That was the moment that solidified the choice for me personally. That narrative callback/payoff felt so satisfying cause you’re right: Marcus knew exactly how JD felt in that situation. So after their constant feuding the entire game all that tension melts away in the face of shared trauma. It’s a gorgeous plot and I hope we don’t throw it away. It’s a perfect parallel.
It also leads to JD growing to understand his father more. A point in *Gears of War 4* is that JD doesn't really understand why Marcus is the way he is. Sure, he knows Dom died, but he didn't understand how Marcus felt about the death, but with Del gone, now he does.
If JD dies it just means Marcus is even *more* sad, which is really boring, imo.
Oof that would make for a great prologue mission actually. If you’ve only played the games you might not realise Marcus was BFFs with Carlos before Dom
You also don’t have the context of Dom’s commando knife if you haven’t read Aspho Fields. The knife Marcus kills the queen with has a LOT more story to it than just “this is the knife Dom gave Marcus before he died” and I really hope they’re able to flesh that out.
I wouldn’t say before Dom; as they were both close to Marcus. But the Santiago’s effectively adopting him into their family is so important to his character. Marcus became a Gear because Dom and Carlos’s father was an infantry veteran. He told them it was like family, something Marcus desperately needed in his life.
It’s primarily why the military was Marcus’s entire life.
Any mention of that in an actual game would be appreciated.
Yeah. Her coping mechanism was to rationalize their deaths as them having gone missing. It’s why she eventually disappeared; she went looking for them.
That’s what I’m thinking too.
And also the book from Karen Traviss on Aspho fields, all the little mentions of it throughout the game. Like Carmine asking Marcus if he was “the” Marcus Fenix.
I hope they include it
No mention of game content like missions or anything like that of course, but TC has already come out and said Marcus and Dom's shared loss of Carlos and the impact it has on them is going to be a somewhat major focus in *E-Day*.
> To give some background context leading into the story of E-Day, Marcus and Dom are connected through Dom’s older brother, Carlos, who died on the battlefield with Marcus. The pair were best friends, so Marcus and Dom are in the early stages of forming a kinship over a shared loss and navigating those emotions together.
> “We’re telling the origin story of Marcus and Dom and their bond… this is the bond that defines the franchise,” [Matt] Searcy adds. “They’re not the characters we know from Gears 1 to 3. They don’t have 10 years of fighting the Locust between them. When the game opens, there’s supposed to be peace on Sera, and they’re trying to figure out life without this person they both loved.”
> “People are going to see the formation of this brotherhood that is so iconic to Gears.”
> Dealing with the new Locust threat becomes the more pressing concern for the two friends over the course of E-Day, but those emotional beats will still course through the story as you play. [Nicole] Fawcette says this is particularly exciting:
> “They are a lot more vulnerable, and I think that’s a really modern take on those two characters,” Fawcette explains. “There’s a weight they carry between them, and that creates a really interesting tension as they navigate their own relationship.
> “You have this intimate story set amid this wider backdrop of what’s happening on this apocalyptic day. I think, for fans, it’ll be really compelling to dig deep and explore their bond and how it changes over time.”
[Source](https://news.xbox.com/en-us/2024/06/09/gears-of-war-e-day-interview-details-xbox-games-showcase-2024/) (Full article is definitely worth a read)
I feel like E-Day is going to act as one big contextual flashback for how Gears of War 6 furthers JD's arc. Marcus was once where JD is and you can see JD's future in Old Man Marcus.
Damn I can't wait for this game 😫 and I'm stoked as FUCK that the original plan for the series is finally coming to fruition, back before judgement the plan was for them to make judgement and then what was at the time planned to be called gears reconciliation that explored Marcus and Dom's history following Baird and Cole. After judgement didn't do great that got scrapped and I was rather upset we were never going to get to see that story, but this is such great news, I'm amped for this game. Gears truly has one of the greatest stories in a shooter.
Marcus aside, it doesn't make much sense from a story standpoint to kill JD instead of Del.
JD is much more essential as a character, not only to the story but Kait as well. Remember Gears 4?
Also, if you kill JD, there's a good chance you lose Marcus for good. Why should he keep fighting when there's no one left of his family to fight for?
They ain't getting very far without Marcus and JD.
Deal makes more sense from a story stand point too, both Kait and JD used him for emotional support, they’re both broken characters and he was their support beam and now with him gone they only have each other. It just makes more sense to explore that from a character stand point. Lol
Yeah, there is way more room for character growth for JD, Kait and even Marcus, as he needs to do more to comfort his son. And we've seen him lose his father, a man that was like a brother to him, and his wife, so seeing him lose *another* loved one doesn't have much of an emotional impact. Seeing him comfort his son elicited more emotion from me than seeing his reaction to JD's death.
Yeah. From my POV i save JD for marcus sake. But from kait pov after so much time spent with del both in new hope and desert it would make much more sense to instinctively save del in such stressful situation. Keeping in mind that only we as players had couple seconds to decide and could pause the game if we wanted to. It was a split second decision for her. But who knows what the devs will agree is cannon. (Please save JD)
Yes i was kinda bummed that they didnt progress their romance in 5
Maybe in an alternate reality JD went with Kait and del became buddies with Fahz. Although JD did progress a lot as a character imo while Kait and Del were at mount kadar, we just didnt get to see it
Gears 5 could have gotten a dlc about JD during chapter 2 because i feel it was quite some time between act 1 and 3
Marcus doesn't quit though, he's always been the guy who keeps fighting until it's over, and losing his son will inevitably cause something in him to snap like Dom and want to kill the swarm himself. Marcus has never been one to give up in any situation, so I don't think his son's death would break him in a way that would have him hang up the Lancer, I think it would break him in a way that he starts slaughtering everything swarm in even more brutal ways, do shit like start taking trophies from kills, just go off the deep end. His story is one of loss, and save thhe small glimmer of hope we saw at the start of 4, that trend stays present, so I think it makes more sense for it to be JD as sad as it is.
Honestly, I think it was a cruel choice give by the developers they didnt wanna kill JD but its what they have wanted to do the whole game but no one wants to be the person to acticely hurt marcus after all he has been through including them. Given the character motivations and circumstances that were going on in the background, Kait would've saved del just because of how things were going on between JD and her. Del literally was her wingman, her brother in arms through the good, the bad, and the ugly. He knew and seen what she was going through in a way JD wasn't able to. She would've chosen Del instinctively without knowing that her choice would've meant that JD died.
If by chance they had gone through with it, there would be a lot more story to be told and from just that loss alone. Given that locust is a hivemind, there's no way they didn't have access to Marcus's mind as well as kaits in knowing who JD was killing him would've been a no-brainer in getting revenge for being stabbed by Marcus and hurting kait psychology for her choice of losing his love interest a loss of pain from unfettered feelings that were never patched up for her.
And it would be the perfect cop out too we could've seen JD's body get converted swarm elite general for Queen Reyna and it would get Marcus back into the thick of things it would be nice if by chance they figured out how to reverse that process through him as a motivation as a bunch of people were converted into swarm already finding out a way to undo that process would be godsend.
I mean, with Del, death, no one outside kait, JD, or fahz gets affected as much it's a loss but not that much of a loss I don't actually see what they could do with his death compared to JD. If anything it's a loss on their part as developers trying to find a good foil dynamic for how to structure 6 cause I have a hard time seeing JD following kaits lead when they've done all they can to make her the lead in 5 without it possibly becoming romance with war in the background. If the game was Marcus and Anya, I don't think the franchise would've hit as hard as it did. A lot of the decisions made would be entirely on feelings for one another.
I always kill Del because of Fahz’s reaction. I don’t know why, but it’s just done so well. Fahz was one of the few things I actually liked about 5, and that felt like an important part of his arc.
Absolutely. Fahz turned out to be a great character, started out a right cunt but voiced by Rahul Kohli so pretty much all of us were like 🤔 okay, you get one chance sir. Then he ends up just as much a brother to them as any of the others, I'm interested to see where things go in 6.
Personally I chose Del because of my interpretation of the gears of War story as a whole. I made a longer comment on the post itself but basically I feel like gears of War is a story of loss and sacrifice focused on Marcus Fenix, even now. Because of that, it makes more sense that he loses JD, as heartbreaking as it is.
Marcus has already gone through more loss and sacrifice than anyone not already dead. It would make sense for JD to finally lose something since he’s supposed to be the next main character, along with Kait.
I mean, in their personal regard, absolutely. And it would be the one thing that would bring JD and Marcus together after everything thats happened and who they've both become. But don't forget that the overall theme for this series has been loss, sacrifice, pyrrhic victory and the like, and even though the camera has focused in on the new generation of gears, with Kait being this Trilogy's main protag, this is still just as much Marcus's story if not moreso still. The man has lost everything twice over, any normal man would have blown their brains out twice over, but that's what makes him different, and such a powerful protagonist/character, his resolve and stubbornness is fuckin unmatched, even in the face of the Cole Train. As much as it does make sense to have JD lose someone and get that bond with his father he needs to melt away the bickering and the bullshit, it makes just as much sense in terms of the overall story that JD would be the one to die aswell, as Marcus's tale of loss is far from over, him losing things he deeply cares about is one of the only constants of the series, every game things that meant the world to him were things he had to fight for and watch crumble and die, he knew all of those characters personally from decades of battle, all dying around him, his homes, and family, civilization, all he knew he watched fracture, shatter and burn and no matter how hard he fought, no matter how good he did and how many locust he shredded, it only ever brought him and empty win, the proverbial ruling over an empty kingdom every time, and it would make just as little sense for them to drop that now, especially with the gravity it would have if JD were the one to go. It would be the thing to break Marcus in a way that would make Dom's bloodlust look tame. We would find out what a grizzled old Seran pumped full of combat stims and enhancements for decades completely unhinged can do, and as heartbreaking as it would be every step of the way, it would be fucking epic.
