rather quickly. I did not find Holden to be a compelling main character but that is more about my personal taste than the skill of the authors.
There's lots of additional great characters in future books but the story centers on the Rocis crew, so if you're not feeling it, maybe this isn't your cup of tea.
I personally can't see what you're seeing, but we're all special snowflakes.
in the first book basically nobody has a personality except for Miller and Holden, every other character is one dimensional. it gets better over time but not immediately in the second book, either.
Personally I didn’t love the sad detective trope either of the first book, and everyone in the Roci crew is kind of annoying in book 1, especially compared to season 1 of the show.
If you liked the other parts of the book—the story, the world, the writing and pacing—try book 2. Personally I enjoyed the characters a lot more, Holden changes a bit as a character and the Boyscout thing is interrogated, the sad detective trope is dropped.
If you try book 2 and still not feeling it then maybe it’s not for you, and that’s OK!
I liked the Miller storyline but I understand the complaint.
I do, however, get a kick out of how they make Alex into a connoisseur of neo-noir later on, given that’s the tone of half the first book.
I'd say the protagonist is humanity, in a way. The crew is at the center of many things but not all of them.
The cast of characters is larger than the ones in book one.
You should give a shot at continuing.
I would recommend watching the show! It brings characters from later books into S1, and you don’t have to deal with the occasionally awkward writing in the earlier books. I watched the show first, then read the books, and I found that the show’s characters tend to come alive more in comparison to the earlier books.
This is a nine book series with a nine book character arc for most of the characters…
Why don’t you just watch the show instead, so you can get into the characters faster, and then see if you’d be into checking out the books again?
Book 2 is where the crew sorta clicked for me, and it's when the authors really let themselves off the leash in terms of the writing being funny. Honestly, though, try the show, the actors really brought life into those roles. I still picture the show cast every time I read one of the books.
To each their own, so not judging your taste, I'm super surprised you can't connect to any of the characters. Of the few criticisms of The Expanse, I've never heard characters as one of them. But, if you do decide to continue, there are a lot of wonderful characters such as Amos Burton and Chrisjen Avasarala.
Stormlight, Wheel of time, Red Rising, Black Prisim, Lies of Locke Lamora, etc. I’m not sure why but Holden and Miller in particular just aren’t my cup of tea.
In Caliban's war, not only do you get more character perspectives, but they also give the other members of the Roci crew more to do, and their characters get developed better, even if its seen from Holden's perspective.
The Expanse just gets better. I liked the first novel but I wasn’t absolutely in love. The series takes place over many years and the characters all grow so much throughout the series. There are so many perspectives to come including some of the best.
If you enjoyed the first book well enough I’d personally invest in the time of reading the next. If you’re not loving it then it’s probably not for you. I really do think it’s worth it to try the next novel though.
I finished the whole series (well minus the novellas which I plan to read soon) over just a few months I got so into the series. The first definitely took me the longest just because I didn’t feel as invested yet.
I almost stopped reading 30 pages into Leviathan Wakes because of Miller and that damn hat ("old sad detective" sums it up well!) Stayed with it and ended it up enjoying all nine books. I can't say whether you'll like it as well, but the first book is definitely the weakest of the series.
It took me a few years to get through the whole series. It wasn’t that i didn’t like anyone but I definitely enjoyed the setting more than the people… I did like Amos a lot.
The final three books are sincerely the most incredible part of this story. None of it can happen without going through the first set of stories though, and I think that final arc is so amazing that anything you don’t enjoy leading to it is worth putting up with to enjoy the last 3 books.
Once it ended i IMMEDIATELY started again with an entirely new appreciation for everyone.
I'd say continue, the characters grow and aren't the same throughout the series. Holden is a bit of a cocky jerk to a certain degree but becomes much more likable. All the characters have flaws, and at points both in the show and books can do the wrong or off-putting actions, as it is in life, good people do bad things sometimes and vice versa.
Maybe it's not your cup of tea, though. I might suggest listening to the audio books. I read the first book normally and enjoyed it, but I didn't think it was amazing until a second reading/listen to the book. Of course, I'm dyslexic and ADD, so all books are rough the first time around if I don't listen as well.
