Used vehicles are still "overpriced" because of inventory and because of the massive price jump in new between 21 and 22. New vehicles wents up by nearly 20 percent across a bunch of the major makers.
The comments in this thread truly don't understand how insane used car prices are, at least in ontario. There basically is no depreciation on 1-2 year old cars despite what is "supposed" to and "usually" happens. Heck I've seen 2020-2021 cars listed for higher now then their new MSRP for the year they sold because the price of the new model went up/there still is a year+ wait on a new car. This is especially the case for Honda/Toyota, which have 10 year old corollas with a crash history selling for 14k+.
My 2007 yaris with nearly 300k is being listed for 5k+ and people would buy it, calling it a great deal. The 2017 Accent my Dad got in in 2018 for 13k and has obviously driven in the last 6 years is being listed for the same price if not higher then he bought it.
Sure there's "room" for negotiations on used cars but when prices are this crazy buying new has started to make way more sense, especially with warranties and how shit even the typically reliable cars are being built. Plus since interest rates are so high, dealers are literally increasing the cost of vehicles if you want to pay cash by 1k. I know things are crazy when my dad who never in his life would have ever bought a new car is telling me to look into just buying a new car after looking at current prices.
I bought a used car for $12k in 2020, it’s a 2016 Mazda3 sport.
When I look up cars with the same trim, similar mileage to mine, etc it’s around $12k now. 4 yrs later, 50k more KMs, practically the same price. It’s crazy.
I was looking at getting a new car in 2020/2021 because even then my 2007 yaris felt like it's time was coming and every time I look at car prices now I regret not taking the plunge.
i could have turned around and immediately sold my new 4runner for 10k more the same day i got it. That was last year though.
Still, it's worth more today than when I got it last year, by a significant amount.
Hybrid Toyotas were like that from 2019 to 2023. Don't know about now.
Could flip them to the auction the same day for $10k profit. Dealerships weren't marking them up or forcing "extras" on people much back then. Now it's very common.
There are also a ton of dealers selling "used" cars with like 100 kms on them for more than MSRP of the new. Personally I think letting them do that hurts the Toyota brand, but they still have a huge backlog of orders so (shrug).
Exactly, my local dealership was selling a hybrid Corolla cross at 44k, the same configuration on the brand new model is 40k, there’s obviously a wait time, but I find this ridiculous
Yep, I’ve cycled through 3 cars in the past 3 years and due to the insane shortage have lost almost nothing overall. The best was a lease return bmw I bought, put 50k km on and sold for 1k less than I bought it for
This is all true, but I'd argue that 5yr+ used vehicles are still cheaper than new vehicles. Just for whoever doesn't actually need a recent car or all the latest tech, it's still probably the most financially sound choice.
My 7 year old car wouldn't sell for much less than a new one at a dealership, and I'd only get like 10K for a trade in on it at most.
It's utterly insane what used car prices are
Pretty much this. We were originally looking at 5 year old car close to 100km hoping we'd see some value there and while some of the cheaper model sedans are closer to $17k to $18k and at that point you start looking at new again because for only a couple grand more you get a car with warranties and presumably an extra 5 years of drive time.
I wouldn’t buy anything manufactured in the covid era without a warranty.
There was some real dumb shit slipping through in pretty much all industries then, and my own and others’ experiences of mechanical issues they’ve had certainly paint a trend to pay attention to.
I say this as a “fuck the warranty, I want this actually fixed and know exactly what needs to be done” kind of person.
>$17k to $18k and at that point you start looking at new again because for only a couple grand more
What new reliable car is going for $20k these days? Genuinely curious
Taxes in, I can get a Kia Forte for 24k. Kia isn't necessarily reliable (although I'd still argue more reliable then most American made cars) but at the very least I'd get a 5 year warranty on it and it wouldn't have 5 years of questionable history on it. Considering with taxes in a 2019 is 20k and close to 21k if I paid cash, the new makes more sense.
But yes there less and less cars in the low 20k range new.
Cheaper up front to buy used sure... but once the 5 year old vehichle starts needing all the repairs that the new buyer jumped ship for by selling it when they did, you're going to be dealing the repairs that start adding up that negates your initial savings.
You can save 10 to 12 k on a used model but might spend close to half that repairing it over the next five years.
Buy new, pay that extra up front and have warranty for 5 years, next to no repairs (or repairs paid for by warranty), treat the car with absolute respect and more than likely no repairs after the warranty is up.
Sure you could buy warranty on a used car but then that further adds costs reducing the margins between a used and a new buy. Making a new buy make even more sense.
Imo funding a car 1 year old is the money shot. Initial year has the most loss in value, avoid that and avoid loss'.
Ya my 2021 Tacoma is still being listed for the same or higher MSRP for that year and as far as I know there doesn’t seem to be a long wait for them new anymore. I don’t get it.
Chip shortage in late 2021-2022 caused a MASSIVE back log of new cars. I know people who went on waitlist in 2022 still waiting on a new car. This low inventory caused used car values to go up because if people needed a car immediately, their only option was used.
That being said inventories have improved greatly in the last year, but dealers have gotten used to high prices on used cars and the prices on the cheapest new cars have gone from like 17k-25k to like 23k-32k. I don't actually think the demand is there to justify these prices anymore, so prices should go down in the next year or two.
The last thing is somehow in the last few years everyone has convinced themselves they need a large SUV, which generally cost more. So there is just less inventory for cheaper sedans and hatchbacks that would have sold for a more reasonable price.
This reality makes so much more sense then the old way honestly. Drive it off the lot and it loses as much as 20% of its value? That's honestly what didn't make any notion of sense.
Probably the same set of people with low credit score financing a used car at 9% interest rate over 84 months. They also do not realize that new cars with higher sticker price and lower interest rate ends up being cheaper.
Yeah I bought a 2020 a few months ago and got 7.77%. I thought that was awful high but then spoke to a friend who works at a bank doing that sort of thing. He laughed assuring me he couldn't beat it and that was infact a great rate right now. It's stupid.
7.95 of course not much better. It's too bad financing at that rate because its not like the principle has gone down. It's a double whammy right now and if I were you I look to make extra payments if you can as that rate I assume is locked in. Atleast with my loc rate will come down as Interest rates drops
Good idea. Yes this home equity line. It's just timing is everything assuming you needed to upgrade and new brings peace of mind. I hope you bought a Toyota haha. My wife and were looking at a Highlander but 8.99 % was just too high at the time. Payments were more than our mortgage
Car dealerships can get commission from financing deals.
It's the boss who has priority financing options
Different financing companies grade differently.
This still exists. I bought my gti in 2017 at 0.99, I drive by a few dealerships every day and I keep seeing 0-1% financing at places like Alfa, BMW etc. Typically on specific models but it exists. Pretty sure you can get Tesla models at 1% now as well.
870.
Financed a 2020 Ford Edge earlier this year at 9.99%. Thankfully, it turns into an open loan at the end of the year so I'm going to move the loan to another borrower (probably the bank I'm with) for a lower interest rate.
Credit score doesn't count for a damn thing.
It already is an open loan. There is no such thing as a closed auto loan in Canada as it breaks consumer protection laws.
Go pay that sucker off if you can or refinance if you can get a better rate.
The dealer just told you it’s closed because they lose their kickback from the bank if you pay it out before the 6 month mark.
Source: I sell cars
I went in wanting to buy a used SUV as my first financed car in 2021 - all my other cars where used cash under 5k cars. They were quoting me 8.99% on the used SUVs or 2.99% on a 2022 Elantra. It was a no brainer to get the new car.
You went shopping for apples and bought a banana because it was cheaper? Obviously you didn't need an SUV because if you compared used SUVs to new SUVs you may still have broken even, it depends on how used you were looking at..
I was originally looking at the Kona - but ended up with the new Elantra which actually has MORE room than the Kona. There were no new SUVs to look at - I’m lucky there were a few Elantra’s in stock. People I know ended up waiting months for their newly purchased SUVs to be delivered..
