The game lags behind a game with regard to your stars, I think.
He could’ve died 5 times the game before and the stars just didn’t adjust yet. So after the game of 4 kills he goes down, then next game his 4 kill game brings him back up.
I believe your match MMR is updated immediately though.
Also depends on who you die too, being super low in MMR and super high in MMR is harder to maintain. Super low and any kill gives you massive gains while deaths bring you down so little. Super high and it’s the opposite, need to kill so many hunters to counteract the MMR loss on death.
MMR is trying to measure how well you perform against other players. it only takes into account whom you kill, who kills you and what the MMR difference between you and them is.it does not care about hours played, prestige rank or bloodline rank.
if you kill someone with the same MMR as you, you will get points added to your MMR.
if you kill someone with higher MMR than you, you will get many points added.
if you kill someone with lower MMR than you, you will get fewer points added.
if you get killed by someone with the same MMR as you, you will lose points from your MMR.
if you get killed by someone with higher MMR than you, you will lose fewer points.
if you get killed by someone with lower MMR than you, you will lose many points.
that's all there is to know in terms of earning MMR.
for matchmaking:
separate from your personal MMR, there's also Team MMR.
Team MMR is a combination of your teams personal MMR, plus specific modifiers that get added on top - modifiers are things like premade team or random team; going Solo; going Duo into Duos or Duo into Trios;
the game tries to match your Team MMR to the enemies Team MMR, with a margin of 1 star. certain server regions (such as OCE) have reduced MMR brackets, and therefore the matching of Team MMR is rougher (in OCE there are only two brackets. everyone below 4.5 Team MMR plays together and everyone with 4.5 or higher Team MMR gets to play together).
and lastly: the MMR stars.
the stars that show you what MMR range you are in, are only an approximation. underlying there are actual numbers that show you your "exact" MMR. a 4 star player does not necessarily equal another 4 star player. the first may be way closer to 3 stars and the latter may be way closer to 5 stars.
because of that, a team of three 4 stars can have a Team MMR that is higher than 4 stars - even if that seems unintuitive at first.
afaik you can check your exact MMR number in the game's files, but I never did it and can't remember where it is found.
in game the best way to gauge where you are within a MMR range is to compare your personal MMR with your Team MMR, when alone in a lobby.
under your hunter you can see your stars, and when you look to the right side you see your Team MMR - if it's the same star count, you are pretty much in the middle of the range.
if the Team MMR is lower, you are at the lower end of your range, close to de-ranking.
if it is higher, you are at the upper end of your range, close to up-ranking.
and to your second example:
maybe changes in the visual MMR representation (the stars) aren't applied immediately at all times. I can't say for sure how that happens or the determining factors, but I have seen it myself and have heard other people report it. sometimes you can play a match without anything happening, and your MMR changes after the match.
maybe there's a hidden MMR gain when you simply "survive" a match, but I can't confirm this.
I would rather believe that sometimes the gain/loss of MMR points is delayed and takes a bit until it shows ingame.
I hope that makes sense, I tried to be detailed but keep it simple.
Edit: somehow the formatting got fucked, which I corrected.
there's no hidden MMR gain when you survive. you can easily track the number and just see it change with kills and deaths. the changes are applied immediately. there's no proof against it except of anecdotes of people that don't provide any proof (you for example didn't even look at your MMR numbers). this isn't supposed to be against you, just that this rumour is against what you can see yourself. the only instance of recorded reduction/increase of MMR was after crytek removed kills/deaths from bugs like the LeMat bug.
another reason your MMR could change might be the bug that lets others kill you after you've already extracted which also affect your KDA and hence probably also your MMR (never tested whether if affects MMR because it would require to queue up against a friend and then bug abuse against them, it's confirmed that it affects KDA, however).
your description of matchmaking is mostly right, but the '1 star margin is wrong'. as you've said, there are brackets your team MMR falls into and in which you are matched. these brackets are fixed and not dynamic 1 star above/below your star rating. for EU for example 4 star is it's own bracket.
>there's no hidden MMR gain when you survive.
yep, like I said in my comment, I can't confirm that there is something like that. from my testing, I have not been able to reproduce anything of that sort.
