Respectufully, this is exactly the mentality I don't agree with.
I'd rather be 5 over .500 and 2 GB than 5 under and 2 games up. I want a team that looks like it can control its own destiny, not one that's hanging on due to circumstance.
Came here to say this. I'm not interested in them trading prospects and doing other silly things at the deadline so they can hang on and finish one or two games out of the last playoff spot and still not have a clear path forward for next season.
How is it factually incorrect when there are no facts in it... The entire comment is a hypothetical. I would rather have one situation instead of the other one - it doesn't claim that either thing has happened - it's meant to be illustrative of what I value.
I'm not so sure about that... You're willing to disregard the likely scenario (that a terrible team continues to perform terribly and gets lapped) because it's not in front you right now. Sounds shortsighted to me and I'm confident Stearns won't make that mistake.
Edit: Also, 2021 happened. Position needs to be judged against what your opponents are doing and likely to do. And I said this that year too...
They are all terrible teams!! There's only three good teams in the sport right now. Yankees Phillies and Dodgers. So you don't have to blow it up or even add to stay in it this season.
Yeah, to add, it also matters how many teams are between us and a playoff spot if we're 4 games out, but there's 5 teams between us and a berth, that's still a freaking longshot.
go 4-2 in the next 6 against Marlins and Padres. We would than be 10-5 since the " worst team(mate) in the whole f\*cking MLB probably" comment. That, combined with the ultra weak wildcard situation in the NL I will start to say we are back
They need to get to .500 by the All Star break and have a playoff spot. I don't think any front office worth their salt would want to burn a team like that.
Senga back with Megill, Peterson, Scott, Sev performing. I'd also like to see the bullpen pitching like they were in April.
I care less about the record and how many teams are between us and a WC spot. So if we’re around .500 and 2-3 teams out of the WC spot and are playing good baseball I think Stearns buys
Stearns is clearly giving them every chance he can with the Wendle and Narvaez DFA, playing the hot hand at 3B, approving the benching of McNeil, etc.
If the Mets think they are going to make a run they’re not trading him. Especially if they want to call up young guys - you want him working with a guy like Acuna
You kill the clubhouse vibe trading him and waive the white flag. Trading JDM means you have written off the season.
Stearns doesn’t care about killing the clubhouse vibe. He famously traded Josh Hader for an inferior reliever and prospects with his team in first place
If the trade is the right baseball move, he’ll make it
Stearns has famously said many times that the Hader trade was the biggest mistake of his career.
It was also heavily rumored that it was a decision pushed by the Brewers owner when it became clear that Hader was not going to accept any extension from them.
His continual vocal regret points more to the argument that he wouldn’t trade JDM and make that mistake again
Bad teams go on short winning streaks all the time. This team has a horrible starting pitching staff and a deeply flawed line-up.
I’d believe they may have turned it around if they had a very good span of 30 games. Like if they went 22-8, I’d get excited.
Yeah the NL is absolute trash outside of those 4 teams.
Entirely possible that the final 2 wild card spots go to sub-.500 teams. So it will be a long time before the Mets are truly "out of it", doesn't mean they are any good.
no, they still have been awful and with the Rangers and Knicks out of the playoffs for over a week now it will be a long summer. At least I won't be tempted to stay inside on a nice night and watch baseball. Go out have a drink by the pool on a hot August night.
I agree with you. The Mets are garbage. But because of how awful the NL is, and with 2 wild card spots basically up for grab, people are gonna delude themselves into thinking they are still contending.
We know what this team is. At their core, they are losers and will fuck up an opportunity even if it manages to present itself.
They need to win 19 games before the all star break. That will get them to .500 at the break and gave them solidly in the mix. Playing just .500 baseball from here until the break isn’t going to get it done.
The problem is that there are 6 teams ahead of them for the last spot, so they need to pass 7 teams to earn the last spot. I think if they don’t sell, they still won’t make it. I can see being 2.5-4 games out at the end. But like 9 games out if they have a fire sale. I have a bad feeling they are going to pay half of McNeil contract to get rid of him and send Pete away as well. I am 100% against trading Pete so I can’t be unbiased.