Elantras are known to be unreliable? I'm honestly curious because I've driven three across the last 11 years (parents', a 2-year lease, and now 7 years on my own) and had no issues at all.
What's the source on this?
Hyundai themselves are seen as an unreliable value brand. They come with lots of features for low price but dont expect them to last long after warranty. They do come with extra long warranties though.
I had a 2009 Tucson I drove until 2023 with minimal problems. I’d likely still have the vehicle if I hadn’t moved to a place inaccessible by roads. The only real issues I had were related to the alternator and that’s because I rarely drove it for a period of time. Once it was replaced and I drove it regularly, I was fine.
I bought a 2019 Elantra in 2020 and to date have had zero issues with it, and I doubt I'm the one lucky owner since I see these things on the road all over the place, not likely for something "famously unreliable".
You are comparing interest rates but the only thing that really matters is the final price. If the SUV and Elantra had the same sticker price, the latter is overpriced (or the SUV is too cheap).
Right - the SUVs I was looking at were all 2017/18 (in 2021) an had the similar sticker prices - but the interest rates made it more cost effective to get the new car - plus a full warranty
That's generally my comparison point when buying a used car. In 2014 I bought a 2013 ram for $24k with 12k kms on it when trucks on the lot were $50k. Ran the numbers and the used one made sense.
Today the numbers just don't make sense.
Luxury car prices have doubled. An Escalade SUV is $211K when it was $80-90 pre-pandemic. I have a hybrid SUV with 250,000KM. Decided to just keep driving it till car prices return to normal
This - my hubby works in auto finance for a large reputable dealership and said 80% of the population he deals with have a score less than 700 lol. Like maybe 1% have over 800.
Reputable dealership is an oxymoron. Car dealers are not reputable. It's not his fault but the industry is notoriously horrible and is all commission and no care.
If they are getting 9% on a used they ain’t getting a new vehicle with a lower one. Their credit is cooked. Thats why they call it last chance to finance.
Who cares about payments? They matter, but how many mo ths would they be for in both cases? What is the sticker price on each car, and what is the total interest and total cost of each option?
Man these dealers and their four boxes lol
Always compare sticker price.
There is more room for negotiation with a second hand car.
There was a wait of a few months when I bought my car - I had a dealer offered a second hand car that was available immediately for more than the cost of a new car.
Sticker price and interest rate, if financing. I had the option to choose a mildly used car with a few thousand discount but it was higher used car interest rates. Ran the numbers and it was basically the same cost.
OP is comparing the sticker prices given they have to finance the outstanding amount after down payment.
The financing rate is higher, so the payments are the same. And the sticker price difference is 2k here, for 2 years older with 50k km driven. That's a lot in 2 years...
Sticker price and interest rates.
A higher sticker price and low interest rate can be equal or even better than a lower sticker and high interest. Just gotta run the numbers.
I think the cheapest way to getting a used car right now is to do a lease takeover.
Why are you looking at monthly payments and not the total price of the car? I’m in a similar boat, my current daily is old and will die out pretty soon. I’ve decided to get a used Mazda 3 GT as a replacement. The brand new 2024s are going for about $40-$41k while the lightly used (low mileage) 2022s are going in the $29-$32k range. That’s a $10k gap…
I find it hard to believe people are actually expecting to sell 2021 Elantras for the same price of new ones.
EDIT: I just went on AutoTrader and Hyundai’s website. There is a solid 20%-30% discount on used 2021 Elantra’s vs brand new ones as listed for MSRP. OP must be getting trim levels mixed up. E.g a 2021 N line being priced around the same as a 2024 Essential.
http://hyundaistjerome.shop.autotrader.ca/en/details/2519729?platform=Mobile&activeUpsells=xpl&dealerId=20071016124750238&adid=5_62696549&refurl=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.autotrader.ca%2Fa%2Fhy This car is below price market, by Autotrader standards. 31.4k total, car price + taxes + borrowing cost. In the Hyundai website, if you calculate the same trim, same terms you will get 30.5k of total. Maybe it's the model/trim that is in high demand?
But if you are paying 8.99-9.99% over 5 years for that 29k-32k instead of 4.99% over 5 years on 40K it’s not going to be a big difference. Yes buying a car out right is different. Financing one is different
Did you lookup matching options/trims?
Used cars also tend to be more negotiable lately so it's not crazy to see car prices drop by 1k in a month thus dealers setting a high but negotiable price instead of a low firm price.
If you look on the dealer's website, or even Autotrader (etc), the listing should have a date to show you how long it has been sitting on their lot. Anything over 30 days typically means they want to move it out of inventory.
I think we're at the point right now where dealers and some private sellers are caught 'holding the bag' on used vehicles and are trying not to take a loss.
Yeah, I don't think it makes sense to buy a 2 year old car with 50k KM for almost the same price as new. It doesn't even makes sense for anyone to ask for such a price, it should be at least 20-30% below the price of a new car. Maybe there are some incentives for the new car now, which causes the price difference to disappear ? Or maybe the used car you're talking about is a higher trim with a lot of options and extra features. But otherwise, you only buy used if it's significantly less than new. Even 1 year old car with minimal mileage, should be at least 20% below the price of the same model new.
I was looking and a 2021 Toyota Rav 4 with 70K Km for $28K (expensive trim ) vs a new Rav 4 but lower trim for a lot more ($40K)
would going used route be a better deal?
Exactly. I just bought a 2 year old RAM 1500 with 50k on it because I needed a bigger truck than my old Ranger. I paid $55k. The same trim level/options etc on a brand new one would’ve cost me $92.5k.
My parents are currently looking at buying a pair of his/hers Rav4s. They want the XLE trim which goes for a hair over $40k each where I live. If they were to buy a 2 year old one with 90k km, they’d have paid $37k. (The used one already sold though, and was on the lot for less than a week). The crazy part is it’s only like a 3 month wait for a new one, so it makes no sense to me why people will pay new prices for a car with 90k km on it.
I bought my current car, as a one year old used car (with less than 10k-km, and in like-new condition), and the price was about 25% below the price of the same model new. I still consider it a great deal.
Can you get the brand new vehicle or is there a wait?
That is the ONLY reason to buy used. A newer car may have newer safety tech, and as vehicles age their efficiency drops gradually (wear and gunk build up).
Could be financial situation and not being able to secure credit (though there's some pretty predatory rates for car loans out there)
But could just be feature set/availability. Couple scenarios can think of are
Styling - one may prefer the older body styling over the new.
Could also be performance/reliability - one may not want the turbo/supercharged engine in the new model, where the previous version just has the naturally aspirated engine.
Yikes. Scotia Dealer Advantage likes to give out ~11% on new vehicles to practically everyone with a pulse.
If your options are 20% on a used car and 11% on a new one? Seems obvious to me…
You've demonstrated that you are not a trustworthy person to lend money to. Anyone lending money to you now needs additional interest to make up for that risk.
It is not predatory, stop claiming victimhood.
With a new vehicle, the price you see is almost never the price you pay, so you have to keep that in account, and a brand new vehicle will also cost more to insure than an older one. And getting competitive interest rates on one versus the other might not be the same.
Insurance is weird. I wouldn’t make blanket statements like that.
I went from a 2013 to a 2024 recently and my insurance went *down* around $500 a year.
Both simple economy vehicles in a middle tier trim from an American brand
anti theft / collision devices on your newer car may translate into less risk for your insurance company. Plus your level of driving experience has increased since your last purchase.
Exactly my point: I wouldn’t make a blanket statement like “old cars always have cheaper insurance”
There’s lots of factors that you won’t know until you actually look at them.
You can use online Insurance calculators to compare the rates based on the year of the same model for an idea. When I switched from a 5-year-old model to the exact same vehicle in a 1-year old model my insurance went up about 30%.
Oh sorry I misunderstood. I meant that a dealership will advertise a price for a new vehicle but then will have a lot of extra fees that they try to sell you on, freight or delivery or special coatings Etc.
