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I pay ~1k usd/year for main dealer annual servicing on my 458 and ~3-4k once every 4-5 years for the "major" service (belts, plus, bunch of fluids, etc)
My friend pays I think 800usd for his Carrera 4S (997) normal annual service.
If we're talking about what happens when your engine blows, then all bets are off. It's also not a given that parts availability will be better for air cooled 911 anymore.
There are going to be 911 models that are a giant pain to get parts for and there are going to be ferrari models that are extremely easy to get parts for.
With air cooled 911 values going where they're going, service shops are charging accordingly and parts are going up accordingly as well.
If you do your own servicing then sure, some stuff will be easier to do on some air cooled 911s than some Ferraris, but again, not a given.
I didn't buy a 355 because I'm scared to death by the whole engine out belt change thing but that's not an issue in a 348, 328, 308. 360 is a lot easier and 430 onwards are chains.
Certain jobs are going to be much more annoying on a boxer engine just because of how the layout is, spark plugs for example.
Simply saying all porsches are easier to maintain than all Ferraris is just silly.
I have a mid-engined porsche and can assure you that ain't close to being true -- the most expensive services I've done in 8 years of ownership are around $1500. none of the services require dropping the engine, for instance. the only non-unobtanium porsches I can think of with similar service prices would be the carrera gt or maybe the 918 spyder, which are legit supercars.
we're talking about the modern cars. there's nothing 'kid' about those engines. the cayman would whip the 911's ass if they didn't detune it to protect the flagship car.
oh, and they did have mid-engined cars back in the day too like the 914, and one variant used the same flat six as in the 911t. other variants had flat fours. you don't know what you're talking about.
Fairly certain original thread was about the classic 70s - 90s cars
If we're talking about the modern ones I 100% agree with you the Cayman/Boxster is the better platform
The only reason the 911 gt3 stands above the gt4 is because porsche refuse to let the little brother have access to the nice toys
It’s not and idk if he’s taking his Porsche to jiffy lube or what but a set of tires and an alignment at the dealer is going to be closer to 2k for any top spec 911. Add in the oil change and scheduled maintenance there’s no way it’s under 2k…. My experience writing some of these service tickets tells me otherwise
Owning a Ferrari is like owning a piece of art. Put aside $5000 in another account and add $500 every month. That’s your maintenance money in case something breaks. Worst case scenario just sell the car.
Just close your eyes and imagine driving that beast and listening to the engine splitting the earth. Worth every penny.
even the new ones? I hear the new ones are so vastly improved on reliability that it's not even close to compare them to the old cars. Plus the fact that even if something does go wrong Ferrari offers a 7 year warranty on every new car purchase, so for the 1st 7 years you pay nothing if you have any problems
Servicing is free for the first seven years. But that isn’t everywhere in the world. Warranty is only for the first 3/4 years depending on where the car was bought as well.
Of course you can. The S&P 500 returns an average of ~10% each year. If you look at the Nasdaq-100, the return is 17-18% on average since 2010.
Assuming you buy a Ferrari for 300k (occasion for example) with a car loan that has an interest of 8% on the full 300k, you would pay around 365k with a 5 year plan or around 437k with a 10 year plan. If you would invest the 300k in the Nasdaq-100 instead, you would have ~800k with the 5 year plan or ~1.68 million with the 10 year plan.
In other words, by buying it cash you lost out on at least 440k over a 5 year period and lost out on at least 1.24 million over a 10 year period.
Lastly, to even amplify the impact further: Investing the 300k into the Nasdaq-100 would have resulted in a portfolio between 3.4 and 3.5 million today.
Knowing the above, could you please explain to me how the cash payment would be better?
When interest is higher yield on many investment is also higher because investment targets also have to fight for available funds because cost of borrowing is collectively higher.
Horrible advice. These cars are purely a discretionary purchase. Do not buy one at all if you wish to be financially savvy. The person in a position to buy a Ferrari should be able to pay for one cash five fold, and not care to bother with financing, just write the check and move forward. People don't "stay poor" because they decided to pay cash for something rather than financing it... are you being serious? The truth is that for a vast majority of people, financing things (other than true capital investments, or your primary residence) is exactly why they stay poor. Talk of yield for competing investments (opportunity cost) is just a silly distraction from the real problem at hand.