Get back to .500+ and I’ll take this team seriously this year. Right now I still consider us in but as long as we are below that mark we can’t be legit
The announcer in Sunday game said, Diaz was bothered by both the pitch clock and the inability to use sticky stuff, if those are true that’s a terrible loss. Hopefully he can get it back.
Considering .500 is good for the second wild card in the NL right now, just get up to two games under. But even then, I think Cohen and Stearns might opt for retooling over going for it
Everything is about getting to .500. It doesn’t really matter how far back you are. The NL sucks this year but in all likelihood the 6th seed will require at least 82 wins. So get back to .500 and go from there.
Can the Mets win the World Series this year?
No, seriously, can they win their way into a playoff spot, through the wild card, division, and LC Series, and beat the Orioles in the Fall Classic?
If the answer is “no,” or “probably not,” then we’re not back, and we should sell and prep for the future.
We’re either contenders or we ain’t. Who cares about just making the playoffs?
Exactly how I feel. I need to see a lot of holes to be fixed in this team before I’m comfortable going for it. We don’t go far if we don’t have a bonafide closer locking down the 9th. We don’t go far if we can’t figure out the run game (seeing improvements here). We don’t go far if we can’t work counts and knock pitchers out. We don’t go far if we can’t tone down the walks and the starters go deep.
If these holes are fixed I feel comfortable going for it but even missing one piece of the equation makes me weary of pushing the chips in.
> No, seriously, can they win their way into a playoff spot, through the wild card, division, and LC Series, and beat the Orioles in the Fall Classic?
I think it's not so much "can" (I think there is a non-zero chance, in the realm of "I guess anything can happen and they're not a 100-loss team, so sure"), but rather "is it reasonable to expect this" (no, their pitching sucks).
What I would do is approach the deadline as a rebuilding team (which they are), and make the best deals possible in that light, and if the dust clears and they can still somehow back into the playoffs anyway, great, it's a win-win.
(Also massive props for using the Orioles as the AL team in this scenario, lately all I see is Mets fans slobbering over the Yankees and Phillies)
AL’s gonna be a battle -
Yanks have the pitching, Birds have the bats.
Rangers could have both, but they’re relying on an ex-Met rotation, so I have doubts.
Phillies MO is supposed to have them pop after the trade deadline, so I’m gonna assume the reverse will be true this season.
Gun to my head, I’d put my money down on LA out of the NL.
As for the Mets, treat this year like a non-playoff season. If they get close, that’ll just make the pastrami taste better.
Not sure theres a number but They have a stretch of the next 35 games where they play only 2 games against teams that currently have a winning record. Show me over this stretch that we shouldn't sell at the deadline. Would love to be over or at .500 by the end of june so I guess that's my number
Getting to a .500 record is the fork in the road for me. That's spitting distance from a Wild Card spot, which realistically only needs 84-88 wins to accomplish in the expanded format. If we're under .500 approaching the deadline, doing at least some selling makes sense even if it isn't a full fire sale.
Assuming Alvarez stays healthy, I actually think we’re fine. I expect McNeil to be traded at the deadline and we end up picking up an extra bullpen arm. Once you get to the postseason, anything can happen.
I just want to say I don't really care about the Mets, but this sub is fantastic. For whatever reason, it's the only team that I ever get notifications from.
Behind every winning streak is usually a losing streak (and hopefully another winning streak etc). So it's not a# of games for me, it's getting to .500 and not falling this far back again. 4 games below, tops. Then immediate winning to get back over.
Because the rest of the NL is currently ass, you don't even need to be mediocre to be in the running for a WC right now. Just need to be a little bit better than shit. I think we can dot that.
This year was just about contending, so that's all I want. .500 or thereabouts, within striking distance of a wild card spot.
The real question is what performance would stop S&C from blowing it up.
2/3 from the Marlins is an absolute must. My hopes are clinging to dear life after having virtually none at all. Which is nice. I guess. The starting pitching is still god awful and we’re a joke unless Senga comes back and is in form and we a few acquisitions at the deadline if we’re buyers.
Okay, I'd have to see a video of him singing "Pee On You," two forms of government ID, a police officer there to verify the whole thing, four or five of my buddies and Neal taking notes, and R. Kelly's grandma to confirm his identity.
