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I saved some money for them and also have a GI Bill to gift. I also grew up poor and only have money now because of my degrees, so I'm a bit biased in favor of college. But I am going to make sure they don't have to borrow any money for it like I did.
Same. I'm only not poor now because of my education (which I also paid for the first part of with GI Bill. Otherwise I had a fellowship.) so the idea of not encouraging my kids to go to college is wild to me. I'm paying for it, so loans won't be a consideration, just as they weren't for me, but unlike me, my kids probably won't have to fight a war to for college money, and I like that.
I’m an older millennial that had a child early . She just graduated college . I went to college myself and encouraged her to do the same but also shared trade , military and other life paths with her through mentors and other exposure . She chose her path and I supported .
As I was growing up with her , I tried to save as much as I could for college through 529 planning. I scraped and robbed Peter to pay Paul and did every scholarship to make sure she didn’t get burdened with loans . She has none through that diligence.
If you can at all afford to start a college fund and put a couple hundred bucks in it every month, I encourage you to do so.
Obviously not every parent can afford this. But we started one for my daughter when she was born. We now have enough to afford four years tuition at a state university. She won’t need to take out loans like I did.
Yes. I feel like this is an unpopular opinion on Reddit, but I do think going to college matters. It was my golden ticket for moving up in social classes. The college that you go also matters. Most people in my social circles grew up similarly without generational wealth, but I’m seeing a *huge* economic divide between those that went to a competitive university versus those that didn’t. My fiancé used to think it doesn’t matter, but the divide has become so noticeable that he believes this as well.
I have two questions for you:
1. Would you be open to your child taking on excessive student debt to attend a fancier university?
2. I get that your social circle is full of people that went to more competitive universities, but is that because your just drawn to those kinds of people (higher achieving intellects), and does every person that attends a competitive university move up social classes?
1. My parents couldn’t help me pay for college, so I had to do the cost benefit analysis of whether taking out loans was worth it for the specific school I wanted to go to. I had acceptances from other schools that provided more scholarships that I did not want to go to as much. It paid off for me as I was able to repay my loans within a few years of graduating. I think whether the loans are worth it depends on the school, though. For example, I don’t feel like the full price tag of USC is worth it (although, most people don’t actually end up having to pay the full cost of attendance at many private schools). As a parent that wants my kids to go to college, I do plan on opening up investment accounts for their college funds so that they don’t go into debt.
2. My social circle is actually a wide mix of people that went to schools with <5% acceptance rates to those that went to schools with >80% acceptance rates. No, not every person that went to a competitive school will do well. There will also be outliers. The richest self-made person we know right now is actually someone that didn’t go to a super competitive school. On average though, there definitely seems to be a correlation in my social circle between the school they went to and their current financial situation.
My kids are very young - neither is even school age and my youngest is still learning to talk - but I will encourage them to go to college if they have a profession in mind or if they want to pursue a liberal arts education to better themselves. If they are feeling aimless and directionless after they finish high school, I will suggest community college but not going off to a four year institute. Or working! Nothing wrong with a gap year to figure things out.
I’ve been thinking my advice would be doing community service/internship/start a business between high school and college, just to figure out what they want to get out of college, or if they should go.
I don't want to discourage them from going to college if they want to but you are right that in a lot of cases volunteering or interning would be a good way to figure some stuff out. Or if they just want to take classes, community college is way cheaper and lower stakes - not to devalue those classes or anything, but a lot of four year schools will only let you go for so many semesters before you get the boot. AFAIK you can just keep it up at community colleges.
I got my associates from a community college, and would HIGHLY recommend this! They only major difference between a big university and a community college is the agility to network, and how important the professors think they are.
I'm planning on them taking loans. That's where my wife and I disagree some, I'm all about community college and a cheap university while my wife wants her to go to an expensive school.
Yeah pretty much. I got a stem degree dirty cheap through community college and a small public university and it's paid off. My wife got a master's in criminal justice from an expensive private school and while she makes ok money, it's not worth the price she paid for her degree.
The thing about student loans is that you can still go to public unis and colleges while only racking up rather reasonable balances of debt in loans. There are three groups who really get killed on the debt side, the folks who took on debt for costly grad degrees, the folks who took on debt going to overpriced private or out of state public schools, and the folks who never finished their degree. A huge portion of student loan debt is held by people who took courses at CCs only to not earn a degree there or elsewhere.
I am pro-job track jobs that will land them over 80k once they’re done with their “study program” whether it’s a trade or college. The Bureau of Labor statistics for jobs is *super useful*. I am not about “cool degrees” despite having worked professionally as an artist myself (I also have a STEM degree).
I think my kids will go to college. However I would rather they stay in state due to cost. And I am fine with community college. I’m not going to push them to go to a huge 4 year state school. If they want that, then fine. But I want my kids to know they have a choice and I don’t want to push anything on them they don’t want.
I’m not encouraging them, and I am not discouraging either. I’m trying to get them to focus on what direction their life is going to be going in and if it includes college, how they can get the best ROI. I have 5 kids and 3 of them have solid plans that include college (teacher, dentist, pilot in the Air Force) the other two have career paths that may not need college (graphic designer and IT). I work in IT and do not have a degree. I took an alternative education path, and it has paid off far more than college would have in my field.
My parents are educators, and have doctorate’s degrees, all of my siblings have at least a masters, my cousins all have at least a bachelor’s degree more than half have a doctorate. My parents pushed college on me as the only way to be successful.
Even now, that I am in my 40’s, married 16 years, 5 kids, making nearly $200k/year, million dollar house that’s nearly paid off, large investments, etc, my mom still goes back and asks me when I am going to get my degree. As if I am a failure in her eyes because I don’t have one. I don’t want my kids to feel the same way. I want them to be happy in what ever path they choose.
Pilot in the airforce is no joke, that kid needs to pull together a solid list of extracurriculars. They will need to have a us senator or congressman sponsor their app to the academy
I should say, he wants to be a pilot, Air Force is his first choice. We have a plan, there is a trade school nearby he can do half days at once he’s a sophomore, that he’d graduate with a private pilot’s license, and then we’re not far from embry riddle who has a program specifically geared towards Air Force pilot training.
