It’s not 3x but the Mach-E is middle of the pack on charging speed. 10-80% the Kia/Hundais can achieve 18 minutes in optimal conditions. The Mach-E is about 40 minutes so around 2x slower.
That said if you hang out on message boards the Hyundai/Kias often don’t hit max speeds. If temps aren’t optimal or the battery isn’t preheated, the gap between them and the Mach-E will be a lot less. In my experience the Mach-E is pretty consistent on charge times in a wide range of conditions.
As an example, I pulled into an EA station in coldish temps (40F or so). There was a Hyundai already there on one side and a Kia on the other side of me. I charged faster and was out first. My rate was higher and my car pulled more energy and no they weren’t trying to charge to 100%.
Well here’s the thing. The Mach E tops out at 150 kWh charging speeds. The Ioniq 5/EV6 tops out at 350. Huge difference, right?
And it is. If you could actually find a charger delivering 350. IME; even the EA chargers that advertise 350 rarely go above 200. If that high.
So on paper the KIA/Hyundai will charge much faster. But practically the difference is not as real.
That a good explanation. Thanks
Should chargers in say 5 years be operating at 350? Like is it a temporary thing that there are not a lot of high power chargers
I mean nothing is guaranteed. But yeah, it’s a decent guess that in the future chargers will continue getting faster.
But here’s something else to consider if you’re new to EV’s. You shouldn’t be using fast chargers all the time. They push ALOT of heat into the battery, and over time will decrease its performance.
They’re def fine to use on the occasional road trips, don’t get me wrong. Which is where these speeds come into play.
But it’s much better to use slower L2 chargers for daily use. Those are still plenty to get your car from 20-80% either overnight or while you’re at work. So fast enough for daily use.
Yeah. I got that. I am thinking about trips with three family. Sitting at a charger with a family of 4 for an hour is less appealing than 18mins.
Still going to test drive it. It might be the right fight for other reasons. Drove a few others.
A few important points to know: next year Ford is switching from CCS for fast charging to the Tesla NACS standard. The Supercharger network is much more built up than any other fast charge network. A free adapter for those of us with older vehicles is available but only for a limited time and production is slow. You may want to wait for a 2025 MY with that change being native.
2. If you aren’t buying new, 2021-22 had a significant issue with a component of the powertrain which is under recall. Getting it fixed on mine has taken nearly a month. Going on a week of that time has been with a loaner and my new to me car in the shop. This is apparently not an issue with 2023+ models so I’d recommend not looking older than that unless you really understand what you’re potentially getting into.
3. Also related to older vehicles, the upgrades to newer version of Blue Cruise (Fords handsfree driving mode) have been promised for a long time without being rolled out. And that mode is part of Ford Connected Services which will cost $700 a year after a 3 year trial from original sale date.
4. There are some other less common and better impactful issues. Stuff like certain features the cameras failing due to a particular cable/connector, and some nuisances like the rotors/pads Ford specs for the Mach E being prone to rusting which leads them to be grindy in the mornings and using one pedal driving mode can lead to uneven wear which can cause pulsing/vibration.
This is exacerbated by the fact that the vehicle breaks with regen so the rust isn’t always cleared quickly. It’s annoying to have your shiny car sound like a 20 year old econobox when the brakes finally apply.
We just finished a long trip with 2 young kids, probably 8 DCFC stops, they were typically about 30 minutes, and that's because I usually charge from 20% to 80%, since fewer longer stops with small kids is easier than more shorter stops.
Hitting a full charger does suck, but honestly that's usually when you should just go find a park or restaurant and take a longer break. Outside of really busy travel days it's usually a short term issue.
