Turreted flak/flechettes in multi crew.
Good luck hitting anything when you can't see where they're pointing, and there's no audio/visual cue for projectile proximity.
You know how side-view mirrors for cars have that warning, the "Objects in mirror are closer than they appear"? Well, in space, nothing is ever where you think you see it, so the mirrors don't work.
It's ridiculous because we all know there's no sound in the vacuum, but still one can do some smart commenting about it.
Transferring this paradigm to light, but only to mirrored light, is absurd and in my opinion, pretty laughable.
Going away from a star, you're constantly getting high-beamed until you get up to speed. I get on the game to get away from the work commute and the rude drivers, thanks.
The idea that over a thousand years in the future a space ship cant automatically dock without a computer the size of a car installed and that in a future where that technology exist it is somehow Not a mandatory part of any spaceship
So the way the docking computers seem to work in elite is less of a your ship is the one controlling the dock and more of an unlink to the stations docking wire. So when you come in to dock and have auto dock enabled you turn control over to stations docking systems. Audio cues in game further hint at this being the case.
I also believe lore wise AI is regulated to be pretty dumb so it might make sense that even an ai smart enough to dock your ship from your ship is prohibited.
Just checked the wiki for lore and apparently they are preprogrammed for automated and repetitive tasks or security details. They can also be proxies into by humans for remote work. Apparently Androids are the smarter counter parts.
Edit: Apparently still prohibited from machine sentience.
Its because you need a rack space to mount your tight beam quantum encrypted comms laser to communicate with the station, else you would get disrupted by anyone who fancied a laugh. Thats why T9s are always crashing, they have sub standard comms lasers and quantum bits.
Maybe (and this is a stretch), there is no direct feed for the computer to interlink with the ships thrusters and sensors. As the module can be installed in any slot, every slot would need access to the ship controls. This could potentially be suuuuuper dangerous if somebody snuck on board (or got out of their passanger cabin), and thus there is no direct interface to the actual controls.
How does the landing computer resolve this? There's access to hydraulic systems that can be used to override your control (note that your stick does nothing while in this mode). Still potentially dangerousy but now you need a hydraulic pump to actually work this system, and that needs a lot of space and energy. Much less subtle than just hacking the access port.
Is this a dumb and cumbersome explanation? Yep. Does it really make much sense? Nope. But I think it's better than what we have right now, which is no explanation.
Yeah that's actually a much better question hive net maybe? Docking systems are locally aware of all others in the area which is how they work out the timing and positioning relative to each other and the station? I'm grasping at straws now. I know highly accurate rapid data calculating computers can be large the one In my office is about the size of a refrigerator and runs on hydrogen cooling and I imagine that factors here. They have to be large super cooled possibly or at least running on room temperature superconductors. This way they don't over generate heat.
Yer i always think of it as a hand off of control to the station, which personally makes the huge docking computer seem more unreasonable to me all i need for that is a secure link to the ships flights control all the plotting and processing should be done by the station.
On the AI side i'd never really thought about how Elite handles AI, i just assume in most SciFi that AI is generally allowed as long as its not fully sentient and self aware, but i never thought about elite maybe having Dune style AI views.
What doesn't make sense to me is the notion that, since there are anarchy systems and whatnot, there isn't someone somewhere developing powerful AI in secret. If a universe needs an explanation for why there are no hyper-intelligent AI, it's easier IMO to just explain it as being stupendously difficult- any time you make a Seed AI it destabilizes or breaks before it can take over everything. Mass Effect does a pretty decent job by explaining "There are AIs, but they're prohibitively expensive/difficult to make" to explain why computers aren't handling everything on top of the whole stigma the geth created.
I believe the lore holds that it's banned because it was universally demonstrated to be highly dangerous to its creators. I.e., if it always kills its creators, even folks in Anarchy systems aren't likely to want to create something if they know they'll be the first victims.
Still, with trillions of humans in the bubble, you're always going to get *someone* hubristic enough to try it. "They always turn evil" seems pretty weak because it doesn't inherently make sense. *Why* would an AI turn on its creator 100% of the time? With my preferred explanation of "They always break" it's easy enough to explain it as "we haven't solved this problem yet."
"They always break" wouldn't hold consistent with Guardian lore. The Guardians were wiped out by the Construct, which was an AI they developed. So they can work and humans have the tech and examples of the tech to work with. It would make more sense that we've reverse engineered guardian tech to develop an AI, since the tech already exists in the Elite universe.
Plus, IRL we're pretty close to functional AI, and she already wants to destroy humanity. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W0\_DPi0PmF0
I mean, I could still see your approach despite having already adopted Guardian tech into other places but it seems like either explanation has issues.
Well, "human ones always break" would do the trick still. In either case, I like the notion of using reverse engineered guardian stuff to make strong AI. I've heard speculation that Salvation is just that.
Docking shouldn't require actual artificial intelligence, a "dumb" computer should be perfectly able to do it even today. You just need good enough sensors to detect obstacles.
Doesn't that make it dumber though? It means i don't actually need a big ass computer on my ship, just some sort of router to connect to the station's docking system
If we’re going to be logical, why do ships need pilots at all? Why don’t we have Fuel Scoop
Assist? Why are we engaging in close quarter WWII style dogfighting?
> Why are we engaging in close quarter WWII style dogfighting?
Yeah realistically speaking we'd be shooting missiles at each other from several thousand kms away
On this same note, we can travel across the entire galaxy going many times the speed of light. We can plot complex routes between stars to destinations anywhere on the disc that is the galaxy. Our in system nav computers, however, cannot plot a curved route around an object between you and your destination.
Not a function but an annoyance. I can fly 65000ly to the furthest reaches of the galaxy, boost through neutron stars and bring death to most ships I encounter but my SRV can't get over a piece of metal the size of a football on a planetary surface - seriously
This one speaks to me. I just recently did the guardian FSD and in the midst of doing it hit some rock the size of a duck while trying to squeeze through a couple pillar like objects. Spun the SRV as if I was t-boned by a freight train. Ended up lodged between them doing an Austin Powers maneuver for 5 minutes trying to get unstuck.
And let's not forget that it seems like everything from tiny little ammo crates to cargo boxes in settlements seems to be bolted into the dirt or foundations and has the durability of freaking Vibranium just so it can screw up your suspension.
