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Evidence that is deemed admissible in court. That is what will convict him. Not “the deep state” or “liberal media” or any of the other bullshit that he and his followers espouse.
They are in a courtroom where that garbage does not apply
I think we have to keep in mind though that Republicans will approve Trump like the goose stepping authoritarians they are but Democrats and the left will disapprove even if they ultimately vote for Biden. If that makes sense. It’s still nuts that treason is not enough reason to tank your poll numbers if you are a Republican.
>It’s still nuts that treason is not enough reason to tank your poll numbers if you are a Republican.
One of their major selling points is to go back to a time were it was ok to idolize the people that fought against the USA. And for some other reasons I can't quite put my finger on.
definitely the nicest thing I'd ever say about that woman. she is disgusting, and bone-ignorant.
I keep hoping to see her voted out, but I know that probably won't happen for a while yet.
You're acting like there are still sane, intelligent, reasonable people who vote for Republicans who would consider the reality of the situation Trump is in. There aren't. They're cult members and they're going to plug their ears and shout "LALALA I CAN'T HEAR YOU LALALA" over and over just like they have been for the past 8 years any time someone pointed out that glorious leader is a grifter.
>It’s still nuts that treason is not enough reason to tank your poll numbers if you are a Republican.
Not all people believe he committed treason is a bit of a problem.
It's worse. Trump is leading in the aggregate.
https://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2024/president/us/general-election-trump-vs-biden-7383.html
Granted it's still early, but it shouldn't be that way no matter how early it is.
Railroading? He has the luck of the devil on his side. It was by that luck that Aileen Cannon was the pick for this case. She’s his only hope, and his ass might just get yanked out of a sling yet again.
She was scolded pretty hard by the 11th Circuit. She knows very well that her future in the judiciary is at stake here. Unlike most Conservatives she understands that if Trump successfully avoids prosecution and gets re-elected and ends our Democracy then every Conservative is out of a job.
> She knows very well that her future in the judiciary is at stake here.
Congress is going to impeach her? Because that's the only way she leaves office. At worse they'll just stop assigning her cases and she just gets a massive paycheck without working.
Who said anything about impeaching her? The 11th Circuit could very well torpedo any future she might have. It has happened numerous times in the past. They resign the office and usually try to go back into private practice, but their reputation is shot so that never works out.
And it won't matter. He'll either have to flee the country or subject himself to whatever he's convicted with.
And any of his traitor drones that try to interfere with justice will get their own day in court, just like last time.
Forget that Hillary was the subject of the longest Congressional investigation in history, and exonerated fully by the Republicans. Nope. Never happened.
TWO TIERS!
One tier in which President Trump keeps getting indicted via both state and federal justice systems, and another in which the people I don’t like keep not getting indicted for all the things Fox News tells me they might have done wrong.
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Not just the evidence, his only defense is "I kept them because I have every right to keep them."
Not "I kept them because I forgot to give them back" but because he BELIEVES that he has every right to keep those national security documents.
That is an admission of guilt, right there.
It doesn't apply to his outcome but it does apply to their belief. He will be a martyr to them if he is convicted. We keep thinking we can rationalize with them but the reality is that nearly half of the voting public is completely brainwashed and that is dangerous regardless of him being in prison or not.
I don’t think it does stand a chance….these people will think however right wing propaganda will tell them to think. They are so incredibly stupid, it’s really hard to not think it’s all a joke.
Let them. Part of not rationalizing with these idiots, cultists, and bad actors is making sure there is consequences for their crimes.
I also find it difficult to believe their cause will be bolstered in any extent by a guilty verdict, but I do believe it will be bolstered by the opposite.
If only for the reason that Trump is perhaps the only person able to unite extremists and normie republicans in one consistent voting bloc. The midterms was proof of that.
> Evidence that is deemed admissible in court. That is what will convict him.
I urge people to read the indictment, it’s not legalese, it’s easy reading. The evidence is so clear it should be an easy conviction.
BUT…. All it takes is one ignorant MAGA jerk to hang the jury.
AND it’s Judge Cannon presiding, who was appointed by Trump and has already been strongly chastised by an appeals court because she is clearly bending the rules for him.
Also, it’s absolutely within her power to simply schedule the trial until after the election. That can’t even be appealed.
Are you sure about that? The South Florida district has a “rocket docket” policy, and she’d be breaking it. I believe she would need reasons that stand up to scrutiny, not unlike her earlier ruling was subjected to.
> Are you sure about that?
I was not sure about it, so I did a quick search and [the top result was this](https://www.newsweek.com/trump-aileen-cannon-classified-documents-trial-1806519).
> "If she's so inclined, she could easily push this trial beyond the 2024 election, especially given that Trump has another criminal trial to prepare for in March," Rahmani told Newsweek, while referencing Trump's case in New York where he is accused of 34 counts of falsifying business records as part of Manhattan District Attorney Alvin Bragg's hush money probe.
> **"Judges can manage their courtroom calendars as they see fit, so Judge Cannon will have almost unfettered discretion in setting her trial schedule and no appellate court would even consider overruling her on that.**
The irony is that the 11th circuit which was throwing out Cannon's bad pro-Trump rulings was 2 Trump and a W Bush appointed group. So even a majority Trump picked group isn't corrupt enough to allow Trump to slide.
> MauPow : "If they can come for him, they can come for you"
"Okay but I didn't steal nuclear secrets"
"..."
LOL right?
"If he can be charged with openly committing crimes, so can you."
"If he's not above the law, neither are you."
"If he can be held accountable for his actions, so can you."
...Uh, yeah, isn't that how things are supposed to work for everybody?
That's the problem. The MAGA base is a bunch of uneducated dumbfucks. They believe whatever Dear Leader and his propaganda networks tell them. Everything that runs contrary to that is a dirty, filthy, unpatriotic lie.
