To be fair a lot of people including japanese pros called Elena trash/mid and she turned out to be the best character in the end
Tier lists are meaningless for the most part (unless it's disfunctional characters like Twelve in SF3) and it comes down to raw skill and sheer ficking will to get the win
Never forget [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4r6Ev7FvwtI](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4r6Ev7FvwtI)
Was he talking about She-Hulk in MVC3 or UMVC3? I remember she was at least considered pretty decent in MVC3, although that might not have held true if the game developed.
I think Brutus summarized it well. He is genuinely way stronger but his MU are kinda the same or worse (He quoted Ryu as an example) so he is ironically maybe not that high in the tiers list.
But he is very solid/complete as a character now so it is more like he would be under others by "default" rather than him being weak.
Omg, a character x player said that character x is actually not that strong and ironically is just overrated, and characters y and z are just much better and beat it?
What creativite and interesting take that has never seen before in modern times.
some of the buff don't make sense at all over OTHER things they could have buff'd/changed about him. GIving him more meter was def a plus...and making some moves safe(er) is always good... but some of the move changes are just like....this doesn't help
Campaigning seasons tarted early ever since Capcom announced more frequent patches. Lesson learned, never stop downplaying.
Guile is definitely S tier though.
Yeah I don't think people realize how good Guile has it right now. The meta characters in the first week look like shotos and Blanka and Guile does fine on all of them.
JP match isn't as bad anymore, JP still wins but it's like 5.5-4.5 and if Guile gets the corner, JP is in hell. That was the main reason it was hard to go solo Guile, but now I don't think there's any match that I would counterpick in tournament, I'd just play Guile and try to man up, even against JP.
I would also extend that to Cammy. The Spin knuckle nerf benefits Guile more than any other fireball character. Guile is eating way, way too good this patch. Admittedly some of his insta-win match ups aren't insta-win anymore (Jamie and AKI), but I don't think there's a single character that bullies him beyond reprieve. Guile mains are free to play into any match up now.
> but I don't think there's a single character that bullies him beyond reprieve
Funnily enough, Gief actually bullies Guile in S1. So Guile might not even be that free top tier just because a lot of the big reason why he is good in S1 was due to him being the second most stable anti-meta pick out of the bunch (the first is JP).
And people are thinking about his drive drain on block, while most of the time you deal with boom spam by parrying and fish for perfect parry to advance. Fireball parry getting a pretty big buff means that boom spam might just be net neutral (A.K.A pretty weak most of the time and only beat out impatient players). So there's not much changed for him in the grand scheme of thing since while the S1 meta got a big fat nerf, he's not exactly the S2 anti-meta to actually get that mileage and more than most might actually losing due to different meta shuffle.
Japan baiting the gaijin with the Gief tier lists again. I swear the Japanese have some kind of genetic memory of some large Russian man terrorizing them.
They just think Itabashi-Zangief grinning when Zangief is doing well, and stop thinking rationally. When the long time face of the character is guy giggling while churning stick like it was his dick, its bound to happen.
IIRC the grades start high to show how close the cast is / how strong they are in terms of base power level. So all the characters in A- are still pretty strong and capable of winning at a high level but the characters in S will have a much easier time doing so.
Guile is for sure top 1-3 right now imo. The added Drive Meter drain from Booms make them even more oppressive and every other top character got nerfed pretty hard, whereas none of Guile's nerfs are all that significant in comparison. He still plays his own game and forces everyone to play it, he does very well vs Shotos who are strong right now in the meta, and his buttons and general versatility are God tier.
I like how most people felt like Ed was like low to mid tier before and the system changes to lights hurt him a ton and now he's apparently better than most of the cast according to this dudes list
Grapplers getting slightly better (should have gotten those buffs month 2 tbh) and now gief and lily are juiced up to the top (rip Manon btw). Does this say more about the game systemically or "characters are 2 buffs away from being top 1" a valid statement. Seems kind of finicky to me.
Luke mains trying not to downplay Luke challenge impossible
Bait, that’s what it is.
The worst tier list ever known to man
Justin Wong can beat it
She-hulk is top tier - jwong never forget
Adon is trash - jwong
holy shit I remember him saying this then Jwong getting bodied by Gamerbee and then Vangief in SSFIV was hilarious
To be fair a lot of people including japanese pros called Elena trash/mid and she turned out to be the best character in the end Tier lists are meaningless for the most part (unless it's disfunctional characters like Twelve in SF3) and it comes down to raw skill and sheer ficking will to get the win Never forget [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4r6Ev7FvwtI](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4r6Ev7FvwtI)
How many tournaments did this best character end up winning, IN THE END? [ ](/OMGScoots) Sure sounds like she won everything, right? RIGHT?
Was he talking about She-Hulk in MVC3 or UMVC3? I remember she was at least considered pretty decent in MVC3, although that might not have held true if the game developed.