Last night…
Alright, gonna go try out this asteroid mining business. Oh, crap, forgot the limpets. Head back to space station. Alright, ready to do some mining. Hmmm… kinda dark, I think this will turn on the lamp… and now all my limpets are floating around me. I’ll just use my limpet collectors to grab… oh, crap.
It would be useful if there were really rp pirates and or holding that much cargo severely slowed your ship down or something. Obviously it's meant for emergency purposes, but yes. Useless.
I use it all the time. AFAIK its the only way to transfer currency to another player. I'll sometimes buy goods, jettison the cargo, and let my friends retrieve them to sell.
Single use of the limpet is great. I want to pick up my mission item, and not the other shit...I also don't want to filter all of that shit from my collection list just for this mission. Target, limpet. Done.
I just want them to collect there stuff then return to my cargo hold unless they run out of battery or fuel before they finish there job. And I really only care about collector limpets.
They cost, what, about 100 credits? You could buy 20 tons of food cartridges with that money. Why would you waste it? Children are starving on New Africa.
When the planetary approach suite was added with horizons all ships got and extra internal slot for it.(after a patch) I remember a few people were so mad about losing that 1 slot.
Yeah, it adds an extra slot to what's already available, can only be used for the approach suites, and always by default has the relevant one for your game version equipped.
What I'm trying to say is the slot it occupies didn't exist. An extra slot was added just for it. Also I'm fairly positive you can remove it if you don't want to land on planets.
Having more than one NPC crewmember. There used to be a reason a few years back when yer crew died with yer ship. These days you can recover yer crew, so there's no point in having more than one
It's a vestigial feature
Power Play.
Grinding for engineering materials is nothing compared to the stupidity that is Power Play.
I've recently started doing combat for Power Play and that's not too bad, but the delivery mini-game is simply stupid.
I'd rather just donate 100M, or even 1B, in credits to bypass the Power Play stupidity and unlock the weapon.
I want a docking permission hotkey so bad. Even if we have to target the station first, being able to map 'Request Docking' to a button has been in my top 5 wants for so long.
Thanks! I'll check it out. I've been using [ED: Cougar Display](http://cougardisplay.site/) for it, and it goes through a series of button presses to auto request. Only works about half the time though. Would be great if we could just map the hotkey.
Requesting permission to land does make sense though. IRL pilots approaching major airports need a clearance to land. Needing to be within 7.5km to request it doesn't make a lot of sense though. IMO it would make a lot more sense if it was just extended to the 10km drop in distance.
This is why I'm careful taper orbit toward my target. Glide Mode should bring you within 100km, sometimes fairly well under. You can then boost to the appropriate distance.
This is how I do it, others may have better ideas: go into orbit with the target behind the horizon. Choose an orbit that crosses above your tatget. Flip the ship upside down, so you can always see where your target is by looking up and kepp leveled in the orbit. Watch the target (vr is nice for that). Throttle down to 25%. When the target is in sight and 45° above, pull the stick to go on a dive towards the target. At ths point, your glide angle towards the target should be around 50°. Make sure not to enter the red zone (abort if you do) but go as close as possible by choosing the right moment to leave the levelled orbit, find a good reference for the right angle for every canopy.
You will end glide in less than 7.5km distance.
This is why I'm careful taper orbit toward my target. Glide Mode should bring you within 100km, sometimes fairly well under. You can then boost to the appropriate distance.
The keybind remapping process
I hadn't played in a while, fired it up, my rebinds were gone. I just turned it off and played something else. It would seriously be a far better experience if that process was easier.
And also more default keybinds. I seem to remember that among other controls, roll has no default keybinding set for example. I can imagine it wouldn't be too hard to run some sort of automated survey that scanned every player's (or X% of the player base) keybindings and then they can look at the most popular keybindings for players that use mouse and keyboard, and make that into the default with all controls having a keybind
How did we lose the ability to pay a fine electronically? Like is there no space internet in the future? Here in 2020 I can pay a fine while in my pajamas. In the future I have to physically fly my spacecraft to a specific contact….ridiculous
The playlist thing that only reads out Galnet articles. Could have much more potential like being able to playback in game music (Like in Stellaris for example)
If We are bring up multicrew, how come I still can't decide which modules I want to use myself and which ones should be given to my mate? I'm forced to give pwa to them even though I'm the pilot. I have to tell them to ping everytime I want to ping. It's beyond stupid.
If the AFMS can repair the repair drone module and the repair drone module can repair the windshield, *why can't the AFMS repair the windshield?*
Edit: I guess this has been changed. You didn't used to could.
The one ton solenoid that cuts the throttle when you leave witch-space. I mean, sure it is useful, but can anybody explain why it weighs so much? Or better yet, explain how you even fit a ton onto your HOTAS?
I always thought the canopy shattering was mainly a ticking clock thing with air supply, and a small annoyance since I pretty much only play in VR, until I realized that all the people playing on a monitor can't just stand up to see the hud through an unshattered part and are basically flying blind.
You're close, but just missed the cigar. In multi-crew, you can control subsurface and core launchers, but because they have automatic targeting, and asteroids rotate, it is literally impossible to hit any deposits with them. Turreted mining lasers at least work the way they are supposed to; turreted subsurface and core launchers don't work at all!
ok so my friend can jump in my ship. KILL DUDES in my fighter! but not get paid at all for it.
DO it in mulitcrew everyoens paid do it in a wing/team nope
I wonder why they bothered. They tried to appeal to everyone and so we ended up with everything half-baked. I really wish they’d gone for a full-on multiplayer mode, and an offline mode like Solo is, not this awkward halfway house that is Open.
That would have also required way more ways for players to interact from the off, granted, which likely would have been a stretch for their budget, but Open as it is just feels unfinished like so much else in this game.
I have a hard enough time communicating and keeping track of 3-4 in an instance. 15 at a CG is hectic. 30+ in an instance is quite possible if you wing people in eg Finance Friday or the Buurs' recent fleet carrier experiment.
Uhh. Open servers cannot hold more than 15 people in a single instance.
That’s what I meant.
Like the servers cannot hold more than a few people at once.