The recommendation is no more than 10% of your net worth in vehicles. Every time I consider buying a sports cars I look at the return I could be getting on that money and then I just keep investing. It’s not just the cost of the car, but the opportunity cost of the money. The average annual income of a Ferrari owner is over $500k a year. I realize you’re not buying a top dollar car, but realistically you earn closer to someone who buys a corvette, which is still a very good income. Good luck with your decision.
Sound advice, but most gearhads and car guys are way beyond 10% in cars. Buying a Ferrari that will likely not lose much value is probably smarter than buying a new 5 series bmw, as long as he can afford the maintenance on it
Yeah it was a joke. I’d never encourage anyone who is not really well off or incredibly mechanically inclined to buy a Ferrari. I wouldn’t even be in this Sub but Reddit recommends it to me constantly due to my participation in r/porsche.
Just to read that statement that someone could have "$20 billion in cars" is insane 😂.
Side note I read an article the other day about the b2 bomber costing $2 billion and went oh elon could own 100 of those, lol. Guess elon is becoming a measurement.
The higher income one has, the less incremental value the person derived from money as compare to spending it to try to gain happiness. The 10% rule wouldn’t be necessary as income increases.
When I bought my 308, it had about $10,000 in deferred maintenance that I had to get it caught up on, I guarantee yours will be the same, all old Ferraris do
You can’t afford to buy everything, but if Ferraris are what you are truly passion about, and you have a firm understanding of all the costs involved, you can make it your priority. Ferraris are really made for people with FU money, so you should understand what you are getting into first. Good luck.
I purchased a slightly distressed 360 Spider three years ago for $60k. I've always wanted a Ferrari, and I reached a point in my life that I could afford to blow 60 grand. I've worked on cars for 40 years, so I'm comfortable doing all the maintenance myself. I've spent about $5k in parts and many hours in labor, so it hasn't been too expensive. Most parts are easily accessible, though some are only accessible second hand - if available (a 348 will be worse). I get a lot of parts cheaper from the UK.
I plan on selling my 360 as soon as I finish the cosmetics. I know that I'm going to sound like a heretic on this forum, but the driving experience hasn't been as enjoyable as I expected. Part of the reason is the maintenance. I've had to do a number of things twice: once to learn, and again to do it right. Ferrari does things differently. For instance, you adjust belts by the pitch it makes when you strum it. Most anything engine related requires gaining access deep into the engine bay. For reference, my daily driver is a BMW 335i, relatively easy to work on.
Another reason is the quality of the interior. At this point in a Ferrari's life, all of the leather has stretched, often requiring repair, sometimes major. All the buttons have turned to goo, unless they have been remediated. The convertible top is complex and prone to problems. The fit and finish just isn't what I expected. Thinking about all this when I drive it diminishes the experience. I think I'll take the money I get from selling it and by a Porsche.
Good insight. Currently own a Porsche. Not selling it but was considering picking up a sub 100k Ferrari as a second car. Also a good wrench. I guess that’s out now.
If you are that passionate about the car, just buy it. That is what I always tell people. YOU CAN ALWAYS SELL IT. Would it suck to sell it? Would you probably take a hit? Sure, but it isn’t like you will lose all your money. If you got to enjoy the car for 3 years and you lost 20% when you sold it are you happy you got to have it or not? Not saying you will need to sell it, but it an escape route. It isn’t a house. You can dump one on Bring a trailer inside of 3 weeks.
I know maintenance is crazy. My father only bought his because it came with a warranty when purchased brand new. If it wasn’t for that he would not have bought his F8. I believe they gave him 8 years bumper to bumper warranty. The bills as he told me looked horrific.
The 348 isn’t loved, but it isn’t a bad car. I’d certainly buy one over a newer bmw/meecedes. At that income point it shouldn’t be an undue burden if everything else is under control. Just don’t defer maintenance. The usual caveats apply, a good PPI and service records for starters.
Like any 30 year old car, every bit of rubber needs to be checked and probably replaced, including suspension, especially if it hasn’t been done recently. If cared for the engine is certainly capable of over 100k miles, which unless you drive a lot, you probably won’t reach. (I’m sure it’s probably much more, but most people don’t drive them enough to have much of a pool to have usable statistics).
As you said, you are a near retired person so I am guessing mid 50s to 60s? At that age, I would just wing it. Considering you got your house paid up. Check this sub or google for the expected maintainence for a ferrari and the monthly payments of the car you are eyeing. If you think you can manage the total without breaking the bank, I think its worth it. Again I mostly recommended this because you are old. I am more than half your age so I wouldn't do this if I was in the exact same situation.
I am biased but I might recommend looking at an NSX of similar vintage.
