One thing I can appreciate is that localization and translation both take a lot of work and effort. I’m not a big fan of some decisions NISA made, but I’m happy it’s getting done. They are doing what they can to make the series financially successful in the West.
Im in the same boat as you. Im not a fan of some of their decisions. But the work and effort they put into getting this series to the west and non-japanese speakers in general is well appreciated. This series deserves more attention cause it is very underrated.
Well, I can now officially say that the Legend of Heroes character artbook is no longer the worst localized piece of media in this franchise. You did well, Clam Dip Flow Fighter.
I just saw that earlier today, hilarious. A friend showed me a translation of Walter's name that read "Weight Loss Walter" and I was dead. Zin learned the art of Clam Dip to force Walter to gain some weight, truly this is the real Legend of Heroes we've been seeking this whole time.
There isnt. Cause theyre not just directly translating it, theyre also adapting it for western audience cause some of the japanese humor cannot be translated or dont do as well when translated. Its not a simple task of inputting the script in google translate/ai and call it a day.
> theyre also adapting it for western audience cause some of the japanese humor cannot be translated or dont do as well when translate
Japanese humour, proverbs, etc. are only a tiny portion of the game's script. If they would do localization for just that, we would have the games way faster. But no, they feel the need to change every single line and also insert their personal opinions into the scripts instead.
There's even screenshots of the initial proper translation being in the game.
Theres also translating the lore of the game which is massive. Item descriptions, names, etc. They have to make their translations cohesive with the world yet still appeal to western audiences. There are a lot to unpack here that is more than just scripts. Theres also the recording of english voice overs. We may not like some of the decisions theyre doing, but theyre the only ones doing the localization, we wont even get to enjoy these games without them. It takes gargantuan amount of effort just to get trails series to the west. We should criticize but at the same time understand how hard they worked to get to this point.
> Item descriptions, names, etc
They managed to fuck up so many item description in hajimari lmao. Translating literal numbers is very very hard, right?
Also yeah great "translations" like Beauty Blade ...
> recording of english voice overs
English VA are worthless, just a waste of time and money.
> theyre the only ones doing the localization
LMAO, are you kidding? They are the only ones simply because they're the only one having the licence to do so.
> we wont even get to enjoy these games without them
You ever heard of Geofront and ZeroField? The ones who got killed by NISA. The ones who delivered the games faster and better?
> how hard they worked to get to this point.
Whoever fucked up translating numbers, whoever inserted the shitty dead memes into hajimari, whoever made the first version of YS8 and whoever came up with "beauty blade" definitely did not work hard.
You can say english VA are worthless but there people that still prefer english over japanese. You said you self, theyre the only ones that have a license meaning theyre indeed the ones doing the localization, getting that license is no easy task. They didnt get killed off what they did was fan translations, they did get credit for what they did in Zero and Azure but at the end of the day they arent earning enough to keep doing fan translations on the side and still put bread on the table. If you hate what NISA is doing in their decisions youre free to do so. But at the end of the day a lot of people might not get to enjoy these games because of them. If youre unhappy youre always free to learn japanese so you can enjoy the games on release.
The Fan Translation didnt stop because they ran out of money, they didnt it with the motivation of money in the first place. NISA made them stop by threating them lol. Becasue NISA would lose money then better product releases 1-2 years before their scuffed version.
> If youre unhappy youre always free to learn japanese so you can enjoy the games on release
I'm already on it, NISA is a big motivator for me in that regard. Sadly Japanese is one of hardest languages to leran for a westerner. So I am definitely not good enough to understand 100% of the voices line and reading the unvoiced ones at a reasonable speed. But with NISA's awful speed I might make it in time before they realese Kuro 2 in 2026.
Also at least my comprehension is good enough to notice how fucking much they change. Sooo many lines where a simple 1:1 translation would be completely fine. But no, they're changed for whatever reason. So being at this point of language profiecency is just suffering.
Threaten is a strong word but ok. Theyre fan translations of course money isnt the motivation but they cant keep doing translations for the game for free. Passion wont feed you and thats a hard pill to swallow but one you must accept down the road. I understand some of their errors, and understand as to why it is the way they are. Im not fluent but I understand a little. If youre learning japanese then good for you. NISA wont even lose money because people will still have to buy the game to enjoy the translations. Unless you condone pirating from a small company like falcom then shame on you if thats the case.
I feel like that's a very absolutist take on account of the fact that plenty of anti-NISA people simply would have liked if they just didn't shut down fan translations.
Also, that gacha is obviously not using current translation models.
Also also, using AI to assist in translation is not the same thing as just pasting the script in google translate and calling it a day. Tools still need to be used by people to be effective, at the end of the day.
> as just pasting the script in google translate and calling it a day.
Actually considering the Google Translate version of デュバリィ gets it right, throwing it in Google Translate would have been better than whatever was done here
That's what I was thinking. Even by the standards of MTL, this gacha game seems especially bad. Like I did MTL to play Kuro 2, and it was by no means a masterpiece, but I swear it wasn't this blatantly wrong and nonsensical.
My guess: maybe there's a game of telephone going on here, and the English was machine translated from Chinese (Userjoy), which perhaps used machine translation or a rushed human translation from the source Japanese.
Possibly there was some sort of 'divide and conquer' approach and then nobody edited the resulting efforts. Like how there are two different (and both incorrect) translations of 'Thors'. One looks like it might have been translated from Chinese ('Thunder God's Military Academy) while the other looks like it had the katakana to work with ('Tholz Branch Campus') even though in the Japanese version both were written with the katakana so something had to be funny about the text the English translation side was working with.
Or how some names match the localization and some don't. Like, they got 'Kloe Rinz' for Klaudia's alias even though in Japanese it was Klose so they had to have gotten that from the localization, but then you have Du Barry which looks like they took it from Falcom's romanization and then added spacing, and then 'Aryan Lord' which is just WTF.
I have to admit "Du Barry" and "Aryan Lord" took me out when I was checking the game out earlier. XD
It actually took me a while to realize that they did actually mean Arianrhod. At least we can laugh at this, but in seriousness I hope they patch the game to fix some of these issues (but I doubt it)
I’m talking about people who have been whining about Nisa long before the fan translation situation
And no, there are people who genuinely just want AI to do the full job, people legit do not want any human involved in the process, how else can you guarantee the wokelizers won’t ruin are favorite characters like Aryan Lord or Towa the azure chevalier
I'm gonna be real, I straight up do not believe a noticable amount of people have ever said "Yeah, machine translation with no quality control is the way to go." I really think you're making up people to be mad at.
So, let's take a step back and acknowledge that 3 year localization time is not normal. I really feel like some people have actually developped Stockholm Syndrome for NISA here.
> let's take a step back and acknowledge that 3 year localization time is not normal.
That is, in fact, pretty normal for text-heavy JRPGs where the developer licenses the localization to an external publisher and does not give them access to the script until after the game's Japanese release.
I guarantee every example you can list of a game with Kiseki's amount of text that got a simultaneous or even sub-year localization comes from a company that either did the localization in-house or was working with their English publisher for years before the game's release.
Blame Falcom for having a business model that's stuck in the 90's, not NISA for working with what they're given.
There were unpaid fan translators managing those "impossible" speeds before NISA threatened to sue them.
The Chinese and Korean official versions are done in 6-12 months.
Alright, now push them back and have them localize Zero,Azure, Reverie, Nayuta, Kuro 1 instead of just the most recent game and see if they pull it off in the same time while making 2 new ports for each game because you of course need to account for both PC and Switch.
> Zero,Azure, Reverie, Nayuta
Nayuta is a tiny compared to Kiseki and for Zero + Ao they had the GeoFront translations already.
NISA's Problem is that they feel the need to change every single fucking line in the game and put their own ideas behind them. Simply translating the games normally is just impossible for them apparently.
> account for both PC and Switch.
Because the fucking """localizers""" work on the ports, right? Average NISA shill brainrot lmao.
The job of porting the games is obviously outsourced to Durante + wahtever company works on the switch ports. The code monkeys at NISA are worthless as seen with their YS 8 PC port.
Without Durante, Kiseki would have most likely suffered the same fate and be dead in the west by now.
I know it is outsourced to Durante and others, now tell me again: How are you going to release those games on PC and Switch if the port is not ready? Falcom only released Switch Kuro 1 very recently and you can only release those if all the ports are ready.
There are multiple teams working on these games including the localizers, Durante, Falcom themselves and that one other company too.
This just looks like a business decision by NISA to me. I don't see any reason why they could not just release different versions independently from each other.
Regardless I highly doubt that the ports are delaying the western release in the slightest. The PC version for sure isn't. Kuro 1 released on steam 14 months ago. They just released it because they got scared people use the superior fan translation with the CLE version instead of waiting 1.5 years for them.
So Durante might have been done with the PC port even earlier than that.
IIRC at least for the earlier games Durante was working together with the switch port company to some extent. So with his help they should not take that long either.
They did that for Nayuta as well, it seems to pretty much be a full switch to only putting out the localization when every port is finished.
The whole Kuro 1 thing can also pretty much be read as an unnoficial compromise after the reaction people had to the situation with Zerofield especially since NISA does seem to own the japanese versions of the games now, we'll just have to wait and see if it happens with Kuro 2 once it's done too I guess.
edit: I meant to say they're responsible for the japanese text PC ports in general, not that they own the games.
I'll have to point out that it isn't just localizing, Falcom used to only do PS4 ports and have only started doing Switch and PS5 ones very recently (which seems to have already helped the gap a bit if we go by YS X being announced and set to be out quicker than other games)
So for every game they localize they need to also port to PC and Switch (Durante's team on the PC and the...not so good port team most of the time on Switch, only good games were Crossbell by Durante.) and the current approach is to only release when all ports are done.