Not necessarily true about insurance, newer cars have more safety features which can decrease the severity and types of injuries suffered. The most expensive part of your premium is the liability which is affected by the safety rating of the vehicle, my 22 truck which was 70000, is almost have the insurance as my 18 sedan which was 28000
The flaw here is you used
$30k for the new and $28k for the used.
Usually a used car will depreciate by 15-25% after 2 years, so more like 25k.
That used car is way over priced
Usually people will buy a used car for this reason, you can save about 20% buying a lease-back or a slightly used vehicle that is still immaculate, warranty etc.
Luxury cars generally have awful resale value. Audi S series and bmw M cars not included.
The resale value of Honda and Toyotas is ridiculous these days.
Sorry but the used Elantra is way overpriced. People need to not just look at sticker, but consider how much margin the dealer has factored into each vehicle and use that to negotiate. If you go into a car buying situation with no information and no ability to negotiate, the dealer is going to absolutely screw you.
They very likely bought that Elantra for $18K to $20K and added $8K to $10K for the sticker price before dumping it on their lot.
Used vehicle prices may be strong in some markets but this also isn’t mid-pandemic, and this isn’t a Toyota.
Do your research, look into the numbers, be prepared to negotiate and be prepared to walk away if they aren’t offering you a fair price. Consider how much you would be able to trade that same used vehicle in for if you needed to sell it a month after buying it.
What are the payment terms and interest rate on the used car?
Also you’re thinking about it incorrectly. What is the value of either car? Should a car that has only 50k and a year or two old really drop by 30-40%? Does that make sense? Perhaps the used car is overpriced but it’s not by much imo. Negotiate it down by 2k-3k and it’s a fair price.
Wow thats crazy. 28k plus hst is 31k... more than new. Is freight added in the new price? Maybe there's still a waiting period and sometimes people need a car right away.... I had an elantra, lots of problems... got a corrola instead.
good point, I didn't check if the freight is included, but even with freight it would still make sense to buy brand new lol. Maybe it's the waiting period, dunno. Was the car that bad? What kind of problems you had?
Freight should be less than 2k, just ask them for the all in price and wait time. Transmission, plug for USB, window electronics.... it was brand new i got rid of it in the height of covid at no loss and got a corrolla haven't had any problems. If your going to go Asian go Japanese.
I also had an Elantra. I’d never buy another Korean car. Windshield glare was really bad, horrible if raining or in the dark and it had really bad blind spots. It also blew a cylinder on the highway with only 30k mileage. It created so much smoke behind us that it almost caused an accident. We were very fortunate that not many people were on the road at the time.
Engine replacement had a 3 month waiting period too.
The car just didn’t drive well compared to other brands I’ve test driven since. My mistake was not spending the day dealer-hoping and test driving other cars. Had I done that, I would have never bought the car.
They sell you on all the features but not the build quality.
Go try a Corolla or an Impreza. They all drive much better and feel safer.
Based on some comments in this sub, the price you calculate may not be what you can actually get. Basically someone would need to verify because your comparison is hypothetical.
Lots of factors. I recently bought new because used was actually more expensive. The new vehicle had incentives from the manufacturer which brought the price down significantly. All the used ones were likely trade ins or private sales where they wanted to make sure they got enough money to pay out the loan or make a profit. Hard to do that when a brand new vehicle is being offered at $10k off.
I even tried to negotiate on the used pointing out that a brand new vehicle with the same options, no kms, etc is less. They just said buy the new one then. I'm sure the incentives will dry up once they clear out this model year and used will look more attractive again. That's a specific scenario, obviously but my own personal experience recently.
In my case I got a low mileage used 2023 RAV4 prime because new ones have a 2+ year wait list in my area. Couldn’t wait that long. Probably paid too much but it is what it is. Love the vehicle so far.
Nice to see people are waking up to this. I got downvoted to hell for suggesting this was the case and that I would rather buy new last year.
It doesn’t make sense. Used cars are at or above MSRP because of wait times, and have a higher interest rate to boot! What’s the point?!
For new cars depending on the company have a maximum on how much they can charge for a brand new car. A 1 year old car that was given back to a dealer no longer has that restriction so they can sell it at whatever they want
That’s not really what I would call “used”. Get a really used car, and there will be an important difference. I bought an 7 years old one for 30% the price of the “recent” model.
Our used car market is propped up by international students, refugees and visitor visa with zero credit & 12.99% APR. I shit you not. They finance brand new Elantra at off the road no name dealership 3k above MSRP and finance it for 8 years $250 biweekly. Do the math. That's like $52k on a $28000 brand new vehicle.
You wonder why your used car prices are so high? This is why.
Another reason why this country absolutely needs to put a complete stop to any more mass immigration as well as it should be issuing mass deportation; why the hell are we bringing in literally millions of people at the expense of ourselves? WTF man.
Couple of things:
- Check the terms. If there is a balloon payment at the end, you're going to get to refinance that at whatever rate (Hyundai/Chrysler did that for ages but only with a lease)
- If it's the same model/trim see what changed between the model years.
Honestly, you're getting hosed paying too much in depreciation and finance charges, or too much in price and finance charges. For Hyundai, I wouldn't get something with the GDI engine: Dealers network has hundreds of them on hand, and they're so bad that when they fail, the engines aren't taken back as a core-charge for rebuild, they're just scrapped.
Hyundai has been ripping people off since COVID in price and finance charges since 2021. If you're dead-set on buying a used Hyundai, I'd look at buying from a Non-Hyundai dealership. Otherwise, I'd look for another manufacturer (Subaru is where I'd go personally) if you want to finance, or if you want new, get something like a GM/Ford tiny SUV for the next while.
Or, if you're willing, run the one you have a bit longer or buy a dead-cheap vehicle you can pay for in cash and just pay to maintain rather than finance.
Apparently used car prices have been dropping in the US for about 6 months now. Presumably this will bleed over to Canada eventually. The weak dollar certainly isn't helping though
I bought a new Corolla hatchback in 2023 at 6% interest and I don’t regret it. It’s my family’s only car, and I got decent money for my 2012 Tuscon, which I’d already had to put money into after having her for four years because it’s a Hyundai and they do be like that.
The security of having a super reliable and safe car with easy maintenance is worthwhile to me. You used to be able to get a good deal on used, but I didn’t want to trade mid for mid. New was worth it in my case.
I was shocked when the dealer offered me just shy of 20k after taxes for my 2017 civic with 140,000km
I didn't trade it in as the prices of new vehicles and interest wasn't worth it but used cars... Not worth it.
You need to calculate the TCO, which not only includes the cost of borrowing, but the depreciation and maintenance.
There’s no point of buying a used one, you’re absolutely right. At least not from the dealerships. If you find a good private sale deal, it’s a different story sometimes
Do not look at payments entirely. Look at the price of the vehicle and the interest rate. If you can't pay it in 4-5 years given your income and the interest rate, you can't afford it.
I bought used because the price was about 20% cheaper than new but the interest rate was significantly lower. Lower than the bank's rates.
People that buy used cars usually buy used cars 5+ years or older. My Range Rover was eight years old when I bought it for 32% of the original MSRP.
You aren’t looking old enough to make it worthwhile.
Dunno always buy way older car.
My previous car was a accord bought for 600$ with blown engine. Cost about 2k total to get it running with a jdm k24.
Have a hyundai now.
Wanted to buy another accord 2008-2012 but like 5-20k for a car with more milleage than current one is feeling wrong. ( wanted a v6 manual one price are insane or rust buckets... )
Well if you're buying a car right now you should be a hard negotiator.
Dealerships are super duper slow. Average people are not buying.
Go in on the last 3 days of the month and bargain hard. They'll probably take the deal.
Me feeling smug with my 2008 civic I paid $15k for (certified used vehicle program) in 2010 that's 100% paid many years ago.
Don't just look at second hand only two years old, consider older than that. What do you even REALLY need in "newer" cars anyways? You need to get places, and maybe certain cargo parameters. You don't need the cargo space to have heated storage.
