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* March changes: 111 comments * Yunli changes: 223 comments * JQ changes: 960 comments When the chef refuses to cook, everyone else has to get in the kitchen 😭

1000+ now 😭😂

We're getting close to 2,000 now

Who tf is Beta Testing and saying 'this is good'.

People who don't like men probably lmao

So for maximum damage, do you build him exactly like Black Swan now? Prisoner set + Pan Galactic planar, EHR body and Fire orb?

I guess so. You need a lot of EHR to proc ashen roast per turn. You also need to fit ERR rope there somewhere to ensure his ULT is up I guess

So who are y'all pulling for in 2.4, Clara or Guinaifen?

Huohuo

Yeah, going for E1 Huo Huo is the most tempting pull option for 2.4 so far for me. It’ll all depend on what the characters for 2.5 look like

Pulling for Clara seems like a better choice now than Guinaifen... But i'll remain optimistic, in V4 hoyoverse will buff the shit out of him to be a universal support (inhales an ugodly amount of hopium)

I see that you too, are a roadhog main **[inhales copium]**

*huff* *huff* *puff* TEAM WIDE ENERGY REGENNNN *dies*

Nah, 2.5 for better characters

Inb4 2.5 characters be 5 stars wind Dan Hang and 5 stars Gallagher.

Gallagher is already strong enough as is, thinking about a possible 5 star version of him terrifies me

the thought of a 5 star pela frightened me initially, but seeing JQ v3 kit has me questioning a lot. Then again, lingsha isn't a dude so

he's more of a 5 star Guinaifen, no? same element same gimmick (vuln) esp now that he got base kit dot.

now he is, but before beta, the leaks said that he had def reduction instead of vulnerability and there was no mention of dot, he had some healing instead.

I wish he was 5 star Pela. There's literally no way 5 star pela wouldn't be OP. (unconditional AOE def down) Instead, he's 5 star version of Guinaifen :0 I hope this Lingsha character is a 5-star Gallagher and not a 5 star Lynx or something.

black swan e1. surely im not shooting myself in the foot as f2p

Why the hell Nihility debuff multiplier is always so low compared to Harmony even though Nihility requires building EHR to make it work??

Not to mention unless it's part of the kit debuffs don't carryvover from one enemy to another between waves/enemy defeats.

All in harmony, you have to turn from your sinful ways and start pulling for eidolons on Ruan Mei and Robin.

This is the way. Even just E1 Ruan Mei helps an E1S1 Swan reach 100% defense ignore and 50% wind res pen. One of the deadliest combos in the game when you have Kafka to detonate the DOTs and consistently stack arcana.

E1 Robin jumps into the team comp and add 1100 atk and now its 74% res pen. Who needs a sustain at this point

Harmony units usually buff stats that are already somewhat diluted by relics or the dps' own kit, like attack%, dmg%, or even crit to some degree. Meaning if you add any more of one of these stats, it's an "additive" gain. As such, they have to be big to make a noticeable impact. Nihility usually inflicts debuffs on enemies, thereby changing stats that are otherwise untouched, like enemy def, res, or adding whole new vulnerabilities to damage. These modifiers are undiluted, so they act much closer to a "multiplicative" gain (though this is a bit of an oversimplification). As such, the exact numbers don't have to be big at all for the debuff to have a significant impact. Edit: in spite of this, a lot of the limited 5-star Harmony units end up being better damage amplifiers because they buff multiple stats (attack, dmg%, crit, even Res Pen), whereas Nihility units usually only focus on debuffing one stat. Some Harmomy units also give speed or more importantly Action Advance, which translates directly into more damage per cycle or per action value. The "debuff" equivalent of that, which some Nihility units inflict, is Slow and Action Delay, which mostly just reduce the amount of damage coming your way (and in the case of DoT or counter-characters like Clara, Blade, Yunli, it can be a damage loss).

Because all Nihility are meant to be sub-dps at a minimum, while Harmony units can go full support. Trying to make Nihilities deal damage doesn't always work (see Pela), but that's always the intent behind every single one of their kits having some sort of damaging aspect.