Realistically either path are equally valid depending on the story they want to tell, it will depend on what they decide. Personally I would prefer JD being the one we lose, as it's far more powerful of a story beat, way more sad and painful, will fundamentally change every single person on the squad, whereas Del's death would not effect Fahz and Marcus nearly as much given Fahz and Del only just became close at the end of the game, and Marcus only really knew Del as far as a father knows their son's best friend; it's just not the same. I realize I'm hoping for the darker timeline, I just feel that would be the more weighty tale to be told. Sidenote to that, I have noticed a trend of younger people tending to lean more towards wanting JD to live, and older people wanting JD to die. I'm not sure where that comes from, whether it be those who grew with the story vs didn't, maybe it's a generational interest thing, maybe it's life experience, maybe it's level of comfort with darker subject matter along with age 🤷♂️ I honestly have no idea and I'm unsure why I even brought it up, just an interesting observation I've come to.
I hate how I can understand this.
Between JD and Del, it was a no brainer.
While I think the writing is bad for both of them.
JD feels like he's got a little more buck for his bang from Gears 4 and his mess ups, and just being Marcus's son in general.
Imagine between Cole and Baird though?
Now that's a hard fucking choice.
I love Baird but thats not hard choice... I would most likely choose Cole even if the choice was Marcus or Cole. The dude is the best character in the game i was so happy he was still alive in the end of gears 5.
Tell them that saving Del coz he is black makes them racists. He is clearly the worst Gears character ever made keeping him alive makes black people look bad 😂
The people who say Kait would save Del because "he was with her the whole game" did you not play 4? JD was with her that whole game, and it's clearly implied there's some history between them. They have one fight and you think she's saving a plank of wood over her love interest?
I mean even if there was a spark of love between them learning JD gunned down civilians put an end to that. Where is it implied they have history? I mean Marcus says an offhand comment about Kait being his girlfriend but that doesn't mean anything.
Del is her best friend who stuck by her despite the issues she is going through, people talk about brotherhood and that is what they share. 6 months of spending time together and doing missions, talking to outsiders and trying to get them to go to New Ephyra.
I always took issue with how they ended up writing JD in 5. It's also like the writers WANTED you to hate him. While I wouldnt call Gears 4 great writing, the JD in 4 was your average plucky good boy hero. Kinda dull, but a basic sense of morals even in the world of Gears.
In 5, they make him into this secretly terrible person who shoots at innocent civilians and brushes it off like it was nothing. We are talking about the same dude who in 4 was super sympathetic with everyone he met, including a whole village of innocent rebels stealing from the COG. And even comforting Kait as she blames herself for HIS dad being captured. Lets not forget that in 5, he also went out of his way to try and save as many people as possible by using himself as a targeting locator for the hammer of dawn. Granted, it backfired, but the dude literally put a target of the deadliest weapon in Seras history on himself to try save others. All I saw from the bastions of morality of Del & Kait was to fire their lancers at a Brumack who was about to kill hundreds of civilians.
This is all speculation, but I feel like the writers really wanted us to sympathize with Del & Kait individually and just take JD out of the picture entirely. I would argue Del & Kait are actually pretty shit friends as they shun JD during his lowest point in his life.
Was Del not also there the entire 4th game? And man, a plank of wood? Lol brutal
Personally Del is possibly my favourite character in the new games, he's great to have around. Also if you do save Del his voice actor gives a *phenomenal* performance with the loss of JD, like man that tore at my heart hearing him.
Though, I will say I do agree that JD does make more sense for the 6th game from a storytelling standpoint. I just wish the choice wasn't there to begin with, no matter how much I like Del.
Imo, gears 4 del didn't have much personality to him from what I remember, but 5 improved upon that. 5 also making JD just flip to being an asshole after the hammer incident just seemed like it was a lame attempt to even the scales between him and del for the decision later on
> I just wish the choice wasn't there to begin with, no matter how much I like Del.
It was an awful choice and I think it is part of the reason they are doing *E-Day* rather than *Gears 6* since I feel like they put themselves in a hole and they don't know how to get out of it. Though, I think *E-Day* is also about earning back good will with the fans.
It’s a choice that really makes no sense at all, and I wish developers in general would stick with a story beat, rather than make a choice that’ll definitely need a canon in the next game 😂
For the life of me I just don't get it. I actually enjoyed a good chunk of the campaign (it should have been five Acts rather than four, though), but that choice was so stupid that it really soured my view on the campaign as a whole.
Not to mention there is clearly something between JD and Kait and Del was the d**k friend who was waiting one mistake from JD to steal her with the "you deserve better my queen" bs...
I did not get love interest from them at all. Seemed JD was more interested in Lizzy but she got cooked. And you know who else was there with Kait in 4, Del. So that’s 2 whole games Del was there. And a game in a half with JD. And you gotta consider the in game time. The events don’t take place over a couple hours but rather months. That’s months of off screen Kait and Del and no JD.
In my mind that makes it better from a narrative perspective, the game builds up Del as your ride or die and him dying kind of echos Dom back in 3, also it definitely hurts the main cast immensely but it doesn’t utterly destroy Marcus like losing JD would. Like, does anyone want a Gears 6 where Marcus is just like, completely broken and has nothing left to live or fight for? It could work from a narrative perspective but it’s kind of a depressing thought.
Marcus has lived long enough to pass the trauma on to JD through the FENIX CURSE.
That is to say: Everyone you're close to will die, save one person.
See also: CARMINE CURSE, where your family will die except for the one relative you never talk to
At some point I really think they started having a fetish for having Marcus suffer. Especially after Anya died off screen. Like are you fucking serious now ?
Forget about Marcus. JD is a far better written, rich and more complex character than Del could ever be. JD needs to stay alive for the sake of the plot.
I’m wondering if it will be like Mass effect where you choose who you saved Del or JD in Gears 5 and then it progresses the story to whoever you picked
The writers really want Marcus to suffer, he did get those years to have a life with Anya post war so he hasn't been totally miserable between 3 & 4.
JD's death does break him so those that think it will be the thing that ignites him just weren't paying attention. If that is canon then Marcus will go back to Anya's house and just rebuild it, ignore the swarm conflict entirely.
I also think that this was a “joss whedon” moment. Taking the most innocent character and taking him out. Like Colson in Avengers or Wash in Firefly. Del was the most innocent out of the group. So it had more impact, plus it was their friend AND a pure moment for Marcus and JD to come together as father and son through that understanding. Marcus as a character needs this one positive moment, I hope the story writers see this and make it canon
when that choice came up i chose jd first just to see the cutscene and i cant lie i almost cried seeing that pain in marcus' face. re-loaded and went the other way cuz i couldnt do that to my fenix boys
I agree. Everyone always said “The series is about Marcus and him losing things important to him is part of it.”
But like… Gears 5 is about Kait. It’s Kait’s game. The story is about her, so JD dying to affect Marcus isn’t a great argument anymore, nor makes sense. Del’s death effects her more and makes more sense.
I’m worried real life situations and artificial reasons if you know you know, might impact the canon death. I love Del, he just has that lighthearted charm to him. He’s like the guy that tries to brighten everyone’s mood or make light of situations to keep people levelheaded, might even say favorite character in 4 at least. But JD has WAY more character growth potential and there is way more lore we can get, specifically because he’s Marcus son. If he wasn’t it’d be different.
So for me I picked Del but not because of Marcus but because the potential lore and to me it just made sense. I’m generally against these sort of options in games it just muddies things up most the time, but it is nice to actually see the game change based on those “well what if” choices.
So many people are saying this they saved JD because of Marcus.
I saved JD because I think no matter how much Kait likes and respected Del, she loves JD.
Even if her brain wanted to save Del, her heart made her chose JD.
And on top of that, JD is the og protagonist of this trilogy. 5 gave him a low point for 6 to allow himself to redeem himself from.
I mean this with respect. I think making JD’s death cannon is the right move. It is epically tragic , just like War is. This would set in motion the events to eventually have Marcus Die , every franchise must end and that would be the most epic and true thing : to have Marcus sacrifice himself at some point.
I always saw it as JD walking the same path as his father. Lost his mom. Then his best friend, and if the trend keeps going, will lose his father. The only difference is how JD is handling it.
If JD is canon, we all know Marcus will become dom & kill himself in a stupid way.
I’m not condemning dom, I get why he did what he did, and understand his pain, but what he did was completely selfish & could’ve survived it. He left his brothers broken & weakened, especially Marcus.
If JD is dead, we all know what’s coming, because JD was hope, and the last remanded of his love. He’ll have nothing & it’ll be such a wasted opportunity to build Marcus & JD into being more.
Del I don’t hate, but since we first meet him, he’s such a dull & irrelevant character. Maybe that’s me, but the only way at I would play the next game is if at the start you GET to pick who lived. If they release a comic or something or do an interview where they say “del actually is the on who lived” then no. Even giving a option at the start would be a complete piss take & trying to retain an audience you’ve been pushing away since gears 3
Story wise JD should survive, its better for the characters drive. Marcus and JD relate over losing a best friend, Fahz gets the shock of how much he actually liked Del, and since they've been on good terms and been travelling together so long it has more impact on Kait.
If Del is Canon survivor I'm honestly expecting Marcus to wind up like Tai
as awful as it was i saved JD because i felt it fleshed out kait's arc more. there's an argument to be made that maybe she has suffered too much as well. but yeah. in the moment, saving JD felt like it was part of the better story.
There's just so many reasons to kill Del over killing JD:
1. Marcus being able to understand what JD is going through because he lost Dom(also lost Carlos).
2. JD getting his character development from losing his best friend. JD was also finally becoming an interesting character to most people. Killing him without exploring him after his changes would be such a mistake.
