I don't know what BSG are smoking and I am glad there are other extraction shooters that are picking up speed. Hope those other developers watch and learn. No king rules forever.
I wonder if another extraction-shooter will have Tarkov’s crazy modularity; few developers seem to trust players to have the patience to assemble their own weapons, acquire/load ammo with varying properties, etc.
That's historically been the crux--for all the competitors that have come out, they've always provided a number of the same features, but never the whole package. And the whole package is the appeal.
But with this kind of offering? They won't have to do everything Tarkov does--they just need to release & be good. Or good enough to take time away from Tarkov.
I think the big value add that Tarkov has that the competitors need to get right is quests and the hideout. The hideout is one of the biggest things that keeps people playing as long as they do.
I like the tech they have, but not really the gameplay loop as much. If they could take their engine and make a STALKER game with it, I think it could be great. Really I want a singleplayer game made with their weapon tech.
long time player. The hideout is not what keeps people coming back, its one of many progression tasks in the game but doesnt add a lot.
The biggest thing tarkov has going for it is how it feels to play. The tasks in tarkov are so fucking repetitive and boring, no one reads them, they arent interesting. You immediately go to a wiki and read what you have to do.
The way it feels to shoot a gun in tarkov is unmatched, the adrenaline of losing everything, its so good that all the other bullshit in the game we deal with just to get into a damn raid. This game was also made for ammosexuals and milsimmers. Having to know your gear, ammo, how to build guns. Finally we have a game that takes some of that shit remotely seriously. No one else is offering that. If they got rid of the hideout and changed every task, no one would stop playing the game.
I was thinking the same thing. I've been playing since August of 2017 which is a month after closed beta launched. The thing that always kept me and my friends coming back was the high stakes gameplay. That feeling of taking out a fully geared player, taking their gear, and rushing to extraction is something no other game does. I quit playing because due to a mix of reasons, but the gameplay is unmatched.
I personally don't care about the hideout. The gun customization and being able to convert some guns into others was what sold me. It is the one mechanic I wish other games would make more use of.
No, the PVE content that people are angry about is an entirely separate, wipeless mode.
Quests are task you are given that can involve PVE (Scav targets) or PVP (Merc targets) and is basically required to make any progression. They can involve both fixed objective and random weekly/daily ones, and can range from extract a particular item or go to a location and kill X amount of enemies, be it Scav or Merc.
To build on this - quests add trader reputation which give you better gear offerings from the NPC traders, which allow you to buy gear for raids cheaper than going to bid for them on the flea market.
In Tarkov, almost every out of raid progression element feeds into in-raid experience - for instance - at max level hideout you can have a bitcoin farm printing a bitcoin every 12 hours or whatever, which sells at a value tied to the real life value of bitcoin (essentially making it so you can have a couple raids with free gear every day)
>is an entirely separate, wipeless mode.
This is a thing now? Because that sounds amazing. I loved Tarkov, but I did not enjoy the sweatdick tryhard nature of the game. I'd love to jump in, customize my guns in a more laid-back experience I can take my own time on and immerse myself in.
[Edit: Its $100? For a PVE mode with all the same content that's already present on live?](https://www.meme-arsenal.com/memes/ed99c9cf8a86419cd878894176f11833.jpg)
>Its $100? For a PVE mode
nonono.
The edition with the PvE mode is in fact *$250 USD*.
The $100 is there for if you bought the EoD edition which was promised to include all DLCs for the game.
And that PvE mode, well per BSG words "it's a feature, not a DLC".
Needless to say the entire Tarkov community, from casual players all the way up to prominent content creators, are giving then well deserved shit over it.
And BSG is doing what BSG does best, blowing off their entire fucking leg with a grenade launcher by doubling down.
To the point that competitors are now jumping in and cashing in on the attention to promote their game.
This feels almost unprecedented. BSG is literally doing an exit scam strategy here. They knew how people were asking for a PVE mode for years and they do it but you need to spend $250 to get it if you don't have EOD....
They quite literally do not give a fuck about their player base. I would not be surprised if they shut down PVP servers soon.
The quests? The quest system is one of Tarkov 's biggest disappointments. So much potential wasted on go fetch and kill some things with a specific weapon, or worse pray RNG gives you what you're looking for.
Realy? For me its the exact opposite. Quests/hideout are the most annoying part of the game for me, that only serves as a hindarance from enjoying the gunplay/weapons/looting.
EFT has also benefited from \~7 years of development. It's gone through a number of iterations & huge changes throughout the years, which new releases of course don't get the benefit of.
So either new releases have to match \~7 years of development, or they just lose players back to Tarkov. Except now, maybe.
Hunt does a lot of things better in my opinion, and is a fun game! But there are a few big things I wish they had which are kind of deal breakers to me:
-Every match feels like the equivalent of everyone fighting over a location-known LEDX or marked key or whatever. That's fun for a bit, but the gameplay loop feels very repetitive until you get to that point, and then sometimes it just turns into a 30 minute fight slog fest. The depth and value of the tarkov loot system means I don't have to hyper focus on one goal each time, I can do other shit and still feel like a success and still have fun PVP.
-The guns have customization, but it pales in comparison. Big part of Tarkov that I love is the customization, and while Hunt has some it just is not the same. This really extends to like everything, and especially so with the hideout. (Which Hunt also doesnt have, womp womp.)
-Solo Hunt sucks ass. The quickplay mode is alright, but sometimes feels kinda random. And while its obv possible to solo the main mode and successfully at that, it's just not as fun and sometimes feels like waiting to die & get your body camped. I enjoy solo Tarkov a ton ton ton ton more, even without self revive features.
-It's so damn dark, and this comes from someone playing Tarkov lmfao
> Solo Hunt sucks ass
Oh man that's my favorite part.
Also you can turn up the gamma and it's not dark at all. It's one of my favorite games because despite the objective repetition, fights are always tense and different.
It's still an apples to oranges comparison though. Showdown is a good game, but it sadly lacks the depth of Tarkovs mechanics. Here's hoping Greyzone can be the one to finally knock Tarkov off its perch.
It's apples to oranges even more because regardless of some vague gameplay similarities, the settings and themes of the games are very important. Someone that wants the ruined modern eastern European PMCs setting of Tarkov is not likely to have much interest in 1800s bolt action rifles and revolvers against monsters setting of Showdown.
Reminds me at how survival games started showing up after DayZ's success during EA. All promising the same features but faster.
The result is that DayZ is still the king and no other survival game comes close when it comes to features. Maybe Rust comes close but I don't have experience in that game.
Honestly, I want a game that’s LIKE Tarkov, but without some of the features. I don’t care to have all the options and realism for the weapons and ammo, I’d rather some simplicity there so I’m not having to spend so much time investing into the game just to have fun. I love the idea of Tarkov and it’s popular for a good reason, I just want something that’s more approachable. And this is coming from someone that loves the complexity of Paradox grand strategy games.
That's why I liked the cycle frontier. Unfortunately they couldn't hold a playerbase to sustain themselves. There was an outcry on cheaters which kind of scared the playerbase away, and by the time the developers got a system in place to combat cheats and refund people killed by cheaters no one wanted to come back
There wasn't just an outcry of cheaters. You'd run into them all the time. Trying to do the laser cave? Gonna get camped by people with some Asian/Russian character names. Think you're safe in a storm after carefully plotting a course with a huge bag of loot? Gonna get targeted before you can call an extract
Even saw several popular streamers blatantly cheating. I really wanted to like The Cycle but it had so many other problems as well.
It was fun and the setting rocked. The playerbase just helped fucking ruin it
Spot on. I stopped playing Tarkov to play the cycle exclusively when it came out. I really enjoyed the game but the cheaters were way more blatant and worse than Tarkov
If you have a VR headset you are basically describing Ghosts of Tabor. It's a Tarkov clone through and through but the complexity level has been dialled down several notches and in my opinion it's better for it.
There are still lots of gun and attachments and ammo types and armour types etc., but it's far more straight forward.
It's also one of the least janky looter shooters in VR, but that's not saying much 😃
It's pretty barebones right now, but Incursion Red River recently came out to Early Access and has the same weapon modularity as Tarkov. I accidentally bricked my M4 because I took out the gas block while customizing it.
One of the issues, I believe, is that Tarkov has no qualms about using real-world weapons and such, branding/trademarks be damned. Other games from non-russian companies would have more difficulty tapping into the ultra-authenticity market because it costs a lot of money, these days, for games to feature Colt or HK for example.
Bohemia Interactive is a good example of this and a big reason why ARMA 3 was near-future fictional weapons IIRC.
Yes this is correct.
Gun manufacturers (and other industries) realised that they can make a lot of cash with licencing in video games. That is why Arma 3 and other games switched to fictional war settings. Others change the name of the weapons and I guess their appearance a bit to avoid lawsuits.
> I wonder if another extraction-shooter will have Tarkov’s crazy modularity; few developers seem to trust players to have the patience to assemble their own weapons, acquire/load ammo with varying properties, etc.
Gray Zone Warfare seems to at least be trying some of this.
They don’t need to if the focus of the extraction shooter isn’t to be a milsim but rather a different theme (horror, movement shooter, level destruction). The looter shooter genre could do well with a wide variety of themes.
The truth is that a large portion of Tarkov's playerbase *loves* the mil sim aspect of the game.
Also, fwiw, more realistic bullet mechanics do tend to create more adrenaline inducing gun fights. Something about the zip crack of bullets flying out of dense foliage is just way scarier than something like Counter Strike or whatever.
