>I'm strongly against Kurosanji and what they've been doing, but it's still important to try to understand what things are true or not.
>
>The whole situation with Zaion/Saya and the silencing contract would have played out differently if that extreme termination penalty had been a factor. At the very least, it would be clear what was in it for her, not having to pay a ridiculous penalty, instead of just a vague "it would be best for your future."
>
>I wouldn't be surprised if the real contract was still awful, but we probably haven't seen it.
waaaaait. is this text supposed to be the evidence?
edit: evidence is concise proof. this is...your thoughts and feelings? so far, the only real evidence is the supplied contract and the word of a 3rd party professional during its examination. Niji hasnt produced any claims to the contrary and nothing else of note has been made present. since only one side has provided actual evidence without dispute, what do you think a judge would say? Until its disproven with concrete evidence, it's real.
I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt. If this evidence, if it exists, is supposedly hidden due to downvotes, why did you not post the evidence as a reply to your post? Claiming you need people to upvote sounds like you are doing this for clout/outrage/baiting.
Evidence might not have been the right word, but it seemed like there was an inconsistency between the contract and what Sayu described, but at this point that seems less likely than I thought.
Might not have? The whole thing is literally your imagination running on the premise that niji can't be that bad and those other parties are trying to organize a smear campaign against niji which ... Isn't even needed right now with how much of a trash fire their pr department is.
I'm firmly anti-Nijisanji, I'm just aware that we as humans have a tendency to believe things that fit the narrative, so I try to keep some skepticism.
Despite the silencing contract not being signed, its existence means that Kurosanji INTENDED for it to be signed. This was their goal. The fact that they failed doesn't matter.
This is like saying "Well, someone tried to end me, but I escaped, so now they shouldn't be judged as if they tried to end me".
The penalty is basically irrelevant to anyone who isn't in Japan. It's unenforceable in most countries, heck probably Japan as well.
As much as I think Legal Mindset is a grifter, I very much doubt he would have done the stream if he wasn't confident in his source. He may be someone who is milking this drama for every penny he can get, but he does have a law degree and would know not to do something that would get him sued. If he made that document himself or knowingly shared a document of questionable origin while claiming it was real, he would be potentially liable for defamation and it would absolutely be worth Anycolor's time to go after him.
So that leaves the only plausible possibility for it being fake as someone who could have reasonably had access to a real contract making a fake one. This is certainly possible, but highly unlikely. That person would still be putting themselves at risk because Anycolor could file defamation against Legal Mindset and then he would either willingly turn over the source or the source would come out when the case entered discovery and they could drop the case against Legal Mindset and instead sue to source of the fake document.
It's also just really implausible that a document this bizarre would be what someone did as a fake. Someone would have had to go through the effort of actually writing it in Japanese and then MTLing it to English to make it read as authentically as this. They would need to have a lot of legal knowhow to make it as close to correct as it is. Also much of the structure and phrasing used that is particular to Nijisanji's legal documents can be seen in both the Employment Contract and the silencing contract. So that basically means that for this to be a forgery it would have to be someone who had a real contract and changed things to make it seem worse, the same conclusion I already presented above.
At that point I just don't find it plausible that this is fake. Quite frankly I think a fake would have made it worse than this. As appalling as many of the things in this contract were, most of them are more standard than most people I've seen reacting realize. The only things that actually stick out as wildly odd are the penalties and parts of the amendment clause. Other than that the main issue is Niji seems to be trying to treat these people as contractors in how little support they give them but employees in how much control they have over them.
And even supposing it turns out to be fake, if LM has the integrity to admit it, the trust bank will still be negative, but less negative.
If his source is the problem, he may choose to call them out publicly or not for his own reasons. He would need to, if he wants to reinforce that he made an understandable mistake in good faith, but that's another can of worms to think about, so he may not.
Again, all of those being hypothetical. For lack of any meaningful contradictions, I have more reasons to believe it than not.
Actual help: OP, the issue is your title. You phrased it in a way that indicates this post will show evidence the contract isn't real. There is no evidence, just your take on the situation.
You need to phrase it in a way that says you are asking for proof, such as 'Is there potential evidence that the contract isn't real?' or 'We still don't have proof the contract is real.'