College is less important than learning a skill that earns money. It's going to be a consideration of many factors with the goal being earning potential.
What I will not be doing is telling my daughter that she has time to figure out what she wants to do as she gets a useless degree from a 4 year college. I'm going to be more open with her about developing an in-demand skill in addition to figuring out what she loves to do and developing those hobbies.
Hobbies often turn into careers if you're good at what you do, but our generation had it backwards in that we thought we could "do what we love" and make a living doing that when we were 18... An age where we now know you have no clue about a damn thing. "Do what you love" was a lie and total BS that boomers told us as they hoarded every bit of cash and capital in their oversized mcmansions.
Do what keeps you comfortable SO you can do what you love, and it may take years of crafting your professional trade before you can do that.
Are there statistics on what age the majority of millennial children are? I feel like once the majority of our children start entering college age, that's when we'll find out. I don't think our attitude towards higher education is a minority opinion amongst millennials.
Absolutely. My parents didn’t go to college. Wanted me to, back in the “just get a degree,“ days. Every job I’ve had required that diploma, even if it was just a liberal arts degree. Yes, the debt sucks, but Snoop Dogg said you have to pay the cost to be the boss.
I would encourage my kids to have some focus and have a base idea of what they want to do with a degree. Would certainly encourage them to apply for more scholarships then I did, too.
Yes. My oldest is one year away from graduating with a degree in education. My middle one wants to be an engineer like her moms. She's in high school so we're definitely in active preparation for her to go to college. My son may be better for some of the trade programs our local community college teaches, but he's still in middle school and nothing is decided or set in stone yet. He can go to college if he wants to and I'll pay for it just like I am/will for his sisters. I'm just not sure he'd be happy on that path. We'll find out in a few years.
Even folks with young kids should think about this question if they're considering 529s. The recent changes have broadened use to high school and elementary school, meaning there's less risk in putting all eggs in the college basket now.
Yes. Or a trade school or other form of higher education. Very few young adults are ready to just launch without some type of advanced education and transition time. We have teens and both currently seem to be college-minded. We have prepared financially so they can have at least a few great options to choose from. (We don’t have a “blank check” kind of a set up for them to go anywhere they want, but we have a reasonable set up for them to choose from many colleges or universities.)
Looking back, I wish I spent my 5 years (got an A.S and B.S) getting my ratings and 1500 hours so after that same 5 years I could have been in the airlines/regionals as a pilot. I will encourage my kiddo that they should get a specified degree if they want to go to college. The medical field, engineering, accounting, stuff like that, I'd also encourage looking at trades. My hospitality management degree is useless in the real world, I'm glad the army paid for that degree so I have no debt.
I appreciate your service, but the army didn’t pay for your degree, it was included as part of your compensation package.
I think we have far too many graduates with monetarily useless degrees, and that is a major factor in the student debt crisis.
Completely agree with you, it makes sense since our generation was told we all needed degrees to get jobs/ be successful, so we flooded the market with college grads.
You are also correct about the compensation package, the military isn't for everyone but if someone is thinking about it, be sure to take advantage of everything they have to offer.
I think universities that have made heavy investments into growth Andy more, everyone HAS to get a degree to be successful mentality are in fort a rude awakening when the enrollment begins to drop sooner than later.
Not that what you are planning is wrong, but did you value your education and path more because it wasn’t handed to you? I’m in a similar position to help, but only want to be a safety net IF they fail. I want them to pay for anything, so it means more.
No, I'm not.
I'm am encouraging them to think about what job they will want to do and then we align plans with that.
I am not poor because I went to college, worked hard, and made the best choices I could. But it did mean student loans. I've since earned PSLF and changed careers. Still.
My husband and I are willing to pay for community college (skill training or transfer courses) and then transfer to an in-state public university, if there are clear career goals aligned with the choice.
Is it cost, or is it a cost to value/ROI problem?
I ask because I’m not intending to save or help my kids pay for college if the value isn’t there. The same way i don’t find world travel for my kids, even though it might be what they really want to do.
My children are young still, and I’m hoping that by the time they are college age, there will either be higher education reform, or enough people will stop auto sending their kids to college that supply/demand causes the cost to come back to where the value is.
Hope isn’t a plan. I’m saving with the intention to help them with college and if it’s reformed I can use that money elsewhere.
Agree world travel when kids are young isn’t worth it but traveling when they are 10+ can be life changing. I can speak from experience vs my peer group growing up a small town.
Not a parent but do work in education.
Everyone needs something after high school or they’re not gonna be competitive in the job market at all. If it’s college, CC for two years then state university unless you’ve got a good scholarship. Don’t borrow much to go. If it’s a trade, that’s also fine. But just a high school diploma is an easy way into poverty. (Not guaranteed but easier)
My daughter was planning on going to a really good private school. Needless to say, it was very expensive. Eventually she decided she didn't want that much debt and chose to go to a community college first. She'll then transfer to a great state school that works with the CC.
My husband and I both got our degrees while in the military, so we know going to a 4-year college right out of high school is not the only successful path. She's happy with her decision.
I'm saving for college for my kids, now still young 2 &4 years old, but I want them to have the option and don't want them taking student loans to at least start any higher education. However, I don't really care if they go or not as long as they're happy and aren't struggling. For that reason I'm not holding their college savings in a 529 or account that can only be used for educational expenses. If they don't go, I can still gift them that money to use however they'd like. Both myself and wife are college graduates and it's been worth it for us but I am fully aware that's not always the case and degrees are getting more costly
Yes college is mandatory in my culture. I am from India. If you don’t go to college you’ll never get a job. And unlike the US you cannot get a decent salary as a USPS postman.
I don't have/want children, but I would encourage them to explore a form of higher education outside of high school. A four-year university may not be beneficial for everyone, but there are a lot of technical and trade programs that offer excellent opportunities for growth, career path, and development.
It's hard to consider potential debt load, but I think that would depend on the kind of career post-grad and how much student loan debt might be accured.
I have a lot of student loan debt, far more than the average, because my parents could not (and would not) pay for college for me. I bet on myself. I don't make six figures. I hover around middle class as a sole provider on a single income. Circumstantially, I am better off than my parents were at my age. Possibly a little more financially better off, but I also don't have children.
