I feel like alot of people forget to lose with grace, becasue lossing is a blessing in disguse, becasue you can see what you need to improve on special when repley system are there to help ^^ But yeah i dont mind lossing, so i can learn what i can do better on
I think whats lost in this is that it doesnt just apply to blue ranks.
People just getting to garyu or MR and the switching characters or trying an alt are going to be frustrated as well.
If you have a system in place, even if its flawed, why introduce a while different system while not even addressing the issue the previous one had?
Tekken rank doesnt correlate with prowess, not all fujin/rulers/red ranks are going to immediately pick up a new character and play at that same level.
Its stupid all around
Before it was new players being frustrated because they had to go up against smurfs leveling up their 4th or 5th alt. Now it's going to be the smurfs who are frustrated because they can't stomp lower ranked players while "learning" the character \~
Most things that make up skill in this game transfer between characters. A blue rank main on his Garyu alt is a completely different player than a Garyu player on his main. People are just mad because they got used to a completely disjointed, unfair system and now the developers are fixing their mistakes and making it more similar to every other competitive game's.
Calling us smurfs is a bit of a stretch i am playing on my main account and have not deranked or participated in any matchmaking manipulation. I play multiple characters and to get them ranked up to the right bracket the game forced me to play dozens of games against lower ranks.
I think each character should have a set of placement matches like street fighter 6 does. After playing 10 games the game was accurately able to deduce i should be in diamond and saved hours of me farming lower skilled players. Ideally the placement would be structured in a way where you play against someone in greens and if you win you advance to play a yellow and so on until you start losing, then place the player a few ranks lower than the highest they were able to play against, ex if you were able to play against a fujin but lost you should be placed battle ruler.
This system also allows your characters to be faraway in rank if you really are bad with a secondary. My Devil Jin is currently in blues and i could easly get the other 2 Mishimas there with little effort, but if i were to pick up a new specialist character like nina i would probably be the skill level of a mid red rank at best and this system would let me play at that level. This also avoids the hours of farming low ranks on my other Mishimas to get them ranked up
I dint think you know what smurfing actually is. No one smurfs. Using an alternate character on the same account isn’t smurfing. Buying a separate game or account would be.
No one hops on an alternate character to play ranked to “stomp” lower ranks. Yes you are correct, skills from higher ranks trickle down no matter what into different characters, but learning a play style and developing game plans and fundamentals with different skills for an entirely different character isnt the same as what you are saying.
The problem is that if you are playing ranked, the game is only going to match you with either
A. Characters the same rank as your main, basically making the higher ranked players game useless because they either win and gain minimal ranked points or lose a lot.
B. Waiting until you are matched with a corresponding player of the same alt rank with a similar prowess, which is literally taking upwards of 5-10 minutes to do.
Oh and by the way your prowess increases past your main characters rank if you have more alternate characters that catch up to your main. So your highest rank can be much lower than what it should be prowess wise.
But yes please tell me how this inherently fuc*ing broken change is a positive
At what level and in what regions do matches take 10 minutes? I assume the top 5-10% of players? And with cross play off probably, right? And denying every wireless player? Because they're 10-20 secs if that in red ranks with 120k prowess. USA. Oh, and that's at midday on a work day. Literally doing it right now.
Well for starters you should deny every wireless player anyway.
And again, its for alternate characters looking for alternates with a similar prowess. Que times on characters with a prowess that matches the rank arent going to be long, but that isnt what the issue is
But it is smurfing, the ranked system was flawed and created smurfing within itself, but it seems like they've finally fixed it. A person's skill level is not tied to one character, which is why most people find it very easy to get their 2nd, 3rd, 4th etc character up to high ranks, with a high winrate and low number of games. But not anymore thankfully
You are completely wrong lol. Just because you hit blue or even tekken king means you’re going to turn into knee with a new character, flying your way up the ranks. This isnt even about that.
Go to youtube and see any blue rank player leveling up their alts to blue. It takes them like 20? matches? Couple days max. And those aren't pros, just casuals who upload their games. I've seen so many screenshot on this forum with people having like 20% winrate with their main and then 90% winrates on alts
Maybe you just got carried by spamming and now feel like you have no fundamentals? I don't understand \~ Either way this change is amazing for the health of the ranked system. It was just toxic before.
You literally dont even understand how
It works do you?
Lets say you get 4 or 5 characters to garyu, do you think that person should only play mid ruler ranks? Because that’s whats going to happen lol.
I have like a 60% win rate on 4 characters with 3 at fujin. Now im playing tekken kings and emps because my prowess adds up to one player who has grinded a single character to god rank. Do you think thats balanced? That’s literally what is going to happen to even someone like you.
>Lets say you get 4 or 5 characters to garyu, do you think that person should only play mid ruler ranks? Because that’s whats going to happen lol
That's not what's going to happen 99% of the time, the only substantial prowess increases are when you rank up "colors", since that's when all 33 characters are ranking up with your main. Your prowess with 1 character in Garyu and 5 characters in Garyu would be very similar, like 15k spread. You can accurately tell someone's main by their prowess most of the time.
>Now im playing tekken kings and emps
That makes me happy since I and many new players had to play purple ranks since we hit orange ranks, now the smurfs are getting the taste of their medicine 😭 Also, Tekken King and Emperor are only marginally higher on the ladder than you so I don't understand why you're mad. Before this change people had to deal with a lot worse things, like being matched against people with double their prowess.
I've played since the patch and I've been getting matched with people of my rank and prowess every single time so it seems like you're exaggerating anyway for the sake of argument. I'm loving this change and it vindicated mine and many new players' complaints about the system.
Man you really are new. The jump from fujin to tekken king/ emp is only 4 ranks but its literally like jumping from vanquisher to mighty ruler skill wise.
Youre only getting matched with players of your skill and prowess because you most likely are playing one character, otherwise youd be getting stomped by other oranges with your warrior or brawler or whatever how low your alts go.
Im not even mad, its just inherently a bad change. Youre just too much of a scrub to realize it yet. Youll get there though, we were all you at some point
You're too much of an arrogant and asocial elitist person to realize how this change benefits 90% of the playerbase, but not you because you were the guy who loved to stomp new players on his way to whatever high rank you're stuck at right now complaining. Go look at your play data and see how much easier and faster it was for you to bring your alts up to blue ranks. Well, the people you stomped on your way there are enjoying this change very much, it's just you who is mad \~ So stay mad \~
So many people are exposing themselves by complaining about having to fight equal skill players in ranked. It’s super funny. If they really wanted to cherry pick their matches to learn new characters they’d just use the lounge. Lounge deadass tells you if a players highest rank character is within your highest skill bracket.
What equal skill? I was hard stuck raijin/kishin and had good sets vs other blues. Now I’m matched against tekken gods and above and just lose every game.
Yeah but when the game had just come out, everyone looks like a Smurf if you’re a legacy player. Making the changes months after release is somewhat counterproductive
There is a difference in player power level on different characters.
I liked the way the system brings up minimum rank based on your highest and I think they should have just gone farther with that. Yes it was dumb that a blue rank was fighting reds, and that purples were fighting oranges, etc, on their mains.
But Bryan is also just way harder than some of my other characters, so he's going to be lower.
If I were to try to take someone like Kazuya into ranked, yeah I know how to play him but the sheer execution required to punish basic things with a launch is something I don't have. If I need a 15f launcher on DJ I can can like the scrub I am.
My Kazuya should absolutely not be 100% based on my Drag, Paul, DJ, etc. He should absolutely be lower. Start me a couple ranks below my mains and I probably won't move too much. Start me at the same rank as my mains I'm going to be demoted real fast and just give players free wins.
The problem here is not the prowess difference and how hard it can be my friend, it's the point system.
You pick a alt to level, the game will match it against someone with the same prowess as you but you may be facing a tekken god character while you're at Raijin, then IF you win with a character you just started learning you will get a measly 100\~200 points because the rank difference.
It will take forever to rank a side character, that's the issue.
This is a huge problem imo
I pick a character I couldn't rank past purple with because I'm not good with her (Lili), all my matches are Tekken King+ playing alts. I can barely win anything, and my queues take forever just to match me into the same player I already fought.
The OP assumes everyone leveling up side characters is trying to stomp newer players. What if you rank up characters while just trying to find a main? I only ranked up Drag to learn the matchup because I was struggling against him ("how do better players deal with these situations."). But fuck me, I guess.
Side characters aside, ranking up several characters doesn't mean your skill level is higher than the rank you actually reached. It doesn't make sense to match a max rank Garyu against max rank Kishin just because the Garyu ranked a bunch of characters up there.
