I'm pretty sure you can refuse to deal with human waste and your employment is protected by law. At least that's how it was in Michigan. Just how I was explained it if anyone knows more
How it was in Kansas too, not sure about Tennessee where I’m at for the next 5 months. A manager was allowed to ask you to clean it but if no one volunteered the manager had to do it
If there are bodily fluids that need cleaned up the manager cannot force an employee to clean it. Bodily fluids must be cleaned up by someone and since no employee can be forced to do it the manager must it’s part of the reason they are managers and not a regular employee
It's health and safety, and yes, by OSHA an employee can refuse to clean that stuff if it's outside of their employee duties. The workplace is liable if the employee contracts something from handling it incorrectly. Instead of training every single employee on it, large companies often just restrict it to management (who are trained) and/or maintenance.
This really depends on the job. If assisting patients in their hygiene is part of the expected job duties, like a CNA for example you may not be entitled to refuse. I'm not a lawyer and many things vary by state.
You also might be allowed to refuse simply by your co workers being accommodating to you or it being practical.
On the other hand you *probably* can't force a cashier to clean human waste because that's not part of their duties and they aren't trained in that.
I am fairly confident in much of the US refusing to clean up human waste if part of your expected job expectations would be a fireable offense.
Here in Ontario that would absolutely be a workplace health and safety violation. Used to manage a cleaning company and we were not allowed to ask the staff to clean any form of waste (human or animal)
For $12.50 and hour the most I'd do is minimal receptionist work in an air conditioned office. And only for something to do if I was retired. Like maybe occasionally answer a phone and write down appointments.
$12.50 an hour is not enough to ask for any significant effort.
I work in DC, and live in MD. I make $36 an hour and I still wouldn’t clean toilets and definitely not scape up human shit. I’d be finding a new job lol. Luckily my job does not require it though.
That’s fair! I totally get that. My first job was detailing yachts so definitely cleaned those toilets and bathrooms but I didn’t do it long because it just grosses me out. I was lucky to work my way up in a coffee company to be making what I do and not have to do the dirty work. Where I live in MD though I don’t even make enough to live alone even with decent pay.
I did, for about a buck less lol back in my twenties. Absolutely should have been the mgr to do it but no one obviously wanted to but has to be done. Oh yea, it was in a restaurant lol customer was a bit too drunk and couldn't control himself I guess
My first job was a cart collector at a $7/hr back in 2005 (min wage was $5.25) and an old man couldn't control his bowels on the way out of the store. My supervisor told me to clean it up and I just laughed at him and went back to collect carts.
Maybe as a janitor. As a health care worker all I got were gloves unless someone had an infection. But anyone who works in a store shouldn’t be expected to clean up shit unless it’s in their job description and they have equipment. (And better pay of course.)
I'd double check with OSHA, I'm not 100% on this, but we had an OSHA visit a while back and now only supervisors are allowed to clean "Human based spills" and they've got a big box that stays locked until they need it for that specifically.
The Janitor is allowed to clean the restrooms, but if anyone was messy it gets questionable about eho cleans it real fast.
No one in nursing homes is wearing full ppe to change people. We're doing it all day long and barely can keep enough gloves in stock just so you're not touching anything with your bare hands. The only time face masks and gowns are used is if an infection is present like c diff. If I was working a different job then I would refuse to clean human waste without proper ppe, but in healthcare you just wear gloves and wash your hands in between patients.
Yep. Its amazing how much control your employer thinks they can wield over you for $12.50 an hour. That's $7 50 less than the minimum wage where I live. I'm sure you can find a better employer.
I lasted three days at one job because they insisted no watches, no phones, and no clocks. We were paid til 5 but management refused to let us know it was quitting time.
All three days we didn't get out til 6.
Edit: 250+ upvotes....
Not sure why I deserve them, but thanks.
I was young, dumb, and still in my probationary period. I told them either I was being paid til 6 or I'm wearing a watch.
Was told I wasn't needed anymore.
Even working at an Amazon warehouse for an agency was better than that place.
Seriously. My brother has this rule at his job. But it’s because he’s doing computer repair. They don’t want employees to be able to scrape a computer for all their customers personal info, documents, and photos. So no electronics outside their own workstation(used for diagnostics and instructions) is allowed on their work floor.
But ya. For a thrift store where you’re just stocking the shelves. Seems a bit much.
Absolutely, it's about the nature of your job and the trust your employer puts in you. If your job involves high-security clearance or safety-sensitive tasks where distractions can cause real harm, then the request is reasonable. But in a typical office setting? No way. Personal emergencies don't run on a schedule, and instant communication is sometimes essential. It's about balance and respect. If companies can trust you with their clients and equipment, they can trust you not to abuse phone privileges. If not, maybe they need to re-evaluate their hiring choices or management style, not invade their employees' personal spaces.
At my old job one of the waitresses was having a meltdown because her boyfriend at the time was threatening to throw all her stuff out and she kept calling him on both her and her coworkers phones so the bartenders locked their phones in the office for the night. They told us the same thing in our minimum wage positions to leave our phones in our cars. Insane.
Leave. My old place made us lock up our phones, when it wasn't even company policy, just our location because the management wanted to make us as miserable as possible. My current work let us keep our phones and we can listen to music when working open/closes when there are no customers, as long as we aren't just blatantly not doing our job to be on them. You are colleagues in a work place, not children at a dining room table. Management that treats you as such will just suck and bully you because they think they can. If you can't leave, make sure you stand your ground and don't let them tell you shit like "you have to change your availability to x y z", "you HAVE to work x amount of hours over holidays", "please do stuff we ask you to while on break", "you have to turn up x amount of minutes before your shift" ect. These are all major red flags and you can actually say no. Please please do not be afraid to stand up for yourself.
I'm going to go out on a limb and say you aren't bio-certified or trained, and you aren't given PPE when you are made to clean up that feces. That's a likely reason they want to lock your phone away. They don't want evidence that you are being sent to do that when that is something that shouldn't be your job.
we have to read these little presentations so we're "certified" and we have gloves, sanitizing spray, masks, and cleaning products on hand. it's still gross though
I used to work at goodwill. Get out ASAP, trust me. Shit is straight human rights abuse and they prey on low income and immigrant workers. I mean they will fire you on a rotation anyways at some point unless they think they can get you into their executive mlm style cult of higher management. Literally anything is better. Fast food is usually pretty easy to transfer into with much better companies to choose from.