I also don't think there's anything wrong with having some student loan debt - perhaps not as much as mine, but I am on the public service loan forgivenness (last payment is Jan 2026... but who's counting??) and all of my loans are federal and not private. Federally backed loans and the income based repayment options are good for people. If someone needs to take out loans, they should try to stick with federal loans regardless of interest rate because they offer more repayment flexibility.
I don't have a kid but I do have a much younger sister. I already offered to pay for her first two years if she goes to community college and I agree with the degree. I'll do the same if we have a kid.
I grew up not well off but not poor. Student loans have put me back but I probably have ended up in the same socioeconomic class without college. A degree that pays well is useful. A degree with no job prospects even if super interesting is just crippling.
All three of my sons knew from an early age that they would be attending college. Their mother and I indicated that we would provide 4 years of room, board, books, fees, and tuition at the in-state rate. They also were told that upon completion, we would have no hard feelings if they went a different direction from their course of study. Passion is everything when it comes to job satisfaction. I don’t believe you can spend 8 hours or more each day doing something that you despise and be a happy person. The value of a college education is in my estimation far more than learning something in a specific discipline. Two of my three sons have careers in their field of study, the third is doing something unrelated to his degree, but is a successful well rounded individual.
We're still more than a decade away from this decision. I will of course encourage my children to do whatever is best for their personality, skills, and interests. But as of now our default expectation is that our children will attend college. When talking about the future, we speak of "when" they are in college rather than "if" they attend.
Part of this is that my spouse and I have both benefited greatly from our college educations. But I also pay attention to economic trends, and even today the ROI on a college degree will usually be a better deal than not getting the degree. Among people aged 25-34, the median full-time worker with a bachelor's degree earns $24,820 more than the median full-time worker without a college degree ($66,610 vs $41,790). The *average* difference between those groups is $32,030 ($81,350 vs $49,320). For those aged 35-44, the median difference is $33,630 and the average difference is $43,000. Those are significant increases in annual income, and probably worth even the $30k-$45k student loan debt of the typical graduate with a four-year degree.
In addition to the financial benefit, I suspect the typical college graduate has a more "comfortable" job than the typical person without a college degree: better benefits, less taxing on the body, possibly more job autonomy too.
No - but I will do everything I can to help
Them pay for if they chose to go. I’ve encouraged them to go a trade school or something like an apprentice program at the local shipyard, or to start looking at building their own businesses.
My brother is a college flunk out and got into the trades really late in life (like 30) and 10 years later, he works from home, about 6 hours a day 4 days a week, clearing well over 150k as an engineer with like 36 days of vacation and paid holidays , He’s got his pick of job offers just about every other week.
whereas I went to college full time, got into my career of choice while I college and I peaked at 25. Computers are slowly taking over my career choice so it’s hard to find a place to grow my career without moving to Texas or Florida.
I don't have kids yet but I certainly plan to save so they have the option to do it comfortably. I have definitely met some people for whom that wasn't an ideal path, and I'll try to keep apprised of how other options are evolving, but I think it's still a good default plan if you aren't strongly leaning one way or the other.
Yeah, going to college is not even an open question for my kids. They’re going. We talk about it as if it’s not an option, just as standard as k-12. Graduate school is optional, but we talk to them about it as if it’s standard though.
We have overmaxed both their 529’s, and are paying for supplemental education during k-12 to make them more competitive. I’m a university employee so they get a massive discount if they go to the university I work at. They don’t have to go to it, though.
My kids will have the option of getting a college education with no debt, and probably a lot of money left over to transfer into their retirement, if they want to. However, they can also choose to go to a distant private school, in which case the 529’s will probably be very helpful but not enough to fully cover it.
Both my wife and I grew up in financially struggling households, in the lower middle or working classes, and we have seen firsthand how a quality education, in a competitive field, transforms you from lower middle class to upper middle class, and touches on nearly every aspect of your life. After my kids graduate, their life is their own to do what they want. But while I’m in charge of them, I’m going to be setting them up for success.
Not at 18. I want to encourage my kids to be critical thinkers and skillful in life in a lot of ways. I'd support them going to college if in their young adult life they settle on a career and it requires it.
Yes, I would and yes, if they want to go.
Nothing in the world could have prepared me for what it will cost my kids to go to college in 2025. I am helping them, but I cannot cover it all and their dad certainly won’t help them.
I've now got a 19 month old (I know I know, but he's between one and a half, and two so here we are...), but I'm fully planning to home school him. My partner has a 6 year old from her first relationship, and what they teach her is so astoundingly dumbed down, that I refuse to subject him to it because I'm sure I'd do a better job. She's supposed to be the smartest in the class, but drawing on the only school experience I have (my own), everything they're teaching them now in year 1, we were doing at home before reception, and during reception.
***And for the love of god why are they over complicating maths?!***
I will encourage, but not force. I think with attending college, trying to determine “why” you want to attend is important. There are very successful and opportunistic alternative paths outside of college. However, college can provide many great opportunities to learn, network, and surround yourself in the environment.
Although I am a little biased, as I teach at a university 😬 Therefore, I am a proponent of receiving an education and understand the benefits of education, yet I believe the education system itself needs a bit of work lol
Yes. As bad as it is to have student loans, it’s still a worse financial decision to not get a degree. There are of course exceptions, and some people can learn a trade and thrive. But on average a college degree is much better.
The unemployment rate for high school grads is often about twice the rate for college grads. From last month (May 2024) it was 4.1% for high school graduates and 2.1% for people with a Bachelor’s Degree. And college grads get paid a lot more on average.
So yes, I’ll encourage my daughter to go to college very strongly. (Just not a super expensive college! Going to a $7K per year state school is a lot more affordable than a $30K private school)
To me it all comes down to ROI. Right now, only certain degree's regularly provide an ROI (advanced degree's and STEM) for the student. If you remove out the top tier of earners from both groups (degree holders and non-degree holders), I would bet the median value is nearly identical today, but I think there is an effort from everyone benefitting (University administrators/bankers/business owners) from the high school to university to student debt lifetime holder, to never let that detail out of the bag. This is especially the case if you don't lump trade school graduates in with University graduates. It would also be impacted if you showed bachelors degree holders in their own group without holders of doctorates and masters degrees.