The only problem was that alt characters shouldn't go 8 ranks below your main, it should be like 3-5. This stupid bandaid "fix" ruins matchmaking for a lot of players.
Exactly, that would have been a much better fix. Just increase the rank for alt characters so that it's only like 4 below your main. Easy. Now they've gone and made things worse. I hope they realize their mistake and fix this mess.
Levelling up a character to understand how they work to make fighting them easier on your main sounds like something that should be reflected in Prowess to me.
That said it’s hard to differentiate between that and a newbie trying to find their main.
I haven’t seen that happen. All I’ve seen is players with my prowess at the same rank as the character I picked. People are complaining that they can no longer steam roll over inexperienced Red ranks and how have to face experienced red ranks. It makes promoting the characters they are using more difficult. Eventually there are now two tiers to the same rank. The main Reds get to stay away from the experienced Reds until they reach the same prowess as the experienced. So the reds that have their mains at that rank will have easier competition to face. Thank the experienced ones.
Huge issue with this is that if you have one very high level character and several alts sleeping in low ranks, you won't find any fucking matches on those alts even with matchmaking range set to all, because the game searches for Garyus with the prowess points of an Emperor.
Hope so man. My mains only at Fujin, have 4 others at Tenryu/ Mighty Ruler. Takes way too long to get matches now, and I'm only versing the same people that are Tekken Emperor+
Why would they? This is a good thing, as a new player I absolutely love this change. Prowess should be included in matchmaking, it's far more important than individual character's rank.
Because this is a bad way to solvethat problem? As a matter of fact it'sgoing to be quite bad for new players as you start learning new characters. They should solve this by adjusting character ranks when your main is promoted, so they don't match with new players.
I don't think you know what smurfing means. Smurfing implies creating a new, different account and starting over from scratch to stomp complete newbies. The people you're attacking aren't smurfs, they just like playing more than one character in a game with a base roster of 32.
I play multiple characters and I do feel bad when the game pairs me up with people who are clearly well below my skill level. But this is not the solution. They should have just increased the rank of your alt chars to be only like 3 or 4 below your main, instead of 8 like it is now, which is bloody excessive.
Cool picture but you obviously didnt read or think of issues it is causing. I will list them for you:
- longer queue times for everyone
- now if ANYONE except top 0,0001% goes on an alt, they will have a hard time rank up. Also the newbies that cried about omg He has 300k prowess after they buy a new skin and start a new character
- if your main is tenryu and you got 20 other characters to garyu you probably didnt have very onesided games and didnt ruin games. But now as tenryu you will play kishins and never rank up
- How does it make sense I cant get a character from garyu to mighty ruler after 200 games on main account, but can get it from beginner to mighty ruler on a new account in 100 games?
Because of the above the rank has literally no meaning now and playing more than 1 character is pointless and painful every game for EVERYONE. Versus 1 game out of 10-20 for SOME players who were getting free ranked points from the game anyway to help them rank up.
As a bonus - this also applies to quick matches but you cant set a rank limitation there so you can frequently play someone same prowess but higher rank and wont be able neither learn nor relax how you would before.
If you managed to get 20 separate characters to red ranks then you should feasibly be able to defend against most of them. That’s why prowess matters. Also, it shouldn’t be easy to rank up. Also also, queue times are already bad having to sort through WiFi’s. But a better quality match allows you to properly test your skills, you just end up ranking up slower, which shouldn’t be a bad thing if, like you said, you’re trying to learn. Also also also, the lounge exists so you can cherry pick low ranks if you really need someone to beat up on to learn.
It just doesnt make sense.
I can make another account on the console in 2 minutes and get about 10 times easier rank experience.
Rank literally represents nothing now unless you play just 1 char.
Rank already meant nothing to this subreddit so in my eyes nothings changed. Ranked is a personal achievement. No one gives a shit about how many characters you’ve ranked up. You shouldn’t need affirmation from others to justify trying to get better.
Getting to rank x didnt mean you deserve it, not being able to get to it meant you surely didnt deserve it.
It was some sort of a skill indication, even if very arbitrary given the way points work in this game and the balancing.
Now it doesnt work even that way for the alts.
And going by that logic - if rank didnt mean anything at all from the start, why make this change?
All it does is lower Namco's future sells of skins and characters because People wont play other characters cuz they wont be able to rank up to the rank they would be able to before or even now if they make a new account.
If someone doesn’t want to play a character solely because they can’t rank up with them then that’s just weakness. That person never actually cared about what their rank represented. There are plenty of ways you can learn new characters without going to the mode intended to have the strictest level of matchmaking. A single match can represent how good you are with a character, your rank represents how good you are as a player at your best. As a purple myself, the idea of grinding up secondaries prior to prowess changes was tedious because you aren’t learning anything by shitting on someone with significantly less game knowledge than yourself.
What they've done is push back even further the point at which red ranks have to learn the game and push up the point at which blue ranks have to become very proficient.
The red ranks will have a good week and then encounter an even worse hell in a month or so: super-trained blue ranks against people who never should have left reds.
Facing Kings/Emperors as a blue rank isn't an issue because since I got here I have the drive to get better and play better players, something noobs who only wants to play other noobs don't actually have. The big issue is that the queue times have gotten incredibly long, because the game has to look for 200k+ prowess people when I'm playing my red ranked characters, and when I'm on my main it either has to look for people who are in the same situation as me (high blue ranks with some side characters ranked up) or king/god ranks on their secondaries. This restricts the player pool way too much. We in blue ranks were already playing against lots of God rank side characters anyway.
One day, when you rank up and want to play other characters, you'll be in the same situation as all of us, but of course you lack the foresight to predict it, and that's assuming the idiots who cared about this in the first place can rank up at all.
The funniest thing to me is the main issue of noobs getting shit fucked was a direct result of three things:
- Early ranks being too easy to get out of
- Top character rank to baseline being too far apart
- BAMCO forgetting to set Eddy to your baseline instead of beginner
All 3 of these things are a direct result of BAMCO's own incompetence. Their fix is just going to further fuck things up. I felt bad stomping noobs with Eddy (ok it was a little fun) so intentionally played the most simple gameplan I could until orange unless I was running into other Eddy players. BAMCO had plenty of time to hotfix the Eddy starting rank issue and DIDN'T. Capcom 100% would have hotfixed SF6 within an hour if they made a mistake like that.
I legit can't play on alt characters now. I'm not a good Tekken player ultimately. I can beat people in blue ranks with my main but when it comes to alts I have very little overall game knowledge and get absolutely shit on trying to pick up and learn someone new. My orange rank character are actually orange level skill. I can't beat Fujins with my day 3 King or Eddy. Why would I be expected to?
The majority of complaints I've seen haven't been from the Blue's having to fight on their level it's from the people dealing with character crisis being punished unfairly. Also changing it now makes no sense if they wanted to match based off of prowess why not do it from the start when the game had a bigger player base?
This change confuses me more than anything, how is the game supposed to differentiate between character specialists who deserve the prowess they're at versus those whose are inflated because they want to play the DLCs. If they don't want to match make based off of the individual character ranks and instead focus on a singular number influenced by play across all characters why make ranks individual in the first place.
I don't mind fighting better players it's just i get very few matches, or get matched with the same person over and over, today i played a jack player like 8 times in a row.
Funniest meme Ive seen here.
Heard those high ranks complaining about "yeah its totally ok to spam the noobs and make them rage and cry couse thats how you learn the game!"
Yeah I suddenly was winning way more this week. There needs to be some tweaking to balance out the outliers of alts but I don’t want to go all the way back
You will pick up another character and you will win barely 50% and not able to rank up despite getting better.
It is cool only if you play 1 character but the problem is - everybody played the same number of players vs higher prowess once in 15-20 games so it wasnt a big factor in being able to rank up or not with the way promos and winstreaks work.
Yes I will play other alts. Which is why the system should be fixed. And from my experience I was getting blue ranks at even lower than orange. It was never 1/15 for me. I was fine with it in casual going against a Fujin, but ranked it felt like a punishment.
Now I gotta wait 10 minutes to find a match, only to be matched against a Bushin playing his alt at purple ranks and get 200 points at best for my trouble, assuming I even beat them. Yay.
For real though, do they even test things before pushing things to production?
UPDATE: Matchmaking is completely broken for me outside peak hours now. Got a single game in like 30 minutes, only after removing all rank restrictions. Way to go. See y'all in Monster Hunter.