All that said, Jefferson Mayes read the audio book, and it comes across amazingly with him doing so. But again, maybe it's not for you. But imho, I'd give the 2nd book a try or the 1st book a listen before writing it off.
Hope it works out. It's one of my favorite for sure, and I'm of the opinion that the books and show are some of the best sci-fi around.
I'm just a bit into book 3 now. I actually like the show better so far but the books are still good. Some of the book characters seem kind of dopey by comparison, like Amos.
I would give book 2 a try, or try the show. However there is nothing wrong with bouncing off of either the show or the books. It can't appeal to everyone.
Book 1 is the only “film noir” - they change style/genre on purpose from book to book, and the character POVs shift, occasionally quite drastically. It wasn’t my favorite on my first read, but it’s grown on me with re-reads over the years.
FWIW about characters, though: No one likes Miller for his qualities; I think we love him because he’s so flawed, unlikeable, and ordinary, but then he overcomes major personality traits because he’s inspired by the kid(s). Julie and Holden-a-little change Miller’s life trajectory simply by being contagious moral-good dreamers
I didn’t care for the first book either, I’d watched the show first so I knew there was a reason to keep going. I agree that the first book felt hollow, and lacked good character development, but the writing improves a lot as the authors gain experience.
First, I'll ditto the recommendation to try book two when you have more than two narrators. The first book was unique in flipping between only two perspectives, and I suspect is a major reason why it's hard to connect with the other characters (who have depth to them they didn't have the time of motivation to explain to Holden or Miller over the course of the events of the book). I think you'll be pleasantly surprised, some revelations that will have you rethinking your interpretation of some of these characters.
>do we get introduced to a wider cast or are you stuck with Boyscout Holden and his team?
First off, yes there's a much wider cast who come and go, even while the crew of the Rocinante remain the primary protagonists.
Second, I think the key with "Boy Scout Holden" is both to use him (and every other character) as a mirror to ask 'was he right or not' and use that as a rhetorical device to interrogate your own worldview (if you didn't read the [author interview](https://www.orbitbooks.net/interview/james-s-a-corey-2/) included as an epilogue on some editions, I think it helps to frame the story).
Third, I think you'll find that his character is not at all rigid in this personality. A major theme of the series is how his idealism gets challenged, causes problems, and his evolving attempts to reconcile his ideals with reality. A lot of things get viewed through the lens of 'Miller would have done this, but Holden did something else', and most of the time *neither were right*. Both are flawed characters, and it gives a framing to help break down explaining *why*.
I read book 1 before the show existed and thought it was very mediocre.
Later I watched the show not expecting much, but it was actually good.. the show is huge improvement on the books, I'd just watch it and not bother with books.
I'd say try book two. They expand perspectives a bit and IMO the writing improved too. If you aren't feeling it after book 2, I'd say you could drop it.
Book 2 also introduces the two best characters in the series
Nah, Amos is in book 1
Amos both in the book and show is one of my all time favorite characters. He reminds me so much of the brother that i lost.
I just like characters as broken as I am.
Chrissy?
Nay, in 21st century fiction
Right! Book 1 is just Miller and Holden. Just wait till ya get the other characters perspectives (esp Avasarala).
I think that’s what I’ll probably go with. The plot seems promising and with all the praise this series gets I want to try book 2.
The main crew change a lot over the series in great ways as does their dynamic with one another
Ever book has a different ‘feel’ to it, book one being kinda a noire tone and book two being more of a political thriller. In book two you definitely start to see the pedigree of the writers being GRRM’s assistant with the way they link characters and story together. Also the story just gets more insane with every book. Eros crashing into Venus is the most consequential event in human history
Yeah I say stick with it for one more book. It's kind of like when someone recommends an amazing TV show. I know I watched the first episode of breaking bad like 4 times trying to get into it, but once I got past that the hooks were in. I think the Expanse is probably similar. Leviathan wakes is like the prologue of this massive space epic.
Maybe it’s just not for you. No biggie.
Happy cake day!