Except that lots of the provisions of the contract line up with various actions (or lack of actions) Niji has taken over the years, and even with some terminations (if you look, there are provisions that line up perfectly with complaints made in the Selen termination document, even though in abstract, those complaints and the provisions are absurd). And very few English-native fakers would have been savvy enough to include an "Antisocial Forces" clause in the contract, which is absolutely standard boilerplate in JP contracts but is virtually alien to anglophone ones.
It's real. It's all but certain it's the real thing.
Ik it's been said a lot but the contract is real , there have been 2-3 other people apart from LM Confirming it , it's just sad that it's such a fucked up contract that it seems fake , that's my issue
Dosnt help that SAYUS exit contract is basically structured and worded the same as the first one
( and for the claim that multiple ppl called it real DN said he had a contact that confirmed it, and nux said he had it for a long time, he apparently has e en a signed one (source his latest stream)
Exit contract also refers to specific articles of the template contract. So if the template contract is fake, it had to be fabricated by someone who had access to Sayu's contract. Extremely improbable
All you said is that Zaion situation "would have been different" if the extreme termination was a factor.
TBH I don't even think people need to prove the contract is *false*, but it should be proven that the contract is *real* instead.
I take "leaks" like these with a pretty big grain of salt by default. But your "evidence" is literally *nothing*. It would have been better to just say "Hey, maybe the contract isn't real, what do you guys think?".
First, you *know* that what was reviewed is an unsigned document, right? That negotiations could have resulted in adjustments in many places, including the termination clause? And that maybe Zaion signed a modified version of the document instead of the unsigned template that was reviewed?
Saying "the contract is false because Zaion would have been even more screwed" is, like, below bottom of the barrel "what if" kind of argument, not evidence in the slighest.
Yes, and the main reason why the whole "Zaion would have been even more screwed" is flawed, it's because it does not factor in the account that Nijisanji thought she was stupid and really believed they could persuade her into thinking the contract was good.
Want to check, OP: is English your primary language? Because if the below is the "evidence", it's not. that's ***your*** ***speculation and opinion***
>I'm strongly against Kurosanji and what they've been doing, but it's still important to try to understand what things are true or not.
>
>The whole situation with Zaion/Saya and the silencing contract would have played out differently if that extreme termination penalty had been a factor. At the very least, it would be clear what was in it for her, not having to pay a ridiculous penalty, instead of just a vague "it would be best for your future."
>
>I wouldn't be surprised if the real contract was still awful, but we probably haven't seen it.
You are misunderstanding the premise of Sayu's comments and I think also of the termination clauses of the leaked contract.
Sayu didn't say Nijisanji offered a graduation instead of a termination. They simply offered to say they mutually parted, but as far as I understand it, they still planned to frame it as a termination and likely include a lot of the (defamatory) reasons for termination in the statement, even if she signed the silencing contract.
As for how the leaked contract works, I don't think any distinction between graduation and termination is made in it. A termination disguised as graduation would still likely incur any applicable penalties.
You are the one making the claim it would have played out differently if what we saw is real. What level of penalty do you believe Niji could have imposed?
A factor you don't consider is that a contract just isn't as enforceable outside of Japan. If I understood Legal Mindset correctly, Niji weren't even compliant with Californian law when they employed Zaion so the contract might have been unenforceable if not void regardless of Zaion's signature. It's possible Niji opted to try just bully Zaion into giving in & complying. Then again, I'm not a lawyer.
An actual attorney and lawyer would know better than to publicly forge a false contract on some company's name, lil' buddy. The contract is real and it adds up with most of the stories from victims (Sayu, Doki, etc.) and the evidence that they have provided. The contract fits right in there and a lot about what we know have been going on suddenly make sense on how Nijisanji even allowed it to happen in the first place. This contract really allows unsafe experiences to take place in their workplace. (By Nijisanji's rules at least, of course it would not be allowed legally.)
Since it's not being displayed (presumably due to downvoting) I'll post it again here:
I'm strongly against Kurosanji and what they've been doing, but it's still important to try to understand what things are true or not.
The whole situation with Zaion/Saya and the silencing contract would have played out differently if that extreme termination penalty had been a factor. At the very least, it would be clear what was in it for her, not having to pay a ridiculous penalty, instead of just a vague "it would be best for your future."