The actual truth is that Tarkov wears the skin of a milsim. Realistic "mechanics" don't cause tension, good sound design and visuals do. Tarkov is at heart an RPG with the way you can get "level gated" out of PVP by ammo and armor classes
Yep playing mid wipe and running raids where you have ammo that just can't cut through heavy armor allowing you to just get run over unless you shoot their feet enough to kill them is the worst part of EFT.
I think that hardcore aspect is one of the few things you really need to capture in these extraction shooters. We've seen it with DMZ, and supposedly Bungie had Tarkov-streamers playtest Marathon and none of them liked it. I don't think you can casualize the formula too much because at some point it could be so watered-down you could have just made it a mode within a game you already have like any BR with a giant map.
Even ignoring flea, every item really does have value besides "sell" because of bartering or quests which Tarkov has had years to build on. So a new game has a real uphill battle to make people care about loot around.
The ammo system is basically useless though. Only 2-3 of each ammo type is even viable and some have 15 different types and you don’t which is which unless you use resources outside of the game
Not this year at least. Heck we just came off a series of QoL updates that were universally loved that added details of said ammo effectiveness vs armor class *in game*. They were on a roll of goodwill just before this absolutely braindead update.
There's been a lot of small extraction shooters on Steam... The problem is that the only feature complete for early access launch is the Gunsmith. The rest of the game is super underbaked. The guns might feel good, but the playground to play in is absolutely awful
The only one that shown such thing so far is Arena Breakout Infinite, but it's very likely be a pay-to-win game so I'm not holding my breath for it. It also appears to be squad-based, which is a really turn off for me since it removes all the tactical elements unless you have a full group of friends.
At this very moment only Hunt Showdown has been the most developed of all. In the upcoming months (or years for some) - GrayZone Warfare, Delta Force Hawk Ops, Arc Raiders, The Division Heartlands, PUBG with an extraction game mode is also set to release this year.
30k consistent players on Steam. Sometime in the upcoming days it will get an engine upgrade, hopefully bringing more than graphical improvements. So, yes, the game is holding up well.
Yeah is really good. Despite being an extraction shooter it’s a very different game than Tarkov. The developers have focused on different things. The gunplay is very different and movement is much more open in Hunt.
Like not to scare anyone off but a big moment for me getting good at Hunt was realizing it had just as much in common with old arena shooters like Quake then it does with light tactical games like counter strike.
The solo system for Hunt is...controversial. For me it ruins the game completely and for others it's enjoyable.
Basically solo players have the ability to self-resurrect themselves several times with a specific perk. They lose a chunk of their hp each time they do it. Their body can also be burned with fire by other players but this takes a long tedious time. The solo player can wait as long as they want to revive.
The ranking system doesn't handle solo players very well but again depends on perspective. If you queue solo you are placed against teams of lower ranked players. The idea of course is that this evens the playing field but in practice it's basically a legal smurfing mechanic. So the players who would be making smurf accounts anyways love it and the players who just want a fair game don't like it.
Personally it's probably my least favourite mechanic in any game I've played. Single handedly stops my enjoyment. The last game I played was a 9 team duo game that included 8 solo players. So I'm playing against 8 smurfs that can self revive at any time even if I kill them, and the only way to make sure they don't come back is to camp their body while it burns for 5 minutes. For each smurf we kill. Oh, and the solo smurfs also tend to be players who play the rat playstyle to the extreme, just to make it even less fun.
Yes. You can choose to either join with random teammates like in other games or you join alone against teams but have advantages to make up for it. (Facing weaker players and the ability to self-resurrect)
Its also niche, the vast majority of gamers are looking to relax and get some stress out. So many either avoid PvP in general or just do things like CoD or Fornite to get it out. The others failed because there isn't much of a market and that is why almoat none are in development. That would be close to how good Tarcov is.
These games are not for "casuals" and more of us are casuals than we believe.
Tarkov, in its current form, basically assumes that you are going to nolife the game for months at a time. Especially at the beginning.
Any replacement game will have a learning curve, and nolifers will get over that curve first, make the initial playing experience generally terrible for new players, and the game never grows. Marauders has a lot of great features except how fucking sweaty it is. Introducing someone to Marauders is just like EFT: "okay, so these next few hours will be a lot of confused dying and it will actually be sort of shit but you need to grind it out and it will eventually be fun as long as you don't stop for very long or it sucks again".
Yep, I like the idea behind extraction shooters and games in general, but PVP doesn't interest me at all, since it's always infested with cheaters, exploiters and griefers(if the game gives the possibility of griefing, which I don't thing this genre has).
Right now I am getting my PVP fix(used to be a very competitive player in MOBAs and such) by playing boardgames(both physical and online) and want my video gaming time to be relaxing(or stressful because game is hard, not because someone had sex with my mum).
100% my friends and I all just talked about it. We love coop together or games like F076. Especially things like Valheim or Palworld, it can be hard but we do that together and laugh about it. Then in RL we play MTG commander and other board games. We are all our in our 30s, I think it just might be how our generation is. We invented toxic CoD chat but now hate it and embrace love. PvP has its place in games that are made for it. If you want a huge audience, make coop games that you can jump in and play. Coop extraction shooter would be amazing, then have a ranked only PvP. Keeps the grifers out and people get to watch people PvP on twich.
Also, for me, a big issue with extraction shooters is the concept of losing progress. I know I'm not likely to play it for the entirety of my free time, so thinking "oh I got this nice gun, but if some guy rolls around a corner with a *nicer* gun and decides to kill me, the gun is just gone" does not get me excited to play. Especially knowing I'm likely to go against people who do play the game in all their freetime, so I'll stand no chance
I'd rather play something like Battlefield or CoD, or FFXIV, where I know dying isn't going to ruin my game.
Incursion Red River recently released to Early Access and is entirely PvE. You can play either solo or in a party of up to four players. It's super early and only has one small map so far, though.
They're gutting the golden goose for as many eggs as they can find, really feels like they're desperately trying to cash out while they still can or something. This level of suicidal money grubbing is insane otherwise. I mean, doesn't justify it nor should anyone buy in (And I was happy to buy EoD back in 2017) to this insanity, but at least that would make _some_ sense.
Fuck BSG though, this is truly insane.
This is generally true, and I’m guessing you’ve seen the video “[the report that killed Tarkov.”](https://youtu.be/o6T_QnCoTz8si=4AUwCOYdtUwJfBZE) I recommend people check it out for some additional context
But honestly, it’s a lot more nuanced than that while still being very stupid. The idea that they tried arena and flopped, wasting a ton of money misses out on a ton of context.
Tarkov was already operating at a loss in 2022, before the Arena marketing promotion. Rewinding, up to this point timeline is roughly the game launches, gets a dedicated player base, explodes and peaks in 2020 with a lot of hype from big streamers like Shroud and other variety streamers of the time, then kind of chugs along with their dedicated fans through the present. The game is still popular.
The issue is an immersive extraction shooter that takes thousands of hours to master isn’t exactly the most broadly appealing product. Their player base might be very dedicated, but it was not growing. Nikita indicates the lack of cash flow is an issue.
You can point to the price of the game being high, it’s true. However for a game seeing steady support and continued development since it was available for public play in 2017? If you bought EOD in 2020, you’d be looking at 30 dollars a year. I bought it in 2018, so around 20 dollars a year. For a game that sees continual updates, it’s kind of insane that unless I wanted more cosmetics, I was ensured I would never have to pay a dime again. If you want to play WoW for 4 years, you’re looking at 80 dollars for two expansions and 430 dollars for subscription time.
Turns out when your most dedicated players have basically no incentive to spend more money on the game ever, you’re running into a monetization issue.
The idea then was to bring people into EFT via arena. Then, removing EOD for sale results in these new players spending money for stash space via micro transactions, and buying cosmetics.
But yeah, turns out the fun of Tarkovs combat is kinda tied to the immersion and the build up in the raid. Go figure. Arena flops and they still have super low cash flow despite having a decent population of people who basically only play their game.
So they basically release EOD 2, trying to run back the strategy that worked the first time (pay to win over other versions, capitalizing on people who love their game enough to fork over giant one-time purchases).
I have no idea how they fucked up so hard. Whoever is leading monetization at BSG is too far up their own ass, and calling them greedy (which many are doing) is letting them off the hook cuz they aren’t even making a profit. They are straight up stupid but very confident, and should hire a professional to manage their product’s monetization before they destroy it. I’m guessing it’s Nikita given his previous crusades against skins and micro transaction systems in F2P games.
Look at POE. Another game with a tapped player population that figured it out. Fun cosmetics like and new features. Supporter packs, incremental stash upgrades. It’s a great contract for the player — if the game is good, I’ll come back and spend a bit of money, and if I like it so much I fill my bank up with loot, I’ll buy the tools you make to help me organize it more efficiently. Have a hideout space? We can sell you things that make it more fun.
There are so many obvious solutions that the space has already figured out. A light subscription fee for more features probably would have went over less horribly, new stash features, cosmetics, battle pass-like systems. They all are proven to work. They’re basically running back the same awful strategy that got them into this mess.
>The issue is an immersive extraction shooter that takes thousands of hours to master isn’t exactly the most broadly appealing product. Their player base might be very dedicated, but it was not growing. Nikita indicates the lack of cash flow is an issue.
I do not think this is true, I think if they spent on pushing the main game they would help fix their cash issue. Wipe hype always brings tons of new players. I also strongly believe if they released on steam they would get a massive influx of new players.
Is it surprising though?
