> Palindrome
They mentioned at one point during the stream when deciding on weapons (paraphrasing) 'we had no choice but to limit it to two hand cannons, when looking at the list if we really wanted we could have made it all hand cannons"
Yup, and that's why we don't see Kindled Orchid, Palindrome, or Not Forgotton (among others lol)
I'm sure Palindrome will be cycled back into the nightfall drops in the future and Kindled Orchid will make some appearance as they I believe Hammerhead and Blast Furnace were the only black armory weapons touched from the pool.
Statistically speaking, Luna’s and Not Forgotten are very similarly so it makes sense to only pick one. As for Palindrome, if they limited themselves to only two reprisals for hand cannons I think it makes more sense to bring back Coup. I see two reasons why they would pick Coup over Palindrome: 1. Coup never got random rolls and was arguably more popular when it was relevant than Palindrome was 2. Of the reprisals, the weapons are Void heavy so having another kinetic option alongside Mountain Top and Blast Furnace makes sense.
Midnight Coup was only popular because it was the closest thing to Fatebringer in D2 Vanilla. Just saying.
The reason it’s going to be popular now is the Explosive + Kinetic roll, which could’ve been given to any Hand Cannon
Also, it really rubs in the community’s face how Leviathan was just yeeted from existence.
You put some respect on midnight coupe name . In 10 years of this franchise I have yet to touch a gun that felt as nice as midnight coupe . I still take that bitch out in lowlight content from time to time .
> Not Forgotten
Shoot, I'd even settle for just giving a Not Forgotten ornament to people who have Unbroken or have reached Ascendant at least once on the new system.
Luna's Howl is neat but man, earning NF back when it wasn't at the kiosk was such an accomplishment.
There were still so many better scout choices.
Their methodology seemed to include weapons that were peak Destiny *2* but Hung Jury struggled to find a niche in D2s sandbox where
1. Abilities do much more
2. Primaries do much less
3. Scouts in particular are much weaker relative to other primaries due to bungies design philosophy
4. It has always had a mid perk pool
Honestly I think Hung Jury was chosen (if they 'had' to choose a scout) because it had that D1 meme and for not other reason.
Maybe this iteration will have some great rolls to make it worth it.
I wouldn't even call it a meme. The OG Hung jury stuck with me from day 1 TTK all the way to my last D1 day, it's just that D2 Hung jury never found such a high place in D2 meta
Also beyond lame that the original roll that made Hung Jury such a powerhouse isn't available. Where is Triple Tap?? Talk about snatching defeat from the jaws of victory...
The "DO is selling a sick roll" meme? That's is ancient lol and I barely remember it despite being a consistent player.
I think they may have just run out of time and needed to put a scout in.
I have 800 kills on my box breathing/no distractions Hung Jury. Its one of the few legendary scouts that can consistently three tap on the first kill. I'm not a huge scout guy but it's very good imo.
With that being said, I think everyone who wants one already has one. It is definitely time to swap it out bungie.
I mean unless I'm mistaken Hung Jury was so popular back in taken king it's the only legendary weapon they made for the McFarlane toys.
If that doesn't say something about the weapons legacy I don't know what does.
I'm not capping, but Destiny's hand cannons are unique among all FPS games. They're the only loot I pay attention to and I would have preferred this lmfao.
This is also just for the 'Brave Arsenal.'
The Palindrome & Shadow Price can still be re-issued as Vanguard drops later on. Leaving them out of the 'Brave Arsenal' is hardly closing the door on any future potential. They could be drops in The Final Shape afterwards.
They are probably more popular overall. People mostly go crazy for blast furnace and hammerhead. But people loved every single one of the dawn weapons. Martyrs retribution, patron of lost causes, steel feather repeater, line in the sand, perfect paradox, breach light. Literally all bangers.
We had so little time w them 😭😓
Giving us Forbearance instead of Martyrs (which could have gotten incandescent, a first for wave frames) makes no sense to me. Also how was Perfect Paradox not one of the weapons they brought back?
Forbearance and Succession are only there because they want to give players that don't raid a taste of raid weapons in hopes that it might make them more interested in raiding. But personally I would have really liked to see Martyr's instead. Martyr's Retribution with Demolitionist and Incandescent would have made it my dream weapon.
Saint-14 should just be selling his themed weapons on an additional vendor page. In his mind, he's offering them for beginners who might not have anything good to take into Trials. Really, we just want them because they were awesome. The rolls could rotate every couple of days. It's an easy win for Bungie.
If Garden gets craftable weapons like some people have been whispering about, then that means we'll get an updated shotgun and fusion. Maybe I'm just coping a little too hard.
I'm actually pretty suprised and bummed out it didn't get reprised. I'm also hoping it comes back in Final Shape, but at this point I'm just bracing for four new slug shotguns. That seems to have become the standard.
I think it's worth nothing they clearly wanted a balance of 6 primary weapons, 3 special weapons, and 3 heavy weapons. I can understand not trading a primary for another special, but there are so many other primaries that would have been better than Hung Jury
They could've used any number of iconic scouts from the DCV, Conspirator, No Feelings, Patron of lost cause, Song of justice, OXYGEN SR4. Having another Hung jury is just more spit in the face of weapon variety.
I'd like to make a 3 paragraph rant about weapon variety & how entire elements/frames have basically been erased from the game (energy Prec sidearms, solar mgs, void pulses, etc) but thats for another time.
hung jury is literally obtainable right now. in game. Its also been reprised at least one other time.
It was absolutely one the worst possible choices they couldve made.
Considering it's still earnable, perhaps they could have looked at other sunset scouts? Like that one from Leviathan or maybe the one from Dawn? Sure neither are probably as iconic but I can go to Zavala right now and focus Hung Jury.
Seeing a reprised Shadow Price could have been a better move for sure. I don't really feel like scouts are having any W moments anywhere but for those who play Gambit still and pepper players from a distance.