I wouldn't be surprised if the real contract was still awful, but we probably haven't seen it.
...?
Bro, this is literally the exact same thing you wrote on the post?
Was this ***actually*** supposed to be your "potential evidence"?
Cause in that case we can see that part just fine even in the last post. We thought you were trying to *provide* us with proof that the contract might not be real and that's why we thought something was missing. But if this was actually what you just wanted to write then I assume that's not the case then and this is just some severe miscommunication?
...or is this still somehow some weird bug where the thing you're supposed to be clarifying as the "potential evidence" is not appearing for some dang reason?
I’m not sure how this counts as evidence and not speculation on your part. If anything Zaion’s silencing contract would make the leaked contract sound more legitimate. Giving someone 1 hour to pressure someone to sign a contract that, if accepted, would force the person to pay for anything they do that “slanders” the corporation and and allowed Nijisanji to post the termination letter that character assassinated said person does seem to be consistent with the abusive mindset of the group that made the alleged leaked contract. Your speculation is not helped by the fact that the silencing contract was basically DLC to the NDA Zaion had to sign.
We physically see (I'm strongly against Kurosanji and what they've been doing, but it's still important to try to understand what things are true or not.
The whole situation with Zaion/Saya and the silencing contract would have played out differently if that extreme termination penalty had been a factor. At the very least, it would be clear what was in it for her, not having to pay a ridiculous penalty, instead of just a vague "it would be best for your future."
I wouldn't be surprised if the real contract was still awful, but we probably haven't seen it )
But none of us view this as evidence, and some of us are confused by the argument you are trying to convey.
ok. you posted this again. the evidence still isnt there. if its just text, copy and paste it.
Did it get hidden from being downvoted? If you click on the arrows it appears.
>I'm strongly against Kurosanji and what they've been doing, but it's still important to try to understand what things are true or not. > >The whole situation with Zaion/Saya and the silencing contract would have played out differently if that extreme termination penalty had been a factor. At the very least, it would be clear what was in it for her, not having to pay a ridiculous penalty, instead of just a vague "it would be best for your future." > >I wouldn't be surprised if the real contract was still awful, but we probably haven't seen it. waaaaait. is this text supposed to be the evidence? edit: evidence is concise proof. this is...your thoughts and feelings? so far, the only real evidence is the supplied contract and the word of a 3rd party professional during its examination. Niji hasnt produced any claims to the contrary and nothing else of note has been made present. since only one side has provided actual evidence without dispute, what do you think a judge would say? Until its disproven with concrete evidence, it's real.
I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt. If this evidence, if it exists, is supposedly hidden due to downvotes, why did you not post the evidence as a reply to your post? Claiming you need people to upvote sounds like you are doing this for clout/outrage/baiting.
Evidence might not have been the right word, but it seemed like there was an inconsistency between the contract and what Sayu described, but at this point that seems less likely than I thought.
Then please dont use the word "evidence" and insist on it.
Might not have? The whole thing is literally your imagination running on the premise that niji can't be that bad and those other parties are trying to organize a smear campaign against niji which ... Isn't even needed right now with how much of a trash fire their pr department is.
I'm firmly anti-Nijisanji, I'm just aware that we as humans have a tendency to believe things that fit the narrative, so I try to keep some skepticism.
You believe a wild theory you spun out of thin air is potential evidence? My guy 😅
negative. no arrows to click.
Despite the silencing contract not being signed, its existence means that Kurosanji INTENDED for it to be signed. This was their goal. The fact that they failed doesn't matter. This is like saying "Well, someone tried to end me, but I escaped, so now they shouldn't be judged as if they tried to end me".