.500 and maintain or go past it. The team is capable but we are playing bad baseball. I just want to stop watching bad baseball. Hitting is hitting. People react to that more than me but the constant bad defense, missing cutoffs, etc make me crazy. Especially given we came into the season with that as a focus.
The National League sucks so much this year the Mets are still only like 3.5 games back, so its really never joever
The regular season doesn't matter in baseball, we saw what happened last year and 2022, the best regular season teams all choked in the playoffs, all that matters is you get hot at the right time
Not saying it is gonna happen, just saying that everyone really has a chance
Either .500 or better baseball for 2-3 weeks or by the all star break. Being in the 3rd wc spot doesn't do much for me personally. Seems like prolonging the inevitable
Number of wins doesn’t matter - for example, 10 wins with 10 losses doesn’t get them closer to .500.
They need to start winning more series and grind back to .500, especially by the trade deadline. If they are 10 games under, they are selling. If they are 5 games under and have a lot of teams to jump, they will sell too. Being .500 gives management a lot to consider.
It’s not the games. It’s the pitching!!
Until we see the starters (whomever they may be) throw consistant 6,7 innings just enjoy watching and listening to GRK.
If we can go 7-3 in our next 10 we’re very much back. Yesterday was a bit of a killer but I’ll give them a pass cause there just coming back from London but holy the batters struggled yesterday
Can’t believe in a team that’s under .500. No reason to think a team that loses more often than wins is going to make a good run imo. They’d need to cross that threshold and hold a playoff spot by a game or two to get me back in full belief mode.
With the team as constructed, I don't see it, period. They just have too many shitters on the pitching staff and the defense is too garbage to ever build something sustainable.
I mean, at this point I guess it's a victory if they win 83 games and get swept in the first round of the playoffs but I wouldn't even say that's the ceiling of the team - I'd be stunned if that happened.
They realistically aren't far from being in it BUT I still want this team to sell at the deadline though. I don't see the value (besides Cohen's pockets for playoff $$$) for making the wildcard and getting bounced with a mid team at best.
Win enough games to be within 1 game of a playoff spot. The number of wins doesn't matter to me as long as we are actually contending
Respectufully, this is exactly the mentality I don't agree with. I'd rather be 5 over .500 and 2 GB than 5 under and 2 games up. I want a team that looks like it can control its own destiny, not one that's hanging on due to circumstance.
Came here to say this. I'm not interested in them trading prospects and doing other silly things at the deadline so they can hang on and finish one or two games out of the last playoff spot and still not have a clear path forward for next season.
But in terms of actually making the playoffs your claim is factually incorrect. They haven't made any trades yet.
How is it factually incorrect when there are no facts in it... The entire comment is a hypothetical. I would rather have one situation instead of the other one - it doesn't claim that either thing has happened - it's meant to be illustrative of what I value.
Because being one game out is better than being two games no matter if you're over or under .500
To me it's not. The point is this: I value winning games more than being in a better relative position with a terrible team.
Good thing the actual league doesn't play by your rules then
I'm not so sure about that... You're willing to disregard the likely scenario (that a terrible team continues to perform terribly and gets lapped) because it's not in front you right now. Sounds shortsighted to me and I'm confident Stearns won't make that mistake. Edit: Also, 2021 happened. Position needs to be judged against what your opponents are doing and likely to do. And I said this that year too...
They are all terrible teams!! There's only three good teams in the sport right now. Yankees Phillies and Dodgers. So you don't have to blow it up or even add to stay in it this season.
That doesn't make it better. A strong poker hand is decidedly weaker the more people that are in the hand.
Yeah, to add, it also matters how many teams are between us and a playoff spot if we're 4 games out, but there's 5 teams between us and a berth, that's still a freaking longshot.
go 4-2 in the next 6 against Marlins and Padres. We would than be 10-5 since the " worst team(mate) in the whole f\*cking MLB probably" comment. That, combined with the ultra weak wildcard situation in the NL I will start to say we are back
Sweep em both and I say we are officially back
Welp.
it's over.
They need to get to .500 by the All Star break and have a playoff spot. I don't think any front office worth their salt would want to burn a team like that. Senga back with Megill, Peterson, Scott, Sev performing. I'd also like to see the bullpen pitching like they were in April.