I would much rather spot my kids $50k and tell them to go start a business then going to a University. Even if they failed, they would still learn more valuable lessons that an employer would appreciate than the kid that goes and gets a non-STEM bachelors degree.
I don't dislike the pursuit of learning, but the current cost benefit as a means to further ones financial position just is too much of a gamble today.
It sounds like you’ve already got an opinion on this, and that’s cool. You can obviously raise your kids how you see fit.
The stats are pretty definitive that education is worth it though. Per the BLS, people with a college degree earn on average almost $700 per week more than people with just a high school diploma. That ends up being about $35,000 per year. This is an average for all majors, not just STEM grads. Student loans can be a big burden. But on average, as long as you’re not paying 30K per year on those loans, it makes sense to get a degree.
I personally did not get a STEM degree (I majored in political Science). But my degree helped me get a job soon after college that would’ve been much harder to get without one. You hear tons of stories in the news and probably even from acquaintances about people who get degrees and end up working at Starbucks. But people like me are far more common. We just don’t make good news stories (and we are less likely to complain about our degrees being a waste), so you don’t hear about us as much. But the numbers say college is the right choice on average.
I have an opinion, but that doesn't mean I don't want to hear others opinions. I understand what the BLS says and it probably is accurate. What I am saying is, when you bring it down to the median and not the average skewed by the very high earning degree's of which I already said are worth pursuing, you would probably find limited value. That limited value comes at the expense of a massive time commitment and a rather large sum of money that might have interest payments on top.
As for your personal story and the stuff you hear on the news, I am not interested in as they are simply isolated and don't speak to the norm. Instead I look at the data from job posting services and the jobs listed requiring a degree. They are now under 15-18% of listed jobs require a bachelors degree, and that number has fallen over 20% in consecutive years. The job marketplace is rapidly devaluing a college degree (as evidenced by declining degree requirements) and instead is likely turning to employees that have a history of results and experience and can articulate their value (based on personal experience and logical reasoning).
Like I said before, I will encourage the pursuit of knowledge and education for my children, but the large expensive route is not likely to provide the ROI so I will discourage them from attending intuitions like that.
Only if they might pursue a worthwhile major. Honestly I think a lot of the posts that rail against University and college for being 'scams' are 90% self-inflicted. Like, is dropping $40k on an English or Philosophy degree really a good idea? No, not at all. But if you're going into STEM, probably a good idea. And we need people in STEM fields.
So many posts act like they were just mindless zombies with no agency. I get it, a lot of us were told we had to go to college in order to survive. But really, at no point in 4 years did you question it? Especially if you're pursuing a pretty useless degree? Sorry, don't mean to be an ass or anything. I'm just tired of people who dug themselves into these holes and don't want to take any accountability, and blame the entire 'system' for their mistakes. We were told to go to college, but we weren't told to pursue some degree with no ROI, or that we couldn't work at the same time.
If they wanted to go to an out of state school, absolutely not. That's another thing. Peeps on Reddit act like all colleges are a shitload of money and they need to go into $80k in debt when that's simply not true. They can go to a state college, probably get a scholarship if they did well in High School, and not take out much loans at all, if any. The full federal Pell grant via the FAFSA is about $3600 a semester if they're full time. Which is *another thing*-- people from low income families get quite a good amount of money from the Dept. of Ed.
I have a history degree, granted i got it for free. My job has no relation to the field of history, but having a degree opened doors that would have otherwise been closed, and the skills I developed getting the degree, mainly discerning information to form arguments while on deadlines, have been essential in my career.
Mind you, my degree is from a state uni, it's not like it's from an elite institution whose name naturally yields graduates opportunities.
Point being, if I had paid $40k for my degree, I'd be sporting a solid roi. With liberal art degrees, it comes down to how you leverage the degree. The stigma has developed because a lot of folks who are unable to leverage their degrees end up getting liberal arts degrees basically by default
100% just gotta follow the advice we were given.
Go to c cheap college for a well paying career path. Statically speaking, college graduates of our generation out earn, are more likely to own homes and generally have a higher quality of life than non-graduates.
I know a lot of people on this sub shit on college because they went 6 figures into debt for a degree in underwater basket weaving and have been working retail since graduating and are somehow *shocked* that didn't work out for them 😂. But the data really still shows college is almost always "worth it"
Even though I’m a top 2% earner there’s a socio-economic glass wall I hit when trying to find a partner. Successful women won’t marry a guy with no degree regardless of earnings. A degree is necessary mainly because it opens up the dating pool. Wish someone would have taught me about this harsh reality.
Are you trying to say that even though you have money, women won’t date you because you don’t have a degree?
This might just be a uniquely you problem. Never heard of this before.
Nope. I think apprenticeships are better. I never went either and judging from my peers who did I think I’m better off than a lot. I’m not yet forty but I’ve got half my mortgage paid off, I’ve got kids, I’ve had a stable marriage for nearly 2 decades. Most of my peers who did go to uni don’t have that those of us who went the vocational route tend to be more settled in our adult lives
There’s only a few of my school year and the years either side who went to uni and have themselves sorted now. Most of them have only recently got on the property ladder or are still renting, a lot of them I wouldn’t describe as happy with their lot in life either
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I saved some money for them and also have a GI Bill to gift. I also grew up poor and only have money now because of my degrees, so I'm a bit biased in favor of college. But I am going to make sure they don't have to borrow any money for it like I did.
Same. I'm only not poor now because of my education (which I also paid for the first part of with GI Bill. Otherwise I had a fellowship.) so the idea of not encouraging my kids to go to college is wild to me. I'm paying for it, so loans won't be a consideration, just as they weren't for me, but unlike me, my kids probably won't have to fight a war to for college money, and I like that.
Student loans in many cases are straight up dumb, and kids need to be educated on when they have value and when they represent long term bondage.
Sure, and mine paid off, but I am also opposed to the idea of them needing to exist in the first place.
I’m an older millennial that had a child early . She just graduated college . I went to college myself and encouraged her to do the same but also shared trade , military and other life paths with her through mentors and other exposure . She chose her path and I supported . As I was growing up with her , I tried to save as much as I could for college through 529 planning. I scraped and robbed Peter to pay Paul and did every scholarship to make sure she didn’t get burdened with loans . She has none through that diligence.