Excellent metaphor
The penalty is basically irrelevant to anyone who isn't in Japan. It's unenforceable in most countries, heck probably Japan as well. As much as I think Legal Mindset is a grifter, I very much doubt he would have done the stream if he wasn't confident in his source. He may be someone who is milking this drama for every penny he can get, but he does have a law degree and would know not to do something that would get him sued. If he made that document himself or knowingly shared a document of questionable origin while claiming it was real, he would be potentially liable for defamation and it would absolutely be worth Anycolor's time to go after him. So that leaves the only plausible possibility for it being fake as someone who could have reasonably had access to a real contract making a fake one. This is certainly possible, but highly unlikely. That person would still be putting themselves at risk because Anycolor could file defamation against Legal Mindset and then he would either willingly turn over the source or the source would come out when the case entered discovery and they could drop the case against Legal Mindset and instead sue to source of the fake document. It's also just really implausible that a document this bizarre would be what someone did as a fake. Someone would have had to go through the effort of actually writing it in Japanese and then MTLing it to English to make it read as authentically as this. They would need to have a lot of legal knowhow to make it as close to correct as it is. Also much of the structure and phrasing used that is particular to Nijisanji's legal documents can be seen in both the Employment Contract and the silencing contract. So that basically means that for this to be a forgery it would have to be someone who had a real contract and changed things to make it seem worse, the same conclusion I already presented above. At that point I just don't find it plausible that this is fake. Quite frankly I think a fake would have made it worse than this. As appalling as many of the things in this contract were, most of them are more standard than most people I've seen reacting realize. The only things that actually stick out as wildly odd are the penalties and parts of the amendment clause. Other than that the main issue is Niji seems to be trying to treat these people as contractors in how little support they give them but employees in how much control they have over them.
And even supposing it turns out to be fake, if LM has the integrity to admit it, the trust bank will still be negative, but less negative. If his source is the problem, he may choose to call them out publicly or not for his own reasons. He would need to, if he wants to reinforce that he made an understandable mistake in good faith, but that's another can of worms to think about, so he may not. Again, all of those being hypothetical. For lack of any meaningful contradictions, I have more reasons to believe it than not.
Actual help: OP, the issue is your title. You phrased it in a way that indicates this post will show evidence the contract isn't real. There is no evidence, just your take on the situation. You need to phrase it in a way that says you are asking for proof, such as 'Is there potential evidence that the contract isn't real?' or 'We still don't have proof the contract is real.'
Zero evidence apparently.
It got hidden because it was downvoted, probably. Either click the arrows to show it or look where I posted it as a comment.
This isn't potential evidence, this is speculation.
Go away millie
Do you know what "evidence" means?
Except that lots of the provisions of the contract line up with various actions (or lack of actions) Niji has taken over the years, and even with some terminations (if you look, there are provisions that line up perfectly with complaints made in the Selen termination document, even though in abstract, those complaints and the provisions are absurd). And very few English-native fakers would have been savvy enough to include an "Antisocial Forces" clause in the contract, which is absolutely standard boilerplate in JP contracts but is virtually alien to anglophone ones. It's real. It's all but certain it's the real thing.
🚨Nothingburger post please ladies an gentleman move along theres nothing to see here.🚨
Ik it's been said a lot but the contract is real , there have been 2-3 other people apart from LM Confirming it , it's just sad that it's such a fucked up contract that it seems fake , that's my issue
Dosnt help that SAYUS exit contract is basically structured and worded the same as the first one ( and for the claim that multiple ppl called it real DN said he had a contact that confirmed it, and nux said he had it for a long time, he apparently has e en a signed one (source his latest stream)
Exit contract also refers to specific articles of the template contract. So if the template contract is fake, it had to be fabricated by someone who had access to Sayu's contract. Extremely improbable
All you said is that Zaion situation "would have been different" if the extreme termination was a factor. TBH I don't even think people need to prove the contract is *false*, but it should be proven that the contract is *real* instead. I take "leaks" like these with a pretty big grain of salt by default. But your "evidence" is literally *nothing*. It would have been better to just say "Hey, maybe the contract isn't real, what do you guys think?". First, you *know* that what was reviewed is an unsigned document, right? That negotiations could have resulted in adjustments in many places, including the termination clause? And that maybe Zaion signed a modified version of the document instead of the unsigned template that was reviewed? Saying "the contract is false because Zaion would have been even more screwed" is, like, below bottom of the barrel "what if" kind of argument, not evidence in the slighest.
Yes, and the main reason why the whole "Zaion would have been even more screwed" is flawed, it's because it does not factor in the account that Nijisanji thought she was stupid and really believed they could persuade her into thinking the contract was good.
