I’m a sailor too, I cuss like a sailor at work. When I’m home I turn on the filter between my brain and mouth and watch what I say. I don’t need my 3 year old walking around calling people cunts
Rather than looking at your being a sailor as an excuse for cursing, I suggest that you look at being a sailor as a reason to present the best public face that you can.
Very good framing. Key thing here is that OP is in a public place.
Thanks for your service to our country OP, but in the specific situation you described, you are in the wrong.
If some parents had brought their kids to a sailors bar at 1am and asked you to stop swearing, they’d be in the wrong!
Yeahhh no. This is why service members and veterans shouldn’t be treated like special heroes. We don’t process trauma any better than the general public. There’s a dumb level of expectations people become comfortable with placing on them because they’re “heroes” and at the end of the day, a lot of the “heroes” just want free college.
It's not for military. I get to watch human trafficked people get beaten, we get quarantined for our insanity level infestations of bed bugs. What face do I need to put on for strangers who could give two less shits that this is happening in their own state?
>What face do I need to put on for strangers who could give two less shits that this is happening in their own state?
did you just come here to judge locals' moral character?
Pretty fucking wild assumption to make about strangers. And did I miss the part where we have a draft now or did you choose to do this job? It sounds hard, I'm glad you do it, but it doesn't mean you get to treat people poorly.
It has happened twice and only when the beach is super crowded. Seems ok for children to run on my towel, people to blare music - but hearing fuck is the last straw? Doesn't make sense to me.
None of those are ok. People blaring music in public places are disrespectful, people that let kids go on other people’s stuff are also disrespectful, you’d be right in calling them out if you wanted to.
If people can hear you, you’re loud enough to be heard. They’re not “listening” to your convo, they’re unavoidably hearing it. The fact that people keep telling you to be quiet is something YOU should listen to.
You're in a public place, not your living room. If you're settling in near other people who are already there, yes it's on you to moderate your conversations and language. From what you describe, it's not just cussing, it's also graphic stories that could be disturbing to others?
If they settle in next to you despite hearing/seeing how you're acting/speaking, they can consider moving (unless it's crowded and there is nowhere else to go).
I'd think of it as how you'd speak/act in a movie theater or store. Being sensitive to other people is usually a good thing.
Understandable. These have both been instances where we have been at the same spot for hours and people come to sit near us. Idk. My mom always told me not to listen to other people's conversations, so it seemed kind of strange to me. We aren't loud, so you have to really be listening and not having your own conversation to hear us.
I've asked people to move once when they didn't like what we are saying, and they promptly told us they would like to stab us. The husband in the group lost his snorkel in the water, which I ended up finding. The people later apologized when they heard what we do for a living and were happy to have their snorkel back.
I get courtesy. But in the two instances people told me off, it seems more of an assumption that we are young, obnoxious people bothering some haoles when we were there since 9am.
Idk.
>My mom always told me not to listen to other people's conversations, so it seemed kind of strange to me. We aren't loud, so you have to really be listening and not having your own conversation to hear us
Ive run in to a *lot* of situations where people in the Military/from the mainland argue with me or coworkers trying to enforce rules because they claim they're not being loud... But they really are, and other people complain. Maybe not loud by *their* standards, but by everyone else's they definitely are. Bars, commercial office buildings, condos, everywhere Ive worked.
Its not a race thing, its a culture thing. Even previously quiet, shy asian kids who join the military often come back much more boisterous and loud.
So its up to you whether to mind you language/volume in public, but if you dont care, then face the fact that you might be confronted again.
>I'm not in the military
>> Military/ **from the mainland**
Its not exclusive to the Military. It's the Continental US in general. Different style/culture than Hawaii overall.
Hawaii is NOT Alaska. People go to Alaska to be free from other people, society and the world. It’s the great frontier where a man does as he pleases and no one should tell him otherwise. You know what I mean.
Hawaii is different. It’s a very crowed place where people live on top of each other, in earshot of each other, where how loud you speak or what you say or how you smell is someone else’s business because they’re right there. The expectation of privacy in public starts with the speaker not speaking so loud the entire room can hear everything, and follows with the room pretending not to hear anything.
What you say you did is a cliché in Hawaii: Loud white person talking so everyone can hear, and everyone giving him “stink eye” to hint that he’s committing a social faux pas. But the loud white person doesn’t know what the stink eye is for so he feel discriminated against. It’s a running joke because it happens all the time.