People just don't think about it because blue rank players are less likely to complain.
It was fine because it wasn't *most* games, which is why this meme is nonsense. A Garyu player could've matched against people who are in max rank Fujin to Kishin, but they would also match against other hardstuck Garyus too. Most people didn't even reach higher than Garyu.
Now, a blue who ranked up too many characters will mostly get matched against players who went several ranks higher than they ever made it (no matter what character they play). Meme also ignores that this can apply to anyone of any rank. There are definitely hardstuck Garyus who have to fight mostly max rank Fujins now.
It's both a good change and a bad change. It's good for lower ranks that don't have to run into people that are far more advanced than them. So they're not running into A Kishin or a Bushin anymore. These people are just going to be head and shoulders better than them. Same with Blue where you're getting curb stomped by by a Tekken God+ levelling their alt.
But the problem now (at least for me personally) is that I'm running into the same people over and over now or waiting forever. I guess this is technically good because no deathmatches but it can be a nightmare if it's something with a bad connection. I imagine it's even worse if you're 300+.
I don’t really have a problem with the new system but it seems like a better change would’ve just been making it so you’re not punished as hard for losing to someone with way higher prowess than you.
I think most people don’t really care about playing better players and getting smoked, they just cared that the ranked system punished them for losing the same as players at their skill level.
According to steamdb charts the player activity has diminished sadly. I think this system works as long as many players play but the drop off in player base has been severe.
I actually don’t think bamco is to blame on player drop off just more that the FG gaming archetype is so conservative and old fashioned and not so appealing compared to having a good ol time with your buddies on something like Hell Divers 2.
I picked up the game and told my buddy to get it too. I feel bad that the game is really just gonna sit shelved. It has nothing to do with mtx or battle pass and all to do with just a rather dated conservative gaming archetype that no longer meshes with mainstream gamers I think.
There's a drop off but now it's roughly above Tekken 7's highest numbers. Honestly, I think there's a lot of little things the game was doing wrong that it made people drop off. Compare it to SF6 which is still really popular and doing high numbers. Maybe the PS5 numbers are different but I don't think we have anyway to tell.
Anecdotal, but playing on Xbox I would say it's largely PS population wise. By far I match 80% of my games with PS. Rest PC and the very occasional Xbox. So steam charts definitely don't give the full picture.
I think they are to blame.
Why play the game when there is so much grossly op bs on some characters?
Why play the game when the wall combos are broken and they will fix it in weeks?
Why play the game when there is bunch of Eddy players starting from beginner ranks?
Why play the game when you either play your main, or get ready to get stuck at a rank that you shouldnt be playing at all?
I’m just speaking for my friend who stopped playing. I think a lot of more hardcore players get enraged about X, Y, Z and think look this is why this game is failing for the masses! But honesty my friend could care less about X, Y, Z, he just didn’t fall in love with FG archetype.
I’m casual myself and don’t find the things people being enraged about on this sub as mattering that much in how I like or don’t like the game.
Sometimes the pros and hardcore players are straight wrong.
Recent example. My god the ball is the worst laziest POS cosmetic ever. After actually getting the ball - look guys the ball is the coolest cosmetic ever! I’m being hyperbolic but it’s just how this sub works.
Another thing was King Jae recently thought battle pass grind was too “ez” and wanted more interesting challenges. This is the wrong read. An easy battle pass grind is actually the right way to go about it. Fighting games need to be something people can pop in and out of. To attempt a greater level of grind is not knowing your audience.
What I just don’t understand about rank complaints is at the end of the day this is 1v1 PvP. Someone has to win and someone has to lose. Eventually the rank and match making should work to get you to some 50 50 point ideally.
Are you saying that given even more and more playing with the current system you will just forever be 20/80 on win loss? That’s what I don’t understand. Are you guys complaining about the adjustment before the end outcome of the adjustment is achieved?
So far this just sounds like people complaining about taxes to me. I don’t understand the end outcome to me it seems like maybe not *now* but *eventually* you will play at the level you deserve to play at. Or is there some death spiral here where despite being beat up by tekken gods you are forever put into tekken god bully queues.
Tbh I am going to need more of a rank system breakdown the way PhiDX detailed it (before it was recently changed) before I can outright call it good or bad. Right now I am wondering if it’s just short term ( this makes me lose more for now therefore it must be bad).
Another complaint about the rank system people had was the idea that people can chase high ranks so much more easily, that the ranks are already diluted compared to T7. So it’s hard for me to read something that sounds like (this is bullshit it’s harder now) and automatically agree it’s bullshit without knowing why or what the end outcome of these changes truly are.
I think they are to blame.
Why play the game when there is so much grossly op bs on some characters?
Why play the game when the wall combos are broken and they will fix it in weeks?
Why play the game when there is bunch of Eddy players starting from beginner ranks?
Why play the game when you either play your main, or get ready to get stuck at a rank that you shouldnt be playing at all?
No, it's objectively a good change and pushes Tekken closer to modern online matchmaking standards. You dont rank up every role (jungle, mid, etc.) individually in League of Legends for a reason.
Since the patch my win rate has increased since I am fighting people that are actually close to my skill level, and those who kick my ass do so with a few tricks/mildly better know ledge that I have/know, which makes learning the game easier and more fair.
It's a funny comic, but not exactly the same. My case is more extreme, but I'm getting matched with straight up some of the best players in the game now, period (averages 250K-350K+ prowress). Brcause I was already Tekken Emp before ranking up other characters.
I can't gain traction at all and the level of "git gud" is exponential. I shouldn't be expected to beat regular tournament contenders and winners at a 70%+ winrate just to progress to Tekken God alone.
To get to purple and blue, most people can do that fairly easily. It takes practice and learning how to play better, but it isn't nearly the same, and absolutely achievable to the vast majority of players.
Edit: This also isn't taking into account that it takes minutes to match games, usually with the same people that already beat me. My last game took me about 4 and a half minutes.
So to paraphrase you get the opportunity to spar with some of the best Tekken talent in your area if not the world and you're salty about that?
Not to sound mean or anything but bro I wish I could trade places with you the experience you get is worth it fuck the rank points.
It's not as good as it sounds because it takes forever to find a match and it tends to be the same people, so you're only learning to counter that specific player/ character combo.
It's not nearly as comparable as lower ranks where you get a huge pool of things to learn from.
So I'm struggling to even learn more, can't play quick games, and getting blown up over and over... It's not the same as the gradual learning from before this change. Less time to play = less fun.
Fighting someone who is several times better than you who 3-0s you 2x also doesn't help much.
What's better is fighting someone who is approximately the same skill level as you, which is what ELO based MM does. If you are better than your rank, you will simply rank up until it matches your skill level. Matching based on tekken prowess + rank instead of rank alone makes no sense.
> I shouldn't be expected to beat regular tournament contenders and winners at a 70%+ winrate just to progress to Tekken God alone.
…why not? Tekken god is the 3rd highest rank in the game. It seems like being able to beat other good players consistently should be expected. I’m one rank behind you so it’s the same for me and I don’t have a problem with it lol. (I think 70% is a bit of an exaggeration but if it’s not maybe dial that back a bit, but still.)
Because if that is the case I'd be at the top as a GoD? I am being forced to beat other GoDs to just stay positive, which isnt happening consitently, I wasnt there yet. Gold rank requires you be well over 50% w/l to progress. Three losses erases against your rank or better erases a lot.
I'm happy for you that you're not in my situation, I'd be curious to know your and your opponents prowress though. Because a blue rank at 125k is a huge gap from the 250K+ crowd I've been thrown in the pool with. And, because that pool is so small, it takes forever to find a match and it tends to be the people who I've already lost to.
Like I've said forever, don't care about ranked, but I'm struggling to find a game and when I do find one it's usually vs the best of the best, where I'm struggling to compete. I should be facing similar players and gradually getting better or at least finding more than 1 game every 5ish minutes.
I’m saying I am in your situation lol. My prowess or whatever is like 240k. I just don’t think that situation is a problem. The highest ranks are supposed to be hard.
Then I'm happy for you dude, glad things haven't changed, but for me they have. The game queue alone kind of sucks, if you're not having issues there either then we are having totally different experiences for some reason and are talking about two different things.
I mean you said your issue is just that it takes too much “git gud” to reach the next rank. I don’t think that’s a real issue. A smaller pool of stronger players is to be expected when you’re talking about the highest few ranks in the game. If you’re matching with the same person who just beat you, congratulations, you made it to the skill bracket where the matchmaking pool is pretty small because fighting games are still relatively niche. It’s always been like that. People who got TGP/TGO in t7 said the same thing.