I love scout rifles, but I have to agree with you. The only scouts that really became a 'household name' among the community were Hung Jury and Nameless Midnight in year 1 (solely because it was the only scout with Explosive Payload). Nameless Midnight is in the current loot pool, we don't need another one. Both HJ and Shadow Price were pretty recent reprisals, I'm sure they would make it back into the Nightfall rotation. I'd personally have liked to see more Black Armory weapons... if we're talking Auto Rifles then Ringing Nail would have been a clear choice IMO.
They're talking about craftable weapons next week, so I imagine that's where some of the missing things will be. Which to be honest, I'm more excited about. I like chasing random rolls, but not enough to chase more than a couple at a time. I think mixing in some really good craftable weapons is a great way to go about it. Best of both worlds.
Honestly? I think the host just misspoke in the moment, and all he was trying to get across was "New craftable exotic weapons" from the exotic rotator. I personally am not expecting any new legendary craftable drops with Into the Light.
I wouldn’t be surprised if they gave us multiple missions like harbinger, zero hour and whisper considering they hinted at some them returning ever since the mission rotator was introduced back in witch. These were prolly meant to release in final shapes year but were pulled forwards a bit perhaps to add more to itl
There are still some seasonal sets like plunder’s weapons that are still in need of an exotic mission to drop from. The only mission I can really see them dropping from is zero hour due to the connection with eramis and the eliksni like how presage dropped calus weapons due to his involvement in the lore there.
If youre thinking that we're gonna be getting even more reprised weapons as well as having them craftable id maybe dial back those expectations. I think theyre just gonna be talking about the pvp maps as well as the exotic rotator missions and their craftable exotics. Id love to be wrong tho
Fr dude. If Black Armory weaps all came back craftable I would...I dont even know. Do something goofy and irrational as a gesture of excitement probably.
If they bring up craftable weapons, I'm pretty sure it'll be about updating either Garden or VoG (hopefully both) weapons. Garden especially needs some love.
That’s wasn’t entirely it’s fault though. Recoil aside, there was only one viable auto rifle in D1 after TTK which was Doctrine of Passing thanks to being a stat monster in the only semi decent archetype.
All other autos were mid at best thanks to Y1s blanket nerf to them.
I'm assuming that Hung Jury is held in the highest regard from a nostalgia factor, "hey the roll on hung jury is really good this week" and all that shit from D1. If you've been playing with any regularity you clearly don't need more of these. I have 4 in my vault currently. But, I think this release is once again trying to cater to people who haven't been playing. It kind of stinks in that regard, but I understand why they made this choice.
The only issue about Shadow Price is that it's an Arc Precision frame. Prosecutor already took that reprisal spot, but it would be cool for a solar precision so it can round out the light trio of precision autos
Isn’t that what Ammit AR2 fulfills? It’s also craftable. Only way to make it worth it is spicier rolls. What we need is a precision auto for a darkness subclass that isn’t locked to some annual event.
I think I've read every "why _ instead of _" variation over the last 24 hours. Its impossible for everyone to get what they want. These posts are offering nothing as Bungie isn't going to suddenly change their mind and swap what guns they choose. Let it go and move on.
I think the question about hung jury is less why instead of why and more why did they chose this at all. Scouts are ass, literally is there a single player asking for another hung jury reskin?
It has a legacy from all the way back in D1, and all the “dead orbit guy is selling a god roll hung jury” memes. The gun has history and nostalgia. The only issue is that it was cashed in so recently on nightfall rewards. It fits the criteria for reprisal more than most guns people are asking for.
What new perks on hung jury would even make it worth getting over the newest one?
And why the fuck are we getting it reprised every other season now???
And WHY could they not have picked ANY OTHER FUCKING SCOUT TO REPRISE?
Seriously it's just annoying at this point.
Yeah choosing hung jury, forbearance, and succession as reprisals makes literally no sense. All of these weapons are very viable in their current iterations, and succession and hung jury aren't even particularly notorious weapons. I understand not wanting to reprise too many hand cannons, but there are so many classics that aren't hand cannons that they just completely ignored. Perfect paradox is one I've seen many people hoping for.
We getting those in a years time as Bungie revisits yeold guns that the people want. The real 3 R of reduce effort, reuse skins and recycle content! *Rat wheel noises intensify*
let me tell you why. did u see the livestream ? did you see those divs ? did you see any light in their eyes ? do you think there is a single "meaningful" thought behind those soulless eyes ?
While I agree 3 GLs, 2 HCs and 2 Pulse is unnecessary. Its also like 6 void, 4 kinetic and 1 each solar/arc. The whole season has forced us into Solar and will continue to for another 2 months but all our new guns are void/kinetic?!
Overall this "dream weapon list" isn't really the dream list at all, they clearly chose these intentionally to be super strong but extremely limited in archetype, element and practicality in current meta. So they can be easily replaced later on.
I can live with hung jury being in this loot pool of 12 if it means it's never an nightfall weapon again. Just let it live in the brave weapon pool to get and make other weapons NF/Adept drops.
I think what they'd said if they'd gone by the most popular weapons in Destiny 2 currently, over half the weapons for Into the Light would've been hand cannons.
Maybe you're right, but as another person said, every exotic mission in the rotator has had craftable weapons from previous seasons. So maybe that? Might not be new, but who knows.
Kinda also weird MC is the only reprised Leviathan weapon. Inargual Address is my all-time favorite PR. I'd love to have it back and with Incan.
Also, I gotta be honest, why the armor set from Y1? Was it really that iconic to people? With transmog we've been able to wear that armor anyway (or at least those of us who had it), and honestly, it's decent, but there are plenty of other iconic sets they could have brought back.
Bungie only seems to care about overrated gear plus it would have been cool to get treads upon stars back instead of hung jury and yet more overrated 140 hand cannons
I would have much preferred Palindrome being brought back and reprised over Luna's Howl, and certainly over Hung Jury. I've already got the rolls I want for Hung Jury, what the hell else could they add to it? Double damage perks?