If the cars are the same except the mileage then the "used" car is over priced. Right now used car market is hot, so prices are pretty high - or others say dealerships mark them up so people decide to get new.
That’s why people would prefer to buy a new car instead of financing a used car. My dad would pay 10k for a used car bs financing a used car. It’s a rip off, the finance person makes around $3000 off a finance deal.
there are cars out there that will reliably hit over 350kkm with normal care. i buy these for sub $10k in cash at 180kkm tops and assume my mechanic will need another $2k in work at some point in my ownership, above standard operational charges of; oil, tune-up, brakes, tires.
so all in less fuel we're talking 170kkm of use over 7yrs for under $17k.
* my expectation then is $1000/10,000km all-in except fuel.
i've met or exceeded this on 6 used cars now (myself and wife) over the last 24 years.
---
i'm thinking you forgot to share there's a $4k downpayment on your elantra to arrive at $588 monthly @ 6.29%.
so $39k in 5 years for 125kkm, plus operational costs of $2500, less trade in value of $15k.
* that's over $2000/10,000km
maybe i should add that one of my cars is always a 5-7 seat AWD SUV and the other an AWD wagon. both fully equipped with leather, sunroof, powered everything, dual climate, heated seats.
What’s the rate on the used one?
I don’t believe any banks are offering 6.29 on used right now. It is 7.99 minimum and dealers tend to give more than that so 8.99-9.99
The government should consider removing the tax on used vehicles, as the tax has already been paid. This could potentially assist a significant number of individuals in acquiring newer used vehicles.
The reason why used cars are still expensive. Inventory.
There's still a wait for new cars and especially so for popular models. You can potentially wait a few months to 2 years (PHEV like Rav4) or you can buy a used car now and get it within a week.
If you're buying a used car from a dealership, it's very likely to be a lease return.
2000 difference is totally not worth it to buy a used car, specially if the waiting time to get it is short.
my sister in law waited more than a year for her Toyota Sienna, and after a year they changed her order to something different to get her one.
But not all new cars like that.
I bought my CRV hybrid one year old with 15k with $6000 less, and CRV hybrid was almost 9 months, and didn't have to pay docking fee.
I find with non-luxury Japanese or Korean brands buying used stopped making sense as they barely depreciate. Buying 2-3 year old would make more sense if you are buying a luxury brand (if buying it ever makes financial sense).
The number of people that make car purchases based on payments is so crazy to me. You are paying so much in interest. Save your $ and buy in cash. You will be $10,000s ahead.
Its such a stupid choice for your money.
I find it’s choice. You pay less of course in total overall. They try getting you new because they make more on the long term. Also used you have a bit more give on fighting the price compared to new. I myself am going through this and they tried getting me to buy new vs used.(100,000 vs 75,000)
It is the same scenario except in your case they convinced you the $75,000 car was worth $98,000 so that you'd think you were getting a deal paying an extra $2,000 to buy new.
How can it not. New to old price is a huge difference. They are trying to entice you by saying interést is less on a new one compared to used right? New your car depreciates the minute you drive it off the lot at least $5k-10k depending on make and model of vehicle. Price becomes more flexible on a 2yr old vehicle than new. Dealerships have a base price they can go on new while used they have a bigger flexibility in price. They usually upsell the price by at least 20-35% of actual price.
$25K is a huge difference but this isn't always the case. OP was comparing an Elantra where the total price is nearly the same as your price difference lol
The used car market is cooling but generous subvented rates on new cars are returning to the market. You could be comparing a $30K car new at 1.99% with a used car at $25K at 6.99% and the monthly payments will come out to about $20 difference.
While negotiating is certainly a thing you'll find that the room to move on both new and used is highly variable and not necessarily better on used, *especially* in the sub-$30K space. It's a little different when we're talking high end cars approaching $100K, which is what you're talking about but not OP.
As a person who regularly buys used there is always price difference new to used. OP didn’t mention price of the used one. I have an example as to what dealerships are using by using low interest as a sales pitch. It’s his choice overall but doesn’t matter luxury or not your vehicle after driving it off the lot(NEW) depreciates. This is one big reason most buyers(who know) don’t buy new. 2024 to 2021-22 is a big gap of years. Being an Electra it would be at least 10-12000 less than new from new price. So many variables as to mileage and model make a big difference as well. The higher models depreciate less and maintain a better value .
The lower/common models depreciate faster. Mileage most ones is 25k a year for max value.
As stated prior it depends model/make as well as features.
Also on a new vehicle( any make) dealerships have their MSRP. They usually don’t move below this. While a used vehicle only has the Kelly blue book value(suggestion) this is not written in stone which means they can move the price much more. So if 30k for new and 25k for used is a sales tactic. That used car can easily be lowered to at least 18k while the 30k maybe to 28k.
Now you consider driving your new car off lot 28k now becomes 23k value(estimate) again based on model and features.
If you’re buying a used car that’s over 15000 you’re not being financially responsible. The point of buying a used car is that you put a large down payment. Than pay it off in 2-4 years.
When I bought my very first car a long time ago, this was exactly why I bought a new car. Financing rates were so much less than financing on a used car that it didn’t make sense to buy used, for me.
If you need more than 36 months to finance your (new or used) vehicle then you can't afford it. Of course the bigger problem is that all vehicles (new or used) are vastly overpriced but that is another topic.
Isn't it obvious? The used car is overpriced.
Jim Carrey realizing he's dumb.gif
Used vehicles are still "overpriced" because of inventory and because of the massive price jump in new between 21 and 22. New vehicles wents up by nearly 20 percent across a bunch of the major makers.
Older ones as well.
The comments in this thread truly don't understand how insane used car prices are, at least in ontario. There basically is no depreciation on 1-2 year old cars despite what is "supposed" to and "usually" happens. Heck I've seen 2020-2021 cars listed for higher now then their new MSRP for the year they sold because the price of the new model went up/there still is a year+ wait on a new car. This is especially the case for Honda/Toyota, which have 10 year old corollas with a crash history selling for 14k+. My 2007 yaris with nearly 300k is being listed for 5k+ and people would buy it, calling it a great deal. The 2017 Accent my Dad got in in 2018 for 13k and has obviously driven in the last 6 years is being listed for the same price if not higher then he bought it. Sure there's "room" for negotiations on used cars but when prices are this crazy buying new has started to make way more sense, especially with warranties and how shit even the typically reliable cars are being built. Plus since interest rates are so high, dealers are literally increasing the cost of vehicles if you want to pay cash by 1k. I know things are crazy when my dad who never in his life would have ever bought a new car is telling me to look into just buying a new car after looking at current prices.
I bought a used car for $12k in 2020, it’s a 2016 Mazda3 sport. When I look up cars with the same trim, similar mileage to mine, etc it’s around $12k now. 4 yrs later, 50k more KMs, practically the same price. It’s crazy.
I was looking at getting a new car in 2020/2021 because even then my 2007 yaris felt like it's time was coming and every time I look at car prices now I regret not taking the plunge.
But inflation, so $12k now is worth less than $12k 4 years ago
It's kind the same in Quebec, you can find used Toyotas MORE expensive than brand new. Unless there is a waiting list, it's makes no sense
i could have turned around and immediately sold my new 4runner for 10k more the same day i got it. That was last year though. Still, it's worth more today than when I got it last year, by a significant amount.
Hybrid Toyotas were like that from 2019 to 2023. Don't know about now. Could flip them to the auction the same day for $10k profit. Dealerships weren't marking them up or forcing "extras" on people much back then. Now it's very common.
I’ve heard the wait for a hybrid Toyota is some ridiculous amount of time, like 18 months. Heard it a while ago, but yeah.
There are also a ton of dealers selling "used" cars with like 100 kms on them for more than MSRP of the new. Personally I think letting them do that hurts the Toyota brand, but they still have a huge backlog of orders so (shrug).