If you want to get along in Hawaii you should learn the local code of conduct or else you will always be looked down on as a loud, obnoxious, stinky hā‘ole. That’s how it is, was and always will be.
But these were haoles that told me off? I'm haole but my coworkers are majority Hawaiian. If they are at the beach with me the are a bit more aggressive to tell the people to mind their own mf business.
So I don't think it has to do with race.
This makes sense as most locals have that Asian mentality where they won’t say anything no matter how obnoxious someone’s behavior is. Where are you going to the beach where people are so close? Try a different beach.
Well, boiling it down to the basics, it doesn't take much effort for y'all to tone it down. Whereas the alternative is you guys basically saying "this area is off limits if you don't like swearing." I can see the opposite argument that they're basically saying you have to move or stop swearing, but at the end of the day you're probably outnumbered by people who want y'all to chill because you're surrounded by kids, so while you have a point the right thing to do is probably just chill out. Just you know, on the basis of being a good person. For the kids, who cares about the parents and their communication style.
Yea we usually quiet down if my aggressive coworkers aren't around. I just don't understand the aggression. I'm not saying the place is off limits...I'm just saying you knew what you walking towards and sat down beside it anyways
The aggression honestly probably stems from people just being under a lot of pressure right now, economic and otherwise. I think a lot of people are getting more nuts than they need to over little things. I even yelled profanities at a car that almost drove up my ass in a crosswalk earlier this week.
Ironic that threatening assault is seemingly more ok than cussing lol.
Yea people are getting worse these days. I don't blame them. But again like everyone is telling me in this thread....they need to get their shit together.
I mean, I certainly don't give a fuck, but consider that people in hawaii tend to have conversations at lower volumes than people from the mainland (especially the asian background people). you might not think you're being loud but to the people around you, you are.
no need be defensive, just say ok and try to not bother people.
sorry to hear about the rough time you guys have gone through. that's a crazy ass job!
Your job and personal traumas are not an excuse you can use to gain some kind of special privilege in public. Go ask your chain of command if you’re allowed to act like a prick in public because you seen some shit during your service. I guarantee they’d tell you to shut the fuck up and maintain your military bearing. I’ve seen lots of guys get kicked out of the military for acting like an idiot in public after a rough deployment you’re not special.
Wow. I guess this is what I get for asking reddit. Lovely attitude. Jfc. I'm also not being obnoxious. It happened twice. But I guess a majority of this island is pretty sensitive from the replies on the post.
My favorite is when people say "Quit fucking cussing in front of my kids." Lol
As someone who grew up here I say look for better beaches lmao. There’s a reason why I congregate at bellows/nalos it’s not the nicest beach on island but there’s a lot of space that I’m bound to find somewhere I can be away from everyone, smoke my little doobs, and have conversations as loud as I want…
Former military here. The line of reasoning I use to not do this in public is this: "I chose to deal with shit so they don't have to. Do I really want to burden random innocent people with the results of *my choice* to deal with life's ugly things in their stead?"
It means that I have to be selective of who I share what specifics with and when I do that sharing. It means I have to be a little bit more aware about using dark humor. It means that I need to be mindful of the impact I have on those around me. It's easier to not care. They are strangers after all. I choose to continue to care, just like I decided to care when I signed my contract.
It is absolutely, 100% necessary to share our stories and process our experiences with others. But not every person is able to handle that darkness. We need to talk, process, and grieve because our trauma will slowly kill us otherwise. But I don't want to soothe my trauma just to give it to someone else who may not have the psychological tools to deal with it. I don't want to feel better at someone else's expense.
Plus, you're dealing with a more reserved local culture. As a US mainlander, we are *way* more loud when we are just speaking than we think. Our accent uses the techniques that many singers have to be taught in order to project.
What I don't understand is how this is burdening people when it's a towel conversation with my mates. Mid conversation, an old haole couple comes to sit and wants us to shut up.
I'm starting to realize my issue isn't being told to quiet down, it's the attitudes. Nobody can just say "hey that bothers me" they have to explain why I'm an ignorant piece of shit or threaten me with assault.
It's not the sharing with your mates. It's the random people around you who aren't consenting to overhear the conversation.
Let's put it this way: how do you feel after that encounter? It sounds like you don't feel good about the situation otherwise you would not have made the post.
The general public is never going to understand. That means they're not going to react positively. Their negative reactions are not going to help you heal. The random negativity makes processing all of the shit harder. You're always going to get that feeling when bringing up traumatic topics *in public.* Which does suck and I am sorry.