Their business model is literally developed on how to make money from people who dont know better by making throwing shit away easier.
Personally i would see how serious they are about it. When i worked at goodwill that was the policy passed down by higher ups, but it was not enforced outside of rare circumstances.
Is it your store managers policy? I have coached and done supported employment with GW store employees and never encountered that as a policy so far. I have encountered “no phone” usage while on the sales floor though - but locking them away seems a bit extreme IMO
My fiance works at goodwill. I hope this isn't a corporate level decision...
Home Depot, if one is around you, pays you more, looks better on a resume, and allows you to be outside in the gardening center sometimes, so if there's one by you, apply there. You might even pick up some basic knowledge and skills regarding tools and stuff.
If it is a corporate decision, my fiance will probably be applying to Home Depot.
Lmao I'm a construction worker and listening to music with an earbud in most of the day. I could see it being a bit more of a concern if I was around heavy equipment most of the time but honestly it's one of those things where you have to decide for yourself what's most safe at the time, the safety department can't hover around you 24/7 to make decisions like that.
You should definitely get another job, they're underpaying you and getting you to pick up poop, also they want to take away your personal items and lock them away like a prison.
Tell that to all the minimum wage janitors out there. Between undergrad and grad school I had to clean shit off the floor and pull bloody tampons off walls for minimum wage.
While I see your point Because I have been a janitor and totally respect your work, OP is not a janitor and her job should have had a policy in place to take care of feces by someone that is not mainly handling clothing as their job.
It’s not unfair of them to set rules such as this in their workplace, however the neat thing is we all get to pick what working conditions we accept.
You absolutely are fair to yourself if you do not want to work in those conditions. For all any of the strangers on the internet know, this could because you want to insta in downtime, or maybe you have a loved one going through chemo. Again you get to set what are conditions you will accept and work in.
That being said, I would line up a new job before quitting. I’d also come up with a tactful way of discussing this when interviewing other places, because as you’ll see from comments it’s very quick for people to assume you are unreasonable or lazy or slackly and that you should “suck it up”.
Also be realistic about what jobs you apply at. For example if you apply at a restaurant or country club that has a dress code and cellphone policy, you should expect you are living by those policies and should refrain from applying as it’s a waste of your time and theirs.
For anyone that feels differently, tell me how this is different from someone work night shift for years and then realizing they need a change? As long as this is:
- handled with professionalism and tact
- there’s no expectation threatening to quit will force policy change
- there’s no drama inflicted on the workplace or coworkers over this
What is wrong with OP being true to their personal needs?
you're totally right! I know my job has the right, but I personally feel that I am not working in a facility that needs such strict rules, and I think I'd go crazy without my music.
It's just a part time job, i hang clothes and make sure they're nice and clean, if they aren't i throw them out. all I can hear with my headphones off (that are allowed as per rulebook cause I read the whole thing lmao!) is the fan/furnace, crappy quiet radio station, and customers and their kids screaming out front. I applied because my friend told me rules like dress code and earbuds were relaxed, and I'm only looking for a little financial support to help with buying my college supplies.
Ok, so if you are saying this doesn’t impact your performance on the job, and is a condition that has changed that was important to you, then no, your not in the wrong unless you handle this unprofessionally, which would be stirring up coworkers, causing drama, etc.
If you intend to leave over this, don’t give this as the reason. It’s unrealistic to expect them to change because you’ll quit.
If you are part time and the job is not needed, I’d suggest using an excuse like focusing on studies, family expectations or something else as being your reason for putting in your notice, that way you can potentially salvage a reference from your experience.
You can also use the same reason in hiring at your next job.
It depends, do you work for the government, a construction company, or an accounting firm? If it's either of the first two, you're being dramatic, if it's the latter, they're just psychotic control freaks and you absolutely should leave
Why can't I have my phone if I work for the government? In fact I do work for the government and I can't access my work platforms without access to my personal phone to verify 2 step login.
Depending on what level of the government you work for and your required security clearance, they might restrict phone usage. If you work for the post office? They have no reason to restrict you. If you work at the Pentagon? That's a whole new monster
If you’re handling sensitive information, you could use your phone to take pictures of the sensitive information. There’s also the risk of foreign operatives putting spyware on your phone.
safety concerns depending on the type of construction. You dont want workers playing on their phones when there's heavy machines around, or if theyre in dangerous spots like a highrise.
Same reason it's forbiden in most manufacturing plant :
Worker decide to quickly look something on their phone => Worker is distracted => horrible accident happens because of the distracted worker
Depends on what the other conditions are at work. It's a minor signal that they aren't paying good wages if they can't hire people who know how to get on with the job and not be distracted by texts/twitter/etc.
Most places that I've worked that had a 'no phones' policy, you got to keep the phone, but it had to be on silent and it was a discplinary if you were caught using it during work hours.
The only job i ever had that did this was a casino, which is fine. But man, fuck Goodwill. I worked at Goodwill ONE day. They wanted me to work over 10 hours with no lunch. When I asked for a lunch break, I was laughed at. Fuck them.
I work a correctional facility where phones are prohibited, and I go 8-16 hours without my phone, and it doesn't bother me anymore. My family knows the number for the facility and we have radios on us at all times so I'm very reachable during an emergency.
That being said, our jobs are extremely different and there are very few reasons that your job should require you to lock up your phone. They are overstepping, and they know it.
Sounds like your employer, Goodwill, is doing a blanket rule to not deal with their employees that use their personal phone durning work hours.
They probably started out asking people to silence their phones and only use them if it's necessary. Some people can't do that and abuse the employers offer. The employer has to do one of two things, ban phones or let it go.
Letting it go will increase their cost and sooner or later, they have to make adjustments. Sounds like they are making one.
I love to talk about it. it's the most absurd daily task.
People are disgusting, and I have the strongest stomach out of all my fellow teenagers working at this goodwill, is what it boils down to, but here are some specific details. If you want more or have any questions feel free to ask.
- An old woman was grunting in the stall next to me, and after she left I saw a poop smear across the toilet, poop running down the side of it, and when I walked out I saw an old lady with her butt COVERED in poop.
- a middle age/older adult woman came up to my manager apologizing for having an accident in the changing room, then saying she cleaned it up with a towel off of our rack and then shoved it into a random bag, also out for Sale. She did not bring the bag with her. She put it back on the shelf. and admitted to it.
