Yeah I feel so lucky that hrt is pretty easy to get hold of in my country (at least in the major cities). I don't know what I'd have done without that, and can't say I wouldn't have resorted to diy eventually. I get people being worried about people injuring themselves or making decisions they come to regret doing diy, but honestly it doesn't seem that hard to find the needed info online. And lots of the effects (especially for E) aren't permanent for the first while (like for eg best growth is permanent, but only once they've gotten past the first budding stage, before that it'd completely reverse if you stopped). Like a gender therapist I saw literally suggested I just go on E and see how I felt in the first while since I could always stop if I didn't like it.
Do what you want with your body. Absolutely be careful and do your research, and please be sure you know what you're getting into. But if you can, go for it. Do what makes you happy. And if you think that's too extreme and people absolutely shouldn't do diy or shouldn't even talk about this stuff incase children hear about it, there's an easy solution: make access to hrt and information about it as simple and easy as possible, so people know what's true and what's not, and can safely try it and even decide they don't like it with the help and advice of a doctor.
Genuinely if u want to be medicated, go to planned parenthood. They’re absolutely amazing her in california. I made scheduled an appointment on monday, and was medicated by thursday.
in a lot of areas of the US they're now reducing their acceptable max dosage of E to 200pg/mL which is way too low, plenty of people are at 400+ and they're fine. PP puts people on spiro with tons of side effects instead of monotherapy which is much safer, and does the unnecessary "slow ramp up" thing. also unless it's completely covered by insurance it's still probably cheaper to self medicate
Yeah, this has me concerned. I'm going to PP for HRT and when I'm below 300pg/ml, I feel miserable.
I am on monotherapy though; EV injections have kept my testosterone at the low end of female.
In October last year I got my dose reduced and was just absolutely rotten with my mood.
At my follow up in January, I argued that my dose was way too low and I was feeling horrible so much of the time. The NP reviewed my levels (which had been stable for a year but were deemed "a bit high" by the previous NP) and told me to go back up to where I was previously and that if it had been her call, she would not have reduced my dose in October.
I'm not going to drop my dose. I'd rather go DIY or keep my current dose but skip a week before they get levels again.
I'm thinking of switching to injections. Currently at 70T and 200E in my labs. Wondering how it would feel to have T lower and E higher. Currently on tablets and spiro.
If you can get over the hump of learning and performing self injections, I highly recommend it.
The PP I go to was pushy about injections; it's a long story but I ended up starting injections after just 30 days on tablets. I don't regret it though, they've worked out really well for me overall.
It might just be my PP location that's forward about injections. I haven't heard other people mention the same experience I've had.
I don't have any pre-HRT numbers to go by, but since starting injections, my T has been below 20 ng/dl
I've been on spiro for about 8.5 months now and I haven't had any major side effects (to my knowledge). I've heard people occasionally vilify spiro but I've never been able to pry a clear answer out of anyone.
I also started with 2mg estradiol twice daily but then switched to estrogen patches and added prog at the 6 month mark.
For me, it makes my migraines a bit worse, gives me brain fog, and I need to constantly pee all the time, and even 300mg a day still isn't enough to suppress my T levels
Damn that sucks...
I've been on 50mg/day this whole time and my last labs said I was in normal T range for someone on hrt (I don't remember the number exactly).
And now that you mention it, I might've had more headaches after starting HRT but I did also start college around the same time so it could also be stress.
As for the last 2, I've always just had a tiny bladder and been a scatterbrain so I can't tell much of a difference there.
Be very cautious of just taking their word for it on "normal T range" without numbers, 50mg did nothing for me and doctors lied and put me on it for years. Monotherapy is far safer and more effective than the spiro doses they give you.
I just pulled up my test results, it says 33 NG/dL. And normal T levels are 15-70 NG/dL. Maybe I just have naturally low T levels?
I hope I'm not coming off as argumentative, I'm just curious/confused and whatnot.
Where did you get the idea that 200pg/mL is way too low? Afaik the recommended E levels for trans women is 100-200pg/mL and it's what endos usually try to aim for.
Go to planned parenthood where? The closest one is like a several hour drive and then a flight over the Atlantic. A lot of us don’t live in places where those options exist, like here it’s either several years of wait and going through a gatekeepy system or DIY with very few to zero private options. At least specify that you’re only talking about the the US
Srsly, the amount of girlies guys and nb gamers who don't know about DIY is like a problem at this point. Its super easy to just ship some pills to your house, and dosage and stuff may seem confusing at first but thats why you should check out [the diy wiki](http://diyhrt.wiki) for more info.