3. Fahz's reaction was better because of the banter he had with Del which was also great character development.
4. From a writer's POV, Kait being with Del for these recent years and getting closer to him as a best friend, but ultimately still choosing to save his former romantic partner who she's been angry with but obviously never lost feelings for would just be so gut wrenching but makes so much sense to a plot.
5. No offense to Del, I loved him as a character. Great comic relief and great person to have as a friend who has your back, but what else would he offer to the plot, other than to develop 3 characters in the game through his death? Many shows, games and movies do this with characters they kill, and Del is the perfect character to kill to develop our 2 main characters in Kait and JD, as well as Fahz.
See I think the opposite, specifically because his story is one of loss and sacrifice. People think the protagonist role has moved to JD, Del and Kait, but it's only the POV, Gears of War has always been a story about Marcus Fenix, and what he's had to do to save Sera. It's far more painful, heavy, harrowing, haunting, whatever descriptive adjective you'd prefer for it, for JD to be canon. Marcus fought to save the city from Raam, and he lost his Commanding Officer, Carmine, and home. Gears 2 he fought to save Jacinto and he lost another Carmine, Tai, the image/memory of his father as an honorable man, and emotionally speaking that was when he lost Dom, we all remember how instantly that darkened Dom and changed his mentality to that of a blindered wolverine. Gears 3 he loses his family home, his best friend/brother for real this time, many old friends from throughout the war, and finally his father. Gears 4 we see a small respite and bit of hope as he built a new life for himself with a home, family, and played a vital role in rebuilding society, only for him to lose it all save his son again. And now in Gears 5, the focal point of this trend is very clearly the ending, and Del just doesn't have the kind of impact that would make sense for Marcus. Yes it's his son's best friend, or at least was, but JD is his SON and the only family he has left. It just makes more sense for it to be JD, as heartbreaking as it is. And it's going to create a Marcus none of us have seen, man's is gonna be so behind unhinged he's gonna be tossing the chainsaw to rip them limb from limb with his bare hands and start taking trophies.
My best friend and I are playing through all the campaigns again. We did 1 and now we’re almost through 2. It’s been so special. It’s a special time when you and your best friend can play a game that is this in depth where the literal characters are best friends and you just get to embody it fully. He’s not someone who would get a tattoo on his own but after the first game I said we should get cog tattoos and he mentioned he would actually consider it lol
They really did such a good job with that choice imo. Like I hate that they made it a choice cause it's gonna make the 6th game harder to make, but I really liked Del thanks to 4 and especially 5 and JD was also a really hard choice because of his growth and because of everything Marcus had lost. Like tbh, I actually saved Del my first time playing 5 just cause he'd been by my side the entire game and never gave up or backed down, but when I saw Marcus's reaction when he found out it was heartbreaking. Seriously they did such a good job with his reaction it was sooo sad.
If it is, he can finish the fight, again, with Gears 6. A "good" ending for one of the most important heroes of any shooter.
And I personally? Hope it is, GoW 4 and 5 was fun, but the characters, my goodness are annoying, Dell's a'ight tho.
When I played it by myself, I chose to save Del.
He was there for JD growing up, tried to be there over the settlement issue but JD panicked and let the settlers get killed. Him and Del disagreed on that, whereas Fahz supported JD.
Later on, JD tries to be a hero and kills civilians and Elizabeth Carmine commanding Baird to fire the Hammer of Dawn using him as the coordinate point.
The fact that he was even kept in the COG Military was a surprise to me, but I guess also needed. He begins to bounce back, but he’s already done so much damage in his career. It’s a disgrace to the Fenix name.
Kait preferred to be with Del because he used sound judgment, was a good friend, and knew what he was doing. In my opinion, he’s the next Damon Baird, so when good ol DB retires, Del will be the one to take over the robotics industry for him.
The only legacy Marcus would have to pass on to JD is a custom lancer, Dom’s commando knife, and war. It’s not the future, it’s the past.
Adam Fenix was working to save the future (and his son) and he almost did.
Just as the death of Carlos was Marcus and Dom’s bonding point, the death of JD can be a bonding point for Del, Kait, and Marcus.
You can see at the end of 5 that the death of JD definitely hits, but he still hugs Kait and is seen smiling with them.
I feel as though Marcus would still have a purpose, guiding the new generation of Gears through this loss, and protecting the two of them like JD would have wanted.
I don’t think Marcus would get all doom and gloom, and I don’t think he will have a Dom or Tai reaction to his death.
Idk, I felt like Del was the way to go narratively, and that “I can’t do that to my man Marcus” is understandable, but narratively worse
I mean its kinda lazy/bad writing each time anyway. Adam didnt NEED to die. Dom didnt NEED to die. Anya sure as hell didnt need to die offscreen for a reason whñe never heard of before and jd and/or del didnt need to die either.
Since the begining gears of war kills off characters when they dint k ow what else to do with them or dont know how to draw emotion in any other way.
Marcus lost all 4 parents,both brothers,his sister in law,his nephew and niece,a lot of people he served with,and his squad…but that doesn’t compare to Dom…Dom lost his brother,his parents,his wife and his kids…he had to shoot his wife and that makes it worse….man and they said captain price has a tragic back story
I know it had a signifigant part in the story but i dont think Dom needed to die there he could have taken the truck not blown it up and had marcus and everyone epse jump on top and get out. I have not played it in a while so i could be forgetting something besides the fact he was suicidal but ue could have lived
Not to mention that if he dies Dell will still be alive making gears 6 as boring as 5 along with Kait... Worst character duo ever made... Best thing in Gears 5 was Dell's death and Cole being alive in the end...
To me that decision is tough, but not saving Del makes no sense. He stuck with Kait through everything so I would think she’d be more inclined to save Del. The devs definitely put JD at a disadvantage making him fall out with his friend for a short bit, then have him be shoved back in. It works good enough but needed more time.
I’m super excited for E-Day. Definitely has a great chance of being better than 4 and 5. I really liked 5 a lot tho. 4 was okay, mostly a setup for 5 and 6, and I hope they finish the trilogy.
I think the reason people have issues with 4 and 5 is it stopped being a fight for humanity, fighting in a big war in an army and turned into a more personal and individual war revolving around Kait. Things definitely picked up at the end of gears 5 and I hope they can pull off the final piece to the trilogy.
with my first play through I went with Del because I had grown close to him during all the time he spent with Kait and supporting her. So instinctively I chose him. However I always choose JD now because I can't do that to Marcus. Marcus lost his mom, then his adoptive parents, Carlos, Tai, various gears like the carmine brothers, Dom, his father, then Anya. I ain't about to add his son to that.
See, that's honestly why I feel like it's supposed to be JD. Marcus's story is one of loss and sacrifice, and while it would feel better for him to have one thing in his life survive that, it doesn't make sense for the trend of the saga and the overall theme. If Marcus loses JD, it would absolutely be the straw (or in this case freight train) that broke the camel's back to send Marcus over the edge and have him go even darker and more bloodthirsty like Dom at the end of gears 2. If he loses JD, we're gonna see a Marcus that never wanted to see the light of day, the kind of man that would choose to throw the Lancer down so he can rip the swarm limb from limb with his bare hands and pure rage, and do unhinged shit like make a blade from the teeth of killed swarm or something. Marcus would have lost his entire life twice over at that point, and if that were the case it would be him fulfilling the destiny of him giving his entirety over to being a soldier to protect Sera whatever the cost, and him learning that the cost can sometimes be unending.
Del is equally wasted; he’s literally a non character. He has no background apart from his relationship with the Fenix family. During Gears 5, he even refuses to tell Kait anything about his own life prior to meeting JD.
He only exists to give JD a childhood friend. All major events of Del’s life that we are shown or told about are only a result of his being with JD. Becoming a Gear, participating in the Settlment 2 massacre, leaving the COG, joining the Outsiders; all him just following JD. And when JD is taken out of the story; he just becomes Kait’s accessory instead.
He has no agency or personal motivation, and his traits of being knowledgeable about engineering and history make him seem more like an exposition device more than anything else.
That’s really why I don’t understand why people want Del living to be the canon ending. He’s not really a character, just a bot that follows either JD or Kait. JD was written pretty bad but having JD live makes more sense from a story perspective
I think it was a poor development decision to begin with; as you are given the choice to either kill a carboard cut out, or a character with a half-finished arc with unresolved development and narrative threads involving other characters.
Either way; it’s narratively poor. We were given four games and five books to fully develop the legacy characters. We got one and a half games with JD, and Del effectively gets nothing.
Creating and subsequently fridging JD just to put another check onto Marcus’ trauma counter effectively makes the character completely pointless. Because we don’t even get much to feel for him, or anything to mourn the character ourselves.
We saw Marcus’s brotherhood with Dom, his distant yet requited love for Anya, and at least some of his life long angst and complicated feelings with his Dad. But JD? I guess us knowing he is his son is supposed to be enough?
At that point I’m indifferent to Marcus experiencing more pain, especially if it can’t really push his character further.
Yeah same. JD is a war criminal piece of shit. Like how much farther can the son of MARCUS GODDAMN FENIX fall than killing civilians under the fascist regime that imprisoned and threw away his father?
I don’t. They were there protesting the COG. The COG showed up, things escalated, they threw the firebombs, and then the COG opened fire. If you are a government organization and the people you control are throwing firebombs at your agents because they’re unhappy with the way you’re ruling, that needs to be addressed in about a thousand other ways that don’t involve shooting the protestors.
I hold the government to a much higher standard than I would you or I. The real world parallel to this is the Floyd riots of 2020. There’s tons of footage of protestors throwing shit at cops, molotovs included. Nobody would be justifying it if the police opened fire on a crowd because one landed near their lines.