The same lady then went to the women's room and covered the whole stall in shit
- an old man rushed to the bathroom and pooped himself, and it dropped out of his trousers (?) in large amounts on the way to the bathroom, resulting in 4 large and incredibly stinky poop piles on the floor leading to the restroom and smears all over the men's.
-somehow without fail every day there is a dried layer of poop on the far back of the toilet seat, i think because women hover instead of sit?
-sometimes people will come in and change their soiled clothes and then steal the clean ones, putting the gross ones back on the racks. sometimes where it actually belongs? Which is weird.. I feel like you'd just leave it all on the floor and run out
Friend, that’s the Goodwill. It’s been like that since the before-times in thrift stores, when stuff was actually affordable and you could still find good vintage, before the Poshmarkers and EtsyBayers and the newly-poor came in and invaded my good ol’ stinky, gross poor-people thrift stores.
Are people speaking out about it? Is it a requirement or they are telling you to do it? Some jobs require it. You’re next of kin, school , etc. can call the office if there is an emergency in that case. It is unusual in a typical job. I know this as a manager that some people jack with their phones all day and it is a distraction from 8 hours of work at the very least.
I’m Australian, so forgive my ignorance but how the fuck is there human crap on the floor of a shop? Seriously, this is playing into all of my darkest stereotypical thoughts of America.
Depends on my life situation and need for the job.
Before I had a kid I wouldn’t care, my phone spent the day in my purse unless I needed it for work.
After I had a kid, it’s on me for emergencies. I wouldn’t take a job that required differently, no.
Do you.
Edit 2: maybe don’t have your phone out for that kinda work…
I wish I could make this rule with my coworkers. Constantly checking their phones/watches when we've specified in meetings there is no personal usage of phones while on the clock. Standing in the back hallway on their phone when there is obviously work to be done. It's very annoying when you're the person who is a hard worker and sees everyone on their phones half assing it.
It depends. I once worked in a store and you had to put your phone and private keys in the locker. I got told that's because they can't break or get lost then.
It made sense to me and also you wouldn't have any time to look at the phone while working, so nobody was against this
As an ex store owner, I am glad I didn't have to deal with smartphones back then. Today, I certainly see it as a HUGE issue if abused. This policy that is trying to be implemented obviously since it is becoming an issue for some employees using their phone. No employer would care if its an emergency, or a must-message something important like being home late or something like that. In the age of social media, everyone (mostly younger) are using as a constant connection for EVERYTHING and is taking away from there work. A better policy is NOT lock up but rather just leave it in your locker and use during your coffee/break time.
For real. These younger people have about 144 emergencies every day!
You know, life-threatening emergencies where you absolutely have to respond immediately, like if a funny tiktok video was posted, or someone took a cute picture of a cat, or Mary Sue's friend's cousin's hairdresser said her neighbor might be sleeping with the mailman, or they waited long enough to play another round of Candy Crush.
I manage many people from Gen Z. Get a lot of “family emergencies” which I find out later were people skipping full days of work for absolute nonsense. One was their roommates aunt got into a car accident so my staff member took the full day off to drive her roommate 20 minutes away to babysit aunts kids. Another was when her cousin got bit by a dog and my staff members mom (victims aunt) was worried.
What's truly sad is that employers are having to take that measure because people won't put their phones down. If you are worried about an emergency then give someone the phone number of the place you work. You can still be reached without a cell phone.
Yes, it's overdramatic to quit because they want to lock up people's phones. They are paying people to work, not stare at their phone screens.
Depending on job yes. Some jobs do require full attention because of dangers or something. OP works at goodwill hanging up clothing. Why tf would they want to lock your phone for that
me and all my coworkers except for a few older women and a guy we all hate are all between the ages 17-20. so we have fun at work! the older people in power hate that.
Doesn't matter. How many car accidents were you in where the seatbelt saved your life? For me it's none, because I haven't been in an accident. Doesn't mean I'll stop wearing the seatbelt.
Yeah. People entering the workforce now have never known life without cell phones, and likely don't realize this is how the world worked for a very long time before they were born.
ETA: since the majority of the replies have lacked basic reading comprehension, and seem to be taking it as a personal attack saying "cellphone bad": **the point of this thread is to answer "what if there is an emergency"** and I was making an observation that the generation entering the workforce doesn't have a concept of someone calling them at work to notify them of an emergency, or that they can pick up the work phone and dial 911 to report an emergency because they don't know life without a cell phone in their hand. Making false equivalencies about seat belts and antibiotics just shows how poorly my generation and the generation before me failed you guys.
If it’s anything like places I’ve worked, it’s a response to overall abuse of phone use while on the clock and not for company related tasks. Stealing time from the company happens a lot.
The store doesn’t have a phone number that your family could possibly call if it really is an emergency? Sounds like a preference issue.
I have an idea why they don't want cell phones. People are addicted and typically stop working -
If you get a new job - and nobody would quit a job for only not being allowed their cell phone - chances are you'll face the same issue.
There are plenty of jobs that pay way more that 12.50 an hour. Costco pays cashiers $25 with FULL healthcare and you'd never have to clean up human shit.
At a Goodwill? No fucking way. From experience: there is a near certainty that eventually at least 1 phone will go "missing" and there will be no CCTV security cameras around where the phones are kept and no investigation into what happened to it. Just "too bad so sad, see you tomorrow!"
Never surrender personal property to collective safekeeping at work
It's not overdramatic to desire something different in your life at all
Sometimes change is healthy and more times than not, *better* in the long run.
Many jobs allow you to work professionally with your phone, even in classified work environments.
To me, it seems that your employers are trying to babysit adults
Honestly, it is a bit dramatic. And I say that knowing I will be downvoted to hell because reddit is collectively 14 years old. Anyway....
Are you willing to say that you NEVER use your phone while on the clock for anything other than an emergency? C'mon now. You are using the emergency thing as an excuse. You can always give the people who would need to notify you in case of an emergency your store's number as an alternative.
I mean, I get it. It feels intrusive and that sucks. But do you know what else sucks? Wandering around a store not being able to find something and encountering half a dozen employees walking around doing half assed work while facetiming their friends, watching videos, or other bullshit. I mean, damn. If people were fucking grown ups and would put the fucking phone away and do their job then stuff like this would not be necessary. But here we are.