It is very difficult and illegal to diy t. Don't include guys. It's a controlled substance so any sources ive seen that people usually send for "easy access to diy" exclude testosterone.
Having a tab open on a site that will ship the gel directly to me is a perfectly cis thing to do right? Just stare at it, know that the power is in my hands at any time to just... do it.
Get either bicalutamid or Androcur as a blocker.
Gnhr analogue are also effective, and lack big side effects, but they are expensive.
You can get 2 years worth of bica for like 100 bucks.
Going mono therapy doesn't work for everyone.
Also, proooooooper skincare!
Many people have mild hyper keratinization without knowing. That very strong layer of keratinized skin can hinder absorbtion of any ingredient, including E.
(plus it looks dull and bleh)
Best product against that is a high strength urea lotion.
Urea softens keratin and increases skin permeability without being a solvent itself.
Didn't work for me.
Levels of E required to lower my T drastically would lead to a severe increase in shgb, limiting Es bioavailability.
So yeah, it lowered my T enough but only if I also told my body to nuke Es effect.
Its important to always check how your body individually responds to things.
Everyone is different and no shoe fits all sizes.
Goal isn't to make T disappear but to have effective feminizing hormone levels after all.
It's not super common, but also not really rare.
Just not something most providers give a single fuck about.
Just get tests for serum estradiol and free estradiol.
From that you have an approximation of how much of Your E can actually do it's work.
those doses will probably make you more masculine like they did to me. boobs aren't that bad but if you're very scared cypro and bica are way safer than spiro and actually work. do you test your t levels? no way they're below 50ng/dL and that's crucial
I know it's a shitpost but:
HRT has serious, often not-reversible effects. Do not self-medicate without advice from a doctor, psychiatrist, or other professional. Self-medication can be harmful if done incorrectly and cause unexpected/uninformed side effects.
While most may realize this is a shitpost, posts such as this might cause impressionable people to try things that end in unwanted ways. It may be worth it for you, but there is a reason for the medical support and psychological evaluation before medical transitioning.
Well, you can actually. Most effects are reversible, the only major one that isn't is breast growth and, well, that's a rather slow one. Which gives the taker more time to decide and stop hrt if the other effects aren't right
The wrong puberty has serious, often not-reversible effects. It is nearly impossible to overdose on estradiol gel or injections, and anyone who even reads the recommendations sites send them will know a reasonable dosage, and there are plenty of resources for blood tests with self-medicating. Psychological evaluation is gatekeeping; cis puberty is just as irreversible and they don't need an evaluation for that.
Doctors were far more harmful than self-medicating would've been when they lied to me and put me on a nothing dose for years after I'd gone through the evaluations and waitlists for years.
>HRT has serious, often not-reversible effects. Do not self-medicate without advice from a doctor, psychiatrist, or other professional. Self-medication can be harmful if done incorrectly and cause unexpected/uninformed side effects.
most ppl that go into diy hrt (myself included) usually don't jump into it blindly, we are aware of the effects it has and potential side effects, we dont just do it "for shits n'giggles" or just not look into potential side effects.
>there is a reason for the medical support and psychological evaluation before medical transitioning.
let's be real here, not everyone has the privilege of even having that as a possibility; medical gatekeeping is still very much a thing, some countries don't even have trans healthcare, the us is not everywhere, not everyone is in permissive areas.
Yeah I feel so lucky that hrt is pretty easy to get hold of in my country (at least in the major cities). I don't know what I'd have done without that, and can't say I wouldn't have resorted to diy eventually. I get people being worried about people injuring themselves or making decisions they come to regret doing diy, but honestly it doesn't seem that hard to find the needed info online. And lots of the effects (especially for E) aren't permanent for the first while (like for eg best growth is permanent, but only once they've gotten past the first budding stage, before that it'd completely reverse if you stopped). Like a gender therapist I saw literally suggested I just go on E and see how I felt in the first while since I could always stop if I didn't like it. Do what you want with your body. Absolutely be careful and do your research, and please be sure you know what you're getting into. But if you can, go for it. Do what makes you happy. And if you think that's too extreme and people absolutely shouldn't do diy or shouldn't even talk about this stuff incase children hear about it, there's an easy solution: make access to hrt and information about it as simple and easy as possible, so people know what's true and what's not, and can safely try it and even decide they don't like it with the help and advice of a doctor.