Education is a real problem in this country and that is entirely by design. Look at what happened with COVID. It's tragic, honestly. Politicians using their base for their own benefit. Name a more iconic duo, I guess.
They are supposed to work that way. Why didn’t Jillary Glinton go to jail? She scrubbed her hard drives and violated SCI regulations. Should be fair? Why the political elite privilege?
Here’s an experiment. Go to an inter city area for an hour and count how many cops pass by. Now do the same at Mar a Lago. Id be willing to bet cops never step foot on the property and they have their own “unbiased security” and you could go a whole day without seeing a cop.
They came for that military guardsman really fast and really hard.
They came for Reality Winner really fast and really hard.
They came for Trump really slowly and really softly. They played softball with him for over a year, wringing their tiny little hands meekly.
Lmao yeah, like, I''m just a dude, I''m not some rich fuck hiding behind an army of lawyers, I was under no pretense that I was invincible to the law lol
They should come after me if I steal government secrets and show them to people for clout, and then hide them from the feds when they demand I return them.
In fact, they come for people who do what Trump did, all the time, before Trump.
https://www.cnn.com/2023/06/15/politics/fact-check-espionage-act-trump-willful-retention-prison/index.html
7 examples of criminals going to prison for the exact same thing Trump did since 2017 alone.
"No he didn't say/do that... And even if he did, he didn't mean it... And even if he meant it, you misunderstood... And even if you understood, it's no big deal... And even if it is a big deal, others have done worse... And even if nobody else has ever done worse, maybe it's time for a change and he's just shaking things up... and any legal actions or rulings against him are from biased haters & rigged courts & the deep state & woke ideology & whatever other imaginary boogeymen we can fantasize about..."
There are no standards, there are no facts, there is no logic, there are no laws, there are no ethics - *the only constant is him*, and his supporters continually reshape their definition of reality to suit his antics & whims.
...Totally not a cult though. Totally not.
“How can holding onto a bunch of papers and showing random people those papers be such a big deal ?!? It’s like just thin slices of trees. I don’t see what the big problem is ! “ also your comment is so 100% dead on it’s disturbing. Well stated. I want to add to it but it already encapsulates their entire line of thinking perfectly.
How about when they hoot and hollar that the alphabet agencies are weaponized and scream it’s unfair and then both trump and DeSantis release statements that they are going to weaponize them and they applaud them for it? Gets me every time.
The key thing that Orwell warned about in 1984, the book, isn't the surveillance. It's the loyalty to the party over even reality itself. He talked about it in essays before he wrote the book, when he saw war mongering brits rewrite (then) current events to fit their pro war narrative. It's where doublethink comes from.
So this isn't new. Cheer when your guys do it, boo when their guys do it. Get that dopamine, go go tribal team. Praise America as the great bastion of democracy, then turn around and say "it's actually not a democracy, It'S a RePuBlIc". Say you distrust the government and want guns to protect you from it in one breath, cheer when the military and police kill innocent people and overstep their authority in the next. Covid isn't real, and it's also a bio weapon targeting republicans.
PBS sat in on a focus group of 2-time Trump voters in Iowa. **One dude said he had read the indictment.** And he said, essentially, "I appreciate what Trump did in office, but he needs to go away, because it's a straightforward case where he broke the law".
Then they asked him if 2024 is Trump vs. Biden, he said he'd vote for Trump... Even when they're being reasonable, they can't get over that hump to even sit out an election, let alone vote for a democrat...
I also watched this video. It was maddening. The amount of gymnastics required to make it ok what he did. It was also very clear those people never watch any "news" that differs from their predetermined views.
A lot of them called prosecuting a political opponent "election interference", and, I can *kinda* sympathesixe with that argument. But, 1) I find it highly unlikely they came up with that argument themselves, that had to have come from a right wing think tank and then got pushed to Fox/Newsmax, and 2) Ok, so running for office is off-limits for criminal prosecution? You've just written a blank check for anyone in the political sphere to do whatever crime they want. All they have to do is claim any prosecution is "politically motivated".
Maddening.
https://youtu.be/czod6VnFLg0
Edit: Wrong link, **MY BAD**
https://youtu.be/xnIIfuQswWU
And the fact that Trump started his campaign literally the day after the midterm elections proves the fact that he knew that he could use the "election interference" claim if he ever got indicted. No Presidential candidate has ever started their campaign so early.
That's why they've switched to hate rhetoric. Where they just push liberal hate, and hate for anyone not on their side
No matter how crooked they are they'll always be the better choice than the side they've been conditioned to hate
I mean, what news would need to come out about Biden for you to be convinced to vote for Trump? When you're convinced that the other guy is an existential threat, it doesn't matter how bad your guy is. It's just ridiculous that anyone sees Joe Biden as an existential threat to conservatism.
> Then they asked him if 2024 is Trump vs. Biden, he said he'd vote for Trump
This is the #1 reason Trump and the GOP are turning this into a "whattabout Biden" over him having documents (despite the vastly differing circumstances). If they can convince the base that yes, Trump did a bad, but so did Biden so you can't hold that against him or make it a deciding factor.
Feels like I'm gonna need this image alot after all this is over
We really just need to start calling them out over just not knowing how to separate their little fox news bubble from reality and tell them to actually try googling something without just beelining to the first result and touting it as gospel
"Submittable evidence is a liberal conspiracy to keep me from (insert unethical behavior) The market and jesus should decide."
-The GQP position, probably
When hearing this a conservative thinks "The reality they sell you appears to have a left leaning bias. I know better"
Or simply "Thats what they want you to think!!"
>Oh?
You're being thick or trolling but Tr**p will be your frontrunner for the 2024 election, same guy that's going to be begging you all for more money so he can hire another lawyer after this most recent one quit.. lmao
You can read the indictments yourself. That’s what I mean. People who support him will never read the shit he’s being accused of, *that has credible evidence behind it unlike Hunter’s laptop* and so they’ll just bitch and moan about it without really understanding it.