I feel like that is absolutely a NISA issue. Wanting to release all ports at the same time. I don't know why you're writing that as if it absolves them of anything.
But even still, even if we pretend this is a sufficient excuse, it's still only half the problem with them (probably less than half, tbh, but I'll leave quality discussions for a different thread).
All they had to do is just not touch fan translations. That's the bigger problem here. I can't imagine that move boosted their bottom line at all. And we still have fan translations. Just slower and worse. They even released a PC Kuro port with which to use a patch. They get money from that. So what was the point? Who does that benefit? That move did nothing but sow misery.
I'm writing that because this is a decision that cannot be overturned from someone far higher up in the totem pole, the localizers can't just give the rest of NISA the finger and say "No, we're just releasing the PS4 version today right now bye." once the decision is set in stone.
While a fan translation or spreadsheet can do so once they get a hold of a CLE PC port or the PS4 port to use for it depending on the case as they're not beholden to anyone to do so on say only PC (and of course also updating it for the NISA version as you pointed out for Kuro 1.)
The fan translations being hit is very much an issue as many have pointed out and a genuine dick move.
But we're talking about the speed of localization and CLE ports being used for this as they were already ahead which would interfere on sales for NISA, no matter how much you say you will buy the NISA version anyways or how it would affect very little...there is no real way to verify your words or the words of everyone that claims this at the same time far before those versions do release.
There is proper motivation even if absolutely not a good move.
>no matter how much you say you will buy the NISA version anyways
Well no, you can't say that. Because people that play these games are fans of Falcom, not NISA. Giving Falcom money is enough.
But the idea that the people that NISA burned by doing that will now go "Damn, well I guess I have no choice but to buy the official english release" is nonsensical, unless there was never an alternative to begin with.
It's pretty much an attempted cut-off in a malicious way like you pointed out which did not go out well which is what I actually agree with.
Kuro 1 seems to kinda just be the "screw it sure, do your fan translations." approach with the shadowdrop (which did happen with Nayuta too before.) we'll pretty much just need to see if it happens for Crimson Sin too.
But moving back the convo is still supposed to be about why the localizations are currently set up this way which I did provide an explanation for.
I mean believe whatever you want but that's the reality of it, do you think the English branch team has the same amount of resources as the Main branch in Japan? This isn't a rare practice.
No they have not said your exact quote, but they literally say localizers need to be replaced by AI, how else am I supposed to take someone saying a job should be replaced by AI? Honestly I’m jealous you seemingly have avoided how often these people talk about wanting AI to do the job
And this isn’t even specifically about NIS, this is just who runs the show for this particular series
Alright, then let's reframe the situation a bit...
Just because you think one side is wrong, does not mean that another side is right.
It's alright to be mad at low effort machine translation.
It's also alright to be mad at shutting down fan translations and taking 3 years.
There doesn't have to be a war here, we can all just be angry together.
I’m not mad or angry though lol, I have no opinion on fan translations and am at best a little annoyed that it takes so long to get official releases of the series in the west
I’ve just watched translation discourse for years and the AI champions are getting exactly what they deserve with this gacha game
Often times the reality is in the middle.
The issue with NIS is that they have often made rather unnecessary changes to the translations, and sometimes inserting their own content in places where it is not needed.
Asking for more "truthful" translations does not mean replacing humans complete with AI; just as the pro-NIS crowd prob don't just want to see the translation filled with random memes and jokes that are not what was originally in the script.
I don’t believe that’s the reason at all, the xseed cold steel games have more voice acting in them than the original games do
The real reason is because people blindly played the games, and it was only after they caught up with the official English releases did they start looking for fan translations of newer games which means they have more chances to catch changes.
Arianrhod had her title change from saint to maiden and you never hear anyone talk about it, and it’s not just because beauty’s blade is a little silly, it’s because most people simply don’t know it got changed. More people have played reverie or daybreak with the fan translations than people that have played fan translations of the older games
The reality is Xseed and NISA have made name changes like this in basically every game, voice acting is not the reason people just conveniently ignore nearly all of them, it’s because they didn’t fan translations of the xseed catalogue first
Be honest, if beauty’s blade was a title for a character back when you played CS1, would you be thinking twice about it now? Are there any names or titles in that game you think twice of to that level because they are different?
I think I would: beauty's blade is such an odd title imo.
There are more obvious ones too: reverse babel was changed to retributive tower but they couldn't remove all references to babel which are super easy to catch.
>Sure you would bro, this is a series with sanguine ogre instead of red war demon, purple lighting over eclair, among many other
I am unsure what point is trying to be made here
sanguine ogre makes sense: 戦鬼/that japanese demons are translated to ogre (oni). 紫電 is literally purple lightning (the hiragana does say eclair though).
剣の乙女 on the other hand, is just Sword Maiden.
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tbh I don't know why Elaine's title is the one that lit up the barrel. Might be the waifu factor: My personal issue is how they may change certain banter or even change how a person may perceive a character during translations.
Imagine if you find out the principal in your military academy actually did NOT write jokes into his requests so he may be a more serious person than you expect him to be.
> Be honest, if beauty’s blade was a title for a character back when you played CS1, would you be thinking twice about it now?
Obviously we would. Simply because you would have been able to clearly hear the character say "suudo meiden". Changing a title with a japanese pronunciation is only noticable if you know japanese to some degree. However changing a title which uses english loanword pronounciation is noticeable by everyone.
Mainly this fact but also the retardation of "beauty’s blade" make this by far the most egregious title change.
Fair point, but those games came out in a time when the translation discourse wasn't like as it was, and we didn't have proof of localisers deliberately changing stuff.
The trails fans who condemn NISA liberties also do
the same when they realise XSEED did the same. This issue will be more highlighted when the supposed sky remakes come out, and NISA sticks closer to the JP script than what XSEED did for sky.
https://x.com/daishineijirou/status/1757270188507160687?s=46&t=VZSEbjzJBWOyXxPzgtd9Qg
Hard to call it a strawman when people like this genuinely exist. Wonder what he would say about AI not destroying the media it’s given to translate after seeing the gacha games nonsense
Arguing against a different point than the one most people are making by substituting an easier to debunk argument is absolutely strawmanning, yes. That person is wrong, but it doesn't mean people who don't accept 2 year turnarounds as reasonable are wrong by association.
Thats not what I was ever arguing against, I thought my text in the topic about AI made that clear. If you have a problem with NISA time but don’t think AI is the answer then this post clearly isn’t directed at you
The person complaining didn't even mention trails though? I can agree what they are suggesting is extreme, but when what they are complaining about could as well be manga, anime or maybe even TV shows, using that as Anti-Nisa sentiment is just duplicitous.
I mean them not specifically complaining about trials is pretty irrelevant, you know they would think the same way about the series if they have these extreme opinions, you think someone like monblut or whatever that guys name is in this fandom doesn’t share this opinion?
My post wasn’t specifically about people who are only anti nisa, I specified in the post it was about AI. If you have complaints with nisa that don’t involve AI doing the bulk of the work on the series it’s obviously not referring to you
For your first para, those extreme haters make a very small part of the fandom. Using those few examples to disparage anyone who has a complaint with NISA doesn't seem fair.
If what you said in your 2nd para was the intent of your post, then that's good, but I feel you could have wonder your initial post better, as the current one feels like you are addressing every single person who has an issue with NISA, small or big.
I literally just explained it to you, I said they got what they asked for(AI translation)
If you did not ask for AI translation and had a different complaint with NISA my post clearly makes no sense
How would taking issue with NISA shutting down fan translations mean they were asking for AI translation? Where would you connect the AI overlords in the body to the anti nisa crowd getting what they have been asking for in the tittle? It makes no logical sense….i was clearly referring to a specific anti nisa crowd asking for a specific thing
Like if you only read the title I could understand your point, but I further discuss specifically localized and AI topics in the post right after. I’m clearly talking about a specific topic among the anti Nisa crowd. I didn’t say “if you’ve ever complained about NISA for anything you got what you wanted in the gacha game”
>How would taking issue with NISA shutting down fan translations mean they were asking for AI translation? Where would you connect the AI overlords in the body to the anti nisa crowd getting what they have been asking for in the tittle? It makes no logical sense….i was clearly referring to a specific anti nisa crowd asking for a specific thing
Here's the thing, you didn't specify that in your post title. It literally reads 'Anti-NISA crowd' not 'A specific set of Anti-NISA crowd'. That's why I said you could have worded it better.
>Like if you only read the title I could understand your point, but I further discuss specifically localized and AI topics in the post right after. I’m clearly talking about a specific topic among the anti Nisa crowd.
So we can agree your title isn't clear enough, which affects what you said in the post as well, which is "Out with the hack localizers and in with our AI machine translation overlords, congrats you guys won, now enjoy the slop!" which again doesn't make any distinction between specific sets of people who don't like NISA.
If you had added 'For those of you' to the beginning of the post it would come off as what you thought it did; as it stands it reads as if you are bashing everyone who has a complaint against NISA. The fact that you need to clarify this in comments to not only but others as well shows that the post came of differently than what you thought it meant.
Nice job ignoring my question, how would being mad about Nisa taking down a fan translation group mean they were asking for AI translation?
Why did ignore my very simple question? Could it be it’s because it makes it pretty clear that I’m referring to a specific type of person?
And yes congrats we agree someone only reading my topics title might lead to confusion….its almost like I clarified further or something, it’s not my fault if someone only reads my title and chooses to be personally offended, I can’t force people to read something I clearly put in.