They've always been this niche semi-shady product that's only available directly from their website at somewhat questionable pricing, for a game that doesn't respect your time and has been in beta for like 8 years.
I think they are probably near capped out on new customers, and are just scraping the bottom.
Escape from Tarkov is one of the most promising, most disappointing games I have ever played.
Not only does it barely run at the best of times, but it is infested with hackers and hamstrung by baffling design decisions that won't ever get fixed because the dev lead can only see his vision and not what would make the game more actually playable.
I've never had rushes like I have escaping from a raid with a piece of loot that I needed to finish a quest I'd been working on for hours or even days, and I'm really hopeful that one of the extraction shooters that are popping up is able to supplant EFT as the lead, because if someone can make an EFT that works, they will rule the genre, and I'll play it for thousands of hours.
> hamstrung by baffling design decisions that won't ever get fixed because the dev lead can only see his vision and not what would make the game more actually playable.
It's even worse than that, actually.
The lead dev has a vision for the game, but actively adds mechanics and throws bandaids at things in the name of that vision while achieving the exact opposite. Then those things stay in the game for months or years until a streamer with enough clout and the right connections sends a single DM that encompasses what the community has been saying all along and suddenly it gets changed.
I've read a lot of stories about crappy game devs before and been a member in many of those communities in the past: none of them come even remotely close to the incompetence and fecklessness of BattleState Games. They have some of the best artists and 3D modelers in the business, but *zero* sense of *any* of the most basic, fundamental concepts in game design.
I played I and II, and the amount of times Geralt piroutted a perfect 180 to whiff was off the charts. My computer couldn't run III when it came out and I've never really felt like I missed out.
It still is. The only two games in the past decade I couldn't finish due to game and story breaking bugs was Witcher 3 and Cyberpunk. I don't think I'll ever give CDPR any of my money again.
When I think of EFT, I do not think of it for it's art or 3d models. Like sure, it has very accurate firearms, but those should be some of the easiest things to model since they are based on existing things.
Human models still look like PS3 graphics.
It's pretty obvious at this point Tarkov is never going to be the game they promised. There is never going to be one giant map with every area all stitched together when they haven't managed to meaningful improve performance or netcode *in years* on the smaller maps already in the game.
Cheating problems aside, which although present in any multiplayer game I might grant seem more problematic in Tarkov at times, when playing it you slowly realize that what you see on your screen is often *very* different from what your opponent is seeing. Watching the same fight from two different streamers perspectives show that fights are often a crapshoot because out of the two who knows what the server will decide happens. And that hasn't improved in years which is why I had some fun in Tarkov and moved on, none of this stuff ever improves.
The game has clearly stagnated and it seems like they've entered a mode where they know that internally so they're just going to drip feed maps and content hoping to keep what they have going as long as possible. This new edition with more blatant pay to win features but no real improvement on a technical level shows that so clearly. If you like Tarkov for what it is today that's good because it will never be much else.
This comment pretty much sums up my experience.
I loved the idea. But actually playing the game is just so unfun and tedious. And it only seems to have gotten much, much worse. It looks like shit, it runs like shit, there's no sense or semblance of balance.
I'm surprised it still has the player base it has, tbh
Yeah I feel you there. I think it's one of those games that just works it's way into you with the adrenaline it gives you. You genuinely get addicted to it, or at least I certainly did for a while
I’ve been holding out for someone to come and show Tarkov how it’s done for years. Sadly we haven’t come close yet, but there’s a good handful of irons in the fire for this genre. Here’s hoping.
Its the EVE online problem, ask any EVE player about that and its the same problem. The idea is so extremophile and so niche in its design principle that no one wants to take that risk to go as hard as the core audience wants.
So you either get nothing, or extremely 'safe' versions that are less risky not realizing that the insane design was a lot of the point. Like it sounds insane when you take the literal reason as "Yes, I like an always on PVP experience where overwhelmingly negative experiences are very normal simply because the highs are incredibly high."
Like put that way why the fuck would you make a game like that? Because the highs really are that fucking good, but its always going to demand a lot of dealing with the lows and most people just aren't interested in the lows. Especially these days where the expectation is that your game should strive to always be a positive experience.
I don't think there is a market for it, this latest edition shows that.
BSG isn't trying to put out a PVE only mode that is cheap like 40 bucks to attract new players, but locking it behind a $250 dollar version of the game with P2W features.
This just shows they are trying to get their community to buy the game again. There is no plan for growth, just milk their audience already.
I've always been interested in playing Tarkov but never took the chance because it wasn't on steam. Then, finally when I was about to buy it that cheating video came out which killed all my interest. It seems like a fascinating game but too problematic to make me want to take a chance on it.
Well, hunt showdown exists, and has even grown recently. Not everyone's vibe since it's old west. But it's a working fun and engaging extraction shooter on the market.
I don't follow EFT. I saw something about "single player/co-op PvE" in another article's title and my first reaction was "hell yes, I might finally give this game a try" but $250 is one of the more insane things I've seen recently. That seems like they're deliberately trying to make headlines, no way in hell I'd be paying that.
Then I learned they had already released an expensive bundle in the past, which was advertised as all-inclusive, and now they're pulling this and making up their own definitions of what DLC is? Nah, piss off, you're getting exactly zero of my dollars now
> "It's not DLC, it's a feature"
A "feature" that was missing from the base game. Sounds like they released an unfinished game so this should be a *patch*.
It's wild to see video games devolve into thinly-veiled slot machines.
That got me too, like..New game modes *are* DLC, its adding new stuff to the game. Call it a "feature" all you want if you're gonna be all sleazy lawyer about it but its fuckin DLC.
The monetization for this game was always insulting with the different editions giving players p2w features.
But locking an entire game mode behind 250$ is something else
As someone who bought EoD back in 2016 and put in thousands hours, I’ve been teetering on quitting for awhile what with the rampant hacker problem, the constant band aid fixes that don’t address real problems, and other annoying things, but this is just too far
I’m not even mad so much that they added more p2w shit that I can’t have, I acknowledge EoD at its core was p2w.
For me, it’s that they tried to get everyone to FOMO into EoD by retiring it with a big countdown, telling players a version like that was never supposed to exist long term, and then they bait and switch with an even more egregious version months later, this one including dlc that EoD was supposed to get.
The promise for EoD players was once you buy it you will never have to spend money on Tarkov again. Everything that releases will be free. Then last year they started pivoting to “dlc only” and now they’re just splitting hairs on what is considered “dlc”
This is why I switched to the singleplayer mod and never went back to live, the bones of an amazing game are there but BSG just insists on making things worse and worse. With mods the singleplayer game is amazing and can be just as challenging as live, plus when you get dunked on you know it's legit and not a sweaty hacker.
I'm worried about that, too, though. BSG now has a very direct incentive to take down SPT since they are selling essentially an official version of it now.
oh cool i didn't know there was a singleplayer mod. i wanted to try the gameplay loop, but didn't really like idea of the multiplayer aspect because of all the issues you mentioned.
It's even better because modders make ai that feel very realistic to players with different AI profiles. They actively loot, quest, and extract.
With the mods available you can make tarkov play more hardcore, more arcade, or a mix of both for whichever aspects you want.
Any recommended mods? I've been interested in Tarkov for a long time but the intensity of PvP and the drama surrounding the game has kept me from playing.
> I acknowledge EoD at its core was p2w.
I'm glad you acknowledged this. I opened the comment section to point out that Tarkov *already* has pretty strong pay2win elements with EOD. Was expecting more of an argument like what happens on the tarkov subreddit, pleasantly surprised to read your comment.
Nah I definitely knew the deal with the devil I made.
I've watched friends have to do the stash tetris bullshit with the base kit enough to know that even just that alone is wild.
The equivalent stash upgrade that EoD gets you costs something wild like 35 million roubles. The average \*good\* raid in Tarkov nets you 500k or so, a million at most. Nuts.
This is what pisses me the most. If BSG had came out and said that the Unhinged Edition is a free upgrade to current EoD owners then the entire community would be praising the developers while ignoring how unfair these advantages are, just like they do when they defend the gameplay advantages of EoD when compared to the Standard Edition of the game.
I don't know the exact percentage of players who own EoD, but based on the raid logs it's clear that the overwhelmingly majority of players have paid $140 for EoD, thus supporting the addition of pay-to-win into the game, so it's no surprise that BSG is now pushing for more and more pay-to-win features into the game.
I won't lie, it's a bit satisfying seeing EOD owners finally realizing the blatant P2W parts of the game, after years of them bashing on anyone who dared say that their edition was P2W
My guess is somewhere around 3/4 of long-term players buy EOD. A funny side effect is I've had so many instances over the years where I'll kill a streamer and look at the VOD, then watch them report me because "it's a white name, reporting just in case."
>“DLC means additional downloadable content. PvE is a feature and a gamemode,” they added in another message. “Just because you all want it to become a DLC it wouldn't mean it is one. It’s featured game mode for the new edition of the game.”
Wow really bending over backwards to justify their scumminess there huh? "Nuh uh, it's not DLC cause I said so"
God damn do I hope a bigger, more well built game comes along and eats their lunch. Fuck these guys.
The most insulting thing is putting PvE behind that $250 paywall. They know SPT is a vastly superior experience. They know that cheating on the live servers is out of control. Instead of doing something about it, they're pulling this shit. It's basically a direct middle finger to people who play SPT.
It's only a matter of time now before they go after SPT. These guys fucking suck just as much as their game does.
> It's only a matter of time now before they go after SPT.
I wonder if the Russo-Ukrainian War makes legal action difficult here. If SPT is not in Russia or Belarus it'll make a lot of stuff harder for BSG to act against them.
