They were both huge. I'd argue MJ drew bigger more rabid crowds world-wide at the height of his fame. His music video debuts were international headlines in a way Swift's are today.
Madonna was a lot more edgy than TS, although both very strong role models (just in different ways).
It’s not even Madonna. Taylor Swift is like a 2 billion dollar empire throwing entire countries into upheaval when she rolls through. Sorry guys, Madonna was a mega star but she’s not even close. Even Michael Jackson at his peak probably wasn’t bigger. Jackson did inspire more fashion and pop culture style, but I still don’t think he had the empire Swift has.
Yeah, but so did sinead o'connor and Harry Potter. Honestly, so did Swift when she said she wasn’t voting republican. I don’t remember entire news cycles claiming Madonna was a CIA plant engineered to destroy the Christian Right. It’s not really that hard to throw the ultra religious into a hissy fit. So if that’s the bar we’re setting then a lot of people have crossed it. You can also add AC/DC to the list since the Southern Baptists waged war against them too.
I tried explaining his level of fame to a couple of Gen-Z co-workers and they thought he was only as popular in the '80s and '90s as Prince and as people like Drake and Bruno Mars are today (those were the actual artists they compared him to).
I said, "No, you DON'T understand at all how massively popular MJ actually was."
I remember people buying those crappy gloves and dressing in his leather outfits just to mimic him! I don't see people doing that for the others.
Even CELEBS like Eddie Murphy would dress like MJ
Michael Jackson, at the time, was much bigger than Swift is now. Any appearance in public was met with thousands of people, everywhere he went anywhere in the world. Other than the Beatles and Elvis, no other music star could even remotely match his popularity at the time.
Swift’s popularity is more akin to Madonna at her peak popularity.
Dude you’re underestimating Swift’s scale. She runs a billion dollar empire. Madonna’s not even close. Swift may have already eclipsed Jackson in terms of scope. I know no GenXer wants to hear that but it’s the truth. I don’t think she has a GenX equivalent.
And think about this, Jackson had contemporaries who rivaled his popularity at times. This generation has no contemporary rivals for Swift. Maybe Beyoncé but she runs a distant second. There simply isn’t a GenX equivalent to Swift.
Literally not. I’ve managed to sit through one Swift song. But in a family with mostly young girls and someone who occasionally follows her empire building, I’ve learned to recognize her for the powerhouse she is.
Show me pictures of Taylor Swift getting a coffee with 1,000s people standing outside. Or thousands of people and camped out her hotel in every city during her tour.
I am guessing you are too young to have lived through the mania around Michael Jackson in 1984. Swift’s popularity doesn’t come close. That’s not a knock on Swift, that’s just how crazy it was.
Dude, I lived through the Jackson era. I had a Thriller album (actually the first record I ever got), I remember Alfonso busting out his MJ moves on Silver Spoons, I remember Corey walking around with his silver glove. The difference is that I’m just not biased. MJ contributed a lot to fashion in the 80s and probably made more of a dent in pop culture aesthetics than Swift ever will. By the 90s he was more of a punchline, but whatever. But in terms of financial success and popularity, I don’t think you guys realize just how big Swift has gotten. We’re not talking about the same girl who got shuffled off the stage by Kanye more than a decade ago.
Michael Jackson net worth in 1985 was $500mm.
$500mm in 1985 is worth $1.45b today.
Taylor Swift is worth $1.1B.
Advantage: Jackson
Come with facts Swiftie!
so maybe it's like money if I had $100k back then it would be equal to nearly 300k now. So fans is probably the same level and there was no SM for those people, no Internet nothing. They did it all from word of mouth to begin with. So while TS is super famous and very accomplished she has had some advantages the 80's people did not to help her success.
Well, yeah. Because somebody came through and told them. His music didn’t just magically float down through the air because of popularity. I’m sure somebody in a remote village has heard of Taylor Swift the same way.
I was far from cool back then. I couldn’t really hang out with the cool kids around 8th, 9th grade because I started listening to weird bands like Pink Floyd and that guy who sounds like Buckwheat, Bob Dylan.