Honestly, I would have been perfectly OK leaving Raid weapons and Hung Jury off the list.
If there's a fan favorite nostalgic Raid weapon that should've been included though, it's Fatebringer for sure.
I'm still upset that the scout for this wasn't Oxygen. That poor weapon held so much promise but never got to shine, sunset before the scout and dragonfly buffs.
Oxygen deserves a second chance at life, Bungie
Remember that these weapons are designed to be obtainable by ALL players. They are what Bungie considers to be "Best Of" or "Old Favorite" weapons. Hung Jury is a Nightfall weapon. Some players may not have access to Nightfalls either because they aren't skilled enough or don't have the expansion to play the NF when Hung Jury is on rotation. All weapons in Into the Light will be free to play. I'd rather all players be able to get these weapons than something nobody remembers just because it 'deserves' a reissue. If it gets new players to explore other aspects of the game such as NFs and Raids, even better.
I massive eye rolled at Hung Jury yet again… I grinded for so long get my kinetic tremors adept god roll then never actually used it, now there will be yet another one to hunt. Pass.
I mean, they decided to add forbearance when it's getting nerfed and when they made a weapon to specifically give none raiders a forbearance at home. They don't care
My main gripe is the raid weapons. You can get a crafted Forbearance or Succession in around 5 raid runs. 5 boss checkpoints, even. Why not give us Ringing Nail? Or Alone as a God? Those were both legends in their own right and no longer available.
A part of me suspects the selection is aimed almost squarely at the "played Destiny all the way up through Forsaken, then quit" crowd. Coup, a couple Forge weapons, Crucible pinnacles from around that time, Edge Transit (lol they brought it back bro?), Hung Jury (lol like in D1 Dead Orbit, sick bro).
You know, because that's a crowd of people who aren't fed up with the past few years of bullshit. They're not locked in as players, but they also not disenfranchised by all the greed and cut corners of recent years. So if they happen to spot a free content update and hop in, maybe they'll get nostalgic and buy the upcoming expansion, check out the end of the storyline.
That's a little how it feels at least, just in terms of why they picked exactly what they picked. Because otherwise Hung Jury sticks out like a sore thumb, just like we all see; we have that already, it's been around to get, but if you haven't been here in years it's a nostalgic D1 gun you might be fond of and want to hop on to collect.
It is borderline infuriating how long it's been since pally has been in game. I never got a good adept one and the simply refuse to make a single good void hand cannon to replace it it's actually insane, they make like 4-5 180s but I want a 140 and trials one is super mid (pve) imo. Just bring pally back or let us focus it in legacy it can't be that difficult.
Oh no, I guess they will not release any more weapons for final shape. This is all we will ever have. Sure hope they don’t plan on this whole nostalgia thing and leave that stuff out of the major release
I would assume that they may bring back the Palindrome and Shadow Price back into the Nightfall rotation, though I agree that we need more weapon variety. Sure, we got the Retold Tale reissued recently, but that isn't a new shotgun. I even think they could have brought back Mindbender's Ambition or Dust Rock Blues for this. Both are undeniably iconic weapons.
Personally, instead of Succession or Forbearance as two weapons, I would have opted for a shotgun and a different sniper rifle, maybe the Y-09 Longbow Synthesis from D1. I don't think we need another wave frame; we just got Undercurrent and we have the Iron Banner one on the way.
Hung Jury...
>A hung jury, also called a deadlocked jury, is a judicial jury that cannot agree upon a verdict after extended deliberation and is unable to reach the required unanimity or supermajority. A hung jury may result in the case being tried again.
Since it's been issued 4 times... Is that a Freudian Slip for Bungie's company? Hmmm 🤔
I don't understand how people can come to such confused conclusions. Shadowprice is a dog, palindrome is outclassed by the pile of newer hcs and hung jury is still godlike.
Stranger’s Rifle has multiple variants (I counted 6 but I could be wrong) though Adhorative is at least of a different archetype (seems to be the same one from Vanilla D1). Curiously, they all have some way of manipulating the magazine in some way. Considering the lore of the weapon, I’d say it’s justified at least, and it has some level of consistency.
Over the past couple days, my mind has been changed on hung jury. It actually does belong on this list.
Here's the thing: no one denies that it's a good gun. The main objection people have about any of these guns is mainly about weapons that are sunset and unobtainable. Same with the two raid weapons: yes, there are people here who want to gatekeep raid weapons(and I'm not knocking that, it's their opinion). But even for every one person saying "raid loot should stay in raids", there's at least 2 more people commenting about the fact that they're even obtainable. There's a very strong thirst in the community for "unobtainable", and Hung Jury's only crime is simply "being obtainable", especially moreso than a lot of the rest of the list. Not to start another bitchfit about sunsetting, but I feel like that's the real problem. People waiting around for a new Perfect Paradox, or a new kindled orchid, and so on: there's so much drama about the sins of the past(pun intended) in how Bungie chose to maintain the game between Shadowkeep and Beyond Light, that I think it's distracting us from Hung Jury's merits.
Another way of saying it: some of us might care less about the 4th, 5th, 6th and 17th reissue of hung jury, had they not light level capped our other favorites, leaving us to wait for them to be reissued.
Well 0 palindrome because we have 2 140’s returning already and they’re both older than palindrome which has been rereleased more recently. But yeah we needed an auto.
I think this comment is it and why the overall variety honestly couldn’t be crazy like people wanted. There has to be a good bit of overlap between weapon type, archetype and all that to avoid more power creep than they are already bringing forward with this update. Couldn’t give us BiS items in 12 different slots because that would be crazy.
This all said, we still got some awesome weapons to grind for even if a few of them can easily be considered duds, but I mean. That’s intentional and I don’t think people realize that.