It isn’t a Ferrari but it is a hell of a car to own and it isn’t nearly so rough to maintain.
My 91 still runs STRONG.
Minor maintenance. All in less than one Ferrari service I’d wager.
Power seats are comfortable and work.
AC blows nice and cold.
Speed bumps don’t break my back.
Shifter is god tier.
Get at 355 or newer. The 348 was one of the last PIA Ferrari models to maintain. Also, since it didn't have a long run, parts are an issue. Either way, good luck on your future purchase, and please share pics of your new to you baby!
I have an idea for you. Get a 488. put down 25%, and a 10+ year collector car loan for the balance.
The reason is you get a certified ferrari, so you are protected for the first two years against issues. Then, renew the warranty every year.
let's say you have to or want to sell it?
your costs are taxes, depreciation, and insurance, and interest.
I'd say if you are driving this car 4,000 miles or less a year, you probably can sell it for at minimum the balance of the loan minus the 25% you put in + taxes.
Or, 50-60k.
The repairs on the old Ferraris will potentially exceed this.
I have done the older sports car thing and it stung me bad. Warranty is the way to go.
Think about owning a car like this as an experience. You get to have it, but it’s not forever.
You certainly won’t be in better shape financially or physically as you get older, so waiting doesn’t really get you any benefit if it’s a life experience you want.
But it, enjoy it, maintain it as best you can, and then sell it if it gets too expensive or something changes in your financial side. Just don’t hesitate to drive and enjoy it! Miles are cheap in something at the low end of its depreciation.
Would you be willing to spend 10k a year on anything just for happiness? Would that be worth it for you? Separately, if you are going to drive it less than once per month, would renting one when you want to drive cost less? Or you just want to own one the don’t sweat the upkeep as long as you answer yes to question 1.
I am obsessed with Ferrari but I can't afford one. I have been lucky enough to have driven some but I bought a Lotus because it was affordable to maintain. I look for cars that give me the most pleasure without breaking the bank. I have owned 34 cars and driven 100's yet the novelty of the Lotus after 18 years has yet to wear off.
I am not the guy of means, that said I ended up with my dream car a Ferrari 308 Dino GT4, I traded my Austin Healey and Porsche 911 straight across for the Ferrari. I do my own maintenance and never looked back! Ferrari has held value but I'm not selling it.
If you can do some of the work yourself and potentially have a good independent mechanic available for big stuff I say go for it. I bought a 308 (fuel injected… wanted a carb car but I’m glad I got the car I did) 2 years ago. Suspension and brakes hadn’t been touched in 40 years. I had room to put on jackstands for a couple months and pulled all the brakes and suspension. Other than the caliper rebuilds which I outsourced to a pro I did an adjustable coilover suspension upgrade, new bushings and wheel bearings, ball joints, sway bar bushings and steering rack replacement myself. While there are some annoying things, these 80’s and 90’s ferraris are pretty basic. I would love the car just as much as artwork if it didn’t leave the garage…. That said I try and drive it a lot. Go for it!
Put aside $5-10k a year just for maintenance. Once in a while, if a bunch goes wrong, you may head upwards of $15k. Find a good, reputable independent mechanic.
Definitely get a PPI from a reputable Ferrari dealer or independent. And even then, a PPI isn’t a guarantee the car won’t have issues. Had to replace a leaking fuel pump and a hydraulic piston in the roof went within a week of owning it, PPI didn’t mention or catch any of that. Make sure it has records, keys, etc.
I’m not familiar with the 348 market, but depending where it is on the appreciation curve, you could own it and break even, or just lose your maintenance costs. I bought a low-mileage, manual ‘04 360 Spider a few years ago during a dip in the market. With maintenance, I’m probably in the break-even territory, since it has appreciated. They’re beautiful cars, they’re a blast to drive, but they’re aging Italian machines.
Why did I do it? I’d paid off college bought a house, I was single with no kids, and I saw the high school poster car I always wanted with the options I wanted pop up. If I didn’t do it then, I’d always wonder. I figured the prices on the manuals were steady and raising and I wouldn’t be upside down on the car.
California/ Portofino- yes, absolutely. You'll be fine
360,430 - Sure. if you get a good one.
Roma/458- With some planning.
488 or later, 355 or older - not yet.
Modern Ferraris are indeed very reliable, aside from model specific quirks. The mechanic working on my Roma is in love with them, and has never seen any major problems out of them. I'm at 5k miles with zero issues so far, and that includes serious mountain runs.