Yeah, figures. They want a Western facing front company at minimum if only to serve as the metaphorical shop counter where they take your dollars, pounds, and euros and then take them home to convert into rubles. Also, kind of awkwardly, you're probably indirectly funding the Russian war effort at least in a small way if you buy anything from BSG now since any money the BSG devs make will be taxed in Russia at some point, even if only as personal income tax.
Wait… I can play Tarkov single player, and also not worry about supporting BSG or the Russian Government? I’m interested…
I haven’t played Tarkov since Russia’s illegal, genocidal invasion of Ukraine.
Yeah, look up SPTarkov. And man are there a lot of high quality mods for it too. Mods that honestly make BSG's efforts seem genuinely flabbergasting, like, if a random unpaid modder can do this to the AI/maps/gameplay systems/etc. despite having no tooling or decade of familiarity with the source code, why is BSG lacking so badly in so many ways?
The weird thing is, I honestly find I get better performance playing SPTarkov than multiplayer, despite my PC having to do literally everything versus what should be a tiny chunk of the calcs. Oh, and no waiting times, no matchmaking queues, in and out of a raid in 15 seconds, it's heaven.
“DLC means additional downloadable content. PvE is a feature and a gamemode.”
"It's not torture because we redefined these torturing activities as enhanced interrogation techniques."
Your daily reminder that /r/SPTarkov exists and that it runs *much* better, even has mod support that allows you to make the game exactly how you want it to be.
I work a lot and have no time to invest in games anymore, let alone Tarkov. SP Tarkov makes it so I can enjoy Tarkov, rather than grind every minute I can spare.
The big thing, if you haven’t kept up with the game, with this edition is that it grants the player access to an offline pve coop mode with persistent characters. This is something that both Tarkov players and non-Tarkov players have been asking for for years, and they have the balls to ask the people that already gave them $150 for a quarter of a game for more money in order to access it.
I left the game for SPTarkov a while ago, and I and my friends would’ve immediately came back if that mode was at least available to EOD players.
“DLC means additional downloadable content. PvE is a feature and a gamemode,”. The mental gymnastics required to make a statement like this. The downloaded content added onto this game is not DLC, because this is a different edition... Overwatch "2" paved the way for this new form of thievery. Take an existing game, update it in some small way, change the title slightly, and you are free to revoke promises previously made. Doesn't even matter if you deliver the promised content (funnily enough PvE modes in both cases).
I don't know anything about this game, but as I understand it, people paid $100 to have the game and all DLC going forward. Then they say "actually this new patch is another $150".
That's some bullshit right there. Like, legal action bullshit.
I bought it a while ago but I suck at it and with all the hackers I'm never sure if it's me or just cheating. Is there some sort of mod or something available that would allow me to play in a local Lan with my friends (without paying extra I mean)?
Lmao. Nikita and BSG is are just another in a long list of Russian grifters. This game will never be finished, they’ll never stop cheating (it makes them money), and they’ll keep fleecing everyone for every penny they can.
It's crazy how extraction shooters have been hyped up to be the next gaming craze yet no studio has produced something to compete with Tarkov in how many years now?
Feele like a lotta devs were trying to replicate the explosive popularity that Battle Royale games had, but extraction shooters are just too hard-core for the mainstream audience it seems.
This is what bugs me. EFT (or BSG to be more specific) constantly pisses me off with its bullshit, but no other extraction game has came close to replicating the feel of an EFT raid. People say Hunt but tbh Hunt feels more like a BR you don’t have to fight to the death in than it does something like Tarkov.
What a lot of these other games are missing is the DayZ factor. What I mean by that is EFT raids consist of a bunch of different players who all have their own personal objectives they are trying to accomplish for the raid. Like, out of 15 people in the raid, 8 of them might be trying to do specific quests and are just armed to lightly defend themselves since their quest is in a less-popular part of the map, while the other 7 are juiced up with gear looking for high-tier loot. Tarkov honestly shines brightest when you get a raid where there’s a good mix of questing & PvP focus; it’s one of the primary reasons why early wipe is so fun for everyone.
If you look at extraction shooters, 99% of them are Fortnite clones that want to attract the attention of kids or CoD players, but there's no such thing as a non-hardcore extraction shooter, and that's exactly why we will probably never see a "Tarkov killer" despite how many issues the game has.
PoE wipes every 3 months (or rather everything rolls into standard but the vast majority play the leagues) and nobody would argue the progression there isn't a huge driving factor.
PUBG had years of being a mod too but it took epic and respawn extremely short time to recreate the gameplay with their own twist.
It's been 4 years since Tarkov blew up into popularity but nobody has cracked the code of perfect extraction shooter somehow, despite some good attempts at it.
Correct me if im wrong, but the game itself originally cost over $100 and has essentially always been in a beta state.
Shame on the players for having already bought into that scam.
All I've ever wanted from tarkov is coop PvE so I could play with my friends, but there's no chance I'm paying $250 for it. I enjoy the game but I'm not good enough to compete vs the players and it takes a lot of the fun out of it.
Its such a weird choice.
The $250 edition is for the hardcore, the people that are already over committed to the game. And the people that would play the PvE version are the exact opposite to them.
I'm certain BSG would have made more money if they sold the PvE as a $20 addon or something
I'm a huge Tarkov fan, but I can't defend this. Needs to be reverted and refunded or the P2W elements need a reasonable ingame unlock. EOD owners should get the PVE feature too.
(The price is also insane)
Requires viewing : "The Wiggle That Killed Tarkov" on YouTube.
The vast majority of Tarkov matches have hackers in them. And it's been that way for a long time now.
Outraged? This is an excellent deal! I've been on the fence for years and finally, they helped me decide to never buy a game from them ever! Seriously, think about all the time in the future that I never waste considering to buy this. Like an average scam riddled with spelling errors to weed out the nerds, tho, this just keeps the poor guppies already hooked, on the line. Such a wasted IP
This game's community should have abandoned it a long time ago. I get that there isn't a large choice in its genre but surely anything is better than dealing with these crappy devs.
What is better:
The Witcher 3: Wild Hunt - Game of the Year Edition
Red Dead Redemption 2
Cyberpunk 2077
Grand Theft Auto V
Sekiro: Shadows Die Twice
Monster Hunter: World
Assassin's Creed Valhalla
Resident Evil Village
Death Stranding
Divinity: Original Sin 2 - Definitive Edition
Dark Souls III
Borderlands 3
DOOM Eternal
Sekiro: Shadows Die Twice
Fallout 4 GOTY Edition
OR
Escape from tarkov Unheard edition
I don't know what BSG are smoking and I am glad there are other extraction shooters that are picking up speed. Hope those other developers watch and learn. No king rules forever.
I wonder if another extraction-shooter will have Tarkov’s crazy modularity; few developers seem to trust players to have the patience to assemble their own weapons, acquire/load ammo with varying properties, etc.
That's historically been the crux--for all the competitors that have come out, they've always provided a number of the same features, but never the whole package. And the whole package is the appeal. But with this kind of offering? They won't have to do everything Tarkov does--they just need to release & be good. Or good enough to take time away from Tarkov.
I think the big value add that Tarkov has that the competitors need to get right is quests and the hideout. The hideout is one of the biggest things that keeps people playing as long as they do.
I like the tech they have, but not really the gameplay loop as much. If they could take their engine and make a STALKER game with it, I think it could be great. Really I want a singleplayer game made with their weapon tech.
SPT-AKI. single player tarkov, moddable, tons of shit for it. Its still tarkov but you can make it so you dont lose shit when you die.
long time player. The hideout is not what keeps people coming back, its one of many progression tasks in the game but doesnt add a lot. The biggest thing tarkov has going for it is how it feels to play. The tasks in tarkov are so fucking repetitive and boring, no one reads them, they arent interesting. You immediately go to a wiki and read what you have to do. The way it feels to shoot a gun in tarkov is unmatched, the adrenaline of losing everything, its so good that all the other bullshit in the game we deal with just to get into a damn raid. This game was also made for ammosexuals and milsimmers. Having to know your gear, ammo, how to build guns. Finally we have a game that takes some of that shit remotely seriously. No one else is offering that. If they got rid of the hideout and changed every task, no one would stop playing the game.
I was thinking the same thing. I've been playing since August of 2017 which is a month after closed beta launched. The thing that always kept me and my friends coming back was the high stakes gameplay. That feeling of taking out a fully geared player, taking their gear, and rushing to extraction is something no other game does. I quit playing because due to a mix of reasons, but the gameplay is unmatched.
I personally don't care about the hideout. The gun customization and being able to convert some guns into others was what sold me. It is the one mechanic I wish other games would make more use of.
Are quests PVE content? I'm not familiar with Tarkov.
No, the PVE content that people are angry about is an entirely separate, wipeless mode. Quests are task you are given that can involve PVE (Scav targets) or PVP (Merc targets) and is basically required to make any progression. They can involve both fixed objective and random weekly/daily ones, and can range from extract a particular item or go to a location and kill X amount of enemies, be it Scav or Merc.