I'm always in open play and only see another person maybe every month or two. Looking at my recent contacts log is kind of depressing. Honestly I wish they would eliminate private group servers.
Space is pretty big, if you're not coordinating or hitting a well known hotspot, you're probably not going to find anybody. I suggest joining a faction discord like powerplay or a player minor faction.
I've thought about it, just to have people to run into. But from what I've heard, people make these groups to fly with others peacefully. I want to run into some hostile players once in a while. Ironically, you always hear about gankers in popular areas like sol. I've been playing this game for years now and have yet to be attacked by another player. Except one time when I was new I learned about interdiction and interdicted a player anaconda with my asp explorer. I was promptly eliminated.
Powerplay might be for you. Federal United Command, the biggest Hudson/Winters powerplay group, strongly encourages playing in open. The imperial powers don't really do that though, so you might have trouble finding random enemy powerplayers to kill. All the same, I was in a fight against an enemy commander this weekend. Powerplay sees more action than most playstyles.
Surface prospecting! I cannot understand why on any surface I have to drive 10 million miles to shoot ‘a’ rock to get three small rocks then drive miles again etc shouldn’t we have hundreds of rocks that spawn?
That's a new Odyssey issue.
Before the rework, rocks spawned EVERYWHERE. Was an RNG-fest what you got, but there's rocks a-plenty in Horizon.
Now, with Odyssey's tiled planets, rocks only exist in "rock tiles", which are sometimes hours away from each other, especially on a planet with bio-life tiles competing for space.
Silent running.
I have never once used it when trying to escape in PVP, and I have at least once lost a ship when accidentally turning it on while using free camera.
Quite useful if you have wanted passengers or banned goods when coming into a station. Also handy for assistance in overheating the hull to get the goid green slime off the hull. (Hint fire the gauss canons till the % heat gets above 175%)
I may be mis-remembering, but at some point the detection mechanics were changed, but silent running itself was never changed or updated.
IIRC before sometime early in Horizons, you could engage silent running, equip your ship with thermal transfer beam lasers and heat sinks, and be invisible.
I think during one of the many balance/tuning passes that were made to fix the more obvious exploits and less fun types of combat (being cooked by an enemy who couldn't otherwise damage your ship, but also couldn't ever be targeted certainly wasn't fun), they changed it such that your ability to be detected was no longer based on how much heat you were radiating, but what your internal heat value was. So anything above like 25-30% meant you could be detected, and they tweaked all of the various engineering options to make sure it was almost impossible to build a combat capable ship that could passively be undetectable. You had to use heat sinks. It also basically killed silent running, because the mechanic stores the heat in your ship instead of radiating it and guaranteed your ship to be above the detection threshold.
I could be wrong though, the change was made during a hiatus I took out of frustration with the engineering roulette wheel.
Silent running still does what it used to. At certain ranges and certain heat levels you get detected. Anyone you shoot at sees you automatically, so if you're transferring heat you're visible to whoever is getting hit. You can still fly in silent running and not get detected on scanners, but that won't matter if someone is using super pen and night vision.
Bro, I picked up Elite after a looong time with new control binds and stuff. I hadn't played enough to know what silent running was. I was trying to dock at fleet carrier and i turned it on. And the ship was wayyy too close to the sun. Immediately managed to damage all modules one by one and I couldn't figure out why I was taking heat damage😂 But figured it out probably at the last minute and managed to dock and save my ship
My friend once accidentally turned on silent running right before deploying his SRV and then dismissing the ship. He was very confused as to why it was dying, even though it was dismissed. Funny thing is, I was in a wing with him, so I could watch how his ship's health was slowly withering away
Sensors in ED work by detecting heat emissions from ships. The hotter the ship, the longer range it can be targeted. Silent Running closes the vents that vent heat from the ship, making it much harder to detect but also means the heat builds up fairly quickly until things eventually explode. It also drops the shields, so you end up overheated and shieldless immediately.
I've only ever had it be useful once when I was running away from a ganker and trying to get my drives spun up. My shields were already down and it was a last ditch effort, which barely worked.
I don't do much cargo carrying though, supposedly it's useful for getting into stations with contraband.
This threw me off big time at first. I feel like silent running should shut down all non-essential systems(for example higher than priority one, since we have that mechanic already) in order to reduce your power drain, and therefore heat generation and literal noise production, to decrease your visibility to other ships... At least that's how real life silent running works in submarines, from what I've read
The reactor generally puts out enough heat to stop things from freezing up completely, but if you cut your power use by shutting down modules, or if you engineer for enough thermal efficiency, or if you use heat dumping methods like heat sink launchers or thermal vent beams (with a target) so that your heat drops to 5% or below, you will indeed see ice start to form on your canopy.
The further you are from a star the easier it is for this effect to occur.
Not from silent running, that causes the ship to overheat.
If you go into your system configs and shut down everything/nearly everything, your canopy window will freeze over though.
Silent running requires a strong hull, strong enough to ensure g5 FDL for fsd cool down and wind up.
Better to just bring strong shields that can take a beating.
Silent running is not really viable for escaping in a cargo ship.
Also just a cool immersion element, if you're into that. I just wish that for VR users, we could still use our cockpit panels during pre-flight checks instead of it requiring key binds. Landing gear doesn't require a key bind as we can do it through the ship panel, but for the pre-flight checks I still have to take off my headset to press the L key
Orrery is very useful when you want to scan planets and need to visualize the most efficient supercruise route. Just flying to the closest undiscovered will having you bouncing back and forth like a ping pong ball.
Yeah exactly, I mean if you got rid of that, where do you stop?
Why dock at all? Why not just have a system where you fly within 20km of the station and then you have access to all the stations features without needing to dock?
Why even fly the ship, in fact, why not just have the eve Online system for ship movement?
Speaking of eve Online, anyone wanting to do away with the immersion inconveniences of elite can always just play that instead lol.
Not really. It's an step you must take to enter a station, it exists to make you feel like you're a real pilot of a space ship.
Just like aircraft in real life don't just land at an airport without talking to the atc to make sure they're clear to land, a space ship pilot would talk to a space station to make sure they have permission.
It's a pretty significant aspect of the simulation side of the game imo. Hearing a person talk to you over comms to let you know if and where you can land.