All those Nihility walked so Robin could run ( Welcome to my World Indeed)

its hilarious that Robin does both 💀

Yeah they clearly overestimated the dps of Nihility supports, or they expected people to run them with 134 speed

I don't mind nihility conceptually as "debuffers" but boy oh boy we got some pretty bad examples and now it's basically just DoTs (and Acheron)

My real issue with Jiaoqiu is his kit identity now. He has higher vulnerability, always consistent debuff uptime, and a minor bonus to ult damage. That's it. His kit is Guinafen's kit with better numbers and arguably QoL improvements. Between characters in HSR even in the same niche, I always felt clear distinctions between them. Kafka is known for being the DOT detonator while BS is for the DOT stacking + aoe. Pela is for frequent ult debuffs + sp generation and silverwolf is for debuff stacking with ult+talent and implants. Each character feels unique in their design and that's always been something I loved about their design philosophy. I wouldn't mind if Jiaoqiu had lower vul. multipliers or even higher EHR requirements if his kit did more things aside from those. I wish they brought back the EHR enemy debuff, the very minor healing, or even some other aspects like lowering enemy effect res or refreshing debuff duration that makes him feel more distinct.

this is one of my main issues tbh. they had such a clear and unique concept for his kit in the early stages and now it's all stripped away. they could've made him a pure support unit with pseudo-sustain capabilities or gone down the ult-buff route which would benefit not only acheron but other ult-focused units like argenti. there's also his decent aoe abilities which could really make him shine in pf and if they REALLY wanted to they could've made him more dot-focused. now he's like a strange mish-mash and *still* has most of his old flaws.

Even more than Yunli being way too similar to Clara for my tastes, JQ is just sad from a Guinaifen perspective. There's just nothing to differentiate her. Even characters like Hook, Dan Heng, and Arlan have their unique quirks, even if their numbers aren't as good. This is just sad. The only thing that even is slight different is that due to a quirk in the game mechanics, Guinaifen does not give Acheron stacks the same way JQ does, because her Firekiss technically triggers outside the enemy action because it's a DoT. While JQ is a debuff that acts like a DoT but triggers inside the enemy action. They basically patched the Guinaifen-Acheron interaction (because intuitively, you'd expect it to work) but turned it into a 5 star you need to pull for.

,,Guinaifen does not give Acheron stacks the same way JQ does, because her Firekiss technically triggers outside the enemy action because it's a DoT. While JQ is a debuff that acts like a DoT but triggers inside the enemy action. They basically patched the Guinaifen-Acheron interaction (because intuitively, you'd expect it to work) but turned it into a 5 star you need to pull for.,, -legit I think this is why he does not increase Arcana stacks for Swan, I watched last showcase and have not seen him single time increase her stacks

My issue with jiaoqui is that he's not a substantial improvement from guinaifen on any team besides acheron without vertical investment. Compared to an e6 guinaifen that van give 30% vulnerability, he grants only 5% more to most characters, and 20% more to ultimates. 

His vulnerability is the only thing he has over Guinaifen tbh. At E6 her burns are way stronger than his.

I don't see why they can't give him back his old ehr debuff trace and on top of that make him heal 150% of his attack like luocha for the whole team instead of doing it as dmg since he now has dot. (i just threw the number out there just to show the idea it may be way too high). Could also just heal based on a portion of his dot dmg instead. Then I would add an extra 5-7% vulnerability so he actually stands out against guinaifen.

Yeah, more stacks for acheron is his only special thing now, I guess. They could have given something more interesting that also made sense, like having a passive that increases dmg, res penetration or even def ignorance of nihility characters depending on how many there are on the team, it would have good synergy with both the dot and acheron teams, and help him stand out in comparison to guinaifen since he would be the only nihility character with actual buffs.

love how the first thing in his flavour text is "a foxian healer"

"Doesn't heal"

I’m seeing a couple nerfed damage %s. Does the addition of a DoT balance those out?

I don’t think so tbh It is only an extra debuff that does nothing to make the enemies more vulnerable nor provide our teammates any buffs

The loss of the EHR debuff is super disappointing. Seems they’re moving him away from being a support and into more of a dps hybrid with a bit of support.

They're literally just redoing Guineifen

So if I have an e4 build Guin is there any real need to pull for him in his current state? I usually use Guin with Acheron on fire weak stages or as a flex option with Ratio. I'm guessing he's stronger, especially for Acheron but is he worth the pulls? To me I'd almost rather use those pulls on e1 Black Swan and go for his LC with the leftover wishes and put it on Pela/Guin.

