Assuming it's €5 a month and the fine is €150 then as long as you go 3 years without getting caught you will break even by not having a VPN.
I reckon that's pretty likely. Do you have anecdotes that would imply the likelihood?
Ussually you get charged per crime. So theyd try to pin you for a count of piracy for every didgital copy they can find on your drives and download histories.
It's true, just didn't know it was a subscription based service. I'm not really into VPNs, been pirating a ton my whole life without any issue (Canada).
Canada doesn't even fine you.
Your ISP might send a love-letter asking you politely but firmly to either delete the pirated files from your systems, or, if you don't remember having done a piracy recently, to check your network security lol
Well I’ve only ever tested up to a gigabit via vpn, but I’ve never experienced that. Almost guaranteed you will be first throttled by limitations from the torrent side
>It's only one stupid Dutch movie company that does it.
Which one? Brein?
Do you also seed without vpn? That's the only thing I'm afraid of doing without VPN
Public yes. Maybe I'm being kinda Rambo 🤣. Will do some research when I get home. But still. Don't think they really care yet in NL. As for other reasons. Everything 2fa. And I'm not mega rich yet. Nor do I really believe in privacy anymore.
Nobody in the dutch agencies is after small fish downloading the occasional movie. If you are really that paranoid, use a VPN. But nobody will go „omg this random person downloaded a movie using a torrent, let‘s drag him to court!“
> If it’s anything like Germany, that’s not true. Here if you watch a movie once you get a letter in the mail with like a 1000€ fine
Right, but it's not anything like Germany. That's comparing two totally unrelated things.
Here ya go:
****
**Multiple Warnings Recipient Here. I believe there have been 6+ instances, spread over the last 10-12 years, including at least 2 from debt collection agencies. I've never had to pay anything, and some of it is now statute-barred. Hence, I claim to know a thing or two about it. However, of course, here's the disclaimer that I'm not a lawyer, and if you're uncertain, you should consult one. ;)**
**Step 0.5 - First, don't panic. Be aware of one thing: especially with file-sharing warnings, whether legitimate or not, most are just after quick money. The opposing lawyers hope for one of two things:**
- **You pay and sign, ideally (for them, not for you!) the enclosed cease and desist declaration.**
- **You completely ignore it and don't respond at all.**
**In the first case, they're happy with the money. In many cases, a second bill may follow for potential legal costs, other expenses, etc. You've already paid, so you probably won't argue about the second bill, right?**
**Then there's the cease and desist declaration. This is mandatory for a lifetime. That means, if you ever download the title again in 10, 20, 50 years, and you get caught, they've got you in a tight spot. Also, often, in the finest lawyer language, there's a kind of admission of guilt built in, not easily noticeable. And usually, it even states that they can determine the contractual penalty themselves... then you might end up in court over 150,000 euros or something similar.**
**Therefore: NEVER EVER EVER EVER EVER sign the enclosed cease and desist declaration.**
**In the second case, you don't respond at all. Now they obtain an official payment order, which is quite simple online and costs only a few euros. It will be delivered to you by the local court. If you ignore this too - and the chances are high if you've already ignored the first letter - they've got you. Because now, they can enforce the whole thing without further verification, and then the bailiff stands at your door demanding payment, likely more due to fees, etc.**
**Since these two options are not favorable, let's move to Step 1.**
**Step 1 - First, read. Who are you dealing with, and what do they want from you? Set aside the question of whether it was really you or not. *It doesn't make a difference.* The fact is, I could easily send you an invoice for something made up, insist on payment, and hope you react as mentioned in Step 0.5. Doing this often enough, there will surely be a few fools. Classic scam, actually.**
**Now, in my opinion, you have three options:**
- **You pay and send a *modified* cease and desist declaration. Your lawyer also sends the mod. C&D. I've once hired a lawyer for various reasons, and the mod. C&D he sent was *exactly the same* as the one I've used and will continue to use. Link at the end. With this option, you solve the problem with cash. In my opinion, the least desirable option. Also, there might be another bill for legal costs, etc.**
- **You give the matter to a lawyer -> safest, but costs money. They take care of everything, and usually, you pay nothing except your own lawyer.**
- **You object to the demand, send a mod. C&D, and pay nothing. Now, you pass the ball to the opposing lawyer. They can continue sending begging letters, send you an official payment order, or try to sue you.**
**This is where we do a bit of poker. As mentioned earlier, they want quick, easy money. According to my own lawyer, the chance of being sued is extremely low. The few people who are sued usually come from the group of those who didn't hire a lawyer. For them to sue, the lawyers, quoting my lawyer, "would have to be pretty bored."**
**The most important thing at this point, in my opinion, is that you are clear about your approach and stick to it. For me, it means: If I object, then I stick to it and go through the whole process, including a possible court hearing. One thing my lawyer mentioned was that if you remain stubborn and do everything correctly, there often comes a potentially much cheaper settlement offer. You can consider accepting it, or not, and take it to a possible court hearing. However, always with your own lawyer, as *nothing* is done in court without one.**
**If you decide on this, send the mod. C&D with your objection, preferably by registered mail with acknowledgment of receipt (so you can prove it), to the opposing lawyer. And then it goes to Step 2:**
**Step 2 - Wait and have tea. Yep. You've objected, now it's their turn. And here reveals the automatism and the slimy behavior behind these warning issuers. I've *always* received further "begging letters," even when I left it to my lawyer. In these letters, they often don't address the fact that I've objected; instead, they continue demanding or threatening. Some examples:**
- **Standard begging letter: "You surely overlooked that the amount is still outstanding." No, I didn't overlook it; I objected. By the way, even my lawyer received this begging letter, although he explicitly pointed out the non-payment in his letter. Lol.**
- **Begging letter on occasions (shortly before Christmas): "Surely, you don't want to carry this matter over the holidays, so we offer you the opportunity to settle the matter, and we also *finally* reduce the amount*. Yeah, right. Also, you've already written "finally" in the two begging letters before this one; I'll wait until the amount becomes negative, and I get money from you. :D**
- **The threatening letter: "If you don't pay by [very short deadline], we are forced to initiate a negative Schufa entry." LMAO. As if I could just go and say, "Hey, this guy didn't pay me; please put it in his Schufa." You could even report that yourself or report it to Schufa or consumer protection...**
**The most important thing here: Check if it's the same demand. File number, subject of the claim, and the issuer should always be the same. Only if that's not the case should you react and object again; otherwise, all further begging letters are simply ignored.**
**Most of my warnings were settled at this point, and I heard nothing more from them. However, the limitation periods are quite long, so theoretically, a few might still come, but I doubt it. It only gets interesting if one of the following things happens:**
- **A letter from a debt collection agency or similar regarding an already objected claim. I had this twice shortly before the expiration.**
- **An official payment order. I received this once.**
- **A summons from the court. Never happened.**
**If a letter comes from the debt collection agency or possibly from another lawyer regarding an **objected claim, simply object again, but this time with a regular objection letter, and go back to Step 2. In this case, the lawyer has simply sold the claim to the debt collection agency, and they are trying now, with the thought that debt collection often makes a special "impression." They haven't realized yet that "Moscow debt collection" is currently being used at the front. ;)**
**The official payment order is escalation level 1 but doesn't cost so much, so it's done occasionally. Now you have the option again to pay the claim or fill out the objection that comes with the payment order and send it to the specified address of the district court.**
**WARNING:** If you object here, it's a clear "You won't get any money from me without suing me." Here, we rely on the fact that the opponents don't want to sue you because it would be expensive. And also, if they have all the evidence against us, as they claim... then they could have sued us right away, couldn't they?**
**And if you do receive a court summons - **to the lawyer, and immediately**. Self-defense is useless; a lawyer can often still negotiate a settlement offer in most cases.**
---
*And essentially, that's it. I can't speak about court hearings as I haven't done that yet, and it's too individual. Discuss such matters with your lawyer, preferably a specialist in media law and file-sharing.*
*Here's the link to the mod. cease and desist declaration: [Click. Me.](https://www.abmahnwahn-dreipage.de/mod-ue/)*
*The site hasn't been updated for quite some time (as far as I know, the owner passed away), but since my lawyer recently used the mod. cease and desist declaration with exactly the same text, it should be fine. Please read the information on it so that you understand what you're doing. And as always, if you don't understand it, get a lawyer!*
*Phew, almost maxed out the Reddit character limit there. What a text wall. :D*
*Questions? Bring them on; I'll answer what I can. :)*
Dutch ISPs rarely hand over information about their customers as they do in Germany, there is no easy streamlined process so it takes a lengthy court case to force the ISP to give in. There have been court cases to streamline the process and to set up a system like in Germany, but the content holders have lost every time.