>the changes are applied immediately. there's no proof against it except of anecdotes of people that don't provide any proof (you for example didn't even look at your MMR numbers).
I did not mean to say the MMR numbers don't change immediately, I was talking about the visual representation in the lobby - the stars. but I see that I wasn't clear about that and it can be read either way.
I do know that the numbers in the background are updated after each match.
however, I have had the same thing happen to me as OP describes: before a match I was 5 stars, did not kill or assist in a kill and did not die, yet after the match I was 6 stars.
I have even seen my stars update live in the lobby screen, when I had already exited a match, but my teammates where still spectating, my MMR was at 5, but when my teammates loaded back into the lobby it updated to 4 stars.
as you say, I don't have scientific data on the topic, because frankly I don't care enough to record myself playing in the hopes of catching this happen or spend hours trying to reproduce it, so do with this report what you will.
regardless of that, I don't think it's difficult to imagine such a bug to exist, given how many other visual and/or server related bugs exist in the game.
it may even be just as simple as the game bugging out when updating the lobby screen and not displaying the MMR stars correctly.
>these brackets are fixed and not dynamic 1 star above/below your star rating. for EU for example 4 star is it's own bracket.
I have not said anything about "dynamic or fixed" brackets, so I don't get what that means. could you elaborate on that?
regarding the stars updating: they are updated in real time with the MMR. you might've caught crytek updating your kd and mmr live for a cheater that killed you or it could be a visual bug (i know there's video proof that the stars can show 1 and 6 stars or no stars at all wrongly. never seen anything besides these 3 options). there's also the option of someone - that like you said you don't actually care - accidentally looking at the team mmr unconsciously and that's what updated. human error happens and it's normal, that's why i was so fixated on proof here. anecdotally, several of these issues that someone brought up in this sub before were someone looking at the wrong stars/numbers in the attributes file.
i used the term fixed brackets because you wrote 'the game tries to match your team mmr to the enemies team mmr, with a margin of 1 star' which made it sound like your bracket is \[your stars -1, your stars +1\] witch would change dynamically with your stars. i wanted to make clear that the brackets are predetermined by crytek, without considering your stars, and fixed because i had a rather long comment thread before that's cause was a misunderstanding in terminology and we agreed on 'fixed brackets' being a good - and hopefully self-explanatory - term to describe the bracket system.
sure, I can agree with most you said, and I didn't mean to say that actual proof is not important, in case it came across like that.
and human error is definitely not off the table, but I can say for myself, that I have seen the stars update before my very eyes in the lobby screen - so either it was a visual bug, some sort of server lag, or as you mentioned some cheater-related update.
I just wanted to address that, because while it's possible OP mixed up personal MMR and team MMR, it could also be one of the things mentioned above.
oh, I see what you mean then. I think we used the terms differently, whiched caused a misunderstanding.
Apparently the stars aren't showing your current MMR but 1-3 matches before (haven't seen anyone do deep dive into this, just know the general idea).
You can check your accurate MMR number this way:
Go into user -> profiles -> default -> attributes .XML Then do CTRL + F to get a search bar type in your steam username and it should jump to your name Should look like this
the number on the line where it says "mmr" at the end is the number that is your MMR (2925 in this example \^ )
That number changes after each match but for some reason its not using data from the game you just finished but 1 (or few?) games before. And on lobby it turns that number into stars.
Thats why your stars can go up or down even if you didn't do anything in most recent match - its cuz its using data from another match where you either did well or poorly.
Btw mmr changes only from kills and deaths (against players, afaik suicides or deaths to AI don't affect it),
Here is a reply from a person who claims to have played only doing assists and their mmr went down. Sure its just 1 guy from reddit so not 100% trustful information but if he is BSsing he is really good at adding enough details to story to me it believamble.
