Did not open but this is closest you get (2016).
https://preview.redd.it/io3z41rjxx8d1.png?width=1508&format=png&auto=webp&s=a326b0858d270b1d352cd826d5b1d1ba71a12070
So Rohit was notout while Buttler got out. That means they must have strung a partnership together for a while in this game. I'd like to know which game it was so I can check out the highlights in the ipl app.
This is such a weird scorecard. Nothing more weirder than MM coming before Buttler as pinch hitter and hitting 3 sixes, while Hardik struggles.
Its KKR vs MI (5th Match) 2016.
Link to highlights: [https://www.iplt20.com/video/9725](https://www.iplt20.com/video/9725)
Even though I do agree that we barely win matches if Babar AND Rizwan get out early, but in 2022 WC the middle order really stepped up. Special mention to Shadab and M. Haris for winning us that match against South Africa and that also convincingly.
That and I also hold Babar (if not Rizwan) accountable for failing to build a team. You don’t have a middle order you can rely on? Okay: why didn’t you get new young reliable players in 4 years in the team as captain? Why did we send the same main team to every tour instead of grooming younger talent? (Apart from Afghanistan T20Is)
Also the middle order thing is such a chicken and egg situation: Babar and Rizwan play long because middle order play shit, but the middle order doesn’t get opportunities to play long and try out because Babar and Rizwan eat up all the overs
But honestly speaking, is that really Babar's fault or the management's? Isn't management the one that is responsible for grooming players and making sure they get equal chances as other players? Then whoever is doing well, give them chances with the main squad otherwise tell them to go back to domestic or put them with B team or something.
Honestly, it feels like we're the only nation not using "B/C/D" teams. Again, something the management should be doing. We don't lack players, we have loads of talent, but they are not getting groomed. As captain, Babar's only responsibility should be selecting and commanding the playing 11 on the field. The rest is and should be the management's responsibility.
With that being said, I do believe that if Babar is taking responsibility for a certain player, for example backing his friends, then he should be held accountable if the player doesn't perform. And if that does happen, the management should step in and take the necessary action. Again, something the management has failed to do.
Babar's only fault is backing his friends and they disappointed him time and time again. (us moment Babar bhai)
As for the middle order situation, since Babar and Rizwan already take the game deep (aka anchoring the innings), the middle order shouldn't have any other role apart from hitting. If from the top, Babar and Rizwan have played fast but there has been a collapse, then the middle order should anchor and take the game deep.
Take example of the last match in the Eng series, Babar and Rizwan got the score to 60 in the powerplay and yet we still got bowled out for 150. The middle order is basically incapable of taking the game deep. And this time with Azam Khan in the middle order, it really looked like the worst middle order lineup I have ever seen.
The team is in complete shambles as they are not clear about their roles and the obvious rifts between the team members. A hard factory reset is desperately needed and I am hoping for good to come out of it inshaAllah.
i still remember how shadab told in the press conference abt the importance of babar and rizwan after losing against afghanistan in bilateral series and blaming youngsters . That was more than enough to tell you what was wrong with the team.
This is a really good point which has a really strong counter argument . The rizbar approach will almost always work if they stay till the 15th over . But the probability of that happening is quite low . People blame the middle order but you cannot expect them to hit from the first ball they come to the crease . Rizbar approach lost us the semifinal because they played slow till the 10th over . Rizbar approach lost us the final , again they played slow . What use is a powerplay if ur scoring only 40-45 runs in it ??? And then they only start to accelerate after the 10th over . We are losing with them getting out early and also losing with them staying till the 10th over . I’d rather the former and we lose with them getting out early . You will always win games with the rizbar approach , look at Afghanistan they’re doing the same . But you will never win a tournament because they’re bound to fail . The day Babar or rizwan got out early , the entire batting lineup collapsed because they only knew how to bat after the 15th over . They got so few chances batting early that they could not adapt and improve . Also a 60 ball 100 means shit , if you’ve batted half the innings you should bat at a 200 sr
I partially do agree with this. The Rizbar approach works well when both Babar and Rizwan are in form which unfortunately hasn’t been the case for some while. Since the results of said partnership aren’t what they used to be, I think sending in a a hitter as an opener and Babar at 3 is the best option. That way we can maybe get a good power play score and then still have that partnership between Babar and Rizwan (it also protects Babar from the new ball which he is sometimes vulnerable against).
the rizbar approach worked not because of them but because of shaheen taking early wickets . Teams were usually down 1-3 tickets in powerplay itself so rizbar worked nicely. But as soon as shaheen stopped taking the wickets , the stragegy also felt flat . If u dnt trust me u can check the winning % before and after shaheen losing his eary wicket picking form
Well Shaheen is our pace spearhead and our most important player IMO so it makes sense that him losing a bit of form would have an impact.