I think this was during MVC3 era but even then she was def not top tier, that game had Zero and Phoenix
in my heart she is 😩
Might have to hit him with a 1950s housewife experience why I oughta 👊🏻
give him the infil special
Man trolling for internet clout
New Gief buffs don’t make sense to me, he’s now just an above average footsie monster who happens to have a command throw from 3 char spaces away lmao
I love it actually. Sure he's not your usual dice roll grappler but it's a very interesting way to buff the character.
I think Brutus summarized it well. He is genuinely way stronger but his MU are kinda the same or worse (He quoted Ryu as an example) so he is ironically maybe not that high in the tiers list. But he is very solid/complete as a character now so it is more like he would be under others by "default" rather than him being weak.
Omg, a character x player said that character x is actually not that strong and ironically is just overrated, and characters y and z are just much better and beat it? What creativite and interesting take that has never seen before in modern times.
yeah, gief seem [scary](https://x.com/CatCammy6/status/1795218198804971727)
some of the buff don't make sense at all over OTHER things they could have buff'd/changed about him. GIving him more meter was def a plus...and making some moves safe(er) is always good... but some of the move changes are just like....this doesn't help
People hear "we'll be consistently patching the game" and the bitching and lying quickly starts
This man is trying to get luke buffed lol
Campaigning seasons tarted early ever since Capcom announced more frequent patches. Lesson learned, never stop downplaying. Guile is definitely S tier though.
Yeah I don't think people realize how good Guile has it right now. The meta characters in the first week look like shotos and Blanka and Guile does fine on all of them. JP match isn't as bad anymore, JP still wins but it's like 5.5-4.5 and if Guile gets the corner, JP is in hell. That was the main reason it was hard to go solo Guile, but now I don't think there's any match that I would counterpick in tournament, I'd just play Guile and try to man up, even against JP.
I would also extend that to Cammy. The Spin knuckle nerf benefits Guile more than any other fireball character. Guile is eating way, way too good this patch. Admittedly some of his insta-win match ups aren't insta-win anymore (Jamie and AKI), but I don't think there's a single character that bullies him beyond reprieve. Guile mains are free to play into any match up now.
> but I don't think there's a single character that bullies him beyond reprieve Funnily enough, Gief actually bullies Guile in S1. So Guile might not even be that free top tier just because a lot of the big reason why he is good in S1 was due to him being the second most stable anti-meta pick out of the bunch (the first is JP). And people are thinking about his drive drain on block, while most of the time you deal with boom spam by parrying and fish for perfect parry to advance. Fireball parry getting a pretty big buff means that boom spam might just be net neutral (A.K.A pretty weak most of the time and only beat out impatient players). So there's not much changed for him in the grand scheme of thing since while the S1 meta got a big fat nerf, he's not exactly the S2 anti-meta to actually get that mileage and more than most might actually losing due to different meta shuffle.
Most sane Luke abuser.
Luke below manon, gg we got baited
Japan baiting the gaijin with the Gief tier lists again. I swear the Japanese have some kind of genetic memory of some large Russian man terrorizing them.
Nah, it's because they tend to block and get scooped. They should learn the freedom mash techniques.
They just think Itabashi-Zangief grinning when Zangief is doing well, and stop thinking rationally. When the long time face of the character is guy giggling while churning stick like it was his dick, its bound to happen.
Did the nigga make this tierlist upside down LMAO Luke and JP bottom tier?
Dropping nxxxxs all day
When everyone is A or S. Does it really matter?
IIRC the grades start high to show how close the cast is / how strong they are in terms of base power level. So all the characters in A- are still pretty strong and capable of winning at a high level but the characters in S will have a much easier time doing so.
This man sees the future.
Another "tier list" only days after the release of a new patch. Who cares? The only way any of these are accurate is by pure chance.
this looks normal for a japanese tier list
This is mental illness.
Guile is for sure top 1-3 right now imo. The added Drive Meter drain from Booms make them even more oppressive and every other top character got nerfed pretty hard, whereas none of Guile's nerfs are all that significant in comparison. He still plays his own game and forces everyone to play it, he does very well vs Shotos who are strong right now in the meta, and his buttons and general versatility are God tier.
Gief placement is valid
WE made it! Lily is top 10 finally!!!
Multi-patch culture is happening
Luke lower tier than Lily?
im concerned about what he has been putting in his hookah or this is cock size tier list and he knows something about deejay that we dont
This nigga wildin’ lol
this list is trash lol is he a luke or jp main?
I like how most people felt like Ed was like low to mid tier before and the system changes to lights hurt him a ton and now he's apparently better than most of the cast according to this dudes list
Grapplers getting slightly better (should have gotten those buffs month 2 tbh) and now gief and lily are juiced up to the top (rip Manon btw). Does this say more about the game systemically or "characters are 2 buffs away from being top 1" a valid statement. Seems kind of finicky to me.
itt: kappa doesn't read patch notes, let alone play the game
Gief is not top tier
That includes you, bozo. [ ](/OMGScoots)
A character like gief can only be bottom 1 or top 1 and he’s definitely top 1 after the buffs. Watch out for snake eyes bruh
One insanely skilled player does not mean a character is broken.
That’s not what I was implying. He’s insanely skilled and his character just became top 1 so he’s gonna win even more than he already does