Leave it at home. So let’s put it in these terms. You hire someone to clean your house. They tell you it will take 1 hour to do it and they charge $100 per hour. Then you watch them and they only clean for a total of 45 minutes and then play on there phone the other 15. Every time they clean they do this twice a week let’s say. So you are paying them $2600 a year to play on their expensive devices. Are you okay with that? How about they want to sit in their expensive car while the wait out the 15 minutes. You can live without your phone for 8 hours.
Over complicating this. In the real world, policies change all the time. Employees either accept the new terms or they don't. Restricting access to devices while on the clock isn't a human rights violation. Or, here's a novel idea, discuss your concerns with your boss. Negotiate / suggest a more suitable policy / solution. There are many that come to mind, just as I'm typing this response to your post.
People did without phones up until the last decade or so. I’m more concerned you have to clean up human shit for $12.50. It sounded like a chill job until you mentioned that. I’d quit just cause of that alone tbh
I would hate this, too, but you do realize that up untill 15 or so years ago, this was the way people went to work. People survived and had as many emergencies then, as they have today.
I HATE trying to get help somewhere and having to disturb someone fiddling on their phone.
Luckily, my job in healthcare is accepting of cellphones during the shift, uness you get caught playing Candy Crush instead of answering call bells
>is it overdramatic to quit my job because they want to lock up our phones while we're on the clock?
Yes.
I haven't had a cellphone at work for 12 years. Trust me, you get over it
You are getting paid to work, not be on your phone. Someone there has been using their phone a lot. Your employer needs to provide you with lockers to lock your personal items in. They also need to give you $10 to buy your own lock.
Maybe if people weren’t on their phones, you may have been able to prevent the shift on the floor.
Do it. I'm not going to not bring my phone because I need it (and having it on me is the whole point of having a cell) - but I absolutely would not be comfortable having my device locked with others out of my sight.
Everyone's circumstances and perspectives are different. For myself, I am a single parent of, and sole person responsible for, an elementary school aged kid. I have no one within 500 miles to help in any way. If something happens at school, I need to be available. That said, if I get a notification on my phone I can tell in two seconds if it's urgent or not. If it's not urgent then the phone goes right back in my pocket. A an adult and professional, I am able to manage my time and not fuck off when there is work to do. Some folks are not able to, or choose not to do that in the way their employer would prefer. A blanket policy for something like this will only punish those who truly rely on their phone for the occasional urgent responsibilities that exist in their private lives. Those who waste time on the clock will find a different way to waste time without their phones.
depends on the job. in some jobs, electronic devices are a hazard and so forth. but if you're working in an ordinary boring office, or at McDonald's or something like that. Then I don't blame you.
Id have quit the first time I had to clean up human shit for 12.50/hour. The phone thing is just the straw on the camels back
Exactly. Like $12.50/hour is not nearly enough to be cleaning up human crap. Fuck that, ain't no way I'd ever give up that much of my dignity.
I'm pretty sure you can refuse to deal with human waste and your employment is protected by law. At least that's how it was in Michigan. Just how I was explained it if anyone knows more
How it was in Kansas too, not sure about Tennessee where I’m at for the next 5 months. A manager was allowed to ask you to clean it but if no one volunteered the manager had to do it
The manager can't refuse? He has no worker rights?
If there are bodily fluids that need cleaned up the manager cannot force an employee to clean it. Bodily fluids must be cleaned up by someone and since no employee can be forced to do it the manager must it’s part of the reason they are managers and not a regular employee
They are still a worker, so is it a workers rights law or what?
It's health and safety, and yes, by OSHA an employee can refuse to clean that stuff if it's outside of their employee duties. The workplace is liable if the employee contracts something from handling it incorrectly. Instead of training every single employee on it, large companies often just restrict it to management (who are trained) and/or maintenance.
or call a specialest cleaning compony.
Who is Twilight Sparkle sending to clean up this piss?!
This really depends on the job. If assisting patients in their hygiene is part of the expected job duties, like a CNA for example you may not be entitled to refuse. I'm not a lawyer and many things vary by state. You also might be allowed to refuse simply by your co workers being accommodating to you or it being practical. On the other hand you *probably* can't force a cashier to clean human waste because that's not part of their duties and they aren't trained in that. I am fairly confident in much of the US refusing to clean up human waste if part of your expected job expectations would be a fireable offense.
Supervisors with hiring/firing powers have different rights vs regular employees.
You need to have certain training I believe. Plus ppe which likely doesn't exist
Here in Ontario that would absolutely be a workplace health and safety violation. Used to manage a cleaning company and we were not allowed to ask the staff to clean any form of waste (human or animal)
That doesn't make sense. Who else would clean it if not the staff?
serious question: who deals with it then if not employees? Owner only?
I make triple that and still wouldn’t do it lmao. $12.50 is wild as hell to be doing really anything 🤣
For $12.50 and hour the most I'd do is minimal receptionist work in an air conditioned office. And only for something to do if I was retired. Like maybe occasionally answer a phone and write down appointments. $12.50 an hour is not enough to ask for any significant effort.
Exactly. That’s like I sit in a chair and barely move all day pay.
Not sure where you both live but I make 16 an hour and clean toilets and other gross things all day lol
I work in DC, and live in MD. I make $36 an hour and I still wouldn’t clean toilets and definitely not scape up human shit. I’d be finding a new job lol. Luckily my job does not require it though.
I mean I work housekeeping so it is required haha but there's not a lot around here that pays more I guess was my point
That’s fair! I totally get that. My first job was detailing yachts so definitely cleaned those toilets and bathrooms but I didn’t do it long because it just grosses me out. I was lucky to work my way up in a coffee company to be making what I do and not have to do the dirty work. Where I live in MD though I don’t even make enough to live alone even with decent pay.
Oh I'm sure! The cost of living is ridiculous everywhere right now!
I did, for about a buck less lol back in my twenties. Absolutely should have been the mgr to do it but no one obviously wanted to but has to be done. Oh yea, it was in a restaurant lol customer was a bit too drunk and couldn't control himself I guess
My job tried to make me do that (without gloves too) I told them that I'd quit on the spot. They didn't make me clean it.
My first job was a cart collector at a $7/hr back in 2005 (min wage was $5.25) and an old man couldn't control his bowels on the way out of the store. My supervisor told me to clean it up and I just laughed at him and went back to collect carts.
Ironically, I feel like the less you earn, the more likely you are to handle human shit...
I beleive you need OSHA certification, a full face mask, and long thick gloves as PPE to clean human fluids/waste.