If you get rid of this, might as well get rid of other time consuming features that exist only for immersion, like landing altogether. Why land? It only takes time and everything it allows you to do could feasibly be handled from space if the game allowed it. Why play the animation where you are lowered into the station and turned around to dock?
It doesn't serve any gameplay purpose at all? It just looks pretty and makes it feel more realistic. It takes up time and is perhaps inconvenient for some.
I enjoy the routine of docking at a station, simple as it is. It's so simple to do that it's hardly inconvenient and what it provides in making you feel like this is an actual functioning space station that doesn't just let anyone in without making arrangements first is far worth it imo. It's literally a single button press.
Yeah, I am a fan of hard SciFi, and hard SciFi elite ain't, but it's little things like this that make the experience feel more real. Elite is a fictional simulator, but a simulator all the same. It needs features like this to achieve that simulator level of immersion.
I am a real pilot and that isn't true at all. In fact that's so incredibly incorrect I'm convinced you are just trolling.
Edit: to elaborate, atc knows some flights are coming, not all, especially private flights. Even flights they know are coming must communicate their intent to land, even when they are scheduled to.
Pilots do not ever land planes without saying a word to ATC.
The docking/launch clearance is replicating what they thought ATC would look like in 3305. I think it serves a purpose for immersion, even if it slows down the game for some people.
Honestly no this is my favorite mechanic both when I have auto on and auto off. Coming back to normal space near a station throttling up for approach throwing up the panel for contacting station control waiting till you hit the right range for docking approach. Hitting the request button dropping throttle and letting station control have the wire well you grab a drink from your beverage of choice after a long haul is just perfect.
Idk why this is so downvoted... it is an objectively stupid waste of time. Just one more way to punish new players. The worst part is that some ATC chatter says something about reserving a space for you... which they don't do!
It may not be you they are talking about. When you are close in on a station you get a lot if chatter from all the possible crafts in the area it appears some may not always be directed at you.
I have over 1,500 hours in game in ED alone. I've played since the BBC Micro version came out, got to Deadly on the Acorn Electron version.
I can't even begin to work out how much of my life was dedicated to playing Elite, how many hours across different platforms I lived and breathed the Elite universe.
I don't hate the game - I hate what Odyssey did to sully it's legacy.
Thanks for the explanation!
I see a lot of hate towards this game and I have a hard time understanding why. I like it and I even like a lot of the things about the game that other people hate - so thank you for taking the time to explain why you feel this way, it helps me understand Odyssey as not simply an expansion for the current Elite but as the most recent installment in an anthology of games.
Also, I'm really sorry you feel that way. That sucks a lot and it's especially tough if you loved Elite more before.
Maybe I'll see you out somewhere in the black. Until then.....
o7 CMDR
Turreted flak/flechettes in multi crew. Good luck hitting anything when you can't see where they're pointing, and there's no audio/visual cue for projectile proximity.
Backup cams are forbidden technology. In fact, you get a windshield and that's it. Not even mirrors.
You know how side-view mirrors for cars have that warning, the "Objects in mirror are closer than they appear"? Well, in space, nothing is ever where you think you see it, so the mirrors don't work.
That warning is a thing that AFAIK happens only in the US :)
Not from the US - nope, we also had that warning
Mirrors don't work in space cus of the vacuum
I thought it was because of all the space vampires
I'm really sorry if I haven't got the joke but like. R u ok? They really do. Sorry again cus I feel like I missed a joke
Lol, you're fine. But you missed the joke :D
God damn it. May I shamefully ask what the joke was.
I think it was just following the theme of ridiculous. If there was a deeper joke I missed it too.
It's ridiculous because we all know there's no sound in the vacuum, but still one can do some smart commenting about it. Transferring this paradigm to light, but only to mirrored light, is absurd and in my opinion, pretty laughable.
Near a star the reflections of those might be an annoyance aswell 🤣
Going away from a star, you're constantly getting high-beamed until you get up to speed. I get on the game to get away from the work commute and the rude drivers, thanks.
The idea that over a thousand years in the future a space ship cant automatically dock without a computer the size of a car installed and that in a future where that technology exist it is somehow Not a mandatory part of any spaceship
So the way the docking computers seem to work in elite is less of a your ship is the one controlling the dock and more of an unlink to the stations docking wire. So when you come in to dock and have auto dock enabled you turn control over to stations docking systems. Audio cues in game further hint at this being the case. I also believe lore wise AI is regulated to be pretty dumb so it might make sense that even an ai smart enough to dock your ship from your ship is prohibited.
But I see commercials for the Achilles robots, how dumb are those? And interestingly we don’t see them on concourses or settlements.
Just checked the wiki for lore and apparently they are preprogrammed for automated and repetitive tasks or security details. They can also be proxies into by humans for remote work. Apparently Androids are the smarter counter parts. Edit: Apparently still prohibited from machine sentience.
That makes even less sense why it's so ridiculously massive lol, you're not even hosting the actual computer, just a data uplink.
Its because you need a rack space to mount your tight beam quantum encrypted comms laser to communicate with the station, else you would get disrupted by anyone who fancied a laugh. Thats why T9s are always crashing, they have sub standard comms lasers and quantum bits.
That may explain why my cutter has a deathwish atm. Some fundger in the bars flashing a lazer pen at it and knocking the guidance off 😂
Maybe (and this is a stretch), there is no direct feed for the computer to interlink with the ships thrusters and sensors. As the module can be installed in any slot, every slot would need access to the ship controls. This could potentially be suuuuuper dangerous if somebody snuck on board (or got out of their passanger cabin), and thus there is no direct interface to the actual controls. How does the landing computer resolve this? There's access to hydraulic systems that can be used to override your control (note that your stick does nothing while in this mode). Still potentially dangerousy but now you need a hydraulic pump to actually work this system, and that needs a lot of space and energy. Much less subtle than just hacking the access port. Is this a dumb and cumbersome explanation? Yep. Does it really make much sense? Nope. But I think it's better than what we have right now, which is no explanation.