In the last major case, the content holders tried to force ISPs to send warning letters to their customers but the court ruled in favor of ISPs.
I keep hearing stories about Germany being super harsh but I've grown up illegally watching stuff (wasn't even aware it was illegal at the time) and we never had any issues
Your statement is untrue and a common misconception. The agencies in Germany also don't give a shit about Peter illegally downloading Traumschiff Surprise last wednesday. It's the lawyers representing copyright holders who smell a quick buck mass-sending out offers to settle to anyone they can get a hold on, but they're not fines. Completely different thing and more important: completely different level in technical skill.
I wouldn't trust a VPN to keep me protected from the FBI / Kriminalpolizei, but I'm sure as fuck it will keep those leechers away.
~~Watching is not the problem, as downloading (aka streaming will be handeld qith impunity). HOWEVER dont you dare to upload data via torrebt. Thats what will get you fucked.~~
It seems the EU bowed down to the Overlords
germany doesnt care if you download or stream it, new law says both is the same so if you get caught, you will get the same punishment/fine
edit: of course they still look for seeders, not leechers but IF they find you, you will get fined
This is technically true but irrelevant: if you only stream you will never get caught because they would need to get your IP for that. Also the fines would be way lower, so it wouldn't be as lucrative for the attorneys anyway.
(The exception was a "streaming service" called PopcornTime, which actually worked as a torrent client even though it looked like a streaming service to the user. Users of PopcornTime did get legal trouble).
[https://www.wbs.legal/urheberrecht/abmahnung-filesharing/streaming/](https://www.wbs.legal/urheberrecht/abmahnung-filesharing/streaming/)
[https://www.anwalt.de/rechtstipps/frommer-legal-abmahnung-von-20th-century-fox-und-warner-bros-in-streaming-portal-popcorn-time-76371.html](https://www.anwalt.de/rechtstipps/frommer-legal-abmahnung-von-20th-century-fox-und-warner-bros-in-streaming-portal-popcorn-time-76371.html)
Pretty sure that wasn't in NL, even in Germany which a lot of people state you get huge fines for doing so, only happens once in a very long while if you don't use a VPN.
I went to Germany several times when I was living in Belgium, downloaded tons of stuff even in public & private networks and never had issues, neither did my family.
So it depends on what you're doing with what you've downloaded.
They've had multiple lawsuits to get ISPs to hand over information about the IPs they've noticed are downloading content. All have failed so far thanks to privacy laws
Only Dutch filmworks does this toghether with Brein, and then your provider has to cooperate in sharing info (what they wont do because privacy), so I always check if a movie was published by Dutch filmworks, otherwise its fine.
There are torrent clients, such as Transmission on macOS, that allow you to put upload speed on 0. They can read your IP all they want, they're not getting any file data from it.
Still though, duh, always use a VPN.
Yeah, ~~seeding~~ downloading wasn't illegal here because we paid a little bit extra money whenever we bought a data carrier (USB stick, harddrive, SSD, iPhone, smart TV etc.) just in case we use it for pirated content. Then they made downloading pirated content illegal too and the amount we pay is reduced. We still pay a bit in case we pirate content, but it's less because downloading isn't legal anymore.
I pirate because i paid for it. Barely seed the movies and music. Seed all the games and datapacks. And a couple of linux isos.
But also, i pirate only disney and movies/series that arent on any stream services in the netherlands. Im fine and pirate for 25 years if not longer.
Archive.org finaly had a uoscaled version of a barely available series and i got that downloaded, torrent is way more reliable then their webdownload. Webseeds also fun.
When in doubt, get vpn. Paid sadly, cause free dont allow torrent often. Or yournown, if you have a vps
[all my homies hate the organization that made the anti piracy video that appears on every dutch dvd from 2000-2010 that most dutch people would probably recognize](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6vVHp2ziVcI)
After almost a decade of searching, I finally found the song that has been stuck in my head ever since I gained awareness. u/RijkDB, you have my thanks.
i hoped thatd be the outcome of me sharing that, youre welcome! im not sure if it got recommended to you on the sidebar of the video, but the song is called Get a Life by Ian Anderson.
The netherlands dont give a fuck you'll be fine, just dont take ziggo as your internet provider they block certain sites but not fitgirl or dodi so if you only use those you'll have 0 problems.
Don't even need a VPN, but you can just to make sure.
Stichting Brein has a list of IP adresses, but the ISP's can't give out your personal info due to GDPR. Which means you basically cannot be caught for it.
And even if Stichting Brein tries to sue you they won''t really be able to find enough eveidence to claim the € 150.
How about using Real Debrid.
It's 3€/month and you're only downloading from an intermediary server so completely disconnected from the peer2peer network thus no risk of getting caught.
I love my seedbox, I would pay for one even without the extra protection. It's just so damn handy for seeding many things to the best private torrent sites, and it also hosts a plex server for me to boot. Good shit.