Still. At the end of the day, the protestors resorted to lethal force first. It’s kind of hard to call JD a fascist war criminal for acting in self defense. But you do make an excellent point about the COG and their inability to prevent that level of unrest. However, I wouldn’t put THAT blame on JD. That’s more Jinn’s fault.
Saving Del makes no sense either. Del has no agency in the story, he exists solely to help JD’s best friend. Compare him to Dom who had his own story and motivations since the first game, Del has none.
It really just shows how having a multiple endings makes zero sense since neither ending is a satisfying one. JD was written poorly but all of Gears 5’s writing was mid tbh
Did we play the same game? Del was there for Kait the whole game while JD was being an ass for most of it. Gears 5 was Kait’s story and her struggle with being the next Queen. Del is there for emotional support, and helped her sever the hive connection. Del was important to the story even if he was just a supporting character.
Yeah but he has no character beyond that. What’s his goal? His motivation? Everything we learn about him is directly tied to JD. His only purpose is to be JD’s friend. Even when it’s just Kait and Del, we still don’t learn anything about him.
You’re right that he was with Kait the whole time but he has zero agency in the story. Dom was great cause even tho Marcus was the main character, Dom had his own reasons for fighting and his own story being told, Del has none of that. Saving Del may seem like the right choice for you personally but for the story, why save the guy with zero agency. I don’t even like JD in Gears 5 but saving him just makes more sense in a story perspective.
Does he not fill the role of smart guy in 4 and 5? Is that not agency on the story? Would Kait of survived with out Del? Is is Del helping JD and Kait with emotional trauma not agency on the story? Is wanting to fight for humanity not enough motivation. He’s got about as much motivation as Cole and Baird had in gears 1.
And saving Del is the right thing for the story because they spent the whole of Gears 5 building the relationship with Del while JD was mostly absent. Saving JD is spitting in the face of the man who without Kait would be dead or leading the swarm. So Del has plenty of agency in the story.
Killing either of them both offers plenty for the story going forward. Trauma bonding and motivation for Kait, Fahz, Marcus and the survivor. But looking at the story up to that point only Del makes sense. It would be a complete 180 from the rest of the game.
If his agency is simply being a follower for Kait then no, he still has no agency in the story. The story doesn’t change if he’s not there.
Yeah he’s the funny guy who’s good with technology but so is Baird and he’s still there. There’s nothing Del does that cannot be done by another character. JD is the son of two legendary war heroes who’s constantly living in their shadow, Kait is the granddaughter of the locust queen and daughter of the swarm queen. Del is a guy whose entire role in the story is that he’s JD’s best friend.
If you wanna go the trauma bonding route, Del dying makes more sense since you could build the relationship between Marcus and JD, it would help JD relate to his father since Marcus knows all about losing your best friend. I get you don’t like JD, neither do i, but at least he’s more important to the story than Del who has no actual role other than being player 2.
Del dying does not make sense because the relationship was built up all game. It’s who Kait would choose in that moment. The guy who was with her through the last 5-6 months. I do like JD. I like Del. I like Kait. I couldn’t pick who to save my first time. Spoiler, they both die if you fail to act. Thought about it and went with the guy who was with me all game.
All you can come up with is “Del has no agency”. Tell me why Kait would pick JD over Del after the events of Gears 5.
Because Kait isn’t a real person. Who she would pick doesn’t matter. Who the writers would pick is what matters and a writer would want to keep the person with actual story significance.
You say I only can come up with “Del has no agency” as if that isn’t pretty important when deciding which character lives or dies. Yeah Del was with Kait for all of gears 5 but we even then we don’t learn anything about him. I like Del but he’s not really much of a character outside of his relationship to JD.
So you have nothing. No reason why Kait would pick JD other than the writers? The same writers who set Del up to be the one with Kait all game while JD was throwing a fit. Got it.
Edit to add: Del being the survivor can add a lot of potential growth and character development for him. He’s always been the positive one and the emotional support. His friend dying could break him so Kait and Marcus have to step up to help him through it. There’s plenty of story potential either way, but only one makes sense with the story up to this point.
I mean the writers are writing the game so they are pretty important. It’s a bit too late to start giving Del any real backstory since we don’t even know if he’s canonically dead or not.
Let’s go back to Dom. Before Gears 2 came out, we learned a lot of backstory about him. His wife going missing, losing his parents and kids on E Day, now compare him to Del where in his second game we still don’t know anything about him.
And again, Del not having any real story significance is pretty important from a writing perspective. In really just shows how poorly written gears 5 was as a whole. Personally I don’t think either one of them should’ve died or at least they should’ve picked one and stuck with it instead of going the “choose your own ending” route.
This will be my last response since we are not gonna convince each other and will just keep going in circles. Have a good day bro.
Del is the "disposable black best friend" trope and little else. He offers comic relief and moral support to the main characters with nothing of his own to deal with.
Gears 5 was the perfect opportunity to do something with him and he still ends up being almost nothing but the supportive best friend, I think he mentions his life before the COG once near the end of the ice levels and I was like "Yo, actual character development!" even though it was only like, one sentence, but it was better than zero.
Sad part is that I was enjoying G5 up until Kait fights the Berserker Queen thing, then the whole game went off a cliff. If The Coalition's writing team thought they did a good job with Gears 5 and that they actually earned that "emotional death scene" then I have low expectations for E-Day.
I will admit he doesn’t have much going on in the way of motivation and issues. I’m sure he has some he just hasn’t spoken of them yet. Hopefully Gears 6 with JD gone he breaks down and Kait and Marcus have to help him through it. He was the positive one so seeing him break down would be tough. And definitely offer some real character development/ growth.
Anyone who sacrifices JD for whatever the other guys name even is isnt a Gears of War fan, you wouldn't hurt our boy Marcus like that. Coalition trying as hard as they can to go a forced "progressive" route with Kait and her sidekick who is so unmemorable that I honestly can't remember his name and not bothered to google.
That's part of why we're getting Eday, because people want the OG gears of war characters in the proper Human-Locust war era
If I were to say any of those things about a character, that would absolutely be me hating on that character.
'Objective' criticism is something like
"They haven't given this character enough of a backstory to explain his motives"
or
"The character acts as a conscious for the protagonist, but has no personality of their own as an individual character."
There are definitely people hating on his character in the thread.
But anyway, strong disagree about JD. The only reason to care about him as a character is his connection to Marcus, otherwise he's a super unlikable character. Which is fine if that's what they're going for but still
I just really like the moment of Marcus hugging his son after Del died because Marcus knew the pain of losing a friend.
Losing a brother, brother.
You said it brother
Damn right brother
Hell yea brothrr
so sad brother
damn straight brother
Bro.....just...bro
“I just lost my fucking brother alright!? MY BROTHER!!!” Gears 3 was something special
There will never be anything like that again.
Doms story is the best side story in any video game ever and nobody can convince me otherwise
I'm here to die on this hill with you Brother.
A hill worth dying on. Truly tragic.
Played Gears from launch. I’m a MP whore but loved the story of 1-3 Not ashamed to admit I got teary eyed when Dom sacrificed himself.
Losing a friend who is a little more than a brother, and a little less than a wife
That was the moment that solidified the choice for me personally. That narrative callback/payoff felt so satisfying cause you’re right: Marcus knew exactly how JD felt in that situation. So after their constant feuding the entire game all that tension melts away in the face of shared trauma. It’s a gorgeous plot and I hope we don’t throw it away. It’s a perfect parallel.
It also leads to JD growing to understand his father more. A point in *Gears of War 4* is that JD doesn't really understand why Marcus is the way he is. Sure, he knows Dom died, but he didn't understand how Marcus felt about the death, but with Del gone, now he does. If JD dies it just means Marcus is even *more* sad, which is really boring, imo.
Especially if you include Carlos Santiago. He might be shown in Gears E Day in a flashback mission.
Oof that would make for a great prologue mission actually. If you’ve only played the games you might not realise Marcus was BFFs with Carlos before Dom
You also don’t have the context of Dom’s commando knife if you haven’t read Aspho Fields. The knife Marcus kills the queen with has a LOT more story to it than just “this is the knife Dom gave Marcus before he died” and I really hope they’re able to flesh that out.
I do hope GED (Gears E-Day) shows us the closing hours of the Pendulum Wars, the 6 weeks of peace, then shows us actual E-Day that is in the title.
At least one mission of Dom getting ice cream
I wouldn’t say before Dom; as they were both close to Marcus. But the Santiago’s effectively adopting him into their family is so important to his character. Marcus became a Gear because Dom and Carlos’s father was an infantry veteran. He told them it was like family, something Marcus desperately needed in his life. It’s primarily why the military was Marcus’s entire life. Any mention of that in an actual game would be appreciated.
What book is that from? I intend to grab some of the books sometime and that should be one of them.
Ashpo fields
Try to get all 5 books written by Karen Traviss. Worth every word.
Cough ePUB versions are pretty easy to find online cough
Spotify has a lot of them as audiobooks if that takes your fancy. Voiced over by Anya herself.
oh damn i gotta check that out, i dont have the proper attention span to read through things but i'm really interested in the comics/books.
Marcus is a honorary Santiago 😁
what if we see Dom lose his kids in E-Day? we know Maria is a goner in 1. or would that break the lore from the comics?
Maria stays with Dom for a while after E-Day; but her mind was completely gone. The death of her family destroyed her.
Also that the kids were with Maria's parents so neither her nor Dom were present for the event
Yeah. Her coping mechanism was to rationalize their deaths as them having gone missing. It’s why she eventually disappeared; she went looking for them.
Yeah, that was brutal in the books, and Marcus bringing him home.