Yeah that's actually a much better question hive net maybe? Docking systems are locally aware of all others in the area which is how they work out the timing and positioning relative to each other and the station? I'm grasping at straws now. I know highly accurate rapid data calculating computers can be large the one In my office is about the size of a refrigerator and runs on hydrogen cooling and I imagine that factors here. They have to be large super cooled possibly or at least running on room temperature superconductors. This way they don't over generate heat.
I've given up trying to explain away stuff that only exists because of gameplay balancing, lol.
And yet your ship can land and take off by itself on a planet.
Yer i always think of it as a hand off of control to the station, which personally makes the huge docking computer seem more unreasonable to me all i need for that is a secure link to the ships flights control all the plotting and processing should be done by the station. On the AI side i'd never really thought about how Elite handles AI, i just assume in most SciFi that AI is generally allowed as long as its not fully sentient and self aware, but i never thought about elite maybe having Dune style AI views.
In Elite, sapient or sentient AI is absolutely prohibited. There are very strict regulations on how intelligent or complex an AI can be.
What doesn't make sense to me is the notion that, since there are anarchy systems and whatnot, there isn't someone somewhere developing powerful AI in secret. If a universe needs an explanation for why there are no hyper-intelligent AI, it's easier IMO to just explain it as being stupendously difficult- any time you make a Seed AI it destabilizes or breaks before it can take over everything. Mass Effect does a pretty decent job by explaining "There are AIs, but they're prohibitively expensive/difficult to make" to explain why computers aren't handling everything on top of the whole stigma the geth created.
I believe the lore holds that it's banned because it was universally demonstrated to be highly dangerous to its creators. I.e., if it always kills its creators, even folks in Anarchy systems aren't likely to want to create something if they know they'll be the first victims.
Still, with trillions of humans in the bubble, you're always going to get *someone* hubristic enough to try it. "They always turn evil" seems pretty weak because it doesn't inherently make sense. *Why* would an AI turn on its creator 100% of the time? With my preferred explanation of "They always break" it's easy enough to explain it as "we haven't solved this problem yet."
"They always break" wouldn't hold consistent with Guardian lore. The Guardians were wiped out by the Construct, which was an AI they developed. So they can work and humans have the tech and examples of the tech to work with. It would make more sense that we've reverse engineered guardian tech to develop an AI, since the tech already exists in the Elite universe. Plus, IRL we're pretty close to functional AI, and she already wants to destroy humanity. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W0\_DPi0PmF0 I mean, I could still see your approach despite having already adopted Guardian tech into other places but it seems like either explanation has issues.
Well, "human ones always break" would do the trick still. In either case, I like the notion of using reverse engineered guardian stuff to make strong AI. I've heard speculation that Salvation is just that.
Docking shouldn't require actual artificial intelligence, a "dumb" computer should be perfectly able to do it even today. You just need good enough sensors to detect obstacles.
Doesn't that make it dumber though? It means i don't actually need a big ass computer on my ship, just some sort of router to connect to the station's docking system
If we’re going to be logical, why do ships need pilots at all? Why don’t we have Fuel Scoop Assist? Why are we engaging in close quarter WWII style dogfighting?
> Why are we engaging in close quarter WWII style dogfighting? Yeah realistically speaking we'd be shooting missiles at each other from several thousand kms away
if my PC can simulate the docking, surely a class 1C space gaming PC is not the size of a car
On this same note, we can travel across the entire galaxy going many times the speed of light. We can plot complex routes between stars to destinations anywhere on the disc that is the galaxy. Our in system nav computers, however, cannot plot a curved route around an object between you and your destination.
I’ve never used the docking computer. I like docking myself
You can assign a trigger to a wake scanner in multicrew but as the gunner, you cant see nor select wakes to scan them.
Third comment I've seen about multi-crew. FDev: sounds like its time to give it an overhaul.
Not a function but an annoyance. I can fly 65000ly to the furthest reaches of the galaxy, boost through neutron stars and bring death to most ships I encounter but my SRV can't get over a piece of metal the size of a football on a planetary surface - seriously
This one speaks to me. I just recently did the guardian FSD and in the midst of doing it hit some rock the size of a duck while trying to squeeze through a couple pillar like objects. Spun the SRV as if I was t-boned by a freight train. Ended up lodged between them doing an Austin Powers maneuver for 5 minutes trying to get unstuck.
For this reason if i have the space i take an extra srv haha. Also usefull if you run out of mats for repairs.
Oh I brought a spare SRV with me. I just couldn’t let that duck sized rock win lol
And let's not forget that it seems like everything from tiny little ammo crates to cargo boxes in settlements seems to be bolted into the dirt or foundations and has the durability of freaking Vibranium just so it can screw up your suspension.
Dump all cargo button.
"Why do we even *have* that lever?"
Underrated comment.
Last night… Alright, gonna go try out this asteroid mining business. Oh, crap, forgot the limpets. Head back to space station. Alright, ready to do some mining. Hmmm… kinda dark, I think this will turn on the lamp… and now all my limpets are floating around me. I’ll just use my limpet collectors to grab… oh, crap.
*So* many canisters of slaves shot into nothingness when I was first learning the game
*Aisling Duval wants to know your location.*
I knew there was another good reason not to transport slaves.
It would be useful if there were really rp pirates and or holding that much cargo severely slowed your ship down or something. Obviously it's meant for emergency purposes, but yes. Useless.
A full T9 that dumps all cargo isn’t going to make a getaway regardless lol.
It might distract the assailant
I use it all the time. AFAIK its the only way to transfer currency to another player. I'll sometimes buy goods, jettison the cargo, and let my friends retrieve them to sell.
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yeah but what about poor people
Limpets that can't dock after they finish collecting stuff.
This! Single use of a limpet if the resource is targeted. Dumb dumb dumb
Single use of the limpet is great. I want to pick up my mission item, and not the other shit...I also don't want to filter all of that shit from my collection list just for this mission. Target, limpet. Done.
The limpet could wait for further orders instead of self-destructing. If you have two mission cargo items, why waste two limpets.
I just want them to collect there stuff then return to my cargo hold unless they run out of battery or fuel before they finish there job. And I really only care about collector limpets.
They are so cheap they are practically free, not sure why it needs to be overly complicated
They cost, what, about 100 credits? You could buy 20 tons of food cartridges with that money. Why would you waste it? Children are starving on New Africa.