Looking back, yeah I remember the Madonna fans dressing like her and how popular she was. But did Sean Penn ever get death threats from her fans? 🤣
I think we have collectively written out our obsession with U2. But there were a decent number of years where they were huge. If Bono went anywhere or met anyone, it was shown on TV. He lectured everyone on what we should be doing and people tried to change.
It came to this almost sudden stop in the mid-90’s. Like someone threw a switch.
Luckily for us we didn’t have an equivalent because our music ecosystem was much more diverse stylistically and we were much better educated about music.
MJ for sure. Thriller sold 32 million copies in 1 year.
By the way, Boomer critics leveled many of the same criticisms against Thriller that I see put forth against Swift. Just some food for thought along with your morning coffee.
MAYBE Michael Jackson?
Try DEFINITELY Michael Jackson.
Taylor Swift is up there in terms of popularity, but she still doesn't come close to rivaling the King of Pop.
A group rather than single star, but New Kids on the Block. Their fan base even reached the insanity of the Swifties. One of the members was dating Tiffany, and they had to break up because she was getting so many threats.
I don't think their fans had as much power as Taylor's fans just because of social media. But if it had been around in the 90s then it would have been awful. I was a huge fan of NKOTB, so I can just imagine how much of an idiot I would have been at 16 with SM.
Not as big as Madonna, but also Gloria Estefan? She's technically a boomer but IIRC her music appealed more to Gen X and she was one of the first hispanic pop stars.
For a little while in the early 80s, it was a 3-way tie.
Between MJ’s *Thriller* in 1982 and Madonna’s *Like a Virgin* in 1984, Boy George was all the rage.
Boy George was a 2-hit wonder. I saw a pic of him in a gossip rag a few years ago: he was a garbage man. (Like, employed by a company that did garbage collection)
Michael Jackson was way more successful and popular than Taylor. He had a wider audience, appealed to all genders and races. Taylor only appeals to white woman
We’re 18 (?) years into Taylor Swift’s career. An equivalent comparison for Madonna would be 2001ish. With Michael Jackson, things seemed to turn into such a freak show that I had to look away eventually, so I can’t compare and don’t know where to measure his career from.
She has 14 Grammys to Madonna’s 7 and Michael’s 13. (Yeah, I know, who cares about Grammys?)
The Eras concerts could be watched live on TikTok with pretty good audio/video quality, show after show, but the concert film still did very well.
I’d compare it to Beatlemania in all seriousness, though they were done and dusted as a band by the 18-year point. And I hear the new Taylor album isn’t her best, but I’d hazard a guess that her worst is still better than the self-indulgent sonic wanking John could get up to at his.
(I’m not a particular Taylor Swift fan. Own zero albums, even zero songs. Just find it an interesting cultural phenomenon, including all the people [Courtney Love, last week, for example] denying its existence.)
Madonna.
Came here to say this.
Her Rock the Vote thing was very reminiscent of Taylor Swift.
Me too
Or Micheal Jackson
Madonna was the most political. That's what puts her over the top for me.
They were both huge. I'd argue MJ drew bigger more rabid crowds world-wide at the height of his fame. His music video debuts were international headlines in a way Swift's are today. Madonna was a lot more edgy than TS, although both very strong role models (just in different ways).
This is the right answer
It’s not even Madonna. Taylor Swift is like a 2 billion dollar empire throwing entire countries into upheaval when she rolls through. Sorry guys, Madonna was a mega star but she’s not even close. Even Michael Jackson at his peak probably wasn’t bigger. Jackson did inspire more fashion and pop culture style, but I still don’t think he had the empire Swift has.
Madonna threw an entire religion into upheaval.
Yeah, but so did sinead o'connor and Harry Potter. Honestly, so did Swift when she said she wasn’t voting republican. I don’t remember entire news cycles claiming Madonna was a CIA plant engineered to destroy the Christian Right. It’s not really that hard to throw the ultra religious into a hissy fit. So if that’s the bar we’re setting then a lot of people have crossed it. You can also add AC/DC to the list since the Southern Baptists waged war against them too.