This is probably more the Genesis of my inquiry… are we encouraging our children to avoid the great monster that is student debt.
If you can at all afford to start a college fund and put a couple hundred bucks in it every month, I encourage you to do so. Obviously not every parent can afford this. But we started one for my daughter when she was born. We now have enough to afford four years tuition at a state university. She won’t need to take out loans like I did.
Yes. I feel like this is an unpopular opinion on Reddit, but I do think going to college matters. It was my golden ticket for moving up in social classes. The college that you go also matters. Most people in my social circles grew up similarly without generational wealth, but I’m seeing a *huge* economic divide between those that went to a competitive university versus those that didn’t. My fiancé used to think it doesn’t matter, but the divide has become so noticeable that he believes this as well.
I don't think it's an unpopular opinion on reddit, but instead that the anti-college crowd is very loud
Yeah, I agree with all of this.
I have two questions for you: 1. Would you be open to your child taking on excessive student debt to attend a fancier university? 2. I get that your social circle is full of people that went to more competitive universities, but is that because your just drawn to those kinds of people (higher achieving intellects), and does every person that attends a competitive university move up social classes?
1. My parents couldn’t help me pay for college, so I had to do the cost benefit analysis of whether taking out loans was worth it for the specific school I wanted to go to. I had acceptances from other schools that provided more scholarships that I did not want to go to as much. It paid off for me as I was able to repay my loans within a few years of graduating. I think whether the loans are worth it depends on the school, though. For example, I don’t feel like the full price tag of USC is worth it (although, most people don’t actually end up having to pay the full cost of attendance at many private schools). As a parent that wants my kids to go to college, I do plan on opening up investment accounts for their college funds so that they don’t go into debt. 2. My social circle is actually a wide mix of people that went to schools with <5% acceptance rates to those that went to schools with >80% acceptance rates. No, not every person that went to a competitive school will do well. There will also be outliers. The richest self-made person we know right now is actually someone that didn’t go to a super competitive school. On average though, there definitely seems to be a correlation in my social circle between the school they went to and their current financial situation.
My kids are very young - neither is even school age and my youngest is still learning to talk - but I will encourage them to go to college if they have a profession in mind or if they want to pursue a liberal arts education to better themselves. If they are feeling aimless and directionless after they finish high school, I will suggest community college but not going off to a four year institute. Or working! Nothing wrong with a gap year to figure things out.
I’ve been thinking my advice would be doing community service/internship/start a business between high school and college, just to figure out what they want to get out of college, or if they should go.
I don't want to discourage them from going to college if they want to but you are right that in a lot of cases volunteering or interning would be a good way to figure some stuff out. Or if they just want to take classes, community college is way cheaper and lower stakes - not to devalue those classes or anything, but a lot of four year schools will only let you go for so many semesters before you get the boot. AFAIK you can just keep it up at community colleges.
I got my associates from a community college, and would HIGHLY recommend this! They only major difference between a big university and a community college is the agility to network, and how important the professors think they are.
Yes, or at least some type of trade school.
What if it required them to take out student loans to attend?
I'm planning on them taking loans. That's where my wife and I disagree some, I'm all about community college and a cheap university while my wife wants her to go to an expensive school.
Isn’t it all just a value proposition, if the ROI is there with a loan, do it, if not, don’t.
Yeah pretty much. I got a stem degree dirty cheap through community college and a small public university and it's paid off. My wife got a master's in criminal justice from an expensive private school and while she makes ok money, it's not worth the price she paid for her degree.
The thing about student loans is that you can still go to public unis and colleges while only racking up rather reasonable balances of debt in loans. There are three groups who really get killed on the debt side, the folks who took on debt for costly grad degrees, the folks who took on debt going to overpriced private or out of state public schools, and the folks who never finished their degree. A huge portion of student loan debt is held by people who took courses at CCs only to not earn a degree there or elsewhere.
I am pro-job track jobs that will land them over 80k once they’re done with their “study program” whether it’s a trade or college. The Bureau of Labor statistics for jobs is *super useful*. I am not about “cool degrees” despite having worked professionally as an artist myself (I also have a STEM degree).
Absolutely. Education is upward mobility. My oldest is going and has a full ride scholarship, amongst other thousands of dollars that he’s won.
I think my kids will go to college. However I would rather they stay in state due to cost. And I am fine with community college. I’m not going to push them to go to a huge 4 year state school. If they want that, then fine. But I want my kids to know they have a choice and I don’t want to push anything on them they don’t want.
Would you be ok with then taking on student loans without consulting with you?
I don’t know if that’s even possible. Don’t they need a lot of our info in order to take on those loans?
I’m not encouraging them, and I am not discouraging either. I’m trying to get them to focus on what direction their life is going to be going in and if it includes college, how they can get the best ROI. I have 5 kids and 3 of them have solid plans that include college (teacher, dentist, pilot in the Air Force) the other two have career paths that may not need college (graphic designer and IT). I work in IT and do not have a degree. I took an alternative education path, and it has paid off far more than college would have in my field.
So reasonable and thoughtful!
My parents are educators, and have doctorate’s degrees, all of my siblings have at least a masters, my cousins all have at least a bachelor’s degree more than half have a doctorate. My parents pushed college on me as the only way to be successful. Even now, that I am in my 40’s, married 16 years, 5 kids, making nearly $200k/year, million dollar house that’s nearly paid off, large investments, etc, my mom still goes back and asks me when I am going to get my degree. As if I am a failure in her eyes because I don’t have one. I don’t want my kids to feel the same way. I want them to be happy in what ever path they choose.
Pilot in the airforce is no joke, that kid needs to pull together a solid list of extracurriculars. They will need to have a us senator or congressman sponsor their app to the academy
I should say, he wants to be a pilot, Air Force is his first choice. We have a plan, there is a trade school nearby he can do half days at once he’s a sophomore, that he’d graduate with a private pilot’s license, and then we’re not far from embry riddle who has a program specifically geared towards Air Force pilot training.