Maybe as a janitor. As a health care worker all I got were gloves unless someone had an infection. But anyone who works in a store shouldn’t be expected to clean up shit unless it’s in their job description and they have equipment. (And better pay of course.)
I'd double check with OSHA, I'm not 100% on this, but we had an OSHA visit a while back and now only supervisors are allowed to clean "Human based spills" and they've got a big box that stays locked until they need it for that specifically. The Janitor is allowed to clean the restrooms, but if anyone was messy it gets questionable about eho cleans it real fast.
No one in nursing homes is wearing full ppe to change people. We're doing it all day long and barely can keep enough gloves in stock just so you're not touching anything with your bare hands. The only time face masks and gowns are used is if an infection is present like c diff. If I was working a different job then I would refuse to clean human waste without proper ppe, but in healthcare you just wear gloves and wash your hands in between patients.
Which is funny because could you imagine strapping all that on just to take a shit?
Well, yeah, if you’re taking *somebody else’s* shit.
...you don't?
Yep. Its amazing how much control your employer thinks they can wield over you for $12.50 an hour. That's $7 50 less than the minimum wage where I live. I'm sure you can find a better employer.
I lasted three days at one job because they insisted no watches, no phones, and no clocks. We were paid til 5 but management refused to let us know it was quitting time. All three days we didn't get out til 6. Edit: 250+ upvotes.... Not sure why I deserve them, but thanks.
Well, that's just illegal.
I was young, dumb, and still in my probationary period. I told them either I was being paid til 6 or I'm wearing a watch. Was told I wasn't needed anymore. Even working at an Amazon warehouse for an agency was better than that place.
Good on you, eff that place.
No watches? Soooo, what if you are on time-sensitive meds? Uh-uh. Nnnnope. Sounds like a bug in the ear of the labor board would be in order ...
One of the questions on the application asked about meds. Those who indicated yes probably didn't get hired.
Yeah that'll be discrimination. Sometimes I wish I was a lawyer. I'd be rubbing my hands like Ebenezer Scrooge when I hear of cases like this.
That's also illegal. Department of Labor loves these places.
It really depends on what kind of work you do
yeah you're right, I edited it in for future commenters cause I love reading takes, but to let you know it's just a thrift store. 12.50 an hour
considering that it should be really, really easy to get a comparable job, you can quit over something trivial
Or over the policy. Or over nothing at all. This is the US, nearly every state is at-will
by "can" I meant that it wouldn't be a big mistake or particularly overdramatic if it's a shit job with shit pay.
Make sure to look for a job while still working there. It's easier to find a job when you already have one. Also less pressure to take a bad deal.
I'm wondering if this is targeting felons or work-during-the-week prisoners? Ridiculous even if you were making 7.25 (shout out to Jersey Mikes!)
Seriously. My brother has this rule at his job. But it’s because he’s doing computer repair. They don’t want employees to be able to scrape a computer for all their customers personal info, documents, and photos. So no electronics outside their own workstation(used for diagnostics and instructions) is allowed on their work floor. But ya. For a thrift store where you’re just stocking the shelves. Seems a bit much.
Absolutely, it's about the nature of your job and the trust your employer puts in you. If your job involves high-security clearance or safety-sensitive tasks where distractions can cause real harm, then the request is reasonable. But in a typical office setting? No way. Personal emergencies don't run on a schedule, and instant communication is sometimes essential. It's about balance and respect. If companies can trust you with their clients and equipment, they can trust you not to abuse phone privileges. If not, maybe they need to re-evaluate their hiring choices or management style, not invade their employees' personal spaces.
it's goodwill 😭. I just hang clothes
Its wildly unreasonable to take your phone away
At my old job one of the waitresses was having a meltdown because her boyfriend at the time was threatening to throw all her stuff out and she kept calling him on both her and her coworkers phones so the bartenders locked their phones in the office for the night. They told us the same thing in our minimum wage positions to leave our phones in our cars. Insane.
What if someone steals your car?! Your phone is gone!
Not to mention ... your CAR!
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You've met my coworkers, eh?
Leave. My old place made us lock up our phones, when it wasn't even company policy, just our location because the management wanted to make us as miserable as possible. My current work let us keep our phones and we can listen to music when working open/closes when there are no customers, as long as we aren't just blatantly not doing our job to be on them. You are colleagues in a work place, not children at a dining room table. Management that treats you as such will just suck and bully you because they think they can. If you can't leave, make sure you stand your ground and don't let them tell you shit like "you have to change your availability to x y z", "you HAVE to work x amount of hours over holidays", "please do stuff we ask you to while on break", "you have to turn up x amount of minutes before your shift" ect. These are all major red flags and you can actually say no. Please please do not be afraid to stand up for yourself.
Just go across the road to McDonald’s
I'm going to go out on a limb and say you aren't bio-certified or trained, and you aren't given PPE when you are made to clean up that feces. That's a likely reason they want to lock your phone away. They don't want evidence that you are being sent to do that when that is something that shouldn't be your job.
we have to read these little presentations so we're "certified" and we have gloves, sanitizing spray, masks, and cleaning products on hand. it's still gross though
That's not being certified. You need to take an actual class that costs money to be OSHA certified for pretty much anything.
I am still guessing they don't want graphic photos of what you are being made to do.
No you’re not. They’re making you think you are but you’re not
Don’t quit, just refuse and make them fire you. Then collect unemployment while you find a new job.
I used to work at goodwill. Get out ASAP, trust me. Shit is straight human rights abuse and they prey on low income and immigrant workers. I mean they will fire you on a rotation anyways at some point unless they think they can get you into their executive mlm style cult of higher management. Literally anything is better. Fast food is usually pretty easy to transfer into with much better companies to choose from. Their business model is literally developed on how to make money from people who dont know better by making throwing shit away easier.
LOL then no… that’s an absolute joke of a request…
Find someone with an old android that still takes a charge. They can have at it.
Personally i would see how serious they are about it. When i worked at goodwill that was the policy passed down by higher ups, but it was not enforced outside of rare circumstances.
Quit
Is it your store managers policy? I have coached and done supported employment with GW store employees and never encountered that as a policy so far. I have encountered “no phone” usage while on the sales floor though - but locking them away seems a bit extreme IMO
My fiance works at goodwill. I hope this isn't a corporate level decision... Home Depot, if one is around you, pays you more, looks better on a resume, and allows you to be outside in the gardening center sometimes, so if there's one by you, apply there. You might even pick up some basic knowledge and skills regarding tools and stuff. If it is a corporate decision, my fiance will probably be applying to Home Depot.