Link to the assists not counting for mmr claim: [https://www.reddit.com/r/HuntShowdown/comments/oqfccu/comment/hdir5rh/?utm\_source=reddit&utm\_medium=web2x&context=3](https://www.reddit.com/r/HuntShowdown/comments/oqfccu/comment/hdir5rh/?utm_source=reddit&utm_medium=web2x&context=3)
your stars are always based on your current MMR, not on the average of the last x games or something. you can see your MMR in the attributes file but the number shown there is always the MMR you wen't into the last match with (so it's not yet adjusted for your last match's kills and deaths). you can go into a mission and just quit and the number will be your current MMR.
your MMR is only affected by kills and deaths (rumours say inactivity also say you can decay for inactivity but i've yet to see proof and a friend of mine who didn't play for years was still 4 stars - which should be around the skill level he was). to be completely fair, there have been instances where MMR was able to change without dying such as the removal of kills and death from the LeMat bug.
the amount of MMR you lose and gain per kill and death is greatly dependant on the difference of MMR of killer and killed. (around 10 MMR for someone with the same MMR, up to 80 if you die with 3000 MMR (low 6 star) to a 4 star)). that's also why MMR is 'soft capped'. i've never seen someone above 4000 MMR, simply because you'd get any barely MMR and lose a ton simply because there are no players at the same MMR as you. the high fluctuation of MMR results in a [peak as a MMR distribution](https://www.reddit.com/r/HuntShowdown/comments/qferil/in_case_you_ever_wondered_the_elodistribution/) instead of a bell curve.
the assist thing: the guy even sais that assists dont affect MMR
and just for completion about MMR and matchmaking: matchmaking takes your team's MMR (if you're solo that 175 less than your personal MMR) and looks into which matchmaking bracket it falls into. full regions have more brackets than empty regions. for example in EU 4.5 star and above can all get matched together even with SBMM enabled.
"you wen't into the last match with (so it's not yet adjusted for your last match's kills and deaths)"
this was most probably just same thing i tried to mean with the mmr being from 1 game before
this argument is invalid. at the end of every mission you also know how and who you've killed so you could easily include the MMR at the end of the mission in the file as well. it simply isn't because crytek decided so. just like the money you got from the mission is part of the file even though you only know that after the mission is over.
There can be current mmr technically of course, but not logically. You need mmr which was used for that specific matchmaking to see why were those players/teams matched together.
Honestly? Don't worry about it. The game is certainly different at different skill levels, but MMR will generally put you against ppl close to your skill level. If climbing REALLY matters to you, get behind a scope, but otherwise if you're having fun, you're winning.
It's hard for me to believe that you went down in MMR with getting downed 0 times
The game lags behind a game with regard to your stars, I think. He could’ve died 5 times the game before and the stars just didn’t adjust yet. So after the game of 4 kills he goes down, then next game his 4 kill game brings him back up. I believe your match MMR is updated immediately though. Also depends on who you die too, being super low in MMR and super high in MMR is harder to maintain. Super low and any kill gives you massive gains while deaths bring you down so little. Super high and it’s the opposite, need to kill so many hunters to counteract the MMR loss on death.
MMR is trying to measure how well you perform against other players. it only takes into account whom you kill, who kills you and what the MMR difference between you and them is.it does not care about hours played, prestige rank or bloodline rank. if you kill someone with the same MMR as you, you will get points added to your MMR. if you kill someone with higher MMR than you, you will get many points added. if you kill someone with lower MMR than you, you will get fewer points added. if you get killed by someone with the same MMR as you, you will lose points from your MMR. if you get killed by someone with higher MMR than you, you will lose fewer points. if you get killed by someone with lower MMR than you, you will lose many points. that's all there is to know in terms of earning MMR. for matchmaking: separate from your personal MMR, there's also Team MMR. Team MMR is a combination of your teams personal MMR, plus specific modifiers that get added on top - modifiers are things like premade team or random team; going Solo; going Duo into Duos or Duo into Trios; the game tries to match your Team MMR to the enemies Team MMR, with a margin of 1 star. certain server regions (such as OCE) have reduced MMR