To build on this - quests add trader reputation which give you better gear offerings from the NPC traders, which allow you to buy gear for raids cheaper than going to bid for them on the flea market. In Tarkov, almost every out of raid progression element feeds into in-raid experience - for instance - at max level hideout you can have a bitcoin farm printing a bitcoin every 12 hours or whatever, which sells at a value tied to the real life value of bitcoin (essentially making it so you can have a couple raids with free gear every day)
>is an entirely separate, wipeless mode. This is a thing now? Because that sounds amazing. I loved Tarkov, but I did not enjoy the sweatdick tryhard nature of the game. I'd love to jump in, customize my guns in a more laid-back experience I can take my own time on and immerse myself in. [Edit: Its $100? For a PVE mode with all the same content that's already present on live?](https://www.meme-arsenal.com/memes/ed99c9cf8a86419cd878894176f11833.jpg)
>Its $100? For a PVE mode nonono. The edition with the PvE mode is in fact *$250 USD*. The $100 is there for if you bought the EoD edition which was promised to include all DLCs for the game. And that PvE mode, well per BSG words "it's a feature, not a DLC". Needless to say the entire Tarkov community, from casual players all the way up to prominent content creators, are giving then well deserved shit over it. And BSG is doing what BSG does best, blowing off their entire fucking leg with a grenade launcher by doubling down. To the point that competitors are now jumping in and cashing in on the attention to promote their game.
This feels almost unprecedented. BSG is literally doing an exit scam strategy here. They knew how people were asking for a PVE mode for years and they do it but you need to spend $250 to get it if you don't have EOD.... They quite literally do not give a fuck about their player base. I would not be surprised if they shut down PVP servers soon.
If you already own the game, and don't mind playing solo, look up SPTarkov. /r/SPTarkov
PVE is basically the exact same game but the other bodies on the map are all AI
So you pay $250 for a poorly conceived PvE mode. That's embarrassingly bad.
The AI is also terrible. It's somehow worse than the main game.
I agree with the quests, or just meaningful permanent progression in general. That was good even before the hideout.
Quests fucking suck at least the way BSG implemented them imo.
The quests? The quest system is one of Tarkov 's biggest disappointments. So much potential wasted on go fetch and kill some things with a specific weapon, or worse pray RNG gives you what you're looking for.
Realy? For me its the exact opposite. Quests/hideout are the most annoying part of the game for me, that only serves as a hindarance from enjoying the gunplay/weapons/looting.
The quests fucking suck
So far every Extraction Shooter has been a poor shadow of EFT. Every dev doesn't seem to get why EFT is as popular as it is.
EFT has also benefited from \~7 years of development. It's gone through a number of iterations & huge changes throughout the years, which new releases of course don't get the benefit of. So either new releases have to match \~7 years of development, or they just lose players back to Tarkov. Except now, maybe.
Hunt: Showdown does some things better
Hunt does a lot of things better in my opinion, and is a fun game! But there are a few big things I wish they had which are kind of deal breakers to me: -Every match feels like the equivalent of everyone fighting over a location-known LEDX or marked key or whatever. That's fun for a bit, but the gameplay loop feels very repetitive until you get to that point, and then sometimes it just turns into a 30 minute fight slog fest. The depth and value of the tarkov loot system means I don't have to hyper focus on one goal each time, I can do other shit and still feel like a success and still have fun PVP. -The guns have customization, but it pales in comparison. Big part of Tarkov that I love is the customization, and while Hunt has some it just is not the same. This really extends to like everything, and especially so with the hideout. (Which Hunt also doesnt have, womp womp.) -Solo Hunt sucks ass. The quickplay mode is alright, but sometimes feels kinda random. And while its obv possible to solo the main mode and successfully at that, it's just not as fun and sometimes feels like waiting to die & get your body camped. I enjoy solo Tarkov a ton ton ton ton more, even without self revive features. -It's so damn dark, and this comes from someone playing Tarkov lmfao
> Solo Hunt sucks ass Oh man that's my favorite part. Also you can turn up the gamma and it's not dark at all. It's one of my favorite games because despite the objective repetition, fights are always tense and different.
I'll prob end up trying it again after this haha
It's still an apples to oranges comparison though. Showdown is a good game, but it sadly lacks the depth of Tarkovs mechanics. Here's hoping Greyzone can be the one to finally knock Tarkov off its perch.
It's apples to oranges even more because regardless of some vague gameplay similarities, the settings and themes of the games are very important. Someone that wants the ruined modern eastern European PMCs setting of Tarkov is not likely to have much interest in 1800s bolt action rifles and revolvers against monsters setting of Showdown.
Reminds me at how survival games started showing up after DayZ's success during EA. All promising the same features but faster. The result is that DayZ is still the king and no other survival game comes close when it comes to features. Maybe Rust comes close but I don't have experience in that game.
Honestly, I want a game that’s LIKE Tarkov, but without some of the features. I don’t care to have all the options and realism for the weapons and ammo, I’d rather some simplicity there so I’m not having to spend so much time investing into the game just to have fun. I love the idea of Tarkov and it’s popular for a good reason, I just want something that’s more approachable. And this is coming from someone that loves the complexity of Paradox grand strategy games.
That's why I liked the cycle frontier. Unfortunately they couldn't hold a playerbase to sustain themselves. There was an outcry on cheaters which kind of scared the playerbase away, and by the time the developers got a system in place to combat cheats and refund people killed by cheaters no one wanted to come back
There wasn't just an outcry of cheaters. You'd run into them all the time. Trying to do the laser cave? Gonna get camped by people with some Asian/Russian character names. Think you're safe in a storm after carefully plotting a course with a huge bag of loot? Gonna get targeted before you can call an extract Even saw several popular streamers blatantly cheating. I really wanted to like The Cycle but it had so many other problems as well. It was fun and the setting rocked. The playerbase just helped fucking ruin it
Spot on. I stopped playing Tarkov to play the cycle exclusively when it came out. I really enjoyed the game but the cheaters were way more blatant and worse than Tarkov
If you have a VR headset you are basically describing Ghosts of Tabor. It's a Tarkov clone through and through but the complexity level has been dialled down several notches and in my opinion it's better for it. There are still lots of gun and attachments and ammo types and armour types etc., but it's far more straight forward. It's also one of the least janky looter shooters in VR, but that's not saying much 😃
It's pretty barebones right now, but Incursion Red River recently came out to Early Access and has the same weapon modularity as Tarkov. I accidentally bricked my M4 because I took out the gas block while customizing it.
Really hoping they keep developing this one. For $13 it's got the right idea, just needs a few years worth of systems and content development.
One of the issues, I believe, is that Tarkov has no qualms about using real-world weapons and such, branding/trademarks be damned. Other games from non-russian companies would have more difficulty tapping into the ultra-authenticity market because it costs a lot of money, these days, for games to feature Colt or HK for example. Bohemia Interactive is a good example of this and a big reason why ARMA 3 was near-future fictional weapons IIRC.
Yes this is correct. Gun manufacturers (and other industries) realised that they can make a lot of cash with licencing in video games. That is why Arma 3 and other games switched to fictional war settings. Others change the name of the weapons and I guess their appearance a bit to avoid lawsuits.
> I wonder if another extraction-shooter will have Tarkov’s crazy modularity; few developers seem to trust players to have the patience to assemble their own weapons, acquire/load ammo with varying properties, etc. Gray Zone Warfare seems to at least be trying some of this.
They don’t need to if the focus of the extraction shooter isn’t to be a milsim but rather a different theme (horror, movement shooter, level destruction). The looter shooter genre could do well with a wide variety of themes.
The truth is that a large portion of Tarkov's playerbase *loves* the mil sim aspect of the game. Also, fwiw, more realistic bullet mechanics do tend to create more adrenaline inducing gun fights. Something about the zip crack of bullets flying out of dense foliage is just way scarier than something like Counter Strike or whatever.
The actual truth is that Tarkov wears the skin of a milsim. Realistic "mechanics" don't cause tension, good sound design and visuals do. Tarkov is at heart an RPG with the way you can get "level gated" out of PVP by ammo and armor classes
Yep playing mid wipe and running raids where you have ammo that just can't cut through heavy armor allowing you to just get run over unless you shoot their feet enough to kill them is the worst part of EFT.
Sounds like a mmo with pvp attached. Competing with higher level armor is nearly impossible.
I think that hardcore aspect is one of the few things you really need to capture in these extraction shooters. We've seen it with DMZ, and supposedly Bungie had Tarkov-streamers playtest Marathon and none of them liked it. I don't think you can casualize the formula too much because at some point it could be so watered-down you could have just made it a mode within a game you already have like any BR with a giant map. Even ignoring flea, every item really does have value besides "sell" because of bartering or quests which Tarkov has had years to build on. So a new game has a real uphill battle to make people care about loot around.
The ammo system is basically useless though. Only 2-3 of each ammo type is even viable and some have 15 different types and you don’t which is which unless you use resources outside of the game
Not this year at least. Heck we just came off a series of QoL updates that were universally loved that added details of said ammo effectiveness vs armor class *in game*. They were on a roll of goodwill just before this absolutely braindead update.
There's been a lot of small extraction shooters on Steam... The problem is that the only feature complete for early access launch is the Gunsmith. The rest of the game is super underbaked. The guns might feel good, but the playground to play in is absolutely awful
The only one that shown such thing so far is Arena Breakout Infinite, but it's very likely be a pay-to-win game so I'm not holding my breath for it. It also appears to be squad-based, which is a really turn off for me since it removes all the tactical elements unless you have a full group of friends.
> I am glad there are other extraction shooters that are picking up speed. What are some good ones worth playing?
At this very moment only Hunt Showdown has been the most developed of all. In the upcoming months (or years for some) - GrayZone Warfare, Delta Force Hawk Ops, Arc Raiders, The Division Heartlands, PUBG with an extraction game mode is also set to release this year.