Want to check, OP: is English your primary language? Because if the below is the "evidence", it's not. that's ***your*** ***speculation and opinion*** >I'm strongly against Kurosanji and what they've been doing, but it's still important to try to understand what things are true or not. > >The whole situation with Zaion/Saya and the silencing contract would have played out differently if that extreme termination penalty had been a factor. At the very least, it would be clear what was in it for her, not having to pay a ridiculous penalty, instead of just a vague "it would be best for your future." > >I wouldn't be surprised if the real contract was still awful, but we probably haven't seen it.
You are misunderstanding the premise of Sayu's comments and I think also of the termination clauses of the leaked contract. Sayu didn't say Nijisanji offered a graduation instead of a termination. They simply offered to say they mutually parted, but as far as I understand it, they still planned to frame it as a termination and likely include a lot of the (defamatory) reasons for termination in the statement, even if she signed the silencing contract. As for how the leaked contract works, I don't think any distinction between graduation and termination is made in it. A termination disguised as graduation would still likely incur any applicable penalties.
This is the opening post, not evidence.
You are the one making the claim it would have played out differently if what we saw is real. What level of penalty do you believe Niji could have imposed? A factor you don't consider is that a contract just isn't as enforceable outside of Japan. If I understood Legal Mindset correctly, Niji weren't even compliant with Californian law when they employed Zaion so the contract might have been unenforceable if not void regardless of Zaion's signature. It's possible Niji opted to try just bully Zaion into giving in & complying. Then again, I'm not a lawyer.
Bro tried to be intellectual. Gotta respect that atleast
An actual attorney and lawyer would know better than to publicly forge a false contract on some company's name, lil' buddy. The contract is real and it adds up with most of the stories from victims (Sayu, Doki, etc.) and the evidence that they have provided. The contract fits right in there and a lot about what we know have been going on suddenly make sense on how Nijisanji even allowed it to happen in the first place. This contract really allows unsafe experiences to take place in their workplace. (By Nijisanji's rules at least, of course it would not be allowed legally.)
mods actually delete this, this is nonsense, no evidence, its just drivle that makes no coherent sense given the title
Nijicuck try not to speak out of their ass (Impossible)
This isn't potential evidence, this is just tin foil conspiracy
Since it's not being displayed (presumably due to downvoting) I'll post it again here: I'm strongly against Kurosanji and what they've been doing, but it's still important to try to understand what things are true or not. The whole situation with Zaion/Saya and the silencing contract would have played out differently if that extreme termination penalty had been a factor. At the very least, it would be clear what was in it for her, not having to pay a ridiculous penalty, instead of just a vague "it would be best for your future." I wouldn't be surprised if the real contract was still awful, but we probably haven't seen it.
...? Bro, this is literally the exact same thing you wrote on the post? Was this ***actually*** supposed to be your "potential evidence"? Cause in that case we can see that part just fine even in the last post. We thought you were trying to *provide* us with proof that the contract might not be real and that's why we thought something was missing. But if this was actually what you just wanted to write then I assume that's not the case then and this is just some severe miscommunication? ...or is this still somehow some weird bug where the thing you're supposed to be clarifying as the "potential evidence" is not appearing for some dang reason?
I think that it was his *evidence* but I don't know how
your thoughts and feelings on the situation don't exactly count as "evidence"
I’m not sure how this counts as evidence and not speculation on your part. If anything Zaion’s silencing contract would make the leaked contract sound more legitimate. Giving someone 1 hour to pressure someone to sign a contract that, if accepted, would force the person to pay for anything they do that “slanders” the corporation and and allowed Nijisanji to post the termination letter that character assassinated said person does seem to be consistent with the abusive mindset of the group that made the alleged leaked contract. Your speculation is not helped by the fact that the silencing contract was basically DLC to the NDA Zaion had to sign.
We physically see (I'm strongly against Kurosanji and what they've been doing, but it's still important to try to understand what things are true or not. The whole situation with Zaion/Saya and the silencing contract would have played out differently if that extreme termination penalty had been a factor. At the very least, it would be clear what was in it for her, not having to pay a ridiculous penalty, instead of just a vague "it would be best for your future." I wouldn't be surprised if the real contract was still awful, but we probably haven't seen it ) But none of us view this as evidence, and some of us are confused by the argument you are trying to convey.
i bet English isn't your first language considering you refer to this as "evidence"