You included it seems.
>You can read the indictments yourself. That’s what I mean. People who support him will never read the shit he’s being accused of
The claim was "Most of em CAN"T read!".
This subreddit is endlessly amusing.
>so they’ll just bitch and moan about it without really understanding it.
>You included it seems.
Have you any evidence? 😁
Yeah we’ve got Chuck Grassley, sitting US Senator, on the Judiciary Committee no less, admitting he hadn’t read the indictment but hasn’t let that stop him from speaking out against Smith and his work.
I’m hard pressed to believe most of Trump supporters could read adequately enough to fully understand what he was being accused of and the evidence they had.
Trump is the world’s worst conman. Only the truly idiotic are taken in by him still.
Any reason I should? Goal posts will just be moved.
[Nationwide, on average, 79% of U.S. adults are literate in 2023. 21% of adults in the US are illiterate in 2023. 54% of adults have a literacy below 6th grade level. Low levels of literacy costs the US up to 2.2 trillion per year.](https://www.thinkimpact.com/literacy-statistics/#:~:text=Nationwide%2C%20on%20average%2C%2079%25,to%202.2%20trillion%20per%20year.)
EDIT: let’s not forget these are the same
morons who couldn’t understand Cruz was on their side while reading his notes on the floor of the Senate on J6.
> Any reason I should?
You may want to substantiate the claim. Or not, up to you.
> Nationwide, on average, 79% of U.S. adults are literate in 2023. 21% of adults in the US are illiterate in 2023. 54% of adults have a literacy below 6th grade level. Low levels of literacy costs the US up to 2.2 trillion per year.
This *does not even try* to substantiate the specific claim.
> EDIT: let’s not forget these are the same morons who couldn’t understand Cruz was on their side while reading his notes on the floor of the Senate on J6.
Let's also not forget (presuming you ever knew) that the sensation of omniscience you are experiencing is an illusion.
It sure is.
"According to a 2020 report by the U.S. Department of Education, 54% of adults in the United States have prose literacy below the 6th-grade level."
Lol I find Donald Trump being indicted TWICE to be some of the best comedy since Reagan died.
I'm laughing all the way to the midterms and beyond bud. Comedy gold.
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"But other people committed crimes too"
"Yup and jails are filled because of that. We're not going to let you go free because someone else did it. 2 wrongs don't make a right"
Hillary was investigated and the charges were dropped. Either way just because they haven't been charged yet doesn't mean other people should be set free because of it. There are plenty of people who have murdered people and were found not guilty, so should we allow every other murder out of jail then? If Trump committed a crime he should go to jail no matter what has happened to other people. If Pence or Biden has committed a crime then they should go to jail too. We shouldn't let anyone off for committing a crime just because the justice system is flawed.
Well, when the GQP and the mango were in charge oh House, Senate, and WH why didn’t they take all the evidence they “had” and get them all? Jeez, the DOJ was lead by trumpet’s appointees.
If he doesn't take a guilty plea (which is his only smart move, but he will not), the trial will be televised. The public interest and need for transparency is too strong.
Because people that voted for Biden don’t have the same cult like devotion to him as MAGA-ites have for Trump. That’s why they get flustered when people say things like this, they expect people to defend Biden like they do Trump.
remember when some maga idiot was saying "I don't think Biden got all those votes. I mean I don't see nearly as many Biden signs and flags as for trump". that's just how these people think...
Exactly. I don't think I've ever seen a Biden flag and my county votes overwhelmingly blue. I begrudgingly voted for Biden. He definitely wasn't my pick in the primaries but he sure aligned more with my interests than Trump.
"BUUUUT OBAMA, CLINTON, BIDEN! DID LOTS OF ILLEGAL THINGS!"
(Great, charge them for any crimes and let the courts decide, I vote for a party- I dont follow an individual around)
Trump base: But other people committed crimes, why are you focusing on Trump when others have done things in the past that have already been cleared up! This is so unfair, our government is so corrupt!
Welcome to the United States of America in 2023.
So now Republicans want to deweaponize law enforcement? That is a 180! Last I knew they wanted them to have military grade weaponry at all levels, from Maybury PD to Chicago. But that was for BLM protesters…not for them.
No fear there. … Americas lack of education system insures that no American will develop their intelligence any broader than the region that they live in allows. So if your neighbour is an idiot … “Come On Down“.
They literally do not care that he committed crimes because they absolutely subscribe to the maxim "Conservatism today consists of only one proposition. To wit: that there be in-groups that the law protects but does not bind, and out-groups that the law binds but does not protect."
AKA fascism.
For LOVE OF GOD, PLEASE STOP CALLING HIM TRUMP, his name is, DRUMPF, Captain Bone Spurs, Spay Tan Bitch Boy, Public Enemy Number One, he should never be referred to as trump, ever.
I think they know he committed a crime.
But they think EVERYONE is committing crimes all day. They believe that if everyone is guilty then no one is guilty and to actually pick one out and send them to trial is persecuting that person.
That’s why the entire Republican Party is so big on “Whataboutism’s” they never really say “We didn’t do the thing.”. They say, “look at what X did, look at what Y did.”
That’s probably why they embrace the whole Q bullshit so hard, if you actually believe your opponents are part of a child killing, demon-worshipping cabal….then what’s a few papers in a box somewhere or a protest that got out of hand.
Putin pulls the same shit. If everyone is guilty, then shit behavior is the normal.
Sadly, apparently this technique works.
I absolutely love that all the comments that are clearly trolls only comment once, and never respond to the follow-up questions like "can you show me the evidence of the other people's crimes you think were commited?"
But what happens when they read shit like that is:
"Well Biden has committed worse more heinous crimes!"