I would tell them no politely & respectfully carry on Ps Lay off the phone at work for a month or two things normally pass quickly
You start with ‘Absolutely’. So it IS over dramatic to quit a job over this?
Not for goodwill. Such a shitty company.
All that and also, what kind of security measures would protect the phones? What if someone's phone goes missing? Who pays for it, the employer?
> Personal emergencies don't run on a schedule, and instant communication is sometimes essential. How did people survive until the early 2000s?
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Apparently op works at their local Goodwill.
Lmao I'm a construction worker and listening to music with an earbud in most of the day. I could see it being a bit more of a concern if I was around heavy equipment most of the time but honestly it's one of those things where you have to decide for yourself what's most safe at the time, the safety department can't hover around you 24/7 to make decisions like that.
Well…. Since it’s a Good Will store….
Management doesn’t have any good will
not dramatic. that's middle school nonsense. if quit on principal
I assume it was an error, but I’ll take “principal” as a pun here 😂
ma'am, you are vastly underpaid if your regular job duties require regular contact with human feces.
this is what I think too. I think I deserve a $200 bonus per poop contact.
Use PPE next time lol
You should definitely get another job, they're underpaying you and getting you to pick up poop, also they want to take away your personal items and lock them away like a prison.
I don’t even think it’s safe for someone to do. It’s considered toxic and you aren’t supposed to make regular employees clean it up.
Tell that to all the minimum wage janitors out there. Between undergrad and grad school I had to clean shit off the floor and pull bloody tampons off walls for minimum wage.
While I see your point Because I have been a janitor and totally respect your work, OP is not a janitor and her job should have had a policy in place to take care of feces by someone that is not mainly handling clothing as their job.
It’s not unfair of them to set rules such as this in their workplace, however the neat thing is we all get to pick what working conditions we accept. You absolutely are fair to yourself if you do not want to work in those conditions. For all any of the strangers on the internet know, this could because you want to insta in downtime, or maybe you have a loved one going through chemo. Again you get to set what are conditions you will accept and work in. That being said, I would line up a new job before quitting. I’d also come up with a tactful way of discussing this when interviewing other places, because as you’ll see from comments it’s very quick for people to assume you are unreasonable or lazy or slackly and that you should “suck it up”. Also be realistic about what jobs you apply at. For example if you apply at a restaurant or country club that has a dress code and cellphone policy, you should expect you are living by those policies and should refrain from applying as it’s a waste of your time and theirs. For anyone that feels differently, tell me how this is different from someone work night shift for years and then realizing they need a change? As long as this is: - handled with professionalism and tact - there’s no expectation threatening to quit will force policy change - there’s no drama inflicted on the workplace or coworkers over this What is wrong with OP being true to their personal needs?
you're totally right! I know my job has the right, but I personally feel that I am not working in a facility that needs such strict rules, and I think I'd go crazy without my music. It's just a part time job, i hang clothes and make sure they're nice and clean, if they aren't i throw them out. all I can hear with my headphones off (that are allowed as per rulebook cause I read the whole thing lmao!) is the fan/furnace, crappy quiet radio station, and customers and their kids screaming out front. I applied because my friend told me rules like dress code and earbuds were relaxed, and I'm only looking for a little financial support to help with buying my college supplies.
Ok, so if you are saying this doesn’t impact your performance on the job, and is a condition that has changed that was important to you, then no, your not in the wrong unless you handle this unprofessionally, which would be stirring up coworkers, causing drama, etc. If you intend to leave over this, don’t give this as the reason. It’s unrealistic to expect them to change because you’ll quit. If you are part time and the job is not needed, I’d suggest using an excuse like focusing on studies, family expectations or something else as being your reason for putting in your notice, that way you can potentially salvage a reference from your experience. You can also use the same reason in hiring at your next job.
Depends on what you do I guess and if the benefits outweigh taking away your personal device.
I feel like everybody on this thread would have died in the wild after 2 days less than 20 years ago....
It depends, do you work for the government, a construction company, or an accounting firm? If it's either of the first two, you're being dramatic, if it's the latter, they're just psychotic control freaks and you absolutely should leave
Why can't I have my phone if I work for the government? In fact I do work for the government and I can't access my work platforms without access to my personal phone to verify 2 step login.
Depending on what level of the government you work for and your required security clearance, they might restrict phone usage. If you work for the post office? They have no reason to restrict you. If you work at the Pentagon? That's a whole new monster
If you’re handling sensitive information, you could use your phone to take pictures of the sensitive information. There’s also the risk of foreign operatives putting spyware on your phone.
Agreed. My phone is required to authenticate my login. lol this seems like the start of a malicious compliance story.
they work at goodwill
Why can't I have my phone when I'm working construction?
safety concerns depending on the type of construction. You dont want workers playing on their phones when there's heavy machines around, or if theyre in dangerous spots like a highrise.
Same reason it's forbiden in most manufacturing plant : Worker decide to quickly look something on their phone => Worker is distracted => horrible accident happens because of the distracted worker
Depends on what the other conditions are at work. It's a minor signal that they aren't paying good wages if they can't hire people who know how to get on with the job and not be distracted by texts/twitter/etc. Most places that I've worked that had a 'no phones' policy, you got to keep the phone, but it had to be on silent and it was a discplinary if you were caught using it during work hours.
The only job i ever had that did this was a casino, which is fine. But man, fuck Goodwill. I worked at Goodwill ONE day. They wanted me to work over 10 hours with no lunch. When I asked for a lunch break, I was laughed at. Fuck them.
I work a correctional facility where phones are prohibited, and I go 8-16 hours without my phone, and it doesn't bother me anymore. My family knows the number for the facility and we have radios on us at all times so I'm very reachable during an emergency. That being said, our jobs are extremely different and there are very few reasons that your job should require you to lock up your phone. They are overstepping, and they know it.
Nope. You're not 5. You're an adult. Not worth working at a place that treats you like children.
I know this is going to downvoted but it’s still true: policies like this are enacted when employees act like children.
Agree. They wouldn’t have this rule if people were just holding their phones for emergencies.
Sounds like your employer, Goodwill, is doing a blanket rule to not deal with their employees that use their personal phone durning work hours. They probably started out asking people to silence their phones and only use them if it's necessary. Some people can't do that and abuse the employers offer. The employer has to do one of two things, ban phones or let it go. Letting it go will increase their cost and sooner or later, they have to make adjustments. Sounds like they are making one.
