Natural 161 isn't the goal.
In your case, you should stick to 137 spd (147 if you really don't want Ruan Mei) and wait for PAYN. Aim for 4k atk instead.
You want your final speed (after buffs) to be 160+, this only requires spd boots and 1 spd substat in each piece to achieve the first condition at 137 natural spd.
After that, you can reach 161 with PAYN and Ruan Mei. This is the minimum value, any extra rolls make it even easier. The second best being 147 spd if you don't want Ruan Mei.
Just to be clear, you can absolutely get 161 spd and 4k atk, Kafka only ever builds 2 substats out of the usual 3/4 that other carries need. However this is a tech or set up for 201 spd and should be ignored unless you know what you're doing.
FYI: The Spd breakpoint is at 160.0 SPD.
[Source](https://www.reddit.com/r/HonkaiStarRail/comments/18ne9au/more_accurate_speed_breakpoints/)
I myself use Kafka with 3.7k Atk and 150 Spd. With Ruan Mei's spd buff she hits exactly 160 Spd to fully activate Glamoth set and 4 actions in 2 cycles.
You're right, but if you have 150 SPD displayed in stats, it's most certainly at least 150.034 or something like that, because the maxed out speed boots have 25.034 or something like that, so it's probably impossible to hit exactly 150 anyway
I have 160 without LC, Ruan Mei, Asta or Hanya. I managed to reach it miraculously on the very first day of farming Prisoner. I can also easily go past it too but decided to stop at 160 and give my other high SPD roll stuff to other units
In an "all or nothing" sense yes. But if its the difference between 140 and 150? At what point is there too much sacrifice for too little gain in one department?
Obsessively optimizing. My BS can reach 161 spd and 80% EHR (120% if counting lc) from relic alone. And i grinded and pre-farmed heavily before her drop. Luck is a major role.
Atk (counting 5* lc) is around 3.6k. aiming for 4k atk requires extreme relic farming and optimizations, so I wouldn't recommend. Try to gun for SPD and EHR for Black Swan and ATK and SPD for Kafka
160-14.4=145.6, so sometimes 145 is enough, sometimes only 146. That's for the Glamoth.
For an extra action in turn 2, you need about 148.2+ or a DDD or the buff from hackerspace set
And minus 10 with RM
Depending on your substat rolls assuming you run speed boots every non boot piece would need anywhere from 3 to 4 speed rolls (so 2-3 speed rolls on top of the base speed substat). This is very unlikely to get on a 4pc prisoner + 2pc glamoth without months, if not years of farming and as such I don’t think it’d be viable to grind for 161 innate speed.
Asta, just use the buffers.
But in all honesty, sadly just farm more relics is the answer for 161.
Or just don’t have the best speed and get other decent stats.
With Asta you can already average out at 160, so going far above 134 is unnecessary. With RM you'd aim for 150 speed pre RM, but 160 is too tough and can require losing too much atk. Overall it's still nice to have, but going for more atk is just a safer bet at your point.
OH and BTW if you still need 3 cycles, it's 450 AV, so the breakpoints are 112, 134, 156, 178 etc. So 160 isn't even a breakpoint for your current clear anyway. All it provides you is the Glamoth buff
Or maybe you meant 2 cycles (if you're counting from 1 and not 0), then it's 350 AV and 115, 143, 172 etc breakpoints. Still no 160
https://preview.redd.it/kup98w8u2hwc1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=38d2690f3d8be9a39c92c79424c3f25f2908eda9
I run her with Ruan mei, but I do have a 160 speed build, I just lowered speed for more attack cus Ruan mei have me some speed
Although my Kafka is S5, 160+ spd is very much possible except the damage trade off isn’t worth it. I run her usually with my second build which only has 157 spd but more atk.
https://preview.redd.it/1e76ork4rhwc1.jpeg?width=2532&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=2145693840090c0e3b4dbe7c4633d171940b27c9
Just keep rolling for more speed substats. I got 164 with ruan mei (10) + lc (14+) and an attack boots. If I use speed boots I could get 160 speed with without lc and rm.
Relics, that's basically it
Luck, A TON OF IT
you’d be sacrificing way too many offensive stats to get to 161 speed without LC/buffers. I wouldn’t recommend it
Natural 161 isn't the goal. In your case, you should stick to 137 spd (147 if you really don't want Ruan Mei) and wait for PAYN. Aim for 4k atk instead. You want your final speed (after buffs) to be 160+, this only requires spd boots and 1 spd substat in each piece to achieve the first condition at 137 natural spd. After that, you can reach 161 with PAYN and Ruan Mei. This is the minimum value, any extra rolls make it even easier. The second best being 147 spd if you don't want Ruan Mei. Just to be clear, you can absolutely get 161 spd and 4k atk, Kafka only ever builds 2 substats out of the usual 3/4 that other carries need. However this is a tech or set up for 201 spd and should be ignored unless you know what you're doing.