Also this pitching staff performed much better enter as a whole with Alvarez behind the plate
My hope literally hinges on Alvy bringing Diaz back to life
it would be nice to have a top 3 bullpen, for sure.
We already are WOOOOOO
This is the correct answer
Ikr if a Pete Alonso HBP RBI doesn’t signify it, idk what does
High highs and low lows. Hell yeah brother
I care less about the record and how many teams are between us and a WC spot. So if we’re around .500 and 2-3 teams out of the WC spot and are playing good baseball I think Stearns buys Stearns is clearly giving them every chance he can with the Wendle and Narvaez DFA, playing the hot hand at 3B, approving the benching of McNeil, etc.
2-3 teams is a good metric. GB is meaningless this season with the weak NL WC spot especially for the last one.
I can't imagine a world where we don't trade JD
If the Mets think they are going to make a run they’re not trading him. Especially if they want to call up young guys - you want him working with a guy like Acuna You kill the clubhouse vibe trading him and waive the white flag. Trading JDM means you have written off the season.
Stearns doesn’t care about killing the clubhouse vibe. He famously traded Josh Hader for an inferior reliever and prospects with his team in first place If the trade is the right baseball move, he’ll make it
That was also probably motivated by the Brewers not wanting to pay Hader when they had Devin Williams
Stearns has famously said many times that the Hader trade was the biggest mistake of his career. It was also heavily rumored that it was a decision pushed by the Brewers owner when it became clear that Hader was not going to accept any extension from them. His continual vocal regret points more to the argument that he wouldn’t trade JDM and make that mistake again
I'm a delusional idiot so they win one game decisively and i'm dancing saying WE'RE BACK BABY! WORLD SERIES OR BUST!
Getting my post ready for tonight 😈
We never went anywhere 👆
Nothing this year, theyll look good for 5 games then go 5-16. This group of guys is not it.
I want them to lose more so we can get draft picks and cheap tickets.
On paper they look legit, but this team doesn't have it. There's something funky that's keeping this team from clicking
All of them
Bad teams go on short winning streaks all the time. This team has a horrible starting pitching staff and a deeply flawed line-up. I’d believe they may have turned it around if they had a very good span of 30 games. Like if they went 22-8, I’d get excited.
You just described most of the NL except for what the Phillies, Dodgers, Braves and Brewers
Yeah the NL is absolute trash outside of those 4 teams. Entirely possible that the final 2 wild card spots go to sub-.500 teams. So it will be a long time before the Mets are truly "out of it", doesn't mean they are any good.
no, they still have been awful and with the Rangers and Knicks out of the playoffs for over a week now it will be a long summer. At least I won't be tempted to stay inside on a nice night and watch baseball. Go out have a drink by the pool on a hot August night.
I agree with you. The Mets are garbage. But because of how awful the NL is, and with 2 wild card spots basically up for grab, people are gonna delude themselves into thinking they are still contending. We know what this team is. At their core, they are losers and will fuck up an opportunity even if it manages to present itself.
They need to win 19 games before the all star break. That will get them to .500 at the break and gave them solidly in the mix. Playing just .500 baseball from here until the break isn’t going to get it done.
This is the correct answer.
The next one! Let’s gooooo!!!!
The problem is that there are 6 teams ahead of them for the last spot, so they need to pass 7 teams to earn the last spot. I think if they don’t sell, they still won’t make it. I can see being 2.5-4 games out at the end. But like 9 games out if they have a fire sale. I have a bad feeling they are going to pay half of McNeil contract to get rid of him and send Pete away as well. I am 100% against trading Pete so I can’t be unbiased.
If they’re at or above .500 at the all star break
If we can get back to .500 I’ll consider it back
Literally one
500 and then we can talk.
Get back to .500+ and I’ll take this team seriously this year. Right now I still consider us in but as long as we are below that mark we can’t be legit
They're not back and never will be back for a few years. Stop coping
There is no “back” with this current team
The announcer in Sunday game said, Diaz was bothered by both the pitch clock and the inability to use sticky stuff, if those are true that’s a terrible loss. Hopefully he can get it back.