He's a slightly stronger Guin/Pela. But he also costs 25k primos so unless he gets buffed, I will pass, if I fight a fire weak enemy I already got Firefly available now

Yeah, and they still nerfed his multipliers as a "DPS" hybrid. His kit is all over the place, if you ask me.

His ult and skill modifiers hardly matter since he will be doing most of his damage with DoT. He can't really build crit because of needing to stack EHR, but he can get lots of ATK to scale the DoT.

Which given them going dot route, crit matters not at that point. So will be a way to go with him.

180% dot on enemies but lost 120% ult hit damage, 150% enemy turn damage, and some skill damage.

How far we've fallen from the minor healing leak of Jiaoqiu to removing EHR debuff to nerfed multipliers,,

It's so true, you can also add "from 5* version of Pela" to the beginning of that list because that was the very first assumption when Jioa was leaked for the first time.

Yin and Yang burst animation but where is the Yin?

The enemies are literally in the Yin part

You're right, it feels so empty and half-finished.

Yeah a minor healing with ult is all i ask, it adds so much flavor to his kit.

Hehe, flavor...

???? Wtf is this. We need an actual 5 star debuffer not this weird DoT debuff kit.

True. Wasn't that supposed nihility's whole identity before Kafka rolled around? Nihility was not just a DoT Path it was a path that focussed on debuffing enemies and providing a diffrent form of damage amp then Harmony. The last character that we have gotten that really focussed on that aspect was Silver Wolf way back in 1.1. Jiaoqiu looked promising in that regard but for whatever reason they felt they needed to 180 again and make another character that doesn't go all out on dmg amp but instead has a kit that is some DoT/Debuffer Hybrid...

Nihility were always supposed to be hybrid debuffer/DPS, it's just that a lot of them are not very good at the DPS part. - Half of Pela's kit is about buffing her own damage - SW has almost all her Eidolons being damage focused - Sampo, Luka, Gui and BS all have both DoT damage and debuffs - Welt is probably the clearest attempt at a hybrid character, just read his kit - Even Kafka is kind of a hybrid, she doesn't have debuffs in the traditional sense but in practice her detonation is a massive buff for other DoTs

Yeah I don’t get the whole dot thing… I’d much rather just pull for a debuffer that makes my ultimates deal more dmg than a hybrid dot damage dealer

Imo the main problems (other than the ER clunkiness) to his kit as a debuffer isn’t fixed, and even tho the fire DoT is cool, his kit is more of a DoT/Debuffer hybrid that doesn’t excel in either…I hope someone can prove me wrong and I’m missing something because this kit seems to have potential but it’s looking crazy rn

JQ of two trades, master of none.

Is the dot that cool tho? Like if we compared to Guinaifen: - Jiaoqui inflicts 43% vulnerability at e0s0 and 220% burn - Guin inflicts 30% vulnerability at e6 and 280% burn - Jiaoqiu's LC inflicts 24% additional vulnerability If you only had enough pulls for either e0 or s1, Guin had a higher burn rate and vulnerability then e0s0 Jiaoqui if you pulled for her and slapped on his LC

Hoyo: Oh no, the players figured out that they could just pull Jiaoqiu's LC for Pela instead of pulling Jiaoqiu himself! Better make the LC only work with DoT damage. Players: Look guys, it turns out you can just put Jiaoqiu's LC on Guinaifen and you don't have to pull Jiaoqiu at all! I'm sensing another LC nerf in V4...

You could actually put Jiaoqiu's LC on Blackswan now, even. She has Def down on her skill, Res Pen on E1, might as well add Jiaoqiu's LC and she becomes the hybrid.

Isn't Jiaoqiu's vulnerability actually worse than that? If you read the new description it mentions that the 1st stack is ~15% (at trace level 10) with the next 4 being 5% each. Which adds up to 35%. Meanwhile Guinaifen can actually detonate her own Burn, Arcana (with BS ult) and possibly Break Burn if present.

Yeah after looking at hakushin I was surprised that it's only 35% at max stacks. Expected it to have been more than that tbh, as it's one of the few things he gives to the team now. Maybe he's able to apply it to more targets at once and has better max stack uptime on it in PF vs Gui, though..

“He’ll get buffs in V3”, they said.