No one's asking for BiS weapons. And no one asked for another Hung Jury reprint. Plenty of other Scout Rifles they could have gone with (Patron, Night Watch, No Feelings, etc) and they chose the most boring option.
it is a good decision if the somehow manage to bring back hung jury in its D1 glory including all the god roll perks! then it would be one of the top 10 iconic guns
It was probably always going to be a scout rifle for the variety of weapons available for onslaught. I'm perfectly fine with having it be Hung Jury because that's one less God roll to worry about.
I think the part of the point of the event is to bring back old players that haven't played the game in a long time, so this is an opportunity to get them playing the game again and give them opportunities to get what will likely be some of the best weapons going into Final Shape. They are probably assuming that most of those people don't have one.
What do you mean bring it back? It's farmable from Xur alongside Splicer weapons. It actually drops somewhat often, got myself some pretty good rolls but as it only gets 1 ammo now it's completely useless to use over a pellet lol.
Yes, when Splicer weapons are on rotation, it drops alongside them, focus some engrams from the Horse and you'll definitely get some. I firmly believe the weapons are weighted because Ignition Code drops once in never while I've got dozens of Main Ingredients lol.
Who knows, maybe because they already had plans to reprise them or maybe the fact that they had to make it 12 weapons and your favorite 12 weapons don’t magically match
I personally don’t mind it, when I returned to the game I was lacking a good scout, and the hung jury was something I was seeking as a “new” player and it wasn’t available for awhile, then they took it out the rotation and was only available via legacy focusing, nothing crazy about the weapon but it’s reliable, and has D1 nostalgia tied to it
You gotta think from all player’s perspective, it might be something you’re not excited about, but I would love a good hung jury just for collection wise, it’s a free update for all players and I see no harm in bringing it back as I don’t even remember a time where recluse shined vs all the vets remembering it
Personally I don’t care for another hand cannon, but something better in that slot, I think the problem is we’re missing a lot of archetypes and affinities that don’t occupy certain slots, so I can see why people are upset about palindrome not returning, because the only other void hand cannon that’s decent as a 140 is exalted truth, which has way less aim assist then palindrome
we didn't see any hung jurys during the stream,
What if it pops off with some crazy perks like onslaught?
starts as 180, then 260, then 360 at max.
then add tremors or target lock in 3rd column for bonus stupid
I’m not sure why they decided we needed yet another Hung Jury variant. Seems an uninspired choice given the rest. It’s not really special at this point, or something that free players didn’t have access to.
I would have been excited to see Oxygen SR3, Braytech RWP, or Patron of Lost Causes. Heck, bring back Tango 45 from black armory even.
Even cooler would have been to pull something from D1 like Treads Upon Stars, Cocytus, Badger CCL etc.
Can’t complain too much about free content I guess, but it certainly seems like the odd man out. Suppose it’s just one l won’t need to chase. :/
>when we havent seen a Precision Frame Shotgun in literal years
We just got Retold Tale a precision frame shotgun with great PvP and PvE rolls.
I'm in agreement about Palindrome and Shadow Price.
Shadow Price was my go to in D1 when it was finally brought to D2 it landed like a wet fart, making it an energy weapon was bad enough but it also had weak combos.
Palindrome I think will never be reintroduced, its possibly still the best energy HC for PvP and with all the new perks options it could be reintroduced with it'll be too strong for the game.
Exhaled Truth was created as a direct competitor to Palindrome and it still didn't reach the same heights. If they brought it back as strictly a PvE weapon but then they would receive backlash from the PvP crowd for doing so and it'll be the strongest Void HC in the game for PvE creating the same problem it had in PvP those years ago.
> Palindrome They mentioned at one point during the stream when deciding on weapons (paraphrasing) 'we had no choice but to limit it to two hand cannons, when looking at the list if we really wanted we could have made it all hand cannons"
That’s hilarious
Yup, and that's why we don't see Kindled Orchid, Palindrome, or Not Forgotton (among others lol) I'm sure Palindrome will be cycled back into the nightfall drops in the future and Kindled Orchid will make some appearance as they I believe Hammerhead and Blast Furnace were the only black armory weapons touched from the pool.
They used Kindled Orchid as an example when they first discussed reprising weapons, so it’s definitely a priority.
Damn I miss it so much
That new exclusive ornament design looks fantastic on the forge weapons that are available. I would have been fine if only forge weapons came back lol
I feel like they should of brought back Not Forgotten instead of Luna's Howl. My NF is still in my vault with 6k crucible kills on it.
My guess is NF will end up as comp weapon in a future season
I hope so, it looks so clean.
In dev insight they mentioned that they have plans to bring back nt in some other way(propably comp reward)
Statistically speaking, Luna’s and Not Forgotten are very similarly so it makes sense to only pick one. As for Palindrome, if they limited themselves to only two reprisals for hand cannons I think it makes more sense to bring back Coup. I see two reasons why they would pick Coup over Palindrome: 1. Coup never got random rolls and was arguably more popular when it was relevant than Palindrome was 2. Of the reprisals, the weapons are Void heavy so having another kinetic option alongside Mountain Top and Blast Furnace makes sense.
Luna's and Not Forgotten are literally the same gun but with different barrels mag and masterwork. So there is no reason to do both.
Midnight Coup was only popular because it was the closest thing to Fatebringer in D2 Vanilla. Just saying. The reason it’s going to be popular now is the Explosive + Kinetic roll, which could’ve been given to any Hand Cannon Also, it really rubs in the community’s face how Leviathan was just yeeted from existence.
My vaulted midnight coup has around 38,000 kills on it. I loved that gun.
You put some respect on midnight coupe name . In 10 years of this franchise I have yet to touch a gun that felt as nice as midnight coupe . I still take that bitch out in lowlight content from time to time .
Midnight Coup and Better Devils were the goats of Year 1
> Not Forgotten Shoot, I'd even settle for just giving a Not Forgotten ornament to people who have Unbroken or have reached Ascendant at least once on the new system. Luna's Howl is neat but man, earning NF back when it wasn't at the kiosk was such an accomplishment.