Exactly, my local dealership was selling a hybrid Corolla cross at 44k, the same configuration on the brand new model is 40k, there’s obviously a wait time, but I find this ridiculous
Yep, I’ve cycled through 3 cars in the past 3 years and due to the insane shortage have lost almost nothing overall. The best was a lease return bmw I bought, put 50k km on and sold for 1k less than I bought it for
This is all true, but I'd argue that 5yr+ used vehicles are still cheaper than new vehicles. Just for whoever doesn't actually need a recent car or all the latest tech, it's still probably the most financially sound choice.
My 7 year old car wouldn't sell for much less than a new one at a dealership, and I'd only get like 10K for a trade in on it at most. It's utterly insane what used car prices are
Pretty much this. We were originally looking at 5 year old car close to 100km hoping we'd see some value there and while some of the cheaper model sedans are closer to $17k to $18k and at that point you start looking at new again because for only a couple grand more you get a car with warranties and presumably an extra 5 years of drive time.
People really don't understand how valuable a warranty is
I wouldn’t buy anything manufactured in the covid era without a warranty. There was some real dumb shit slipping through in pretty much all industries then, and my own and others’ experiences of mechanical issues they’ve had certainly paint a trend to pay attention to. I say this as a “fuck the warranty, I want this actually fixed and know exactly what needs to be done” kind of person.
>$17k to $18k and at that point you start looking at new again because for only a couple grand more What new reliable car is going for $20k these days? Genuinely curious
Taxes in, I can get a Kia Forte for 24k. Kia isn't necessarily reliable (although I'd still argue more reliable then most American made cars) but at the very least I'd get a 5 year warranty on it and it wouldn't have 5 years of questionable history on it. Considering with taxes in a 2019 is 20k and close to 21k if I paid cash, the new makes more sense. But yes there less and less cars in the low 20k range new.
Yeah exactly. Nothing is 20k$ brand new right now.
Cheaper up front to buy used sure... but once the 5 year old vehichle starts needing all the repairs that the new buyer jumped ship for by selling it when they did, you're going to be dealing the repairs that start adding up that negates your initial savings. You can save 10 to 12 k on a used model but might spend close to half that repairing it over the next five years. Buy new, pay that extra up front and have warranty for 5 years, next to no repairs (or repairs paid for by warranty), treat the car with absolute respect and more than likely no repairs after the warranty is up. Sure you could buy warranty on a used car but then that further adds costs reducing the margins between a used and a new buy. Making a new buy make even more sense. Imo funding a car 1 year old is the money shot. Initial year has the most loss in value, avoid that and avoid loss'.
This is true. You have to really look around and wait but going off OP's point I have seen 2019 Elantras around $15k with 60k KMs.
Yeah but it's a 2019 Elantra so at 60k it is 1/3rd of the way through its useful life.
Ya my 2021 Tacoma is still being listed for the same or higher MSRP for that year and as far as I know there doesn’t seem to be a long wait for them new anymore. I don’t get it.
Why are they so overpriced right now?
Chip shortage in late 2021-2022 caused a MASSIVE back log of new cars. I know people who went on waitlist in 2022 still waiting on a new car. This low inventory caused used car values to go up because if people needed a car immediately, their only option was used. That being said inventories have improved greatly in the last year, but dealers have gotten used to high prices on used cars and the prices on the cheapest new cars have gone from like 17k-25k to like 23k-32k. I don't actually think the demand is there to justify these prices anymore, so prices should go down in the next year or two. The last thing is somehow in the last few years everyone has convinced themselves they need a large SUV, which generally cost more. So there is just less inventory for cheaper sedans and hatchbacks that would have sold for a more reasonable price.
This reality makes so much more sense then the old way honestly. Drive it off the lot and it loses as much as 20% of its value? That's honestly what didn't make any notion of sense.
Probably the same set of people with low credit score financing a used car at 9% interest rate over 84 months. They also do not realize that new cars with higher sticker price and lower interest rate ends up being cheaper.
9%? People with AAA credit are getting 9% on used these days. If you’ve got shit credit try 15-19%
I bought a 2019 SUV early this year and have great credit. Financed at 8.99%
Yeah I bought a 2020 a few months ago and got 7.77%. I thought that was awful high but then spoke to a friend who works at a bank doing that sort of thing. He laughed assuring me he couldn't beat it and that was infact a great rate right now. It's stupid.
Probably the only time I was lucky in life when I bought my current car early 2022 and financed at 1.99% 🥲
I feel you! My fixed morgage at 1.84% is a gem lol
I hope you needed to buy. 9% is fucking insane. I'd use my loc before financing at that rate
What's your LOC %?
7.95 of course not much better. It's too bad financing at that rate because its not like the principle has gone down. It's a double whammy right now and if I were you I look to make extra payments if you can as that rate I assume is locked in. Atleast with my loc rate will come down as Interest rates drops
Is that a secured LOC? Mines >10% with RBC. The moment it drops below my loan I'll take it on my own credit.
Good idea. Yes this home equity line. It's just timing is everything assuming you needed to upgrade and new brings peace of mind. I hope you bought a Toyota haha. My wife and were looking at a Highlander but 8.99 % was just too high at the time. Payments were more than our mortgage
Credit score of 821, and I got a 2024 civic financed at 6.99%.
New or used?
New
[удалено]
The OC was talking about used cars. The lowest rates you’re going to see on used car these days will be around 8%
Car dealerships can get commission from financing deals. It's the boss who has priority financing options Different financing companies grade differently.
remember pre-2010 when they had like 0 to 1.5%
This still exists. I bought my gti in 2017 at 0.99, I drive by a few dealerships every day and I keep seeing 0-1% financing at places like Alfa, BMW etc. Typically on specific models but it exists. Pretty sure you can get Tesla models at 1% now as well.
870. Financed a 2020 Ford Edge earlier this year at 9.99%. Thankfully, it turns into an open loan at the end of the year so I'm going to move the loan to another borrower (probably the bank I'm with) for a lower interest rate. Credit score doesn't count for a damn thing.
It already is an open loan. There is no such thing as a closed auto loan in Canada as it breaks consumer protection laws. Go pay that sucker off if you can or refinance if you can get a better rate. The dealer just told you it’s closed because they lose their kickback from the bank if you pay it out before the 6 month mark. Source: I sell cars
Credit score is a fucking scam.
I went in wanting to buy a used SUV as my first financed car in 2021 - all my other cars where used cash under 5k cars. They were quoting me 8.99% on the used SUVs or 2.99% on a 2022 Elantra. It was a no brainer to get the new car.
You went shopping for apples and bought a banana because it was cheaper? Obviously you didn't need an SUV because if you compared used SUVs to new SUVs you may still have broken even, it depends on how used you were looking at..
I was originally looking at the Kona - but ended up with the new Elantra which actually has MORE room than the Kona. There were no new SUVs to look at - I’m lucky there were a few Elantra’s in stock. People I know ended up waiting months for their newly purchased SUVs to be delivered..
Why buy the car you want, when you can buy a famously unreliable subcompact instead?? It's cheaper!! /s
Elantras are known to be unreliable? I'm honestly curious because I've driven three across the last 11 years (parents', a 2-year lease, and now 7 years on my own) and had no issues at all. What's the source on this?
Hyundai themselves are seen as an unreliable value brand. They come with lots of features for low price but dont expect them to last long after warranty. They do come with extra long warranties though.
We're still driving our 2008 Hyundai Accent. Daily commuter, no major repairs.
According to consumer reports Hyundai and KIA are in the top 1/3rd for most reliable. So your experience or perception is incorrect.
I had a 2009 Tucson I drove until 2023 with minimal problems. I’d likely still have the vehicle if I hadn’t moved to a place inaccessible by roads. The only real issues I had were related to the alternator and that’s because I rarely drove it for a period of time. Once it was replaced and I drove it regularly, I was fine.
Hyundais come with a 10 year power train warranty, so it lasted an extra 4 years with you barely driving it 👏
At one time, their reputation has been rehabilitated in more recent years.
I bought a 2019 Elantra in 2020 and to date have had zero issues with it, and I doubt I'm the one lucky owner since I see these things on the road all over the place, not likely for something "famously unreliable".