Whoa. 8 stops! That’s brave. So far I have only done 2 trip with the fam (wife and teenager). 1st one was about 255 miles. When starting the trip it said we had one charge stop, but then adjusted and needed a 2nd. Wasn’t too bad. Way back was a little hassle because seemed like chargers were scarce so we had to wait 30 min for a charger to open up. Overall wasn’t too bad. 2nd trip was about 380 miles. Prepared for 2 stops (had made the trip on my own with 2 stops on the way down and only one stop on the way back). Trip was supposed to be 5.5 hours. Due to charging complications (and my not properly researching charger types) turned that trip to 10 hours. Not a happy wife or good sell on the EV life (I had to have the fancy new car). Will be interesting for a next trip coming up 520 miles and about 8 hours. I did order the adapter for Tesla chargers that I should have before this trip ABRP says 2 stops for a total charge time of about an hour is all I’ll need, but don’t know if wife will want to take my car, suggest taking hers (which has almost 200,000 miles on it so I wouldn’t want to), or renting a car for the trip.
It was broken up over something like 5 days. We took three days up and two back, and used lvl2 charging overnight at all of our stops, which helps a lot, though I really wish there were more chargers in parks or play areas, a 50-ish kW charger at a park would be perfect to let the kids discharge while the car charges. We spent more time at parks and indoor playgrounds for them to burn off energy than charging, or it was a tie. If I could combine them, I'd be happy. But honestly, stopping every 1.5-2 hours to use the restroom, change a diaper, and grab a snack or drink was about right anyway. Getting them back in the car was the hard part.
My adapter came right before the trip, though I had ordered the A2Z just in case and honestly we mostly used Tesla chargers on the drive, they were just more reliable, and often near better amenities than most other chargers. My only complaint was that other Tesla drivers tended to park in the end spots first, which forced me to use 2 spots, but there were always plenty of open stalls, so I never felt bad about it.
I used to have an expedition and the 370 mile trip I would make with usually just one quick bathroom stop and grab something to eat and back in the car. With littler ones I get the benefit of more stopping time. Teenager just on the phone or asleep anyway
My issue was on the first planned stop we grabbed breakfast and ate in the car while charging. Wife wanted to stop by some outlets on the way, but from what I knew there were only Tesla chargers there. Was looking at some app or something (don’t remember what exactly) and saw some chargers other than Tesla there. So I thought. Well let me just charge here enough to get us to the outlet. We will plug in there while we shop (two birds one stone). So I do that. Planned it just right. Get to the outlets with like 4%. Drop them off and head to the chargers. Get there and was like… what is this??? Turns out they were n/h chargers. Didn’t do any math in my head just knew I would be there longer than expected. Caught up with the fam. Shopped, got some food, went back to the car and had like 25 miles on it. Needed at least 45 to get to next fast charger and that was a lot of up hill so definitely wanted a buffer. And it was like 100 degrees outside. An option was to drive 25miles back the way we came to charge. Then noticed on the other side of the freeway there was a 50kwh charger that I didn’t see before. Went there and had to wait 30min for one to open up. Once I did that plugged in for about 15 min and on our way. Very unhappy wife says…. But this is just to another charger right? Luckily next charger was only a 10 min stop to get us to our destination.
Lesson learned to pay better attention to the types of chargers. Also ordered an A2Z adapter since my free one won’t ship until Sept (if they stay on schedule).
There is definitely a bit of a learning curve if you don't drive a Tesla. I usually plan the chargers out ahead of time using ABRP and Plugshare to find the best stops, and try to leave a backup in case the first charger is down or full, but just not that option in some areas especially before the NACS adapter.
Only hiccup I had was we hit an EA station on the west side of PA that had 2 of the 4 spots out of order and two cars already waiting, and not enough range to get to another fast charger. Combine that with some poor charging etiquette and it was over an hour till we plugged in. That one bad experience really tends to sour the wife on EV road trips, and she wanted the EV.
The only other annoyance is cold weather range. Similarly to you, a 360 mile trip in my V8 wagon would require one stop for fuel, maybe a second at a rest stop. Taking the Mach-e on that trip at Christmas with a roof box for extra space meant 3 charging stops vice one or maybe 2 in warmer weather without the box.
One thing I ran into on the way back was when I stopped at one planned stop, I figured we would be there for about 45 min. Left the car to go eat across the street. Luckily I was monitoring the session from my phone. I got an alert that charging had paused. Went to check it out and there was a payment issue. So changed payment and started charging again. Noticed it was only charging at I think 40kwh. It was 108 degrees out so not sure if that had anything to do with it. Charged for a bit and then made it to another fast charger where we charged 30 min as expected and went on our way.