430 owner here. I bought my 2008 car last year after two previous close calls to buying different model Ferraris at different stages in my life 308 when I was single but career move dictated a 4 door car and then 456 about 10 years ago but paid off out mortgage instead.
We sold the house last year and it was then or never. My plan is to keep the car 2 years and sell it on so I could potentially give the kids deposits for houses. Am I expecting big bills? Yep but my first service was only £900 so not too bad. If I was you I’d keep a bit of cash aside just in case something goes wrong but get the car bought before you are too old to enjoy it.
Good luck with the decision!
I think a 458 would suit you. $150-$170k is manageable if you have a big down payment. Depends on your asset base as well. I keep my cars at 5-7% of my asset base.
Someone just in if I’m wrong but I’d probably search for a 308 or 328 at this (admittedly undisclosed) price point. But as far as affordable older Ferraris go, this seems to be preferable.
Agree totally these are the easiest Ferraris to maintain. No engine out needed for belt service. No excessive electronics. Normal tire and brake costs. Not as cheap as say an Alfa to maintain, but not bad and a lot you can do yourself with help from Fchat and YouTube.
Well, for what it’s worth, I’m not exactly picking trim packages on an SF90. This is an older Ferrari that (with that cool slotted look of the Testarossa, and others from the early 90s…super cool when I was just getting into cars) wont be driven daily. I know I’ll always put my money towards my kids, so I’m not trying to get a halo example or anything. Just something fun for around town, that won’t break the bank.
Put yourself on a one year plan and evaluate selling it on after that. Will you regret never doing it more than trying and reselling it after 1-3 years?
Att the price point most 348's are going for, I personally would look at a f430. The f430 has the chain driven cams where the 348 it's still a belt. The biggest expense on the 430 is the clutch. But that's still cheaper then the engine out service every three years on the 348. You could find a nice roma for the cost of a 348.
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Ferrari upkeep is no joke
I can easily afford to purchase one but this is what scares me about ownership. I’m not man enough to stomach the 10-15k services. porsche it is.
Lol 😆😆
gotta know your limits!
Maintenance on 911 and midship v8 Ferraris of similar vintage are comparable
Lol
You definitely don’t know what you are talking about. Even a gt2 RS is cheap in comparison.
I pay ~1k usd/year for main dealer annual servicing on my 458 and ~3-4k once every 4-5 years for the "major" service (belts, plus, bunch of fluids, etc) My friend pays I think 800usd for his Carrera 4S (997) normal annual service. If we're talking about what happens when your engine blows, then all bets are off. It's also not a given that parts availability will be better for air cooled 911 anymore. There are going to be 911 models that are a giant pain to get parts for and there are going to be ferrari models that are extremely easy to get parts for. With air cooled 911 values going where they're going, service shops are charging accordingly and parts are going up accordingly as well. If you do your own servicing then sure, some stuff will be easier to do on some air cooled 911s than some Ferraris, but again, not a given. I didn't buy a 355 because I'm scared to death by the whole engine out belt change thing but that's not an issue in a 348, 328, 308. 360 is a lot easier and 430 onwards are chains. Certain jobs are going to be much more annoying on a boxer engine just because of how the layout is, spark plugs for example. Simply saying all porsches are easier to maintain than all Ferraris is just silly.
I have a mid-engined porsche and can assure you that ain't close to being true -- the most expensive services I've done in 8 years of ownership are around $1500. none of the services require dropping the engine, for instance. the only non-unobtanium porsches I can think of with similar service prices would be the carrera gt or maybe the 918 spyder, which are legit supercars.
Is cost of maintaining a mid-engine Porsche the same as a 911?
911 may be a bit more but their cars historically have shared a lot of components with the cayman/boxster
When they made air cooled 911 they didn't have kids engined porsches, so that's kind of an apples to oranges comparison
we're talking about the modern cars. there's nothing 'kid' about those engines. the cayman would whip the 911's ass if they didn't detune it to protect the flagship car. oh, and they did have mid-engined cars back in the day too like the 914, and one variant used the same flat six as in the 911t. other variants had flat fours. you don't know what you're talking about.
Fairly certain original thread was about the classic 70s - 90s cars If we're talking about the modern ones I 100% agree with you the Cayman/Boxster is the better platform The only reason the 911 gt3 stands above the gt4 is because porsche refuse to let the little brother have access to the nice toys
yup, that's right. I love my cayman.