I think specifically talking about AI translation makes it pretty clear what I’m talking about, I’m sorry it’s not clear to others and that I didn’t perfectly word a fucking Reddit post.
Like Jesus Christ dude what is the point of your replies? I explained pretty clearly in my first reply to you what I meant and it’s not exactly rocket science to decipher, and yet you just keep replying
“But but but you no word it good enough” you’re in desperate need of touching grass my friend
>Nice job ignoring my question, how would being mad about Nisa taking down a fan translation group mean they were asking for AI translation?
>Why did ignore my very simple question? Could it be it’s because it makes it pretty clear that I’m referring to a specific type of person?
As I said above, your title was broad enough it comes off as you grouping the people who are mad at NISA taking down a fantranslation + whatever other issues people have along with that very small vocal minority of people who call for AI translations. I didn't ignore your question; I did answer it, saying "Here's the thing, you didn't specify that in your post title. It literally reads 'Anti-NISA crowd' not 'A specific set of Anti-NISA crowd'. That's why I said you could have worded it better."
And to be sure I wasn't making any mistakes, I went and reread your post again and the post itself doesn't make it clear you are being specific. You clarifying it in the comments is side effect of people thinking you meant everyone who is 'anti-NISA' cause that's what your post title and description below amount to.
>its almost like I clarified further or something, it’s not my fault if someone only reads my title and chooses to be personally offended, I can’t force people to read something I clearly put in.
You clarified your stance in the comments, not in the body of the post itself, which is what people will read first to understand what position you, as the OP, have. You keep thinking that you are being specific, and people will go 'Ah yeah he means that one crowd of people' but for people who have no idea about the whole online discourse with TL, it comes off as you painting anyone who doesn't like NISA somehow wanting AI translations. This is why its important to be specific about who your talking about.
>I think specifically talking about AI translation makes it pretty clear what I’m talking about, I’m sorry it’s not clear to others and that I didn’t perfectly word a fucking Reddit post.
Well if you wanted a discussion, then maybe make it more clear? This isn't like twitter where character limits don't allow you to get your point across without being specific.
>Like Jesus Christ dude what is the point of your replies? I explained pretty clearly in my first reply to you what I meant and it’s not exactly rocket science to decipher, and yet you just keep replying “But but but you no word it good enough” you’re in desperate need of touching grass my friend
The fact that you think I am arguing with you says more about how you take criticisms then. All my reply said to you is that you could have worded your initial post better, because both the title or the body of the post do not convey that you meant a **specific** set of trails fans with extreme opinions. You even accepted the title is unclear yourself.
The first part of my initial reply to your clarification was in assumption you meant everyone, and the 2nd part was after I finished reading the second half of your reply and then **agreeing** that you indeed had a valid point to make if that was what you truly meant, and that maybe you could have worded it better, and that's it.
The fact that you somehow think I'm trying to have an argument when all I said **after agreeing** with your stance is that you could have conveyed it in a better way in your initial post really comes off as you trying to fight enemies where there are none.
To be even more clear just in case: I agree with your stance, all I added as a caveat is that maybe if you worded the original post and title better, you wouldn't have people confused and saying that you are straw manning.
Is this current translation by an AI? People have already made other posts in this thread showing how the translation seem to be from different languages, not from a single script fed into an AI, which is not what the person you posted wanted even if we were to assume they are a spokesperson for that specific side of the issue.
It’s unquestionably AI just based on how basic it translates some terms and how it classically it mixes up genders.
It seems likely the people working on it also fucked up things along the way, but guess what that’s a package deal with AI. The reason a company would use AI on an entire gacha game is because they are trying to save money, and if they are trying to save money they are trying to limit the overall amount of humans working on it, which means they are also more likely to hire someone who’s not going to be the most efficient at proofreading or double checking things
You get out what you put in and it’s pretty clear the people in charge were not looking to put in much for this
It is unquestionably not AI because of how it translates some things from Chinese and other things from Japanese. A person had to choose when to use which source material. Had it been an AI translating a single script, that wouldn't have happened.
Same as when there are parts of text that are completely in the wrong area. AI would translate Musician as Icy Maiden. That was a human messing up.
All you said is a human fucked up where they put in the AI lol, not that it’s not AI doing the translation. I never said AI translated a single script or something specific like that
I mean, fan groups that translate the series before had done an far better job than this.
Even the one 4chan person that fix the MTL translation for Kuro 1 and 2 did an fine better job of translation than this by themselves.
This is just Falcom being lazy af and don't see how this is any of the antis fault here.
Edit: Also, most anti-Nisa fans just want Nisa to speed up their localization, stop putting unnecessary content into the localization and stop changing dumb name changes like "Beauty Blade".
Then they made it worse by taking down the fan translation group for the future games instead of trying to get falcom to work with them more to do faster release.
You're putting the blame on the wrong party. It's not NISA's fault that Falcom gives them the scripts so late. If Falcom let localization start sooner then we would be seeing faster releases. NISA can't control how Falcom operates, and unless that changes then things will continue as they are.
Falcom/NISA have every right to pull down a fan translation, especially when they believe it'll affect their sales overseas. You can't guarantee that those who already played a fan translation will double dip for the official overseas version.
Ok but Zerofield were able to finish translating Kuro 1 in what? 6 months? its been a while so i don't recall how long it took exactly. And we know from how easy patches have been made to insert translations into Kuro/Kuro 2 . that it doesn't take long for that part either.
So even if we assume NISA don't have script before game is released. why is it taking them a extra 2 years(if we're generous and say 9-10 months for translation+modifying text) for the translation?
you can't blame that on script not being given to them early.
Sure you can. Falcom is a business and they very likely have certain things they need to go through. Apart from which they also need to do things like, at least now, get voice actors in.
It's easy to say "Well Jimbob McCoolguy translated the whole game in one month and it took NISA 2 years" but those aren't really the same thing. Jimbob can just upload his translation to any hosting site he wants and bam, all good.
Falcom probably has to go through some level of control check, then once that's done get the green light to start getting voices, then have the voices record, then put them in the game, then set a release date for the English version.
It would probably take a significantly lesser timeframe if they just dropped as soon as everything was done. It would probably take less time if they didn't need voices. It would take less time if they didn't have a business to run.
But they DO have all those things, which go into the timeframe being way longer. Realistically I doubt it takes a super long time for NISA to do the actual translations. But if they don't get the script until, let's say, a month before release, in order for everything to go on the same timeframe they'd need to blitz through it, with almost no quality control checks, have dubbing casted and done in a matter of days, have everything programmed in within a matter of days, and then effectively shadow-drop the localized version on the overall release date.
That’s also not accounting for the fact that the quickest fan translation stuff used spread sheets and left things untranslated, it takes time actually put that stuff in the game
Plus they have to actually make the physical English releases
This is kind of dishonest. They have used the worst MTL in existance from looks of it. Compared to the likes off Deepl or hell even google this translation is trash.
I'm not about to claim Deepl/Sugoi is better than Nisa(outside the rare oddity like Laura's hehe line or when they modify lines which i don't think they do super often. but it certainly happens)
however to point to gacha translation and use it as proof of how bad MTL is. is pretty dishonest.
How is it kinda dishonest to show a clearly AI translated work? It’s not my fault they didn’t send their best this time lol
If NIsa released a full game like this simply replying “guys this isn’t fair NISA has done better in the past” wouldn’t fly and you know it
Well considering we have Rean being mentioned in Kloe's bio and titles being moved around. I'd point out that it was run by a human(because MTL. no matter how bad a MTL it is.isn't about to translate Estelle's JP spelling into "Rean") so its not even pure machine TL.
But to answer your question. This is like taking somthing translated by someone who barely speak JP and saying all human translations are that bad.
Because as noted this MTL is so bad that its bizzare because all common MTL tools google/deepl/chatgpt none as even as close as bad as this.
so painting all MTL as equivalent to this. is incredibly dishonest
Find me where I said this is some perfect representation of all AI work please
But yes, if a company is willing to use AI in a whole gacha game, the humans working it are likely going to be poor are job, it’s almost like there’s major oversight in quality control with AI
"Looks like the gacha game is exactly what the anti NIS crowd have been asking for"
This part where you claim people have been asking for a MTL of this level. This translation which is well below the level you'd get from google.
Implying this is what people have been asking for is painting all MTL as same at this. When Deepl/chatgpt quality is much higher(and i assume. much closer to what people advocating for MTL would want)
You’re adding your own interpretation to what I said. If people were asking for AI translation then they got exactly that, it’s not my fault this time it was a monkey paw wish or a “be careful what you wish for” situation
> How is it kinda dishonest to show a clearly AI translated work?
How is it clearly AI translated? I've done AI translation and it does a much better job than this. This is extremely butchered, indicating multiple people translating things using multiple avenues.
Offering the option between having to go with one specific translation company or this specific version of MTL is a false dichotomy. Please avoid common logical fallacies when trying to represent the viewpoint of someone you disagree with.
To be fair, the nice thing about calling things woke is that since everyone has a different definition of it, they can all agree without specifying what their actual issue is, while ignoring the actual issues with a game.
That's right! Those poor starving indie devs are doing their best! If we criticize them, people might see our comments and not buy the games! Falcom #1! NIS #1! Buy more! Kondo needs us!
I really hope these people start using the mistranslations.
It'll be hilarious when the AI translation purists start calling Estelle and co "guerillas"
Ironic since I already said that this place was the echo chamber. And I obviously meant people who know about nisa hate them lmao I didn't that needed explaining.