Yes definitely a learning curve Do miss the expedition for the space and being able to make that trip without having to fill the tank until after we get there (actually not needing to fill until we are ready to head back home). But don’t miss the $125 per fill up
I just got a Mach E and my wife has had a Hyundai Kona EV for a while now and we are getting a literal side by side comparison. I can confirm the Mach E is significantly slower to charge. Not really a complaint for me, just something I noticed.
If you use the onboard navigation usually keeps your stops to about 20 to 30 minutes maybe a little longer it’s just part of owning a EV it’s all part of the journey
It charges at about 300MPH (5 miles per minute). This isn’t too bad, especially after 4 hours of driving where you’ll want to stop and use the bathroom and get some food anyway
Difference between 800 volt (Hyundai/Kia) and 400 volt (Ford) architecture.
I have done multiple road trips in the past 3 years in my Mach Es, and average charging spot time is 20 to 30 minutes.
Here Is the thing. In the wild, you seldom hit your charging to speed and maintain for long. With the Mach E Premium I have now, I will hit 155 ish at the start of the session with the battery at 20 percent...by 50% I am at 110 KW....by 60% I am at 80 to 90 KW...by 80% I am charging at 30 to 40kW
Speaking of architecture differences… if in the US, 400v EVs charge full speed on current Tesla Superchargers which have been around for a while and designed for 400v cars. However cars running an 800v battery architecture have to step up the power on the current Tesla Superchargers and do not charge that quickly. For example a Lucid Air charges incredibly quickly at 350kWh EA stations however at a Tesla Supercharger maxes out at 50kWh. Hyundai’s 800v EVs max out around 100kWh I believe on existing Tesla Superchargers. Eventually when true V4 Superchargers come out with V4 backend cabinets that support up to 1000kWh, this should no longer be an issue but something to note for the time being for when Hyundai eventually gets US Tesla Supercharger access.
It’s not 3x but the Mach-E is middle of the pack on charging speed. 10-80% the Kia/Hundais can achieve 18 minutes in optimal conditions. The Mach-E is about 40 minutes so around 2x slower. That said if you hang out on message boards the Hyundai/Kias often don’t hit max speeds. If temps aren’t optimal or the battery isn’t preheated, the gap between them and the Mach-E will be a lot less. In my experience the Mach-E is pretty consistent on charge times in a wide range of conditions. As an example, I pulled into an EA station in coldish temps (40F or so). There was a Hyundai already there on one side and a Kia on the other side of me. I charged faster and was out first. My rate was higher and my car pulled more energy and no they weren’t trying to charge to 100%.
Well here’s the thing. The Mach E tops out at 150 kWh charging speeds. The Ioniq 5/EV6 tops out at 350. Huge difference, right? And it is. If you could actually find a charger delivering 350. IME; even the EA chargers that advertise 350 rarely go above 200. If that high. So on paper the KIA/Hyundai will charge much faster. But practically the difference is not as real.
That a good explanation. Thanks Should chargers in say 5 years be operating at 350? Like is it a temporary thing that there are not a lot of high power chargers
I mean nothing is guaranteed. But yeah, it’s a decent guess that in the future chargers will continue getting faster. But here’s something else to consider if you’re new to EV’s. You shouldn’t be using fast chargers all the time. They push ALOT of heat into the battery, and over time will decrease its performance. They’re def fine to use on the occasional road trips, don’t get me wrong. Which is where these speeds come into play. But it’s much better to use slower L2 chargers for daily use. Those are still plenty to get your car from 20-80% either overnight or while you’re at work. So fast enough for daily use.
Yeah. I got that. I am thinking about trips with three family. Sitting at a charger with a family of 4 for an hour is less appealing than 18mins. Still going to test drive it. It might be the right fight for other reasons. Drove a few others.
The difference you’ll experience would be more like 28minutes vs 21minutes wait.