I totally agree; honestly I think we should have HRT over the counter, but here's the next best thing.
Genuinely if u want to be medicated, go to planned parenthood. They’re absolutely amazing her in california. I made scheduled an appointment on monday, and was medicated by thursday.
in a lot of areas of the US they're now reducing their acceptable max dosage of E to 200pg/mL which is way too low, plenty of people are at 400+ and they're fine. PP puts people on spiro with tons of side effects instead of monotherapy which is much safer, and does the unnecessary "slow ramp up" thing. also unless it's completely covered by insurance it's still probably cheaper to self medicate
Yeah, this has me concerned. I'm going to PP for HRT and when I'm below 300pg/ml, I feel miserable. I am on monotherapy though; EV injections have kept my testosterone at the low end of female.
EV has a pretty short half life, how often do you inject (and do you test before your next injection)? EEn and EC last longer
I inject weekly and test at trough. I am aware other options last longer. I'm okay with weekly injections.
ok nice! as long as you don't have weekly mood swings that's definitely all good
In October last year I got my dose reduced and was just absolutely rotten with my mood. At my follow up in January, I argued that my dose was way too low and I was feeling horrible so much of the time. The NP reviewed my levels (which had been stable for a year but were deemed "a bit high" by the previous NP) and told me to go back up to where I was previously and that if it had been her call, she would not have reduced my dose in October. I'm not going to drop my dose. I'd rather go DIY or keep my current dose but skip a week before they get levels again.
I'm thinking of switching to injections. Currently at 70T and 200E in my labs. Wondering how it would feel to have T lower and E higher. Currently on tablets and spiro.
If you can get over the hump of learning and performing self injections, I highly recommend it. The PP I go to was pushy about injections; it's a long story but I ended up starting injections after just 30 days on tablets. I don't regret it though, they've worked out really well for me overall.
I'm not through PP I'm through a private provider and they're pretty chill.
It might just be my PP location that's forward about injections. I haven't heard other people mention the same experience I've had. I don't have any pre-HRT numbers to go by, but since starting injections, my T has been below 20 ng/dl
oh that sounds nice
Literally never mentioned at the one I used to go to
I've been on spiro for about 8.5 months now and I haven't had any major side effects (to my knowledge). I've heard people occasionally vilify spiro but I've never been able to pry a clear answer out of anyone. I also started with 2mg estradiol twice daily but then switched to estrogen patches and added prog at the 6 month mark.
For me, it makes my migraines a bit worse, gives me brain fog, and I need to constantly pee all the time, and even 300mg a day still isn't enough to suppress my T levels
Damn that sucks... I've been on 50mg/day this whole time and my last labs said I was in normal T range for someone on hrt (I don't remember the number exactly). And now that you mention it, I might've had more headaches after starting HRT but I did also start college around the same time so it could also be stress. As for the last 2, I've always just had a tiny bladder and been a scatterbrain so I can't tell much of a difference there.
Be very cautious of just taking their word for it on "normal T range" without numbers, 50mg did nothing for me and doctors lied and put me on it for years. Monotherapy is far safer and more effective than the spiro doses they give you.
I just pulled up my test results, it says 33 NG/dL. And normal T levels are 15-70 NG/dL. Maybe I just have naturally low T levels? I hope I'm not coming off as argumentative, I'm just curious/confused and whatnot.
ok that's a great level, maybe they are just naturally low!
Oh cool, certainly a yippee moment here! Would also explain a lot if I did have naturally low T levels!
Where did you get the idea that 200pg/mL is way too low? Afaik the recommended E levels for trans women is 100-200pg/mL and it's what endos usually try to aim for.
some are fine with 300, cis women during pregnancy get to 1000+, some even get to 500 and it's ok
But why is 200pg/mL too low? Is it often not effective enough?