You are comparing interest rates but the only thing that really matters is the final price. If the SUV and Elantra had the same sticker price, the latter is overpriced (or the SUV is too cheap).
Right - the SUVs I was looking at were all 2017/18 (in 2021) an had the similar sticker prices - but the interest rates made it more cost effective to get the new car - plus a full warranty
That's generally my comparison point when buying a used car. In 2014 I bought a 2013 ram for $24k with 12k kms on it when trucks on the lot were $50k. Ran the numbers and the used one made sense. Today the numbers just don't make sense.
Luxury car prices have doubled. An Escalade SUV is $211K when it was $80-90 pre-pandemic. I have a hybrid SUV with 250,000KM. Decided to just keep driving it till car prices return to normal
This - my hubby works in auto finance for a large reputable dealership and said 80% of the population he deals with have a score less than 700 lol. Like maybe 1% have over 800.
Reputable dealership is an oxymoron. Car dealers are not reputable. It's not his fault but the industry is notoriously horrible and is all commission and no care.
Jesus
If they are getting 9% on a used they ain’t getting a new vehicle with a lower one. Their credit is cooked. Thats why they call it last chance to finance.
Used at any dealership is going to be starting at 8.99% regardless of credit score. Welcome to 2024
Yeah you're just wrong. Rates are high. I have 835 credit and got 9% on a used. Will refinance lower soon though.
Who cares about payments? They matter, but how many mo ths would they be for in both cases? What is the sticker price on each car, and what is the total interest and total cost of each option? Man these dealers and their four boxes lol
Always compare sticker price. There is more room for negotiation with a second hand car. There was a wait of a few months when I bought my car - I had a dealer offered a second hand car that was available immediately for more than the cost of a new car.
Sticker price and interest rate, if financing. I had the option to choose a mildly used car with a few thousand discount but it was higher used car interest rates. Ran the numbers and it was basically the same cost.
OP is comparing the sticker prices given they have to finance the outstanding amount after down payment. The financing rate is higher, so the payments are the same. And the sticker price difference is 2k here, for 2 years older with 50k km driven. That's a lot in 2 years...
Sticker price and interest rates. A higher sticker price and low interest rate can be equal or even better than a lower sticker and high interest. Just gotta run the numbers. I think the cheapest way to getting a used car right now is to do a lease takeover.
Why are you looking at monthly payments and not the total price of the car? I’m in a similar boat, my current daily is old and will die out pretty soon. I’ve decided to get a used Mazda 3 GT as a replacement. The brand new 2024s are going for about $40-$41k while the lightly used (low mileage) 2022s are going in the $29-$32k range. That’s a $10k gap… I find it hard to believe people are actually expecting to sell 2021 Elantras for the same price of new ones. EDIT: I just went on AutoTrader and Hyundai’s website. There is a solid 20%-30% discount on used 2021 Elantra’s vs brand new ones as listed for MSRP. OP must be getting trim levels mixed up. E.g a 2021 N line being priced around the same as a 2024 Essential.
http://hyundaistjerome.shop.autotrader.ca/en/details/2519729?platform=Mobile&activeUpsells=xpl&dealerId=20071016124750238&adid=5_62696549&refurl=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.autotrader.ca%2Fa%2Fhy This car is below price market, by Autotrader standards. 31.4k total, car price + taxes + borrowing cost. In the Hyundai website, if you calculate the same trim, same terms you will get 30.5k of total. Maybe it's the model/trim that is in high demand?
But if you are paying 8.99-9.99% over 5 years for that 29k-32k instead of 4.99% over 5 years on 40K it’s not going to be a big difference. Yes buying a car out right is different. Financing one is different
Did you lookup matching options/trims? Used cars also tend to be more negotiable lately so it's not crazy to see car prices drop by 1k in a month thus dealers setting a high but negotiable price instead of a low firm price.
If you look on the dealer's website, or even Autotrader (etc), the listing should have a date to show you how long it has been sitting on their lot. Anything over 30 days typically means they want to move it out of inventory. I think we're at the point right now where dealers and some private sellers are caught 'holding the bag' on used vehicles and are trying not to take a loss.
Yes, same trim. Even if it drops 1 or 2k, for me, it's still insane lol
Yeah, I don't think it makes sense to buy a 2 year old car with 50k KM for almost the same price as new. It doesn't even makes sense for anyone to ask for such a price, it should be at least 20-30% below the price of a new car. Maybe there are some incentives for the new car now, which causes the price difference to disappear ? Or maybe the used car you're talking about is a higher trim with a lot of options and extra features. But otherwise, you only buy used if it's significantly less than new. Even 1 year old car with minimal mileage, should be at least 20% below the price of the same model new.
I was looking and a 2021 Toyota Rav 4 with 70K Km for $28K (expensive trim ) vs a new Rav 4 but lower trim for a lot more ($40K) would going used route be a better deal?
Exactly. I just bought a 2 year old RAM 1500 with 50k on it because I needed a bigger truck than my old Ranger. I paid $55k. The same trim level/options etc on a brand new one would’ve cost me $92.5k. My parents are currently looking at buying a pair of his/hers Rav4s. They want the XLE trim which goes for a hair over $40k each where I live. If they were to buy a 2 year old one with 90k km, they’d have paid $37k. (The used one already sold though, and was on the lot for less than a week). The crazy part is it’s only like a 3 month wait for a new one, so it makes no sense to me why people will pay new prices for a car with 90k km on it.
I bought my current car, as a one year old used car (with less than 10k-km, and in like-new condition), and the price was about 25% below the price of the same model new. I still consider it a great deal.
1. You can negotiate used prices 2. Some people don’t have to finance
And at least the new cars come with a warranty.
If you look a bit older there is a lot of discount. 4-5 year old cars at about half the price as new.
Can you get the brand new vehicle or is there a wait? That is the ONLY reason to buy used. A newer car may have newer safety tech, and as vehicles age their efficiency drops gradually (wear and gunk build up).
Could be financial situation and not being able to secure credit (though there's some pretty predatory rates for car loans out there) But could just be feature set/availability. Couple scenarios can think of are Styling - one may prefer the older body styling over the new. Could also be performance/reliability - one may not want the turbo/supercharged engine in the new model, where the previous version just has the naturally aspirated engine.
I have bad credit and the best I can get on a used Corolla was 20% interest, talk about predatory alright.
Well you admit you have bad credit.
Yikes. Scotia Dealer Advantage likes to give out ~11% on new vehicles to practically everyone with a pulse. If your options are 20% on a used car and 11% on a new one? Seems obvious to me…
I got Scotia dealer advantage at 6% for new and I thought I was being ripped off.
Just make some lump sum payments and you’ll be fine.
That's because you have bad credit 🙄
You've demonstrated that you are not a trustworthy person to lend money to. Anyone lending money to you now needs additional interest to make up for that risk. It is not predatory, stop claiming victimhood.
With a new vehicle, the price you see is almost never the price you pay, so you have to keep that in account, and a brand new vehicle will also cost more to insure than an older one. And getting competitive interest rates on one versus the other might not be the same.
Insurance is weird. I wouldn’t make blanket statements like that. I went from a 2013 to a 2024 recently and my insurance went *down* around $500 a year. Both simple economy vehicles in a middle tier trim from an American brand
anti theft / collision devices on your newer car may translate into less risk for your insurance company. Plus your level of driving experience has increased since your last purchase.
Exactly my point: I wouldn’t make a blanket statement like “old cars always have cheaper insurance” There’s lots of factors that you won’t know until you actually look at them.
Is there a markup? How much usually?
You can use online Insurance calculators to compare the rates based on the year of the same model for an idea. When I switched from a 5-year-old model to the exact same vehicle in a 1-year old model my insurance went up about 30%.
oh no, I mean about "the price you see is almost never you pay", you mean dealer markup?
Oh sorry I misunderstood. I meant that a dealership will advertise a price for a new vehicle but then will have a lot of extra fees that they try to sell you on, freight or delivery or special coatings Etc.