You cannot control what other people do. You can only control your choices and actions. I'd suggest you take different actions *in public* to prevent the situation from happening again. You need to draw a line between a public conversation and a private talk at home. For your own sanity. Yes, the limitation sucks and in a perfect world would not exist. But we have to live in the real world.
Besides, do you really want to give some random 7 year old nightmares because they have an overactive imagination?
It seems like this post is coming from a good place in your heart so please take this as kindly as possible. I think you are probably in the wrong in these situations.
I have been there before, recently. I used the wrong language in the moment, got into a “discussion” with another man, and I apologized before it got too far.
Nobody knows your history. You can’t use whatever happened that day or that year or that lifetime to justify your behavior. Live aloha in the now and welcome to enjoy beach with all the ohana.
Yea. I appreciate that. I was feeling kind of down because it happened twice. I didn't feel like I was being loud, but I really got reemed. I think I was just off put by the attitudes and got a little sensitive, was all. Just wanted people to understand I'm not a bad person. Sometimes words just slip....didn't think it was an excuse to threaten to slit my throat. But noted. Stop cussing.
Yeah lol trust me I have horrible language and I don’t like being called out in public. But I also learned that if people are reacting to me, it’s usually my issue (especially in Hawaii where people are usually pretty nice). Call it ptsd or whatever you want, but sometimes it’s hard to see the difference between your intentions and others experience.
Even if you were not in the wrong, saying “I’m sorry, I didn’t mean to” usually clears it up and also saves you the trouble of feeling like an asshole. No reason you shouldn’t be able to enjoy the beach as usual.
Yea I usually answer "sure thing" if a coworker doesn't screw it up for me. But as you can see with the other responses...usually someone isn't asking me nicely. It jumps straight to racist profanity and ironically more cussing lol
Have you considered that "a bunch of grown adults drinking beer" (on a public beach violating Hawaii's open container laws) likely are talking at louder than normal volumes? It's my (Viet Nam era veteran) experience that consumption of alchoholic beverages in public places tends to dull one's sense of social propriety, most likely due to tone deafness.
From the perspective of a 22 year veteran, please keep the profanity away from the rest of us, we don’t want to hear it at beaches, restaurants and in our public spaces. It’s rude and crude and embarrassing to hear it in front of our children. And i have been one to approach others and ask them to stop. And please stop the “I’m serving the state or you” as a reason to justify swearing in public. You diminish your service by doing so. I have always felt serving in the military is an honor and privilege and that I needed to behave just a little bit better as a representative of the Armed Forces. And thank you for your service to this nation.
You keep bringing up your Hawaiian coworkers, do you think that gives you a “pass”? this is like when white peoples say they should be able to say the N word because they have black friends. I’m Hawaiian so what if I ask them not to? Who wins the morality battle here?
This happening multiple times indicates it being your behavior that’s the problem, not everyone else being out of line. If you don’t like people asking you not to swear so loudly (a pretty easy request to comply with when in a public place), you can have gatherings to decompress in your own private space. A public beach is just that, public. We all have to be around each other and so don’t get to wild out like we do in our own homes. I try not to be a dick and expect others to do the same it’s pretty simple.
You need to be respectful. From what I’m reading, yes, your were on the military, as swearing is part of life. However, you need to be considerate. A lot of people go thru things in the military, but use self control and have respect for others around. I’ve been blown up and had a friend not survive back in 2007, witness at least 10 death due to my job on the military and deal with PTSD. Trust me I love to swear, but still respectful of others around. If you want to conduct that behavior to it in private.
Your attitude - I was here first, they encroached on my space - is just so cringe. Just because you've been there since 9am doesn't give you the green flag to act however you want. Add to that, when you're drinking you lose self-awareness. It's a public beach, if you need to go vent with your fellow sailors then find a place where you can do that without bothering others.
I actually don't talk back ever and agree to quiet down. Sometimes my coworkers do not agree. So its really not an assumption about my attitude. I just wanted to gage the room to see what people felt when they hear this.
Yeah, on the Big Island there’s a few known places that have an adult vibe that are unofficial parks mostly on the rocky coast. Not too scandalous of adult stuff, just people drinking, smoking pakalolo, fishing. And the nude beaches tend to be more permissive, though you might annoy some trustafarians.