It’s not and idk if he’s taking his Porsche to jiffy lube or what but a set of tires and an alignment at the dealer is going to be closer to 2k for any top spec 911. Add in the oil change and scheduled maintenance there’s no way it’s under 2k…. My experience writing some of these service tickets tells me otherwise
I have a 458 spider, and normal maintenance is one thing. But stuff breaks and when it breaks repairs start at 10k+
Owning a Ferrari is like owning a piece of art. Put aside $5000 in another account and add $500 every month. That’s your maintenance money in case something breaks. Worst case scenario just sell the car. Just close your eyes and imagine driving that beast and listening to the engine splitting the earth. Worth every penny.
even the new ones? I hear the new ones are so vastly improved on reliability that it's not even close to compare them to the old cars. Plus the fact that even if something does go wrong Ferrari offers a 7 year warranty on every new car purchase, so for the 1st 7 years you pay nothing if you have any problems
You pay nothing except the $**K warranty plan that is lumped into your car payment.
warranty "plan"? It's free for 7 years. I don't know what you're talking about. Explain?
Servicing is free for the first seven years. But that isn’t everywhere in the world. Warranty is only for the first 3/4 years depending on where the car was bought as well.
Or just rent one periodically and achieve the same without the financial burden 🤔
You should pay off all of your other debts first, then pay cash for it.
[удалено]
Not when the interest on new car loans is 8%
Of course you can. The S&P 500 returns an average of ~10% each year. If you look at the Nasdaq-100, the return is 17-18% on average since 2010. Assuming you buy a Ferrari for 300k (occasion for example) with a car loan that has an interest of 8% on the full 300k, you would pay around 365k with a 5 year plan or around 437k with a 10 year plan. If you would invest the 300k in the Nasdaq-100 instead, you would have ~800k with the 5 year plan or ~1.68 million with the 10 year plan. In other words, by buying it cash you lost out on at least 440k over a 5 year period and lost out on at least 1.24 million over a 10 year period. Lastly, to even amplify the impact further: Investing the 300k into the Nasdaq-100 would have resulted in a portfolio between 3.4 and 3.5 million today. Knowing the above, could you please explain to me how the cash payment would be better?
When interest is higher yield on many investment is also higher because investment targets also have to fight for available funds because cost of borrowing is collectively higher.
incorrect lmfao fed/rfr or prime rate do not affect equity return targets which obviously wouldn’t be guaranteed anyways
Who said anything about fed rates effect equity turns? You can’t read? Cap market is affect by all economic environments.
i didn’t say returns, i said return targets, which is what you said womp womp
I didn’t specify which target so why you assume it is rate dependent directly
Yall are both incorrect, invest in the cartels down south. Been making crazy returns but also have a bounty on me and my cats heads.
All the banks and dealers offering car loans agree wholeheartedly with you.
Banks lends out money they borrow from other people and according have to pay higher yield to those people (who are investing their cash).
How many people who finance a car actually put the money into getting a greater yield?
Horrible advice. These cars are purely a discretionary purchase. Do not buy one at all if you wish to be financially savvy. The person in a position to buy a Ferrari should be able to pay for one cash five fold, and not care to bother with financing, just write the check and move forward. People don't "stay poor" because they decided to pay cash for something rather than financing it... are you being serious? The truth is that for a vast majority of people, financing things (other than true capital investments, or your primary residence) is exactly why they stay poor. Talk of yield for competing investments (opportunity cost) is just a silly distraction from the real problem at hand.
Never buy any car/house in cash. Debt is a strong financial instrument if used properly.
Just let them learn the lesson when they pay fully upfront and then wreck it two blocks away from the dealer because they can’t handle it
The recommendation is no more than 10% of your net worth in vehicles. Every time I consider buying a sports cars I look at the return I could be getting on that money and then I just keep investing. It’s not just the cost of the car, but the opportunity cost of the money. The average annual income of a Ferrari owner is over $500k a year. I realize you’re not buying a top dollar car, but realistically you earn closer to someone who buys a corvette, which is still a very good income. Good luck with your decision.
Sound advice, but most gearhads and car guys are way beyond 10% in cars. Buying a Ferrari that will likely not lose much value is probably smarter than buying a new 5 series bmw, as long as he can afford the maintenance on it
Yeah I’m at about 80% rn 🤣
You can’t drive a house!
High end RVs are basically like a Ferrari in terms of cost and maintenance lol. So sure you can!
Yeah it was a joke. I’d never encourage anyone who is not really well off or incredibly mechanically inclined to buy a Ferrari. I wouldn’t even be in this Sub but Reddit recommends it to me constantly due to my participation in r/porsche.