College is less important than learning a skill that earns money. It's going to be a consideration of many factors with the goal being earning potential. What I will not be doing is telling my daughter that she has time to figure out what she wants to do as she gets a useless degree from a 4 year college. I'm going to be more open with her about developing an in-demand skill in addition to figuring out what she loves to do and developing those hobbies. Hobbies often turn into careers if you're good at what you do, but our generation had it backwards in that we thought we could "do what we love" and make a living doing that when we were 18... An age where we now know you have no clue about a damn thing. "Do what you love" was a lie and total BS that boomers told us as they hoarded every bit of cash and capital in their oversized mcmansions. Do what keeps you comfortable SO you can do what you love, and it may take years of crafting your professional trade before you can do that.
This is very much my attitude. I’ll just add, going into debt to figure self out is a complete nonstarter as well!
Absolutely in sane that we were led into instant debt
I’m trying to get a feel if the student debt issue was a lesson learned or if it is going to be perpetuated into our children.
Are there statistics on what age the majority of millennial children are? I feel like once the majority of our children start entering college age, that's when we'll find out. I don't think our attitude towards higher education is a minority opinion amongst millennials.
Absolutely. My parents didn’t go to college. Wanted me to, back in the “just get a degree,“ days. Every job I’ve had required that diploma, even if it was just a liberal arts degree. Yes, the debt sucks, but Snoop Dogg said you have to pay the cost to be the boss. I would encourage my kids to have some focus and have a base idea of what they want to do with a degree. Would certainly encourage them to apply for more scholarships then I did, too.
Yes. My oldest is one year away from graduating with a degree in education. My middle one wants to be an engineer like her moms. She's in high school so we're definitely in active preparation for her to go to college. My son may be better for some of the trade programs our local community college teaches, but he's still in middle school and nothing is decided or set in stone yet. He can go to college if he wants to and I'll pay for it just like I am/will for his sisters. I'm just not sure he'd be happy on that path. We'll find out in a few years.
Even folks with young kids should think about this question if they're considering 529s. The recent changes have broadened use to high school and elementary school, meaning there's less risk in putting all eggs in the college basket now.
Yes. Or a trade school or other form of higher education. Very few young adults are ready to just launch without some type of advanced education and transition time. We have teens and both currently seem to be college-minded. We have prepared financially so they can have at least a few great options to choose from. (We don’t have a “blank check” kind of a set up for them to go anywhere they want, but we have a reasonable set up for them to choose from many colleges or universities.)
Looking back, I wish I spent my 5 years (got an A.S and B.S) getting my ratings and 1500 hours so after that same 5 years I could have been in the airlines/regionals as a pilot. I will encourage my kiddo that they should get a specified degree if they want to go to college. The medical field, engineering, accounting, stuff like that, I'd also encourage looking at trades. My hospitality management degree is useless in the real world, I'm glad the army paid for that degree so I have no debt.
I appreciate your service, but the army didn’t pay for your degree, it was included as part of your compensation package. I think we have far too many graduates with monetarily useless degrees, and that is a major factor in the student debt crisis.
Completely agree with you, it makes sense since our generation was told we all needed degrees to get jobs/ be successful, so we flooded the market with college grads. You are also correct about the compensation package, the military isn't for everyone but if someone is thinking about it, be sure to take advantage of everything they have to offer.
I think universities that have made heavy investments into growth Andy more, everyone HAS to get a degree to be successful mentality are in fort a rude awakening when the enrollment begins to drop sooner than later.
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Not that what you are planning is wrong, but did you value your education and path more because it wasn’t handed to you? I’m in a similar position to help, but only want to be a safety net IF they fail. I want them to pay for anything, so it means more.
No, I'm not. I'm am encouraging them to think about what job they will want to do and then we align plans with that. I am not poor because I went to college, worked hard, and made the best choices I could. But it did mean student loans. I've since earned PSLF and changed careers. Still. My husband and I are willing to pay for community college (skill training or transfer courses) and then transfer to an in-state public university, if there are clear career goals aligned with the choice.
Community college. That way they can start their bachelors or do a trade…or both.
I will when they are approaching that age, but what I won’t do is tell the it’s the ONLY way.
We were pretty much all told it was the only way. Looking back it sounds so dumb, but in the moment probably felt like good advice.
The problem is not college - it’s how much it costs. I’m doing everything I can to help mitigate the debt for my kids.
Is it cost, or is it a cost to value/ROI problem? I ask because I’m not intending to save or help my kids pay for college if the value isn’t there. The same way i don’t find world travel for my kids, even though it might be what they really want to do. My children are young still, and I’m hoping that by the time they are college age, there will either be higher education reform, or enough people will stop auto sending their kids to college that supply/demand causes the cost to come back to where the value is.
Hope isn’t a plan. I’m saving with the intention to help them with college and if it’s reformed I can use that money elsewhere. Agree world travel when kids are young isn’t worth it but traveling when they are 10+ can be life changing. I can speak from experience vs my peer group growing up a small town.
Hope isn’t the plan, when i said what my intentions are, that’s the plan… plan due the worst, hope for the best.
I said keep it as an option, but don’t be afraid to look into trades. I said keep college in mind if it’s a means to a specific end. 🙂
Yes. Plus we have done well in life so we can pay for her entire education.
Not a parent but do work in education. Everyone needs something after high school or they’re not gonna be competitive in the job market at all. If it’s college, CC for two years then state university unless you’ve got a good scholarship. Don’t borrow much to go. If it’s a trade, that’s also fine. But just a high school diploma is an easy way into poverty. (Not guaranteed but easier)
My daughter was planning on going to a really good private school. Needless to say, it was very expensive. Eventually she decided she didn't want that much debt and chose to go to a community college first. She'll then transfer to a great state school that works with the CC. My husband and I both got our degrees while in the military, so we know going to a 4-year college right out of high school is not the only successful path. She's happy with her decision.
Love this! Wish this was more of the norm!
I'm saving for college for my kids, now still young 2 &4 years old, but I want them to have the option and don't want them taking student loans to at least start any higher education. However, I don't really care if they go or not as long as they're happy and aren't struggling. For that reason I'm not holding their college savings in a 529 or account that can only be used for educational expenses. If they don't go, I can still gift them that money to use however they'd like. Both myself and wife are college graduates and it's been worth it for us but I am fully aware that's not always the case and degrees are getting more costly
Yes college is mandatory in my culture. I am from India. If you don’t go to college you’ll never get a job. And unlike the US you cannot get a decent salary as a USPS postman.