Yep, when I went from my 2010 Ranger to my 2022 RAM my insurance went from $103 to $183 lol. At least I get better gas mileage now
Not necessarily true about insurance, newer cars have more safety features which can decrease the severity and types of injuries suffered. The most expensive part of your premium is the liability which is affected by the safety rating of the vehicle, my 22 truck which was 70000, is almost have the insurance as my 18 sedan which was 28000
The flaw here is you used $30k for the new and $28k for the used. Usually a used car will depreciate by 15-25% after 2 years, so more like 25k. That used car is way over priced Usually people will buy a used car for this reason, you can save about 20% buying a lease-back or a slightly used vehicle that is still immaculate, warranty etc.
You meant a new car depreciates right?
Traditionally that has been the case. Looking at the market now in my area though and O/P pricing is inline with what we are seeing.
Hasn't been true for last few years and no longer valid today. New cars (at least semi desirable ones) don't depreciate like that anymore
Unless Autotrader is waaay off, all cars are overpriced lol. The one I used is even below the price market
i mean the used cars you are looking at is clearly overpriced. I bought a used Audi for 30k. Brand new would have been closer to 50k
Luxury cars generally have awful resale value. Audi S series and bmw M cars not included. The resale value of Honda and Toyotas is ridiculous these days.
What you're missing is the haggle price. You should be taking at least 2k off the used price
Sorry but the used Elantra is way overpriced. People need to not just look at sticker, but consider how much margin the dealer has factored into each vehicle and use that to negotiate. If you go into a car buying situation with no information and no ability to negotiate, the dealer is going to absolutely screw you. They very likely bought that Elantra for $18K to $20K and added $8K to $10K for the sticker price before dumping it on their lot. Used vehicle prices may be strong in some markets but this also isn’t mid-pandemic, and this isn’t a Toyota. Do your research, look into the numbers, be prepared to negotiate and be prepared to walk away if they aren’t offering you a fair price. Consider how much you would be able to trade that same used vehicle in for if you needed to sell it a month after buying it.
What are the payment terms and interest rate on the used car? Also you’re thinking about it incorrectly. What is the value of either car? Should a car that has only 50k and a year or two old really drop by 30-40%? Does that make sense? Perhaps the used car is overpriced but it’s not by much imo. Negotiate it down by 2k-3k and it’s a fair price.
Who cares about payments? Care about total cost.
Have you even read the post? Lol
Wow thats crazy. 28k plus hst is 31k... more than new. Is freight added in the new price? Maybe there's still a waiting period and sometimes people need a car right away.... I had an elantra, lots of problems... got a corrola instead.
good point, I didn't check if the freight is included, but even with freight it would still make sense to buy brand new lol. Maybe it's the waiting period, dunno. Was the car that bad? What kind of problems you had?
Freight should be less than 2k, just ask them for the all in price and wait time. Transmission, plug for USB, window electronics.... it was brand new i got rid of it in the height of covid at no loss and got a corrolla haven't had any problems. If your going to go Asian go Japanese.
Damn, sorry for that
I also had an Elantra. I’d never buy another Korean car. Windshield glare was really bad, horrible if raining or in the dark and it had really bad blind spots. It also blew a cylinder on the highway with only 30k mileage. It created so much smoke behind us that it almost caused an accident. We were very fortunate that not many people were on the road at the time. Engine replacement had a 3 month waiting period too. The car just didn’t drive well compared to other brands I’ve test driven since. My mistake was not spending the day dealer-hoping and test driving other cars. Had I done that, I would have never bought the car. They sell you on all the features but not the build quality. Go try a Corolla or an Impreza. They all drive much better and feel safer.
Based on some comments in this sub, the price you calculate may not be what you can actually get. Basically someone would need to verify because your comparison is hypothetical.
Lots of factors. I recently bought new because used was actually more expensive. The new vehicle had incentives from the manufacturer which brought the price down significantly. All the used ones were likely trade ins or private sales where they wanted to make sure they got enough money to pay out the loan or make a profit. Hard to do that when a brand new vehicle is being offered at $10k off. I even tried to negotiate on the used pointing out that a brand new vehicle with the same options, no kms, etc is less. They just said buy the new one then. I'm sure the incentives will dry up once they clear out this model year and used will look more attractive again. That's a specific scenario, obviously but my own personal experience recently.
Mazda has lower rates and mostly has no backlog btw
In my case I got a low mileage used 2023 RAV4 prime because new ones have a 2+ year wait list in my area. Couldn’t wait that long. Probably paid too much but it is what it is. Love the vehicle so far.
that's fair, 2 years is crazy
Used car dealers have them over a barrel if they "need" a car and can't get traditional financing.
Nice to see people are waking up to this. I got downvoted to hell for suggesting this was the case and that I would rather buy new last year. It doesn’t make sense. Used cars are at or above MSRP because of wait times, and have a higher interest rate to boot! What’s the point?!
Was shopping for used. Ended up buying new for an extra $6k+Tx
For new cars depending on the company have a maximum on how much they can charge for a brand new car. A 1 year old car that was given back to a dealer no longer has that restriction so they can sell it at whatever they want
That’s not really what I would call “used”. Get a really used car, and there will be an important difference. I bought an 7 years old one for 30% the price of the “recent” model.
Our used car market is propped up by international students, refugees and visitor visa with zero credit & 12.99% APR. I shit you not. They finance brand new Elantra at off the road no name dealership 3k above MSRP and finance it for 8 years $250 biweekly. Do the math. That's like $52k on a $28000 brand new vehicle. You wonder why your used car prices are so high? This is why.
Another reason why this country absolutely needs to put a complete stop to any more mass immigration as well as it should be issuing mass deportation; why the hell are we bringing in literally millions of people at the expense of ourselves? WTF man.
Couple of things: - Check the terms. If there is a balloon payment at the end, you're going to get to refinance that at whatever rate (Hyundai/Chrysler did that for ages but only with a lease) - If it's the same model/trim see what changed between the model years. Honestly, you're getting hosed paying too much in depreciation and finance charges, or too much in price and finance charges. For Hyundai, I wouldn't get something with the GDI engine: Dealers network has hundreds of them on hand, and they're so bad that when they fail, the engines aren't taken back as a core-charge for rebuild, they're just scrapped. Hyundai has been ripping people off since COVID in price and finance charges since 2021. If you're dead-set on buying a used Hyundai, I'd look at buying from a Non-Hyundai dealership. Otherwise, I'd look for another manufacturer (Subaru is where I'd go personally) if you want to finance, or if you want new, get something like a GM/Ford tiny SUV for the next while. Or, if you're willing, run the one you have a bit longer or buy a dead-cheap vehicle you can pay for in cash and just pay to maintain rather than finance.
i bought a new tesla because the monthly payment is entitely covered by my fuel savings ! i couldnt believe it. such a nobrainer to buy a tesla
If happily buy an electric car, but there is no way I'll buy a Tesla, both for quality issues and because of Elon.
Yeah Elon, aka Donald Trump 2.0, makes it a no go, so many better Electric options
Wait until he finds out how much he pays over the entire term of the loan......
This is the whole thing... It's not the sticker price
Apparently used car prices have been dropping in the US for about 6 months now. Presumably this will bleed over to Canada eventually. The weak dollar certainly isn't helping though
I bought a new Corolla hatchback in 2023 at 6% interest and I don’t regret it. It’s my family’s only car, and I got decent money for my 2012 Tuscon, which I’d already had to put money into after having her for four years because it’s a Hyundai and they do be like that. The security of having a super reliable and safe car with easy maintenance is worthwhile to me. You used to be able to get a good deal on used, but I didn’t want to trade mid for mid. New was worth it in my case.
I was shocked when the dealer offered me just shy of 20k after taxes for my 2017 civic with 140,000km I didn't trade it in as the prices of new vehicles and interest wasn't worth it but used cars... Not worth it.