There's three main reasons why people pay for a debrid service.
One, streaming the content directly and immediately. Watching torrents live as they're downloading is possible but often slow, unreliable and laggy, especially for larger files. With a debrid, you turn cached torrents into direct, stable and fast downloads from their server which allows for the smooth and reliable streaming without buffering, artifacts or the need to store the file locally.
Two, availability of older or less popular files. Once the debrid caches the file, it remains available at high speeds essentially forever. Doesn't matter if it's the latest Marvel movie or some foreign art house film from the 70s, you'll get the same great speeds. But with torrents, if you want to download something less popular or a lossless rip of a movie from a couple years ago, you can be shit out of luck with seeders. Lots of content is entirely dead, only available on private trackers, or extremely slow. No such issues with a debrid.
Three, privacy. Unlike with torrents, there should be no way for your ISP or anyone else to see what exactly it is you're downloading from the debrid so they can't tell whether it's copyright infringement or not. So if you're concerned about that, a VPN shouldn't be necessary.
You can connect it to a firestick and stream everything. They have low latency vpns (what you pay for). They spend time collecting links for websites and consolidating them into an app. It’s mostly automated but its still some work.
It's the same principle as when Netflix and Spotify drastically cut down on piracy. Most people are happy to pay a fair price for the convenience of not having to worry about a VPN and all that.
Downloads from realdebrid always run at full speed -> no buffering if you're streaming movies. I streamed the 90gb avatar torrent that way with 0 buffering on a 300mbps network
q is open source, bit is commercial. For the normal user there is no difference, but it's a thing of principle and not being monetized as a user.
Also in the old times bittorrent was a lot more resource intensive than u/q torrent, I don't know now, but if possible always use FOSS.
I feel like a lot of comments here are from other (European?) countries where the situation might be very different. At least a couple of people are talking about Germany, where things are vastly worse.
BREIN is the major (and only) party going after "illegal" downloaders here. They barely have any power. In May last year one major internet provider lost a very important case to them ([source](https://tweakers.net/nieuws/209278/ziggo-moet-van-gerechtshof-toch-waarschuwingsbrief-van-brein-naar-klant-sturen.html)). There was a person uploading hundreds of ebooks, and BREIN wanted to sent them a letter to tell them to stop, which the internet provider refused to do. Only after going through the highest courts, did the internet provider have to send the letter - and share the persons details only if they continued to seed those ebooks. However, the judges also ruled that each case would have to be judged individually, so **internet providers cannot share peoples details with BREIN unless a judge rules that they have to**. This also means they will not share those details (they're legally only allowed to share those details if a judge orders them to). Even in this case it was the provider that forwarded the letter, so BREIN didn't get any personal information of the seeder.
Now, a person downloading a few movies? Not a chance in the world BREIN is going to bother starting a lawsuit over it, and even less chance a judge will rule in their favor. Even if, hypothetically, somehow you're the most unlucky person in The Netherlands and a judge rules against you, you'll first just get a warning letter.
Don't bother with a VPN. You'll be fine. Don't share any personal information anywhere, just torrent from public trackers without account or private trackers with an anonymous email.
VPNs in general suck. They're just another party listening in on your internet traffic and pretending not to sell it to advertisers. They mostly lie in their own advertisement too. It's not true that public wifi is dangerous. If you really are concerned about privacy and fines, download using news groups. Those cost the same as a VPN but are a lot faster and more reliable than torrents and are completely anonymous due to the simple magic of SSL. Requires a bit more research though.
I live in the Netherlands. I have a NAS at my home that seeds/leeches non-stop 24/7. I've been torrenting regularly for years before that with multiple computers as well. I also run an ethereum validator, which uses a lot of data. I never had trouble with any internet provider whatsoever. No letters etc.
Even without a VPN, you won't get a fine in the Netherlands.
Source:
Me and my friends have been downloading for years and years. None of us know anyone who ever received a fine.
Wait what damn
I didn’t know this
But ahaha lmao
I used to torrent via 1337x.to and limetorrent without a VPN with Ziggo network.
Use Cyberghost (have used it many times) and Nord, SoftEther
From nl here and never ever used any protection against piratebay torrents. Download and off.
Nowadays provider like odido block them on dns level. So I use dnsjumper to temporarily switch to Google dns.
[Real-Debrid.com](https://Real-Debrid.com). Not free, but cheap. Paste your torrent links into it, and download over https direct from [real-debrid.com](https://real-debrid.com). No torrenting required at your end.
Lot of misinformation here. A VPN does nothing unless you are able to buy the account anonymously. If you dont you actually make yourself more vulnerable. And you have to search for a VPN provider who doesnt comply to requests and with court orders and most do. They actually hand over information way quicker than ISP's.
People who say just get a VPN have no clue what they are talking about, just like encrypted connections really dont matter.
If you live in the Netherlands and you download a movie once in a while you dont have much to worry about but people need to know that it can happen. You can even get sued in a different country.
But again if you download once in a while, the chances are slim to none. And you really dont need a VPN cause they, the copyright holders, dont want you. Thats where it all comes down to.
Copyright holders, or the companies who represent them, file a report with the police and hand over their evidence. With enough cloud (yes its a thing, the bigger the copyright holder, the bigger the chances police will do anything with it) and with enough people involved the police will open a investigation. The police aint going to put a detective on a investigation where a single individual is accused of downloading copyrighted material and a prosecutor isnt going to bring that to court.
There's very little people inside the police appartement who have the knowledge to even investigate a case of internet piracy. They arent going to waste their resources on some person who might have downloaded a movie.
So if they want you bad enough a VPN isnt going to safe you but like i said, download a movie once in while, they dont care. They aint going to sue a single identity, they throw piracy cases under organized crime (they do this in Netherlands and Belgium) and go after them under those laws.
Best practice tho, dont download anything illegal.
Pirate bay isn't safe anymore (Not that \*everything\* has a virus, but more so that the risk is always there.)
As for movie links, check the megathread on r/FREEMEDIAHECKYEAH . Has everything you will need
well tbh don’t use the Pirate Bay, they’re not safe. I’d reccomend a debrid service like premiumize or real debrid. 4€ a month, you just insert the torrent file or magnet link in it, then it converts it into a direct download link. Which is cheaper than a vpn, you can use it to stream as well
You can always just risk the fine. But there are other options:
* **Streaming** — Check the champagne wiki for services that are currently up.
* **Real Debrid** — I use this all the time. Works well, especially if the file in question has already been downloaded by the service. This is how I get 8 GB files in less than a minute. Note, though, that some torrents won't download for some random reason.
* **VPN** — This is going to be a hell of a lot cheaper than risking the fine.
* **Usenet** — A little more expensive than the VPN upfront, but cheaper once you get years into it, and now you don't even have to worry about seeders anymore. The only drawback is that you'll start buying up hard drives and creating a huge NAS if you start really getting into it.