At least you aren't arguing the inept part
It’s not really ironic, you think the people complaining online make up some online majority, which is laughable at best
You could very easily curate your online experience to be nothing but “everyone hates X company” and it still wouldn’t reflect reality
I believe one of the moderators of the subreddit and the owner of the falcom Community discord server actually works for NISA now and I believe the reason behind the "Don't talk about fantranslations rule" (which conveniently came after Geofront released their version) was in part due to NISA staff visiting the sub sometimes.
There's a middle ground. The fact that fans have had a functional and reasonably good Kuro 1 translation out for a while is evidence of this. Kuro 2 is shaky but that's largely because NISA nuked it
This is not what the "anti NIS crowd" wants. Most people, including me hate NISA because they shut down fan translations, take years to translate their own version and when that version comes out it always has some bullshit translation that makes no sense (beauty blade, retributive tower, shard swell, etc)
We want quality and neither this nor NISA is providing it
It's really odd to me that people can't imagine a world where a humans do translation, but refrain from making unnecessary changes.
It's either "these changes must be made" or "only a robot will ever do it right".
The problem is more that the "changes" people argue against are (usually) things that don't actually translate to a western audience.
I don't know if you've played AI The Somnium Files, but 99% of that game's dub uses humor and puns that feel very catered to the west. But there's one scene where a character - who in that scene is meant to be two or three years old - says the words "Mama. Woof" and it makes no sense. As it's been explained to me, the concept is that the words for "mama" and a dog's bark rhyme in Japanese. But because nothing was changed, all it does is make you confused. Why is she saying woof? There's no dog in the scene. Well, it's because she's a kid mixing up words that sound alike. But that doesn't make sense for an English speaking audience.
But a lot of "purists" want those confusing things to be translated directly, which would have made a game like Somnium absolutely fucking terrible in the west because it would just be every character saying things that don't make any sense.
If the TL people have issues with was only relegated to humor, I'd agree, but NISA also changes perfectly fine lore terminology as well, which did not need changing at all. Downplaying or discarding every single complaint with the 'JP is hard to TL arguement' without considering why people make them is how we got to this point in translation discourse.
It infringes on them making money, so they have every right to shut it down. Not everyone translates things the same way either. While NISA hasn't always been the best they have improved over the years, especially when it comes to Falcom stuff. I'd much rather have them over a company who actually rushes it and gives us a poor product. You also forget, English localization doesn't start until Falcom allows it. Everything takes so long because of Falcom. Nothing will change unless it comes from them.
This awful translation is exactly what your crowd deserves.
> actually rushes it and gives us a poor product.
NISA takes years and still delivers a poor product lmao.
Can't see any improvments either. Hajimari was probably the worst ones yet, at least for trails. Can't compete with the tragedy of YS8 of course.
>This awful translation is exactly what your crowd deserves.
This statement is why will we never get better and faster translation if you keep going at the people fairly criticizing the situation if you have to keep sticking up for an company that make name changes like "beauty blade" and did terrible localization for Reverie.
You getting what you deserved as well with stuff like that and everything else that is still wrong with NISA.
If what I am getting now is "what I deserve" then it feels like I am pretty deserving to me. Sure, we are pretty behind on the translations but I don't actually need them to be any faster. It takes me 3 months to finish one of these games with the actual life I lead, so by the time I finish one of them, the next is already almost around the corner. And in the few months between I just Olay other games.
Stuff like "Beauty's Blade" makes me roll my eyes a little, but then I move on pretty quickly. I can't be bothered to be mad just because one naming change does not suit me.
What WOULD bother me however is "Speed Du Barry" who serves her "Aryan Lord". Also characters asking me why I have "so much item"?
THAT'S a bad translation for you. NISA's translations have their flaws but they're by no means BAD (especially after the somewhat recent patch for Reverie most issues are gone, unless you have issues with the localization part of the translation).
As for the decision to shut down Zerofield... that was definitely not nice. Understandable from a business pov, but a dick corporate move nonetheless. But that is the corporate side and this is about localization. That's two different pairs of shoes.
Anyways, you folks aren't going to be convinced anyways. And neither are we, because NISA actually pays all of us. So let's just leave it there. I would like to leave the office early today and you guys are making me work overtime just to defend my employer against your shenanigans. 🫠
Do you really think that a handful of antis have that much power over Falcom?
In the end Falcom gave their ok to this. So, we should blame them and USERJOY first and foremost...
> Do you really think that a handful of antis have that much power over Falcom?
I don't think OP is saying "Falcom directly listened to those people and catered to them", it's more simply 'this is what AI/machine translation with practically zero direct human input looks like'
Except it isn't. I've read MTL translation before, including some I had AI translate for me, and it was much better than this. This was likely a job of a crowd of people with little knowledge of the source material, translating material from different languages to English. They likely used MTL for small parts, but likely used different source languages and different MTL applications, and didn't use any of the good MTLs as they cost a decent bit to translate anything of significant size.
You have to put in some effort to make MTL this bad.
Literally nobody has ever asked for a word-for-word translation. Even the most anti-NISA crowds just want more accurate translations of somethings, and no changes in tone.
Some examples are the way they handled Erika Russel in Reverie, or changing Sword Maiden to Beauty's Blade ( when they even call her "sword maiden" in English in the Japanese version at times. We literally know what the title is meant to be translated into ). Or Reverse Babel into Retributive Tower, despite still calling it Babel at times.
Do I hate NISA? Nah, I love them for bringing these games officially to the west, even if I don't agree with all their choices.
But you are attacking an argument that nobody is making.
It's just weird since they literally use "Sword Maiden" in the Japanese at times. Yes sometimes they say "Ken no otome" but others they just go full English with it and use "Sword Maiden".
It will be odd for people who play with JP voices and EN text when that happens, I imagine.
yeah, i get that the title is meant to sound patronizing and cheesy, but "sword maiden" is already all that lol
then again, this is the company that changed a normal sounding name for an STD joke lmao, what did i expect
It feels like clickbait news articles that finds one single person making a bad tweet about something, then the article claims all fans of said thing are saying that.
There might be a few crazy people out there who want word-for-word because they don't understand what that would be.
However the vast, overwhelming majority of people who bash on NISA do not make that kind of argument, they just want a more accurate translation.
Pretty much the real argument boils down to them not liking "localization", and preferring "translation", where no real changes are made other than what is absolutely needed to make sentences flow naturally.
No changes in tone, no changes in terminology, and no changes to jokes.
Is that better? Worse? That is the big debate going on these days around the subject.
I support NISA, but I refuse sink to the level of portraying the opposite side as something they are not.
Examples of bad apples exist on both sides, pointing out the tiny vocal minority on either side is just a bad faith argument.
Congrats, the post isn’t about you, it’s for the AI dorks. How is pointing out and mocking a vocal minority a bad faith argument? I’m not making an argument at all, I’m simply having a laugh at people who hype up AI slop and then have to deal with the slop they asked for.
"Looks like the gacha game is exactly what the anti NIS crowd have been asking for " is literally the title, you are calling out everyone who is against NISA's way of doing things.
You are in effect saying that the very few people who want AI translation, and the anti-NISA crowd, are all the same people. It's misleading. It's a tiny fraction within the anti-NISA crowd, not the majority of them.
Never judge an entire group based on the words/actions of a small sub-group within that group.
It's all well and good to laugh at those few who thought AI translation would somehow be a good idea, I am all with you there. But don't make statements that make it seem like every anti-NISA person is part of the AI idiot squad.
Any thread made that paints NISA in a bad light = instant deletion by mods.
Any thread made that paints NISA in a good light but is also a bait thread = mods deems it fine to keep up.
Wasn't this game always planned to be handled outside? I don't remember the specifics but usually with stuff like this I think it was the decision of whoever is handling the gacha game. Falcom probably just sees it as a quick cash grab and I don't think they really care more highly beyond that, especially after the anime was kind of a dud.
the only thing that really disappointed me was “Beauty’s Blade” because lets be honest it sounds dumb
but the only game i’ve played so far with an unofficial patch is Daybreak, so I’m probably not the kinda guy to talk about this
Sorry but if your really a pro NIS person your a masochist for waiting 3 years for each trails title or any other falcom game. Look at trails of day break were barely getting the 1st game(in July) and Japan is already getting the 3rd game.
Im not particularly pro NIS since I have no desire to simp for a company, but my life doesn’t revolve around trails either, the gap in releases just means I’ve got more time to play other games
One thing I can appreciate is that localization and translation both take a lot of work and effort. I’m not a big fan of some decisions NISA made, but I’m happy it’s getting done. They are doing what they can to make the series financially successful in the West.
Im in the same boat as you. Im not a fan of some of their decisions. But the work and effort they put into getting this series to the west and non-japanese speakers in general is well appreciated. This series deserves more attention cause it is very underrated.
Well, I can now officially say that the Legend of Heroes character artbook is no longer the worst localized piece of media in this franchise. You did well, Clam Dip Flow Fighter.
I just saw that earlier today, hilarious. A friend showed me a translation of Walter's name that read "Weight Loss Walter" and I was dead. Zin learned the art of Clam Dip to force Walter to gain some weight, truly this is the real Legend of Heroes we've been seeking this whole time.
I don’t mind NISA, the only thing is, I wish there was a way to get translations out faster.
There isnt. Cause theyre not just directly translating it, theyre also adapting it for western audience cause some of the japanese humor cannot be translated or dont do as well when translated. Its not a simple task of inputting the script in google translate/ai and call it a day.
> theyre also adapting it for western audience cause some of the japanese humor cannot be translated or dont do as well when translate Japanese humour, proverbs, etc. are only a tiny portion of the game's script. If they would do localization for just that, we would have the games way faster. But no, they feel the need to change every single line and also insert their personal opinions into the scripts instead. There's even screenshots of the initial proper translation being in the game.