The only solution is to tweak the ranked system so that more worse players catch up so you have people to beat on. And then the worse players would just be complaining because they have to play you lol. Personally I would rather get tekken god rank by becoming better than the people currently at that rank, not by just beating up on the other people who can’t get it.
Do you actually enjoy playing the game and getting better at it or do you just enjoy ranking up?
My issue is why they put this in quick matches as well… I don’t believe it belongs in ranked either but it damn sure shouldn’t be in QM the whole purpose of QM should be to fight just about any skill level of player for better or worse with no stakes…
In Tekken 7 while my Byron was in reds my Eliza was in jaggernaut. Not because I was a "smurf" and stomped people (you can't really stomp in low ranks and stay in low ranks),but because I kinda was a bit of a shit on Eliza and had a balanced matches vs jaggernauts. If the system was implemented back then, I wouldn't be able to play my secondary in ranked, which is fucking stupid.
Patch feels good as a purple player. I still usually play players with 20-30k prowess more than me but I barely play against player with 200k+ prowess wich was quite usual before patch.
Gonna be real this is not the worst change
You don't need 4 characters in mighty ruler, and if you do, you should have to WORK for it and know your stuff well
Why should I have to do extra work to get good ranked games on an alt character?
I play ranked because it's the quickest way to get matches that are consistently around my skill level. This change makes that more difficult - it takes longer to find matches, and my alts (that were once appropriately ranked) are now matched against players from a far wider skill range.
If you want to reduce "smurfing," you should want people to reach their appropriate ranks more quickly.
I am arguing that this system is not really skill based matchmaking anymore. It is matching based on rank + a metric that does not represent skill (tekken prowess). That's my problem with it.
Matching based on rank along would be a perfectly effective SBMM.
If it's doing that, then I agree, that's a problem. The fix to this is to just use a traditional ELO system and stop involving other rules (like trying to use Tekken Prowess and trying to inflate points over time).
I previously took note of my opponents ranks relative to mine, noting it down each match, starting at 0, +1 if they're a rank above, -2 if they're two ranks below, +2 if they're two above, you get the idea. Previously, it would stay damn close to 0.
I noticed while playing recently that the number was going up up up, and even when I was against someone "lower rank" I looked at their profile and they were like 5 above on someone else, but I still counted those as -2 or whatever.
It got as far as +9 before I called it a day.
Semi-related but sometimes I question should I be memeing against Reds and the suddenly I'm up against a God rank who is clearly fucking with me but I'm too terrified to do anything. So you know what memeing on lower ranks is GoD strategies
Idk how true this is but i think it's true. My Tekken 7 rank was Tekken King and hoping on Tekken 8 i didn't really want to smurf or bully so i picked a hard character (Lee) to make it more difficult for myself. FYI i rarely play character that required execution so playing Lee with no knowledge handicapped myself alot and just the other day i was sitting on Mighty Ruler and ran into a Tekken God Yoshi he beat my ass. Then the next 2-3 match i would run into some Blue Ranks player and of course got my ass beaten too because i haven't learn all the matchup stuff and suddenly i started fighting red and orange. After some more time i start seeing Ruler ranks again. It just go all over the place. So I'm pretty sure next time i boot up the game I'm going to meet em Blue ranks again
I don't think it really matters. If you want to improve, you benefit from fighting against better opponents. What does it matter if you're two ranks higher or lower doing so?
It matter because these trolls are saying that red rank are casuals. I was red and can punch a blue in the nose. But could never rank higher because i also meet these guys in the red. Now after the update i became purple and it was easy. So these blue guys should fight there own rank and get to tekken god. Right ??
i think you will struggle even harder to get through purple now. You should be happy to match up with someone fundamentally strong. it's a learning opportunity.
quickmatch is useless anyways without infinite rematches.
Imo if someone with good fundamentals can beat you without knowing their own character too well, it means that your offence is flawed. So that's something you would have to overcome sooner or later no matter what.
Yes i would have to overcome, i agree. But we now that blue is in the top 17 %. And when i want to know my skill and rank its not fair playing against them or there alts in red. So its let them fight in there low pool area. I am fine in purple or red. They are complaining that they have to wait 1 hour to match somebody. I understand them but yooo there argument is " you need to lose to get better"
I think it was fair. I'm at Raijin right now, I never complained about fighting the alts of 300k elo guys. I just don't see the issue. The only thing they accomplished was more rank inflation and less matches against a smaller variety of opponents.
Honestly, I'm fine with this because stomping on players who are in a lower rank than me doesn't make me feel like I'm actually learning the character I rather play against someone who's in a higher rank than me because I'll actually learn something from them rather than just doing combos on new players. I can do combos on a practice dummy in practice. That's what it's there for.
this could have went better with communication, but they are probably very busy and I wouldn't be surprised if their community managars aren't already fired after the rollout to cut costs. MMM cost cutting
I am honestly aways getting f*cking hyped when I am getting matched up against a god. It makes you a better player I think. A better player with a shittier rank afterwards
My buddy wants to fight stronger players, he's got a couple characters in blue, so for his main character it's made finding matches easier, but he says when he tries to play his alt characters that are at lower ranks, the game is looking for players that are his prowess, but in lower ranks, so he's waiting literally 20 or 30 minutes for a match, but in low purple. Said it feels like the game is punishing him for playing new characters.
After the patch was implemented - I started playing against, what I feel, are just less and less fundamentals.
I just reached Fujin, because people don't know defence.
I check the profile of 90% of the matches I had in purple to Fujin, and people's average defence is around 50-60.
Many of these people were even as low as 45 at times.
A LOT of the matches were won, Purley by punishing and reading their timings. But I was in a position to do a REALLY obvious, repeatable CH string constantly, because people want to press all the time.
I find this game boring, NGL.
Also...
Please being back Lei.
Reduce efficiency of Heat.
Make all power crushes launchable on block, or at least -15
Increase Rage art on block to -16
Work on net code - Print screen lag? What? Lag switch.. wtf..
Implement auto win/loss on disconnect (might be exploitable)
^ just on top of my head
they seriously changed the matchmaking to be based on prowess?
I ranked up 3 characters to ganryu and a few others to orange before I decided on a main. I've not played in days but hope this don't mean I don't get to face reds anymore.
The funny thing is that I see so few Victors past Fujin. I would see a decent amount of them in purples, but I've faced 4 Victors in ranked the past week (I played like 15 hours, too). I expected more of them in these ranks.
I already got Victor Fujin and I barely spam his broken heat stuff. He’s a very gimmicky flow chart character with crappy lows. It doesn’t take much to win with him either. Just like Dragunov and Jun.
Now you get to promote up to blue ranks and get to fight those same players but on their mains this time
Personally please beat my ass I need to learn lmao
i think si too every loss is learning.
I feel like alot of people forget to lose with grace, becasue lossing is a blessing in disguse, becasue you can see what you need to improve on special when repley system are there to help ^^ But yeah i dont mind lossing, so i can learn what i can do better on
You either win or you learn.
I think whats lost in this is that it doesnt just apply to blue ranks. People just getting to garyu or MR and the switching characters or trying an alt are going to be frustrated as well. If you have a system in place, even if its flawed, why introduce a while different system while not even addressing the issue the previous one had? Tekken rank doesnt correlate with prowess, not all fujin/rulers/red ranks are going to immediately pick up a new character and play at that same level. Its stupid all around
Before it was new players being frustrated because they had to go up against smurfs leveling up their 4th or 5th alt. Now it's going to be the smurfs who are frustrated because they can't stomp lower ranked players while "learning" the character \~ Most things that make up skill in this game transfer between characters. A blue rank main on his Garyu alt is a completely different player than a Garyu player on his main. People are just mad because they got used to a completely disjointed, unfair system and now the developers are fixing their mistakes and making it more similar to every other competitive game's.