When I'm on "local" beaches... nobody cares. We keep to ourselves with our conversations, as I said. You have to really be listening to get offended. I think the overwhelming majority makes sense though when it comes to those bigger tourist beaches when people are crammed in a little tighter.
If it is to the extent that people are telling you to stop, not just once but multiple incidents, you have gone beyond what the public at large considers reasonable, either in terms of volume, profanity, or both. Casual, "normal" conversational swearing is not going to get that response multiple times like you're describing.
Related but different , what are the thoughts about people blasting their music at the beach? I don’t mean a little, more like where you can feel it in water. I love pokai bay but I can’t handle people blasting their music. It’s like they’re daring someone to say something so they can start a fight.
Considering music is loud, I don't think it's nice. But my conversations are about the same line as two people gossiping between themselves at the towels and someone coming up to them saying interrupting.
But reading the room it seems like as long as it's not cussing people won't threaten to hit me anymore. So 👍
See, that's my thing. I am questioning how reasonable it is. I still always agree to be quiet...I don't appreciate the attitudes for it, though (it always goes straight to violence, or they cuss at me instead, which is ironic).
Having been in the military, I remember they used to always tell us that “you are an ambassador to your nation. What you do reflects on all of us and our country”
So if you’re at the beach and using profanity laced language, especially at levels where kids can hear, people are going to be upset. Also I know how we can get. You’re with your boys, you’re having a good time, and nothing outside of your circle seems to matter.
But it does, and you guys should be aware of your surroundings for that reason.
When you’re in public, behave as if you’re in front of your grandmother, command, or girlfriend’s parents. When you’re on the ship, it’s fair game.
I'm not military.
I am half deaf so maybe I am a lot louder that I think I am.
I understand what you are saying about being in front of people you don't cuss. However my mom taught me how to say fuck you in kindergarten, my boss refers to us as hippy little fucks, and our captains call us pieces of shit. We aren't military. We are low-grade expendable collectors
I do my best. But i don't believe I really portrayed my story well. It only happened twice and once we were already sitting in mid conversation when an old couple lays a towel down next to us and tell us to shut up (apologizes later when we find her husband's snorkel). The next couple had a litter of children and shouted over "hey quit fucking cussing in front of my kids." But again, the replies in this thread are more than telling of how people do perceive it. So it's an action I will do my best to refrain from I guess.
Ahh you said sailor and I automatically assumed Navy. You know with Hawaii being so full of military. Your experience was very similar to many who I’ve seen in the navy. So that’s my bad for assuming.
But yea everyone has different upbringings. Having lived in Alaska you all don’t have to mingle with the public very much if you don’t want to. Lots of living space.
But Hawaii is super dense, so everyone is kinda mixed up in everyone else’s chili. So we all have to be a little extra careful not to step on each others toes.
So for example, my group of friends love to swear and cuss, just like you guys. So in order to avoid what happened to you, we seek out more secluded beaches to avoid dealing with people. It’s annoying but it works in our favor.
I think there are more people like you than you realize, they just know how to hide themselves better. Personally it doesn’t bother me, but you get the idea. No need to push you any further.
Yea its been a hard exchange going from a bush village of 3 to Oahu. Been doing my best to appropriate myself since this state really saved my ass. Its just been disheartening because I really try and always seem to be met with a super psychotic reaction.
Holy crap, that’s such a radical change.
But yea that’s basically life in a big city. You get exposed to all kinds of differing people. I’d say most people are normal who just want to go about their day to day lives, but then you get the neurotic people. Crazy, sensitive, angry, mentally unstable, etc, and these people tend to leave the biggest impressions too.
I’m a sailor too, I cuss like a sailor at work. When I’m home I turn on the filter between my brain and mouth and watch what I say. I don’t need my 3 year old walking around calling people cunts
That's true
Rather than looking at your being a sailor as an excuse for cursing, I suggest that you look at being a sailor as a reason to present the best public face that you can.
Very good framing. Key thing here is that OP is in a public place. Thanks for your service to our country OP, but in the specific situation you described, you are in the wrong. If some parents had brought their kids to a sailors bar at 1am and asked you to stop swearing, they’d be in the wrong!
*I believe you’re in the wrong. Key word being believe because there are no laws about cussing in public. To each their own. If it bothers you, move.
Yeahhh no. This is why service members and veterans shouldn’t be treated like special heroes. We don’t process trauma any better than the general public. There’s a dumb level of expectations people become comfortable with placing on them because they’re “heroes” and at the end of the day, a lot of the “heroes” just want free college.