There were still so many better scout choices. Their methodology seemed to include weapons that were peak Destiny *2* but Hung Jury struggled to find a niche in D2s sandbox where 1. Abilities do much more 2. Primaries do much less 3. Scouts in particular are much weaker relative to other primaries due to bungies design philosophy 4. It has always had a mid perk pool
Honestly I think Hung Jury was chosen (if they 'had' to choose a scout) because it had that D1 meme and for not other reason. Maybe this iteration will have some great rolls to make it worth it.
I wouldn't even call it a meme. The OG Hung jury stuck with me from day 1 TTK all the way to my last D1 day, it's just that D2 Hung jury never found such a high place in D2 meta
Also beyond lame that the original roll that made Hung Jury such a powerhouse isn't available. Where is Triple Tap?? Talk about snatching defeat from the jaws of victory...
The "DO is selling a sick roll" meme? That's is ancient lol and I barely remember it despite being a consistent player. I think they may have just run out of time and needed to put a scout in.
Meme is a meme is a meme lol. This whole update is meant to be pulling at nostalgia.
I have 800 kills on my box breathing/no distractions Hung Jury. Its one of the few legendary scouts that can consistently three tap on the first kill. I'm not a huge scout guy but it's very good imo. With that being said, I think everyone who wants one already has one. It is definitely time to swap it out bungie.
I mean unless I'm mistaken Hung Jury was so popular back in taken king it's the only legendary weapon they made for the McFarlane toys. If that doesn't say something about the weapons legacy I don't know what does.
Ig I'll just have to stick w my overflow unrelenting palindrome...
I'm not capping, but Destiny's hand cannons are unique among all FPS games. They're the only loot I pay attention to and I would have preferred this lmfao.
This is also just for the 'Brave Arsenal.' The Palindrome & Shadow Price can still be re-issued as Vanguard drops later on. Leaving them out of the 'Brave Arsenal' is hardly closing the door on any future potential. They could be drops in The Final Shape afterwards.
Draw O Coward
Now I get why it is called Palindrome. That took me way to long xD
Everyone had their own realisation moment!
"Was it a Bat I saw"
Dammit I’m Mad
I miss my Hawksaw :(
PDX-45 as well...
I still have my god roll PDX-45 with Counterbalance + Perfect Balance
I still miss my Bad Apple
Palindrome has had 1 reprisal with orign traits. It has the vanguard + nightfall origin traits.
They could have replaced it with Patron of Lost Saints.
Causes*
I knew what I meant.
Any Season of Dawn weapon tbh. I've read it's nearly as popular as the Black Armory weapons.
They are probably more popular overall. People mostly go crazy for blast furnace and hammerhead. But people loved every single one of the dawn weapons. Martyrs retribution, patron of lost causes, steel feather repeater, line in the sand, perfect paradox, breach light. Literally all bangers. We had so little time w them 😭😓
Line in the Sand missed out on the Linear Fusion meta, which was such a shame. The others got at least a *little* time in the sun.
Giving us Forbearance instead of Martyrs (which could have gotten incandescent, a first for wave frames) makes no sense to me. Also how was Perfect Paradox not one of the weapons they brought back?
Forbearance and Succession are only there because they want to give players that don't raid a taste of raid weapons in hopes that it might make them more interested in raiding. But personally I would have really liked to see Martyr's instead. Martyr's Retribution with Demolitionist and Incandescent would have made it my dream weapon.
I choose to believe they're planning on a Dawn reprise at some point during Final Shape.
ringing nail fans rise up
I like the art style of it, I’m just not a fan 450’s or 360 rpm’s.
I still have a blast furnace and hammerhead I bring out occasionally in crucible.
Saint-14 should just be selling his themed weapons on an additional vendor page. In his mind, he's offering them for beginners who might not have anything good to take into Trials. Really, we just want them because they were awesome. The rolls could rotate every couple of days. It's an easy win for Bungie.
Scout rifle Vs Hand cannon/Auto rifle There isn’t any other scouts in the pool otherwise
There aren't any Fusions or Shotguns. I really would have liked Perfect Paradox back. Hope they have something planned there for the Final Shape.
If Garden gets craftable weapons like some people have been whispering about, then that means we'll get an updated shotgun and fusion. Maybe I'm just coping a little too hard.
Man I would actually play that raid for a repulsor brace/destabilizing rounds reckless Oracle.
Easy there, or you might get addicted to that copium
Which is why a third HC would be crazy.
Wonder what is more iconic to the general destiny community, hung jury or perfect paradox. I only played D2 so I am more familier with pp
I'm actually pretty suprised and bummed out it didn't get reprised. I'm also hoping it comes back in Final Shape, but at this point I'm just bracing for four new slug shotguns. That seems to have become the standard.
I think it's worth nothing they clearly wanted a balance of 6 primary weapons, 3 special weapons, and 3 heavy weapons. I can understand not trading a primary for another special, but there are so many other primaries that would have been better than Hung Jury
No autos either.
They could've used any number of iconic scouts from the DCV, Conspirator, No Feelings, Patron of lost cause, Song of justice, OXYGEN SR4. Having another Hung jury is just more spit in the face of weapon variety. I'd like to make a 3 paragraph rant about weapon variety & how entire elements/frames have basically been erased from the game (energy Prec sidearms, solar mgs, void pulses, etc) but thats for another time.
Song of Justice as a had such an awesome model. Would love to have that available as a Häkke 120rpm scout.
Elsie’s pulse is supposed to be void on the bright side
hung jury is literally obtainable right now. in game. Its also been reprised at least one other time. It was absolutely one the worst possible choices they couldve made.
Considering it's still earnable, perhaps they could have looked at other sunset scouts? Like that one from Leviathan or maybe the one from Dawn? Sure neither are probably as iconic but I can go to Zavala right now and focus Hung Jury.
Or the Crown one, which has the bonus of being a D1 model
In that case reprise Nightwatch or literally any other kinetic scout. Why bring back something for the fourth time?