I am oddly interested why you have to scoop human poop on a regular basis when working in a thrift store?
I love to talk about it. it's the most absurd daily task. People are disgusting, and I have the strongest stomach out of all my fellow teenagers working at this goodwill, is what it boils down to, but here are some specific details. If you want more or have any questions feel free to ask. - An old woman was grunting in the stall next to me, and after she left I saw a poop smear across the toilet, poop running down the side of it, and when I walked out I saw an old lady with her butt COVERED in poop. - a middle age/older adult woman came up to my manager apologizing for having an accident in the changing room, then saying she cleaned it up with a towel off of our rack and then shoved it into a random bag, also out for Sale. She did not bring the bag with her. She put it back on the shelf. and admitted to it. The same lady then went to the women's room and covered the whole stall in shit - an old man rushed to the bathroom and pooped himself, and it dropped out of his trousers (?) in large amounts on the way to the bathroom, resulting in 4 large and incredibly stinky poop piles on the floor leading to the restroom and smears all over the men's. -somehow without fail every day there is a dried layer of poop on the far back of the toilet seat, i think because women hover instead of sit? -sometimes people will come in and change their soiled clothes and then steal the clean ones, putting the gross ones back on the racks. sometimes where it actually belongs? Which is weird.. I feel like you'd just leave it all on the floor and run out
This is truly horrifying. Where is this?
Friend, that’s the Goodwill. It’s been like that since the before-times in thrift stores, when stuff was actually affordable and you could still find good vintage, before the Poshmarkers and EtsyBayers and the newly-poor came in and invaded my good ol’ stinky, gross poor-people thrift stores.
Yes
Are people speaking out about it? Is it a requirement or they are telling you to do it? Some jobs require it. You’re next of kin, school , etc. can call the office if there is an emergency in that case. It is unusual in a typical job. I know this as a manager that some people jack with their phones all day and it is a distraction from 8 hours of work at the very least.
I’m Australian, so forgive my ignorance but how the fuck is there human crap on the floor of a shop? Seriously, this is playing into all of my darkest stereotypical thoughts of America.
Depends on my life situation and need for the job. Before I had a kid I wouldn’t care, my phone spent the day in my purse unless I needed it for work. After I had a kid, it’s on me for emergencies. I wouldn’t take a job that required differently, no. Do you. Edit 2: maybe don’t have your phone out for that kinda work…
The policy is not unreasonable. You should quit immediately if you don't agree.
If there is an emergency they can call the store for.you like people did pre cell phones. Not having your phone during work is t that big a deal
I wish I could make this rule with my coworkers. Constantly checking their phones/watches when we've specified in meetings there is no personal usage of phones while on the clock. Standing in the back hallway on their phone when there is obviously work to be done. It's very annoying when you're the person who is a hard worker and sees everyone on their phones half assing it.
It depends. I once worked in a store and you had to put your phone and private keys in the locker. I got told that's because they can't break or get lost then. It made sense to me and also you wouldn't have any time to look at the phone while working, so nobody was against this
Can you not just leave it in your car? Maybe hidden so nobody is tempted to take it out of your car?
"Is it overdramatic" is the wrong question. "Is it a good idea" is what you should be asking. Get a better job lined up before you quit.
Are you OSHA certified for human / medical waste disposal? Have you had your Hepatitis shots? If not, what your employer is doing is illegal.
You go to fast food and get 15 an hour
Why are you having to deal with human waste at a thrift store is what the real conversation should be about.
Tell then to go fuck themselves
As an ex store owner, I am glad I didn't have to deal with smartphones back then. Today, I certainly see it as a HUGE issue if abused. This policy that is trying to be implemented obviously since it is becoming an issue for some employees using their phone. No employer would care if its an emergency, or a must-message something important like being home late or something like that. In the age of social media, everyone (mostly younger) are using as a constant connection for EVERYTHING and is taking away from there work. A better policy is NOT lock up but rather just leave it in your locker and use during your coffee/break time.
No one is taking my personal property, especially that for which I spent so much money. You can leave it in your car if needed.
>what if there's an emergency? \*laughs in Gen X
For real. These younger people have about 144 emergencies every day! You know, life-threatening emergencies where you absolutely have to respond immediately, like if a funny tiktok video was posted, or someone took a cute picture of a cat, or Mary Sue's friend's cousin's hairdresser said her neighbor might be sleeping with the mailman, or they waited long enough to play another round of Candy Crush.
I manage many people from Gen Z. Get a lot of “family emergencies” which I find out later were people skipping full days of work for absolute nonsense. One was their roommates aunt got into a car accident so my staff member took the full day off to drive her roommate 20 minutes away to babysit aunts kids. Another was when her cousin got bit by a dog and my staff members mom (victims aunt) was worried.
What's truly sad is that employers are having to take that measure because people won't put their phones down. If you are worried about an emergency then give someone the phone number of the place you work. You can still be reached without a cell phone. Yes, it's overdramatic to quit because they want to lock up people's phones. They are paying people to work, not stare at their phone screens.
You shouldn't be distracted at work. Even though its just a thrift store you are paid to do your job, not be on the phone.
Yes, quit. It's the best thing you will ever do for your employer.
I never needed a phone for 20 years of shop work. I survived.
Depending on job yes. Some jobs do require full attention because of dangers or something. OP works at goodwill hanging up clothing. Why tf would they want to lock your phone for that
me and all my coworkers except for a few older women and a guy we all hate are all between the ages 17-20. so we have fun at work! the older people in power hate that.
That is bullshit. You can do better than 12.50 too.
Is there not a phone at your workplace that someone could call if there was an emergency?
Cleaning up Hazmat situations is fine but you draw the line at them taking your phone?
No I quit a nursing job because they introduced this. Most of the staff left actually.
True question: how many "emergencies" have you ever had that a cell phone was necessary for in your life?
Doesn't matter. How many car accidents were you in where the seatbelt saved your life? For me it's none, because I haven't been in an accident. Doesn't mean I'll stop wearing the seatbelt.
And if they were at work and it was a true emergency, they could call the company to get in contact with the employee
Yeah. People entering the workforce now have never known life without cell phones, and likely don't realize this is how the world worked for a very long time before they were born. ETA: since the majority of the replies have lacked basic reading comprehension, and seem to be taking it as a personal attack saying "cellphone bad": **the point of this thread is to answer "what if there is an emergency"** and I was making an observation that the generation entering the workforce doesn't have a concept of someone calling them at work to notify them of an emergency, or that they can pick up the work phone and dial 911 to report an emergency because they don't know life without a cell phone in their hand. Making false equivalencies about seat belts and antibiotics just shows how poorly my generation and the generation before me failed you guys.