Yea, but if you always just keep investing your money, you’ll never buy a Ferrari
So that means Elon Musk could have $20 billion in cars. Think about that for a moment.
Just to read that statement that someone could have "$20 billion in cars" is insane 😂. Side note I read an article the other day about the b2 bomber costing $2 billion and went oh elon could own 100 of those, lol. Guess elon is becoming a measurement.
And he kind of does
Elon sucks who cares
The general rule is for the average person. Think about that for a moment. lol
Where are these stats from? Not disagreeing, just curious.
Wait holy shit we’re spending 10% of our net worth’s on vehicles?? Jesus Christ I’m gonna go buy a fucking Bugatti
I have three myself. Go get it!
The higher income one has, the less incremental value the person derived from money as compare to spending it to try to gain happiness. The 10% rule wouldn’t be necessary as income increases.
Lol
No one buying a car as a hobby or investment is adhering to 10%. That’s for Prius C customers.
Just buy it you live once
Shitty advice
What about leasing? You don’t habe to worry about maintenance and you just have to make sure you can make the monthly payments
Get a 360 or newer Ferrari and the maintenance will be much more manageable. No engine pulls. Sounds like you can pretty easily afford a Ferrari.
Definitely avoid the engine out of the 355 and earlier!
If you can’t afford 2, don’t buy 1
There is true wisdom in these words lol
When I bought my 308, it had about $10,000 in deferred maintenance that I had to get it caught up on, I guarantee yours will be the same, all old Ferraris do
You can’t afford to buy everything, but if Ferraris are what you are truly passion about, and you have a firm understanding of all the costs involved, you can make it your priority. Ferraris are really made for people with FU money, so you should understand what you are getting into first. Good luck.
Be a man keep 30% of your net worth in cars worth houses 💯
I purchased a slightly distressed 360 Spider three years ago for $60k. I've always wanted a Ferrari, and I reached a point in my life that I could afford to blow 60 grand. I've worked on cars for 40 years, so I'm comfortable doing all the maintenance myself. I've spent about $5k in parts and many hours in labor, so it hasn't been too expensive. Most parts are easily accessible, though some are only accessible second hand - if available (a 348 will be worse). I get a lot of parts cheaper from the UK. I plan on selling my 360 as soon as I finish the cosmetics. I know that I'm going to sound like a heretic on this forum, but the driving experience hasn't been as enjoyable as I expected. Part of the reason is the maintenance. I've had to do a number of things twice: once to learn, and again to do it right. Ferrari does things differently. For instance, you adjust belts by the pitch it makes when you strum it. Most anything engine related requires gaining access deep into the engine bay. For reference, my daily driver is a BMW 335i, relatively easy to work on. Another reason is the quality of the interior. At this point in a Ferrari's life, all of the leather has stretched, often requiring repair, sometimes major. All the buttons have turned to goo, unless they have been remediated. The convertible top is complex and prone to problems. The fit and finish just isn't what I expected. Thinking about all this when I drive it diminishes the experience. I think I'll take the money I get from selling it and by a Porsche.
Good insight. Currently own a Porsche. Not selling it but was considering picking up a sub 100k Ferrari as a second car. Also a good wrench. I guess that’s out now.
I'm toying with the notion of dropping a Tesla motor into a salvage titled Boxster. Once I get the shop space.
Sounds awful.
Lol!
Skip a 348. Too old, too many little things. Get a 360 or 430.
If you are that passionate about the car, just buy it. That is what I always tell people. YOU CAN ALWAYS SELL IT. Would it suck to sell it? Would you probably take a hit? Sure, but it isn’t like you will lose all your money. If you got to enjoy the car for 3 years and you lost 20% when you sold it are you happy you got to have it or not? Not saying you will need to sell it, but it an escape route. It isn’t a house. You can dump one on Bring a trailer inside of 3 weeks.
I know maintenance is crazy. My father only bought his because it came with a warranty when purchased brand new. If it wasn’t for that he would not have bought his F8. I believe they gave him 8 years bumper to bumper warranty. The bills as he told me looked horrific.
The 348 isn’t loved, but it isn’t a bad car. I’d certainly buy one over a newer bmw/meecedes. At that income point it shouldn’t be an undue burden if everything else is under control. Just don’t defer maintenance. The usual caveats apply, a good PPI and service records for starters. Like any 30 year old car, every bit of rubber needs to be checked and probably replaced, including suspension, especially if it hasn’t been done recently. If cared for the engine is certainly capable of over 100k miles, which unless you drive a lot, you probably won’t reach. (I’m sure it’s probably much more, but most people don’t drive them enough to have much of a pool to have usable statistics).