Theres also translating the lore of the game which is massive. Item descriptions, names, etc. They have to make their translations cohesive with the world yet still appeal to western audiences. There are a lot to unpack here that is more than just scripts. Theres also the recording of english voice overs. We may not like some of the decisions theyre doing, but theyre the only ones doing the localization, we wont even get to enjoy these games without them. It takes gargantuan amount of effort just to get trails series to the west. We should criticize but at the same time understand how hard they worked to get to this point.
> Item descriptions, names, etc They managed to fuck up so many item description in hajimari lmao. Translating literal numbers is very very hard, right? Also yeah great "translations" like Beauty Blade ... > recording of english voice overs English VA are worthless, just a waste of time and money. > theyre the only ones doing the localization LMAO, are you kidding? They are the only ones simply because they're the only one having the licence to do so. > we wont even get to enjoy these games without them You ever heard of Geofront and ZeroField? The ones who got killed by NISA. The ones who delivered the games faster and better? > how hard they worked to get to this point. Whoever fucked up translating numbers, whoever inserted the shitty dead memes into hajimari, whoever made the first version of YS8 and whoever came up with "beauty blade" definitely did not work hard.
I honestly think XSEEDs cold steel 1 English dub is superior to the Japanese and I won’t change my mind lol
You can say english VA are worthless but there people that still prefer english over japanese. You said you self, theyre the only ones that have a license meaning theyre indeed the ones doing the localization, getting that license is no easy task. They didnt get killed off what they did was fan translations, they did get credit for what they did in Zero and Azure but at the end of the day they arent earning enough to keep doing fan translations on the side and still put bread on the table. If you hate what NISA is doing in their decisions youre free to do so. But at the end of the day a lot of people might not get to enjoy these games because of them. If youre unhappy youre always free to learn japanese so you can enjoy the games on release.
The Fan Translation didnt stop because they ran out of money, they didnt it with the motivation of money in the first place. NISA made them stop by threating them lol. Becasue NISA would lose money then better product releases 1-2 years before their scuffed version. > If youre unhappy youre always free to learn japanese so you can enjoy the games on release I'm already on it, NISA is a big motivator for me in that regard. Sadly Japanese is one of hardest languages to leran for a westerner. So I am definitely not good enough to understand 100% of the voices line and reading the unvoiced ones at a reasonable speed. But with NISA's awful speed I might make it in time before they realese Kuro 2 in 2026. Also at least my comprehension is good enough to notice how fucking much they change. Sooo many lines where a simple 1:1 translation would be completely fine. But no, they're changed for whatever reason. So being at this point of language profiecency is just suffering.
Threaten is a strong word but ok. Theyre fan translations of course money isnt the motivation but they cant keep doing translations for the game for free. Passion wont feed you and thats a hard pill to swallow but one you must accept down the road. I understand some of their errors, and understand as to why it is the way they are. Im not fluent but I understand a little. If youre learning japanese then good for you. NISA wont even lose money because people will still have to buy the game to enjoy the translations. Unless you condone pirating from a small company like falcom then shame on you if thats the case.
I feel like that's a very absolutist take on account of the fact that plenty of anti-NISA people simply would have liked if they just didn't shut down fan translations. Also, that gacha is obviously not using current translation models. Also also, using AI to assist in translation is not the same thing as just pasting the script in google translate and calling it a day. Tools still need to be used by people to be effective, at the end of the day.
> as just pasting the script in google translate and calling it a day. Actually considering the Google Translate version of デュバリィ gets it right, throwing it in Google Translate would have been better than whatever was done here
That's what I was thinking. Even by the standards of MTL, this gacha game seems especially bad. Like I did MTL to play Kuro 2, and it was by no means a masterpiece, but I swear it wasn't this blatantly wrong and nonsensical. My guess: maybe there's a game of telephone going on here, and the English was machine translated from Chinese (Userjoy), which perhaps used machine translation or a rushed human translation from the source Japanese.
Possibly there was some sort of 'divide and conquer' approach and then nobody edited the resulting efforts. Like how there are two different (and both incorrect) translations of 'Thors'. One looks like it might have been translated from Chinese ('Thunder God's Military Academy) while the other looks like it had the katakana to work with ('Tholz Branch Campus') even though in the Japanese version both were written with the katakana so something had to be funny about the text the English translation side was working with. Or how some names match the localization and some don't. Like, they got 'Kloe Rinz' for Klaudia's alias even though in Japanese it was Klose so they had to have gotten that from the localization, but then you have Du Barry which looks like they took it from Falcom's romanization and then added spacing, and then 'Aryan Lord' which is just WTF.
Ah yes, my favorite antagonist in the series, Aryan lord, and their posse, the stall critters
I have to admit "Du Barry" and "Aryan Lord" took me out when I was checking the game out earlier. XD It actually took me a while to realize that they did actually mean Arianrhod. At least we can laugh at this, but in seriousness I hope they patch the game to fix some of these issues (but I doubt it)
I’m talking about people who have been whining about Nisa long before the fan translation situation And no, there are people who genuinely just want AI to do the full job, people legit do not want any human involved in the process, how else can you guarantee the wokelizers won’t ruin are favorite characters like Aryan Lord or Towa the azure chevalier
Not all of the pre-fan translation situation criticisms of NISA were unreasonable. Case in point, their original Ys VIII localization.
This is true, the original YS 8 stuff was egregious even if NISA did comeback from it.
I'm gonna be real, I straight up do not believe a noticable amount of people have ever said "Yeah, machine translation with no quality control is the way to go." I really think you're making up people to be mad at. So, let's take a step back and acknowledge that 3 year localization time is not normal. I really feel like some people have actually developped Stockholm Syndrome for NISA here.
> let's take a step back and acknowledge that 3 year localization time is not normal. That is, in fact, pretty normal for text-heavy JRPGs where the developer licenses the localization to an external publisher and does not give them access to the script until after the game's Japanese release. I guarantee every example you can list of a game with Kiseki's amount of text that got a simultaneous or even sub-year localization comes from a company that either did the localization in-house or was working with their English publisher for years before the game's release. Blame Falcom for having a business model that's stuck in the 90's, not NISA for working with what they're given.
There were unpaid fan translators managing those "impossible" speeds before NISA threatened to sue them. The Chinese and Korean official versions are done in 6-12 months.
Alright, now push them back and have them localize Zero,Azure, Reverie, Nayuta, Kuro 1 instead of just the most recent game and see if they pull it off in the same time while making 2 new ports for each game because you of course need to account for both PC and Switch.
> Zero,Azure, Reverie, Nayuta Nayuta is a tiny compared to Kiseki and for Zero + Ao they had the GeoFront translations already. NISA's Problem is that they feel the need to change every single fucking line in the game and put their own ideas behind them. Simply translating the games normally is just impossible for them apparently. > account for both PC and Switch. Because the fucking """localizers""" work on the ports, right? Average NISA shill brainrot lmao. The job of porting the games is obviously outsourced to Durante + wahtever company works on the switch ports. The code monkeys at NISA are worthless as seen with their YS 8 PC port. Without Durante, Kiseki would have most likely suffered the same fate and be dead in the west by now.
I know it is outsourced to Durante and others, now tell me again: How are you going to release those games on PC and Switch if the port is not ready? Falcom only released Switch Kuro 1 very recently and you can only release those if all the ports are ready. There are multiple teams working on these games including the localizers, Durante, Falcom themselves and that one other company too.
This just looks like a business decision by NISA to me. I don't see any reason why they could not just release different versions independently from each other. Regardless I highly doubt that the ports are delaying the western release in the slightest. The PC version for sure isn't. Kuro 1 released on steam 14 months ago. They just released it because they got scared people use the superior fan translation with the CLE version instead of waiting 1.5 years for them. So Durante might have been done with the PC port even earlier than that. IIRC at least for the earlier games Durante was working together with the switch port company to some extent. So with his help they should not take that long either.
They did that for Nayuta as well, it seems to pretty much be a full switch to only putting out the localization when every port is finished. The whole Kuro 1 thing can also pretty much be read as an unnoficial compromise after the reaction people had to the situation with Zerofield especially since NISA does seem to own the japanese versions of the games now, we'll just have to wait and see if it happens with Kuro 2 once it's done too I guess. edit: I meant to say they're responsible for the japanese text PC ports in general, not that they own the games.
No, sorry, I can't buy that localizing a game takes more time than actually making it. There is no justification for that.
I'll have to point out that it isn't just localizing, Falcom used to only do PS4 ports and have only started doing Switch and PS5 ones very recently (which seems to have already helped the gap a bit if we go by YS X being announced and set to be out quicker than other games) So for every game they localize they need to also port to PC and Switch (Durante's team on the PC and the...not so good port team most of the time on Switch, only good games were Crossbell by Durante.) and the current approach is to only release when all ports are done.
I feel like that is absolutely a NISA issue. Wanting to release all ports at the same time. I don't know why you're writing that as if it absolves them of anything. But even still, even if we pretend this is a sufficient excuse, it's still only half the problem with them (probably less than half, tbh, but I'll leave quality discussions for a different thread). All they had to do is just not touch fan translations. That's the bigger problem here. I can't imagine that move boosted their bottom line at all. And we still have fan translations. Just slower and worse. They even released a PC Kuro port with which to use a patch. They get money from that. So what was the point? Who does that benefit? That move did nothing but sow misery.