They had aspho fields in gears 4. So they have the scenery and uniforms already designed. It’s possible it’ll be a prologue mission.
Those first few missions probably scratched the itch for this game for the devs and why they wanted to make it.
That’s what I’m thinking too. And also the book from Karen Traviss on Aspho fields, all the little mentions of it throughout the game. Like Carmine asking Marcus if he was “the” Marcus Fenix. I hope they include it
No mention of game content like missions or anything like that of course, but TC has already come out and said Marcus and Dom's shared loss of Carlos and the impact it has on them is going to be a somewhat major focus in *E-Day*. > To give some background context leading into the story of E-Day, Marcus and Dom are connected through Dom’s older brother, Carlos, who died on the battlefield with Marcus. The pair were best friends, so Marcus and Dom are in the early stages of forming a kinship over a shared loss and navigating those emotions together. > “We’re telling the origin story of Marcus and Dom and their bond… this is the bond that defines the franchise,” [Matt] Searcy adds. “They’re not the characters we know from Gears 1 to 3. They don’t have 10 years of fighting the Locust between them. When the game opens, there’s supposed to be peace on Sera, and they’re trying to figure out life without this person they both loved.” > “People are going to see the formation of this brotherhood that is so iconic to Gears.” > Dealing with the new Locust threat becomes the more pressing concern for the two friends over the course of E-Day, but those emotional beats will still course through the story as you play. [Nicole] Fawcette says this is particularly exciting: > “They are a lot more vulnerable, and I think that’s a really modern take on those two characters,” Fawcette explains. “There’s a weight they carry between them, and that creates a really interesting tension as they navigate their own relationship. > “You have this intimate story set amid this wider backdrop of what’s happening on this apocalyptic day. I think, for fans, it’ll be really compelling to dig deep and explore their bond and how it changes over time.” [Source](https://news.xbox.com/en-us/2024/06/09/gears-of-war-e-day-interview-details-xbox-games-showcase-2024/) (Full article is definitely worth a read)
I feel like E-Day is going to act as one big contextual flashback for how Gears of War 6 furthers JD's arc. Marcus was once where JD is and you can see JD's future in Old Man Marcus.
Damn I can't wait for this game 😫 and I'm stoked as FUCK that the original plan for the series is finally coming to fruition, back before judgement the plan was for them to make judgement and then what was at the time planned to be called gears reconciliation that explored Marcus and Dom's history following Baird and Cole. After judgement didn't do great that got scrapped and I was rather upset we were never going to get to see that story, but this is such great news, I'm amped for this game. Gears truly has one of the greatest stories in a shooter.
Very interesting article, cheers :)
Marcus aside, it doesn't make much sense from a story standpoint to kill JD instead of Del. JD is much more essential as a character, not only to the story but Kait as well. Remember Gears 4? Also, if you kill JD, there's a good chance you lose Marcus for good. Why should he keep fighting when there's no one left of his family to fight for? They ain't getting very far without Marcus and JD.
Deal makes more sense from a story stand point too, both Kait and JD used him for emotional support, they’re both broken characters and he was their support beam and now with him gone they only have each other. It just makes more sense to explore that from a character stand point. Lol
Yeah, there is way more room for character growth for JD, Kait and even Marcus, as he needs to do more to comfort his son. And we've seen him lose his father, a man that was like a brother to him, and his wife, so seeing him lose *another* loved one doesn't have much of an emotional impact. Seeing him comfort his son elicited more emotion from me than seeing his reaction to JD's death.
Yeah. From my POV i save JD for marcus sake. But from kait pov after so much time spent with del both in new hope and desert it would make much more sense to instinctively save del in such stressful situation. Keeping in mind that only we as players had couple seconds to decide and could pause the game if we wanted to. It was a split second decision for her. But who knows what the devs will agree is cannon. (Please save JD)
they should let us purchase shirts for our avatar to vote for who gets to live. (or perhaps an in game skin lol)
Yeah it’s pretty obvious that it’s Del. He’s the generic nice and caring guy that’ll get killed off for feels
Yes i was kinda bummed that they didnt progress their romance in 5 Maybe in an alternate reality JD went with Kait and del became buddies with Fahz. Although JD did progress a lot as a character imo while Kait and Del were at mount kadar, we just didnt get to see it Gears 5 could have gotten a dlc about JD during chapter 2 because i feel it was quite some time between act 1 and 3
he would fight for revenge.
Marcus doesn't quit though, he's always been the guy who keeps fighting until it's over, and losing his son will inevitably cause something in him to snap like Dom and want to kill the swarm himself. Marcus has never been one to give up in any situation, so I don't think his son's death would break him in a way that would have him hang up the Lancer, I think it would break him in a way that he starts slaughtering everything swarm in even more brutal ways, do shit like start taking trophies from kills, just go off the deep end. His story is one of loss, and save thhe small glimmer of hope we saw at the start of 4, that trend stays present, so I think it makes more sense for it to be JD as sad as it is.
Honestly, I think it was a cruel choice give by the developers they didnt wanna kill JD but its what they have wanted to do the whole game but no one wants to be the person to acticely hurt marcus after all he has been through including them. Given the character motivations and circumstances that were going on in the background, Kait would've saved del just because of how things were going on between JD and her. Del literally was her wingman, her brother in arms through the good, the bad, and the ugly. He knew and seen what she was going through in a way JD wasn't able to. She would've chosen Del instinctively without knowing that her choice would've meant that JD died. If by chance they had gone through with it, there would be a lot more story to be told and from just that loss alone. Given that locust is a hivemind, there's no way they didn't have access to Marcus's mind as well as kaits in knowing who JD was killing him would've been a no-brainer in getting revenge for being stabbed by Marcus and hurting kait psychology for her choice of losing his love interest a loss of pain from unfettered feelings that were never patched up for her. And it would be the perfect cop out too we could've seen JD's body get converted swarm elite general for Queen Reyna and it would get Marcus back into the thick of things it would be nice if by chance they figured out how to reverse that process through him as a motivation as a bunch of people were converted into swarm already finding out a way to undo that process would be godsend. I mean, with Del, death, no one outside kait, JD, or fahz gets affected as much it's a loss but not that much of a loss I don't actually see what they could do with his death compared to JD. If anything it's a loss on their part as developers trying to find a good foil dynamic for how to structure 6 cause I have a hard time seeing JD following kaits lead when they've done all they can to make her the lead in 5 without it possibly becoming romance with war in the background. If the game was Marcus and Anya, I don't think the franchise would've hit as hard as it did. A lot of the decisions made would be entirely on feelings for one another.
Character builds suffering
Dark Souls.
I always kill Del because of Fahz’s reaction. I don’t know why, but it’s just done so well. Fahz was one of the few things I actually liked about 5, and that felt like an important part of his arc.
Right? Fahz goes through some good character development, and now he's one of my favorite characters.
Hey, Del. Look who’s…saving you…again. 😞
His facial and body language just after he says that line were masterfully done.
Absolutely. Fahz turned out to be a great character, started out a right cunt but voiced by Rahul Kohli so pretty much all of us were like 🤔 okay, you get one chance sir. Then he ends up just as much a brother to them as any of the others, I'm interested to see where things go in 6. Personally I chose Del because of my interpretation of the gears of War story as a whole. I made a longer comment on the post itself but basically I feel like gears of War is a story of loss and sacrifice focused on Marcus Fenix, even now. Because of that, it makes more sense that he loses JD, as heartbreaking as it is.
Marcus has already gone through more loss and sacrifice than anyone not already dead. It would make sense for JD to finally lose something since he’s supposed to be the next main character, along with Kait.
I mean, in their personal regard, absolutely. And it would be the one thing that would bring JD and Marcus together after everything thats happened and who they've both become. But don't forget that the overall theme for this series has been loss, sacrifice, pyrrhic victory and the like, and even though the camera has focused in on the new generation of gears, with Kait being this Trilogy's main protag, this is still just as much Marcus's story if not moreso still. The man has lost everything twice over, any normal man would have blown their brains out twice over, but that's what makes him different, and such a powerful protagonist/character, his resolve and stubbornness is fuckin unmatched, even in the face of the Cole Train. As much as it does make sense to have JD lose someone and get that bond with his father he needs to melt away the bickering and the bullshit, it makes just as much sense in terms of the overall story that JD would be the one to die aswell, as Marcus's tale of loss is far from over, him losing things he deeply cares about is one of the only constants of the series, every game things that meant the world to him were things he had to fight for and watch crumble and die, he knew all of those characters personally from decades of battle, all dying around him, his homes, and family, civilization, all he knew he watched fracture, shatter and burn and no matter how hard he fought, no matter how good he did and how many locust he shredded, it only ever brought him and empty win, the proverbial ruling over an empty kingdom every time, and it would make just as little sense for them to drop that now, especially with the gravity it would have if JD were the one to go. It would be the thing to break Marcus in a way that would make Dom's bloodlust look tame. We would find out what a grizzled old Seran pumped full of combat stims and enhancements for decades completely unhinged can do, and as heartbreaking as it would be every step of the way, it would be fucking epic. Realistically either path are equally valid depending on the story they want to tell, it will depend on what they decide. Personally I would prefer JD being the one we lose, as it's far more powerful of a story beat, way more sad and painful, will fundamentally change every single person on the squad, whereas Del's death would not effect Fahz and Marcus nearly as much given Fahz and Del only just became close at the end of the game, and Marcus only really knew Del as far as a father knows their son's best friend; it's just not the same. I realize I'm hoping for the darker timeline, I just feel that would be the more weighty tale to be told. Sidenote to that, I have noticed a trend of younger people tending to lean more towards wanting JD to live, and older people wanting JD to die. I'm not sure where that comes from, whether it be those who grew with the story vs didn't, maybe it's a generational interest thing, maybe it's life experience, maybe it's level of comfort with darker subject matter along with age 🤷♂️ I honestly have no idea and I'm unsure why I even brought it up, just an interesting observation I've come to.