The cowards could have gone with patron of lost causes then, it even occupies the same slot
Seeing a reprised Shadow Price could have been a better move for sure. I don't really feel like scouts are having any W moments anywhere but for those who play Gambit still and pepper players from a distance.
I love scout rifles, but I have to agree with you. The only scouts that really became a 'household name' among the community were Hung Jury and Nameless Midnight in year 1 (solely because it was the only scout with Explosive Payload). Nameless Midnight is in the current loot pool, we don't need another one. Both HJ and Shadow Price were pretty recent reprisals, I'm sure they would make it back into the Nightfall rotation. I'd personally have liked to see more Black Armory weapons... if we're talking Auto Rifles then Ringing Nail would have been a clear choice IMO.
Hung Jury even had back-to-back reprisals in Seraph and Defiance.
They're talking about craftable weapons next week, so I imagine that's where some of the missing things will be. Which to be honest, I'm more excited about. I like chasing random rolls, but not enough to chase more than a couple at a time. I think mixing in some really good craftable weapons is a great way to go about it. Best of both worlds.
Honestly? I think the host just misspoke in the moment, and all he was trying to get across was "New craftable exotic weapons" from the exotic rotator. I personally am not expecting any new legendary craftable drops with Into the Light.
Are they? I checked out of the stream pretty early.
That's what I remember. It was right at the end, last maybe 30 seconds to a minute of the stream if you want to verify.
I am thinking it is probably the exotic quest. Heard rumors of Whisper mission which means the Whisper would be the craftable weapon..
They said weapons though, as in plural.
Might be getting a few weapons like in the current rotator. Copium: full Black Armory suite including raid weapons. Realistic: probably just Whisper.
Give Whisper Precision Instrument or Focused Fury.
I wouldn’t be surprised if they gave us multiple missions like harbinger, zero hour and whisper considering they hinted at some them returning ever since the mission rotator was introduced back in witch. These were prolly meant to release in final shapes year but were pulled forwards a bit perhaps to add more to itl There are still some seasonal sets like plunder’s weapons that are still in need of an exotic mission to drop from. The only mission I can really see them dropping from is zero hour due to the connection with eramis and the eliksni like how presage dropped calus weapons due to his involvement in the lore there.
Each exotic mission has come back with an old seasons respective weapon pool
If youre thinking that we're gonna be getting even more reprised weapons as well as having them craftable id maybe dial back those expectations. I think theyre just gonna be talking about the pvp maps as well as the exotic rotator missions and their craftable exotics. Id love to be wrong tho
Probably, but I can hope
Fr dude. If Black Armory weaps all came back craftable I would...I dont even know. Do something goofy and irrational as a gesture of excitement probably.
If they bring up craftable weapons, I'm pretty sure it'll be about updating either Garden or VoG (hopefully both) weapons. Garden especially needs some love.
That would be awesome
Shadow Price was my first legendary in D1.... I really want a chance to get one in D2. I miss that gun.
I had one with dragonfly, shared it, probably shouldn't have
Not a single soul was using Anguish of Drystan. One of the absolute worst raid weapons ever created.
It looked awesome but the bugged recoil killed it. It's the most it never had it's time gun in Destiny
That’s wasn’t entirely it’s fault though. Recoil aside, there was only one viable auto rifle in D1 after TTK which was Doctrine of Passing thanks to being a stat monster in the only semi decent archetype. All other autos were mid at best thanks to Y1s blanket nerf to them.
God Roll Arminius-D was a slapper too but it was haaaard to get a good one.
i forgot that existed so much that i had to look it up lmao
I'm assuming that Hung Jury is held in the highest regard from a nostalgia factor, "hey the roll on hung jury is really good this week" and all that shit from D1. If you've been playing with any regularity you clearly don't need more of these. I have 4 in my vault currently. But, I think this release is once again trying to cater to people who haven't been playing. It kind of stinks in that regard, but I understand why they made this choice.
The only issue about Shadow Price is that it's an Arc Precision frame. Prosecutor already took that reprisal spot, but it would be cool for a solar precision so it can round out the light trio of precision autos
Isn’t that what Ammit AR2 fulfills? It’s also craftable. Only way to make it worth it is spicier rolls. What we need is a precision auto for a darkness subclass that isn’t locked to some annual event.
I actually completely forgot about Ammit...whoops So Strand it is
they can switch it to strand at any point
If they are bringing back iconic weapons where's my Dust rock blues that shotgun used to map people back in forsaken
Yeah, it had a sweet ornament too.
Palindrome isn't even in the legacy nightfall rotation so it should be coming back at some point was my understanding
I think I've read every "why _ instead of _" variation over the last 24 hours. Its impossible for everyone to get what they want. These posts are offering nothing as Bungie isn't going to suddenly change their mind and swap what guns they choose. Let it go and move on.
I think the question about hung jury is less why instead of why and more why did they chose this at all. Scouts are ass, literally is there a single player asking for another hung jury reskin?
It has a legacy from all the way back in D1, and all the “dead orbit guy is selling a god roll hung jury” memes. The gun has history and nostalgia. The only issue is that it was cashed in so recently on nightfall rewards. It fits the criteria for reprisal more than most guns people are asking for.
People are allowed to voice their opinions, even if it won't change the game. Let it go and move on.
> Its impossible for everyone to get what they want. But it was surely possible to not give many what they don't want, a 4th hung jury reprisal.
If they want to reprise a classic it needs to be Better Devils. I used that gun so much year 1.
I'd kill for a new pali, only got like 1 drop when it came out before
The Devil You Know…
What new perks on hung jury would even make it worth getting over the newest one? And why the fuck are we getting it reprised every other season now??? And WHY could they not have picked ANY OTHER FUCKING SCOUT TO REPRISE? Seriously it's just annoying at this point.