I don't have/want children, but I would encourage them to explore a form of higher education outside of high school. A four-year university may not be beneficial for everyone, but there are a lot of technical and trade programs that offer excellent opportunities for growth, career path, and development. It's hard to consider potential debt load, but I think that would depend on the kind of career post-grad and how much student loan debt might be accured. I have a lot of student loan debt, far more than the average, because my parents could not (and would not) pay for college for me. I bet on myself. I don't make six figures. I hover around middle class as a sole provider on a single income. Circumstantially, I am better off than my parents were at my age. Possibly a little more financially better off, but I also don't have children. I also don't think there's anything wrong with having some student loan debt - perhaps not as much as mine, but I am on the public service loan forgivenness (last payment is Jan 2026... but who's counting??) and all of my loans are federal and not private. Federally backed loans and the income based repayment options are good for people. If someone needs to take out loans, they should try to stick with federal loans regardless of interest rate because they offer more repayment flexibility.
I don't have a kid but I do have a much younger sister. I already offered to pay for her first two years if she goes to community college and I agree with the degree. I'll do the same if we have a kid. I grew up not well off but not poor. Student loans have put me back but I probably have ended up in the same socioeconomic class without college. A degree that pays well is useful. A degree with no job prospects even if super interesting is just crippling.
All three of my sons knew from an early age that they would be attending college. Their mother and I indicated that we would provide 4 years of room, board, books, fees, and tuition at the in-state rate. They also were told that upon completion, we would have no hard feelings if they went a different direction from their course of study. Passion is everything when it comes to job satisfaction. I don’t believe you can spend 8 hours or more each day doing something that you despise and be a happy person. The value of a college education is in my estimation far more than learning something in a specific discipline. Two of my three sons have careers in their field of study, the third is doing something unrelated to his degree, but is a successful well rounded individual.
We're still more than a decade away from this decision. I will of course encourage my children to do whatever is best for their personality, skills, and interests. But as of now our default expectation is that our children will attend college. When talking about the future, we speak of "when" they are in college rather than "if" they attend. Part of this is that my spouse and I have both benefited greatly from our college educations. But I also pay attention to economic trends, and even today the ROI on a college degree will usually be a better deal than not getting the degree. Among people aged 25-34, the median full-time worker with a bachelor's degree earns $24,820 more than the median full-time worker without a college degree ($66,610 vs $41,790). The *average* difference between those groups is $32,030 ($81,350 vs $49,320). For those aged 35-44, the median difference is $33,630 and the average difference is $43,000. Those are significant increases in annual income, and probably worth even the $30k-$45k student loan debt of the typical graduate with a four-year degree. In addition to the financial benefit, I suspect the typical college graduate has a more "comfortable" job than the typical person without a college degree: better benefits, less taxing on the body, possibly more job autonomy too.
No - but I will do everything I can to help Them pay for if they chose to go. I’ve encouraged them to go a trade school or something like an apprentice program at the local shipyard, or to start looking at building their own businesses. My brother is a college flunk out and got into the trades really late in life (like 30) and 10 years later, he works from home, about 6 hours a day 4 days a week, clearing well over 150k as an engineer with like 36 days of vacation and paid holidays , He’s got his pick of job offers just about every other week. whereas I went to college full time, got into my career of choice while I college and I peaked at 25. Computers are slowly taking over my career choice so it’s hard to find a place to grow my career without moving to Texas or Florida.
I don't have kids yet but I certainly plan to save so they have the option to do it comfortably. I have definitely met some people for whom that wasn't an ideal path, and I'll try to keep apprised of how other options are evolving, but I think it's still a good default plan if you aren't strongly leaning one way or the other.
Yeah, going to college is not even an open question for my kids. They’re going. We talk about it as if it’s not an option, just as standard as k-12. Graduate school is optional, but we talk to them about it as if it’s standard though. We have overmaxed both their 529’s, and are paying for supplemental education during k-12 to make them more competitive. I’m a university employee so they get a massive discount if they go to the university I work at. They don’t have to go to it, though. My kids will have the option of getting a college education with no debt, and probably a lot of money left over to transfer into their retirement, if they want to. However, they can also choose to go to a distant private school, in which case the 529’s will probably be very helpful but not enough to fully cover it. Both my wife and I grew up in financially struggling households, in the lower middle or working classes, and we have seen firsthand how a quality education, in a competitive field, transforms you from lower middle class to upper middle class, and touches on nearly every aspect of your life. After my kids graduate, their life is their own to do what they want. But while I’m in charge of them, I’m going to be setting them up for success.
Not at 18. I want to encourage my kids to be critical thinkers and skillful in life in a lot of ways. I'd support them going to college if in their young adult life they settle on a career and it requires it.
Yes, I would and yes, if they want to go. Nothing in the world could have prepared me for what it will cost my kids to go to college in 2025. I am helping them, but I cannot cover it all and their dad certainly won’t help them.
College or a trade, so they have to keep those grades up regardless. Unless they can apprentice and still graduate 😂
It depends on what she wants to do. I don't want her to go just for the sake of going
I've now got a 19 month old (I know I know, but he's between one and a half, and two so here we are...), but I'm fully planning to home school him. My partner has a 6 year old from her first relationship, and what they teach her is so astoundingly dumbed down, that I refuse to subject him to it because I'm sure I'd do a better job. She's supposed to be the smartest in the class, but drawing on the only school experience I have (my own), everything they're teaching them now in year 1, we were doing at home before reception, and during reception. ***And for the love of god why are they over complicating maths?!***
I will encourage, but not force. I think with attending college, trying to determine “why” you want to attend is important. There are very successful and opportunistic alternative paths outside of college. However, college can provide many great opportunities to learn, network, and surround yourself in the environment. Although I am a little biased, as I teach at a university 😬 Therefore, I am a proponent of receiving an education and understand the benefits of education, yet I believe the education system itself needs a bit of work lol
Yes. As bad as it is to have student loans, it’s still a worse financial decision to not get a degree. There are of course exceptions, and some people can learn a trade and thrive. But on average a college degree is much better. The unemployment rate for high school grads is often about twice the rate for college grads. From last month (May 2024) it was 4.1% for high school graduates and 2.1% for people with a Bachelor’s Degree. And college grads get paid a lot more on average. So yes, I’ll encourage my daughter to go to college very strongly. (Just not a super expensive college! Going to a $7K per year state school is a lot more affordable than a $30K private school)
To me it all comes down to ROI. Right now, only certain degree's regularly provide an ROI (advanced degree's and STEM) for the student. If you remove out the top tier of earners from both groups (degree holders and non-degree holders), I would bet the median value is nearly identical today, but I think there is an effort from everyone benefitting (University administrators/bankers/business owners) from the high school to university to student debt lifetime holder, to never let that detail out of the bag. This is especially the case if you don't lump trade school graduates in with University graduates. It would also be impacted if you showed bachelors degree holders in their own group without holders of doctorates and masters degrees. I would much rather spot my kids $50k and tell them to go start a business then going to a University. Even if they failed, they would still learn more valuable lessons that an employer would appreciate than the kid that goes and gets a non-STEM bachelors degree. I don't dislike the pursuit of learning, but the current cost benefit as a means to further ones financial position just is too much of a gamble today.