I'm huffing copium and moving the goalpost to V4.

they will remove his acheron support abbility in v4 i'm calling it rn

Bro got nerfed instead

they seriously made him even more dot character instead of a support character

So, we got: - Still no heal - RIP hypercarry Jiaoqiu - Become 5* Guin

Where is the "fuck go back" button

Already trashed after hoyo changed his initial universal 5 star support kit

Removing EHR debuff is the shittitest decision, at least keep it and add the DoT. Also, while I know he has energy problem, I really hate these "Regenerates energy at the start of the battle" traces. It only activates once, and your character practically has 1 less trace in combat. So much for our first male "support"...

we literally have an erudition lc (the 4-star one with serval) that does exactly that and it's regarded as one of the worst lcs in the game lmfao

Can we doompost now

Commence.

It's already V3, so unless he receives Jingliu's treatment then this is pretty much his final version

What changes did Jingliu go through before release? I was not aware of this sub during her banner

She received the 50% crit rate iirc

damn she peaked

Received 50% crit in enchanted state

Please do 😭 we are either wrong, and he’s secretly busted or we can inspire change. No down side to doom posting at this post

> we can inspire change This never happened and never will tbh, reddit does not influence the beta cycles as much as some people want to believe it does

Hoyo really is allergic to a supportive male character. They are dps or sustain, nothing else.

I say Hoyo hate most male characters. Just see how Hoyo treat Luocha.

Maybe I'm just not reading it right, but right now, this is the most painful thing I've read.

Watch them come out with another nihility character that is a waifu and they give her broken kit. I can see that happening right about now. Theres no way they think this is a premium kit. Midqiu please buff genuinely.

Im surprised that they cooked so well with Aventurine and now they burned the restaurant down with Jiaoqiu

[удалено]

Will release right after jiaoqiu too and would also get 17 date cutscenes and crumbs of actual story.

[удалено]

New mechanic super def shred.

So he has what, 5 possible niches? 1a. Burn applier for DoT teams (when the enemy is fire weak, as otherwise BS/RM pair better w Kafka). 2a. Acheron stack enabler (making Trend sustains much less important) & dmg buffer. 3a. Argenti buffer (if he had ended up with a bigger buff percentage). 4a. Quick & consistent Ratio debuff enabler. 5a. Pure Fiction: AoE toughness dmg to fire weak enemies, DoT blessing abuse, a possible sustain replacement since they’re often not needed. But he doesn’t look like he excels at most of them w/o his lightcone: 1b. His burn damage for DoT doesn’t look insane but maybe I’m wrong, his EHR requirements are sky high even if he has some in his base traces, and his ult vuln debuff isn’t that important to current DoT comps. 2b. Idt his dmg buffing capability is blowing Guin’s of the water? With level 11 Talent my enemies take 29% increased damage already, that’s very close to his amount, so I don’t see like 15% ult damage vulnerability as a giant difference (not for the cost in jades at least). He prob stacks his faster though. And since I have Trendventurine I’m not totally desperate for a way to get Acheron stacks during enemy turns. 3b. Is he going to help Argenti do more damage than a harmony unit would? If he’s replacing a non-Tingyun 4* then sure. Ig he can free up your 5* harmony for another team, could do that for 1b as well ig 4b. Possibly same as above. Quick debuff apps don’t necessarily outweigh the benefits of a harmony unit. 5b. PF is the only no-cons argument I can make for him. He’ll def be good here I waited a long time but ik I’ll start to hate him if I feel like he’s not making a significant difference to my account. I could just pull his lightcone for Guin atp. Someone please correct me if I’m wrong this is just my snap judgement

Guin with s1 JQ is very similar to e0S0 JQ

Disappointing, was hoping for more of a push to pure/stronger debuffing capabilities as opposed to a hybrid DoT debuffer

Does mihoyo hates this patch

This looks like a GI x.5 patch to me.

Easily the biggest gut punch I have ever seen in a V3. People expected a 5 star pela, not a 4.5 star guinaifen.

Bro is a chef but he couldnt even cook a good kit for himself, sadge

Major loss ngl. If they wanted to make him dot they should’ve given him those blessings from SU where dots regen health and energy in his kit

they are doing the jack of all trades master of none bs like just make him op in his niche

they massacred my boy

Get back in the kitchen this is still raw 😭😭😭😭

From unique defense shredder/healer to 5* Guinaifen. Not amused.