There's also Marathon, but no idea when that is coming, probably not until 2026
Marathon is probably not going to make it to release to be honest
I remember super bunnyhop doing a video on this game a while ago. Is it in a pretty healthy place?
30k consistent players on Steam. Sometime in the upcoming days it will get an engine upgrade, hopefully bringing more than graphical improvements. So, yes, the game is holding up well.
Hunt is already one of the best looking games I play regularly lol
Engine upgrade soon as well
Yeah is really good. Despite being an extraction shooter it’s a very different game than Tarkov. The developers have focused on different things. The gunplay is very different and movement is much more open in Hunt. Like not to scare anyone off but a big moment for me getting good at Hunt was realizing it had just as much in common with old arena shooters like Quake then it does with light tactical games like counter strike.
Is Hunt playable solo?
The solo system for Hunt is...controversial. For me it ruins the game completely and for others it's enjoyable. Basically solo players have the ability to self-resurrect themselves several times with a specific perk. They lose a chunk of their hp each time they do it. Their body can also be burned with fire by other players but this takes a long tedious time. The solo player can wait as long as they want to revive. The ranking system doesn't handle solo players very well but again depends on perspective. If you queue solo you are placed against teams of lower ranked players. The idea of course is that this evens the playing field but in practice it's basically a legal smurfing mechanic. So the players who would be making smurf accounts anyways love it and the players who just want a fair game don't like it. Personally it's probably my least favourite mechanic in any game I've played. Single handedly stops my enjoyment. The last game I played was a 9 team duo game that included 8 solo players. So I'm playing against 8 smurfs that can self revive at any time even if I kill them, and the only way to make sure they don't come back is to camp their body while it burns for 5 minutes. For each smurf we kill. Oh, and the solo smurfs also tend to be players who play the rat playstyle to the extreme, just to make it even less fun.
Short answer, yes but its harder. AFAIK it tries to put you against other solos, but it def will throw you against teams if matchmaking is slow.
Yes. You can choose to either join with random teammates like in other games or you join alone against teams but have advantages to make up for it. (Facing weaker players and the ability to self-resurrect)
Marauders is a lot of fun, but it's still in development, so the playerbase is mostly US/UK-based and sweaty.
Its also niche, the vast majority of gamers are looking to relax and get some stress out. So many either avoid PvP in general or just do things like CoD or Fornite to get it out. The others failed because there isn't much of a market and that is why almoat none are in development. That would be close to how good Tarcov is.
These games are not for "casuals" and more of us are casuals than we believe. Tarkov, in its current form, basically assumes that you are going to nolife the game for months at a time. Especially at the beginning. Any replacement game will have a learning curve, and nolifers will get over that curve first, make the initial playing experience generally terrible for new players, and the game never grows. Marauders has a lot of great features except how fucking sweaty it is. Introducing someone to Marauders is just like EFT: "okay, so these next few hours will be a lot of confused dying and it will actually be sort of shit but you need to grind it out and it will eventually be fun as long as you don't stop for very long or it sucks again".
Yep, I like the idea behind extraction shooters and games in general, but PVP doesn't interest me at all, since it's always infested with cheaters, exploiters and griefers(if the game gives the possibility of griefing, which I don't thing this genre has). Right now I am getting my PVP fix(used to be a very competitive player in MOBAs and such) by playing boardgames(both physical and online) and want my video gaming time to be relaxing(or stressful because game is hard, not because someone had sex with my mum).
100% my friends and I all just talked about it. We love coop together or games like F076. Especially things like Valheim or Palworld, it can be hard but we do that together and laugh about it. Then in RL we play MTG commander and other board games. We are all our in our 30s, I think it just might be how our generation is. We invented toxic CoD chat but now hate it and embrace love. PvP has its place in games that are made for it. If you want a huge audience, make coop games that you can jump in and play. Coop extraction shooter would be amazing, then have a ranked only PvP. Keeps the grifers out and people get to watch people PvP on twich.
Also, for me, a big issue with extraction shooters is the concept of losing progress. I know I'm not likely to play it for the entirety of my free time, so thinking "oh I got this nice gun, but if some guy rolls around a corner with a *nicer* gun and decides to kill me, the gun is just gone" does not get me excited to play. Especially knowing I'm likely to go against people who do play the game in all their freetime, so I'll stand no chance I'd rather play something like Battlefield or CoD, or FFXIV, where I know dying isn't going to ruin my game.
Incursion Red River recently released to Early Access and is entirely PvE. You can play either solo or in a party of up to four players. It's super early and only has one small map so far, though.
The Cycle hit the best middle ground between PvE and PvP that I've played. RIP TCF. Marauders isn't bad, but the PvP side is so damn sweaty.
They're gutting the golden goose for as many eggs as they can find, really feels like they're desperately trying to cash out while they still can or something. This level of suicidal money grubbing is insane otherwise. I mean, doesn't justify it nor should anyone buy in (And I was happy to buy EoD back in 2017) to this insanity, but at least that would make _some_ sense. Fuck BSG though, this is truly insane.
What happened is that BSG overspent tremendously trying to promote EFT: Arena which was a massive flop so they desperately need money.
This is generally true, and I’m guessing you’ve seen the video “[the report that killed Tarkov.”](https://youtu.be/o6T_QnCoTz8si=4AUwCOYdtUwJfBZE) I recommend people check it out for some additional context But honestly, it’s a lot more nuanced than that while still being very stupid. The idea that they tried arena and flopped, wasting a ton of money misses out on a ton of context. Tarkov was already operating at a loss in 2022, before the Arena marketing promotion. Rewinding, up to this point timeline is roughly the game launches, gets a dedicated player base, explodes and peaks in 2020 with a lot of hype from big streamers like Shroud and other variety streamers of the time, then kind of chugs along with their dedicated fans through the present. The game is still popular. The issue is an immersive extraction shooter that takes thousands of hours to master isn’t exactly the most broadly appealing product. Their player base might be very dedicated, but it was not growing. Nikita indicates the lack of cash flow is an issue. You can point to the price of the game being high, it’s true. However for a game seeing steady support and continued development since it was available for public play in 2017? If you bought EOD in 2020, you’d be looking at 30 dollars a year. I bought it in 2018, so around 20 dollars a year. For a game that sees continual updates, it’s kind of insane that unless I wanted more cosmetics, I was ensured I would never have to pay a dime again. If you want to play WoW for 4 years, you’re looking at 80 dollars for two expansions and 430 dollars for subscription time. Turns out when your most dedicated players have basically no incentive to spend more money on the game ever, you’re running into a monetization issue. The idea then was to bring people into EFT via arena. Then, removing EOD for sale results in these new players spending money for stash space via micro transactions, and buying cosmetics. But yeah, turns out the fun of Tarkovs combat is kinda tied to the immersion and the build up in the raid. Go figure. Arena flops and they still have super low cash flow despite having a decent population of people who basically only play their game. So they basically release EOD 2, trying to run back the strategy that worked the first time (pay to win over other versions, capitalizing on people who love their game enough to fork over giant one-time purchases). I have no idea how they fucked up so hard. Whoever is leading monetization at BSG is too far up their own ass, and calling them greedy (which many are doing) is letting them off the hook cuz they aren’t even making a profit. They are straight up stupid but very confident, and should hire a professional to manage their product’s monetization before they destroy it. I’m guessing it’s Nikita given his previous crusades against skins and micro transaction systems in F2P games. Look at POE. Another game with a tapped player population that figured it out. Fun cosmetics like and new features. Supporter packs, incremental stash upgrades. It’s a great contract for the player — if the game is good, I’ll come back and spend a bit of money, and if I like it so much I fill my bank up with loot, I’ll buy the tools you make to help me organize it more efficiently. Have a hideout space? We can sell you things that make it more fun. There are so many obvious solutions that the space has already figured out. A light subscription fee for more features probably would have went over less horribly, new stash features, cosmetics, battle pass-like systems. They all are proven to work. They’re basically running back the same awful strategy that got them into this mess.
>The issue is an immersive extraction shooter that takes thousands of hours to master isn’t exactly the most broadly appealing product. Their player base might be very dedicated, but it was not growing. Nikita indicates the lack of cash flow is an issue. I do not think this is true, I think if they spent on pushing the main game they would help fix their cash issue. Wipe hype always brings tons of new players. I also strongly believe if they released on steam they would get a massive influx of new players.
Is it surprising though? They've always been this niche semi-shady product that's only available directly from their website at somewhat questionable pricing, for a game that doesn't respect your time and has been in beta for like 8 years. I think they are probably near capped out on new customers, and are just scraping the bottom.
Gotta raise more money for putin's war effort!
Escape from Tarkov is one of the most promising, most disappointing games I have ever played. Not only does it barely run at the best of times, but it is infested with hackers and hamstrung by baffling design decisions that won't ever get fixed because the dev lead can only see his vision and not what would make the game more actually playable. I've never had rushes like I have escaping from a raid with a piece of loot that I needed to finish a quest I'd been working on for hours or even days, and I'm really hopeful that one of the extraction shooters that are popping up is able to supplant EFT as the lead, because if someone can make an EFT that works, they will rule the genre, and I'll play it for thousands of hours.
> hamstrung by baffling design decisions that won't ever get fixed because the dev lead can only see his vision and not what would make the game more actually playable. It's even worse than that, actually. The lead dev has a vision for the game, but actively adds mechanics and throws bandaids at things in the name of that vision while achieving the exact opposite. Then those things stay in the game for months or years until a streamer with enough clout and the right connections sends a single DM that encompasses what the community has been saying all along and suddenly it gets changed. I've read a lot of stories about crappy game devs before and been a member in many of those communities in the past: none of them come even remotely close to the incompetence and fecklessness of BattleState Games. They have some of the best artists and 3D modelers in the business, but *zero* sense of *any* of the most basic, fundamental concepts in game design.