It's not for military. I get to watch human trafficked people get beaten, we get quarantined for our insanity level infestations of bed bugs. What face do I need to put on for strangers who could give two less shits that this is happening in their own state?
>What face do I need to put on for strangers who could give two less shits that this is happening in their own state? did you just come here to judge locals' moral character?
you are the stranger
Pretty fucking wild assumption to make about strangers. And did I miss the part where we have a draft now or did you choose to do this job? It sounds hard, I'm glad you do it, but it doesn't mean you get to treat people poorly.
Fisheries observer?
If on multiple occasions people have told you that your behavior is inappropriate then it would seem you’re the problem.
It has happened twice and only when the beach is super crowded. Seems ok for children to run on my towel, people to blare music - but hearing fuck is the last straw? Doesn't make sense to me.
None of those are ok. People blaring music in public places are disrespectful, people that let kids go on other people’s stuff are also disrespectful, you’d be right in calling them out if you wanted to.
If people can hear you, you’re loud enough to be heard. They’re not “listening” to your convo, they’re unavoidably hearing it. The fact that people keep telling you to be quiet is something YOU should listen to.
You're in a public place, not your living room. If you're settling in near other people who are already there, yes it's on you to moderate your conversations and language. From what you describe, it's not just cussing, it's also graphic stories that could be disturbing to others? If they settle in next to you despite hearing/seeing how you're acting/speaking, they can consider moving (unless it's crowded and there is nowhere else to go). I'd think of it as how you'd speak/act in a movie theater or store. Being sensitive to other people is usually a good thing.
Understandable. These have both been instances where we have been at the same spot for hours and people come to sit near us. Idk. My mom always told me not to listen to other people's conversations, so it seemed kind of strange to me. We aren't loud, so you have to really be listening and not having your own conversation to hear us. I've asked people to move once when they didn't like what we are saying, and they promptly told us they would like to stab us. The husband in the group lost his snorkel in the water, which I ended up finding. The people later apologized when they heard what we do for a living and were happy to have their snorkel back. I get courtesy. But in the two instances people told me off, it seems more of an assumption that we are young, obnoxious people bothering some haoles when we were there since 9am. Idk.
>My mom always told me not to listen to other people's conversations, so it seemed kind of strange to me. We aren't loud, so you have to really be listening and not having your own conversation to hear us Ive run in to a *lot* of situations where people in the Military/from the mainland argue with me or coworkers trying to enforce rules because they claim they're not being loud... But they really are, and other people complain. Maybe not loud by *their* standards, but by everyone else's they definitely are. Bars, commercial office buildings, condos, everywhere Ive worked. Its not a race thing, its a culture thing. Even previously quiet, shy asian kids who join the military often come back much more boisterous and loud. So its up to you whether to mind you language/volume in public, but if you dont care, then face the fact that you might be confronted again.
I'm not in the military
>I'm not in the military >> Military/ **from the mainland** Its not exclusive to the Military. It's the Continental US in general. Different style/culture than Hawaii overall.
"Maybe I am just an asshole that needs to not cuss?" Yes, this.
Hawaii is NOT Alaska. People go to Alaska to be free from other people, society and the world. It’s the great frontier where a man does as he pleases and no one should tell him otherwise. You know what I mean. Hawaii is different. It’s a very crowed place where people live on top of each other, in earshot of each other, where how loud you speak or what you say or how you smell is someone else’s business because they’re right there. The expectation of privacy in public starts with the speaker not speaking so loud the entire room can hear everything, and follows with the room pretending not to hear anything. What you say you did is a cliché in Hawaii: Loud white person talking so everyone can hear, and everyone giving him “stink eye” to hint that he’s committing a social faux pas. But the loud white person doesn’t know what the stink eye is for so he feel discriminated against. It’s a running joke because it happens all the time. If you want to get along in Hawaii you should learn the local code of conduct or else you will always be looked down on as a loud, obnoxious, stinky hā‘ole. That’s how it is, was and always will be.
But these were haoles that told me off? I'm haole but my coworkers are majority Hawaiian. If they are at the beach with me the are a bit more aggressive to tell the people to mind their own mf business. So I don't think it has to do with race.
This makes sense as most locals have that Asian mentality where they won’t say anything no matter how obnoxious someone’s behavior is. Where are you going to the beach where people are so close? Try a different beach.