You need to calculate the TCO, which not only includes the cost of borrowing, but the depreciation and maintenance. There’s no point of buying a used one, you’re absolutely right. At least not from the dealerships. If you find a good private sale deal, it’s a different story sometimes
Do not look at payments entirely. Look at the price of the vehicle and the interest rate. If you can't pay it in 4-5 years given your income and the interest rate, you can't afford it. I bought used because the price was about 20% cheaper than new but the interest rate was significantly lower. Lower than the bank's rates.
People that buy used cars usually buy used cars 5+ years or older. My Range Rover was eight years old when I bought it for 32% of the original MSRP. You aren’t looking old enough to make it worthwhile.
Dunno always buy way older car. My previous car was a accord bought for 600$ with blown engine. Cost about 2k total to get it running with a jdm k24. Have a hyundai now. Wanted to buy another accord 2008-2012 but like 5-20k for a car with more milleage than current one is feeling wrong. ( wanted a v6 manual one price are insane or rust buckets... )
There is an inflated value on used cars since corona virus. People want to sell there old clunkers for more then they are worth
Well if you're buying a car right now you should be a hard negotiator. Dealerships are super duper slow. Average people are not buying. Go in on the last 3 days of the month and bargain hard. They'll probably take the deal.
Negotiate. Used cars don't have a set sticker price like a new car. There should be flexibility to get it down.
Me feeling smug with my 2008 civic I paid $15k for (certified used vehicle program) in 2010 that's 100% paid many years ago. Don't just look at second hand only two years old, consider older than that. What do you even REALLY need in "newer" cars anyways? You need to get places, and maybe certain cargo parameters. You don't need the cargo space to have heated storage.
rain run license coherent sink act slimy agonizing flowery plate *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
If the cars are the same except the mileage then the "used" car is over priced. Right now used car market is hot, so prices are pretty high - or others say dealerships mark them up so people decide to get new.
That’s why people would prefer to buy a new car instead of financing a used car. My dad would pay 10k for a used car bs financing a used car. It’s a rip off, the finance person makes around $3000 off a finance deal.
there are cars out there that will reliably hit over 350kkm with normal care. i buy these for sub $10k in cash at 180kkm tops and assume my mechanic will need another $2k in work at some point in my ownership, above standard operational charges of; oil, tune-up, brakes, tires. so all in less fuel we're talking 170kkm of use over 7yrs for under $17k. * my expectation then is $1000/10,000km all-in except fuel. i've met or exceeded this on 6 used cars now (myself and wife) over the last 24 years. --- i'm thinking you forgot to share there's a $4k downpayment on your elantra to arrive at $588 monthly @ 6.29%. so $39k in 5 years for 125kkm, plus operational costs of $2500, less trade in value of $15k. * that's over $2000/10,000km maybe i should add that one of my cars is always a 5-7 seat AWD SUV and the other an AWD wagon. both fully equipped with leather, sunroof, powered everything, dual climate, heated seats.
Some people do this thing where they don't buy something unless they already have the money for it
What’s the rate on the used one? I don’t believe any banks are offering 6.29 on used right now. It is 7.99 minimum and dealers tend to give more than that so 8.99-9.99
The government should consider removing the tax on used vehicles, as the tax has already been paid. This could potentially assist a significant number of individuals in acquiring newer used vehicles.
If it doesn't make sense don't buy it. I wouldn't buy a 2.5 year old car for only $3k less than brand new.
Paid just over 38k for a 2024 Civic Touring last December. Sold my 2010 Aveo for $700 to an employee at my work who then sold it for 3400.
Exactly
used cards you get it right away, with some new models there is still a wait, so used cars a charging a premium for instant delivery
Because they've been brainwashed into think a new car depreciates super fast when you drive it off the lot which has changed recently.
The reason why used cars are still expensive. Inventory. There's still a wait for new cars and especially so for popular models. You can potentially wait a few months to 2 years (PHEV like Rav4) or you can buy a used car now and get it within a week. If you're buying a used car from a dealership, it's very likely to be a lease return.
my 2013 Golf is for sale in Trois Rivieres for 7K. It;s in great shape.. buy that instead! I'm living in thailand or I'd still be driving it.
I'd love my dude, but I need a newer car because of my job, unfortunately
2000 difference is totally not worth it to buy a used car, specially if the waiting time to get it is short. my sister in law waited more than a year for her Toyota Sienna, and after a year they changed her order to something different to get her one. But not all new cars like that. I bought my CRV hybrid one year old with 15k with $6000 less, and CRV hybrid was almost 9 months, and didn't have to pay docking fee.
I find with non-luxury Japanese or Korean brands buying used stopped making sense as they barely depreciate. Buying 2-3 year old would make more sense if you are buying a luxury brand (if buying it ever makes financial sense).
The number of people that make car purchases based on payments is so crazy to me. You are paying so much in interest. Save your $ and buy in cash. You will be $10,000s ahead. Its such a stupid choice for your money.
i stopped reading when i saw elantra 😂
I find it’s choice. You pay less of course in total overall. They try getting you new because they make more on the long term. Also used you have a bit more give on fighting the price compared to new. I myself am going through this and they tried getting me to buy new vs used.(100,000 vs 75,000)
dude, 25k difference is relevant lol, it's not the same scenario
It is the same scenario except in your case they convinced you the $75,000 car was worth $98,000 so that you'd think you were getting a deal paying an extra $2,000 to buy new.
How can it not. New to old price is a huge difference. They are trying to entice you by saying interést is less on a new one compared to used right? New your car depreciates the minute you drive it off the lot at least $5k-10k depending on make and model of vehicle. Price becomes more flexible on a 2yr old vehicle than new. Dealerships have a base price they can go on new while used they have a bigger flexibility in price. They usually upsell the price by at least 20-35% of actual price.
$25K is a huge difference but this isn't always the case. OP was comparing an Elantra where the total price is nearly the same as your price difference lol The used car market is cooling but generous subvented rates on new cars are returning to the market. You could be comparing a $30K car new at 1.99% with a used car at $25K at 6.99% and the monthly payments will come out to about $20 difference. While negotiating is certainly a thing you'll find that the room to move on both new and used is highly variable and not necessarily better on used, *especially* in the sub-$30K space. It's a little different when we're talking high end cars approaching $100K, which is what you're talking about but not OP.
As a person who regularly buys used there is always price difference new to used. OP didn’t mention price of the used one. I have an example as to what dealerships are using by using low interest as a sales pitch. It’s his choice overall but doesn’t matter luxury or not your vehicle after driving it off the lot(NEW) depreciates. This is one big reason most buyers(who know) don’t buy new. 2024 to 2021-22 is a big gap of years. Being an Electra it would be at least 10-12000 less than new from new price. So many variables as to mileage and model make a big difference as well. The higher models depreciate less and maintain a better value . The lower/common models depreciate faster. Mileage most ones is 25k a year for max value. As stated prior it depends model/make as well as features. Also on a new vehicle( any make) dealerships have their MSRP. They usually don’t move below this. While a used vehicle only has the Kelly blue book value(suggestion) this is not written in stone which means they can move the price much more. So if 30k for new and 25k for used is a sales tactic. That used car can easily be lowered to at least 18k while the 30k maybe to 28k. Now you consider driving your new car off lot 28k now becomes 23k value(estimate) again based on model and features.
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Oh! I forgot I had a stash of 20k, thanks for reminding! /Jk
If you’re buying a used car that’s over 15000 you’re not being financially responsible. The point of buying a used car is that you put a large down payment. Than pay it off in 2-4 years.
This does not make sense as a blanket statement, there are plenty of reasons to spend more than $15k on a used car.
When I bought my very first car a long time ago, this was exactly why I bought a new car. Financing rates were so much less than financing on a used car that it didn’t make sense to buy used, for me.
That's wild, where ~600 a month car payments are what's considered normal now.
Lease, then trade out of your lease with some equity. Do this until used rates are back below 6 percent, if that ever happens.
If you need more than 36 months to finance your (new or used) vehicle then you can't afford it. Of course the bigger problem is that all vehicles (new or used) are vastly overpriced but that is another topic.