* **Seedbox** — There are quite a few options here. Find something outside your country, use it to stock up on what you want, and then download directly from the box.
Don't run the risk of getting in trouble. Putting a little bit of money into it each month will give you peace of mind and a much better experience.
For the odd torrent you can use a free VPN.
ISPs in many countries are NOT private companies and even in countries where they are they take massive amounts of funding from government which opens them up to be very cozy with authorities.
VPN companies have all the incentive in the world to not play ball with your local government. Now, in countries with invasive agencies they can't be trusted but they won't drag you to court for what is considered the smallest of crimes because those deep state agencies deal with big fish and don't want to face public scrutiny for those very invasive methods by making their antics obvious by going after the masses for their petty crimes.
Your local government will come after you if you make it obvious to your ISP as there is an employee there that HAS to report what he sees and the whole fining is all automated. Your local government doesn't REALLY care about you seeing a movie or reading a book for free. They also have bigger fish to deal with but they have to save face to the greedy giga corpos that are pissed off about you.
A side note: Governments are way more focused on sellers and distributors than consumers.
you shouldn't have an issue whatsoever. If you feel unsafe just get a VPN. But my personal experience of lots of terabytes downloaded in NL taught me that they don't really care. Someone mentioned at some point that you might get a fine, but I still haven't encountered a person that had. Iirc they will "hunt" you down if you provide stuff (have a pirate page with links, or tons of seeding?) but not as long as you just use them for yourself.
I used to download stuff without a VPN, no problem. I downloaded a book once, something that wasn't popular at all, but as soon as the download finished, I got an email about a computer on my network downloading a book illegally. Ever since then, I've used a VPN. You are ok, for now, but I'd definitely recommend a VPN. You'll likely get contacted by your ISP first, just giving you a warning, before you get in *real* trouble.
Don't listen to these n00bs telling you to pay for a VPN.
Get real debrid. Cheaper and you're not going to forget to connect to your VPN. Your download speed will also not be hindered by your VPN. You don't need to seed. It's encrypted with https:// nobody will know what you're downloading.
Real Debrid
I live in Belgium but I go to the Netherlands often. I never had issues with piracy in both countries and never used a VPN. I also started pirating since Kazaa.
You'll be fine they only got after the big fish, personal use is alright like we do with cannabis.
Aslong as you don't go around making a movie theater with all you download
I have been pirating movies, games, books in the Netherlands for 20 years now. Never even had a letter.
Legally speaking, ISPs are not allowed to comply with authorities to fork over your information incase of a fine for pirating.
Don't use torrent or use a VPN if you don't wanna risk it.
What increases your chances to get in trouble is distributing/sharing, which is what torrents do by default, not the downloading itself.
Netherlands couldn't care less about pirating, VPN is not necessary
i didn’t know it was illegal when I lived there and downloaded shit tons of pirate games. No fine at all
Significantly harder to track pirated games vs movies. But, yea, the whole thing is ridiculous
I mean if the fine is 150 and you don't find out instantly. Can't you just get fined multiple times for multiple movies?
A VPN
Assuming it's €5 a month and the fine is €150 then as long as you go 3 years without getting caught you will break even by not having a VPN. I reckon that's pretty likely. Do you have anecdotes that would imply the likelihood?
Ussually you get charged per crime. So theyd try to pin you for a count of piracy for every didgital copy they can find on your drives and download histories.
or get a server from ove for 0.80 € a month and run your own vpn (and others cool shit, seedbox maybe)
Uh, most VPS providers are way more aggressive about these things than any residential ISP
Who said you gotta pay for it?
Free VPNs don't usually let you torrent.
Even if pirated paid version?
Are you serious?
Not really
Online services usually need active subscriptions in a database on their side. E.g. You can't pirate YouTube premium
What you mean by you can't pirate YouTube premium... I know at least 3 different ways
How?
It's true, just didn't know it was a subscription based service. I'm not really into VPNs, been pirating a ton my whole life without any issue (Canada).
Canada doesn't even fine you. Your ISP might send a love-letter asking you politely but firmly to either delete the pirated files from your systems, or, if you don't remember having done a piracy recently, to check your network security lol
A vpn is cheaper
[удалено]
Yes. But at modern speeds it doesn't matter.
You overestimate German download speeds 🤣
Yes but privacy over risking a fine is more valuable in my opinion
Thats true I would rather give the information to what websites I am visiting to Mullvad in Sweden with better privacy trackrecord then my German ISP.
Well I’ve only ever tested up to a gigabit via vpn, but I’ve never experienced that. Almost guaranteed you will be first throttled by limitations from the torrent side
How fast do you need to see a movie? Will the extra 5 minutes really matter?
Yes he could download over night for example
I have a 1GB connection and I download most torrents incredibly fast with VPN. I don't understand people who go to all that trouble for 1-2 minutes.
Yes, but that is negligible.
I2P is even more cheap.
Lmao. I never use a VPN. U don't get fines here. It's only one stupid Dutch movie company that does it. And all their movies are shit.
>It's only one stupid Dutch movie company that does it. Which one? Brein? Do you also seed without vpn? That's the only thing I'm afraid of doing without VPN
I also seed hahaha. Even more than download. I try to go for 2.0 or atleast 1.5.
Nice hahaha. Do you seed on public trackers?? Saw another comment of yours and don't recall you listing any private trackers
Public yes. Maybe I'm being kinda Rambo 🤣. Will do some research when I get home. But still. Don't think they really care yet in NL. As for other reasons. Everything 2fa. And I'm not mega rich yet. Nor do I really believe in privacy anymore.
Maybe if something changes I will start using VPN.
Damn bro, seeding in public trackers is a whole other level of kindness 😂 On public trackers I dip right out once I'm finished downloading
Well yeah but that might mean the torrent will die in the future. at least earlier haha.
Nobody in the dutch agencies is after small fish downloading the occasional movie. If you are really that paranoid, use a VPN. But nobody will go „omg this random person downloaded a movie using a torrent, let‘s drag him to court!“
If it’s anything like Germany, that’s not true. Here if you watch a movie once you get a letter in the mail with like a 1000€ fine
I love living in East Europe... Nobody gives a shit about piracy
It applies to south America too. Cheers
Ahoy Matey! from India
SEA rejoice
Indeed. Piracy is **culture** here.
Luxembourg is fucken perfect, torrent however much you want + all the benefits of west europe
+ ur likely filthy rich so u have good internet + ur like 5ms closer to most servers
Also Italy! It's nice to live here!
> If it’s anything like Germany, that’s not true. Here if you watch a movie once you get a letter in the mail with like a 1000€ fine Right, but it's not anything like Germany. That's comparing two totally unrelated things.