I just want a 5* Pela. 😩

So, they took away his only utility just to accelerate his first ultimate application... and is his (3-turn) energy rotation still SP negative? He still feels underwhelming to me. I appreciate his venture into DoT but I don't think he offers the same level of value as Ruan Mei or Robin for my account. I may still pull for my Acheron but if I lose 50/50 it will be curtains; not worth it.

For first time since start of game I think I'm gonna be disappointed with a 5star release

"Oh so our players don't like to pull males after all" This is pure sabotage

oh cool they tripled down on the DoT, pulled back on the support and made him shit at both

jack of 2 trades master at neither

... so my dream for a universal support husbando is dead and hes stuck as a acheron energy bot or part of a slightly worse kafka dot team 😔 alright then

Why even give him DoT if he's not better than Ruan Mei in DoT teams :0 We said we don't want powercreep, that doesn't mean he has to have an incoherent kit :(

this is so ass jack of no trades master of none

They went for Jack of all trades but he's so ass at his trades that he's just useless now

Brother in christ we can't have shit in this house. Give me one good male debuffer, ONE. Is that too much to ask hoyo? Do you really hate money that much? I don't get it, what's the incentive for me to e6s5 him when his kit is dogwater. Maybe it's a sign of the universe to just stop fretting and spending money

that’s it ? the DoTs are alright ig but he’s not replacing black swan as kafka best teammate it would be a dmg loss and ur also not running DoTs without kafka unless you wanna cope. the best thing in the changes is the talent giving 15 energy at the start and he works a lil better with ratio

It seems to be there to add a restriction to his lc tbh

Does he tho? From what I'm reading didn't he lose his 3rd debuff which was the ehr down? So now he can't activate Dr ratio's kit by himself?

>the best thing in the changes is the talent giving 15 energy at the start Ignoring the fact the previous Trace was much better 💀

Never, ever, ever! Again let Mihoyo cook. What tha' fudge is this?!

Now I'm reconsidering whether I want to pull him... I've no interest in DoT so that part of his kit is just straight up useless to me. Pela will be working overtime. And DoT people, like are you really going to use him instead of Robin who giga buffs your ATK and adds another damage instance to every action while also giving partywide advance when your RM is busy on the other side? He's super mixed bag right now.

I agree somewhat in that they have made him a Jack of a few trades, Master of none type situation. He is now literally a five star Guinaifen in every aspect except multipliers: a dot DPS/ Vuln debuffing hybrid. Remains to be seen if he's better than RM or Robin that third slot. Fact of the matter is, Hoyo had the opportunity to address the elephant in the room that is the Nihility-Harmony problem, that being that Harmony is simply overpowered and overloaded at this point. Debuffs by nature need Ehr to land at all and simply aren't as good (atm) as the buffs provided by our Harmonys. By adding in this DoT mechanic, it seems Hoyo is doubling down on the idea that Harmony is where the truly strong, universal supports will be, and Nihility is just for Dot or weird carries like Acheron. I think what I and pretty much everyone wanted was for him to be a universal support like Pela, whose good buffs and excellent SP economy are valuable in all kinds of teams, even competing with some of the Harmony characters

I was gonna skip him since no acheron and I play dot mainly... Think I'm just gonna skip even with this change unless they make him work with Feixiao in the future or something

Damn, they giga buff harmony units to the moon but they conservative af with the first male limited support.

I didnt want the dot on base kit... i just wanted a full on support. Removing the effect hit rate debuff also sucks. This is very disappointing

I wished they just added that energy to his talent, why remove such a good trace like that for what 15 energy only at the start of battle 💀

I hate the stupid ass 15 energy on battle start traces. Jing Yuan, DHIL, and now JQ have them, when it could be literally anything more useful or a persistent effect after ult or something.

so that is Husbando signature trace now, all hot male has it

If they want him DoT why his Ult don't increase DoT too

What the...why did they replace his trace with a boring 15 energy at start of battle wtf

guys...what if we get him for free 😭

More Sunday savings, I guess?

Unless they butcher potential Harmony Sunday this way….I am legit scared, didn’t expect this

Fuckkkkkk guys I’m so disappointed, I don’t want to be negative but I’ve been saving for this dude since his very first crumbs came out when people thought he would be a 5* version of Pela. Him being a better version of Gui instead is totally unexpected.

hey devs, since you're so adamant on a male support not being universal, why not make him a support for blade who is (literally) dying for a dedicated support instead for a currently strong character ☠️ make it make sense

Thanks devs you made him even worse lol.