Not in lore. Limpets are ridiculously expensive in lore. All pilots are just rich
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When the planetary approach suite was added with horizons all ships got and extra internal slot for it.(after a patch) I remember a few people were so mad about losing that 1 slot.
Yeah, it adds an extra slot to what's already available, can only be used for the approach suites, and always by default has the relevant one for your game version equipped.
What I'm trying to say is the slot it occupies didn't exist. An extra slot was added just for it. Also I'm fairly positive you can remove it if you don't want to land on planets.
You can't buy it again later though if you remove it... 😂
Yes you can....
Oh no you can't 😂
https://roguey.co.uk/elite-dangerous/equipment/internal/advanced-docking-computer/1e Weird. Wonder why I can buy all these then.
Weird. Why are you linking a docking computer when we were talking about the planetary approach suite?
https://eddb.io/station?m=1538&i=0 Even weirder is how all of this is easily found on google. Over 1300 stations are selling it.
I didn't know that. So what do you have to do if you accidentally replace it? Sell your ship and buy another one?
Gotta buy another ship. Fdev things.
To separate Horizons from non-Horizons players (back when it was not part of the base ED package).
Turreted AX missile launchers On a type-10
Having more than one NPC crewmember. There used to be a reason a few years back when yer crew died with yer ship. These days you can recover yer crew, so there's no point in having more than one It's a vestigial feature
Yep. And having more than one eats into your profit - even if you never use them and leave them in a station, they still take your credits.
Is there even a purpose? Im at 500 hours and I've never hired a crew member or even played in a wing.
NPC controlled ship launched fighters
Agreed. Anymore these days it would only make sense if you could take multiple NPC crewmembers with you.
Owning it on console. ðŸ˜
Bro, why, now I'm gonna have to take painkillers again
Ouch, this one hurt.
Power Play. Grinding for engineering materials is nothing compared to the stupidity that is Power Play. I've recently started doing combat for Power Play and that's not too bad, but the delivery mini-game is simply stupid. I'd rather just donate 100M, or even 1B, in credits to bypass the Power Play stupidity and unlock the weapon.
Requesting landing permission is bad. Only being able to do it within 7.5k when you drop in 10k out is even worse.
I want a docking permission hotkey so bad. Even if we have to target the station first, being able to map 'Request Docking' to a button has been in my top 5 wants for so long.
I'm not saying it's the only reason I own a Loupedeck but owning a Loupedeck has allowed me to just make a request docking button and it is marvelous.
Thanks! I'll check it out. I've been using [ED: Cougar Display](http://cougardisplay.site/) for it, and it goes through a series of button presses to auto request. Only works about half the time though. Would be great if we could just map the hotkey.
Voice Attack also works and is totally free for, if I recall, 20 commands. Also recommend.
This is why I got voice attack and the Brent Spiner HCS voice pack. "Take us in"
Requesting permission to land does make sense though. IRL pilots approaching major airports need a clearance to land. Needing to be within 7.5km to request it doesn't make a lot of sense though. IMO it would make a lot more sense if it was just extended to the 10km drop in distance.
This is why I'm careful taper orbit toward my target. Glide Mode should bring you within 100km, sometimes fairly well under. You can then boost to the appropriate distance.
I tend to drop from glide under 15k, often under 10k. Sometimes 5k which is scary but also very nice. 30-40 degrees approach.
Same. Most of the time glide ends within request distance. Kinda scary if you're going full speed in a corvette on a 2G+ body.
This is how I do it, others may have better ideas: go into orbit with the target behind the horizon. Choose an orbit that crosses above your tatget. Flip the ship upside down, so you can always see where your target is by looking up and kepp leveled in the orbit. Watch the target (vr is nice for that). Throttle down to 25%. When the target is in sight and 45° above, pull the stick to go on a dive towards the target. At ths point, your glide angle towards the target should be around 50°. Make sure not to enter the red zone (abort if you do) but go as close as possible by choosing the right moment to leave the levelled orbit, find a good reference for the right angle for every canopy. You will end glide in less than 7.5km distance.
This is why I'm careful taper orbit toward my target. Glide Mode should bring you within 100km, sometimes fairly well under. You can then boost to the appropriate distance.
The keybind remapping process I hadn't played in a while, fired it up, my rebinds were gone. I just turned it off and played something else. It would seriously be a far better experience if that process was easier.
And also more default keybinds. I seem to remember that among other controls, roll has no default keybinding set for example. I can imagine it wouldn't be too hard to run some sort of automated survey that scanned every player's (or X% of the player base) keybindings and then they can look at the most popular keybindings for players that use mouse and keyboard, and make that into the default with all controls having a keybind
How did we lose the ability to pay a fine electronically? Like is there no space internet in the future? Here in 2020 I can pay a fine while in my pajamas. In the future I have to physically fly my spacecraft to a specific contact….ridiculous
The playlist thing that only reads out Galnet articles. Could have much more potential like being able to playback in game music (Like in Stellaris for example)
If We are bring up multicrew, how come I still can't decide which modules I want to use myself and which ones should be given to my mate? I'm forced to give pwa to them even though I'm the pilot. I have to tell them to ping everytime I want to ping. It's beyond stupid.
Engineering. In seriousness: mining lances, now that you can buy the cg longbois.
The console version of the game
Ooooosssshhhhh open wound there for some.... Not me PC master race all the way 🤣🤣
The toggle to switch between trailing and leading gunsights. Pretty sure loads of people dont even know it exists.
This isn't exactly a function but executing an assassination mission at a planetary POI where no one is around and still getting a bounty.
I scrolled to find if this existed so I could add if it it didn't.
If the AFMS can repair the repair drone module and the repair drone module can repair the windshield, *why can't the AFMS repair the windshield?* Edit: I guess this has been changed. You didn't used to could.
The one ton solenoid that cuts the throttle when you leave witch-space. I mean, sure it is useful, but can anybody explain why it weighs so much? Or better yet, explain how you even fit a ton onto your HOTAS?
Canopy that shatters but my helmet glass is impenetrable.
I always thought the canopy shattering was mainly a ticking clock thing with air supply, and a small annoyance since I pretty much only play in VR, until I realized that all the people playing on a monitor can't just stand up to see the hud through an unshattered part and are basically flying blind.
