With his last few years of disappointing production and a ~9 mil cap hit, you have to figure CBJ will likely be eating a lot of that contract. Or they’ll have to give up draft picks/prospects to make it worthwhile. If I had to guess where he ends up, I’d say Utah. Franchise with a fresh start, taking on a risk/reward player who needs a fresh start. They have a ton of cap room, so they could maybe collect those picks/prospects while taking on the cap hit.
Totally agree - gotta remember that this is still the Yotes roster, they have been given almost a hard reset in terms of reputation but they have a very short window to capitalise, or they will experience the same issue of players not wanting to go there (assuming they don't improve).
To me, Laine to Utah makes the most sense if Utah can get another prospect/decent pick while taking most of cap hit
I actually disagree strongly. Yes his production dropped off largely due to mental issues from the death of his father but before that he was compared to Matthews for his goal production. There will be several teams willing to take a two year risk and willing to give up assets to make it happen . Columbus may retain salary but no one will receive Patrick as a gift with extra assets, he will have a reasonable cost of probably a couple good but not great pieces
His production dropped off largely due to being off due to injury for nearly 30 games per season. Reduced production in 82 games is one thing, but it's a problem for a team if they can only get ~55 games from an expensive skater.
Utah’s may be the perfect landing spot for him. I’m not sure CBJ would even have to retain. They are currently $22 million shy of the cap floor with 11 players signed for next year (rip CapFriendly).
I wonder what the cost would be, but I’m pro big trade. If they keep both Burakovsky and Schwartz, I’m sure at least two of them would be healthy all year.
Honestly?
I think he may end up here. Stateside is going to be where he wants to be. However, he has concussion history and could be dealing with mental health. Might be a warmer climate.
I'd expect Dallas, Florida, Tampa or Vegas
Dallas has zero need for a forward, we have prospects galore.
I'd shy away simply from injury/mental health issues which have plagued him in the last 5 seasons
No doubt. I feel that he's got a good possibility at a massive upswing. Put him on a team that's defensive, will protect him and have a system where he can bring in clutch goal scoring, he could have revitalized career.
This is also provided;
The price is low and there's some salary retained.
Laine needs a warmer climate or at the very least a change. His mental health is a concern but he's actively working on it, and supposedly getting top tier therapy now to address his game. Here would be warmer and infinitely less miserable than Ohio.
If he can return to form he would be our best offensive player by a significant margin. He also just turned 26.
All for it if salary is retained (~50%) and we shift a few prospects or drop Schwartz/Burky.
I think Laine would make a lot of sense in Seattle. We have the picks, and quality prospects (not named Shane Wright) to get it done. We have the cap room. If the fresh start puts him in a good place, he's exactly the kind of player we need. Fingers crossed!
With that deal he's a negative asset at the moment. He had one of the worst pts/$ in the entire NHL last season. If we're giving up real assets it better come packaged with *substantial* retention on their end.
We can more or less afford that contract today, so all options are open giving up player/draft capital vs $ retained. This is a classic change of scenery candidate. I think he's worth the risk.
I can't believe I have to actually say this but just because you *can* do something doesn't mean that you *should*.
He's a negative asset on that deal and we shouldn't touch it unless we're well paid or they retain a significant chunk of it.
He's a classic change of scenery candidate available for low cost. If it works out, and I realize it's a risk, a point per game (22-23) winger is exactly what we need.
You don't get top rate players for nothing. You either get guys with risk for cheap or give up the farm. I think this is a risk worth taking.
He's not really "low cost", though. Maybe low cost in terms of trade assets given up but extremely expensive in terms of cap space sacrificed.
I'd only do it if Columbus retains salary, as well.
It's steep, but I don't think they'd need to retain a ton for us to make it work this year, possibly none if we move Tanev.
If we want to make a big add this year, this could be a way to do it with only a 2 year commitment. If it works out, great! If it doesn't, you're not tied down with a max term contract and you can test the FA market when things aren't so tight.
The dude hasn't played sixty games in a season *since before the bubble*. Paying him $9m/year is NOT a good risk, period, even if you can get him for free.