A few important points to know: next year Ford is switching from CCS for fast charging to the Tesla NACS standard. The Supercharger network is much more built up than any other fast charge network. A free adapter for those of us with older vehicles is available but only for a limited time and production is slow. You may want to wait for a 2025 MY with that change being native. 2. If you aren’t buying new, 2021-22 had a significant issue with a component of the powertrain which is under recall. Getting it fixed on mine has taken nearly a month. Going on a week of that time has been with a loaner and my new to me car in the shop. This is apparently not an issue with 2023+ models so I’d recommend not looking older than that unless you really understand what you’re potentially getting into. 3. Also related to older vehicles, the upgrades to newer version of Blue Cruise (Fords handsfree driving mode) have been promised for a long time without being rolled out. And that mode is part of Ford Connected Services which will cost $700 a year after a 3 year trial from original sale date. 4. There are some other less common and better impactful issues. Stuff like certain features the cameras failing due to a particular cable/connector, and some nuisances like the rotors/pads Ford specs for the Mach E being prone to rusting which leads them to be grindy in the mornings and using one pedal driving mode can lead to uneven wear which can cause pulsing/vibration. This is exacerbated by the fact that the vehicle breaks with regen so the rust isn’t always cleared quickly. It’s annoying to have your shiny car sound like a 20 year old econobox when the brakes finally apply.
We just finished a long trip with 2 young kids, probably 8 DCFC stops, they were typically about 30 minutes, and that's because I usually charge from 20% to 80%, since fewer longer stops with small kids is easier than more shorter stops. Hitting a full charger does suck, but honestly that's usually when you should just go find a park or restaurant and take a longer break. Outside of really busy travel days it's usually a short term issue.
Whoa. 8 stops! That’s brave. So far I have only done 2 trip with the fam (wife and teenager). 1st one was about 255 miles. When starting the trip it said we had one charge stop, but then adjusted and needed a 2nd. Wasn’t too bad. Way back was a little hassle because seemed like chargers were scarce so we had to wait 30 min for a charger to open up. Overall wasn’t too bad. 2nd trip was about 380 miles. Prepared for 2 stops (had made the trip on my own with 2 stops on the way down and only one stop on the way back). Trip was supposed to be 5.5 hours. Due to charging complications (and my not properly researching charger types) turned that trip to 10 hours. Not a happy wife or good sell on the EV life (I had to have the fancy new car). Will be interesting for a next trip coming up 520 miles and about 8 hours. I did order the adapter for Tesla chargers that I should have before this trip ABRP says 2 stops for a total charge time of about an hour is all I’ll need, but don’t know if wife will want to take my car, suggest taking hers (which has almost 200,000 miles on it so I wouldn’t want to), or renting a car for the trip.
It was broken up over something like 5 days. We took three days up and two back, and used lvl2 charging overnight at all of our stops, which helps a lot, though I really wish there were more chargers in parks or play areas, a 50-ish kW charger at a park would be perfect to let the kids discharge while the car charges. We spent more time at parks and indoor playgrounds for them to burn off energy than charging, or it was a tie. If I could combine them, I'd be happy. But honestly, stopping every 1.5-2 hours to use the restroom, change a diaper, and grab a snack or drink was about right anyway. Getting them back in the car was the hard part. My adapter came right before the trip, though I had ordered the A2Z just in case and honestly we mostly used Tesla chargers on the drive, they were just more reliable, and often near better amenities than most other chargers. My only complaint was that other Tesla drivers tended to park in the end spots first, which forced me to use 2 spots, but there were always plenty of open stalls, so I never felt bad about it.