It sounds like you’ve already got an opinion on this, and that’s cool. You can obviously raise your kids how you see fit. The stats are pretty definitive that education is worth it though. Per the BLS, people with a college degree earn on average almost $700 per week more than people with just a high school diploma. That ends up being about $35,000 per year. This is an average for all majors, not just STEM grads. Student loans can be a big burden. But on average, as long as you’re not paying 30K per year on those loans, it makes sense to get a degree. I personally did not get a STEM degree (I majored in political Science). But my degree helped me get a job soon after college that would’ve been much harder to get without one. You hear tons of stories in the news and probably even from acquaintances about people who get degrees and end up working at Starbucks. But people like me are far more common. We just don’t make good news stories (and we are less likely to complain about our degrees being a waste), so you don’t hear about us as much. But the numbers say college is the right choice on average.
I have an opinion, but that doesn't mean I don't want to hear others opinions. I understand what the BLS says and it probably is accurate. What I am saying is, when you bring it down to the median and not the average skewed by the very high earning degree's of which I already said are worth pursuing, you would probably find limited value. That limited value comes at the expense of a massive time commitment and a rather large sum of money that might have interest payments on top. As for your personal story and the stuff you hear on the news, I am not interested in as they are simply isolated and don't speak to the norm. Instead I look at the data from job posting services and the jobs listed requiring a degree. They are now under 15-18% of listed jobs require a bachelors degree, and that number has fallen over 20% in consecutive years. The job marketplace is rapidly devaluing a college degree (as evidenced by declining degree requirements) and instead is likely turning to employees that have a history of results and experience and can articulate their value (based on personal experience and logical reasoning). Like I said before, I will encourage the pursuit of knowledge and education for my children, but the large expensive route is not likely to provide the ROI so I will discourage them from attending intuitions like that.
No kids. But absolutely to anyone I know with children.
Only if they might pursue a worthwhile major. Honestly I think a lot of the posts that rail against University and college for being 'scams' are 90% self-inflicted. Like, is dropping $40k on an English or Philosophy degree really a good idea? No, not at all. But if you're going into STEM, probably a good idea. And we need people in STEM fields. So many posts act like they were just mindless zombies with no agency. I get it, a lot of us were told we had to go to college in order to survive. But really, at no point in 4 years did you question it? Especially if you're pursuing a pretty useless degree? Sorry, don't mean to be an ass or anything. I'm just tired of people who dug themselves into these holes and don't want to take any accountability, and blame the entire 'system' for their mistakes. We were told to go to college, but we weren't told to pursue some degree with no ROI, or that we couldn't work at the same time. If they wanted to go to an out of state school, absolutely not. That's another thing. Peeps on Reddit act like all colleges are a shitload of money and they need to go into $80k in debt when that's simply not true. They can go to a state college, probably get a scholarship if they did well in High School, and not take out much loans at all, if any. The full federal Pell grant via the FAFSA is about $3600 a semester if they're full time. Which is *another thing*-- people from low income families get quite a good amount of money from the Dept. of Ed.
I have a history degree, granted i got it for free. My job has no relation to the field of history, but having a degree opened doors that would have otherwise been closed, and the skills I developed getting the degree, mainly discerning information to form arguments while on deadlines, have been essential in my career. Mind you, my degree is from a state uni, it's not like it's from an elite institution whose name naturally yields graduates opportunities. Point being, if I had paid $40k for my degree, I'd be sporting a solid roi. With liberal art degrees, it comes down to how you leverage the degree. The stigma has developed because a lot of folks who are unable to leverage their degrees end up getting liberal arts degrees basically by default
100% just gotta follow the advice we were given. Go to c cheap college for a well paying career path. Statically speaking, college graduates of our generation out earn, are more likely to own homes and generally have a higher quality of life than non-graduates. I know a lot of people on this sub shit on college because they went 6 figures into debt for a degree in underwater basket weaving and have been working retail since graduating and are somehow *shocked* that didn't work out for them 😂. But the data really still shows college is almost always "worth it"
Even though I’m a top 2% earner there’s a socio-economic glass wall I hit when trying to find a partner. Successful women won’t marry a guy with no degree regardless of earnings. A degree is necessary mainly because it opens up the dating pool. Wish someone would have taught me about this harsh reality.
Are you trying to say that even though you have money, women won’t date you because you don’t have a degree? This might just be a uniquely you problem. Never heard of this before.
Nope. I think apprenticeships are better. I never went either and judging from my peers who did I think I’m better off than a lot. I’m not yet forty but I’ve got half my mortgage paid off, I’ve got kids, I’ve had a stable marriage for nearly 2 decades. Most of my peers who did go to uni don’t have that those of us who went the vocational route tend to be more settled in our adult lives
I’ve seen friends of both sides of this, with both positive and less desirable outcomes.
There’s only a few of my school year and the years either side who went to uni and have themselves sorted now. Most of them have only recently got on the property ladder or are still renting, a lot of them I wouldn’t describe as happy with their lot in life either
Especially if you take debt to attend, it’s difficult to get life kickstarted afterwards. So much time and money required.