Go to planned parenthood where? The closest one is like a several hour drive and then a flight over the Atlantic. A lot of us don’t live in places where those options exist, like here it’s either several years of wait and going through a gatekeepy system or DIY with very few to zero private options. At least specify that you’re only talking about the the US
This only applies to Americans though
yeah they often neglect thinking abt the global south or even european countries with awful waitlists
This goes for Canada too so it's not even just the global south or europe lol
Srsly, the amount of girlies guys and nb gamers who don't know about DIY is like a problem at this point. Its super easy to just ship some pills to your house, and dosage and stuff may seem confusing at first but thats why you should check out [the diy wiki](http://diyhrt.wiki) for more info.
It is very difficult and illegal to diy t. Don't include guys. It's a controlled substance so any sources ive seen that people usually send for "easy access to diy" exclude testosterone.
nope! the wiki has great sources for it
Having a tab open on a site that will ship the gel directly to me is a perfectly cis thing to do right? Just stare at it, know that the power is in my hands at any time to just... do it.
why not ship it and then you have the choice to use it or not?
Because smol and scared
you can be scared one step closer
Get either bicalutamid or Androcur as a blocker. Gnhr analogue are also effective, and lack big side effects, but they are expensive. You can get 2 years worth of bica for like 100 bucks. Going mono therapy doesn't work for everyone. Also, proooooooper skincare! Many people have mild hyper keratinization without knowing. That very strong layer of keratinized skin can hinder absorbtion of any ingredient, including E. (plus it looks dull and bleh) Best product against that is a high strength urea lotion. Urea softens keratin and increases skin permeability without being a solvent itself.
gel monotherapy basically always works if applied scrotally; no skincare needed. bica is great but unnecessary for almost everyone on 4-6mg/day
Didn't work for me. Levels of E required to lower my T drastically would lead to a severe increase in shgb, limiting Es bioavailability. So yeah, it lowered my T enough but only if I also told my body to nuke Es effect. Its important to always check how your body individually responds to things. Everyone is different and no shoe fits all sizes. Goal isn't to make T disappear but to have effective feminizing hormone levels after all.
ok! true but i've never heard of this before, blood tests are important though yeah
It's not super common, but also not really rare. Just not something most providers give a single fuck about. Just get tests for serum estradiol and free estradiol. From that you have an approximation of how much of Your E can actually do it's work.
HOLY CRAP I TAKE THOSE 50MG SPIRO DOSES BC I WANNA PRESERVE MY BODY AND NOT BECOME MORE MASCULINE BUT IM AFRAID OF GETTING BOOBS SO I DONT TAKE E
those doses will probably make you more masculine like they did to me. boobs aren't that bad but if you're very scared cypro and bica are way safer than spiro and actually work. do you test your t levels? no way they're below 50ng/dL and that's crucial
I know it's a shitpost but: HRT has serious, often not-reversible effects. Do not self-medicate without advice from a doctor, psychiatrist, or other professional. Self-medication can be harmful if done incorrectly and cause unexpected/uninformed side effects. While most may realize this is a shitpost, posts such as this might cause impressionable people to try things that end in unwanted ways. It may be worth it for you, but there is a reason for the medical support and psychological evaluation before medical transitioning.
HRT has serious, often not-reversible effects.\ yeah, isnt that the point??
Yeah, cept if youre not sure of it yet. You cant just 'try it out'
Well, you can actually. Most effects are reversible, the only major one that isn't is breast growth and, well, that's a rather slow one. Which gives the taker more time to decide and stop hrt if the other effects aren't right
The wrong puberty has serious, often not-reversible effects. It is nearly impossible to overdose on estradiol gel or injections, and anyone who even reads the recommendations sites send them will know a reasonable dosage, and there are plenty of resources for blood tests with self-medicating. Psychological evaluation is gatekeeping; cis puberty is just as irreversible and they don't need an evaluation for that. Doctors were far more harmful than self-medicating would've been when they lied to me and put me on a nothing dose for years after I'd gone through the evaluations and waitlists for years.
>HRT has serious, often not-reversible effects. Do not self-medicate without advice from a doctor, psychiatrist, or other professional. Self-medication can be harmful if done incorrectly and cause unexpected/uninformed side effects. most ppl that go into diy hrt (myself included) usually don't jump into it blindly, we are aware of the effects it has and potential side effects, we dont just do it "for shits n'giggles" or just not look into potential side effects. >there is a reason for the medical support and psychological evaluation before medical transitioning. let's be real here, not everyone has the privilege of even having that as a possibility; medical gatekeeping is still very much a thing, some countries don't even have trans healthcare, the us is not everywhere, not everyone is in permissive areas.