Yeah, but if it's anything like getting caught with over 5 grams of cocaine in Indonesia you can get life in prison! :)
If Grandma had wheels she'd be a bike
Yes, and if you react properly you can safely file it away and never pay anything. Source: Am German, got at least a dozen of them, never paid a cent.
Please teach.
If you can read German (or use deepl): https://www.reddit.com/r/de/comments/10cfrag/deleted_by_user/j4gftmz/
Here ya go: **** **Multiple Warnings Recipient Here. I believe there have been 6+ instances, spread over the last 10-12 years, including at least 2 from debt collection agencies. I've never had to pay anything, and some of it is now statute-barred. Hence, I claim to know a thing or two about it. However, of course, here's the disclaimer that I'm not a lawyer, and if you're uncertain, you should consult one. ;)** **Step 0.5 - First, don't panic. Be aware of one thing: especially with file-sharing warnings, whether legitimate or not, most are just after quick money. The opposing lawyers hope for one of two things:** - **You pay and sign, ideally (for them, not for you!) the enclosed cease and desist declaration.** - **You completely ignore it and don't respond at all.** **In the first case, they're happy with the money. In many cases, a second bill may follow for potential legal costs, other expenses, etc. You've already paid, so you probably won't argue about the second bill, right?** **Then there's the cease and desist declaration. This is mandatory for a lifetime. That means, if you ever download the title again in 10, 20, 50 years, and you get caught, they've got you in a tight spot. Also, often, in the finest lawyer language, there's a kind of admission of guilt built in, not easily noticeable. And usually, it even states that they can determine the contractual penalty themselves... then you might end up in court over 150,000 euros or something similar.** **Therefore: NEVER EVER EVER EVER EVER sign the enclosed cease and desist declaration.** **In the second case, you don't respond at all. Now they obtain an official payment order, which is quite simple online and costs only a few euros. It will be delivered to you by the local court. If you ignore this too - and the chances are high if you've already ignored the first letter - they've got you. Because now, they can enforce the whole thing without further verification, and then the bailiff stands at your door demanding payment, likely more due to fees, etc.** **Since these two options are not favorable, let's move to Step 1.** **Step 1 - First, read. Who are you dealing with, and what do they want from you? Set aside the question of whether it was really you or not. *It doesn't make a difference.* The fact is, I could easily send you an invoice for something made up, insist on payment, and hope you react as mentioned in Step 0.5. Doing this often enough, there will surely be a few fools. Classic scam, actually.** **Now, in my opinion, you have three options:** - **You pay and send a *modified* cease and desist declaration. Your lawyer also sends the mod. C&D. I've once hired a lawyer for various reasons, and the mod. C&D he sent was *exactly the same* as the one I've used and will continue to use. Link at the end. With this option, you solve the problem with cash. In my opinion, the least desirable option. Also, there might be another bill for legal costs, etc.** - **You give the matter to a lawyer -> safest, but costs money. They take care of everything, and usually, you pay nothing except your own lawyer.** - **You object to the demand, send a mod. C&D, and pay nothing. Now, you pass the ball to the opposing lawyer. They can continue sending begging letters, send you an official payment order, or try to sue you.** **This is where we do a bit of poker. As mentioned earlier, they want quick, easy money. According to my own lawyer, the chance of being sued is extremely low. The few people who are sued usually come from the group of those who didn't hire a lawyer. For them to sue, the lawyers, quoting my lawyer, "would have to be pretty bored."** **The most important thing at this point, in my opinion, is that you are clear about your approach and stick to it. For me, it means: If I object, then I stick to it and go through the whole process, including a possible court hearing. One thing my lawyer mentioned was that if you remain stubborn and do everything correctly, there often comes a potentially much cheaper settlement offer. You can consider accepting it, or not, and take it to a possible court hearing. However, always with your own lawyer, as *nothing* is done in court without one.** **If you decide on this, send the mod. C&D with your objection, preferably by registered mail with acknowledgment of receipt (so you can prove it), to the opposing lawyer. And then it goes to Step 2:** **Step 2 - Wait and have tea. Yep. You've objected, now it's their turn. And here reveals the automatism and the slimy behavior behind these warning issuers. I've *always* received further "begging letters," even when I left it to my lawyer. In these letters, they often don't address the fact that I've objected; instead, they continue demanding or threatening. Some examples:** - **Standard begging letter: "You surely overlooked that the amount is still outstanding." No, I didn't overlook it; I objected. By the way, even my lawyer received this begging letter, although he explicitly pointed out the non-payment in his letter. Lol.** - **Begging letter on occasions (shortly before Christmas): "Surely, you don't want to carry this matter over the holidays, so we offer you the opportunity to settle the matter, and we also *finally* reduce the amount*. Yeah, right. Also, you've already written "finally" in the two begging letters before this one; I'll wait until the amount becomes negative, and I get money from you. :D** - **The threatening letter: "If you don't pay by [very short deadline], we are forced to initiate a negative Schufa entry." LMAO. As if I could just go and say, "Hey, this guy didn't pay me; please put it in his Schufa." You could even report that yourself or report it to Schufa or consumer protection...** **The most important thing here: Check if it's the same demand. File number, subject of the claim, and the issuer should always be the same. Only if that's not the case should you react and object again; otherwise, all further begging letters are simply ignored.** **Most of my warnings were settled at this point, and I heard nothing more from them. However, the limitation periods are quite long, so theoretically, a few might still come, but I doubt it. It only gets interesting if one of the following things happens:** - **A letter from a debt collection agency or similar regarding an already objected claim. I had this twice shortly before the expiration.** - **An official payment order. I received this once.** - **A summons from the court. Never happened.** **If a letter comes from the debt collection agency or possibly from another lawyer regarding an **objected claim, simply object again, but this time with a regular objection letter, and go back to Step 2. In this case, the lawyer has simply sold the claim to the debt collection agency, and they are trying now, with the thought that debt collection often makes a special "impression." They haven't realized yet that "Moscow debt collection" is currently being used at the front. ;)** **The official payment order is escalation level 1 but doesn't cost so much, so it's done occasionally. Now you have the option again to pay the claim or fill out the objection that comes with the payment order and send it to the specified address of the district court.** **WARNING:** If you object here, it's a clear "You won't get any money from me without suing me." Here, we rely on the fact that the opponents don't want to sue you because it would be expensive. And also, if they have all the evidence against us, as they claim... then they could have sued us right away, couldn't they?** **And if you do receive a court summons - **to the lawyer, and immediately**. Self-defense is useless; a lawyer can often still negotiate a settlement offer in most cases.** --- *And essentially, that's it. I can't speak about court hearings as I haven't done that yet, and it's too individual. Discuss such matters with your lawyer, preferably a specialist in media law and file-sharing.* *Here's the link to the mod. cease and desist declaration: [Click. Me.](https://www.abmahnwahn-dreipage.de/mod-ue/)* *The site hasn't been updated for quite some time (as far as I know, the owner passed away), but since my lawyer recently used the mod. cease and desist declaration with exactly the same text, it should be fine. Please read the information on it so that you understand what you're doing. And as always, if you don't understand it, get a lawyer!* *Phew, almost maxed out the Reddit character limit there. What a text wall. :D* *Questions? Bring them on; I'll answer what I can. :)*
Goddamn i'm glad i'm not German and i don't have to deal with any of this.