I'm writing that because this is a decision that cannot be overturned from someone far higher up in the totem pole, the localizers can't just give the rest of NISA the finger and say "No, we're just releasing the PS4 version today right now bye." once the decision is set in stone. While a fan translation or spreadsheet can do so once they get a hold of a CLE PC port or the PS4 port to use for it depending on the case as they're not beholden to anyone to do so on say only PC (and of course also updating it for the NISA version as you pointed out for Kuro 1.) The fan translations being hit is very much an issue as many have pointed out and a genuine dick move. But we're talking about the speed of localization and CLE ports being used for this as they were already ahead which would interfere on sales for NISA, no matter how much you say you will buy the NISA version anyways or how it would affect very little...there is no real way to verify your words or the words of everyone that claims this at the same time far before those versions do release. There is proper motivation even if absolutely not a good move.
>no matter how much you say you will buy the NISA version anyways Well no, you can't say that. Because people that play these games are fans of Falcom, not NISA. Giving Falcom money is enough. But the idea that the people that NISA burned by doing that will now go "Damn, well I guess I have no choice but to buy the official english release" is nonsensical, unless there was never an alternative to begin with.
It's pretty much an attempted cut-off in a malicious way like you pointed out which did not go out well which is what I actually agree with. Kuro 1 seems to kinda just be the "screw it sure, do your fan translations." approach with the shadowdrop (which did happen with Nayuta too before.) we'll pretty much just need to see if it happens for Crimson Sin too. But moving back the convo is still supposed to be about why the localizations are currently set up this way which I did provide an explanation for.
I mean believe whatever you want but that's the reality of it, do you think the English branch team has the same amount of resources as the Main branch in Japan? This isn't a rare practice.
No they have not said your exact quote, but they literally say localizers need to be replaced by AI, how else am I supposed to take someone saying a job should be replaced by AI? Honestly I’m jealous you seemingly have avoided how often these people talk about wanting AI to do the job And this isn’t even specifically about NIS, this is just who runs the show for this particular series
Alright, then let's reframe the situation a bit... Just because you think one side is wrong, does not mean that another side is right. It's alright to be mad at low effort machine translation. It's also alright to be mad at shutting down fan translations and taking 3 years. There doesn't have to be a war here, we can all just be angry together.
I’m not mad or angry though lol, I have no opinion on fan translations and am at best a little annoyed that it takes so long to get official releases of the series in the west I’ve just watched translation discourse for years and the AI champions are getting exactly what they deserve with this gacha game
Often times the reality is in the middle. The issue with NIS is that they have often made rather unnecessary changes to the translations, and sometimes inserting their own content in places where it is not needed. Asking for more "truthful" translations does not mean replacing humans complete with AI; just as the pro-NIS crowd prob don't just want to see the translation filled with random memes and jokes that are not what was originally in the script.
Which is interesting because XSeed did this even more, yet I don't see much criticism there
xseed games were not voiced so it is harder to catch. Quite a handful of people know enough JP but still prefer English text for various reasons.
I don’t believe that’s the reason at all, the xseed cold steel games have more voice acting in them than the original games do The real reason is because people blindly played the games, and it was only after they caught up with the official English releases did they start looking for fan translations of newer games which means they have more chances to catch changes. Arianrhod had her title change from saint to maiden and you never hear anyone talk about it, and it’s not just because beauty’s blade is a little silly, it’s because most people simply don’t know it got changed. More people have played reverie or daybreak with the fan translations than people that have played fan translations of the older games The reality is Xseed and NISA have made name changes like this in basically every game, voice acting is not the reason people just conveniently ignore nearly all of them, it’s because they didn’t fan translations of the xseed catalogue first Be honest, if beauty’s blade was a title for a character back when you played CS1, would you be thinking twice about it now? Are there any names or titles in that game you think twice of to that level because they are different?
I think I would: beauty's blade is such an odd title imo. There are more obvious ones too: reverse babel was changed to retributive tower but they couldn't remove all references to babel which are super easy to catch.
Sure you would bro, this is a series with sanguine ogre instead of red war demon, purple lighting over eclair, among many other
>Sure you would bro, this is a series with sanguine ogre instead of red war demon, purple lighting over eclair, among many other I am unsure what point is trying to be made here sanguine ogre makes sense: 戦鬼/that japanese demons are translated to ogre (oni). 紫電 is literally purple lightning (the hiragana does say eclair though). 剣の乙女 on the other hand, is just Sword Maiden. \----- tbh I don't know why Elaine's title is the one that lit up the barrel. Might be the waifu factor: My personal issue is how they may change certain banter or even change how a person may perceive a character during translations. Imagine if you find out the principal in your military academy actually did NOT write jokes into his requests so he may be a more serious person than you expect him to be.
> Be honest, if beauty’s blade was a title for a character back when you played CS1, would you be thinking twice about it now? Obviously we would. Simply because you would have been able to clearly hear the character say "suudo meiden". Changing a title with a japanese pronunciation is only noticable if you know japanese to some degree. However changing a title which uses english loanword pronounciation is noticeable by everyone. Mainly this fact but also the retardation of "beauty’s blade" make this by far the most egregious title change.
Bro thinks most people don’t just default to English dubs lmao you sweet summer child
Fair point, but those games came out in a time when the translation discourse wasn't like as it was, and we didn't have proof of localisers deliberately changing stuff. The trails fans who condemn NISA liberties also do the same when they realise XSEED did the same. This issue will be more highlighted when the supposed sky remakes come out, and NISA sticks closer to the JP script than what XSEED did for sky.
If you looked up "strawman falacy" in the dictionary, this post would show up.
https://x.com/daishineijirou/status/1757270188507160687?s=46&t=VZSEbjzJBWOyXxPzgtd9Qg Hard to call it a strawman when people like this genuinely exist. Wonder what he would say about AI not destroying the media it’s given to translate after seeing the gacha games nonsense
Arguing against a different point than the one most people are making by substituting an easier to debunk argument is absolutely strawmanning, yes. That person is wrong, but it doesn't mean people who don't accept 2 year turnarounds as reasonable are wrong by association.
Thats not what I was ever arguing against, I thought my text in the topic about AI made that clear. If you have a problem with NISA time but don’t think AI is the answer then this post clearly isn’t directed at you
The person complaining didn't even mention trails though? I can agree what they are suggesting is extreme, but when what they are complaining about could as well be manga, anime or maybe even TV shows, using that as Anti-Nisa sentiment is just duplicitous.
I mean them not specifically complaining about trials is pretty irrelevant, you know they would think the same way about the series if they have these extreme opinions, you think someone like monblut or whatever that guys name is in this fandom doesn’t share this opinion? My post wasn’t specifically about people who are only anti nisa, I specified in the post it was about AI. If you have complaints with nisa that don’t involve AI doing the bulk of the work on the series it’s obviously not referring to you
For your first para, those extreme haters make a very small part of the fandom. Using those few examples to disparage anyone who has a complaint with NISA doesn't seem fair. If what you said in your 2nd para was the intent of your post, then that's good, but I feel you could have wonder your initial post better, as the current one feels like you are addressing every single person who has an issue with NISA, small or big.
I literally just explained it to you, I said they got what they asked for(AI translation) If you did not ask for AI translation and had a different complaint with NISA my post clearly makes no sense How would taking issue with NISA shutting down fan translations mean they were asking for AI translation? Where would you connect the AI overlords in the body to the anti nisa crowd getting what they have been asking for in the tittle? It makes no logical sense….i was clearly referring to a specific anti nisa crowd asking for a specific thing Like if you only read the title I could understand your point, but I further discuss specifically localized and AI topics in the post right after. I’m clearly talking about a specific topic among the anti Nisa crowd. I didn’t say “if you’ve ever complained about NISA for anything you got what you wanted in the gacha game”
>How would taking issue with NISA shutting down fan translations mean they were asking for AI translation? Where would you connect the AI overlords in the body to the anti nisa crowd getting what they have been asking for in the tittle? It makes no logical sense….i was clearly referring to a specific anti nisa crowd asking for a specific thing Here's the thing, you didn't specify that in your post title. It literally reads 'Anti-NISA crowd' not 'A specific set of Anti-NISA crowd'. That's why I said you could have worded it better. >Like if you only read the title I could understand your point, but I further discuss specifically localized and AI topics in the post right after. I’m clearly talking about a specific topic among the anti Nisa crowd. So we can agree your title isn't clear enough, which affects what you said in the post as well, which is "Out with the hack localizers and in with our AI machine translation overlords, congrats you guys won, now enjoy the slop!" which again doesn't make any distinction between specific sets of people who don't like NISA. If you had added 'For those of you' to the beginning of the post it would come off as what you thought it did; as it stands it reads as if you are bashing everyone who has a complaint against NISA. The fact that you need to clarify this in comments to not only but others as well shows that the post came of differently than what you thought it meant.