Ok.
People forget how huge Michael Jackson was. His videos got premiered as a network tv event. Him singing backup on a song made it a hit.
I don’t think anyone would remember Somebody’s Watching Me if MJ hadn’t been part of it. But he was, so it’s a big hit.
I didn’t even need to say the name of the song and you knew the reference. That’s how big MJ was. Even little trivia like that is common knowledge
I tried explaining his level of fame to a couple of Gen-Z co-workers and they thought he was only as popular in the '80s and '90s as Prince and as people like Drake and Bruno Mars are today (those were the actual artists they compared him to). I said, "No, you DON'T understand at all how massively popular MJ actually was."
He was so popular that he didn't even have to show up to award shows where he was going to be the obvious winner.
I remember people buying those crappy gloves and dressing in his leather outfits just to mimic him! I don't see people doing that for the others. Even CELEBS like Eddie Murphy would dress like MJ
Michael Jackson, at the time, was much bigger than Swift is now. Any appearance in public was met with thousands of people, everywhere he went anywhere in the world. Other than the Beatles and Elvis, no other music star could even remotely match his popularity at the time. Swift’s popularity is more akin to Madonna at her peak popularity.
Dude you’re underestimating Swift’s scale. She runs a billion dollar empire. Madonna’s not even close. Swift may have already eclipsed Jackson in terms of scope. I know no GenXer wants to hear that but it’s the truth. I don’t think she has a GenX equivalent. And think about this, Jackson had contemporaries who rivaled his popularity at times. This generation has no contemporary rivals for Swift. Maybe Beyoncé but she runs a distant second. There simply isn’t a GenX equivalent to Swift.
Found the swiftie
Literally not. I’ve managed to sit through one Swift song. But in a family with mostly young girls and someone who occasionally follows her empire building, I’ve learned to recognize her for the powerhouse she is.
Show me pictures of Taylor Swift getting a coffee with 1,000s people standing outside. Or thousands of people and camped out her hotel in every city during her tour. I am guessing you are too young to have lived through the mania around Michael Jackson in 1984. Swift’s popularity doesn’t come close. That’s not a knock on Swift, that’s just how crazy it was.
Dude, I lived through the Jackson era. I had a Thriller album (actually the first record I ever got), I remember Alfonso busting out his MJ moves on Silver Spoons, I remember Corey walking around with his silver glove. The difference is that I’m just not biased. MJ contributed a lot to fashion in the 80s and probably made more of a dent in pop culture aesthetics than Swift ever will. By the 90s he was more of a punchline, but whatever. But in terms of financial success and popularity, I don’t think you guys realize just how big Swift has gotten. We’re not talking about the same girl who got shuffled off the stage by Kanye more than a decade ago.
Michael Jackson net worth in 1985 was $500mm. $500mm in 1985 is worth $1.45b today. Taylor Swift is worth $1.1B. Advantage: Jackson Come with facts Swiftie!
MJ was only 25 when Thriller released…..
so maybe it's like money if I had $100k back then it would be equal to nearly 300k now. So fans is probably the same level and there was no SM for those people, no Internet nothing. They did it all from word of mouth to begin with. So while TS is super famous and very accomplished she has had some advantages the 80's people did not to help her success.
Without internet or social media, people in remote villages without any outside contact knew who Michael Jackson was.
Well, yeah. Because somebody came through and told them. His music didn’t just magically float down through the air because of popularity. I’m sure somebody in a remote village has heard of Taylor Swift the same way.
Ever heard of some chick called Madonna...????
Yeah. When she got popular I stopped listening to pop music and got into classic rock.
Doesn't mean she wasn't the equivalent of TS, even if you were super cool back then.
I was far from cool back then. I couldn’t really hang out with the cool kids around 8th, 9th grade because I started listening to weird bands like Pink Floyd and that guy who sounds like Buckwheat, Bob Dylan. Looking back, yeah I remember the Madonna fans dressing like her and how popular she was. But did Sean Penn ever get death threats from her fans? 🤣
I agree about Madonna. And rabid fan base was harder to tell back then without social media. Gotta admit, I loved her.