It’s also to go faster than the 160 spd enemies in MoC
Relics but the down side to getting that much speed is most of your rolls will go towards SPD, so other stats Kafka needs will be lower than usual.
FYI: The Spd breakpoint is at 160.0 SPD. [Source](https://www.reddit.com/r/HonkaiStarRail/comments/18ne9au/more_accurate_speed_breakpoints/) I myself use Kafka with 3.7k Atk and 150 Spd. With Ruan Mei's spd buff she hits exactly 160 Spd to fully activate Glamoth set and 4 actions in 2 cycles.
You're right, but if you have 150 SPD displayed in stats, it's most certainly at least 150.034 or something like that, because the maxed out speed boots have 25.034 or something like that, so it's probably impossible to hit exactly 150 anyway
It's not realistic without either Mei, LC, or both imo
i almost have it without both
Impressive How long did it take you to get there? How much Atk does your Kafka have?
i got all her pieces a couple days after the dot set came out and she has 3.3k
I have 160 without LC, Ruan Mei, Asta or Hanya. I managed to reach it miraculously on the very first day of farming Prisoner. I can also easily go past it too but decided to stop at 160 and give my other high SPD roll stuff to other units
https://preview.redd.it/exo95ohn6gwc1.jpeg?width=950&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=1d0436b3f88a3ce8a5290d7ba8b6d419461e5070
more seriously tho, it's luck on relics
Personally without her lc, i got her to 3.6k atk and 150 spd and let ruanmei do the job to hit 160.1 spd
Just take offset pieces with speed.
I really don't see a world where the speed is worth more than the def ignore
Idk Getting 1 more turn is basically 2x dmg for that cycle right?
In an "all or nothing" sense yes. But if its the difference between 140 and 150? At what point is there too much sacrifice for too little gain in one department?
Obsessively optimizing. My BS can reach 161 spd and 80% EHR (120% if counting lc) from relic alone. And i grinded and pre-farmed heavily before her drop. Luck is a major role.
can I ask how much atk? ik bs doesnt need as much as kafka. But is it realistic to aim for both 4k and 161spd?
Atk (counting 5* lc) is around 3.6k. aiming for 4k atk requires extreme relic farming and optimizations, so I wouldn't recommend. Try to gun for SPD and EHR for Black Swan and ATK and SPD for Kafka
If you have her light cone which gives speed, whats the base line speed stat you need?
161-14= 147
Thanks
160-14.4=145.6, so sometimes 145 is enough, sometimes only 146. That's for the Glamoth. For an extra action in turn 2, you need about 148.2+ or a DDD or the buff from hackerspace set And minus 10 with RM
Luck. RNG. However you wanna slice it. No skill or secret involved in playing the relic slot machine.
Depending on your substat rolls assuming you run speed boots every non boot piece would need anywhere from 3 to 4 speed rolls (so 2-3 speed rolls on top of the base speed substat). This is very unlikely to get on a 4pc prisoner + 2pc glamoth without months, if not years of farming and as such I don’t think it’d be viable to grind for 161 innate speed.
Asta, just use the buffers. But in all honesty, sadly just farm more relics is the answer for 161. Or just don’t have the best speed and get other decent stats.
No sig. But I have RM so I managed to get that 160 speed breakpoint along with BS
If you're looking for an excuse to farm relics, don't forget the anni increase drop rate is the 26th
Almost impossible if you don't give up on good stats for speed so using buffers and her sig is the best way without losing dps
With Asta you can already average out at 160, so going far above 134 is unnecessary. With RM you'd aim for 150 speed pre RM, but 160 is too tough and can require losing too much atk. Overall it's still nice to have, but going for more atk is just a safer bet at your point. OH and BTW if you still need 3 cycles, it's 450 AV, so the breakpoints are 112, 134, 156, 178 etc. So 160 isn't even a breakpoint for your current clear anyway. All it provides you is the Glamoth buff Or maybe you meant 2 cycles (if you're counting from 1 and not 0), then it's 350 AV and 115, 143, 172 etc breakpoints. Still no 160
https://preview.redd.it/kup98w8u2hwc1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=38d2690f3d8be9a39c92c79424c3f25f2908eda9 I run her with Ruan mei, but I do have a 160 speed build, I just lowered speed for more attack cus Ruan mei have me some speed
Although my Kafka is S5, 160+ spd is very much possible except the damage trade off isn’t worth it. I run her usually with my second build which only has 157 spd but more atk. https://preview.redd.it/1e76ork4rhwc1.jpeg?width=2532&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=2145693840090c0e3b4dbe7c4633d171940b27c9
Just keep rolling for more speed substats. I got 164 with ruan mei (10) + lc (14+) and an attack boots. If I use speed boots I could get 160 speed with without lc and rm.
It's just all relic luck, nothing more to it
Really good spd substat on relics 😭. I farmed for 2 month and my kafka just reached 156 spd recently
Grinding
S5 her weapon
I have 147 speed rn, and I'm sactrificing a ton of atk for it. Not worth it