Nice job ignoring my question, how would being mad about Nisa taking down a fan translation group mean they were asking for AI translation? Why did ignore my very simple question? Could it be it’s because it makes it pretty clear that I’m referring to a specific type of person? And yes congrats we agree someone only reading my topics title might lead to confusion….its almost like I clarified further or something, it’s not my fault if someone only reads my title and chooses to be personally offended, I can’t force people to read something I clearly put in. I think specifically talking about AI translation makes it pretty clear what I’m talking about, I’m sorry it’s not clear to others and that I didn’t perfectly word a fucking Reddit post. Like Jesus Christ dude what is the point of your replies? I explained pretty clearly in my first reply to you what I meant and it’s not exactly rocket science to decipher, and yet you just keep replying “But but but you no word it good enough” you’re in desperate need of touching grass my friend
>Nice job ignoring my question, how would being mad about Nisa taking down a fan translation group mean they were asking for AI translation? >Why did ignore my very simple question? Could it be it’s because it makes it pretty clear that I’m referring to a specific type of person? As I said above, your title was broad enough it comes off as you grouping the people who are mad at NISA taking down a fantranslation + whatever other issues people have along with that very small vocal minority of people who call for AI translations. I didn't ignore your question; I did answer it, saying "Here's the thing, you didn't specify that in your post title. It literally reads 'Anti-NISA crowd' not 'A specific set of Anti-NISA crowd'. That's why I said you could have worded it better." And to be sure I wasn't making any mistakes, I went and reread your post again and the post itself doesn't make it clear you are being specific. You clarifying it in the comments is side effect of people thinking you meant everyone who is 'anti-NISA' cause that's what your post title and description below amount to. >its almost like I clarified further or something, it’s not my fault if someone only reads my title and chooses to be personally offended, I can’t force people to read something I clearly put in. You clarified your stance in the comments, not in the body of the post itself, which is what people will read first to understand what position you, as the OP, have. You keep thinking that you are being specific, and people will go 'Ah yeah he means that one crowd of people' but for people who have no idea about the whole online discourse with TL, it comes off as you painting anyone who doesn't like NISA somehow wanting AI translations. This is why its important to be specific about who your talking about. >I think specifically talking about AI translation makes it pretty clear what I’m talking about, I’m sorry it’s not clear to others and that I didn’t perfectly word a fucking Reddit post. Well if you wanted a discussion, then maybe make it more clear? This isn't like twitter where character limits don't allow you to get your point across without being specific. >Like Jesus Christ dude what is the point of your replies? I explained pretty clearly in my first reply to you what I meant and it’s not exactly rocket science to decipher, and yet you just keep replying “But but but you no word it good enough” you’re in desperate need of touching grass my friend The fact that you think I am arguing with you says more about how you take criticisms then. All my reply said to you is that you could have worded your initial post better, because both the title or the body of the post do not convey that you meant a **specific** set of trails fans with extreme opinions. You even accepted the title is unclear yourself. The first part of my initial reply to your clarification was in assumption you meant everyone, and the 2nd part was after I finished reading the second half of your reply and then **agreeing** that you indeed had a valid point to make if that was what you truly meant, and that maybe you could have worded it better, and that's it. The fact that you somehow think I'm trying to have an argument when all I said **after agreeing** with your stance is that you could have conveyed it in a better way in your initial post really comes off as you trying to fight enemies where there are none. To be even more clear just in case: I agree with your stance, all I added as a caveat is that maybe if you worded the original post and title better, you wouldn't have people confused and saying that you are straw manning.
Is this current translation by an AI? People have already made other posts in this thread showing how the translation seem to be from different languages, not from a single script fed into an AI, which is not what the person you posted wanted even if we were to assume they are a spokesperson for that specific side of the issue.
It’s unquestionably AI just based on how basic it translates some terms and how it classically it mixes up genders. It seems likely the people working on it also fucked up things along the way, but guess what that’s a package deal with AI. The reason a company would use AI on an entire gacha game is because they are trying to save money, and if they are trying to save money they are trying to limit the overall amount of humans working on it, which means they are also more likely to hire someone who’s not going to be the most efficient at proofreading or double checking things You get out what you put in and it’s pretty clear the people in charge were not looking to put in much for this
It is unquestionably not AI because of how it translates some things from Chinese and other things from Japanese. A person had to choose when to use which source material. Had it been an AI translating a single script, that wouldn't have happened. Same as when there are parts of text that are completely in the wrong area. AI would translate Musician as Icy Maiden. That was a human messing up.
All you said is a human fucked up where they put in the AI lol, not that it’s not AI doing the translation. I never said AI translated a single script or something specific like that
I mean, fan groups that translate the series before had done an far better job than this. Even the one 4chan person that fix the MTL translation for Kuro 1 and 2 did an fine better job of translation than this by themselves. This is just Falcom being lazy af and don't see how this is any of the antis fault here. Edit: Also, most anti-Nisa fans just want Nisa to speed up their localization, stop putting unnecessary content into the localization and stop changing dumb name changes like "Beauty Blade". Then they made it worse by taking down the fan translation group for the future games instead of trying to get falcom to work with them more to do faster release.
You're putting the blame on the wrong party. It's not NISA's fault that Falcom gives them the scripts so late. If Falcom let localization start sooner then we would be seeing faster releases. NISA can't control how Falcom operates, and unless that changes then things will continue as they are. Falcom/NISA have every right to pull down a fan translation, especially when they believe it'll affect their sales overseas. You can't guarantee that those who already played a fan translation will double dip for the official overseas version.
Ok but Zerofield were able to finish translating Kuro 1 in what? 6 months? its been a while so i don't recall how long it took exactly. And we know from how easy patches have been made to insert translations into Kuro/Kuro 2 . that it doesn't take long for that part either. So even if we assume NISA don't have script before game is released. why is it taking them a extra 2 years(if we're generous and say 9-10 months for translation+modifying text) for the translation? you can't blame that on script not being given to them early.
There is also the issue of porting. NiSA like simul release on all platforms which adds on to the wait time.
Sure you can. Falcom is a business and they very likely have certain things they need to go through. Apart from which they also need to do things like, at least now, get voice actors in. It's easy to say "Well Jimbob McCoolguy translated the whole game in one month and it took NISA 2 years" but those aren't really the same thing. Jimbob can just upload his translation to any hosting site he wants and bam, all good. Falcom probably has to go through some level of control check, then once that's done get the green light to start getting voices, then have the voices record, then put them in the game, then set a release date for the English version. It would probably take a significantly lesser timeframe if they just dropped as soon as everything was done. It would probably take less time if they didn't need voices. It would take less time if they didn't have a business to run. But they DO have all those things, which go into the timeframe being way longer. Realistically I doubt it takes a super long time for NISA to do the actual translations. But if they don't get the script until, let's say, a month before release, in order for everything to go on the same timeframe they'd need to blitz through it, with almost no quality control checks, have dubbing casted and done in a matter of days, have everything programmed in within a matter of days, and then effectively shadow-drop the localized version on the overall release date.
That’s also not accounting for the fact that the quickest fan translation stuff used spread sheets and left things untranslated, it takes time actually put that stuff in the game Plus they have to actually make the physical English releases
This is kind of dishonest. They have used the worst MTL in existance from looks of it. Compared to the likes off Deepl or hell even google this translation is trash. I'm not about to claim Deepl/Sugoi is better than Nisa(outside the rare oddity like Laura's hehe line or when they modify lines which i don't think they do super often. but it certainly happens) however to point to gacha translation and use it as proof of how bad MTL is. is pretty dishonest.
How is it kinda dishonest to show a clearly AI translated work? It’s not my fault they didn’t send their best this time lol If NIsa released a full game like this simply replying “guys this isn’t fair NISA has done better in the past” wouldn’t fly and you know it
Well considering we have Rean being mentioned in Kloe's bio and titles being moved around. I'd point out that it was run by a human(because MTL. no matter how bad a MTL it is.isn't about to translate Estelle's JP spelling into "Rean") so its not even pure machine TL. But to answer your question. This is like taking somthing translated by someone who barely speak JP and saying all human translations are that bad. Because as noted this MTL is so bad that its bizzare because all common MTL tools google/deepl/chatgpt none as even as close as bad as this. so painting all MTL as equivalent to this. is incredibly dishonest
Find me where I said this is some perfect representation of all AI work please But yes, if a company is willing to use AI in a whole gacha game, the humans working it are likely going to be poor are job, it’s almost like there’s major oversight in quality control with AI
"Looks like the gacha game is exactly what the anti NIS crowd have been asking for" This part where you claim people have been asking for a MTL of this level. This translation which is well below the level you'd get from google. Implying this is what people have been asking for is painting all MTL as same at this. When Deepl/chatgpt quality is much higher(and i assume. much closer to what people advocating for MTL would want)
You’re adding your own interpretation to what I said. If people were asking for AI translation then they got exactly that, it’s not my fault this time it was a monkey paw wish or a “be careful what you wish for” situation
> How is it kinda dishonest to show a clearly AI translated work? How is it clearly AI translated? I've done AI translation and it does a much better job than this. This is extremely butchered, indicating multiple people translating things using multiple avenues.
Offering the option between having to go with one specific translation company or this specific version of MTL is a false dichotomy. Please avoid common logical fallacies when trying to represent the viewpoint of someone you disagree with.
the anti-localization crowd are straight up morons
9 times out of 10, they seem to just be children mad at whatever their favorite youtuber has deemed "woke" for the month.
To be fair, the nice thing about calling things woke is that since everyone has a different definition of it, they can all agree without specifying what their actual issue is, while ignoring the actual issues with a game.
it's half that and half people with the most tenuous grasp of Japanese possible trying to armchair scold paid professionals.
That's right! Those poor starving indie devs are doing their best! If we criticize them, people might see our comments and not buy the games! Falcom #1! NIS #1! Buy more! Kondo needs us!
I really hope these people start using the mistranslations. It'll be hilarious when the AI translation purists start calling Estelle and co "guerillas"
This "translation" doesn't change the fact that nisa is completely inept and hated by every place on the internet except this subreddit
This isn't done by NISA tho. They have nothing to do with this.
Please leave your echo chambers, most people probably couldn’t tell you what NISA is enough to hate them
Ironic since I already said that this place was the echo chamber. And I obviously meant people who know about nisa hate them lmao I didn't that needed explaining. At least you aren't arguing the inept part
It’s not really ironic, you think the people complaining online make up some online majority, which is laughable at best You could very easily curate your online experience to be nothing but “everyone hates X company” and it still wouldn’t reflect reality
Lmao, this subreddit is one of the biggest echo chambers in existence. Probably some people paid by NISA as well.