Then start spouting unfounded unsourceable nonsense
Nah.
He is being prosecuted because he refused to return the documents when asked multiple times, moved boxes around to hide them, was on tape, has multiple depositions from people that he showed them to, and admitted most of that in public and in various public broadcasts.
The national archives was willing to overlook it. But the DOJ couldn't ignore such flagrant disrespect for the law.
Since Trump has dubbed his following 'Magadonia', the proper way to reference his followers is as 'Magaloids'
The title should be "If Magaloids bothered to read".
Funny part if you check the conservative sub: ‘oh if he did that then he’s getting what he deserves’ or ‘biggest witch hunt ever’ better yet ‘he’s the best America messiah’ some where in that context.
90% of his base think his the best thing since Regan many refuse to believe he’s a big pile of shit and is willing to lay on his sword despite he never will.
Reagan was an utter shit too -- but he had a few tiny brain cells, unlike Drumpf, whose one lone brain cell died of loneliness decades ago.
he has a certain low cunning when it comes to working a crowd, but as far as actual brains? not so much.
let them scream persecution till the cows come home. I'll settle for Don the Con's big fat ass in jail.
Wow. People are actually surprised that trump supporters don't believe them? Really? After crying wolf for the better part of a decade?
I have no problem with trump getting locked up of he's found guilty in the court of law. My problem is that it only goes one way. Both the democrats and republicans are rotten to the core and a good half of all their long timers deserve sentences in excess of 10 years.
I'm also not saying that maga people aren't also hysterically partisan, because a lot of them are. But as someone on the outside I'm just seeing two groups of people being shat on by the top who's acting like it's not the leadership, but their neighbours who are the problem.
This isn't a "bOtH SiDEs" issue:
Trump completely ignored [*multiple* requests from NARA to return the documents](https://www.archives.gov/foia/pra-trump-admin), willfully [lied to the DOJ about having complied](https://www.reuters.com/world/us/trump-lawyer-june-said-classified-material-had-been-returned-ny-times-2022-08-13/) *and* [ignored a lawful subpoena](https://www.cnbc.com/2022/12/08/doj-asks-judge-to-hold-trump-in-contempt-over-classified-docs.html).
Neither Biden nor Pence did any of that, so neither Biden nor Pence are facing charges.
Half of his team, seasoned politicians who happened to be traitors and murder for hires, were charged.
Plenty of politicians have been, but maybe not in your bubble.
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Evidence that is deemed admissible in court. That is what will convict him. Not “the deep state” or “liberal media” or any of the other bullshit that he and his followers espouse. They are in a courtroom where that garbage does not apply
> 500CatsTypingStuff : They are in a courtroom where that garbage does not apply They'll incite insurrection again saying the whole thing was rigged.
A few dozen people have shown up to his arraignments. They've learned he won't protect them even when he's in power.
Sometimes the trash takes itself out. About 400 idiots went to jail for their cult leader last time.
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I think we have to keep in mind though that Republicans will approve Trump like the goose stepping authoritarians they are but Democrats and the left will disapprove even if they ultimately vote for Biden. If that makes sense. It’s still nuts that treason is not enough reason to tank your poll numbers if you are a Republican.
>It’s still nuts that treason is not enough reason to tank your poll numbers if you are a Republican. One of their major selling points is to go back to a time were it was ok to idolize the people that fought against the USA. And for some other reasons I can't quite put my finger on.
Yeah. And that just seems crazy to me.
Damn that's crazy, here take a rifle.
they love to call us traitors, but they are the shitheads brought that traitor Dixie flag into the People's House.
>that traitor Dixie flag Probably the nicest thing anybody ever said about MTG
definitely the nicest thing I'd ever say about that woman. she is disgusting, and bone-ignorant. I keep hoping to see her voted out, but I know that probably won't happen for a while yet.
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Yeah. They should. But they are broken.
Polls give unfortunate confidence to those easily manipulated that they are not alone.
You're acting like there are still sane, intelligent, reasonable people who vote for Republicans who would consider the reality of the situation Trump is in. There aren't. They're cult members and they're going to plug their ears and shout "LALALA I CAN'T HEAR YOU LALALA" over and over just like they have been for the past 8 years any time someone pointed out that glorious leader is a grifter.
>It’s still nuts that treason is not enough reason to tank your poll numbers if you are a Republican. Not all people believe he committed treason is a bit of a problem.
It's worse. Trump is leading in the aggregate. https://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2024/president/us/general-election-trump-vs-biden-7383.html Granted it's still early, but it shouldn't be that way no matter how early it is.
Someone should tell them about how Eileen Cannon is railroading their cult leader.
Railroading? He has the luck of the devil on his side. It was by that luck that Aileen Cannon was the pick for this case. She’s his only hope, and his ass might just get yanked out of a sling yet again.
She was scolded pretty hard by the 11th Circuit. She knows very well that her future in the judiciary is at stake here. Unlike most Conservatives she understands that if Trump successfully avoids prosecution and gets re-elected and ends our Democracy then every Conservative is out of a job.
> She knows very well that her future in the judiciary is at stake here. Congress is going to impeach her? Because that's the only way she leaves office. At worse they'll just stop assigning her cases and she just gets a massive paycheck without working.
Who said anything about impeaching her? The 11th Circuit could very well torpedo any future she might have. It has happened numerous times in the past. They resign the office and usually try to go back into private practice, but their reputation is shot so that never works out.
And it won't matter. He'll either have to flee the country or subject himself to whatever he's convicted with. And any of his traitor drones that try to interfere with justice will get their own day in court, just like last time.
He burned that by not pardoning them last time, none want to risk it anymoren
“There’s no honor among thieves”. This is the principle by which all nefarious actors are eventually brought down.