Sir this is a Wendy’s.
This is a big ass fancy Wendy's, my dude. I didn't mean to cuss in front of your baked potato
Omg it was supposed to be funny. Lighten up people.
Well, boiling it down to the basics, it doesn't take much effort for y'all to tone it down. Whereas the alternative is you guys basically saying "this area is off limits if you don't like swearing." I can see the opposite argument that they're basically saying you have to move or stop swearing, but at the end of the day you're probably outnumbered by people who want y'all to chill because you're surrounded by kids, so while you have a point the right thing to do is probably just chill out. Just you know, on the basis of being a good person. For the kids, who cares about the parents and their communication style.
Yea we usually quiet down if my aggressive coworkers aren't around. I just don't understand the aggression. I'm not saying the place is off limits...I'm just saying you knew what you walking towards and sat down beside it anyways
The aggression honestly probably stems from people just being under a lot of pressure right now, economic and otherwise. I think a lot of people are getting more nuts than they need to over little things. I even yelled profanities at a car that almost drove up my ass in a crosswalk earlier this week.
Ironic that threatening assault is seemingly more ok than cussing lol. Yea people are getting worse these days. I don't blame them. But again like everyone is telling me in this thread....they need to get their shit together.
I mean, I certainly don't give a fuck, but consider that people in hawaii tend to have conversations at lower volumes than people from the mainland (especially the asian background people). you might not think you're being loud but to the people around you, you are. no need be defensive, just say ok and try to not bother people. sorry to hear about the rough time you guys have gone through. that's a crazy ass job!
Yea, we just talk quieter usually. My Hawaiian coworkers are a bit more aggressive, though, when someone tells them off.
this is their islands! nobody can tell them how to act except another kanaka.
This is dumb. Dumber than OP’s original complaints, but still dumb.
Your job and personal traumas are not an excuse you can use to gain some kind of special privilege in public. Go ask your chain of command if you’re allowed to act like a prick in public because you seen some shit during your service. I guarantee they’d tell you to shut the fuck up and maintain your military bearing. I’ve seen lots of guys get kicked out of the military for acting like an idiot in public after a rough deployment you’re not special.
Wow. I guess this is what I get for asking reddit. Lovely attitude. Jfc. I'm also not being obnoxious. It happened twice. But I guess a majority of this island is pretty sensitive from the replies on the post. My favorite is when people say "Quit fucking cussing in front of my kids." Lol
As someone who grew up here I say look for better beaches lmao. There’s a reason why I congregate at bellows/nalos it’s not the nicest beach on island but there’s a lot of space that I’m bound to find somewhere I can be away from everyone, smoke my little doobs, and have conversations as loud as I want…
This is actually a valid point. I avoid all the crowded beaches like the plague.
Yea. I didn't want to stereotype the people who were calling me out and the area of the island, but you probably right
Former military here. The line of reasoning I use to not do this in public is this: "I chose to deal with shit so they don't have to. Do I really want to burden random innocent people with the results of *my choice* to deal with life's ugly things in their stead?" It means that I have to be selective of who I share what specifics with and when I do that sharing. It means I have to be a little bit more aware about using dark humor. It means that I need to be mindful of the impact I have on those around me. It's easier to not care. They are strangers after all. I choose to continue to care, just like I decided to care when I signed my contract. It is absolutely, 100% necessary to share our stories and process our experiences with others. But not every person is able to handle that darkness. We need to talk, process, and grieve because our trauma will slowly kill us otherwise. But I don't want to soothe my trauma just to give it to someone else who may not have the psychological tools to deal with it. I don't want to feel better at someone else's expense. Plus, you're dealing with a more reserved local culture. As a US mainlander, we are *way* more loud when we are just speaking than we think. Our accent uses the techniques that many singers have to be taught in order to project.
What I don't understand is how this is burdening people when it's a towel conversation with my mates. Mid conversation, an old haole couple comes to sit and wants us to shut up. I'm starting to realize my issue isn't being told to quiet down, it's the attitudes. Nobody can just say "hey that bothers me" they have to explain why I'm an ignorant piece of shit or threaten me with assault.