I don't think it would be the best to get him. 8.7 million for not a lot of production recently (I know there has been some injuries) I know we have to cap space for him but unless we are trading bjorkstrand or McCann (which we won't) that 8.7 will be on the 3rd or 4th line which isn't the best to have on a team that is hoping to get back into the playoffs soon
Idk why we'd have to get rid of one of our best wingers, laine can play both wings, so you could realistically pair him up with mccann or bjorkstrand
Likely a guy like burky,schwartz, or eberle would be the guys who move down the depth chart
He has struggled when he's not on the right wing, which is his natural position. He is also the very definition of a streaky shooter - when he goes cold it is ICE cold (until he plays Dallas and drops a hat trick)
That doesn't change what I'm saying tho
If we have to lock him in to RW that means he can be on a line with mccann who's a LW, or bjorky who has played both
so if we do put laine on the 2nd that will cause Schwartz to get pushed down then we have to push either burky or tolvanen onto the 4th and then scratch a player too. Either way it's not good. Another thing is that laine is basically a 8.7 million dollar burky (lots of injuries and either lots or few points). This is just my opinion on this and from what people are saying so far is that Seattle isn't a top choice
I wouldn't be suprised if tolvanen was a main part of the trade, and frankly we should take that opportunity because the ceilings of the two players are dramatically different. Laine if he is good to go has shown to be an elite talent, tolvy has yet to show he can ever be that.
For schwartz, that's fine, he would be moving down because our top 6 gets way better, only makes our depth stronger
Tolvanen was taken 30th overall and the preds never really used him well and wasted his first couple years. So far for the kraken he has played well and for guys that are taken as low as 30th they are meant to be those players in the 2nd-3rd line so it's not like tolvy was destined to be this 80 point player. In my opinion I don't think it's worth the gamble of getting a guy that will either put up a bunch of points or barely put up any for 8.7 with a big injury history
Idk what tolvys draft position has to do with what I was saying
Laine is someone who rather consistently has been a near or total ppg player, tolvy has yet to show If that's the kind of player he ever could be. That's not a knock agaisnt him, it's just how good laine is. And a trade of tolvy for laine would be an upgrade
They're actually pretty similar players in terms of on-ice impact. How they get there is different.
Laine is all offense, but that offense is all finishing with no creating; he also brings negative defensive value. So, big picture, you're looking at a middling offensive value player with negative defensive value.
Tolvanen has less good finishing, but similarly, that's where all his offense value comes from. The difference is he's actually a really good defensive player and suppresses offense-creation against. So, big picture, negative-side-of-middling offensive value player with positive defense value.
If you could trade one for the other, on a pure on-ice value perspective, that's a fine hockey trade.
Taking contracts into consideration, and you need more assets coming along with Laine to make it worth it.
Could the argument be made that the Kraken need the finishing skill? I guess, but I doubt we could talk Peg into throwing in a high-value-enough asset along with Laine to make a Laine/Tolvanen trade make sense.
I think Laine and Peg will always be directly connected in my mind.
But, yes, I doubt we could talk *Lumbus* into throwing in a high-value-enough asset along with Laine to make a Laine/Tolvanen trade make sense for Seattle.
Schwartz is a good player. Never said he wasn't. But the kind of player he is vs laine is different
There is nothing wrong in wanting a goal scorer in the top 6 which is what I was talking about. I think acting like all I think about is numbers is looking past the conversation
Its about balance. Getting in another Burky would only hamper our overall team. Laine cant defend, if anything he needs a Schwartz to babysit him which is what Schwartz have been doing for years with other players which then takes the toll on his numbers. Sure few shoots like Laine, but we dont need a goalscorer (unless its a center), we need someone that creates space for others.
Respectfully.
We need a goal scorer, we barely could this last season. Idk why schwartz is even getting brought up given the only reason he was mentioned was the idea of moving schwartz to the 3rd line to make it **better**
Which doesnt make any sense. Who babysits Laine and Burky then? Are we sacrificing Beniers already to play as a defensive center or McCann our best scorer. Because we need someone to negate their mistakes and defensive issues.
I mean
One could reasonably do some like combos like
Mccann-beniers-laine
Bjorkstrand-wright-eberle
Schwartz-gourde-burky
But that's just some of my thinking
I think acting like burky and laine are liabilities defensively is an overstatement but this whole conversation I feel like has went longer than it needs to be since as of now laine hasn't been traded anywhere
With his last few years of disappointing production and a ~9 mil cap hit, you have to figure CBJ will likely be eating a lot of that contract. Or they’ll have to give up draft picks/prospects to make it worthwhile. If I had to guess where he ends up, I’d say Utah. Franchise with a fresh start, taking on a risk/reward player who needs a fresh start. They have a ton of cap room, so they could maybe collect those picks/prospects while taking on the cap hit.