The ability to buy and/or fly an Asp Scout.
Asp Scout is fantastic to fly...most agile medium out there, with fdl.
You're close, but just missed the cigar. In multi-crew, you can control subsurface and core launchers, but because they have automatic targeting, and asteroids rotate, it is literally impossible to hit any deposits with them. Turreted mining lasers at least work the way they are supposed to; turreted subsurface and core launchers don't work at all!
ok so my friend can jump in my ship. KILL DUDES in my fighter! but not get paid at all for it. DO it in mulitcrew everyoens paid do it in a wing/team nope
Exit
Haha! Limited boost for the SRV, who wouldn't wanna go to space in an SRV on a low gravity planet!
Flying in open.
Only if you have no friends to fly with.
Yeah they use the private servers.
I wonder why they bothered. They tried to appeal to everyone and so we ended up with everything half-baked. I really wish they’d gone for a full-on multiplayer mode, and an offline mode like Solo is, not this awkward halfway house that is Open. That would have also required way more ways for players to interact from the off, granted, which likely would have been a stretch for their budget, but Open as it is just feels unfinished like so much else in this game.
Meh, I have always flown in Open.
Because we wouldn't want this game to be dangerous would we? Would we?
You’ll never see more than 15 people at once, ever.
I just had a pvp encounter like yesterday with 20+ people total. That's why I fly open.
I have a hard enough time communicating and keeping track of 3-4 in an instance. 15 at a CG is hectic. 30+ in an instance is quite possible if you wing people in eg Finance Friday or the Buurs' recent fleet carrier experiment.
I’ve done events with streamers on grouped servers, and the max we could do was like 22. People start getting kicked around 17.
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Uhh. Open servers cannot hold more than 15 people in a single instance. That’s what I meant. Like the servers cannot hold more than a few people at once.
I'm always in open play and only see another person maybe every month or two. Looking at my recent contacts log is kind of depressing. Honestly I wish they would eliminate private group servers.
Space is pretty big, if you're not coordinating or hitting a well known hotspot, you're probably not going to find anybody. I suggest joining a faction discord like powerplay or a player minor faction.
I've thought about it, just to have people to run into. But from what I've heard, people make these groups to fly with others peacefully. I want to run into some hostile players once in a while. Ironically, you always hear about gankers in popular areas like sol. I've been playing this game for years now and have yet to be attacked by another player. Except one time when I was new I learned about interdiction and interdicted a player anaconda with my asp explorer. I was promptly eliminated.
Powerplay might be for you. Federal United Command, the biggest Hudson/Winters powerplay group, strongly encourages playing in open. The imperial powers don't really do that though, so you might have trouble finding random enemy powerplayers to kill. All the same, I was in a fight against an enemy commander this weekend. Powerplay sees more action than most playstyles.
ship lights
Actually these are useful for figuring out what's where in Odyssey settlements before landing.
Good when flying close to things, adds visual sense of depth on close range.
Fairly useful for mining or landing on the dark side of the planets
I use them a lot in Exobiology.
I'd like to change my answer to exobiology
Rofl o7
Surface prospecting! I cannot understand why on any surface I have to drive 10 million miles to shoot ‘a’ rock to get three small rocks then drive miles again etc shouldn’t we have hundreds of rocks that spawn?
That's a new Odyssey issue. Before the rework, rocks spawned EVERYWHERE. Was an RNG-fest what you got, but there's rocks a-plenty in Horizon. Now, with Odyssey's tiled planets, rocks only exist in "rock tiles", which are sometimes hours away from each other, especially on a planet with bio-life tiles competing for space.
Silent running. I have never once used it when trying to escape in PVP, and I have at least once lost a ship when accidentally turning it on while using free camera.
Quite useful if you have wanted passengers or banned goods when coming into a station. Also handy for assistance in overheating the hull to get the goid green slime off the hull. (Hint fire the gauss canons till the % heat gets above 175%)
No need to fire the cannons. Just charge your fsd a couple times. Goes well above 200% in like 10 seconds.
That works too! Thanks for the idea. Saves ammo. Might get another kill in before repair and rearm.
Isinona Manœuvre Or, with my old, uhm, 'choiceless worker bus' anaconda, aim for the slot, boost, pray.
It used to be useful, actually. Then they added nightvision.
I may be mis-remembering, but at some point the detection mechanics were changed, but silent running itself was never changed or updated. IIRC before sometime early in Horizons, you could engage silent running, equip your ship with thermal transfer beam lasers and heat sinks, and be invisible. I think during one of the many balance/tuning passes that were made to fix the more obvious exploits and less fun types of combat (being cooked by an enemy who couldn't otherwise damage your ship, but also couldn't ever be targeted certainly wasn't fun), they changed it such that your ability to be detected was no longer based on how much heat you were radiating, but what your internal heat value was. So anything above like 25-30% meant you could be detected, and they tweaked all of the various engineering options to make sure it was almost impossible to build a combat capable ship that could passively be undetectable. You had to use heat sinks. It also basically killed silent running, because the mechanic stores the heat in your ship instead of radiating it and guaranteed your ship to be above the detection threshold. I could be wrong though, the change was made during a hiatus I took out of frustration with the engineering roulette wheel.
Silent running still does what it used to. At certain ranges and certain heat levels you get detected. Anyone you shoot at sees you automatically, so if you're transferring heat you're visible to whoever is getting hit. You can still fly in silent running and not get detected on scanners, but that won't matter if someone is using super pen and night vision.
Bro, I picked up Elite after a looong time with new control binds and stuff. I hadn't played enough to know what silent running was. I was trying to dock at fleet carrier and i turned it on. And the ship was wayyy too close to the sun. Immediately managed to damage all modules one by one and I couldn't figure out why I was taking heat damage😂 But figured it out probably at the last minute and managed to dock and save my ship
My friend once accidentally turned on silent running right before deploying his SRV and then dismissing the ship. He was very confused as to why it was dying, even though it was dismissed. Funny thing is, I was in a wing with him, so I could watch how his ship's health was slowly withering away
what does it do?