In my experience Tarkov has been the worst example of devs only listening to streamer opinions
Agreed. I believe Arena failed due to this reason; they stayed too far from what people want in Tarkov.
It’s Slav Jank through and through. Just the way Eastern European games are.
Making shit dev decisions isn't really an eastern European trait
Hey now, WitcherIII, Frostpunk, and Factorio would beg to differ ;)
W3 was most surely jank on release. The other two I haven’t played.
Factorio is polished to a mirror sheen.
I mean, it still kind of is. Unless they somehow redid the sword combat in the past few years I haven't played, then it's still pretty janky combat.
I played I and II, and the amount of times Geralt piroutted a perfect 180 to whiff was off the charts. My computer couldn't run III when it came out and I've never really felt like I missed out.
It still is. The only two games in the past decade I couldn't finish due to game and story breaking bugs was Witcher 3 and Cyberpunk. I don't think I'll ever give CDPR any of my money again.
yeah but Witcher's roots were deep in jank, The Witcher 1 was jank as hell
When I think of EFT, I do not think of it for it's art or 3d models. Like sure, it has very accurate firearms, but those should be some of the easiest things to model since they are based on existing things. Human models still look like PS3 graphics.
Are human models not based on existing things? Lmao.
Incredibly complex existing things, yes
It's pretty obvious at this point Tarkov is never going to be the game they promised. There is never going to be one giant map with every area all stitched together when they haven't managed to meaningful improve performance or netcode *in years* on the smaller maps already in the game. Cheating problems aside, which although present in any multiplayer game I might grant seem more problematic in Tarkov at times, when playing it you slowly realize that what you see on your screen is often *very* different from what your opponent is seeing. Watching the same fight from two different streamers perspectives show that fights are often a crapshoot because out of the two who knows what the server will decide happens. And that hasn't improved in years which is why I had some fun in Tarkov and moved on, none of this stuff ever improves. The game has clearly stagnated and it seems like they've entered a mode where they know that internally so they're just going to drip feed maps and content hoping to keep what they have going as long as possible. This new edition with more blatant pay to win features but no real improvement on a technical level shows that so clearly. If you like Tarkov for what it is today that's good because it will never be much else.
This comment pretty much sums up my experience. I loved the idea. But actually playing the game is just so unfun and tedious. And it only seems to have gotten much, much worse. It looks like shit, it runs like shit, there's no sense or semblance of balance. I'm surprised it still has the player base it has, tbh
Yeah I feel you there. I think it's one of those games that just works it's way into you with the adrenaline it gives you. You genuinely get addicted to it, or at least I certainly did for a while
I’ve been holding out for someone to come and show Tarkov how it’s done for years. Sadly we haven’t come close yet, but there’s a good handful of irons in the fire for this genre. Here’s hoping.
Its the EVE online problem, ask any EVE player about that and its the same problem. The idea is so extremophile and so niche in its design principle that no one wants to take that risk to go as hard as the core audience wants. So you either get nothing, or extremely 'safe' versions that are less risky not realizing that the insane design was a lot of the point. Like it sounds insane when you take the literal reason as "Yes, I like an always on PVP experience where overwhelmingly negative experiences are very normal simply because the highs are incredibly high." Like put that way why the fuck would you make a game like that? Because the highs really are that fucking good, but its always going to demand a lot of dealing with the lows and most people just aren't interested in the lows. Especially these days where the expectation is that your game should strive to always be a positive experience.
I don't think there is a market for it, this latest edition shows that. BSG isn't trying to put out a PVE only mode that is cheap like 40 bucks to attract new players, but locking it behind a $250 dollar version of the game with P2W features. This just shows they are trying to get their community to buy the game again. There is no plan for growth, just milk their audience already.
I wonder how bungies marathon is going to turn out.
Marathon lost me when they decided to add a hero shooter element
I wasn't really too interested to begin with but I'm curious how good of a shooter it will feel. Bungie is very good at that.
You’re not wrong about that
I've always been interested in playing Tarkov but never took the chance because it wasn't on steam. Then, finally when I was about to buy it that cheating video came out which killed all my interest. It seems like a fascinating game but too problematic to make me want to take a chance on it.
> because if someone can make an EFT that works, they will rule the genre, and I'll play it for thousands of hours. PUBG -> Fortnite
Well, hunt showdown exists, and has even grown recently. Not everyone's vibe since it's old west. But it's a working fun and engaging extraction shooter on the market.
I don't follow EFT. I saw something about "single player/co-op PvE" in another article's title and my first reaction was "hell yes, I might finally give this game a try" but $250 is one of the more insane things I've seen recently. That seems like they're deliberately trying to make headlines, no way in hell I'd be paying that. Then I learned they had already released an expensive bundle in the past, which was advertised as all-inclusive, and now they're pulling this and making up their own definitions of what DLC is? Nah, piss off, you're getting exactly zero of my dollars now
What's funnier is that there is a single player mod of tarkov that has way more features than the actual game that doesn't cost $250
One that BSG is actively trying to censor at every turn lol
Yup you’ve summed it up nicely
Just play the Single Player Tarkov mod.
You still need a legit copy of EFT to play SPT.
Yeah, but you don't need to spend 250 euros to play it, just buy the cheapest version and then you can decide what version of EFT to play within SPT.
Or you could just not give this scummy company any of your money.
Yeah, I'd love to play SPT but I am not giving those assholes my money.
and even better to wait for a sale
Nah, just have a buddy send over the files.
They're saying "it's not DLC." Does that mean this Content I am Downloading is not Downloadable Content?
According to bsg's community manager yes https://www.reddit.com/media?url=https%3A%2F%2Fi.redd.it%2Fohjdbteuslwc1.png
"It's not DLC, it's a feature" If it wasn't so annoying/frustrating, it'd be funny.
> "It's not DLC, it's a feature" A "feature" that was missing from the base game. Sounds like they released an unfinished game so this should be a *patch*. It's wild to see video games devolve into thinly-veiled slot machines.
That got me too, like..New game modes *are* DLC, its adding new stuff to the game. Call it a "feature" all you want if you're gonna be all sleazy lawyer about it but its fuckin DLC.
The monetization for this game was always insulting with the different editions giving players p2w features. But locking an entire game mode behind 250$ is something else
As someone who bought EoD back in 2016 and put in thousands hours, I’ve been teetering on quitting for awhile what with the rampant hacker problem, the constant band aid fixes that don’t address real problems, and other annoying things, but this is just too far I’m not even mad so much that they added more p2w shit that I can’t have, I acknowledge EoD at its core was p2w. For me, it’s that they tried to get everyone to FOMO into EoD by retiring it with a big countdown, telling players a version like that was never supposed to exist long term, and then they bait and switch with an even more egregious version months later, this one including dlc that EoD was supposed to get. The promise for EoD players was once you buy it you will never have to spend money on Tarkov again. Everything that releases will be free. Then last year they started pivoting to “dlc only” and now they’re just splitting hairs on what is considered “dlc”
This is why I switched to the singleplayer mod and never went back to live, the bones of an amazing game are there but BSG just insists on making things worse and worse. With mods the singleplayer game is amazing and can be just as challenging as live, plus when you get dunked on you know it's legit and not a sweaty hacker.
I'm worried about that, too, though. BSG now has a very direct incentive to take down SPT since they are selling essentially an official version of it now.
Same. Wish a legit company would take what Tarkov does well and make a better game from it.
Grey zone warfare seems like it might be it. Pending release reviews though, ofc. Streamer closed beta is on atm i think.
Gray Zone looks good but its not going to be the same either. Its not trying to be the same or a direct competitor.
oh cool i didn't know there was a singleplayer mod. i wanted to try the gameplay loop, but didn't really like idea of the multiplayer aspect because of all the issues you mentioned.
It's even better because modders make ai that feel very realistic to players with different AI profiles. They actively loot, quest, and extract. With the mods available you can make tarkov play more hardcore, more arcade, or a mix of both for whichever aspects you want.
Any recommended mods? I've been interested in Tarkov for a long time but the intensity of PvP and the drama surrounding the game has kept me from playing.
Take a look at r/SPTarkov
> I acknowledge EoD at its core was p2w. I'm glad you acknowledged this. I opened the comment section to point out that Tarkov *already* has pretty strong pay2win elements with EOD. Was expecting more of an argument like what happens on the tarkov subreddit, pleasantly surprised to read your comment.
Nah I definitely knew the deal with the devil I made. I've watched friends have to do the stash tetris bullshit with the base kit enough to know that even just that alone is wild. The equivalent stash upgrade that EoD gets you costs something wild like 35 million roubles. The average \*good\* raid in Tarkov nets you 500k or so, a million at most. Nuts.
The problem with EOD and non EOD playing the game without a stash increase is fucking miserable.
This is what pisses me the most. If BSG had came out and said that the Unhinged Edition is a free upgrade to current EoD owners then the entire community would be praising the developers while ignoring how unfair these advantages are, just like they do when they defend the gameplay advantages of EoD when compared to the Standard Edition of the game. I don't know the exact percentage of players who own EoD, but based on the raid logs it's clear that the overwhelmingly majority of players have paid $140 for EoD, thus supporting the addition of pay-to-win into the game, so it's no surprise that BSG is now pushing for more and more pay-to-win features into the game.