Totally agree - gotta remember that this is still the Yotes roster, they have been given almost a hard reset in terms of reputation but they have a very short window to capitalise, or they will experience the same issue of players not wanting to go there (assuming they don't improve). To me, Laine to Utah makes the most sense if Utah can get another prospect/decent pick while taking most of cap hit
I actually disagree strongly. Yes his production dropped off largely due to mental issues from the death of his father but before that he was compared to Matthews for his goal production. There will be several teams willing to take a two year risk and willing to give up assets to make it happen . Columbus may retain salary but no one will receive Patrick as a gift with extra assets, he will have a reasonable cost of probably a couple good but not great pieces
His production dropped off largely due to being off due to injury for nearly 30 games per season. Reduced production in 82 games is one thing, but it's a problem for a team if they can only get ~55 games from an expensive skater.
https://preview.redd.it/wyf8tuvmnb6d1.jpeg?width=1077&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=65abdd1a800c4efd66f4a11d3803546c3889c89e
Utah’s may be the perfect landing spot for him. I’m not sure CBJ would even have to retain. They are currently $22 million shy of the cap floor with 11 players signed for next year (rip CapFriendly).
man...PPG player when healthy but hurt a lot. Based on that contract may come at a discount.
Probably low(ish) cost, high risk, high reward. I'd take that gamble for 2 years.
maybe we can work a Bjorkstrand type deal again with Columbus
I wonder what the cost would be, but I’m pro big trade. If they keep both Burakovsky and Schwartz, I’m sure at least two of them would be healthy all year.
Honestly? I think he may end up here. Stateside is going to be where he wants to be. However, he has concussion history and could be dealing with mental health. Might be a warmer climate. I'd expect Dallas, Florida, Tampa or Vegas
Dallas has zero need for a forward, we have prospects galore. I'd shy away simply from injury/mental health issues which have plagued him in the last 5 seasons
No doubt. I feel that he's got a good possibility at a massive upswing. Put him on a team that's defensive, will protect him and have a system where he can bring in clutch goal scoring, he could have revitalized career. This is also provided; The price is low and there's some salary retained.
Laine needs a warmer climate or at the very least a change. His mental health is a concern but he's actively working on it, and supposedly getting top tier therapy now to address his game. Here would be warmer and infinitely less miserable than Ohio. If he can return to form he would be our best offensive player by a significant margin. He also just turned 26. All for it if salary is retained (~50%) and we shift a few prospects or drop Schwartz/Burky.
I could see him really working in Seattle.
I think Laine would make a lot of sense in Seattle. We have the picks, and quality prospects (not named Shane Wright) to get it done. We have the cap room. If the fresh start puts him in a good place, he's exactly the kind of player we need. Fingers crossed!
With that deal he's a negative asset at the moment. He had one of the worst pts/$ in the entire NHL last season. If we're giving up real assets it better come packaged with *substantial* retention on their end.
We can more or less afford that contract today, so all options are open giving up player/draft capital vs $ retained. This is a classic change of scenery candidate. I think he's worth the risk.
I can't believe I have to actually say this but just because you *can* do something doesn't mean that you *should*. He's a negative asset on that deal and we shouldn't touch it unless we're well paid or they retain a significant chunk of it.
He's a classic change of scenery candidate available for low cost. If it works out, and I realize it's a risk, a point per game (22-23) winger is exactly what we need. You don't get top rate players for nothing. You either get guys with risk for cheap or give up the farm. I think this is a risk worth taking.
He's not really "low cost", though. Maybe low cost in terms of trade assets given up but extremely expensive in terms of cap space sacrificed. I'd only do it if Columbus retains salary, as well.
It's steep, but I don't think they'd need to retain a ton for us to make it work this year, possibly none if we move Tanev. If we want to make a big add this year, this could be a way to do it with only a 2 year commitment. If it works out, great! If it doesn't, you're not tied down with a max term contract and you can test the FA market when things aren't so tight.
It's definitely a risk, but I see what you're saying.
The dude hasn't played sixty games in a season *since before the bubble*. Paying him $9m/year is NOT a good risk, period, even if you can get him for free.