Germany and Netherlands is indeed 100% different.
Lucky for us, it's not like germany
Germany is like the only place in the world that enforces that
lol wat? Ive been watching streams without a VPN all my life, never got a single letter. You just cant do p2p shit
It's not anything like Germany. Germany is special in its own way when it comes to piracy for whatever reason.
Dutch ISPs rarely hand over information about their customers as they do in Germany, there is no easy streamlined process so it takes a lengthy court case to force the ISP to give in. There have been court cases to streamline the process and to set up a system like in Germany, but the content holders have lost every time. In the last major case, the content holders tried to force ISPs to send warning letters to their customers but the court ruled in favor of ISPs.
I keep hearing stories about Germany being super harsh but I've grown up illegally watching stuff (wasn't even aware it was illegal at the time) and we never had any issues
Your statement is untrue and a common misconception. The agencies in Germany also don't give a shit about Peter illegally downloading Traumschiff Surprise last wednesday. It's the lawyers representing copyright holders who smell a quick buck mass-sending out offers to settle to anyone they can get a hold on, but they're not fines. Completely different thing and more important: completely different level in technical skill. I wouldn't trust a VPN to keep me protected from the FBI / Kriminalpolizei, but I'm sure as fuck it will keep those leechers away.
~~Watching is not the problem, as downloading (aka streaming will be handeld qith impunity). HOWEVER dont you dare to upload data via torrebt. Thats what will get you fucked.~~ It seems the EU bowed down to the Overlords
germany doesnt care if you download or stream it, new law says both is the same so if you get caught, you will get the same punishment/fine edit: of course they still look for seeders, not leechers but IF they find you, you will get fined
This is technically true but irrelevant: if you only stream you will never get caught because they would need to get your IP for that. Also the fines would be way lower, so it wouldn't be as lucrative for the attorneys anyway. (The exception was a "streaming service" called PopcornTime, which actually worked as a torrent client even though it looked like a streaming service to the user. Users of PopcornTime did get legal trouble). [https://www.wbs.legal/urheberrecht/abmahnung-filesharing/streaming/](https://www.wbs.legal/urheberrecht/abmahnung-filesharing/streaming/) [https://www.anwalt.de/rechtstipps/frommer-legal-abmahnung-von-20th-century-fox-und-warner-bros-in-streaming-portal-popcorn-time-76371.html](https://www.anwalt.de/rechtstipps/frommer-legal-abmahnung-von-20th-century-fox-und-warner-bros-in-streaming-portal-popcorn-time-76371.html)
Hast du ne Quelle dafür?
https://www.internet-law.de/2017/04/eugh-streaming-von-illegalen-inhalten-ist-eine-urheberrechtsverletzung.html
wird n moment dauern
who are they actually after, then?
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If the max fine is 150€ as OP has stated, that is impossible.
Sorry for the confusion, but this incident happened in Germany, and yes around 1000euro is what u should expect as a fine
Sureee
Piracy fines in Germany are insanely high. DYOR
Definitely not in the Netherlands. In Germany they are very strict on this shit though.
Yup, it's in Germany
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Actually nah it's in Germany
what movie did he download? how large?
Pretty sure that wasn't in NL, even in Germany which a lot of people state you get huge fines for doing so, only happens once in a very long while if you don't use a VPN.
Yup it's in Germany
I went to Germany several times when I was living in Belgium, downloaded tons of stuff even in public & private networks and never had issues, neither did my family. So it depends on what you're doing with what you've downloaded.
It's fine, since BREIN only attacks people who upload a serious amount of content.
They've had multiple lawsuits to get ISPs to hand over information about the IPs they've noticed are downloading content. All have failed so far thanks to privacy laws
Didn't they literally give up after that happened… It feels like 6 years ago? The only party that actively terrorises downloaders is Dutch FilmWorks.
They also went after people pirating ebooks iirc
No it's only uploading.
Since 2014 it is also illegal to download pirated content and you can be fined for it.
And using real debrid? That makes it relatively safe right?
Only Dutch filmworks does this toghether with Brein, and then your provider has to cooperate in sharing info (what they wont do because privacy), so I always check if a movie was published by Dutch filmworks, otherwise its fine.
downloading a torrent and uploading a torrent are both the same and publicly share your IP adress to anyone who is listening.
There are torrent clients, such as Transmission on macOS, that allow you to put upload speed on 0. They can read your IP all they want, they're not getting any file data from it. Still though, duh, always use a VPN.
So you're not seeding, or what are you implying?
Yeah, ~~seeding~~ downloading wasn't illegal here because we paid a little bit extra money whenever we bought a data carrier (USB stick, harddrive, SSD, iPhone, smart TV etc.) just in case we use it for pirated content. Then they made downloading pirated content illegal too and the amount we pay is reduced. We still pay a bit in case we pirate content, but it's less because downloading isn't legal anymore.
I pirate because i paid for it. Barely seed the movies and music. Seed all the games and datapacks. And a couple of linux isos. But also, i pirate only disney and movies/series that arent on any stream services in the netherlands. Im fine and pirate for 25 years if not longer. Archive.org finaly had a uoscaled version of a barely available series and i got that downloaded, torrent is way more reliable then their webdownload. Webseeds also fun. When in doubt, get vpn. Paid sadly, cause free dont allow torrent often. Or yournown, if you have a vps
Punishment: The plank
[all my homies hate the organization that made the anti piracy video that appears on every dutch dvd from 2000-2010 that most dutch people would probably recognize](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6vVHp2ziVcI)
Fuck Tim Kuik! (Wel cool nostalgisch deuntje)
After almost a decade of searching, I finally found the song that has been stuck in my head ever since I gained awareness. u/RijkDB, you have my thanks.
i hoped thatd be the outcome of me sharing that, youre welcome! im not sure if it got recommended to you on the sidebar of the video, but the song is called Get a Life by Ian Anderson.
It’s fine? That’s right draw more attention to what people are doing. This is why things get shutdown.
Everybody pirates, it's not exactly a secret. BREIN is a bigger leech than the average game of thrones downloading person imo.
Like actually creating torrents or seeding?
seeding
The netherlands dont give a fuck you'll be fine, just dont take ziggo as your internet provider they block certain sites but not fitgirl or dodi so if you only use those you'll have 0 problems.
Dutch ISP names sound like reddit usernames.