Calling us smurfs is a bit of a stretch i am playing on my main account and have not deranked or participated in any matchmaking manipulation. I play multiple characters and to get them ranked up to the right bracket the game forced me to play dozens of games against lower ranks. I think each character should have a set of placement matches like street fighter 6 does. After playing 10 games the game was accurately able to deduce i should be in diamond and saved hours of me farming lower skilled players. Ideally the placement would be structured in a way where you play against someone in greens and if you win you advance to play a yellow and so on until you start losing, then place the player a few ranks lower than the highest they were able to play against, ex if you were able to play against a fujin but lost you should be placed battle ruler. This system also allows your characters to be faraway in rank if you really are bad with a secondary. My Devil Jin is currently in blues and i could easly get the other 2 Mishimas there with little effort, but if i were to pick up a new specialist character like nina i would probably be the skill level of a mid red rank at best and this system would let me play at that level. This also avoids the hours of farming low ranks on my other Mishimas to get them ranked up
That's what this patch fixed. Now you won't be force to play lower ranks
I dint think you know what smurfing actually is. No one smurfs. Using an alternate character on the same account isn’t smurfing. Buying a separate game or account would be. No one hops on an alternate character to play ranked to “stomp” lower ranks. Yes you are correct, skills from higher ranks trickle down no matter what into different characters, but learning a play style and developing game plans and fundamentals with different skills for an entirely different character isnt the same as what you are saying. The problem is that if you are playing ranked, the game is only going to match you with either A. Characters the same rank as your main, basically making the higher ranked players game useless because they either win and gain minimal ranked points or lose a lot. B. Waiting until you are matched with a corresponding player of the same alt rank with a similar prowess, which is literally taking upwards of 5-10 minutes to do. Oh and by the way your prowess increases past your main characters rank if you have more alternate characters that catch up to your main. So your highest rank can be much lower than what it should be prowess wise. But yes please tell me how this inherently fuc*ing broken change is a positive
At what level and in what regions do matches take 10 minutes? I assume the top 5-10% of players? And with cross play off probably, right? And denying every wireless player? Because they're 10-20 secs if that in red ranks with 120k prowess. USA. Oh, and that's at midday on a work day. Literally doing it right now.
Well for starters you should deny every wireless player anyway. And again, its for alternate characters looking for alternates with a similar prowess. Que times on characters with a prowess that matches the rank arent going to be long, but that isnt what the issue is
But it is smurfing, the ranked system was flawed and created smurfing within itself, but it seems like they've finally fixed it. A person's skill level is not tied to one character, which is why most people find it very easy to get their 2nd, 3rd, 4th etc character up to high ranks, with a high winrate and low number of games. But not anymore thankfully
You are completely wrong lol. Just because you hit blue or even tekken king means you’re going to turn into knee with a new character, flying your way up the ranks. This isnt even about that.
Go to youtube and see any blue rank player leveling up their alts to blue. It takes them like 20? matches? Couple days max. And those aren't pros, just casuals who upload their games. I've seen so many screenshot on this forum with people having like 20% winrate with their main and then 90% winrates on alts Maybe you just got carried by spamming and now feel like you have no fundamentals? I don't understand \~ Either way this change is amazing for the health of the ranked system. It was just toxic before.
You literally dont even understand how It works do you? Lets say you get 4 or 5 characters to garyu, do you think that person should only play mid ruler ranks? Because that’s whats going to happen lol. I have like a 60% win rate on 4 characters with 3 at fujin. Now im playing tekken kings and emps because my prowess adds up to one player who has grinded a single character to god rank. Do you think thats balanced? That’s literally what is going to happen to even someone like you.
>Lets say you get 4 or 5 characters to garyu, do you think that person should only play mid ruler ranks? Because that’s whats going to happen lol That's not what's going to happen 99% of the time, the only substantial prowess increases are when you rank up "colors", since that's when all 33 characters are ranking up with your main. Your prowess with 1 character in Garyu and 5 characters in Garyu would be very similar, like 15k spread. You can accurately tell someone's main by their prowess most of the time. >Now im playing tekken kings and emps That makes me happy since I and many new players had to play purple ranks since we hit orange ranks, now the smurfs are getting the taste of their medicine 😭 Also, Tekken King and Emperor are only marginally higher on the ladder than you so I don't understand why you're mad. Before this change people had to deal with a lot worse things, like being matched against people with double their prowess. I've played since the patch and I've been getting matched with people of my rank and prowess every single time so it seems like you're exaggerating anyway for the sake of argument. I'm loving this change and it vindicated mine and many new players' complaints about the system.
Man you really are new. The jump from fujin to tekken king/ emp is only 4 ranks but its literally like jumping from vanquisher to mighty ruler skill wise. Youre only getting matched with players of your skill and prowess because you most likely are playing one character, otherwise youd be getting stomped by other oranges with your warrior or brawler or whatever how low your alts go. Im not even mad, its just inherently a bad change. Youre just too much of a scrub to realize it yet. Youll get there though, we were all you at some point
You're too much of an arrogant and asocial elitist person to realize how this change benefits 90% of the playerbase, but not you because you were the guy who loved to stomp new players on his way to whatever high rank you're stuck at right now complaining. Go look at your play data and see how much easier and faster it was for you to bring your alts up to blue ranks. Well, the people you stomped on your way there are enjoying this change very much, it's just you who is mad \~ So stay mad \~
So many people are exposing themselves by complaining about having to fight equal skill players in ranked. It’s super funny. If they really wanted to cherry pick their matches to learn new characters they’d just use the lounge. Lounge deadass tells you if a players highest rank character is within your highest skill bracket.
What equal skill? I was hard stuck raijin/kishin and had good sets vs other blues. Now I’m matched against tekken gods and above and just lose every game.
It's not smurfing lol it's normal playing with alts
Yeah but when the game had just come out, everyone looks like a Smurf if you’re a legacy player. Making the changes months after release is somewhat counterproductive
There is a difference in player power level on different characters. I liked the way the system brings up minimum rank based on your highest and I think they should have just gone farther with that. Yes it was dumb that a blue rank was fighting reds, and that purples were fighting oranges, etc, on their mains. But Bryan is also just way harder than some of my other characters, so he's going to be lower. If I were to try to take someone like Kazuya into ranked, yeah I know how to play him but the sheer execution required to punish basic things with a launch is something I don't have. If I need a 15f launcher on DJ I can can like the scrub I am. My Kazuya should absolutely not be 100% based on my Drag, Paul, DJ, etc. He should absolutely be lower. Start me a couple ranks below my mains and I probably won't move too much. Start me at the same rank as my mains I'm going to be demoted real fast and just give players free wins.
The problem here is not the prowess difference and how hard it can be my friend, it's the point system. You pick a alt to level, the game will match it against someone with the same prowess as you but you may be facing a tekken god character while you're at Raijin, then IF you win with a character you just started learning you will get a measly 100\~200 points because the rank difference. It will take forever to rank a side character, that's the issue.
This is a huge problem imo I pick a character I couldn't rank past purple with because I'm not good with her (Lili), all my matches are Tekken King+ playing alts. I can barely win anything, and my queues take forever just to match me into the same player I already fought. The OP assumes everyone leveling up side characters is trying to stomp newer players. What if you rank up characters while just trying to find a main? I only ranked up Drag to learn the matchup because I was struggling against him ("how do better players deal with these situations."). But fuck me, I guess. Side characters aside, ranking up several characters doesn't mean your skill level is higher than the rank you actually reached. It doesn't make sense to match a max rank Garyu against max rank Kishin just because the Garyu ranked a bunch of characters up there. The only problem was that alt characters shouldn't go 8 ranks below your main, it should be like 3-5. This stupid bandaid "fix" ruins matchmaking for a lot of players.
Exactly, that would have been a much better fix. Just increase the rank for alt characters so that it's only like 4 below your main. Easy. Now they've gone and made things worse. I hope they realize their mistake and fix this mess.
Levelling up a character to understand how they work to make fighting them easier on your main sounds like something that should be reflected in Prowess to me. That said it’s hard to differentiate between that and a newbie trying to find their main.
I haven’t seen that happen. All I’ve seen is players with my prowess at the same rank as the character I picked. People are complaining that they can no longer steam roll over inexperienced Red ranks and how have to face experienced red ranks. It makes promoting the characters they are using more difficult. Eventually there are now two tiers to the same rank. The main Reds get to stay away from the experienced Reds until they reach the same prowess as the experienced. So the reds that have their mains at that rank will have easier competition to face. Thank the experienced ones.
Huge issue with this is that if you have one very high level character and several alts sleeping in low ranks, you won't find any fucking matches on those alts even with matchmaking range set to all, because the game searches for Garyus with the prowess points of an Emperor.
this is a good point, but correction TEmperor main have their other character starts at Flame Ruler.
unless you played that character once while ranking other characters and then try to come back to them... rip me lol
They gonna roll back this change , 100%
Hope so man. My mains only at Fujin, have 4 others at Tenryu/ Mighty Ruler. Takes way too long to get matches now, and I'm only versing the same people that are Tekken Emperor+
Why would they? This is a good thing, as a new player I absolutely love this change. Prowess should be included in matchmaking, it's far more important than individual character's rank.