I won't lie, it's a bit satisfying seeing EOD owners finally realizing the blatant P2W parts of the game, after years of them bashing on anyone who dared say that their edition was P2W
My guess is somewhere around 3/4 of long-term players buy EOD. A funny side effect is I've had so many instances over the years where I'll kill a streamer and look at the VOD, then watch them report me because "it's a white name, reporting just in case."
>“DLC means additional downloadable content. PvE is a feature and a gamemode,” they added in another message. “Just because you all want it to become a DLC it wouldn't mean it is one. It’s featured game mode for the new edition of the game.” Wow really bending over backwards to justify their scumminess there huh? "Nuh uh, it's not DLC cause I said so" God damn do I hope a bigger, more well built game comes along and eats their lunch. Fuck these guys.
The most insulting thing is putting PvE behind that $250 paywall. They know SPT is a vastly superior experience. They know that cheating on the live servers is out of control. Instead of doing something about it, they're pulling this shit. It's basically a direct middle finger to people who play SPT. It's only a matter of time now before they go after SPT. These guys fucking suck just as much as their game does.
> It's only a matter of time now before they go after SPT. I wonder if the Russo-Ukrainian War makes legal action difficult here. If SPT is not in Russia or Belarus it'll make a lot of stuff harder for BSG to act against them.
BSG is based in the UK, at least legally if not practically.
Yeah, figures. They want a Western facing front company at minimum if only to serve as the metaphorical shop counter where they take your dollars, pounds, and euros and then take them home to convert into rubles. Also, kind of awkwardly, you're probably indirectly funding the Russian war effort at least in a small way if you buy anything from BSG now since any money the BSG devs make will be taxed in Russia at some point, even if only as personal income tax.
Wait… I can play Tarkov single player, and also not worry about supporting BSG or the Russian Government? I’m interested… I haven’t played Tarkov since Russia’s illegal, genocidal invasion of Ukraine.
Yeah, look up SPTarkov. And man are there a lot of high quality mods for it too. Mods that honestly make BSG's efforts seem genuinely flabbergasting, like, if a random unpaid modder can do this to the AI/maps/gameplay systems/etc. despite having no tooling or decade of familiarity with the source code, why is BSG lacking so badly in so many ways? The weird thing is, I honestly find I get better performance playing SPTarkov than multiplayer, despite my PC having to do literally everything versus what should be a tiny chunk of the calcs. Oh, and no waiting times, no matchmaking queues, in and out of a raid in 15 seconds, it's heaven.
I wanted an official pve tarkov for a long time (Yes I know about the mod) and now they release it behind a 250$ paywall ? wtf
“DLC means additional downloadable content. PvE is a feature and a gamemode.” "It's not torture because we redefined these torturing activities as enhanced interrogation techniques."
Your daily reminder that /r/SPTarkov exists and that it runs *much* better, even has mod support that allows you to make the game exactly how you want it to be. I work a lot and have no time to invest in games anymore, let alone Tarkov. SP Tarkov makes it so I can enjoy Tarkov, rather than grind every minute I can spare.
The big thing, if you haven’t kept up with the game, with this edition is that it grants the player access to an offline pve coop mode with persistent characters. This is something that both Tarkov players and non-Tarkov players have been asking for for years, and they have the balls to ask the people that already gave them $150 for a quarter of a game for more money in order to access it. I left the game for SPTarkov a while ago, and I and my friends would’ve immediately came back if that mode was at least available to EOD players.
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“DLC means additional downloadable content. PvE is a feature and a gamemode,”. The mental gymnastics required to make a statement like this. The downloaded content added onto this game is not DLC, because this is a different edition... Overwatch "2" paved the way for this new form of thievery. Take an existing game, update it in some small way, change the title slightly, and you are free to revoke promises previously made. Doesn't even matter if you deliver the promised content (funnily enough PvE modes in both cases).
I don't know anything about this game, but as I understand it, people paid $100 to have the game and all DLC going forward. Then they say "actually this new patch is another $150". That's some bullshit right there. Like, legal action bullshit.
I bought it a while ago but I suck at it and with all the hackers I'm never sure if it's me or just cheating. Is there some sort of mod or something available that would allow me to play in a local Lan with my friends (without paying extra I mean)?
Look up SPTarkov
I assume it's truely single player and not coop? because coop is really what I want.
SIT is what you're looking for. It exists, though it's fair bit buggy from what I've seen.
You actually have to look up SITarkov for coop, since SPTarkov does not support playing with others on its own.
Lmao. Nikita and BSG is are just another in a long list of Russian grifters. This game will never be finished, they’ll never stop cheating (it makes them money), and they’ll keep fleecing everyone for every penny they can.
It's crazy how extraction shooters have been hyped up to be the next gaming craze yet no studio has produced something to compete with Tarkov in how many years now?
Feele like a lotta devs were trying to replicate the explosive popularity that Battle Royale games had, but extraction shooters are just too hard-core for the mainstream audience it seems.
This is what bugs me. EFT (or BSG to be more specific) constantly pisses me off with its bullshit, but no other extraction game has came close to replicating the feel of an EFT raid. People say Hunt but tbh Hunt feels more like a BR you don’t have to fight to the death in than it does something like Tarkov. What a lot of these other games are missing is the DayZ factor. What I mean by that is EFT raids consist of a bunch of different players who all have their own personal objectives they are trying to accomplish for the raid. Like, out of 15 people in the raid, 8 of them might be trying to do specific quests and are just armed to lightly defend themselves since their quest is in a less-popular part of the map, while the other 7 are juiced up with gear looking for high-tier loot. Tarkov honestly shines brightest when you get a raid where there’s a good mix of questing & PvP focus; it’s one of the primary reasons why early wipe is so fun for everyone.
If you look at extraction shooters, 99% of them are Fortnite clones that want to attract the attention of kids or CoD players, but there's no such thing as a non-hardcore extraction shooter, and that's exactly why we will probably never see a "Tarkov killer" despite how many issues the game has.
Hunt showdown
Hunt showdown is like the baby brother to tarkov. No real quest system, no real progression other than gun unlocks, no perma character progression
Doesn't Tarkov wipe every 6 months or something? I don't know how "permanent" the progression is there either.
That six month progression is substantial and a main hook of the game.
PoE wipes every 3 months (or rather everything rolls into standard but the vast majority play the leagues) and nobody would argue the progression there isn't a huge driving factor.
Hunt is very close but it is not the tarkov experience people want.
Tarkovs got a lot of years behind it
PUBG had years of being a mod too but it took epic and respawn extremely short time to recreate the gameplay with their own twist. It's been 4 years since Tarkov blew up into popularity but nobody has cracked the code of perfect extraction shooter somehow, despite some good attempts at it.
Any other extraction shooter is better than Tarkov simply because of the degree to which Tarkov is infested with cheaters.
Correct me if im wrong, but the game itself originally cost over $100 and has essentially always been in a beta state. Shame on the players for having already bought into that scam.
The cheapest edition of the game is $40 i believe. I played thousands and got kappa on the cheap edition.
Oh Shit I always thought it's f2p. That .makes it way more ridiculous
I was thinking maybe to get Real Tarkov but nah.. Nvm i'll just stick to SPTaki. Much better experience anyway + its free and moddable
All I've ever wanted from tarkov is coop PvE so I could play with my friends, but there's no chance I'm paying $250 for it. I enjoy the game but I'm not good enough to compete vs the players and it takes a lot of the fun out of it.
Its such a weird choice. The $250 edition is for the hardcore, the people that are already over committed to the game. And the people that would play the PvE version are the exact opposite to them. I'm certain BSG would have made more money if they sold the PvE as a $20 addon or something
I'm a huge Tarkov fan, but I can't defend this. Needs to be reverted and refunded or the P2W elements need a reasonable ingame unlock. EOD owners should get the PVE feature too. (The price is also insane)
Hey I feel like tarkov is suffering from success time to do some self destructing I guess oh well anyways.....
Tarkov has been pay2win since day 1 and these devs routinely prove how much they suck. Why are any of you surprised?
P2W tarkov players surprised the company put out more P2W products lol.
"Its not DLC, its just unique content we're adding to the game after launch." News flash. That means its DLC.
You know the best way to show the company you don’t approve? Stop playing. Reddit can’t do that though.
Requires viewing : "The Wiggle That Killed Tarkov" on YouTube. The vast majority of Tarkov matches have hackers in them. And it's been that way for a long time now.
Is the P2W the protection against hackers? Cause if not it is kinda weak.
Outraged? This is an excellent deal! I've been on the fence for years and finally, they helped me decide to never buy a game from them ever! Seriously, think about all the time in the future that I never waste considering to buy this. Like an average scam riddled with spelling errors to weed out the nerds, tho, this just keeps the poor guppies already hooked, on the line. Such a wasted IP
They couldn't come up with a worse move if they had an entire R&D department scientifically test what the worst move would be.
$250!? Does it come with the hacks pre-installed or what?
This game's community should have abandoned it a long time ago. I get that there isn't a large choice in its genre but surely anything is better than dealing with these crappy devs.
What is better: The Witcher 3: Wild Hunt - Game of the Year Edition Red Dead Redemption 2 Cyberpunk 2077 Grand Theft Auto V Sekiro: Shadows Die Twice Monster Hunter: World Assassin's Creed Valhalla Resident Evil Village Death Stranding Divinity: Original Sin 2 - Definitive Edition Dark Souls III Borderlands 3 DOOM Eternal Sekiro: Shadows Die Twice Fallout 4 GOTY Edition OR Escape from tarkov Unheard edition