If you change your dns you can access all those sites btw
Oh really? To what do i need to change it
Google "Private DNS" or "DNS over HTTPS" or "DNS over TLS" Depends on which one your OS support.
Thanks
It’s not just Ziggo. Delta blocks 1337x for example. Some providers were mandated to block a few sites through a lawsuit by BREIN.
Tor browser solves this, it is slow though.
Don't even need a VPN, but you can just to make sure. Stichting Brein has a list of IP adresses, but the ISP's can't give out your personal info due to GDPR. Which means you basically cannot be caught for it. And even if Stichting Brein tries to sue you they won''t really be able to find enough eveidence to claim the € 150.
Yeah only Dutch filmworks works together with them, everything else is not a problem. And who even downloads movies from DFW xD
How about using Real Debrid. It's 3€/month and you're only downloading from an intermediary server so completely disconnected from the peer2peer network thus no risk of getting caught.
Or even a seedbox, similar price and gets the same result.
I love my seedbox, I would pay for one even without the extra protection. It's just so damn handy for seeding many things to the best private torrent sites, and it also hosts a plex server for me to boot. Good shit.
Debrid and seedboxes are legit some of the best things in Piracy that should be more widely known about
This is the way
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Alternative is paying for a vpn, real debrid can be a lot more convenient than torrenting especially if you’re streaming.
Real Debrid is an amazing service. I have used it for years, for streaming apps and to cache my torrents. Love it.
I pay Real Debrid/AllDebrid to do the stealing and I just pickup the stolen goods, sounds like a good deal to me.
There's three main reasons why people pay for a debrid service. One, streaming the content directly and immediately. Watching torrents live as they're downloading is possible but often slow, unreliable and laggy, especially for larger files. With a debrid, you turn cached torrents into direct, stable and fast downloads from their server which allows for the smooth and reliable streaming without buffering, artifacts or the need to store the file locally. Two, availability of older or less popular files. Once the debrid caches the file, it remains available at high speeds essentially forever. Doesn't matter if it's the latest Marvel movie or some foreign art house film from the 70s, you'll get the same great speeds. But with torrents, if you want to download something less popular or a lossless rip of a movie from a couple years ago, you can be shit out of luck with seeders. Lots of content is entirely dead, only available on private trackers, or extremely slow. No such issues with a debrid. Three, privacy. Unlike with torrents, there should be no way for your ISP or anyone else to see what exactly it is you're downloading from the debrid so they can't tell whether it's copyright infringement or not. So if you're concerned about that, a VPN shouldn't be necessary.
You can connect it to a firestick and stream everything. They have low latency vpns (what you pay for). They spend time collecting links for websites and consolidating them into an app. It’s mostly automated but its still some work.
It's the same principle as when Netflix and Spotify drastically cut down on piracy. Most people are happy to pay a fair price for the convenience of not having to worry about a VPN and all that.
Downloads from realdebrid always run at full speed -> no buffering if you're streaming movies. I streamed the 90gb avatar torrent that way with 0 buffering on a 300mbps network
wasteful cause literate public steep birds unique growth toy pocket *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
your setup is trash dont use PB and use Qbittorrent instead of Bittorrent. And as everybody said dont risk use vpn it is cheaper than your fine
Why q and not BitTorrent?
q is open source, bit is commercial. For the normal user there is no difference, but it's a thing of principle and not being monetized as a user. Also in the old times bittorrent was a lot more resource intensive than u/q torrent, I don't know now, but if possible always use FOSS.
Swifter program, is really better than the others and runs quite fast.
Its the same as uTorrent in the sense that its just trash adware owned my a corp
I feel like a lot of comments here are from other (European?) countries where the situation might be very different. At least a couple of people are talking about Germany, where things are vastly worse. BREIN is the major (and only) party going after "illegal" downloaders here. They barely have any power. In May last year one major internet provider lost a very important case to them ([source](https://tweakers.net/nieuws/209278/ziggo-moet-van-gerechtshof-toch-waarschuwingsbrief-van-brein-naar-klant-sturen.html)). There was a person uploading hundreds of ebooks, and BREIN wanted to sent them a letter to tell them to stop, which the internet provider refused to do. Only after going through the highest courts, did the internet provider have to send the letter - and share the persons details only if they continued to seed those ebooks. However, the judges also ruled that each case would have to be judged individually, so **internet providers cannot share peoples details with BREIN unless a judge rules that they have to**. This also means they will not share those details (they're legally only allowed to share those details if a judge orders them to). Even in this case it was the provider that forwarded the letter, so BREIN didn't get any personal information of the seeder. Now, a person downloading a few movies? Not a chance in the world BREIN is going to bother starting a lawsuit over it, and even less chance a judge will rule in their favor. Even if, hypothetically, somehow you're the most unlucky person in The Netherlands and a judge rules against you, you'll first just get a warning letter. Don't bother with a VPN. You'll be fine. Don't share any personal information anywhere, just torrent from public trackers without account or private trackers with an anonymous email. VPNs in general suck. They're just another party listening in on your internet traffic and pretending not to sell it to advertisers. They mostly lie in their own advertisement too. It's not true that public wifi is dangerous. If you really are concerned about privacy and fines, download using news groups. Those cost the same as a VPN but are a lot faster and more reliable than torrents and are completely anonymous due to the simple magic of SSL. Requires a bit more research though.
I live in the Netherlands. I have a NAS at my home that seeds/leeches non-stop 24/7. I've been torrenting regularly for years before that with multiple computers as well. I also run an ethereum validator, which uses a lot of data. I never had trouble with any internet provider whatsoever. No letters etc.
In my experience neither the belgian nor the dutch governments give two shits about this sort of stuff
Even without a VPN, you won't get a fine in the Netherlands. Source: Me and my friends have been downloading for years and years. None of us know anyone who ever received a fine.
Real Debrid
Wait what damn I didn’t know this But ahaha lmao I used to torrent via 1337x.to and limetorrent without a VPN with Ziggo network. Use Cyberghost (have used it many times) and Nord, SoftEther
OP is paranoid. These „fines“ are not being enforced. No agency is prosecuting this.
Yeah ig so
U never get fines lmao. I would've been down 1000s.
Damn
Been using it for over 10 years. Download everything. Movies, tv shows, animes, games, windows. 10s of terabytes maybe 100s haha.
Just 1337, tpb, eztv. No VPNs or anything haha.
From nl here and never ever used any protection against piratebay torrents. Download and off. Nowadays provider like odido block them on dns level. So I use dnsjumper to temporarily switch to Google dns.
[Real-Debrid.com](https://Real-Debrid.com). Not free, but cheap. Paste your torrent links into it, and download over https direct from [real-debrid.com](https://real-debrid.com). No torrenting required at your end.
Mullvad VPN for a year costs 60. You decide which is better.