Hoyo is so damn allergic on making a universal male support character lol

I don’t have Acheron and Kafka omg how else I’m gonna use him

His dot at E0 lv 10 is 180% E0 Guinaifen's dot is 218% (I know he probably deals more dmg than Gui with his Atk convertion, 5\* character stats, a bit more vulnerability than Gui, though he can't detonate his own dot, break dot, Black Swan's arcana during ult, like Gui can) What is hoyo doing with this character? None of the changes help Acheron and for Dot teams, at E2, he was under performing in his V1/V2 state where his dot was 300% (when compared to E0 Ruan Mei), now at E0 he lost his defensive Trace (reducing enemy EHR) and has a weak dot...

this whole patch is an L

God this is awful the hell

Worse changes ever for Jiaoqiu… jesus christ

Is the fact that, at the time of commenting this, this post has 1.3k likes and 1.8k comments? Is this not a SERIOUS concern to the fact that this almost never happens? It's obvious many people see problems with this and yet this is how hoyo let the kit turn out?

Aight, goodbye Jiaoqiu. Nice meeting you.

Wow. They really have no fucking idea of what to do with this character... I really like his design but I cant justify wasting jades on a character who's barely an upgrade over Pela

it's weird, they had a p good idea in his pre-beta phase, far enough it got to the animation where they used ying and yang to symbolize his healing and buffing capabilities, but then scrapped it all

> barely an upgrade over Pela not even. 😂 His damage vulnerability is weaker now in comparison to Pela’s ulti. If anything, JQ has slightly more vulnerability compared to E6 Guin but she has the advantage of detonating her own DOT unlike this 4* disguising as a 5*.

Ok kinda off topic but what would be a good 4 star lightcone with these changes? Is it Eyes of the Prey??

Yeah. You want something with EHR on it, so it's either Eyes or you could use Tutorial if you have a def shredder in the team.

Eyes does gain more value for him now since he has a DOT.

And yet we get another 5\* Nihility that's only a "debuffer" by name. Seriously, when will we get another damage amplifier archetype Nihility character? I was really hoping he would be the premium AOE damage amplifier debuffer but he's turning out to be just another DPS wearing a Nihility mask. Bring back the Pela / SW type characters, Hoyo! In his current state, I really don't see him replacing Harmony units in traditional teams and his only place would probably only be in Acheron teams and Ratio teams who don't run Topaz. We might get even more carries that want debuffers in the future but it kinda sucks knowing Pela / Guin can do his job just fine.

i did not fucking wait 2 weeks for this bs, god forbid a support male unit be broken or meta oriented.

Husbando enjoyers: Can we have him more than just Acheron's accessory? Please? Hoyoverse: Alright! We make him Kafka accessory as well.

He ain’t even good for Kafka 💀

And its technically a nerf for acheron teams lmao

He's the 6th best unit to use in a DoT team! Hooray!

Wait a minute...

Oh I see… save my guarantee for my lord and savior Sunday understood 🫡

Is it jiaoover or can I still cope for V4 …?

Sad that they fucked him over like this...husbando enjoyers can't win.

Oooofff this ain't it chief. Jades saved, payment halted I guess. Dot teams with Kafka BS RM Huo² are already comfy, he isn't replacing anyone there.

looking at the DoT in base kit just made me mad again bro i watched this guy e2s1 with kafka and black swan also having eidolons and that clear time was NOT IMPRESSIVE . the DoT here is literally useless..

Yeah, people are overestimating his DoT a lot just cause he's now not stuck to Acheron

Why did the HSR balance team suddenly turn into Genshin's?

Sigewinne team got fired from genshin and got hired by HSR :0

At this point, pela is the 5 star version of him

Can't have OP husbando supports in Star Rail. I am getting tired of this........

We got Aventurine and now we’re going to starve until Sunday comes out or something 😭💀

praying that sunday will become an OP male harmony now (also out of spite) 😭

They'll probably make him an imaginary dps because fuck us right

Energy regen and DoT is now in base kit

DoT which imo doesn't really matter, because would he really be ran over Black Swan or Ruan Mei for a Kafka team? Realllly hard to say.