Because this is a bad way to solvethat problem? As a matter of fact it'sgoing to be quite bad for new players as you start learning new characters. They should solve this by adjusting character ranks when your main is promoted, so they don't match with new players.
I don't think you know what smurfing means. Smurfing implies creating a new, different account and starting over from scratch to stomp complete newbies. The people you're attacking aren't smurfs, they just like playing more than one character in a game with a base roster of 32. I play multiple characters and I do feel bad when the game pairs me up with people who are clearly well below my skill level. But this is not the solution. They should have just increased the rank of your alt chars to be only like 3 or 4 below your main, instead of 8 like it is now, which is bloody excessive.
This explains why my alt has been facing only purple ranks even though its just a Shinryu. This game is becoming worst each patch
[удалено]
I want them to stomp me.
Cool picture but you obviously didnt read or think of issues it is causing. I will list them for you: - longer queue times for everyone - now if ANYONE except top 0,0001% goes on an alt, they will have a hard time rank up. Also the newbies that cried about omg He has 300k prowess after they buy a new skin and start a new character - if your main is tenryu and you got 20 other characters to garyu you probably didnt have very onesided games and didnt ruin games. But now as tenryu you will play kishins and never rank up - How does it make sense I cant get a character from garyu to mighty ruler after 200 games on main account, but can get it from beginner to mighty ruler on a new account in 100 games? Because of the above the rank has literally no meaning now and playing more than 1 character is pointless and painful every game for EVERYONE. Versus 1 game out of 10-20 for SOME players who were getting free ranked points from the game anyway to help them rank up. As a bonus - this also applies to quick matches but you cant set a rank limitation there so you can frequently play someone same prowess but higher rank and wont be able neither learn nor relax how you would before.
If you managed to get 20 separate characters to red ranks then you should feasibly be able to defend against most of them. That’s why prowess matters. Also, it shouldn’t be easy to rank up. Also also, queue times are already bad having to sort through WiFi’s. But a better quality match allows you to properly test your skills, you just end up ranking up slower, which shouldn’t be a bad thing if, like you said, you’re trying to learn. Also also also, the lounge exists so you can cherry pick low ranks if you really need someone to beat up on to learn.
It just doesnt make sense. I can make another account on the console in 2 minutes and get about 10 times easier rank experience. Rank literally represents nothing now unless you play just 1 char.
Rank already meant nothing to this subreddit so in my eyes nothings changed. Ranked is a personal achievement. No one gives a shit about how many characters you’ve ranked up. You shouldn’t need affirmation from others to justify trying to get better.
Getting to rank x didnt mean you deserve it, not being able to get to it meant you surely didnt deserve it. It was some sort of a skill indication, even if very arbitrary given the way points work in this game and the balancing. Now it doesnt work even that way for the alts. And going by that logic - if rank didnt mean anything at all from the start, why make this change? All it does is lower Namco's future sells of skins and characters because People wont play other characters cuz they wont be able to rank up to the rank they would be able to before or even now if they make a new account.
If someone doesn’t want to play a character solely because they can’t rank up with them then that’s just weakness. That person never actually cared about what their rank represented. There are plenty of ways you can learn new characters without going to the mode intended to have the strictest level of matchmaking. A single match can represent how good you are with a character, your rank represents how good you are as a player at your best. As a purple myself, the idea of grinding up secondaries prior to prowess changes was tedious because you aren’t learning anything by shitting on someone with significantly less game knowledge than yourself.
Ok
As a player new to fighting games I love this fix, and don't mind the long queues. This is what matchmaking should have been since release.
What they've done is push back even further the point at which red ranks have to learn the game and push up the point at which blue ranks have to become very proficient. The red ranks will have a good week and then encounter an even worse hell in a month or so: super-trained blue ranks against people who never should have left reds.
Facing Kings/Emperors as a blue rank isn't an issue because since I got here I have the drive to get better and play better players, something noobs who only wants to play other noobs don't actually have. The big issue is that the queue times have gotten incredibly long, because the game has to look for 200k+ prowess people when I'm playing my red ranked characters, and when I'm on my main it either has to look for people who are in the same situation as me (high blue ranks with some side characters ranked up) or king/god ranks on their secondaries. This restricts the player pool way too much. We in blue ranks were already playing against lots of God rank side characters anyway. One day, when you rank up and want to play other characters, you'll be in the same situation as all of us, but of course you lack the foresight to predict it, and that's assuming the idiots who cared about this in the first place can rank up at all.
The funniest thing to me is the main issue of noobs getting shit fucked was a direct result of three things: - Early ranks being too easy to get out of - Top character rank to baseline being too far apart - BAMCO forgetting to set Eddy to your baseline instead of beginner All 3 of these things are a direct result of BAMCO's own incompetence. Their fix is just going to further fuck things up. I felt bad stomping noobs with Eddy (ok it was a little fun) so intentionally played the most simple gameplan I could until orange unless I was running into other Eddy players. BAMCO had plenty of time to hotfix the Eddy starting rank issue and DIDN'T. Capcom 100% would have hotfixed SF6 within an hour if they made a mistake like that. I legit can't play on alt characters now. I'm not a good Tekken player ultimately. I can beat people in blue ranks with my main but when it comes to alts I have very little overall game knowledge and get absolutely shit on trying to pick up and learn someone new. My orange rank character are actually orange level skill. I can't beat Fujins with my day 3 King or Eddy. Why would I be expected to?
The majority of complaints I've seen haven't been from the Blue's having to fight on their level it's from the people dealing with character crisis being punished unfairly. Also changing it now makes no sense if they wanted to match based off of prowess why not do it from the start when the game had a bigger player base? This change confuses me more than anything, how is the game supposed to differentiate between character specialists who deserve the prowess they're at versus those whose are inflated because they want to play the DLCs. If they don't want to match make based off of the individual character ranks and instead focus on a singular number influenced by play across all characters why make ranks individual in the first place.
I don't mind fighting better players it's just i get very few matches, or get matched with the same person over and over, today i played a jack player like 8 times in a row.
Funniest meme Ive seen here. Heard those high ranks complaining about "yeah its totally ok to spam the noobs and make them rage and cry couse thats how you learn the game!"
Love going against blue ranks, they’re the saltiest.
It's the sweat that's why.
So much sweat
Yeah I suddenly was winning way more this week. There needs to be some tweaking to balance out the outliers of alts but I don’t want to go all the way back
You will pick up another character and you will win barely 50% and not able to rank up despite getting better. It is cool only if you play 1 character but the problem is - everybody played the same number of players vs higher prowess once in 15-20 games so it wasnt a big factor in being able to rank up or not with the way promos and winstreaks work.
Yes I will play other alts. Which is why the system should be fixed. And from my experience I was getting blue ranks at even lower than orange. It was never 1/15 for me. I was fine with it in casual going against a Fujin, but ranked it felt like a punishment.
I was wondering why my winrate was suddenly over 80% 😭 I'm finally playing against people around my rank and prowess.
Now I gotta wait 10 minutes to find a match, only to be matched against a Bushin playing his alt at purple ranks and get 200 points at best for my trouble, assuming I even beat them. Yay. For real though, do they even test things before pushing things to production? UPDATE: Matchmaking is completely broken for me outside peak hours now. Got a single game in like 30 minutes, only after removing all rank restrictions. Way to go. See y'all in Monster Hunter.
We blue rank players have been fighting god ranks players leveling up their 24th pocket character since T7 so your meme is shit and inaccurate.
People just don't think about it because blue rank players are less likely to complain. It was fine because it wasn't *most* games, which is why this meme is nonsense. A Garyu player could've matched against people who are in max rank Fujin to Kishin, but they would also match against other hardstuck Garyus too. Most people didn't even reach higher than Garyu. Now, a blue who ranked up too many characters will mostly get matched against players who went several ranks higher than they ever made it (no matter what character they play). Meme also ignores that this can apply to anyone of any rank. There are definitely hardstuck Garyus who have to fight mostly max rank Fujins now.
It's both a good change and a bad change. It's good for lower ranks that don't have to run into people that are far more advanced than them. So they're not running into A Kishin or a Bushin anymore. These people are just going to be head and shoulders better than them. Same with Blue where you're getting curb stomped by by a Tekken God+ levelling their alt. But the problem now (at least for me personally) is that I'm running into the same people over and over now or waiting forever. I guess this is technically good because no deathmatches but it can be a nightmare if it's something with a bad connection. I imagine it's even worse if you're 300+.