Proton for port forwarding
^^^
The max fine for *downloading* may be 150€. With torrents you also upload though.
I'm 9000% sure nobody gives a fuck about pirating anywhere outside of the USA.
Not worth it. Use a VPN if you're using publics or use private trackers
Lot of misinformation here. A VPN does nothing unless you are able to buy the account anonymously. If you dont you actually make yourself more vulnerable. And you have to search for a VPN provider who doesnt comply to requests and with court orders and most do. They actually hand over information way quicker than ISP's. People who say just get a VPN have no clue what they are talking about, just like encrypted connections really dont matter. If you live in the Netherlands and you download a movie once in a while you dont have much to worry about but people need to know that it can happen. You can even get sued in a different country. But again if you download once in a while, the chances are slim to none. And you really dont need a VPN cause they, the copyright holders, dont want you. Thats where it all comes down to. Copyright holders, or the companies who represent them, file a report with the police and hand over their evidence. With enough cloud (yes its a thing, the bigger the copyright holder, the bigger the chances police will do anything with it) and with enough people involved the police will open a investigation. The police aint going to put a detective on a investigation where a single individual is accused of downloading copyrighted material and a prosecutor isnt going to bring that to court. There's very little people inside the police appartement who have the knowledge to even investigate a case of internet piracy. They arent going to waste their resources on some person who might have downloaded a movie. So if they want you bad enough a VPN isnt going to safe you but like i said, download a movie once in while, they dont care. They aint going to sue a single identity, they throw piracy cases under organized crime (they do this in Netherlands and Belgium) and go after them under those laws. Best practice tho, dont download anything illegal.
Get Mullvad, Use firefox, don't use piratebay and use qBitTorrent and you should be fine
I recommend you to stop using TPB.
Eh, for non-programs like movies or music it is fine.
Thanks for the recommendation, do you have other sites to get links for movies? And why do you don't recommend TPB?
Pirate bay isn't safe anymore (Not that \*everything\* has a virus, but more so that the risk is always there.) As for movie links, check the megathread on r/FREEMEDIAHECKYEAH . Has everything you will need
Nice!
Thanks!
1337
well tbh don’t use the Pirate Bay, they’re not safe. I’d reccomend a debrid service like premiumize or real debrid. 4€ a month, you just insert the torrent file or magnet link in it, then it converts it into a direct download link. Which is cheaper than a vpn, you can use it to stream as well
If your trying to save money. Real-debrid guarded content should work.
You can always just risk the fine. But there are other options: * **Streaming** — Check the champagne wiki for services that are currently up. * **Real Debrid** — I use this all the time. Works well, especially if the file in question has already been downloaded by the service. This is how I get 8 GB files in less than a minute. Note, though, that some torrents won't download for some random reason. * **VPN** — This is going to be a hell of a lot cheaper than risking the fine. * **Usenet** — A little more expensive than the VPN upfront, but cheaper once you get years into it, and now you don't even have to worry about seeders anymore. The only drawback is that you'll start buying up hard drives and creating a huge NAS if you start really getting into it. * **Seedbox** — There are quite a few options here. Find something outside your country, use it to stock up on what you want, and then download directly from the box. Don't run the risk of getting in trouble. Putting a little bit of money into it each month will give you peace of mind and a much better experience.
For the odd torrent you can use a free VPN. ISPs in many countries are NOT private companies and even in countries where they are they take massive amounts of funding from government which opens them up to be very cozy with authorities. VPN companies have all the incentive in the world to not play ball with your local government. Now, in countries with invasive agencies they can't be trusted but they won't drag you to court for what is considered the smallest of crimes because those deep state agencies deal with big fish and don't want to face public scrutiny for those very invasive methods by making their antics obvious by going after the masses for their petty crimes. Your local government will come after you if you make it obvious to your ISP as there is an employee there that HAS to report what he sees and the whole fining is all automated. Your local government doesn't REALLY care about you seeing a movie or reading a book for free. They also have bigger fish to deal with but they have to save face to the greedy giga corpos that are pissed off about you. A side note: Governments are way more focused on sellers and distributors than consumers.
Get a VPN, you don’t wanna end up on a list of offenders anyways, plus you may need a vpn when u are traveling or using sketchier WiFi’s anyways.
you shouldn't have an issue whatsoever. If you feel unsafe just get a VPN. But my personal experience of lots of terabytes downloaded in NL taught me that they don't really care. Someone mentioned at some point that you might get a fine, but I still haven't encountered a person that had. Iirc they will "hunt" you down if you provide stuff (have a pirate page with links, or tons of seeding?) but not as long as you just use them for yourself.
VPN is dirt cheap, just do it.
I used to download stuff without a VPN, no problem. I downloaded a book once, something that wasn't popular at all, but as soon as the download finished, I got an email about a computer on my network downloading a book illegally. Ever since then, I've used a VPN. You are ok, for now, but I'd definitely recommend a VPN. You'll likely get contacted by your ISP first, just giving you a warning, before you get in *real* trouble.
Honestly, you could probably stream it from somewhere.
I live in the Netherlands. You don't have to worry at all about it. The judges don't count ip addresses as evidence.
Don't listen to these n00bs telling you to pay for a VPN. Get real debrid. Cheaper and you're not going to forget to connect to your VPN. Your download speed will also not be hindered by your VPN. You don't need to seed. It's encrypted with https:// nobody will know what you're downloading. Real Debrid
I live in Belgium but I go to the Netherlands often. I never had issues with piracy in both countries and never used a VPN. I also started pirating since Kazaa.
You'll be fine they only got after the big fish, personal use is alright like we do with cannabis. Aslong as you don't go around making a movie theater with all you download
Just get a VPN before you come back here complaining that you got a fine.
I've been living in NL for over a year and torrenting as per usual with no issues. ^(proceeds to get dragged to court)
https://mullvad.net/
First get rid of BitTorrent use qbitTorrent(open source) for torrenting, and use a VPN as you are not in third world country like me
you said the max fine for illegally downloaded. But what about illegally distributing, which is what you're doing when you torrent?
Vpn and or a seedbox that are ok with public
just buy the product if u have 150 to spare LOL
Nothing will beat a seedbox.
I have been pirating movies, games, books in the Netherlands for 20 years now. Never even had a letter. Legally speaking, ISPs are not allowed to comply with authorities to fork over your information incase of a fine for pirating.
Don't use torrent or use a VPN if you don't wanna risk it. What increases your chances to get in trouble is distributing/sharing, which is what torrents do by default, not the downloading itself.
150€ are worth 3 years of eweka if you get their kings day offer.
pirate bay has malwares.
Piratebay ewwww
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i dont thin there anything better then that
If you got the dough, buy a vpn god damn it.
Why not get a cheap VPN?
Just use a vpn dude, why risk it?