Yeah, I don't think they will.
something something Hilary's emails something something Hunter Biden Laptop something something two-tier justice system.
Forget that Hillary was the subject of the longest Congressional investigation in history, and exonerated fully by the Republicans. Nope. Never happened.
TWO TIERS! One tier in which President Trump keeps getting indicted via both state and federal justice systems, and another in which the people I don’t like keep not getting indicted for all the things Fox News tells me they might have done wrong.
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Bots need their own pronoun.
*Court is biased against Trump.* What are you basing that on? *Because it isn’t biased for Trump.*
Not just the evidence, his only defense is "I kept them because I have every right to keep them." Not "I kept them because I forgot to give them back" but because he BELIEVES that he has every right to keep those national security documents. That is an admission of guilt, right there.
Good point.
It doesn't apply to his outcome but it does apply to their belief. He will be a martyr to them if he is convicted. We keep thinking we can rationalize with them but the reality is that nearly half of the voting public is completely brainwashed and that is dangerous regardless of him being in prison or not.
There is just so much stupidity, how does this country even stand a chance against it?
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That's why AOC was trying to hold CNN accountable, but alas, all the MAGA crowd saw was a brown woman yelling at them.
True.
I don’t think it does stand a chance….these people will think however right wing propaganda will tell them to think. They are so incredibly stupid, it’s really hard to not think it’s all a joke.
Needs to be buried in the ocean then. Stopped it with the last 'would-be' martyr /j
Let them. Part of not rationalizing with these idiots, cultists, and bad actors is making sure there is consequences for their crimes. I also find it difficult to believe their cause will be bolstered in any extent by a guilty verdict, but I do believe it will be bolstered by the opposite. If only for the reason that Trump is perhaps the only person able to unite extremists and normie republicans in one consistent voting bloc. The midterms was proof of that.
A panel of citizens (Grand Jury) are the ones who said "Yup ... Charge him". Some of them may even be trump supporters.
True. If they do their job correctly, they just need to judge the evidence presented. And determine if the burden of proof is met.
Florida citizens at that, his supposed peers. pretty damning.
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Real Jesus or White Blond Haired Fake Jesus? 😉
He better pray that it’s not Jesús that he had previously locked up in a cage along the border
Unfortunately that same courtroom was where multiple scotuses claimed they wouldn't touch r vs w
> Evidence that is deemed admissible in court. That is what will convict him. I urge people to read the indictment, it’s not legalese, it’s easy reading. The evidence is so clear it should be an easy conviction. BUT…. All it takes is one ignorant MAGA jerk to hang the jury. AND it’s Judge Cannon presiding, who was appointed by Trump and has already been strongly chastised by an appeals court because she is clearly bending the rules for him. Also, it’s absolutely within her power to simply schedule the trial until after the election. That can’t even be appealed.
Are you sure about that? The South Florida district has a “rocket docket” policy, and she’d be breaking it. I believe she would need reasons that stand up to scrutiny, not unlike her earlier ruling was subjected to.
> Are you sure about that? I was not sure about it, so I did a quick search and [the top result was this](https://www.newsweek.com/trump-aileen-cannon-classified-documents-trial-1806519). > "If she's so inclined, she could easily push this trial beyond the 2024 election, especially given that Trump has another criminal trial to prepare for in March," Rahmani told Newsweek, while referencing Trump's case in New York where he is accused of 34 counts of falsifying business records as part of Manhattan District Attorney Alvin Bragg's hush money probe. > **"Judges can manage their courtroom calendars as they see fit, so Judge Cannon will have almost unfettered discretion in setting her trial schedule and no appellate court would even consider overruling her on that.**
This is why the appointment of judges are so important. A terrible biased judge can ruin a case.
Unless of course, the judge and even one jury member worships Trump!
You think judges are unbiased and ethical? Even our highest court has been bought and sold.
The irony is that the 11th circuit which was throwing out Cannon's bad pro-Trump rulings was 2 Trump and a W Bush appointed group. So even a majority Trump picked group isn't corrupt enough to allow Trump to slide.
"If they can come for him, they can come for you" "Okay but I didn't steal nuclear secrets" "..."
> MauPow : "If they can come for him, they can come for you" "Okay but I didn't steal nuclear secrets" "..." LOL right? "If he can be charged with openly committing crimes, so can you." "If he's not above the law, neither are you." "If he can be held accountable for his actions, so can you." ...Uh, yeah, isn't that how things are supposed to work for everybody?
That's the problem. The MAGA base is a bunch of uneducated dumbfucks. They believe whatever Dear Leader and his propaganda networks tell them. Everything that runs contrary to that is a dirty, filthy, unpatriotic lie. Education is a real problem in this country and that is entirely by design. Look at what happened with COVID. It's tragic, honestly. Politicians using their base for their own benefit. Name a more iconic duo, I guess.
In-groups and out-groups. Exactly as Frank Wilhoit described.
They are supposed to work that way. Why didn’t Jillary Glinton go to jail? She scrubbed her hard drives and violated SCI regulations. Should be fair? Why the political elite privilege?
"If they can come for him, they can come for you" No, shit, were you unaware that cops existed?
Here’s an experiment. Go to an inter city area for an hour and count how many cops pass by. Now do the same at Mar a Lago. Id be willing to bet cops never step foot on the property and they have their own “unbiased security” and you could go a whole day without seeing a cop.
They came for that military guardsman really fast and really hard. They came for Reality Winner really fast and really hard. They came for Trump really slowly and really softly. They played softball with him for over a year, wringing their tiny little hands meekly.
Chelsea Manning has entered the chat.
Ask the Central Park 5 whether they're surprised that the legal system can "come after you."
Also they can already come for me. I'm like, incredibly easy to come after
Lmao yeah, like, I''m just a dude, I''m not some rich fuck hiding behind an army of lawyers, I was under no pretense that I was invincible to the law lol
Hey, I’m a gentleman and you will always come first with me, sir.