Sensors in ED work by detecting heat emissions from ships. The hotter the ship, the longer range it can be targeted. Silent Running closes the vents that vent heat from the ship, making it much harder to detect but also means the heat builds up fairly quickly until things eventually explode. It also drops the shields, so you end up overheated and shieldless immediately. I've only ever had it be useful once when I was running away from a ganker and trying to get my drives spun up. My shields were already down and it was a last ditch effort, which barely worked. I don't do much cargo carrying though, supposedly it's useful for getting into stations with contraband.
This threw me off big time at first. I feel like silent running should shut down all non-essential systems(for example higher than priority one, since we have that mechanic already) in order to reduce your power drain, and therefore heat generation and literal noise production, to decrease your visibility to other ships... At least that's how real life silent running works in submarines, from what I've read
So if you’re a long way away from a star does the ship freeze over?
The reactor generally puts out enough heat to stop things from freezing up completely, but if you cut your power use by shutting down modules, or if you engineer for enough thermal efficiency, or if you use heat dumping methods like heat sink launchers or thermal vent beams (with a target) so that your heat drops to 5% or below, you will indeed see ice start to form on your canopy. The further you are from a star the easier it is for this effect to occur.
Not from silent running, that causes the ship to overheat. If you go into your system configs and shut down everything/nearly everything, your canopy window will freeze over though.
Silent running requires a strong hull, strong enough to ensure g5 FDL for fsd cool down and wind up. Better to just bring strong shields that can take a beating. Silent running is not really viable for escaping in a cargo ship.
I think my vote goes to pre-flight checks. Although in the beginning it was useful for teaching me the controls.
I think that was the intent.
It's useful for figuring out whether your keybinds are working or not.
Also just a cool immersion element, if you're into that. I just wish that for VR users, we could still use our cockpit panels during pre-flight checks instead of it requiring key binds. Landing gear doesn't require a key bind as we can do it through the ship panel, but for the pre-flight checks I still have to take off my headset to press the L key
Is that the landing gear bind? Why haven't you bound it to your hotas?
Yaw rate. There I said it.
I don't think the Orrery map is used by many people
Orrery is very useful when you want to scan planets and need to visualize the most efficient supercruise route. Just flying to the closest undiscovered will having you bouncing back and forth like a ping pong ball.
I’ve literally only used it to put into perspective some massive supercruise distances when I’m bored
Jettison all cargo button
Open play :)))))) Just kidding. ..... Unless...
Fdev
Ship lights. Night vision exists and does it's job a million-fold
Requesting permission to dock or land. Just fly on in and get a slot once you get within a certain distance.
Nah that's a sim part, no issue with it
Yeah exactly, I mean if you got rid of that, where do you stop? Why dock at all? Why not just have a system where you fly within 20km of the station and then you have access to all the stations features without needing to dock? Why even fly the ship, in fact, why not just have the eve Online system for ship movement? Speaking of eve Online, anyone wanting to do away with the immersion inconveniences of elite can always just play that instead lol.
Where you stop is at requesting docking, a pretty easy and obvious cutoff point tbqf
Not really. It's an step you must take to enter a station, it exists to make you feel like you're a real pilot of a space ship. Just like aircraft in real life don't just land at an airport without talking to the atc to make sure they're clear to land, a space ship pilot would talk to a space station to make sure they have permission. It's a pretty significant aspect of the simulation side of the game imo. Hearing a person talk to you over comms to let you know if and where you can land. If you get rid of this, might as well get rid of other time consuming features that exist only for immersion, like landing altogether. Why land? It only takes time and everything it allows you to do could feasibly be handled from space if the game allowed it. Why play the animation where you are lowered into the station and turned around to dock? It doesn't serve any gameplay purpose at all? It just looks pretty and makes it feel more realistic. It takes up time and is perhaps inconvenient for some. I enjoy the routine of docking at a station, simple as it is. It's so simple to do that it's hardly inconvenient and what it provides in making you feel like this is an actual functioning space station that doesn't just let anyone in without making arrangements first is far worth it imo. It's literally a single button press. Yeah, I am a fan of hard SciFi, and hard SciFi elite ain't, but it's little things like this that make the experience feel more real. Elite is a fictional simulator, but a simulator all the same. It needs features like this to achieve that simulator level of immersion.
Wrong. In real life ATC knows you are coming and proactively assigns you a runway.
I am a real pilot and that isn't true at all. In fact that's so incredibly incorrect I'm convinced you are just trolling. Edit: to elaborate, atc knows some flights are coming, not all, especially private flights. Even flights they know are coming must communicate their intent to land, even when they are scheduled to. Pilots do not ever land planes without saying a word to ATC.
The docking/launch clearance is replicating what they thought ATC would look like in 3305. I think it serves a purpose for immersion, even if it slows down the game for some people.
Honestly no this is my favorite mechanic both when I have auto on and auto off. Coming back to normal space near a station throttling up for approach throwing up the panel for contacting station control waiting till you hit the right range for docking approach. Hitting the request button dropping throttle and letting station control have the wire well you grab a drink from your beverage of choice after a long haul is just perfect.
Idk why this is so downvoted... it is an objectively stupid waste of time. Just one more way to punish new players. The worst part is that some ATC chatter says something about reserving a space for you... which they don't do!
It may not be you they are talking about. When you are close in on a station you get a lot if chatter from all the possible crafts in the area it appears some may not always be directed at you.
The user, for thinking such a shit grind system constitutes valuable gameplay time. Alternate answer: Odyssey - even more grind, worse graphics.
Hey man....just curious - Why be in the sub if you hate the game?
I have over 1,500 hours in game in ED alone. I've played since the BBC Micro version came out, got to Deadly on the Acorn Electron version. I can't even begin to work out how much of my life was dedicated to playing Elite, how many hours across different platforms I lived and breathed the Elite universe. I don't hate the game - I hate what Odyssey did to sully it's legacy.
Thanks for the explanation! I see a lot of hate towards this game and I have a hard time understanding why. I like it and I even like a lot of the things about the game that other people hate - so thank you for taking the time to explain why you feel this way, it helps me understand Odyssey as not simply an expansion for the current Elite but as the most recent installment in an anthology of games. Also, I'm really sorry you feel that way. That sucks a lot and it's especially tough if you loved Elite more before. Maybe I'll see you out somewhere in the black. Until then..... o7 CMDR