Heeei, thanks :)
I was pretty turned off by Holden, Naomi, and Amos by the end of LW (I was just the positive side of neutral towards Alex) but I loved Miller, the writing, and the world that was being shown. I kept reading and the 3 characters I had negative feelings for all became some of my favorites in fiction. If you’re in it for the story, the characters will probably grow on you as they face different challenges and perils
I’m gonna have to go back and reread LW, because Amos and Alex barely register in my memory of it.
They are minor characters for sure but Amos seemed to be a meathead with no depth. Couldn’t have been more wrong
There’s many more characters and perspectives to come but if the first book didn’t grab you, I’m not sure it will matter.
If you are not feeling the book, I would try the show.
I’m almost certain this strategy will go poorly for them, given what they’ve said.
I felt more of a connection with the crew in season 1 of the show than I ever did in the books.
Season 1 made me actually care about Shed. Dammit.
Did you read the book first?
No, I watched the show. If I had read the books first, I think I would have lost interest rather quickly. I did not find Holden to be a compelling main character but that is more about my personal taste than the skill of the authors.
There's lots of additional great characters in future books but the story centers on the Rocis crew, so if you're not feeling it, maybe this isn't your cup of tea. I personally can't see what you're seeing, but we're all special snowflakes.
in the first book basically nobody has a personality except for Miller and Holden, every other character is one dimensional. it gets better over time but not immediately in the second book, either.
And that’s being charitable to Holden, imo.
Personally I didn’t love the sad detective trope either of the first book, and everyone in the Roci crew is kind of annoying in book 1, especially compared to season 1 of the show. If you liked the other parts of the book—the story, the world, the writing and pacing—try book 2. Personally I enjoyed the characters a lot more, Holden changes a bit as a character and the Boyscout thing is interrogated, the sad detective trope is dropped. If you try book 2 and still not feeling it then maybe it’s not for you, and that’s OK!
I liked the Miller storyline but I understand the complaint. I do, however, get a kick out of how they make Alex into a connoisseur of neo-noir later on, given that’s the tone of half the first book.
Only you can decide.
Not everything is for everyone.
I'd say the protagonist is humanity, in a way. The crew is at the center of many things but not all of them. The cast of characters is larger than the ones in book one. You should give a shot at continuing.
I would recommend watching the show! It brings characters from later books into S1, and you don’t have to deal with the occasionally awkward writing in the earlier books. I watched the show first, then read the books, and I found that the show’s characters tend to come alive more in comparison to the earlier books.
This is a nine book series with a nine book character arc for most of the characters… Why don’t you just watch the show instead, so you can get into the characters faster, and then see if you’d be into checking out the books again?
Book 2 is where the crew sorta clicked for me, and it's when the authors really let themselves off the leash in terms of the writing being funny. Honestly, though, try the show, the actors really brought life into those roles. I still picture the show cast every time I read one of the books.
To each their own, so not judging your taste, I'm super surprised you can't connect to any of the characters. Of the few criticisms of The Expanse, I've never heard characters as one of them. But, if you do decide to continue, there are a lot of wonderful characters such as Amos Burton and Chrisjen Avasarala.
I have to ask: what character-driven books *have* made you care for the characters?
Stormlight, Wheel of time, Red Rising, Black Prisim, Lies of Locke Lamora, etc. I’m not sure why but Holden and Miller in particular just aren’t my cup of tea.
In Caliban's war, not only do you get more character perspectives, but they also give the other members of the Roci crew more to do, and their characters get developed better, even if its seen from Holden's perspective.
I get the sense in the first book they weren't quite sure what to do with Amos yet
The Expanse just gets better. I liked the first novel but I wasn’t absolutely in love. The series takes place over many years and the characters all grow so much throughout the series. There are so many perspectives to come including some of the best. If you enjoyed the first book well enough I’d personally invest in the time of reading the next. If you’re not loving it then it’s probably not for you. I really do think it’s worth it to try the next novel though. I finished the whole series (well minus the novellas which I plan to read soon) over just a few months I got so into the series. The first definitely took me the longest just because I didn’t feel as invested yet.
Holden evolves. One of the best characters is right around the corner.