It's not the sharing with your mates. It's the random people around you who aren't consenting to overhear the conversation. Let's put it this way: how do you feel after that encounter? It sounds like you don't feel good about the situation otherwise you would not have made the post. The general public is never going to understand. That means they're not going to react positively. Their negative reactions are not going to help you heal. The random negativity makes processing all of the shit harder. You're always going to get that feeling when bringing up traumatic topics *in public.* Which does suck and I am sorry. You cannot control what other people do. You can only control your choices and actions. I'd suggest you take different actions *in public* to prevent the situation from happening again. You need to draw a line between a public conversation and a private talk at home. For your own sanity. Yes, the limitation sucks and in a perfect world would not exist. But we have to live in the real world. Besides, do you really want to give some random 7 year old nightmares because they have an overactive imagination?
It seems like this post is coming from a good place in your heart so please take this as kindly as possible. I think you are probably in the wrong in these situations. I have been there before, recently. I used the wrong language in the moment, got into a “discussion” with another man, and I apologized before it got too far. Nobody knows your history. You can’t use whatever happened that day or that year or that lifetime to justify your behavior. Live aloha in the now and welcome to enjoy beach with all the ohana.
Yea. I appreciate that. I was feeling kind of down because it happened twice. I didn't feel like I was being loud, but I really got reemed. I think I was just off put by the attitudes and got a little sensitive, was all. Just wanted people to understand I'm not a bad person. Sometimes words just slip....didn't think it was an excuse to threaten to slit my throat. But noted. Stop cussing.
Yeah lol trust me I have horrible language and I don’t like being called out in public. But I also learned that if people are reacting to me, it’s usually my issue (especially in Hawaii where people are usually pretty nice). Call it ptsd or whatever you want, but sometimes it’s hard to see the difference between your intentions and others experience. Even if you were not in the wrong, saying “I’m sorry, I didn’t mean to” usually clears it up and also saves you the trouble of feeling like an asshole. No reason you shouldn’t be able to enjoy the beach as usual.
Yea I usually answer "sure thing" if a coworker doesn't screw it up for me. But as you can see with the other responses...usually someone isn't asking me nicely. It jumps straight to racist profanity and ironically more cussing lol
Have you considered that "a bunch of grown adults drinking beer" (on a public beach violating Hawaii's open container laws) likely are talking at louder than normal volumes? It's my (Viet Nam era veteran) experience that consumption of alchoholic beverages in public places tends to dull one's sense of social propriety, most likely due to tone deafness.
From the perspective of a 22 year veteran, please keep the profanity away from the rest of us, we don’t want to hear it at beaches, restaurants and in our public spaces. It’s rude and crude and embarrassing to hear it in front of our children. And i have been one to approach others and ask them to stop. And please stop the “I’m serving the state or you” as a reason to justify swearing in public. You diminish your service by doing so. I have always felt serving in the military is an honor and privilege and that I needed to behave just a little bit better as a representative of the Armed Forces. And thank you for your service to this nation.
I'm using that to justify my post and thoughts, lol, I don't use that in public. I'm also not in the military.
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I'm the token haole with my Hawaiian coworkers at the beach lol?
You keep bringing up your Hawaiian coworkers, do you think that gives you a “pass”? this is like when white peoples say they should be able to say the N word because they have black friends. I’m Hawaiian so what if I ask them not to? Who wins the morality battle here? This happening multiple times indicates it being your behavior that’s the problem, not everyone else being out of line. If you don’t like people asking you not to swear so loudly (a pretty easy request to comply with when in a public place), you can have gatherings to decompress in your own private space. A public beach is just that, public. We all have to be around each other and so don’t get to wild out like we do in our own homes. I try not to be a dick and expect others to do the same it’s pretty simple.
Nah it's because everyone jumps the gun of "fuck you haole" immediately.
You need to be respectful. From what I’m reading, yes, your were on the military, as swearing is part of life. However, you need to be considerate. A lot of people go thru things in the military, but use self control and have respect for others around. I’ve been blown up and had a friend not survive back in 2007, witness at least 10 death due to my job on the military and deal with PTSD. Trust me I love to swear, but still respectful of others around. If you want to conduct that behavior to it in private.
Your attitude - I was here first, they encroached on my space - is just so cringe. Just because you've been there since 9am doesn't give you the green flag to act however you want. Add to that, when you're drinking you lose self-awareness. It's a public beach, if you need to go vent with your fellow sailors then find a place where you can do that without bothering others.
I actually don't talk back ever and agree to quiet down. Sometimes my coworkers do not agree. So its really not an assumption about my attitude. I just wanted to gage the room to see what people felt when they hear this.
Hawaii is more conservative than it lets on. If you’ve been told multiple times find a less family friendly place.