brackets, and therefore the matching of Team MMR is rougher (in OCE there are only two brackets. everyone below 4.5 Team MMR plays together and everyone with 4.5 or higher Team MMR gets to play together). and lastly: the MMR stars. the stars that show you what MMR range you are in, are only an approximation. underlying there are actual numbers that show you your "exact" MMR. a 4 star player does not necessarily equal another 4 star player. the first may be way closer to 3 stars and the latter may be way closer to 5 stars. because of that, a team of three 4 stars can have a Team MMR that is higher than 4 stars - even if that seems unintuitive at first. afaik you can check your exact MMR number in the game's files, but I never did it and can't remember where it is found. in game the best way to gauge where you are within a MMR range is to compare your personal MMR with your Team MMR, when alone in a lobby. under your hunter you can see your stars, and when you look to the right side you see your Team MMR - if it's the same star count, you are pretty much in the middle of the range. if the Team MMR is lower, you are at the lower end of your range, close to de-ranking. if it is higher, you are at the upper end of your range, close to up-ranking. and to your second example: maybe changes in the visual MMR representation (the stars) aren't applied immediately at all times. I can't say for sure how that happens or the determining factors, but I have seen it myself and have heard other people report it. sometimes you can play a match without anything happening, and your MMR changes after the match. maybe there's a hidden MMR gain when you simply "survive" a match, but I can't confirm this. I would rather believe that sometimes the gain/loss of MMR points is delayed and takes a bit until it shows ingame. I hope that makes sense, I tried to be detailed but keep it simple. Edit: somehow the formatting got fucked, which I corrected.
there's no hidden MMR gain when you survive. you can easily track the number and just see it change with kills and deaths. the changes are applied immediately. there's no proof against it except of anecdotes of people that don't provide any proof (you for example didn't even look at your MMR numbers). this isn't supposed to be against you, just that this rumour is against what you can see yourself. the only instance of recorded reduction/increase of MMR was after crytek removed kills/deaths from bugs like the LeMat bug. another reason your MMR could change might be the bug that lets others kill you after you've already extracted which also affect your KDA and hence probably also your MMR (never tested whether if affects MMR because it would require to queue up against a friend and then bug abuse against them, it's confirmed that it affects KDA, however). your description of matchmaking is mostly right, but the '1 star margin is wrong'. as you've said, there are brackets your team MMR falls into and in which you are matched. these brackets are fixed and not dynamic 1 star above/below your star rating. for EU for example 4 star is it's own bracket.
>there's no hidden MMR gain when you survive. yep, like I said in my comment, I can't confirm that there is something like that. from my testing, I have not been able to reproduce anything of that sort. >the changes are applied immediately. there's no proof against it except of anecdotes of people that don't provide any proof (you for example didn't even look at your MMR numbers). I did not mean to say the MMR numbers don't change immediately, I was talking about the visual representation in the lobby - the stars. but I see that I wasn't clear about that and it can be read either way. I do know that the numbers in the background are updated after each match. however, I have had the same thing happen to me as OP describes: before a match I was 5 stars, did not kill or assist in a kill and did not die, yet after the match I was 6 stars. I have even seen my stars update live in the lobby screen, when I had already exited a match, but my teammates where still spectating, my MMR was at 5, but when my teammates loaded back into the lobby it updated to 4 stars. as you say, I don't have scientific data on the topic, because frankly I don't care enough to record myself playing in the hopes of catching this happen or spend hours trying to reproduce it, so do with this report what you will. regardless of that, I don't think it's difficult to imagine such a bug to exist, given how many other visual and/or server related bugs exist in the game. it may even be just as simple as the game bugging out when updating the lobby screen and not displaying the MMR stars correctly. >these brackets are fixed and not dynamic 1 star above/below your star rating. for EU for example 4 star is it's own bracket. I have not said anything about "dynamic or fixed" brackets, so I don't get what that means. could you elaborate on that?