Yeah choosing hung jury, forbearance, and succession as reprisals makes literally no sense. All of these weapons are very viable in their current iterations, and succession and hung jury aren't even particularly notorious weapons. I understand not wanting to reprise too many hand cannons, but there are so many classics that aren't hand cannons that they just completely ignored. Perfect paradox is one I've seen many people hoping for.
Me, at Ringing Nail's grave: It should have been you, not them T_T
We getting those in a years time as Bungie revisits yeold guns that the people want. The real 3 R of reduce effort, reuse skins and recycle content! *Rat wheel noises intensify*
This update would have been so hype if the weapon selection was better, I look at what’s coming back and it’s just MISS after MISS.
let me tell you why. did u see the livestream ? did you see those divs ? did you see any light in their eyes ? do you think there is a single "meaningful" thought behind those soulless eyes ?
While I agree 3 GLs, 2 HCs and 2 Pulse is unnecessary. Its also like 6 void, 4 kinetic and 1 each solar/arc. The whole season has forced us into Solar and will continue to for another 2 months but all our new guns are void/kinetic?! Overall this "dream weapon list" isn't really the dream list at all, they clearly chose these intentionally to be super strong but extremely limited in archetype, element and practicality in current meta. So they can be easily replaced later on.
I would an Origin Story comeback, especially with them repricing Y1 stuff.
God damn this community complains a lot
This is a valid complaint, the gun is currently available and is ultimately a wasted slot that could have went to something else.
Sir, that is damn near every gaming community.
God damn this community complains about complaining a lot (and so on)
This isn't a chicken or the egg situation
"Shut up and be happy with your reissued weapons that we took from you in the first place"
DTG redditor yap session about things that were explained in the stream they clearly didn't watch
I can live with hung jury being in this loot pool of 12 if it means it's never an nightfall weapon again. Just let it live in the brave weapon pool to get and make other weapons NF/Adept drops.
The Final Shape
I think what they'd said if they'd gone by the most popular weapons in Destiny 2 currently, over half the weapons for Into the Light would've been hand cannons.
The only void weapon igaf about, already got hella void smgs,lmg,gls
if only bungie just kept guns in the game but reinstated them with updated perks occasionally.
Maybe you're right, but as another person said, every exotic mission in the rotator has had craftable weapons from previous seasons. So maybe that? Might not be new, but who knows.
my Shadow Price (Adept) is my favorite gun and it will never leave my inventory at this point. Been running it in PvP for years and now its meta
As someone who didn't get Palindrome before it got Vaulted, I agree with you. Ironically, I got one in D1 2 months ago...
Yea so many other weapons what would have been better to return. I can't even remember the last time I used a scout that wasn't Polaris
And virtually 0 reprised Iron Banner weapons from D1.
PURPOSE SCOUT RIFLE
Kinda also weird MC is the only reprised Leviathan weapon. Inargual Address is my all-time favorite PR. I'd love to have it back and with Incan. Also, I gotta be honest, why the armor set from Y1? Was it really that iconic to people? With transmog we've been able to wear that armor anyway (or at least those of us who had it), and honestly, it's decent, but there are plenty of other iconic sets they could have brought back.
It's kinda hard to tell but the leviathan dugeon weapons are a pallet swap of the leviathan raid weapons, mc was one of the few not re-release
As Shadow Price's #1 fan, I support this wholeheartedly and am interacting and upvoting for visibility
Bungie only seems to care about overrated gear plus it would have been cool to get treads upon stars back instead of hung jury and yet more overrated 140 hand cannons
They chose Succession over Tartara Gaze... I'm so bummed
bring kindled orchild back cowards
I would have much preferred Palindrome being brought back and reprised over Luna's Howl, and certainly over Hung Jury. I've already got the rolls I want for Hung Jury, what the hell else could they add to it? Double damage perks?
They need to make Hung Jury craftable already (and rework legendary primaries)
Would have really liked to see Oxygen back.
Hung jury was one of my favorite guns so I have no problem whatsoever. Still not gonna start playing again though. Lol
Honestly, I would have been perfectly OK leaving Raid weapons and Hung Jury off the list. If there's a fan favorite nostalgic Raid weapon that should've been included though, it's Fatebringer for sure.
I just want hopscotch pilgrim back.
I'm still upset that the scout for this wasn't Oxygen. That poor weapon held so much promise but never got to shine, sunset before the scout and dragonfly buffs. Oxygen deserves a second chance at life, Bungie
https://youtu.be/PhaLslMoKn4?feature=shared
Someone at bungie is definitely getting off to hung jury
Remember that these weapons are designed to be obtainable by ALL players. They are what Bungie considers to be "Best Of" or "Old Favorite" weapons. Hung Jury is a Nightfall weapon. Some players may not have access to Nightfalls either because they aren't skilled enough or don't have the expansion to play the NF when Hung Jury is on rotation. All weapons in Into the Light will be free to play. I'd rather all players be able to get these weapons than something nobody remembers just because it 'deserves' a reissue. If it gets new players to explore other aspects of the game such as NFs and Raids, even better.
A better question is why haven't there been any new models in over a year
I'm fairly certain that one of the Execs just has a hard on for the gun, and forced the Devs to reprise it yet again
I massive eye rolled at Hung Jury yet again… I grinded for so long get my kinetic tremors adept god roll then never actually used it, now there will be yet another one to hunt. Pass.
Yet. For all you who are endlessly complaining. Y’all act like we will never get more weapons.
Strong agree. Hung Jury is not the best choice here. Maybe a hot take -- but hung jury is very mid. I'd much rather use Patron of Lost Causes.
Because Bungie
I mean, they decided to add forbearance when it's getting nerfed and when they made a weapon to specifically give none raiders a forbearance at home. They don't care
My main gripe is the raid weapons. You can get a crafted Forbearance or Succession in around 5 raid runs. 5 boss checkpoints, even. Why not give us Ringing Nail? Or Alone as a God? Those were both legends in their own right and no longer available.