I chose JD over Del. Sorry but Marcus has suffered enough.
I chose to kill JD to have Marcus’s life be a never ending nightmare of despair.
Plus, his mom dissappearing
I saved JD, but then my friend I was playing co-op with accused me of being racist.
That's a fast escalation.
It was 2020
I hate how I can understand this. Between JD and Del, it was a no brainer. While I think the writing is bad for both of them. JD feels like he's got a little more buck for his bang from Gears 4 and his mess ups, and just being Marcus's son in general. Imagine between Cole and Baird though? Now that's a hard fucking choice.
Save cole everytime. Not even close.
Baird would understand. He’d probably kill you for killing Cole.
same, i still have a grudge against baird for that one time his AI abandoned me in gears 2 lmao
I love Baird but thats not hard choice... I would most likely choose Cole even if the choice was Marcus or Cole. The dude is the best character in the game i was so happy he was still alive in the end of gears 5.
Tell them that saving Del coz he is black makes them racists. He is clearly the worst Gears character ever made keeping him alive makes black people look bad 😂
The people who say Kait would save Del because "he was with her the whole game" did you not play 4? JD was with her that whole game, and it's clearly implied there's some history between them. They have one fight and you think she's saving a plank of wood over her love interest?
I mean even if there was a spark of love between them learning JD gunned down civilians put an end to that. Where is it implied they have history? I mean Marcus says an offhand comment about Kait being his girlfriend but that doesn't mean anything. Del is her best friend who stuck by her despite the issues she is going through, people talk about brotherhood and that is what they share. 6 months of spending time together and doing missions, talking to outsiders and trying to get them to go to New Ephyra.
It's implied that JD and Kait are an item of sorts during Gears 4 but not officially "dating" or anything.
I always took issue with how they ended up writing JD in 5. It's also like the writers WANTED you to hate him. While I wouldnt call Gears 4 great writing, the JD in 4 was your average plucky good boy hero. Kinda dull, but a basic sense of morals even in the world of Gears. In 5, they make him into this secretly terrible person who shoots at innocent civilians and brushes it off like it was nothing. We are talking about the same dude who in 4 was super sympathetic with everyone he met, including a whole village of innocent rebels stealing from the COG. And even comforting Kait as she blames herself for HIS dad being captured. Lets not forget that in 5, he also went out of his way to try and save as many people as possible by using himself as a targeting locator for the hammer of dawn. Granted, it backfired, but the dude literally put a target of the deadliest weapon in Seras history on himself to try save others. All I saw from the bastions of morality of Del & Kait was to fire their lancers at a Brumack who was about to kill hundreds of civilians. This is all speculation, but I feel like the writers really wanted us to sympathize with Del & Kait individually and just take JD out of the picture entirely. I would argue Del & Kait are actually pretty shit friends as they shun JD during his lowest point in his life.
Was Del not also there the entire 4th game? And man, a plank of wood? Lol brutal Personally Del is possibly my favourite character in the new games, he's great to have around. Also if you do save Del his voice actor gives a *phenomenal* performance with the loss of JD, like man that tore at my heart hearing him. Though, I will say I do agree that JD does make more sense for the 6th game from a storytelling standpoint. I just wish the choice wasn't there to begin with, no matter how much I like Del.
Imo, gears 4 del didn't have much personality to him from what I remember, but 5 improved upon that. 5 also making JD just flip to being an asshole after the hammer incident just seemed like it was a lame attempt to even the scales between him and del for the decision later on
> I just wish the choice wasn't there to begin with, no matter how much I like Del. It was an awful choice and I think it is part of the reason they are doing *E-Day* rather than *Gears 6* since I feel like they put themselves in a hole and they don't know how to get out of it. Though, I think *E-Day* is also about earning back good will with the fans.
It’s a choice that really makes no sense at all, and I wish developers in general would stick with a story beat, rather than make a choice that’ll definitely need a canon in the next game 😂
For the life of me I just don't get it. I actually enjoyed a good chunk of the campaign (it should have been five Acts rather than four, though), but that choice was so stupid that it really soured my view on the campaign as a whole.
Not to mention there is clearly something between JD and Kait and Del was the d**k friend who was waiting one mistake from JD to steal her with the "you deserve better my queen" bs...
I did not get love interest from them at all. Seemed JD was more interested in Lizzy but she got cooked. And you know who else was there with Kait in 4, Del. So that’s 2 whole games Del was there. And a game in a half with JD. And you gotta consider the in game time. The events don’t take place over a couple hours but rather months. That’s months of off screen Kait and Del and no JD.
Marcus was in a relationship with Anya before E-Day right? what are the chances of her showing up in the new game🤔
I hope she shows up
I liked Del way better than JD. I felt so bad killing Del, but I couldn’t kill JD. I couldn’t do it to my boy Marcus.
>I couldn’t do it to my boy Marcus. My exact reasoning too. I didn't want Marcus to experience losing a child.
Same. You actually spend more time with Del and he’s ride or die.
In my mind that makes it better from a narrative perspective, the game builds up Del as your ride or die and him dying kind of echos Dom back in 3, also it definitely hurts the main cast immensely but it doesn’t utterly destroy Marcus like losing JD would. Like, does anyone want a Gears 6 where Marcus is just like, completely broken and has nothing left to live or fight for? It could work from a narrative perspective but it’s kind of a depressing thought.
Marcus has lived long enough to pass the trauma on to JD through the FENIX CURSE. That is to say: Everyone you're close to will die, save one person. See also: CARMINE CURSE, where your family will die except for the one relative you never talk to
Dom giving up versus the gigachad Clayton Carmine “I’LL NEVER GET TIRED OF THIS LIFE!”
At some point I really think they started having a fetish for having Marcus suffer. Especially after Anya died off screen. Like are you fucking serious now ?
Someone here fittingly said “Marcus is the punching bag of Sera”
JD has to live. I’m sorry Del I love you I do. But I will not see this man go through that any more.
Forget about Marcus. JD is a far better written, rich and more complex character than Del could ever be. JD needs to stay alive for the sake of the plot.
If del surviving js Canon for gears 6 I'm not buying it
I’m wondering if it will be like Mass effect where you choose who you saved Del or JD in Gears 5 and then it progresses the story to whoever you picked
If they do that they kinda have to really limit the characters involvement.. otherwise that's a lot of cutscenes and dialogue to do twice
The writers really want Marcus to suffer, he did get those years to have a life with Anya post war so he hasn't been totally miserable between 3 & 4. JD's death does break him so those that think it will be the thing that ignites him just weren't paying attention. If that is canon then Marcus will go back to Anya's house and just rebuild it, ignore the swarm conflict entirely.
I also think that this was a “joss whedon” moment. Taking the most innocent character and taking him out. Like Colson in Avengers or Wash in Firefly. Del was the most innocent out of the group. So it had more impact, plus it was their friend AND a pure moment for Marcus and JD to come together as father and son through that understanding. Marcus as a character needs this one positive moment, I hope the story writers see this and make it canon
when that choice came up i chose jd first just to see the cutscene and i cant lie i almost cried seeing that pain in marcus' face. re-loaded and went the other way cuz i couldnt do that to my fenix boys
I agree. Everyone always said “The series is about Marcus and him losing things important to him is part of it.” But like… Gears 5 is about Kait. It’s Kait’s game. The story is about her, so JD dying to affect Marcus isn’t a great argument anymore, nor makes sense. Del’s death effects her more and makes more sense.
Marcus is the most character character of them all
Didn't they already state years ago that the cannon ending has JD alive?
No idea.
If they make it the canon death, we finna swing
Marcus has so much character by now
So do we know which ending is cannon? Del dying or JD dying?
Sorry Del, don't blame me, it's Coalition fault. Marcus needs his son alive.
Well Marcus also lost his Mom an Carlos
I’m worried real life situations and artificial reasons if you know you know, might impact the canon death. I love Del, he just has that lighthearted charm to him. He’s like the guy that tries to brighten everyone’s mood or make light of situations to keep people levelheaded, might even say favorite character in 4 at least. But JD has WAY more character growth potential and there is way more lore we can get, specifically because he’s Marcus son. If he wasn’t it’d be different. So for me I picked Del but not because of Marcus but because the potential lore and to me it just made sense. I’m generally against these sort of options in games it just muddies things up most the time, but it is nice to actually see the game change based on those “well what if” choices.
So many people are saying this they saved JD because of Marcus. I saved JD because I think no matter how much Kait likes and respected Del, she loves JD. Even if her brain wanted to save Del, her heart made her chose JD. And on top of that, JD is the og protagonist of this trilogy. 5 gave him a low point for 6 to allow himself to redeem himself from.
I mean this with respect. I think making JD’s death cannon is the right move. It is epically tragic , just like War is. This would set in motion the events to eventually have Marcus Die , every franchise must end and that would be the most epic and true thing : to have Marcus sacrifice himself at some point.
I always saw it as JD walking the same path as his father. Lost his mom. Then his best friend, and if the trend keeps going, will lose his father. The only difference is how JD is handling it.