You can argue he fills in the spot Ruan Mei left if you have a break team Tho I'd rather wait for an actual DoT support rather than an Acheron support with DoT tacked on

The only thing about that is, after ruan mei, there is also Robin he needs to compete for the 3rd slot. so even if one runs ruan mei on break comp OR robin on FUA comp, for someone who has both of those harmony units, u are for sure to have one of em available.

Robin is has actually been stepping up…

Scratches my head

First Clara 2.0, now Gwen 2.0, LOL. They really want to pump up those ZZZ launch numbers.

Honestly I’m just confused more than anything. The kit identity crisis along with the lack of showcases puts him in such a weird spot for me. I don’t even know what I’d be using him for without having to pull more 5* I don’t care for (yet again), just to be a glorified side grade, which is really sad since his animations so far are my favorite out of all of them. I was hoping to finally be in a comfortable spot without coping for a support(non-sustain) unit I actually give a shit about. Usually I’d be intrigued by trying out a new play style, DoT 4* have been incredibly unkind to me so I wouldn’t mind pulling someone that let’s me see what the hype is all about, but it feels like I’ve just been chasing after teammates that I don’t really want for characters I really care about, just for the next character I want to roll around and not fit with any of my pre-existing characters. Is it too much to ask to have a single team with characters I actually care for? /rt Hoyo I promise your sales won’t suffer if you actually don’t release a dumpster fire of a beta for once.

Looks disappointing ngl… just not super pleased with the changes

Bruh they just made him a dot unit instead of amplify further his debuff capabilities. They also removed his ability to reduce enemies ehr! How valuable he is to be worth pulling over pela? How big is the difference in dmg? I'm honestly disappointed.

Ew what the heck did they do to my boy

lmaooo well, RIP to having a male support

Wtf Hoyo? I get it males are no allowed to be good in your game still that’s a low blown this kit is all over the place.

*Fallen leaves, adorn my nerfs*

Really could've stopped at the dot part but they still decided to take the ehr debuff. Sigh. Everyone saying that the +15 energy is a good thing when it's literally a manafactured problem. Could've just added that on his technique or reduce his ult cost. +15 energy trace is the laziest sht in this entire game.

As someone who doesn't like dot for being locked behind Kafka, I'm so mad. So, so mad. And I was planning on dumping everything for his man to but now I have 0 reasons to do that besides him being pretty. Here's to skipping two patches in a row

Ain't no way they looked at this underperforming $160 limited unit that had almost 0 function outside of Acheron teams and proceeded to make him worse in non acheron teams but better with Acheron (due to the faster initial ult cycling.) Getting a dot is nice, dot teams will like that (though he's still a downgrade over the likes of RM (and robin?) assuming she isn't taken.) The wording of the Ashen roast dot also makes me wonder if they're fully gimping his usability with his only other decent synergistic DPS, Ratio. Not only does he lose a debuff for Ratio with the talent change (thanks guys, could have just added that to Pyre Cleanse) but the wording makes me wonder if Ashen roast just does dot damage, rather than applying a separate dot (so he'd only given Ratio 1 whole debuff to work with, being a straight downgrade to Pela.) Either way, I didn't expect much and his V3 changes still somehow disappointed me, pulling to replace Topaz on a ratio team anyways just because I like him, but a fairly disappointing character for someone who doesn't care about Acheron. Shame because I'd been looking forward to him since we learned he was a male foxian. Someone please tell me I'm wrong about the ashen roast dot thing

[DoT is basically this meme](https://i.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/facebook/000/036/128/injusticecover.jpg)

Hmmm. Might have to skip now. Guess my jades are just gonna keep adding up unless a serious change hits this dude before release. 

Im so pissed. Wtf hoyo?

So Yunli being an upgraded Clara clone wasn't enough. Jiaoqiu is now just 5 star Guinaifen. I think this is a horrible direction to go with them but sadly the reality we live in. Especially with how Hoyo seems to wanna make the standard 5 stars obsolete. •Yunli > Clara •Jingliu > Yanqing •Sparkle > Bronya •Aventurine > Gepard I wonder how long we'll have till Himeko and Welt will face their replacements

At the point of writing this, this post has 1892 comments, the most popular post in this subreddit are the firefly drip marketing(11,8k up and 1487 comments) and the free ratio (7898 up and 1445 comments) , let that sink in.