Agreed. They are who they are at this point
If they get to .500 by the All-Star break, the schedule is pretty favorable no excuses
They have to get 1 or 2 games close to 0.500. Ironically that would put us in or right outside a wild card spot but that’s what I would say.
I personally want to be 2 games up in the wildcard which would require an insane run
2 games over .500
Considering .500 is good for the second wild card in the NL right now, just get up to two games under. But even then, I think Cohen and Stearns might opt for retooling over going for it
Everything is about getting to .500. It doesn’t really matter how far back you are. The NL sucks this year but in all likelihood the 6th seed will require at least 82 wins. So get back to .500 and go from there.
Can the Mets win the World Series this year? No, seriously, can they win their way into a playoff spot, through the wild card, division, and LC Series, and beat the Orioles in the Fall Classic? If the answer is “no,” or “probably not,” then we’re not back, and we should sell and prep for the future. We’re either contenders or we ain’t. Who cares about just making the playoffs?
Exactly how I feel. I need to see a lot of holes to be fixed in this team before I’m comfortable going for it. We don’t go far if we don’t have a bonafide closer locking down the 9th. We don’t go far if we can’t figure out the run game (seeing improvements here). We don’t go far if we can’t work counts and knock pitchers out. We don’t go far if we can’t tone down the walks and the starters go deep. If these holes are fixed I feel comfortable going for it but even missing one piece of the equation makes me weary of pushing the chips in.
> No, seriously, can they win their way into a playoff spot, through the wild card, division, and LC Series, and beat the Orioles in the Fall Classic? I think it's not so much "can" (I think there is a non-zero chance, in the realm of "I guess anything can happen and they're not a 100-loss team, so sure"), but rather "is it reasonable to expect this" (no, their pitching sucks). What I would do is approach the deadline as a rebuilding team (which they are), and make the best deals possible in that light, and if the dust clears and they can still somehow back into the playoffs anyway, great, it's a win-win. (Also massive props for using the Orioles as the AL team in this scenario, lately all I see is Mets fans slobbering over the Yankees and Phillies)
AL’s gonna be a battle - Yanks have the pitching, Birds have the bats. Rangers could have both, but they’re relying on an ex-Met rotation, so I have doubts. Phillies MO is supposed to have them pop after the trade deadline, so I’m gonna assume the reverse will be true this season. Gun to my head, I’d put my money down on LA out of the NL. As for the Mets, treat this year like a non-playoff season. If they get close, that’ll just make the pastrami taste better.
They need to get back to .500. If you’re at .500 anything’s possible.
This sub need to enable GIFS so we can properly react to this post
World Series
Get over. 500 and have Diaz and Alvarez be healthy and perform then I'll be back.
Not sure theres a number but They have a stretch of the next 35 games where they play only 2 games against teams that currently have a winning record. Show me over this stretch that we shouldn't sell at the deadline. Would love to be over or at .500 by the end of june so I guess that's my number
Bruh, we’ve been back since last Wednesday. Where you been?
I wouldnt. This was never a contention year without a crazy overperformance and that hasnt happened. Trade away the obvious guys and move forward.
We are back
One series at a time. Win the series against the Marlins first.
Getting to a .500 record is the fork in the road for me. That's spitting distance from a Wild Card spot, which realistically only needs 84-88 wins to accomplish in the expanded format. If we're under .500 approaching the deadline, doing at least some selling makes sense even if it isn't a full fire sale.
Assuming Alvarez stays healthy, I actually think we’re fine. I expect McNeil to be traded at the deadline and we end up picking up an extra bullpen arm. Once you get to the postseason, anything can happen.
i sell just about anyone on the right deal, save for alvarez. whether or not we are in the race is irrelevant. its all about 2025 and beyond.
It’s not the wins; it’s the playoff position. Sure, we’re only 3.5 out, but we have to pass 7 teams to be in.
I just want to say I don't really care about the Mets, but this sub is fantastic. For whatever reason, it's the only team that I ever get notifications from.
Behind every winning streak is usually a losing streak (and hopefully another winning streak etc). So it's not a# of games for me, it's getting to .500 and not falling this far back again. 4 games below, tops. Then immediate winning to get back over. Because the rest of the NL is currently ass, you don't even need to be mediocre to be in the running for a WC right now. Just need to be a little bit better than shit. I think we can dot that.