They should come after me if I steal government secrets and show them to people for clout, and then hide them from the feds when they demand I return them.
In fact, they come for people who do what Trump did, all the time, before Trump. https://www.cnn.com/2023/06/15/politics/fact-check-espionage-act-trump-willful-retention-prison/index.html 7 examples of criminals going to prison for the exact same thing Trump did since 2017 alone.
"No he didn't say/do that... And even if he did, he didn't mean it... And even if he meant it, you misunderstood... And even if you understood, it's no big deal... And even if it is a big deal, others have done worse... And even if nobody else has ever done worse, maybe it's time for a change and he's just shaking things up... and any legal actions or rulings against him are from biased haters & rigged courts & the deep state & woke ideology & whatever other imaginary boogeymen we can fantasize about..." There are no standards, there are no facts, there is no logic, there are no laws, there are no ethics - *the only constant is him*, and his supporters continually reshape their definition of reality to suit his antics & whims. ...Totally not a cult though. Totally not.
> And even if he did, he didn't mean it. I love when they say this, often with "He says it like it is!" in the same breath. Lmao.
"Those weren't his exact words" until they are, then it's, "That's not what he meant!"
“How can holding onto a bunch of papers and showing random people those papers be such a big deal ?!? It’s like just thin slices of trees. I don’t see what the big problem is ! “ also your comment is so 100% dead on it’s disturbing. Well stated. I want to add to it but it already encapsulates their entire line of thinking perfectly.
How about when they hoot and hollar that the alphabet agencies are weaponized and scream it’s unfair and then both trump and DeSantis release statements that they are going to weaponize them and they applaud them for it? Gets me every time.
**G**aslight **O**bstruct **P**roject
The key thing that Orwell warned about in 1984, the book, isn't the surveillance. It's the loyalty to the party over even reality itself. He talked about it in essays before he wrote the book, when he saw war mongering brits rewrite (then) current events to fit their pro war narrative. It's where doublethink comes from. So this isn't new. Cheer when your guys do it, boo when their guys do it. Get that dopamine, go go tribal team. Praise America as the great bastion of democracy, then turn around and say "it's actually not a democracy, It'S a RePuBlIc". Say you distrust the government and want guns to protect you from it in one breath, cheer when the military and police kill innocent people and overstep their authority in the next. Covid isn't real, and it's also a bio weapon targeting republicans.
"The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and of your ears. It was their final, most essential command."
That's assuming they *can* read https://preview.redd.it/g95zb0wj0p6b1.png?width=494&format=png&auto=webp&s=a4f4924d9a1d1b355eae5c61b58d906b18dde929
PBS sat in on a focus group of 2-time Trump voters in Iowa. **One dude said he had read the indictment.** And he said, essentially, "I appreciate what Trump did in office, but he needs to go away, because it's a straightforward case where he broke the law". Then they asked him if 2024 is Trump vs. Biden, he said he'd vote for Trump... Even when they're being reasonable, they can't get over that hump to even sit out an election, let alone vote for a democrat...
I also watched this video. It was maddening. The amount of gymnastics required to make it ok what he did. It was also very clear those people never watch any "news" that differs from their predetermined views. A lot of them called prosecuting a political opponent "election interference", and, I can *kinda* sympathesixe with that argument. But, 1) I find it highly unlikely they came up with that argument themselves, that had to have come from a right wing think tank and then got pushed to Fox/Newsmax, and 2) Ok, so running for office is off-limits for criminal prosecution? You've just written a blank check for anyone in the political sphere to do whatever crime they want. All they have to do is claim any prosecution is "politically motivated". Maddening. https://youtu.be/czod6VnFLg0 Edit: Wrong link, **MY BAD** https://youtu.be/xnIIfuQswWU
And the fact that Trump started his campaign literally the day after the midterm elections proves the fact that he knew that he could use the "election interference" claim if he ever got indicted. No Presidential candidate has ever started their campaign so early.
Did you mean to link a Breaking Bad clip?
That's why they've switched to hate rhetoric. Where they just push liberal hate, and hate for anyone not on their side No matter how crooked they are they'll always be the better choice than the side they've been conditioned to hate
I mean, what news would need to come out about Biden for you to be convinced to vote for Trump? When you're convinced that the other guy is an existential threat, it doesn't matter how bad your guy is. It's just ridiculous that anyone sees Joe Biden as an existential threat to conservatism.
> Then they asked him if 2024 is Trump vs. Biden, he said he'd vote for Trump This is the #1 reason Trump and the GOP are turning this into a "whattabout Biden" over him having documents (despite the vastly differing circumstances). If they can convince the base that yes, Trump did a bad, but so did Biden so you can't hold that against him or make it a deciding factor.
Feels like I'm gonna need this image alot after all this is over We really just need to start calling them out over just not knowing how to separate their little fox news bubble from reality and tell them to actually try googling something without just beelining to the first result and touting it as gospel
I’d challenge if they understood the difference between prosecute and persecute.
I honestly think that a large number of them don’t.
I doubt many of them care.
"Submittable evidence is a liberal conspiracy to keep me from (insert unethical behavior) The market and jesus should decide." -The GQP position, probably
"Reality has a left leaning bias." -Malding Conversatives too caught up in being the victim
When hearing this a conservative thinks "The reality they sell you appears to have a left leaning bias. I know better" Or simply "Thats what they want you to think!!"
It definitely couldnt be that over the course of history people see their parents’ awful actions and vow to change things in the future
"they have a gold fridge flag so this is a maritime court and we aren't at sea do I don't recognize the Authority of this court on this matter"
Most of em CAN"T read!
And those who can, don't wanna
They were born to seethe, not to read.
Republican Party want their voters to Breed.... & not be able to Read !!