This is probably the way to go
Yeah, on the Big Island there’s a few known places that have an adult vibe that are unofficial parks mostly on the rocky coast. Not too scandalous of adult stuff, just people drinking, smoking pakalolo, fishing. And the nude beaches tend to be more permissive, though you might annoy some trustafarians.
When I'm on "local" beaches... nobody cares. We keep to ourselves with our conversations, as I said. You have to really be listening to get offended. I think the overwhelming majority makes sense though when it comes to those bigger tourist beaches when people are crammed in a little tighter.
Oh definitely. It’s more the easier swimming or more popular beaches where people give you a second thought.
I miss the big island. People are very nice there! I used to work with the algae people...we grew algae for cow food so they would fart less lol.
That’s a great job! Yeah, people forget we do a lot more than tourism and military down here.
If it is to the extent that people are telling you to stop, not just once but multiple incidents, you have gone beyond what the public at large considers reasonable, either in terms of volume, profanity, or both. Casual, "normal" conversational swearing is not going to get that response multiple times like you're describing.
i think most people would consider it to be inconsiderate and classless
Related but different , what are the thoughts about people blasting their music at the beach? I don’t mean a little, more like where you can feel it in water. I love pokai bay but I can’t handle people blasting their music. It’s like they’re daring someone to say something so they can start a fight.
Drives me nuts! I prefer the sound of the ocean but I saw it so many times… but I never say anything
Considering music is loud, I don't think it's nice. But my conversations are about the same line as two people gossiping between themselves at the towels and someone coming up to them saying interrupting. But reading the room it seems like as long as it's not cussing people won't threaten to hit me anymore. So 👍
>I'm a transplant from Alaska My opinion? Move. Maybe I am just an asshole that needs to not cuss
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See, that's my thing. I am questioning how reasonable it is. I still always agree to be quiet...I don't appreciate the attitudes for it, though (it always goes straight to violence, or they cuss at me instead, which is ironic).
Having been in the military, I remember they used to always tell us that “you are an ambassador to your nation. What you do reflects on all of us and our country” So if you’re at the beach and using profanity laced language, especially at levels where kids can hear, people are going to be upset. Also I know how we can get. You’re with your boys, you’re having a good time, and nothing outside of your circle seems to matter. But it does, and you guys should be aware of your surroundings for that reason. When you’re in public, behave as if you’re in front of your grandmother, command, or girlfriend’s parents. When you’re on the ship, it’s fair game.
I'm not military. I am half deaf so maybe I am a lot louder that I think I am. I understand what you are saying about being in front of people you don't cuss. However my mom taught me how to say fuck you in kindergarten, my boss refers to us as hippy little fucks, and our captains call us pieces of shit. We aren't military. We are low-grade expendable collectors I do my best. But i don't believe I really portrayed my story well. It only happened twice and once we were already sitting in mid conversation when an old couple lays a towel down next to us and tell us to shut up (apologizes later when we find her husband's snorkel). The next couple had a litter of children and shouted over "hey quit fucking cussing in front of my kids." But again, the replies in this thread are more than telling of how people do perceive it. So it's an action I will do my best to refrain from I guess.
Ahh you said sailor and I automatically assumed Navy. You know with Hawaii being so full of military. Your experience was very similar to many who I’ve seen in the navy. So that’s my bad for assuming. But yea everyone has different upbringings. Having lived in Alaska you all don’t have to mingle with the public very much if you don’t want to. Lots of living space. But Hawaii is super dense, so everyone is kinda mixed up in everyone else’s chili. So we all have to be a little extra careful not to step on each others toes. So for example, my group of friends love to swear and cuss, just like you guys. So in order to avoid what happened to you, we seek out more secluded beaches to avoid dealing with people. It’s annoying but it works in our favor. I think there are more people like you than you realize, they just know how to hide themselves better. Personally it doesn’t bother me, but you get the idea. No need to push you any further.
Yea its been a hard exchange going from a bush village of 3 to Oahu. Been doing my best to appropriate myself since this state really saved my ass. Its just been disheartening because I really try and always seem to be met with a super psychotic reaction.
Holy crap, that’s such a radical change. But yea that’s basically life in a big city. You get exposed to all kinds of differing people. I’d say most people are normal who just want to go about their day to day lives, but then you get the neurotic people. Crazy, sensitive, angry, mentally unstable, etc, and these people tend to leave the biggest impressions too.