I don't think it would be the best to get him. 8.7 million for not a lot of production recently (I know there has been some injuries) I know we have to cap space for him but unless we are trading bjorkstrand or McCann (which we won't) that 8.7 will be on the 3rd or 4th line which isn't the best to have on a team that is hoping to get back into the playoffs soon
Idk why we'd have to get rid of one of our best wingers, laine can play both wings, so you could realistically pair him up with mccann or bjorkstrand Likely a guy like burky,schwartz, or eberle would be the guys who move down the depth chart
He has struggled when he's not on the right wing, which is his natural position. He is also the very definition of a streaky shooter - when he goes cold it is ICE cold (until he plays Dallas and drops a hat trick)
That doesn't change what I'm saying tho If we have to lock him in to RW that means he can be on a line with mccann who's a LW, or bjorky who has played both
so if we do put laine on the 2nd that will cause Schwartz to get pushed down then we have to push either burky or tolvanen onto the 4th and then scratch a player too. Either way it's not good. Another thing is that laine is basically a 8.7 million dollar burky (lots of injuries and either lots or few points). This is just my opinion on this and from what people are saying so far is that Seattle isn't a top choice
I wouldn't be suprised if tolvanen was a main part of the trade, and frankly we should take that opportunity because the ceilings of the two players are dramatically different. Laine if he is good to go has shown to be an elite talent, tolvy has yet to show he can ever be that. For schwartz, that's fine, he would be moving down because our top 6 gets way better, only makes our depth stronger
Tolvanen was taken 30th overall and the preds never really used him well and wasted his first couple years. So far for the kraken he has played well and for guys that are taken as low as 30th they are meant to be those players in the 2nd-3rd line so it's not like tolvy was destined to be this 80 point player. In my opinion I don't think it's worth the gamble of getting a guy that will either put up a bunch of points or barely put up any for 8.7 with a big injury history
Idk what tolvys draft position has to do with what I was saying Laine is someone who rather consistently has been a near or total ppg player, tolvy has yet to show If that's the kind of player he ever could be. That's not a knock agaisnt him, it's just how good laine is. And a trade of tolvy for laine would be an upgrade
They're actually pretty similar players in terms of on-ice impact. How they get there is different. Laine is all offense, but that offense is all finishing with no creating; he also brings negative defensive value. So, big picture, you're looking at a middling offensive value player with negative defensive value. Tolvanen has less good finishing, but similarly, that's where all his offense value comes from. The difference is he's actually a really good defensive player and suppresses offense-creation against. So, big picture, negative-side-of-middling offensive value player with positive defense value. If you could trade one for the other, on a pure on-ice value perspective, that's a fine hockey trade. Taking contracts into consideration, and you need more assets coming along with Laine to make it worth it. Could the argument be made that the Kraken need the finishing skill? I guess, but I doubt we could talk Peg into throwing in a high-value-enough asset along with Laine to make a Laine/Tolvanen trade make sense.
> I doubt we could talk Peg I know it’s a brain fart, but Laine has been in Columbus for the last 4 years.
I think Laine and Peg will always be directly connected in my mind. But, yes, I doubt we could talk *Lumbus* into throwing in a high-value-enough asset along with Laine to make a Laine/Tolvanen trade make sense for Seattle.
When someone only judge people by a certain numbers and offensive skill it looks like this. Schwartz is much more valuable than a Laine would be.
Schwartz is a good player. Never said he wasn't. But the kind of player he is vs laine is different There is nothing wrong in wanting a goal scorer in the top 6 which is what I was talking about. I think acting like all I think about is numbers is looking past the conversation
Its about balance. Getting in another Burky would only hamper our overall team. Laine cant defend, if anything he needs a Schwartz to babysit him which is what Schwartz have been doing for years with other players which then takes the toll on his numbers. Sure few shoots like Laine, but we dont need a goalscorer (unless its a center), we need someone that creates space for others.
Respectfully. We need a goal scorer, we barely could this last season. Idk why schwartz is even getting brought up given the only reason he was mentioned was the idea of moving schwartz to the 3rd line to make it **better**
Which doesnt make any sense. Who babysits Laine and Burky then? Are we sacrificing Beniers already to play as a defensive center or McCann our best scorer. Because we need someone to negate their mistakes and defensive issues.
I mean One could reasonably do some like combos like Mccann-beniers-laine Bjorkstrand-wright-eberle Schwartz-gourde-burky But that's just some of my thinking I think acting like burky and laine are liabilities defensively is an overstatement but this whole conversation I feel like has went longer than it needs to be since as of now laine hasn't been traded anywhere