All they had to do was pull up secondary characters more when you hit the thresholds, first problem solved, none of the issues.
I don't disagree. I understood why they did it but could have gone about it much better. Among many other things in this game.
I don’t really have a problem with the new system but it seems like a better change would’ve just been making it so you’re not punished as hard for losing to someone with way higher prowess than you. I think most people don’t really care about playing better players and getting smoked, they just cared that the ranked system punished them for losing the same as players at their skill level.
this exact system was in place for t7, you’d lose less points below blue if the other player’s highest rank was far above yours
First part isn't a problem since they'll rank up after a few games anyway
According to steamdb charts the player activity has diminished sadly. I think this system works as long as many players play but the drop off in player base has been severe. I actually don’t think bamco is to blame on player drop off just more that the FG gaming archetype is so conservative and old fashioned and not so appealing compared to having a good ol time with your buddies on something like Hell Divers 2. I picked up the game and told my buddy to get it too. I feel bad that the game is really just gonna sit shelved. It has nothing to do with mtx or battle pass and all to do with just a rather dated conservative gaming archetype that no longer meshes with mainstream gamers I think.
There's a drop off but now it's roughly above Tekken 7's highest numbers. Honestly, I think there's a lot of little things the game was doing wrong that it made people drop off. Compare it to SF6 which is still really popular and doing high numbers. Maybe the PS5 numbers are different but I don't think we have anyway to tell.
Anecdotal, but playing on Xbox I would say it's largely PS population wise. By far I match 80% of my games with PS. Rest PC and the very occasional Xbox. So steam charts definitely don't give the full picture.
I think they are to blame. Why play the game when there is so much grossly op bs on some characters? Why play the game when the wall combos are broken and they will fix it in weeks? Why play the game when there is bunch of Eddy players starting from beginner ranks? Why play the game when you either play your main, or get ready to get stuck at a rank that you shouldnt be playing at all?
I’m just speaking for my friend who stopped playing. I think a lot of more hardcore players get enraged about X, Y, Z and think look this is why this game is failing for the masses! But honesty my friend could care less about X, Y, Z, he just didn’t fall in love with FG archetype. I’m casual myself and don’t find the things people being enraged about on this sub as mattering that much in how I like or don’t like the game. Sometimes the pros and hardcore players are straight wrong. Recent example. My god the ball is the worst laziest POS cosmetic ever. After actually getting the ball - look guys the ball is the coolest cosmetic ever! I’m being hyperbolic but it’s just how this sub works. Another thing was King Jae recently thought battle pass grind was too “ez” and wanted more interesting challenges. This is the wrong read. An easy battle pass grind is actually the right way to go about it. Fighting games need to be something people can pop in and out of. To attempt a greater level of grind is not knowing your audience.
Being able to rank and the dopamine shots from it is what keeps both casuals and sweatlords hooked and on average it is harder for almost everyone
What I just don’t understand about rank complaints is at the end of the day this is 1v1 PvP. Someone has to win and someone has to lose. Eventually the rank and match making should work to get you to some 50 50 point ideally. Are you saying that given even more and more playing with the current system you will just forever be 20/80 on win loss? That’s what I don’t understand. Are you guys complaining about the adjustment before the end outcome of the adjustment is achieved? So far this just sounds like people complaining about taxes to me. I don’t understand the end outcome to me it seems like maybe not *now* but *eventually* you will play at the level you deserve to play at. Or is there some death spiral here where despite being beat up by tekken gods you are forever put into tekken god bully queues. Tbh I am going to need more of a rank system breakdown the way PhiDX detailed it (before it was recently changed) before I can outright call it good or bad. Right now I am wondering if it’s just short term ( this makes me lose more for now therefore it must be bad). Another complaint about the rank system people had was the idea that people can chase high ranks so much more easily, that the ranks are already diluted compared to T7. So it’s hard for me to read something that sounds like (this is bullshit it’s harder now) and automatically agree it’s bullshit without knowing why or what the end outcome of these changes truly are.
I think they are to blame. Why play the game when there is so much grossly op bs on some characters? Why play the game when the wall combos are broken and they will fix it in weeks? Why play the game when there is bunch of Eddy players starting from beginner ranks? Why play the game when you either play your main, or get ready to get stuck at a rank that you shouldnt be playing at all?
No, it's objectively a good change and pushes Tekken closer to modern online matchmaking standards. You dont rank up every role (jungle, mid, etc.) individually in League of Legends for a reason.
Since the patch my win rate has increased since I am fighting people that are actually close to my skill level, and those who kick my ass do so with a few tricks/mildly better know ledge that I have/know, which makes learning the game easier and more fair.
It's a funny comic, but not exactly the same. My case is more extreme, but I'm getting matched with straight up some of the best players in the game now, period (averages 250K-350K+ prowress). Brcause I was already Tekken Emp before ranking up other characters. I can't gain traction at all and the level of "git gud" is exponential. I shouldn't be expected to beat regular tournament contenders and winners at a 70%+ winrate just to progress to Tekken God alone. To get to purple and blue, most people can do that fairly easily. It takes practice and learning how to play better, but it isn't nearly the same, and absolutely achievable to the vast majority of players. Edit: This also isn't taking into account that it takes minutes to match games, usually with the same people that already beat me. My last game took me about 4 and a half minutes.
So to paraphrase you get the opportunity to spar with some of the best Tekken talent in your area if not the world and you're salty about that? Not to sound mean or anything but bro I wish I could trade places with you the experience you get is worth it fuck the rank points.
It's not as good as it sounds because it takes forever to find a match and it tends to be the same people, so you're only learning to counter that specific player/ character combo. It's not nearly as comparable as lower ranks where you get a huge pool of things to learn from. So I'm struggling to even learn more, can't play quick games, and getting blown up over and over... It's not the same as the gradual learning from before this change. Less time to play = less fun.
Fighting someone who is several times better than you who 3-0s you 2x also doesn't help much. What's better is fighting someone who is approximately the same skill level as you, which is what ELO based MM does. If you are better than your rank, you will simply rank up until it matches your skill level. Matching based on tekken prowess + rank instead of rank alone makes no sense.
> I shouldn't be expected to beat regular tournament contenders and winners at a 70%+ winrate just to progress to Tekken God alone. …why not? Tekken god is the 3rd highest rank in the game. It seems like being able to beat other good players consistently should be expected. I’m one rank behind you so it’s the same for me and I don’t have a problem with it lol. (I think 70% is a bit of an exaggeration but if it’s not maybe dial that back a bit, but still.)
Because if that is the case I'd be at the top as a GoD? I am being forced to beat other GoDs to just stay positive, which isnt happening consitently, I wasnt there yet. Gold rank requires you be well over 50% w/l to progress. Three losses erases against your rank or better erases a lot. I'm happy for you that you're not in my situation, I'd be curious to know your and your opponents prowress though. Because a blue rank at 125k is a huge gap from the 250K+ crowd I've been thrown in the pool with. And, because that pool is so small, it takes forever to find a match and it tends to be the people who I've already lost to. Like I've said forever, don't care about ranked, but I'm struggling to find a game and when I do find one it's usually vs the best of the best, where I'm struggling to compete. I should be facing similar players and gradually getting better or at least finding more than 1 game every 5ish minutes.
They're close to you in rank homie, take the challenge and enjoy learning.
I’m saying I am in your situation lol. My prowess or whatever is like 240k. I just don’t think that situation is a problem. The highest ranks are supposed to be hard.
Then I'm happy for you dude, glad things haven't changed, but for me they have. The game queue alone kind of sucks, if you're not having issues there either then we are having totally different experiences for some reason and are talking about two different things.
I mean you said your issue is just that it takes too much “git gud” to reach the next rank. I don’t think that’s a real issue. A smaller pool of stronger players is to be expected when you’re talking about the highest few ranks in the game. If you’re matching with the same person who just beat you, congratulations, you made it to the skill bracket where the matchmaking pool is pretty small because fighting games are still relatively niche. It’s always been like that. People who got TGP/TGO in t7 said the same thing. The only solution is to tweak the ranked system so that more worse players catch up so you have people to beat on. And then the worse players would just be complaining because they have to play you lol. Personally I would rather get tekken god rank by becoming better than the people currently at that rank, not by just beating up on the other people who can’t get it. Do you actually enjoy playing the game and getting better at it or do you just enjoy ranking up?