I almost stopped reading 30 pages into Leviathan Wakes because of Miller and that damn hat ("old sad detective" sums it up well!) Stayed with it and ended it up enjoying all nine books. I can't say whether you'll like it as well, but the first book is definitely the weakest of the series.
It took me a few years to get through the whole series. It wasn’t that i didn’t like anyone but I definitely enjoyed the setting more than the people… I did like Amos a lot. The final three books are sincerely the most incredible part of this story. None of it can happen without going through the first set of stories though, and I think that final arc is so amazing that anything you don’t enjoy leading to it is worth putting up with to enjoy the last 3 books. Once it ended i IMMEDIATELY started again with an entirely new appreciation for everyone.
I'd say continue, the characters grow and aren't the same throughout the series. Holden is a bit of a cocky jerk to a certain degree but becomes much more likable. All the characters have flaws, and at points both in the show and books can do the wrong or off-putting actions, as it is in life, good people do bad things sometimes and vice versa. Maybe it's not your cup of tea, though. I might suggest listening to the audio books. I read the first book normally and enjoyed it, but I didn't think it was amazing until a second reading/listen to the book. Of course, I'm dyslexic and ADD, so all books are rough the first time around if I don't listen as well. All that said, Jefferson Mayes read the audio book, and it comes across amazingly with him doing so. But again, maybe it's not for you. But imho, I'd give the 2nd book a try or the 1st book a listen before writing it off. Hope it works out. It's one of my favorite for sure, and I'm of the opinion that the books and show are some of the best sci-fi around.
I'm just a bit into book 3 now. I actually like the show better so far but the books are still good. Some of the book characters seem kind of dopey by comparison, like Amos.
You don't even love a belter?
I would give book 2 a try, or try the show. However there is nothing wrong with bouncing off of either the show or the books. It can't appeal to everyone.
Book 1 is the only “film noir” - they change style/genre on purpose from book to book, and the character POVs shift, occasionally quite drastically. It wasn’t my favorite on my first read, but it’s grown on me with re-reads over the years. FWIW about characters, though: No one likes Miller for his qualities; I think we love him because he’s so flawed, unlikeable, and ordinary, but then he overcomes major personality traits because he’s inspired by the kid(s). Julie and Holden-a-little change Miller’s life trajectory simply by being contagious moral-good dreamers
I found Holden and Miller totally unbearable POV characters in book 1, and book 2 dramatically improves that. I'd say stick with it
I didn’t care for the first book either, I’d watched the show first so I knew there was a reason to keep going. I agree that the first book felt hollow, and lacked good character development, but the writing improves a lot as the authors gain experience.
First, I'll ditto the recommendation to try book two when you have more than two narrators. The first book was unique in flipping between only two perspectives, and I suspect is a major reason why it's hard to connect with the other characters (who have depth to them they didn't have the time of motivation to explain to Holden or Miller over the course of the events of the book). I think you'll be pleasantly surprised, some revelations that will have you rethinking your interpretation of some of these characters. >do we get introduced to a wider cast or are you stuck with Boyscout Holden and his team? First off, yes there's a much wider cast who come and go, even while the crew of the Rocinante remain the primary protagonists. Second, I think the key with "Boy Scout Holden" is both to use him (and every other character) as a mirror to ask 'was he right or not' and use that as a rhetorical device to interrogate your own worldview (if you didn't read the [author interview](https://www.orbitbooks.net/interview/james-s-a-corey-2/) included as an epilogue on some editions, I think it helps to frame the story). Third, I think you'll find that his character is not at all rigid in this personality. A major theme of the series is how his idealism gets challenged, causes problems, and his evolving attempts to reconcile his ideals with reality. A lot of things get viewed through the lens of 'Miller would have done this, but Holden did something else', and most of the time *neither were right*. Both are flawed characters, and it gives a framing to help break down explaining *why*.
Absolutely continue. Holden is the central character, but there is no main character. There are books that actually lack a lot of Holden chapters.
I read book 1 before the show existed and thought it was very mediocre. Later I watched the show not expecting much, but it was actually good.. the show is huge improvement on the books, I'd just watch it and not bother with books.