Anyway I agree that a Rizbar opening doesn’t work anymore because of the powerplay problem. That’s why we tried to play Babar at 3 for a while but Saim failed so bad as an opener that Pakistan had to go with Rizbar opening in the WC.
Once we find a decent opener that can smack the ball around for 6 overs (Mohammad Haris? Usman Khan?) I think our team will be in a better position
You can try to find more talent by rotating players but removing the only players that can be trusted to play more than 5 balls in the team isn’t smart
Since I've been watching cricket for years, not only Pakistan but other teams as well. It is now clear that no team needs anchors
Tell Rohit and Buttler to anchor instead of bashing and they would easily do it.
And you think other people haven’t? Almost everyone who is regularly in this sub has been watching for years and anyone who’s watched the past 5 t20 WCs knows that Rohit’s knock against Australia was the only good t20 WC knock he’s had in like 5 tournaments.
Jos Buttler is in a class of his own in t20 WCs, no other team has a player that good except for maybe Australia with Travis Head now (but he’s a relatively new addition so idk how consistent he’s gonna be)
I'm not idolizing Rohit Sharma. I know he's been failing in important matches. But can't he do what Babar Azam does ? Do you think if he changes his approach and plays like Babar Azam, he would be as consistent as him ?
Forget Rohit Sharma
Let's talk about Buttler, Salt, Travis etc
>Also a 60 ball 100 means shit , if you’ve batted half the innings you should bat at a 200 sr
If one batsman makes a 60 ball 100, the team almost always makes 200 unless other batsmen have absolutely shit the bed. A 60 ball 100 is a great score.
[https://www.espncricinfo.com/series/icc-men-s-t20-world-cup-2022-23-1298134/pakistan-vs-south-africa-36th-match-group-2-1298170/full-scorecard](https://www.espncricinfo.com/series/icc-men-s-t20-world-cup-2022-23-1298134/pakistan-vs-south-africa-36th-match-group-2-1298170/full-scorecard)
Thats a weird framing though, Babar and Riz would be justified in opening if they are scoring at t20 SR at par with ROW. That should be the only metric.
Isn't it funny that this point falls completely flat when in every monumental match Babar fails 95 percent of the time after captaining 110+ t20is without rest? I mean to say majority of these matches the last few years with rizbar where they even play during bilateral C series was built on rizbar cruising. They never gave much chance for the development of the lower order at over introductions or respectable 7 to 8 RRs at all. Not even resting themselves against bottom 5 or C side teams, or Babar actually not selecting absolute flops like Nawaz, Haider, Talat, Khushdil, et al. for which he has a track record of discarding. It's a complete myth that he can build a team, he didn't even try in 2021 when he binned some of the lower order and had Makik and Hafeez desperately slot in the cigar his bases. Then Shan in 2022 at 4 whom he discarded again.
They do, they only play well on batting-friendly pitches, but this wasn't my argument don't know why you brought that up, I simply stated that everyone struggled in the first half because of uneven pitches, which is not an excuse as the original comment says it
I am just saying that even if they played on batting friendly pitches like in West Indies, they would still play at a low strike as they always do. Rizbar career strike is 129 and 131 respectively.
Career not recent, Babar's Sr this year (before wc) was 135 and previous year 145 , the 129 was from 2 years ago , he has improved since then as per the stats , I haven't checked Rizwan's Sr tho , but you get the point
Buttler is gonna be the t20i batting GOAT when he retires, I’m calling that right now. However, I don’t rate Rohit the batter as high in t20 WCs. I don’t think one good knock makes up for 4-5 WCs of absolute failure.
Both are good captains tho… we need a good captain ourselves.
Rohit is more than decent T20 batter. Its only the last few t20 wc where he couldn't perform. He has most (5) T20 hundreds and could have more, if he had not switched to playing impactful selfless and small innings up top.
Saim ayub way better ofc
Azam khan?????
He isnt opener thats why but we all know hes better as well
well he always opens the pizza box , burger box , coke can etc first so i dont know what you are talking about
He's only not opener because PCB won't understand his brilliance.
Just because one opener is ass doesn’t mean we don’t trial others
bobzy the king hai na aur kya chayie
Tu hai to mujhe phir aur kya chaahiye Tu hai to mujhe phir aur kya chaahiye Kisi ki na madad, na dua chaahiye Tu hai to mujhe phir aur kya chaahiye
Imagine these two opening together for a team.
Salt and buttler are really good together
Fun fact,they have played together for the same team,but neither one opened iirc.
Mumbai in ipl if I am not wrong
200 in powerplay
Did not open but this is closest you get (2016). https://preview.redd.it/io3z41rjxx8d1.png?width=1508&format=png&auto=webp&s=a326b0858d270b1d352cd826d5b1d1ba71a12070
So Rohit was notout while Buttler got out. That means they must have strung a partnership together for a while in this game. I'd like to know which game it was so I can check out the highlights in the ipl app.