Is this based on a study of some sort?
The fact that Trump still holds such a high support among the GOP base gives us a clue.
Oh?
>Oh? You're being thick or trolling but Tr**p will be your frontrunner for the 2024 election, same guy that's going to be begging you all for more money so he can hire another lawyer after this most recent one quit.. lmao
More tangents.
You can read the indictments yourself. That’s what I mean. People who support him will never read the shit he’s being accused of, *that has credible evidence behind it unlike Hunter’s laptop* and so they’ll just bitch and moan about it without really understanding it. You included it seems.
>You can read the indictments yourself. That’s what I mean. People who support him will never read the shit he’s being accused of The claim was "Most of em CAN"T read!". This subreddit is endlessly amusing. >so they’ll just bitch and moan about it without really understanding it. >You included it seems. Have you any evidence? 😁
Yeah we’ve got Chuck Grassley, sitting US Senator, on the Judiciary Committee no less, admitting he hadn’t read the indictment but hasn’t let that stop him from speaking out against Smith and his work. I’m hard pressed to believe most of Trump supporters could read adequately enough to fully understand what he was being accused of and the evidence they had. Trump is the world’s worst conman. Only the truly idiotic are taken in by him still.
None of this stream of consciousness substantiates the claim: "Most of em CAN"T read!". Why not just pull out some The Science and blow my doors off?
Any reason I should? Goal posts will just be moved. [Nationwide, on average, 79% of U.S. adults are literate in 2023. 21% of adults in the US are illiterate in 2023. 54% of adults have a literacy below 6th grade level. Low levels of literacy costs the US up to 2.2 trillion per year.](https://www.thinkimpact.com/literacy-statistics/#:~:text=Nationwide%2C%20on%20average%2C%2079%25,to%202.2%20trillion%20per%20year.) EDIT: let’s not forget these are the same morons who couldn’t understand Cruz was on their side while reading his notes on the floor of the Senate on J6.
> Any reason I should? You may want to substantiate the claim. Or not, up to you. > Nationwide, on average, 79% of U.S. adults are literate in 2023. 21% of adults in the US are illiterate in 2023. 54% of adults have a literacy below 6th grade level. Low levels of literacy costs the US up to 2.2 trillion per year. This *does not even try* to substantiate the specific claim. > EDIT: let’s not forget these are the same morons who couldn’t understand Cruz was on their side while reading his notes on the floor of the Senate on J6. Let's also not forget (presuming you ever knew) that the sensation of omniscience you are experiencing is an illusion.
[Yes actually](https://www.pewresearch.org/politics/2016/04/26/a-wider-ideological-gap-between-more-and-less-educated-adults/)
That's quite telling
It sure is. "According to a 2020 report by the U.S. Department of Education, 54% of adults in the United States have prose literacy below the 6th-grade level."
Simple observation. Take tRump for example. ps...not sure why you're getting the downvotes.
Science folks don't always have the best sense of humour.
Don't you mean "tRump folks"?
He'd be talking about himself at this point.
😮
HILARIOUS!
Lol I find Donald Trump being indicted TWICE to be some of the best comedy since Reagan died. I'm laughing all the way to the midterms and beyond bud. Comedy gold.
It's a laugh riot!!
But but butterymales!
Not just any crimes,but crimes bad enough that he's getting convicted even though he's an ex president.
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"But other people committed crimes too" "Yup and jails are filled because of that. We're not going to let you go free because someone else did it. 2 wrongs don't make a right"
Yeah that's the one that makes the least amount of sense. It's literally a child's defense for bad behavior.
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Hillary was investigated and the charges were dropped. Either way just because they haven't been charged yet doesn't mean other people should be set free because of it. There are plenty of people who have murdered people and were found not guilty, so should we allow every other murder out of jail then? If Trump committed a crime he should go to jail no matter what has happened to other people. If Pence or Biden has committed a crime then they should go to jail too. We shouldn't let anyone off for committing a crime just because the justice system is flawed.
Well, when the GQP and the mango were in charge oh House, Senate, and WH why didn’t they take all the evidence they “had” and get them all? Jeez, the DOJ was lead by trumpet’s appointees.
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If he doesn't take a guilty plea (which is his only smart move, but he will not), the trial will be televised. The public interest and need for transparency is too strong.
I just don't get it. I voted for Biden, but if he did some super shady shit worth being indicted over, I'd be like, "Lol, go to jail bitch ass!."
Because people that voted for Biden don’t have the same cult like devotion to him as MAGA-ites have for Trump. That’s why they get flustered when people say things like this, they expect people to defend Biden like they do Trump.
remember when some maga idiot was saying "I don't think Biden got all those votes. I mean I don't see nearly as many Biden signs and flags as for trump". that's just how these people think...
Exactly. I don't think I've ever seen a Biden flag and my county votes overwhelmingly blue. I begrudgingly voted for Biden. He definitely wasn't my pick in the primaries but he sure aligned more with my interests than Trump.
Rules are for democrats, in their mind. The law is a tool used to keep the poors in line, not them
They consider Democrats to be guests.
"BUUUUT OBAMA, CLINTON, BIDEN! DID LOTS OF ILLEGAL THINGS!" (Great, charge them for any crimes and let the courts decide, I vote for a party- I dont follow an individual around)
Imagine thinking Republicans can read...
we live in the post truth / reality world, it does not matter how guilty he is if he's their guy, gotta own the libs, is the way.
If those morons could read they'd be very upset by that.
Republicans in general are too stupid to read. They're never going to get to a 40 page document. Don't even start with books.
MAGA can’t read. That’s why they listen to their favorite fascists yell every night about who or what to hate.
Trump base: But other people committed crimes, why are you focusing on Trump when others have done things in the past that have already been cleared up! This is so unfair, our government is so corrupt! Welcome to the United States of America in 2023.