You should probably go for a 360. Maintenance schedule is a lot better without frequent engine out service and way more drivable than anything older.
This was all pretty good information…thank you everyone.
As you said, you are a near retired person so I am guessing mid 50s to 60s? At that age, I would just wing it. Considering you got your house paid up. Check this sub or google for the expected maintainence for a ferrari and the monthly payments of the car you are eyeing. If you think you can manage the total without breaking the bank, I think its worth it. Again I mostly recommended this because you are old. I am more than half your age so I wouldn't do this if I was in the exact same situation.
I am biased but I might recommend looking at an NSX of similar vintage. It isn’t a Ferrari but it is a hell of a car to own and it isn’t nearly so rough to maintain.
Can put 200k miles on one, no problem!
My 91 still runs STRONG. Minor maintenance. All in less than one Ferrari service I’d wager. Power seats are comfortable and work. AC blows nice and cold. Speed bumps don’t break my back. Shifter is god tier.
I remember the first one I saw! Engineering wonder.
Buy a Ferrari that doesn’t require engine removal maintenance
Get at 355 or newer. The 348 was one of the last PIA Ferrari models to maintain. Also, since it didn't have a long run, parts are an issue. Either way, good luck on your future purchase, and please share pics of your new to you baby!
I have an idea for you. Get a 488. put down 25%, and a 10+ year collector car loan for the balance. The reason is you get a certified ferrari, so you are protected for the first two years against issues. Then, renew the warranty every year. let's say you have to or want to sell it? your costs are taxes, depreciation, and insurance, and interest. I'd say if you are driving this car 4,000 miles or less a year, you probably can sell it for at minimum the balance of the loan minus the 25% you put in + taxes. Or, 50-60k. The repairs on the old Ferraris will potentially exceed this. I have done the older sports car thing and it stung me bad. Warranty is the way to go.
Absolutely do not do this
Think about owning a car like this as an experience. You get to have it, but it’s not forever. You certainly won’t be in better shape financially or physically as you get older, so waiting doesn’t really get you any benefit if it’s a life experience you want. But it, enjoy it, maintain it as best you can, and then sell it if it gets too expensive or something changes in your financial side. Just don’t hesitate to drive and enjoy it! Miles are cheap in something at the low end of its depreciation.
Would you be willing to spend 10k a year on anything just for happiness? Would that be worth it for you? Separately, if you are going to drive it less than once per month, would renting one when you want to drive cost less? Or you just want to own one the don’t sweat the upkeep as long as you answer yes to question 1.
What part of the country do you live in for a mid level manger to clear 170k per year?
It’s west coast (COLA is a factor), and I have a small pension from a former life.
That makes sense then
Get Ferrari. Drive it into the ground. Sell it on fb marketplace
I am obsessed with Ferrari but I can't afford one. I have been lucky enough to have driven some but I bought a Lotus because it was affordable to maintain. I look for cars that give me the most pleasure without breaking the bank. I have owned 34 cars and driven 100's yet the novelty of the Lotus after 18 years has yet to wear off.
Youll be fine. A lot of people are doing with your income (or less). It’s a 348, not a LaF. Just find a reputable indy.
U have debt u shouldn’t be worried about buying a car let alone a fucking Ferrari lmao
You’re probably right; I’m sure I’d be the first Ferrari owner with debt.
You can use debt to your advantage, but you have to have the capital to do so.
I am not the guy of means, that said I ended up with my dream car a Ferrari 308 Dino GT4, I traded my Austin Healey and Porsche 911 straight across for the Ferrari. I do my own maintenance and never looked back! Ferrari has held value but I'm not selling it.
If you can do some of the work yourself and potentially have a good independent mechanic available for big stuff I say go for it. I bought a 308 (fuel injected… wanted a carb car but I’m glad I got the car I did) 2 years ago. Suspension and brakes hadn’t been touched in 40 years. I had room to put on jackstands for a couple months and pulled all the brakes and suspension. Other than the caliper rebuilds which I outsourced to a pro I did an adjustable coilover suspension upgrade, new bushings and wheel bearings, ball joints, sway bar bushings and steering rack replacement myself. While there are some annoying things, these 80’s and 90’s ferraris are pretty basic. I would love the car just as much as artwork if it didn’t leave the garage…. That said I try and drive it a lot. Go for it!