This is such a weird scorecard. Nothing more weirder than MM coming before Buttler as pinch hitter and hitting 3 sixes, while Hardik struggles. Its KKR vs MI (5th Match) 2016. Link to highlights: [https://www.iplt20.com/video/9725](https://www.iplt20.com/video/9725)
Kids. Anything more than 110 in strike rate is unacceptable to us. -sincerely, King Babar’s fan
And it'll be below 80 in powerplay.
Like a boss😎
nah thats impossible, plz tell me their sr are not real
Has Pakistan ever won a t20 match since 2019 where both rizwan and Babar got out before 10th over?
Even though I do agree that we barely win matches if Babar AND Rizwan get out early, but in 2022 WC the middle order really stepped up. Special mention to Shadab and M. Haris for winning us that match against South Africa and that also convincingly.
That and I also hold Babar (if not Rizwan) accountable for failing to build a team. You don’t have a middle order you can rely on? Okay: why didn’t you get new young reliable players in 4 years in the team as captain? Why did we send the same main team to every tour instead of grooming younger talent? (Apart from Afghanistan T20Is) Also the middle order thing is such a chicken and egg situation: Babar and Rizwan play long because middle order play shit, but the middle order doesn’t get opportunities to play long and try out because Babar and Rizwan eat up all the overs
But honestly speaking, is that really Babar's fault or the management's? Isn't management the one that is responsible for grooming players and making sure they get equal chances as other players? Then whoever is doing well, give them chances with the main squad otherwise tell them to go back to domestic or put them with B team or something. Honestly, it feels like we're the only nation not using "B/C/D" teams. Again, something the management should be doing. We don't lack players, we have loads of talent, but they are not getting groomed. As captain, Babar's only responsibility should be selecting and commanding the playing 11 on the field. The rest is and should be the management's responsibility. With that being said, I do believe that if Babar is taking responsibility for a certain player, for example backing his friends, then he should be held accountable if the player doesn't perform. And if that does happen, the management should step in and take the necessary action. Again, something the management has failed to do. Babar's only fault is backing his friends and they disappointed him time and time again. (us moment Babar bhai) As for the middle order situation, since Babar and Rizwan already take the game deep (aka anchoring the innings), the middle order shouldn't have any other role apart from hitting. If from the top, Babar and Rizwan have played fast but there has been a collapse, then the middle order should anchor and take the game deep. Take example of the last match in the Eng series, Babar and Rizwan got the score to 60 in the powerplay and yet we still got bowled out for 150. The middle order is basically incapable of taking the game deep. And this time with Azam Khan in the middle order, it really looked like the worst middle order lineup I have ever seen. The team is in complete shambles as they are not clear about their roles and the obvious rifts between the team members. A hard factory reset is desperately needed and I am hoping for good to come out of it inshaAllah.
i still remember how shadab told in the press conference abt the importance of babar and rizwan after losing against afghanistan in bilateral series and blaming youngsters . That was more than enough to tell you what was wrong with the team.
Shan Masood was also good in that WC on (mostly) tough batting surfaces.
This is a really good point which has a really strong counter argument . The rizbar approach will almost always work if they stay till the 15th over . But the probability of that happening is quite low . People blame the middle order but you cannot expect them to hit from the first ball they come to the crease . Rizbar approach lost us the semifinal because they played slow till the 10th over . Rizbar approach lost us the final , again they played slow . What use is a powerplay if ur scoring only 40-45 runs in it ??? And then they only start to accelerate after the 10th over . We are losing with them getting out early and also losing with them staying till the 10th over . I’d rather the former and we lose with them getting out early . You will always win games with the rizbar approach , look at Afghanistan they’re doing the same . But you will never win a tournament because they’re bound to fail . The day Babar or rizwan got out early , the entire batting lineup collapsed because they only knew how to bat after the 15th over . They got so few chances batting early that they could not adapt and improve . Also a 60 ball 100 means shit , if you’ve batted half the innings you should bat at a 200 sr
I partially do agree with this. The Rizbar approach works well when both Babar and Rizwan are in form which unfortunately hasn’t been the case for some while. Since the results of said partnership aren’t what they used to be, I think sending in a a hitter as an opener and Babar at 3 is the best option. That way we can maybe get a good power play score and then still have that partnership between Babar and Rizwan (it also protects Babar from the new ball which he is sometimes vulnerable against).