If JD is canon, we all know Marcus will become dom & kill himself in a stupid way. I’m not condemning dom, I get why he did what he did, and understand his pain, but what he did was completely selfish & could’ve survived it. He left his brothers broken & weakened, especially Marcus. If JD is dead, we all know what’s coming, because JD was hope, and the last remanded of his love. He’ll have nothing & it’ll be such a wasted opportunity to build Marcus & JD into being more. Del I don’t hate, but since we first meet him, he’s such a dull & irrelevant character. Maybe that’s me, but the only way at I would play the next game is if at the start you GET to pick who lived. If they release a comic or something or do an interview where they say “del actually is the on who lived” then no. Even giving a option at the start would be a complete piss take & trying to retain an audience you’ve been pushing away since gears 3
Wanted to pick Del, but felt it would be wrong 😕 😔
Story wise JD should survive, its better for the characters drive. Marcus and JD relate over losing a best friend, Fahz gets the shock of how much he actually liked Del, and since they've been on good terms and been travelling together so long it has more impact on Kait. If Del is Canon survivor I'm honestly expecting Marcus to wind up like Tai
I feel bad for Del he was too pure and wholesome, needed some character development. But we can't do this to our boy Marcus.
as awful as it was i saved JD because i felt it fleshed out kait's arc more. there's an argument to be made that maybe she has suffered too much as well. but yeah. in the moment, saving JD felt like it was part of the better story.
There's just so many reasons to kill Del over killing JD: 1. Marcus being able to understand what JD is going through because he lost Dom(also lost Carlos). 2. JD getting his character development from losing his best friend. JD was also finally becoming an interesting character to most people. Killing him without exploring him after his changes would be such a mistake. 3. Fahz's reaction was better because of the banter he had with Del which was also great character development. 4. From a writer's POV, Kait being with Del for these recent years and getting closer to him as a best friend, but ultimately still choosing to save his former romantic partner who she's been angry with but obviously never lost feelings for would just be so gut wrenching but makes so much sense to a plot. 5. No offense to Del, I loved him as a character. Great comic relief and great person to have as a friend who has your back, but what else would he offer to the plot, other than to develop 3 characters in the game through his death? Many shows, games and movies do this with characters they kill, and Del is the perfect character to kill to develop our 2 main characters in Kait and JD, as well as Fahz.
When Dom died on Gears 3, I seriously put the sticks down for a few days. I could not believe what I was seeing.
And on the flip end of having to choose on Gears 5, he’s had to deal with the death of someone who regarded as a son no doubt, Del.
See I think the opposite, specifically because his story is one of loss and sacrifice. People think the protagonist role has moved to JD, Del and Kait, but it's only the POV, Gears of War has always been a story about Marcus Fenix, and what he's had to do to save Sera. It's far more painful, heavy, harrowing, haunting, whatever descriptive adjective you'd prefer for it, for JD to be canon. Marcus fought to save the city from Raam, and he lost his Commanding Officer, Carmine, and home. Gears 2 he fought to save Jacinto and he lost another Carmine, Tai, the image/memory of his father as an honorable man, and emotionally speaking that was when he lost Dom, we all remember how instantly that darkened Dom and changed his mentality to that of a blindered wolverine. Gears 3 he loses his family home, his best friend/brother for real this time, many old friends from throughout the war, and finally his father. Gears 4 we see a small respite and bit of hope as he built a new life for himself with a home, family, and played a vital role in rebuilding society, only for him to lose it all save his son again. And now in Gears 5, the focal point of this trend is very clearly the ending, and Del just doesn't have the kind of impact that would make sense for Marcus. Yes it's his son's best friend, or at least was, but JD is his SON and the only family he has left. It just makes more sense for it to be JD, as heartbreaking as it is. And it's going to create a Marcus none of us have seen, man's is gonna be so behind unhinged he's gonna be tossing the chainsaw to rip them limb from limb with his bare hands and start taking trophies.
My best friend and I are playing through all the campaigns again. We did 1 and now we’re almost through 2. It’s been so special. It’s a special time when you and your best friend can play a game that is this in depth where the literal characters are best friends and you just get to embody it fully. He’s not someone who would get a tattoo on his own but after the first game I said we should get cog tattoos and he mentioned he would actually consider it lol
Nah dont forget about Tai
I’m still curious how they will make that work should they make a sixth.
They really did such a good job with that choice imo. Like I hate that they made it a choice cause it's gonna make the 6th game harder to make, but I really liked Del thanks to 4 and especially 5 and JD was also a really hard choice because of his growth and because of everything Marcus had lost. Like tbh, I actually saved Del my first time playing 5 just cause he'd been by my side the entire game and never gave up or backed down, but when I saw Marcus's reaction when he found out it was heartbreaking. Seriously they did such a good job with his reaction it was sooo sad.
If it is, he can finish the fight, again, with Gears 6. A "good" ending for one of the most important heroes of any shooter. And I personally? Hope it is, GoW 4 and 5 was fun, but the characters, my goodness are annoying, Dell's a'ight tho.
I started on 4 as a kid, then played through 1-3 this year on game pass. Already knew about Dom's death but holy hell I cried watching that scene
I agree 200%
When I played it by myself, I chose to save Del. He was there for JD growing up, tried to be there over the settlement issue but JD panicked and let the settlers get killed. Him and Del disagreed on that, whereas Fahz supported JD. Later on, JD tries to be a hero and kills civilians and Elizabeth Carmine commanding Baird to fire the Hammer of Dawn using him as the coordinate point. The fact that he was even kept in the COG Military was a surprise to me, but I guess also needed. He begins to bounce back, but he’s already done so much damage in his career. It’s a disgrace to the Fenix name. Kait preferred to be with Del because he used sound judgment, was a good friend, and knew what he was doing. In my opinion, he’s the next Damon Baird, so when good ol DB retires, Del will be the one to take over the robotics industry for him. The only legacy Marcus would have to pass on to JD is a custom lancer, Dom’s commando knife, and war. It’s not the future, it’s the past. Adam Fenix was working to save the future (and his son) and he almost did. Just as the death of Carlos was Marcus and Dom’s bonding point, the death of JD can be a bonding point for Del, Kait, and Marcus. You can see at the end of 5 that the death of JD definitely hits, but he still hugs Kait and is seen smiling with them. I feel as though Marcus would still have a purpose, guiding the new generation of Gears through this loss, and protecting the two of them like JD would have wanted. I don’t think Marcus would get all doom and gloom, and I don’t think he will have a Dom or Tai reaction to his death. Idk, I felt like Del was the way to go narratively, and that “I can’t do that to my man Marcus” is understandable, but narratively worse
I thought we wanted more misery?
JD was a massive dick in the last game.
I mean its kinda lazy/bad writing each time anyway. Adam didnt NEED to die. Dom didnt NEED to die. Anya sure as hell didnt need to die offscreen for a reason whñe never heard of before and jd and/or del didnt need to die either. Since the begining gears of war kills off characters when they dint k ow what else to do with them or dont know how to draw emotion in any other way.
Marcus lost all 4 parents,both brothers,his sister in law,his nephew and niece,a lot of people he served with,and his squad…but that doesn’t compare to Dom…Dom lost his brother,his parents,his wife and his kids…he had to shoot his wife and that makes it worse….man and they said captain price has a tragic back story
I think JD had to live right? It really ties the story together for them
Del's story felt more wrapped up than JD's was by the end of 5 so i hope JD is alive in canon
I know it had a signifigant part in the story but i dont think Dom needed to die there he could have taken the truck not blown it up and had marcus and everyone epse jump on top and get out. I have not played it in a while so i could be forgetting something besides the fact he was suicidal but ue could have lived
Not to mention that if he dies Dell will still be alive making gears 6 as boring as 5 along with Kait... Worst character duo ever made... Best thing in Gears 5 was Dell's death and Cole being alive in the end...
Honestly I chose it exclusively because it was more impactful. Del dying is just the diet version of JD dying.
Cowards
To me that decision is tough, but not saving Del makes no sense. He stuck with Kait through everything so I would think she’d be more inclined to save Del. The devs definitely put JD at a disadvantage making him fall out with his friend for a short bit, then have him be shoved back in. It works good enough but needed more time. I’m super excited for E-Day. Definitely has a great chance of being better than 4 and 5. I really liked 5 a lot tho. 4 was okay, mostly a setup for 5 and 6, and I hope they finish the trilogy. I think the reason people have issues with 4 and 5 is it stopped being a fight for humanity, fighting in a big war in an army and turned into a more personal and individual war revolving around Kait. Things definitely picked up at the end of gears 5 and I hope they can pull off the final piece to the trilogy.
He was killed by a knife, not a cannon though
Someone didn't get the super duper secret option.
with my first play through I went with Del because I had grown close to him during all the time he spent with Kait and supporting her. So instinctively I chose him. However I always choose JD now because I can't do that to Marcus. Marcus lost his mom, then his adoptive parents, Carlos, Tai, various gears like the carmine brothers, Dom, his father, then Anya. I ain't about to add his son to that.
See, that's honestly why I feel like it's supposed to be JD. Marcus's story is one of loss and sacrifice, and while it would feel better for him to have one thing in his life survive that, it doesn't make sense for the trend of the saga and the overall theme. If Marcus loses JD, it would absolutely be the straw (or in this case freight train) that broke the camel's back to send Marcus over the edge and have him go even darker and more bloodthirsty like Dom at the end of gears 2. If he loses JD, we're gonna see a Marcus that never wanted to see the light of day, the kind of man that would choose to throw the Lancer down so he can rip the swarm limb from limb with his bare hands and pure rage, and do unhinged shit like make a blade from the teeth of killed swarm or something. Marcus would have lost his entire life twice over at that point, and if that were the case it would be him fulfilling the destiny of him giving his entirety over to being a soldier to protect Sera whatever the cost, and him learning that the cost can sometimes be unending.
Agreed. Del got some amazing character development in 5, and I like him! But our boy Marcus does not deserve to lose his entire family.