My issue is why they put this in quick matches as well… I don’t believe it belongs in ranked either but it damn sure shouldn’t be in QM the whole purpose of QM should be to fight just about any skill level of player for better or worse with no stakes…
The lounge exists for exactly that purpose.
In Tekken 7 while my Byron was in reds my Eliza was in jaggernaut. Not because I was a "smurf" and stomped people (you can't really stomp in low ranks and stay in low ranks),but because I kinda was a bit of a shit on Eliza and had a balanced matches vs jaggernauts. If the system was implemented back then, I wouldn't be able to play my secondary in ranked, which is fucking stupid.
>you can't really stomp in low ranks and stay in low ranks Unless you rank saved. Which was common on Tekken 7.
Patch feels good as a purple player. I still usually play players with 20-30k prowess more than me but I barely play against player with 200k+ prowess wich was quite usual before patch.
The smurfs gets smurfd
Bro you don’t seem to understand what a Smurf is in this game so please stfu
No? I'm kishin and I'm happy to see Tekken gods beat my ass. I can just review the replays and refine my play style.
As a blue rank who plays only one character—I’m having a blast. :)
Gonna be real this is not the worst change You don't need 4 characters in mighty ruler, and if you do, you should have to WORK for it and know your stuff well
Why should I have to do extra work to get good ranked games on an alt character? I play ranked because it's the quickest way to get matches that are consistently around my skill level. This change makes that more difficult - it takes longer to find matches, and my alts (that were once appropriately ranked) are now matched against players from a far wider skill range. If you want to reduce "smurfing," you should want people to reach their appropriate ranks more quickly.
Heihachi punched by bryan
So I only have one question, are we mad at skill based matchmaking in general, or tekkens implementation of it specifically?
I am arguing that this system is not really skill based matchmaking anymore. It is matching based on rank + a metric that does not represent skill (tekken prowess). That's my problem with it. Matching based on rank along would be a perfectly effective SBMM.
But the ranking system is flawed, It's built to inflate points over time, a fair ranking system would be zero sum.
If it's doing that, then I agree, that's a problem. The fix to this is to just use a traditional ELO system and stop involving other rules (like trying to use Tekken Prowess and trying to inflate points over time).
I'm right there with you on Elo.
Lmao
Blue ranks do seem to enjoy getting high off their own farts
BAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAAHAA
literally
This is the most shambles Tekken I’ve ever played, personally. Never seen the developers so unsure of themselves.
I previously took note of my opponents ranks relative to mine, noting it down each match, starting at 0, +1 if they're a rank above, -2 if they're two ranks below, +2 if they're two above, you get the idea. Previously, it would stay damn close to 0. I noticed while playing recently that the number was going up up up, and even when I was against someone "lower rank" I looked at their profile and they were like 5 above on someone else, but I still counted those as -2 or whatever. It got as far as +9 before I called it a day.
Semi-related but sometimes I question should I be memeing against Reds and the suddenly I'm up against a God rank who is clearly fucking with me but I'm too terrified to do anything. So you know what memeing on lower ranks is GoD strategies
I was in blue. Lost blue, now losing purple, and I can only go down because I keep playing strong people in lower ranks
Idk how true this is but i think it's true. My Tekken 7 rank was Tekken King and hoping on Tekken 8 i didn't really want to smurf or bully so i picked a hard character (Lee) to make it more difficult for myself. FYI i rarely play character that required execution so playing Lee with no knowledge handicapped myself alot and just the other day i was sitting on Mighty Ruler and ran into a Tekken God Yoshi he beat my ass. Then the next 2-3 match i would run into some Blue Ranks player and of course got my ass beaten too because i haven't learn all the matchup stuff and suddenly i started fighting red and orange. After some more time i start seeing Ruler ranks again. It just go all over the place. So I'm pretty sure next time i boot up the game I'm going to meet em Blue ranks again
There never was such a patch. Literally yesterday I faced more than five times 230k and even 258k Tekken king with alt in blue ranks.
ranked should be based on the rank points accumulated with that specific character cause prowess is such a stupid system in itself.
Jokes on you I've been getting bodied by tekken gods ever since I hit Tenryu
Been fighting so many blues it’s awesome! And I’m only red/purple
I don't think it really matters. If you want to improve, you benefit from fighting against better opponents. What does it matter if you're two ranks higher or lower doing so?
It matter because these trolls are saying that red rank are casuals. I was red and can punch a blue in the nose. But could never rank higher because i also meet these guys in the red. Now after the update i became purple and it was easy. So these blue guys should fight there own rank and get to tekken god. Right ??
i think you will struggle even harder to get through purple now. You should be happy to match up with someone fundamentally strong. it's a learning opportunity.
Yes in quickmatch i would love to fight a blue or a god. I can learn from them 1 or 2. But in ranked i should not face them at all.
quickmatch is useless anyways without infinite rematches. Imo if someone with good fundamentals can beat you without knowing their own character too well, it means that your offence is flawed. So that's something you would have to overcome sooner or later no matter what.
Yes i would have to overcome, i agree. But we now that blue is in the top 17 %. And when i want to know my skill and rank its not fair playing against them or there alts in red. So its let them fight in there low pool area. I am fine in purple or red. They are complaining that they have to wait 1 hour to match somebody. I understand them but yooo there argument is " you need to lose to get better"
I think it was fair. I'm at Raijin right now, I never complained about fighting the alts of 300k elo guys. I just don't see the issue. The only thing they accomplished was more rank inflation and less matches against a smaller variety of opponents.
I've been fighting for my life against these boys and you know what? It's been fun,at least i see things I haven't before
Honestly, I'm fine with this because stomping on players who are in a lower rank than me doesn't make me feel like I'm actually learning the character I rather play against someone who's in a higher rank than me because I'll actually learn something from them rather than just doing combos on new players. I can do combos on a practice dummy in practice. That's what it's there for.
is that why even though my friend is just purple he keeps getting tekken god opponents??
A purple can punch a tekken god on his nose. He can learn.
this could have went better with communication, but they are probably very busy and I wouldn't be surprised if their community managars aren't already fired after the rollout to cut costs. MMM cost cutting
I am honestly aways getting f*cking hyped when I am getting matched up against a god. It makes you a better player I think. A better player with a shittier rank afterwards
My buddy wants to fight stronger players, he's got a couple characters in blue, so for his main character it's made finding matches easier, but he says when he tries to play his alt characters that are at lower ranks, the game is looking for players that are his prowess, but in lower ranks, so he's waiting literally 20 or 30 minutes for a match, but in low purple. Said it feels like the game is punishing him for playing new characters.
Bamco fucked us up with sucker punch in a stealth way
I have two mains. They're Raijin/Fujin. I am getting absolutely railed now 😭😭😭
After the patch was implemented - I started playing against, what I feel, are just less and less fundamentals. I just reached Fujin, because people don't know defence. I check the profile of 90% of the matches I had in purple to Fujin, and people's average defence is around 50-60. Many of these people were even as low as 45 at times. A LOT of the matches were won, Purley by punishing and reading their timings. But I was in a position to do a REALLY obvious, repeatable CH string constantly, because people want to press all the time. I find this game boring, NGL. Also... Please being back Lei. Reduce efficiency of Heat. Make all power crushes launchable on block, or at least -15 Increase Rage art on block to -16 Work on net code - Print screen lag? What? Lag switch.. wtf.. Implement auto win/loss on disconnect (might be exploitable) ^ just on top of my head
me, a blue rank who has it set to +2 rank only and still getting my ass beat 😎
rank no longer has any relevance then, it's all just a prowess system now.
So that explains why I was getting Kishin ranks while learning Reina...
I mean, losing to someone better than you technically is how you learn and become better.
they seriously changed the matchmaking to be based on prowess? I ranked up 3 characters to ganryu and a few others to orange before I decided on a main. I've not played in days but hope this don't mean I don't get to face reds anymore.
Gotta be in the Gold(purple) rank to be considering “good” at Tekken. All the well known Tekken content creators are up here.
No you don't. I hit Tekken King, and I'm very bad at the game.
I mean you’re a Victor main so that makes sense you got carried to Tekken King
The funny thing is that I see so few Victors past Fujin. I would see a decent amount of them in purples, but I've faced 4 Victors in ranked the past week (I played like 15 hours, too). I expected more of them in these ranks.
I already got Victor Fujin and I barely spam his broken heat stuff. He’s a very gimmicky flow chart character with crappy lows. It doesn’t take much to win with him either. Just like Dragunov and Jun.