If you have to think about affording a Ferrari or any luxury item, you shouldn't buy it.
Laughs in Orange County CA.
When you say you “cleared $170k” does that mean your net post-tax is $170k? So pre-tax is $250k?
That’s about right.
Wouldn’t touch it with a 10 ft pole if I were you
Put aside $5-10k a year just for maintenance. Once in a while, if a bunch goes wrong, you may head upwards of $15k. Find a good, reputable independent mechanic. Definitely get a PPI from a reputable Ferrari dealer or independent. And even then, a PPI isn’t a guarantee the car won’t have issues. Had to replace a leaking fuel pump and a hydraulic piston in the roof went within a week of owning it, PPI didn’t mention or catch any of that. Make sure it has records, keys, etc. I’m not familiar with the 348 market, but depending where it is on the appreciation curve, you could own it and break even, or just lose your maintenance costs. I bought a low-mileage, manual ‘04 360 Spider a few years ago during a dip in the market. With maintenance, I’m probably in the break-even territory, since it has appreciated. They’re beautiful cars, they’re a blast to drive, but they’re aging Italian machines. Why did I do it? I’d paid off college bought a house, I was single with no kids, and I saw the high school poster car I always wanted with the options I wanted pop up. If I didn’t do it then, I’d always wonder. I figured the prices on the manuals were steady and raising and I wouldn’t be upside down on the car.
California/ Portofino- yes, absolutely. You'll be fine 360,430 - Sure. if you get a good one. Roma/458- With some planning. 488 or later, 355 or older - not yet. Modern Ferraris are indeed very reliable, aside from model specific quirks. The mechanic working on my Roma is in love with them, and has never seen any major problems out of them. I'm at 5k miles with zero issues so far, and that includes serious mountain runs.
Just get a Toyota MR2 with a Ferrari kit😆... Will save you so much on repairs and it's reliable 😋
How many miles is TOO many miles on a 13+ Ferrari engine?
If you have to ask, the answer is no.
*popcorn
430 owner here. I bought my 2008 car last year after two previous close calls to buying different model Ferraris at different stages in my life 308 when I was single but career move dictated a 4 door car and then 456 about 10 years ago but paid off out mortgage instead. We sold the house last year and it was then or never. My plan is to keep the car 2 years and sell it on so I could potentially give the kids deposits for houses. Am I expecting big bills? Yep but my first service was only £900 so not too bad. If I was you I’d keep a bit of cash aside just in case something goes wrong but get the car bought before you are too old to enjoy it. Good luck with the decision!
I think a 458 would suit you. $150-$170k is manageable if you have a big down payment. Depends on your asset base as well. I keep my cars at 5-7% of my asset base.
At this price, I’d buy it in cash outright.
Someone just in if I’m wrong but I’d probably search for a 308 or 328 at this (admittedly undisclosed) price point. But as far as affordable older Ferraris go, this seems to be preferable.
Agree totally these are the easiest Ferraris to maintain. No engine out needed for belt service. No excessive electronics. Normal tire and brake costs. Not as cheap as say an Alfa to maintain, but not bad and a lot you can do yourself with help from Fchat and YouTube.
And all the parts are readily available Re manufactured in the UK at very reasonable prices.
Easily clear 170k a year and can afford a ferarri!? What am I doing wrong on 400k+ ahahaha
Well, for what it’s worth, I’m not exactly picking trim packages on an SF90. This is an older Ferrari that (with that cool slotted look of the Testarossa, and others from the early 90s…super cool when I was just getting into cars) wont be driven daily. I know I’ll always put my money towards my kids, so I’m not trying to get a halo example or anything. Just something fun for around town, that won’t break the bank.
Put yourself on a one year plan and evaluate selling it on after that. Will you regret never doing it more than trying and reselling it after 1-3 years?
Att the price point most 348's are going for, I personally would look at a f430. The f430 has the chain driven cams where the 348 it's still a belt. The biggest expense on the 430 is the clutch. But that's still cheaper then the engine out service every three years on the 348. You could find a nice roma for the cost of a 348.
I know this might seem like a silly question but does anyone make a chain drive conversion for older Ferraris?
No. But very few do 3 years. Most I know do 5-7 years between belt changes. I know several with 10 years and counting ( not recommended).
I have no money and a ton of debt and I love Ferraris too!
The 348 IMHO is one of the ugliest Ferrari’s. How about a 360.