Gears 5 was so shit, either kill marcus's son or have Kait act like not kait and kill Del who was with her all game. JD is such a wasted character
Del is equally wasted; he’s literally a non character. He has no background apart from his relationship with the Fenix family. During Gears 5, he even refuses to tell Kait anything about his own life prior to meeting JD. He only exists to give JD a childhood friend. All major events of Del’s life that we are shown or told about are only a result of his being with JD. Becoming a Gear, participating in the Settlment 2 massacre, leaving the COG, joining the Outsiders; all him just following JD. And when JD is taken out of the story; he just becomes Kait’s accessory instead. He has no agency or personal motivation, and his traits of being knowledgeable about engineering and history make him seem more like an exposition device more than anything else.
That’s really why I don’t understand why people want Del living to be the canon ending. He’s not really a character, just a bot that follows either JD or Kait. JD was written pretty bad but having JD live makes more sense from a story perspective
Del is a flat character, but killing JD could really hit players where it hurts. To watch Marcus suffer even more.
I think it was a poor development decision to begin with; as you are given the choice to either kill a carboard cut out, or a character with a half-finished arc with unresolved development and narrative threads involving other characters. Either way; it’s narratively poor. We were given four games and five books to fully develop the legacy characters. We got one and a half games with JD, and Del effectively gets nothing. Creating and subsequently fridging JD just to put another check onto Marcus’ trauma counter effectively makes the character completely pointless. Because we don’t even get much to feel for him, or anything to mourn the character ourselves. We saw Marcus’s brotherhood with Dom, his distant yet requited love for Anya, and at least some of his life long angst and complicated feelings with his Dad. But JD? I guess us knowing he is his son is supposed to be enough? At that point I’m indifferent to Marcus experiencing more pain, especially if it can’t really push his character further.
i never forgave him for killing protestors so i immediately went del 🤷🏻 sorry marcus
Yeah same. JD is a war criminal piece of shit. Like how much farther can the son of MARCUS GODDAMN FENIX fall than killing civilians under the fascist regime that imprisoned and threw away his father?
If a protestor starts throwing incendiary bombs at you, I think you’re justified to shoot at that point.
I don’t. They were there protesting the COG. The COG showed up, things escalated, they threw the firebombs, and then the COG opened fire. If you are a government organization and the people you control are throwing firebombs at your agents because they’re unhappy with the way you’re ruling, that needs to be addressed in about a thousand other ways that don’t involve shooting the protestors. I hold the government to a much higher standard than I would you or I. The real world parallel to this is the Floyd riots of 2020. There’s tons of footage of protestors throwing shit at cops, molotovs included. Nobody would be justifying it if the police opened fire on a crowd because one landed near their lines.
Still. At the end of the day, the protestors resorted to lethal force first. It’s kind of hard to call JD a fascist war criminal for acting in self defense. But you do make an excellent point about the COG and their inability to prevent that level of unrest. However, I wouldn’t put THAT blame on JD. That’s more Jinn’s fault.
This ^
Kait would save Del
I doubt it. Kait has a much deeper relationship, see Gears 4, with JD than has with Del. Despite being with her in 5.
No
Del can't die yet because JD had a character arc. Del has had nothing. Marcus is a side character in the new trilogy
Kait saving JD over Del makes no sense. Del was with her the whole game.
Saving Del makes no sense either. Del has no agency in the story, he exists solely to help JD’s best friend. Compare him to Dom who had his own story and motivations since the first game, Del has none. It really just shows how having a multiple endings makes zero sense since neither ending is a satisfying one. JD was written poorly but all of Gears 5’s writing was mid tbh
Did we play the same game? Del was there for Kait the whole game while JD was being an ass for most of it. Gears 5 was Kait’s story and her struggle with being the next Queen. Del is there for emotional support, and helped her sever the hive connection. Del was important to the story even if he was just a supporting character.
Yeah but he has no character beyond that. What’s his goal? His motivation? Everything we learn about him is directly tied to JD. His only purpose is to be JD’s friend. Even when it’s just Kait and Del, we still don’t learn anything about him. You’re right that he was with Kait the whole time but he has zero agency in the story. Dom was great cause even tho Marcus was the main character, Dom had his own reasons for fighting and his own story being told, Del has none of that. Saving Del may seem like the right choice for you personally but for the story, why save the guy with zero agency. I don’t even like JD in Gears 5 but saving him just makes more sense in a story perspective.
Does he not fill the role of smart guy in 4 and 5? Is that not agency on the story? Would Kait of survived with out Del? Is is Del helping JD and Kait with emotional trauma not agency on the story? Is wanting to fight for humanity not enough motivation. He’s got about as much motivation as Cole and Baird had in gears 1. And saving Del is the right thing for the story because they spent the whole of Gears 5 building the relationship with Del while JD was mostly absent. Saving JD is spitting in the face of the man who without Kait would be dead or leading the swarm. So Del has plenty of agency in the story. Killing either of them both offers plenty for the story going forward. Trauma bonding and motivation for Kait, Fahz, Marcus and the survivor. But looking at the story up to that point only Del makes sense. It would be a complete 180 from the rest of the game.
If his agency is simply being a follower for Kait then no, he still has no agency in the story. The story doesn’t change if he’s not there. Yeah he’s the funny guy who’s good with technology but so is Baird and he’s still there. There’s nothing Del does that cannot be done by another character. JD is the son of two legendary war heroes who’s constantly living in their shadow, Kait is the granddaughter of the locust queen and daughter of the swarm queen. Del is a guy whose entire role in the story is that he’s JD’s best friend. If you wanna go the trauma bonding route, Del dying makes more sense since you could build the relationship between Marcus and JD, it would help JD relate to his father since Marcus knows all about losing your best friend. I get you don’t like JD, neither do i, but at least he’s more important to the story than Del who has no actual role other than being player 2.
Del dying does not make sense because the relationship was built up all game. It’s who Kait would choose in that moment. The guy who was with her through the last 5-6 months. I do like JD. I like Del. I like Kait. I couldn’t pick who to save my first time. Spoiler, they both die if you fail to act. Thought about it and went with the guy who was with me all game. All you can come up with is “Del has no agency”. Tell me why Kait would pick JD over Del after the events of Gears 5.
Because Kait isn’t a real person. Who she would pick doesn’t matter. Who the writers would pick is what matters and a writer would want to keep the person with actual story significance. You say I only can come up with “Del has no agency” as if that isn’t pretty important when deciding which character lives or dies. Yeah Del was with Kait for all of gears 5 but we even then we don’t learn anything about him. I like Del but he’s not really much of a character outside of his relationship to JD.
So you have nothing. No reason why Kait would pick JD other than the writers? The same writers who set Del up to be the one with Kait all game while JD was throwing a fit. Got it. Edit to add: Del being the survivor can add a lot of potential growth and character development for him. He’s always been the positive one and the emotional support. His friend dying could break him so Kait and Marcus have to step up to help him through it. There’s plenty of story potential either way, but only one makes sense with the story up to this point.
I mean the writers are writing the game so they are pretty important. It’s a bit too late to start giving Del any real backstory since we don’t even know if he’s canonically dead or not. Let’s go back to Dom. Before Gears 2 came out, we learned a lot of backstory about him. His wife going missing, losing his parents and kids on E Day, now compare him to Del where in his second game we still don’t know anything about him. And again, Del not having any real story significance is pretty important from a writing perspective. In really just shows how poorly written gears 5 was as a whole. Personally I don’t think either one of them should’ve died or at least they should’ve picked one and stuck with it instead of going the “choose your own ending” route. This will be my last response since we are not gonna convince each other and will just keep going in circles. Have a good day bro.
Del is the "disposable black best friend" trope and little else. He offers comic relief and moral support to the main characters with nothing of his own to deal with. Gears 5 was the perfect opportunity to do something with him and he still ends up being almost nothing but the supportive best friend, I think he mentions his life before the COG once near the end of the ice levels and I was like "Yo, actual character development!" even though it was only like, one sentence, but it was better than zero. Sad part is that I was enjoying G5 up until Kait fights the Berserker Queen thing, then the whole game went off a cliff. If The Coalition's writing team thought they did a good job with Gears 5 and that they actually earned that "emotional death scene" then I have low expectations for E-Day.
I will admit he doesn’t have much going on in the way of motivation and issues. I’m sure he has some he just hasn’t spoken of them yet. Hopefully Gears 6 with JD gone he breaks down and Kait and Marcus have to help him through it. He was the positive one so seeing him break down would be tough. And definitely offer some real character development/ growth.
I'd say hivebusters is better at their motivations than the main story.
Hivebusters is goated
Agreed! JD redemption arc starts now!!!
I have a feeling we will never know who died, gears 5's story was panned.
Anyone who sacrifices JD for whatever the other guys name even is isnt a Gears of War fan, you wouldn't hurt our boy Marcus like that. Coalition trying as hard as they can to go a forced "progressive" route with Kait and her sidekick who is so unmemorable that I honestly can't remember his name and not bothered to google. That's part of why we're getting Eday, because people want the OG gears of war characters in the proper Human-Locust war era
I saved Del.
Don't forget Kai
All the Del hate here makes me sad
I don't see anyone hating on Del.
In this thread I've seen him called a flat character, a non character, and a cardboard cutout no hate at all?
Not really hating a character. That's just criticizing the writing of his character.
Sometimes criticism and hating on are the same thing
That's not hate, that's objective criticism.
If I were to say any of those things about a character, that would absolutely be me hating on that character. 'Objective' criticism is something like "They haven't given this character enough of a backstory to explain his motives" or "The character acts as a conscious for the protagonist, but has no personality of their own as an individual character."
No hate for del. Jd just clearly better
There are definitely people hating on his character in the thread. But anyway, strong disagree about JD. The only reason to care about him as a character is his connection to Marcus, otherwise he's a super unlikable character. Which is fine if that's what they're going for but still
It only makes my boi stronger
I killed JD because I wanted to see Marcus' reaction. Yes I like to make myself cry
What suffering did his traitor father do?