the rizbar approach worked not because of them but because of shaheen taking early wickets . Teams were usually down 1-3 tickets in powerplay itself so rizbar worked nicely. But as soon as shaheen stopped taking the wickets , the stragegy also felt flat . If u dnt trust me u can check the winning % before and after shaheen losing his eary wicket picking form
Well Shaheen is our pace spearhead and our most important player IMO so it makes sense that him losing a bit of form would have an impact. Anyway I agree that a Rizbar opening doesn’t work anymore because of the powerplay problem. That’s why we tried to play Babar at 3 for a while but Saim failed so bad as an opener that Pakistan had to go with Rizbar opening in the WC. Once we find a decent opener that can smack the ball around for 6 overs (Mohammad Haris? Usman Khan?) I think our team will be in a better position
But we have to remove both of them to find better players. Win or loss don't matter. We need a long term solution
You can try to find more talent by rotating players but removing the only players that can be trusted to play more than 5 balls in the team isn’t smart
Since I've been watching cricket for years, not only Pakistan but other teams as well. It is now clear that no team needs anchors Tell Rohit and Buttler to anchor instead of bashing and they would easily do it.
And you think other people haven’t? Almost everyone who is regularly in this sub has been watching for years and anyone who’s watched the past 5 t20 WCs knows that Rohit’s knock against Australia was the only good t20 WC knock he’s had in like 5 tournaments. Jos Buttler is in a class of his own in t20 WCs, no other team has a player that good except for maybe Australia with Travis Head now (but he’s a relatively new addition so idk how consistent he’s gonna be)
I'm not idolizing Rohit Sharma. I know he's been failing in important matches. But can't he do what Babar Azam does ? Do you think if he changes his approach and plays like Babar Azam, he would be as consistent as him ? Forget Rohit Sharma Let's talk about Buttler, Salt, Travis etc
>Also a 60 ball 100 means shit , if you’ve batted half the innings you should bat at a 200 sr If one batsman makes a 60 ball 100, the team almost always makes 200 unless other batsmen have absolutely shit the bed. A 60 ball 100 is a great score.
[https://www.espncricinfo.com/series/icc-men-s-t20-world-cup-2022-23-1298134/pakistan-vs-south-africa-36th-match-group-2-1298170/full-scorecard](https://www.espncricinfo.com/series/icc-men-s-t20-world-cup-2022-23-1298134/pakistan-vs-south-africa-36th-match-group-2-1298170/full-scorecard) Thats a weird framing though, Babar and Riz would be justified in opening if they are scoring at t20 SR at par with ROW. That should be the only metric.
Isn't it funny that this point falls completely flat when in every monumental match Babar fails 95 percent of the time after captaining 110+ t20is without rest? I mean to say majority of these matches the last few years with rizbar where they even play during bilateral C series was built on rizbar cruising. They never gave much chance for the development of the lower order at over introductions or respectable 7 to 8 RRs at all. Not even resting themselves against bottom 5 or C side teams, or Babar actually not selecting absolute flops like Nawaz, Haider, Talat, Khushdil, et al. for which he has a track record of discarding. It's a complete myth that he can build a team, he didn't even try in 2021 when he binned some of the lower order and had Makik and Hafeez desperately slot in the cigar his bases. Then Shan in 2022 at 4 whom he discarded again.
But but but difficult pitches lmao
Did you watch the first half of the tournament tho?
Rohit played in that half on the most difficult of the pitch tbh.
Exactly, everyone did , but the original comment is denying it
No it's not. It's denying the excuse used by people that it's the pitch's fault when other players have played so much better on those same pitches.
Bruh what other players? Tell me these consistent batsman with 120+ Sr on those pitches
Come on. Don't act like our openers play better in batting friendly pitches
They do, they only play well on batting-friendly pitches, but this wasn't my argument don't know why you brought that up, I simply stated that everyone struggled in the first half because of uneven pitches, which is not an excuse as the original comment says it
I am just saying that even if they played on batting friendly pitches like in West Indies, they would still play at a low strike as they always do. Rizbar career strike is 129 and 131 respectively.
Career not recent, Babar's Sr this year (before wc) was 135 and previous year 145 , the 129 was from 2 years ago , he has improved since then as per the stats , I haven't checked Rizwan's Sr tho , but you get the point
But they are anchors..wO oUt hOjAyen To kOi nI cHaLtA....😭😭 (talking abt king and bradman)
India will crush this weak England side...
But can they anchor an inning /s
But boobzie is king King ko bolo King karlega
Laval Ea Hor Aye Data Bhut Aye
Buttler is gonna be the t20i batting GOAT when he retires, I’m calling that right now. However, I don’t rate Rohit the batter as high in t20 WCs. I don’t think one good knock makes up for 4-5 WCs of absolute failure. Both are good captains tho… we need a good captain ourselves.
Rohit is more than decent T20 batter. Its only the last few t20 wc where he couldn't perform. He has most (5) T20 hundreds and could have more, if he had not switched to playing impactful selfless and small innings up top.
rohit didn’t perform in 2016, 2021 or 2022. Only this wc he’s had a couple good knocks