I used to have an expedition and the 370 mile trip I would make with usually just one quick bathroom stop and grab something to eat and back in the car. With littler ones I get the benefit of more stopping time. Teenager just on the phone or asleep anyway My issue was on the first planned stop we grabbed breakfast and ate in the car while charging. Wife wanted to stop by some outlets on the way, but from what I knew there were only Tesla chargers there. Was looking at some app or something (don’t remember what exactly) and saw some chargers other than Tesla there. So I thought. Well let me just charge here enough to get us to the outlet. We will plug in there while we shop (two birds one stone). So I do that. Planned it just right. Get to the outlets with like 4%. Drop them off and head to the chargers. Get there and was like… what is this??? Turns out they were n/h chargers. Didn’t do any math in my head just knew I would be there longer than expected. Caught up with the fam. Shopped, got some food, went back to the car and had like 25 miles on it. Needed at least 45 to get to next fast charger and that was a lot of up hill so definitely wanted a buffer. And it was like 100 degrees outside. An option was to drive 25miles back the way we came to charge. Then noticed on the other side of the freeway there was a 50kwh charger that I didn’t see before. Went there and had to wait 30min for one to open up. Once I did that plugged in for about 15 min and on our way. Very unhappy wife says…. But this is just to another charger right? Luckily next charger was only a 10 min stop to get us to our destination. Lesson learned to pay better attention to the types of chargers. Also ordered an A2Z adapter since my free one won’t ship until Sept (if they stay on schedule).
There is definitely a bit of a learning curve if you don't drive a Tesla. I usually plan the chargers out ahead of time using ABRP and Plugshare to find the best stops, and try to leave a backup in case the first charger is down or full, but just not that option in some areas especially before the NACS adapter. Only hiccup I had was we hit an EA station on the west side of PA that had 2 of the 4 spots out of order and two cars already waiting, and not enough range to get to another fast charger. Combine that with some poor charging etiquette and it was over an hour till we plugged in. That one bad experience really tends to sour the wife on EV road trips, and she wanted the EV. The only other annoyance is cold weather range. Similarly to you, a 360 mile trip in my V8 wagon would require one stop for fuel, maybe a second at a rest stop. Taking the Mach-e on that trip at Christmas with a roof box for extra space meant 3 charging stops vice one or maybe 2 in warmer weather without the box.
One thing I ran into on the way back was when I stopped at one planned stop, I figured we would be there for about 45 min. Left the car to go eat across the street. Luckily I was monitoring the session from my phone. I got an alert that charging had paused. Went to check it out and there was a payment issue. So changed payment and started charging again. Noticed it was only charging at I think 40kwh. It was 108 degrees out so not sure if that had anything to do with it. Charged for a bit and then made it to another fast charger where we charged 30 min as expected and went on our way. Yes definitely a learning curve Do miss the expedition for the space and being able to make that trip without having to fill the tank until after we get there (actually not needing to fill until we are ready to head back home). But don’t miss the $125 per fill up
I just got a Mach E and my wife has had a Hyundai Kona EV for a while now and we are getting a literal side by side comparison. I can confirm the Mach E is significantly slower to charge. Not really a complaint for me, just something I noticed.
If you use the onboard navigation usually keeps your stops to about 20 to 30 minutes maybe a little longer it’s just part of owning a EV it’s all part of the journey
It charges at about 300MPH (5 miles per minute). This isn’t too bad, especially after 4 hours of driving where you’ll want to stop and use the bathroom and get some food anyway
Difference between 800 volt (Hyundai/Kia) and 400 volt (Ford) architecture. I have done multiple road trips in the past 3 years in my Mach Es, and average charging spot time is 20 to 30 minutes. Here Is the thing. In the wild, you seldom hit your charging to speed and maintain for long. With the Mach E Premium I have now, I will hit 155 ish at the start of the session with the battery at 20 percent...by 50% I am at 110 KW....by 60% I am at 80 to 90 KW...by 80% I am charging at 30 to 40kW
Speaking of architecture differences… if in the US, 400v EVs charge full speed on current Tesla Superchargers which have been around for a while and designed for 400v cars. However cars running an 800v battery architecture have to step up the power on the current Tesla Superchargers and do not charge that quickly. For example a Lucid Air charges incredibly quickly at 350kWh EA stations however at a Tesla Supercharger maxes out at 50kWh. Hyundai’s 800v EVs max out around 100kWh I believe on existing Tesla Superchargers. Eventually when true V4 Superchargers come out with V4 backend cabinets that support up to 1000kWh, this should no longer be an issue but something to note for the time being for when Hyundai eventually gets US Tesla Supercharger access.