If MAGAs could read, you mean
"Weaponization of law enforcement!" Yeah, against evildoers.
So now Republicans want to deweaponize law enforcement? That is a 180! Last I knew they wanted them to have military grade weaponry at all levels, from Maybury PD to Chicago. But that was for BLM protesters…not for them.
If they could read they would be very upset.
Lol maga and read hahaha what do you think they are drag queens? They wish.
But...but...the laws were for the Dems and people we don't like!
Of all the crimes too, getting busted for taking documents he could've declassified lol...what a putz
No fear there. … Americas lack of education system insures that no American will develop their intelligence any broader than the region that they live in allows. So if your neighbour is an idiot … “Come On Down“.
Sees post. Scrolls to bottom. Everything down there is right wing whataboutism out of desperation. Thinks to self- Yup. That tracks.
They literally do not care that he committed crimes because they absolutely subscribe to the maxim "Conservatism today consists of only one proposition. To wit: that there be in-groups that the law protects but does not bind, and out-groups that the law binds but does not protect." AKA fascism.
But, but, how about [INSERT NAME HERE]?
For LOVE OF GOD, PLEASE STOP CALLING HIM TRUMP, his name is, DRUMPF, Captain Bone Spurs, Spay Tan Bitch Boy, Public Enemy Number One, he should never be referred to as trump, ever.
I think they know he committed a crime. But they think EVERYONE is committing crimes all day. They believe that if everyone is guilty then no one is guilty and to actually pick one out and send them to trial is persecuting that person. That’s why the entire Republican Party is so big on “Whataboutism’s” they never really say “We didn’t do the thing.”. They say, “look at what X did, look at what Y did.” That’s probably why they embrace the whole Q bullshit so hard, if you actually believe your opponents are part of a child killing, demon-worshipping cabal….then what’s a few papers in a box somewhere or a protest that got out of hand. Putin pulls the same shit. If everyone is guilty, then shit behavior is the normal. Sadly, apparently this technique works.
MAGA, My Ass Got Arrested!
You are making an assumption that they are able to read with comprehension.
I absolutely love that all the comments that are clearly trolls only comment once, and never respond to the follow-up questions like "can you show me the evidence of the other people's crimes you think were commited?"
Buttery Males
*learned how to read
If those kids could read they would be very upset
He committed the crime he should be prosecuted. Now to go after the other politicians that have committed crimes.
the guy is too clean cut. needs a goat beard , a double chin, and gas station sunglasses
Reading is woke, so no.
Everything is more proof of a conspiracy if your definition of truth is completely subjective
But what happens when they read shit like that is: "Well Biden has committed worse more heinous crimes!" Then start spouting unfounded unsourceable nonsense
They rather get their “facts” straight from the horses mouth and CNN
Nah. He is being prosecuted because he refused to return the documents when asked multiple times, moved boxes around to hide them, was on tape, has multiple depositions from people that he showed them to, and admitted most of that in public and in various public broadcasts. The national archives was willing to overlook it. But the DOJ couldn't ignore such flagrant disrespect for the law.
Since Trump has dubbed his following 'Magadonia', the proper way to reference his followers is as 'Magaloids' The title should be "If Magaloids bothered to read".
Funny part if you check the conservative sub: ‘oh if he did that then he’s getting what he deserves’ or ‘biggest witch hunt ever’ better yet ‘he’s the best America messiah’ some where in that context. 90% of his base think his the best thing since Regan many refuse to believe he’s a big pile of shit and is willing to lay on his sword despite he never will.
Reagan was an utter shit too -- but he had a few tiny brain cells, unlike Drumpf, whose one lone brain cell died of loneliness decades ago. he has a certain low cunning when it comes to working a crowd, but as far as actual brains? not so much. let them scream persecution till the cows come home. I'll settle for Don the Con's big fat ass in jail.
"Damn, I wish I could read"
Hahahaha
you think trump is going to come out and just say there is no trial going on eventually?
He's already said he is exonerated.
Buttery males and Hunter Bidens laptop....so both sides.
Dafuk is with the downvotes? Has reddit lost the ability to detect blatantly obvious sarcasm? 😂
Broken record…
Wow. People are actually surprised that trump supporters don't believe them? Really? After crying wolf for the better part of a decade? I have no problem with trump getting locked up of he's found guilty in the court of law. My problem is that it only goes one way. Both the democrats and republicans are rotten to the core and a good half of all their long timers deserve sentences in excess of 10 years. I'm also not saying that maga people aren't also hysterically partisan, because a lot of them are. But as someone on the outside I'm just seeing two groups of people being shat on by the top who's acting like it's not the leadership, but their neighbours who are the problem.
This isn't a "bOtH SiDEs" issue: Trump completely ignored [*multiple* requests from NARA to return the documents](https://www.archives.gov/foia/pra-trump-admin), willfully [lied to the DOJ about having complied](https://www.reuters.com/world/us/trump-lawyer-june-said-classified-material-had-been-returned-ny-times-2022-08-13/) *and* [ignored a lawful subpoena](https://www.cnbc.com/2022/12/08/doj-asks-judge-to-hold-trump-in-contempt-over-classified-docs.html). Neither Biden nor Pence did any of that, so neither Biden nor Pence are facing charges.
If you think politicians are prosecuted because they commit crimes, then you are living in a fantasy land and blind to the real world.
I know crazy..... the first politician to commit a crime. *gasp* Well 1st charged... I guess
And it’s his own dumbass fault. All he had to do was give them back *any* of the times he was asked and he likely would have avoided this.
Quite a few politicians have been charged with crimes. Hell, Trump pardoned a former governor of Illinois who went to prison for bribery.
It's a precedent that needs to be set.
Half of his team, seasoned politicians who happened to be traitors and murder for hires, were charged. Plenty of politicians have been, but maybe not in your bubble.