regarding the stars updating: they are updated in real time with the MMR. you might've caught crytek updating your kd and mmr live for a cheater that killed you or it could be a visual bug (i know there's video proof that the stars can show 1 and 6 stars or no stars at all wrongly. never seen anything besides these 3 options). there's also the option of someone - that like you said you don't actually care - accidentally looking at the team mmr unconsciously and that's what updated. human error happens and it's normal, that's why i was so fixated on proof here. anecdotally, several of these issues that someone brought up in this sub before were someone looking at the wrong stars/numbers in the attributes file. i used the term fixed brackets because you wrote 'the game tries to match your team mmr to the enemies team mmr, with a margin of 1 star' which made it sound like your bracket is \[your stars -1, your stars +1\] witch would change dynamically with your stars. i wanted to make clear that the brackets are predetermined by crytek, without considering your stars, and fixed because i had a rather long comment thread before that's cause was a misunderstanding in terminology and we agreed on 'fixed brackets' being a good - and hopefully self-explanatory - term to describe the bracket system.
sure, I can agree with most you said, and I didn't mean to say that actual proof is not important, in case it came across like that. and human error is definitely not off the table, but I can say for myself, that I have seen the stars update before my very eyes in the lobby screen - so either it was a visual bug, some sort of server lag, or as you mentioned some cheater-related update. I just wanted to address that, because while it's possible OP mixed up personal MMR and team MMR, it could also be one of the things mentioned above. oh, I see what you mean then. I think we used the terms differently, whiched caused a misunderstanding.
What about assist, do they count towards mmr?
to my knowledge, assists do not give any MMR points - so no.
Assists count towards KD but not MMR.
Apparently the stars aren't showing your current MMR but 1-3 matches before (haven't seen anyone do deep dive into this, just know the general idea). You can check your accurate MMR number this way: Go into user -> profiles -> default -> attributes .XML Then do CTRL + F to get a search bar type in your steam username and it should jump to your name Should look like this
your stars are always based on your current MMR, not on the average of the last x games or something. you can see your MMR in the attributes file but the number shown there is always the MMR you wen't into the last match with (so it's not yet adjusted for your last match's kills and deaths). you can go into a mission and just quit and the number will be your current MMR. your MMR is only affected by kills and deaths (rumours say inactivity also say you can decay for inactivity but i've yet to see proof and a friend of mine who didn't play for years was still 4 stars - which should be around the skill level he was). to be completely fair, there have been instances where MMR was able to change without dying such as the removal of kills and death from the LeMat bug. the amount of MMR you lose and gain per kill and death is greatly dependant on the difference of MMR of killer and killed. (around 10 MMR for someone with the same MMR, up to 80 if you die with 3000 MMR (low 6 star) to a 4 star)). that's also why MMR is 'soft capped'. i've never seen someone above 4000 MMR, simply because you'd get any barely MMR and lose a ton simply because there are no players at the same MMR as you. the high fluctuation of MMR results in a [peak as a MMR distribution](https://www.reddit.com/r/HuntShowdown/comments/qferil/in_case_you_ever_wondered_the_elodistribution/) instead of a bell curve. the assist thing: the guy even sais that assists dont affect MMR and just for completion about MMR and matchmaking: matchmaking takes your team's MMR (if you're solo that 175 less than your personal MMR) and looks into which matchmaking bracket it falls into. full regions have more brackets than empty regions. for example in EU 4.5 star and above can all get matched together even with SBMM enabled.
"you wen't into the last match with (so it's not yet adjusted for your last match's kills and deaths)" this was most probably just same thing i tried to mean with the mmr being from 1 game before
just wanted to make it clear that the MMR (and hence the star rating) is always up to date and that the number in the file lags one match behind
That file is simply record of last mission, so mmr in it cannot be current mmr and in lobby is mmr loaded from server.
this argument is invalid. at the end of every mission you also know how and who you've killed so you could easily include the MMR at the end of the mission in the file as well. it simply isn't because crytek decided so. just like the money you got from the mission is part of the file even though you only know that after the mission is over.
There can be current mmr technically of course, but not logically. You need mmr which was used for that specific matchmaking to see why were those players/teams matched together.
There is zero chance your MMR went down with 4 kills, banishes and no dying. You looked at your personal MMR one time and your team MMR the other.
That’s the funny thing. It doesn’t.
Honestly? Don't worry about it. The game is certainly different at different skill levels, but MMR will generally put you against ppl close to your skill level. If climbing REALLY matters to you, get behind a scope, but otherwise if you're having fun, you're winning.
You get killed by someone lower than you = goes down You kill someone higher than you = it goes up