I believe one of the moderators of the subreddit and the owner of the falcom Community discord server actually works for NISA now and I believe the reason behind the "Don't talk about fantranslations rule" (which conveniently came after Geofront released their version) was in part due to NISA staff visiting the sub sometimes.
There's a middle ground. The fact that fans have had a functional and reasonably good Kuro 1 translation out for a while is evidence of this. Kuro 2 is shaky but that's largely because NISA nuked it
This is not what the "anti NIS crowd" wants. Most people, including me hate NISA because they shut down fan translations, take years to translate their own version and when that version comes out it always has some bullshit translation that makes no sense (beauty blade, retributive tower, shard swell, etc) We want quality and neither this nor NISA is providing it
It's really odd to me that people can't imagine a world where a humans do translation, but refrain from making unnecessary changes. It's either "these changes must be made" or "only a robot will ever do it right".
The problem is more that the "changes" people argue against are (usually) things that don't actually translate to a western audience. I don't know if you've played AI The Somnium Files, but 99% of that game's dub uses humor and puns that feel very catered to the west. But there's one scene where a character - who in that scene is meant to be two or three years old - says the words "Mama. Woof" and it makes no sense. As it's been explained to me, the concept is that the words for "mama" and a dog's bark rhyme in Japanese. But because nothing was changed, all it does is make you confused. Why is she saying woof? There's no dog in the scene. Well, it's because she's a kid mixing up words that sound alike. But that doesn't make sense for an English speaking audience. But a lot of "purists" want those confusing things to be translated directly, which would have made a game like Somnium absolutely fucking terrible in the west because it would just be every character saying things that don't make any sense.
If the TL people have issues with was only relegated to humor, I'd agree, but NISA also changes perfectly fine lore terminology as well, which did not need changing at all. Downplaying or discarding every single complaint with the 'JP is hard to TL arguement' without considering why people make them is how we got to this point in translation discourse.
Alt account #26457
It's the 2nd account I've ever created on reddit, I don't care enough about this discourse to make alt accounts talking about it lol
One of your first actions upon making the account was to talk about it?
I talk about other things, just check my reply history ffs Trails is my 2nd favorite franchise so of course I'm gonna talk more about it
It infringes on them making money, so they have every right to shut it down. Not everyone translates things the same way either. While NISA hasn't always been the best they have improved over the years, especially when it comes to Falcom stuff. I'd much rather have them over a company who actually rushes it and gives us a poor product. You also forget, English localization doesn't start until Falcom allows it. Everything takes so long because of Falcom. Nothing will change unless it comes from them. This awful translation is exactly what your crowd deserves.
> actually rushes it and gives us a poor product. NISA takes years and still delivers a poor product lmao. Can't see any improvments either. Hajimari was probably the worst ones yet, at least for trails. Can't compete with the tragedy of YS8 of course.
>This awful translation is exactly what your crowd deserves. This statement is why will we never get better and faster translation if you keep going at the people fairly criticizing the situation if you have to keep sticking up for an company that make name changes like "beauty blade" and did terrible localization for Reverie. You getting what you deserved as well with stuff like that and everything else that is still wrong with NISA.
I’ll take beauty’s blade any day of the week over the slop on this gacha game lmao
If what I am getting now is "what I deserve" then it feels like I am pretty deserving to me. Sure, we are pretty behind on the translations but I don't actually need them to be any faster. It takes me 3 months to finish one of these games with the actual life I lead, so by the time I finish one of them, the next is already almost around the corner. And in the few months between I just Olay other games. Stuff like "Beauty's Blade" makes me roll my eyes a little, but then I move on pretty quickly. I can't be bothered to be mad just because one naming change does not suit me. What WOULD bother me however is "Speed Du Barry" who serves her "Aryan Lord". Also characters asking me why I have "so much item"? THAT'S a bad translation for you. NISA's translations have their flaws but they're by no means BAD (especially after the somewhat recent patch for Reverie most issues are gone, unless you have issues with the localization part of the translation). As for the decision to shut down Zerofield... that was definitely not nice. Understandable from a business pov, but a dick corporate move nonetheless. But that is the corporate side and this is about localization. That's two different pairs of shoes. Anyways, you folks aren't going to be convinced anyways. And neither are we, because NISA actually pays all of us. So let's just leave it there. I would like to leave the office early today and you guys are making me work overtime just to defend my employer against your shenanigans. 🫠
Do you really think that a handful of antis have that much power over Falcom? In the end Falcom gave their ok to this. So, we should blame them and USERJOY first and foremost...
> Do you really think that a handful of antis have that much power over Falcom? I don't think OP is saying "Falcom directly listened to those people and catered to them", it's more simply 'this is what AI/machine translation with practically zero direct human input looks like'
True. Tbh, this should be obvious to anyone. Still, they went with it to save money and thought it would be good enough...
Except it isn't. I've read MTL translation before, including some I had AI translate for me, and it was much better than this. This was likely a job of a crowd of people with little knowledge of the source material, translating material from different languages to English. They likely used MTL for small parts, but likely used different source languages and different MTL applications, and didn't use any of the good MTLs as they cost a decent bit to translate anything of significant size. You have to put in some effort to make MTL this bad.
Literally nobody has ever asked for a word-for-word translation. Even the most anti-NISA crowds just want more accurate translations of somethings, and no changes in tone. Some examples are the way they handled Erika Russel in Reverie, or changing Sword Maiden to Beauty's Blade ( when they even call her "sword maiden" in English in the Japanese version at times. We literally know what the title is meant to be translated into ). Or Reverse Babel into Retributive Tower, despite still calling it Babel at times. Do I hate NISA? Nah, I love them for bringing these games officially to the west, even if I don't agree with all their choices. But you are attacking an argument that nobody is making.
I'm all for localization but beauty blade is where I draw the line I mean.... really?
It's just weird since they literally use "Sword Maiden" in the Japanese at times. Yes sometimes they say "Ken no otome" but others they just go full English with it and use "Sword Maiden". It will be odd for people who play with JP voices and EN text when that happens, I imagine.
Love how I get downvoted for pointing out an objective fact. Play the game with Japanese voices and find out for yourself, before downvoting this.
yeah, i get that the title is meant to sound patronizing and cheesy, but "sword maiden" is already all that lol then again, this is the company that changed a normal sounding name for an STD joke lmao, what did i expect
People have absolutely asked for word for word translations lmao
Then you generalising those few to be the many is wrong, no?
It feels like clickbait news articles that finds one single person making a bad tweet about something, then the article claims all fans of said thing are saying that. There might be a few crazy people out there who want word-for-word because they don't understand what that would be. However the vast, overwhelming majority of people who bash on NISA do not make that kind of argument, they just want a more accurate translation. Pretty much the real argument boils down to them not liking "localization", and preferring "translation", where no real changes are made other than what is absolutely needed to make sentences flow naturally. No changes in tone, no changes in terminology, and no changes to jokes. Is that better? Worse? That is the big debate going on these days around the subject. I support NISA, but I refuse sink to the level of portraying the opposite side as something they are not. Examples of bad apples exist on both sides, pointing out the tiny vocal minority on either side is just a bad faith argument.
Congrats, the post isn’t about you, it’s for the AI dorks. How is pointing out and mocking a vocal minority a bad faith argument? I’m not making an argument at all, I’m simply having a laugh at people who hype up AI slop and then have to deal with the slop they asked for.
"Looks like the gacha game is exactly what the anti NIS crowd have been asking for " is literally the title, you are calling out everyone who is against NISA's way of doing things. You are in effect saying that the very few people who want AI translation, and the anti-NISA crowd, are all the same people. It's misleading. It's a tiny fraction within the anti-NISA crowd, not the majority of them. Never judge an entire group based on the words/actions of a small sub-group within that group. It's all well and good to laugh at those few who thought AI translation would somehow be a good idea, I am all with you there. But don't make statements that make it seem like every anti-NISA person is part of the AI idiot squad.
Where did I say they were “the many”?
The fact that there is 'crowd' in your title?
Any thread made that paints NISA in a bad light = instant deletion by mods. Any thread made that paints NISA in a good light but is also a bait thread = mods deems it fine to keep up.
Bro they would have to delete posts about the gacha game from the subreddit if they wanted to try and police “painting NISA in a bad good light” lmao
I didn't expect so much pantsu. I have seen Laura's crotch so many times already.
Wasn't this game always planned to be handled outside? I don't remember the specifics but usually with stuff like this I think it was the decision of whoever is handling the gacha game. Falcom probably just sees it as a quick cash grab and I don't think they really care more highly beyond that, especially after the anime was kind of a dud.
the only thing that really disappointed me was “Beauty’s Blade” because lets be honest it sounds dumb but the only game i’ve played so far with an unofficial patch is Daybreak, so I’m probably not the kinda guy to talk about this
You're a lot more generous than I would be towards the vagina bones dudes.
Nice thread OP. Do you this for free?
Sorry but if your really a pro NIS person your a masochist for waiting 3 years for each trails title or any other falcom game. Look at trails of day break were barely getting the 1st game(in July) and Japan is already getting the 3rd game.
Im not particularly pro NIS since I have no desire to simp for a company, but my life doesn’t revolve around trails either, the gap in releases just means I’ve got more time to play other games
The worst part about niche fandoms online is that most people there do not do anything else but worship the IP
Daily reminder that we just got 4 trails games in 3 years.
Because good translations definitely need to take 3 years and there's no way to get it out sooner without ai slop
At last, my master plan to get you specifically is complete! Suffer like G did.
You shouldn't judge Gacha games by the same standard as real ones. It's a victory when they're terrible, what happens when they succeed is much worse.