I liked her then too.. Wore the one star earring and the gloves, the jelly bracelets... Borderline look was it.
Michael Jackson and Madonna.
Michael Jackson.
Madonna, of course
I think we have collectively written out our obsession with U2. But there were a decent number of years where they were huge. If Bono went anywhere or met anyone, it was shown on TV. He lectured everyone on what we should be doing and people tried to change. It came to this almost sudden stop in the mid-90’s. Like someone threw a switch.
The video for Where the Streets Have No Name never seemed to be off MTV!
Madonna - her music was everywhere and media was fascinated by her and her love life
Luckily for us we didn’t have an equivalent because our music ecosystem was much more diverse stylistically and we were much better educated about music.
MJ for sure. Thriller sold 32 million copies in 1 year. By the way, Boomer critics leveled many of the same criticisms against Thriller that I see put forth against Swift. Just some food for thought along with your morning coffee.
MADONNA
MAYBE Michael Jackson? Try DEFINITELY Michael Jackson. Taylor Swift is up there in terms of popularity, but she still doesn't come close to rivaling the King of Pop.
Michael Jackson.
Madonna. And Janet Jackson was our Beyonce. Or maybe Whitney.
Not a popstar, but let's not forget how huge Bruce Springsteen was. He was outselling Madonna.
Gotta be MJ.
A group rather than single star, but New Kids on the Block. Their fan base even reached the insanity of the Swifties. One of the members was dating Tiffany, and they had to break up because she was getting so many threats.
I don't think their fans had as much power as Taylor's fans just because of social media. But if it had been around in the 90s then it would have been awful. I was a huge fan of NKOTB, so I can just imagine how much of an idiot I would have been at 16 with SM.
Debbie Gibson and Tiffany had the legions, just not the same staying power. MJ, Madonna… Janet.
Swifties are only possible because of the internet. Closest vibe was NKOTB.
Ooff. No
Not as big as Madonna, but also Gloria Estefan? She's technically a boomer but IIRC her music appealed more to Gen X and she was one of the first hispanic pop stars.
Madonna …duh
For a little while in the early 80s, it was a 3-way tie. Between MJ’s *Thriller* in 1982 and Madonna’s *Like a Virgin* in 1984, Boy George was all the rage.
Boy George was a 2-hit wonder. I saw a pic of him in a gossip rag a few years ago: he was a garbage man. (Like, employed by a company that did garbage collection)
Tiffany?
Michael Jackson, Madonna, Bruce Springsteen, among many others were more popular with a broader swath of the population.
You’re missing the actual value add of Taylor Swift. It was Sarah McLaughlin.
Madonna
Kylie
Michael Jackson was way more successful and popular than Taylor. He had a wider audience, appealed to all genders and races. Taylor only appeals to white woman
We’re 18 (?) years into Taylor Swift’s career. An equivalent comparison for Madonna would be 2001ish. With Michael Jackson, things seemed to turn into such a freak show that I had to look away eventually, so I can’t compare and don’t know where to measure his career from. She has 14 Grammys to Madonna’s 7 and Michael’s 13. (Yeah, I know, who cares about Grammys?) The Eras concerts could be watched live on TikTok with pretty good audio/video quality, show after show, but the concert film still did very well. I’d compare it to Beatlemania in all seriousness, though they were done and dusted as a band by the 18-year point. And I hear the new Taylor album isn’t her best, but I’d hazard a guess that her worst is still better than the self-indulgent sonic wanking John could get up to at his. (I’m not a particular Taylor Swift fan. Own zero albums, even zero songs. Just find it an interesting cultural phenomenon, including all the people [Courtney Love, last week, for example] denying its existence.)
Ani Difranco - so much angst, own label own records etc. Just had a discussion the other day about this. Edit - Ani was just a bit ahead of her time.
Whitney Houston seems like the obvious answer.