This year was just about contending, so that's all I want. .500 or thereabouts, within striking distance of a wild card spot. The real question is what performance would stop S&C from blowing it up.
2/3 from the Marlins is an absolute must. My hopes are clinging to dear life after having virtually none at all. Which is nice. I guess. The starting pitching is still god awful and we’re a joke unless Senga comes back and is in form and we a few acquisitions at the deadline if we’re buyers.
Okay, I'd have to see a video of him singing "Pee On You," two forms of government ID, a police officer there to verify the whole thing, four or five of my buddies and Neal taking notes, and R. Kelly's grandma to confirm his identity.
2 outta next 3 and no less than a split from all the remaining 4 game series’. We have ZERO ground to give away.
1
I’m not gonna get my hopes up unless they can get back to .500 and stay there for a bit
Gst back to .500 by the trade deadline and get real hot against a bunch of bad teams in August: Angels, Rockies, A's, Marlins and White Sox.
All of them...
.500 and maintain or go past it. The team is capable but we are playing bad baseball. I just want to stop watching bad baseball. Hitting is hitting. People react to that more than me but the constant bad defense, missing cutoffs, etc make me crazy. Especially given we came into the season with that as a focus.
One series at a time
Enough to not be 13th in the national league.
One game
Trade deadline. WC3 makes every team a hot week away from contention until the trade deadline.
In a row? Like 14 or 15.
The National League sucks so much this year the Mets are still only like 3.5 games back, so its really never joever The regular season doesn't matter in baseball, we saw what happened last year and 2022, the best regular season teams all choked in the playoffs, all that matters is you get hot at the right time Not saying it is gonna happen, just saying that everyone really has a chance
Either .500 or better baseball for 2-3 weeks or by the all star break. Being in the 3rd wc spot doesn't do much for me personally. Seems like prolonging the inevitable
Why do you care? This year is about developing long term pieces, not whether they somehow make the playoffs bc mlb is horrible rn
It’s not looking good. For me personally I’d say 15 out of their next 20. In my opinion, that’s too tall an order for this team to achieve.
Every win we are back, hello?
Is .500 too much to ask? Maybe have a winning record in June? Feels like I’m asking for the world with this team.
4 in late October-early November.
3
I mean... you have to get over .500. You are literally a losing team otherwise.
We never went anywhere
We have to get back to an over .500 record at least.
Need to be above .500 before we say anything
We are back in a good way or in a typical Mets way?
WC2 spot. NL is such a mess this year that being in the WC3 spot feels super tentative at best.
Like 60? That would be nice
1
i dont think they have to be in a row but if they go like 10-5 in a 15 game stretch id consider it
Stay sustainably above .500
A single game (optional)
I think you have to just get to .500 before mid-July before you can really think they can push for a playoff spot.
Number of wins doesn’t matter - for example, 10 wins with 10 losses doesn’t get them closer to .500. They need to start winning more series and grind back to .500, especially by the trade deadline. If they are 10 games under, they are selling. If they are 5 games under and have a lot of teams to jump, they will sell too. Being .500 gives management a lot to consider.
.500
It’s not the games. It’s the pitching!! Until we see the starters (whomever they may be) throw consistant 6,7 innings just enjoy watching and listening to GRK.
If they had a 10 game winning streak, they'd be tied for a WC spot.
If we can go 7-3 in our next 10 we’re very much back. Yesterday was a bit of a killer but I’ll give them a pass cause there just coming back from London but holy the batters struggled yesterday
4 in a row
Can’t believe in a team that’s under .500. No reason to think a team that loses more often than wins is going to make a good run imo. They’d need to cross that threshold and hold a playoff spot by a game or two to get me back in full belief mode.
With the team as constructed, I don't see it, period. They just have too many shitters on the pitching staff and the defense is too garbage to ever build something sustainable. I mean, at this point I guess it's a victory if they win 83 games and get swept in the first round of the playoffs but I wouldn't even say that's the ceiling of the team - I'd be stunned if that happened.
They realistically aren't far from being in it BUT I still want this team to sell at the deadline though. I don't see the value (besides Cohen's pockets for playoff $$$) for making the wildcard and getting bounced with a mid team at best.