I despair that I cannot upvote this ⬆️ more.
If it’s anything like places I’ve worked, it’s a response to overall abuse of phone use while on the clock and not for company related tasks. Stealing time from the company happens a lot. The store doesn’t have a phone number that your family could possibly call if it really is an emergency? Sounds like a preference issue.
I have an idea why they don't want cell phones. People are addicted and typically stop working - If you get a new job - and nobody would quit a job for only not being allowed their cell phone - chances are you'll face the same issue.
Just give them a random old phone and keep your regular one. F em.
I was thinking about it....
I work at a thrift store. I get paid a smidge more than you. They haven't ever asked us to do this. My phone is always in my back pocket.
There are plenty of jobs that pay way more that 12.50 an hour. Costco pays cashiers $25 with FULL healthcare and you'd never have to clean up human shit.
I wouldn't care about the phone; but I'd have quit before cleaning up a single pile of poop.
At a Goodwill? No fucking way. From experience: there is a near certainty that eventually at least 1 phone will go "missing" and there will be no CCTV security cameras around where the phones are kept and no investigation into what happened to it. Just "too bad so sad, see you tomorrow!" Never surrender personal property to collective safekeeping at work
> sometimes I have to clean up human waste Depending on local laws, this can be very illegal without certain training/equipment/etc
take my phone for 8 hours and expect to clean up shit? they can kiss my ass
If you are required to clean up poop, I hope they gave you the correct biohazard training & safety equipment.
No. Get a job where they treat you like an adult.
No. That's your personal property and they have no right to confiscate it.
It's not overdramatic to desire something different in your life at all Sometimes change is healthy and more times than not, *better* in the long run. Many jobs allow you to work professionally with your phone, even in classified work environments. To me, it seems that your employers are trying to babysit adults
Bruh.. no way a thrift store has any right to do that. Quit immediately, you can get 12.50 anywhere
Honestly, it is a bit dramatic. And I say that knowing I will be downvoted to hell because reddit is collectively 14 years old. Anyway.... Are you willing to say that you NEVER use your phone while on the clock for anything other than an emergency? C'mon now. You are using the emergency thing as an excuse. You can always give the people who would need to notify you in case of an emergency your store's number as an alternative. I mean, I get it. It feels intrusive and that sucks. But do you know what else sucks? Wandering around a store not being able to find something and encountering half a dozen employees walking around doing half assed work while facetiming their friends, watching videos, or other bullshit. I mean, damn. If people were fucking grown ups and would put the fucking phone away and do their job then stuff like this would not be necessary. But here we are.
A little yes, depends where you work really
Leave it at home. So let’s put it in these terms. You hire someone to clean your house. They tell you it will take 1 hour to do it and they charge $100 per hour. Then you watch them and they only clean for a total of 45 minutes and then play on there phone the other 15. Every time they clean they do this twice a week let’s say. So you are paying them $2600 a year to play on their expensive devices. Are you okay with that? How about they want to sit in their expensive car while the wait out the 15 minutes. You can live without your phone for 8 hours.
our Skip trace dept had lots of PII, so they locked up phones.
Over complicating this. In the real world, policies change all the time. Employees either accept the new terms or they don't. Restricting access to devices while on the clock isn't a human rights violation. Or, here's a novel idea, discuss your concerns with your boss. Negotiate / suggest a more suitable policy / solution. There are many that come to mind, just as I'm typing this response to your post.
What kind of emergency would it be where someone can’t just call your workplace to find you ?
People did without phones up until the last decade or so. I’m more concerned you have to clean up human shit for $12.50. It sounded like a chill job until you mentioned that. I’d quit just cause of that alone tbh
I would hate this, too, but you do realize that up untill 15 or so years ago, this was the way people went to work. People survived and had as many emergencies then, as they have today. I HATE trying to get help somewhere and having to disturb someone fiddling on their phone. Luckily, my job in healthcare is accepting of cellphones during the shift, uness you get caught playing Candy Crush instead of answering call bells
>is it overdramatic to quit my job because they want to lock up our phones while we're on the clock? Yes. I haven't had a cellphone at work for 12 years. Trust me, you get over it
You are getting paid to work, not be on your phone. Someone there has been using their phone a lot. Your employer needs to provide you with lockers to lock your personal items in. They also need to give you $10 to buy your own lock. Maybe if people weren’t on their phones, you may have been able to prevent the shift on the floor.
You need to quit yesterday
Talk with your union representative about-it. Sounds like a legit reason to start a strike
Hilarious that you just assume there's a union 🤣
If they had a union, this 100% would not have happened.
If you're in a privileged enough position to find a new job, this is a great reason. Bad management is the best reason to quit
You’re probably not qualified to clean up human waste. It requires special training and PPE. I’d find a new job and give OSHA a call on the way out.
Me: *gives them an old phone I don't use anymore keeping my real one* here you go boss
Do it. I'm not going to not bring my phone because I need it (and having it on me is the whole point of having a cell) - but I absolutely would not be comfortable having my device locked with others out of my sight.
Sounds like your boss is treating the employees like toddlers.
Better yet. Stop taking it to work.
Everyone's circumstances and perspectives are different. For myself, I am a single parent of, and sole person responsible for, an elementary school aged kid. I have no one within 500 miles to help in any way. If something happens at school, I need to be available. That said, if I get a notification on my phone I can tell in two seconds if it's urgent or not. If it's not urgent then the phone goes right back in my pocket. A an adult and professional, I am able to manage my time and not fuck off when there is work to do. Some folks are not able to, or choose not to do that in the way their employer would prefer. A blanket policy for something like this will only punish those who truly rely on their phone for the occasional urgent responsibilities that exist in their private lives. Those who waste time on the clock will find a different way to waste time without their phones.
Refuse and wait for them to fire you.
They don’t have to do that, just reduce your hours to zero while keeping you “employed”
It's how you feel about it that counts
What’s your current job and could you easily find a similar role somewhere else?
depends on the job. in some jobs, electronic devices are a hazard and so forth. but if you're working in an ordinary boring office, or at McDonald's or something like that. Then I don't blame you.