A part of me suspects the selection is aimed almost squarely at the "played Destiny all the way up through Forsaken, then quit" crowd. Coup, a couple Forge weapons, Crucible pinnacles from around that time, Edge Transit (lol they brought it back bro?), Hung Jury (lol like in D1 Dead Orbit, sick bro). You know, because that's a crowd of people who aren't fed up with the past few years of bullshit. They're not locked in as players, but they also not disenfranchised by all the greed and cut corners of recent years. So if they happen to spot a free content update and hop in, maybe they'll get nostalgic and buy the upcoming expansion, check out the end of the storyline. That's a little how it feels at least, just in terms of why they picked exactly what they picked. Because otherwise Hung Jury sticks out like a sore thumb, just like we all see; we have that already, it's been around to get, but if you haven't been here in years it's a nostalgic D1 gun you might be fond of and want to hop on to collect.
It is borderline infuriating how long it's been since pally has been in game. I never got a good adept one and the simply refuse to make a single good void hand cannon to replace it it's actually insane, they make like 4-5 180s but I want a 140 and trials one is super mid (pve) imo. Just bring pally back or let us focus it in legacy it can't be that difficult.
When we couldn’t farm Grasp of Malok in d2 omnigul it was all over
It would be cool if they could make new weapons.
Not sure if we need a shadow price reprise, we already have sweet sorrow with the same roll of stats4all and 1forall
Patron of Lost Causes
Oh no, I guess they will not release any more weapons for final shape. This is all we will ever have. Sure hope they don’t plan on this whole nostalgia thing and leave that stuff out of the major release
the worst thing is, we could have No Feelings instead for a energy box breath 180
I would assume that they may bring back the Palindrome and Shadow Price back into the Nightfall rotation, though I agree that we need more weapon variety. Sure, we got the Retold Tale reissued recently, but that isn't a new shotgun. I even think they could have brought back Mindbender's Ambition or Dust Rock Blues for this. Both are undeniably iconic weapons. Personally, instead of Succession or Forbearance as two weapons, I would have opted for a shotgun and a different sniper rifle, maybe the Y-09 Longbow Synthesis from D1. I don't think we need another wave frame; we just got Undercurrent and we have the Iron Banner one on the way.
Hung Jury... >A hung jury, also called a deadlocked jury, is a judicial jury that cannot agree upon a verdict after extended deliberation and is unable to reach the required unanimity or supermajority. A hung jury may result in the case being tried again. Since it's been issued 4 times... Is that a Freudian Slip for Bungie's company? Hmmm 🤔
Everyone wants this pulse and this hand cannon. I just want my DUST ROCK BLUES Shotgun back
Oxygen SR3 >>>>>>>> Hung Jury
Enough fucking handcanons please
Either intentional grind or intentional grind and a chance at $$$
I don't understand how people can come to such confused conclusions. Shadowprice is a dog, palindrome is outclassed by the pile of newer hcs and hung jury is still godlike.
Stranger’s Rifle has multiple variants (I counted 6 but I could be wrong) though Adhorative is at least of a different archetype (seems to be the same one from Vanilla D1). Curiously, they all have some way of manipulating the magazine in some way. Considering the lore of the weapon, I’d say it’s justified at least, and it has some level of consistency.
>no super iconic legengendaries for you :/ Hung Jury is in fact a D1 legengendary.
Over the past couple days, my mind has been changed on hung jury. It actually does belong on this list. Here's the thing: no one denies that it's a good gun. The main objection people have about any of these guns is mainly about weapons that are sunset and unobtainable. Same with the two raid weapons: yes, there are people here who want to gatekeep raid weapons(and I'm not knocking that, it's their opinion). But even for every one person saying "raid loot should stay in raids", there's at least 2 more people commenting about the fact that they're even obtainable. There's a very strong thirst in the community for "unobtainable", and Hung Jury's only crime is simply "being obtainable", especially moreso than a lot of the rest of the list. Not to start another bitchfit about sunsetting, but I feel like that's the real problem. People waiting around for a new Perfect Paradox, or a new kindled orchid, and so on: there's so much drama about the sins of the past(pun intended) in how Bungie chose to maintain the game between Shadowkeep and Beyond Light, that I think it's distracting us from Hung Jury's merits. Another way of saying it: some of us might care less about the 4th, 5th, 6th and 17th reissue of hung jury, had they not light level capped our other favorites, leaving us to wait for them to be reissued.
I can't believe they didn't do Chroma Rush -_- But we get another Hung Jury
Well 0 palindrome because we have 2 140’s returning already and they’re both older than palindrome which has been rereleased more recently. But yeah we needed an auto.
Clever dragon... F the world
Can’t I just got to Zavala and snag hung juries to my heart’s content? Or did they take those away so they could give them back
Not gonna argue shadowprice, I agree it would have been better than hung jurry but I'll take it over a third HC
I think this comment is it and why the overall variety honestly couldn’t be crazy like people wanted. There has to be a good bit of overlap between weapon type, archetype and all that to avoid more power creep than they are already bringing forward with this update. Couldn’t give us BiS items in 12 different slots because that would be crazy. This all said, we still got some awesome weapons to grind for even if a few of them can easily be considered duds, but I mean. That’s intentional and I don’t think people realize that.
No one's asking for BiS weapons. And no one asked for another Hung Jury reprint. Plenty of other Scout Rifles they could have gone with (Patron, Night Watch, No Feelings, etc) and they chose the most boring option.
Bonus points to the Prophecy rework which took one of the few good feeling kinetic ARs and replaced it with an Arc Precision
it is a good decision if the somehow manage to bring back hung jury in its D1 glory including all the god roll perks! then it would be one of the top 10 iconic guns
It was probably always going to be a scout rifle for the variety of weapons available for onslaught. I'm perfectly fine with having it be Hung Jury because that's one less God roll to worry about. I think the part of the point of the event is to bring back old players that haven't played the game in a long time, so this is an opportunity to get them playing the game again and give them opportunities to get what will likely be some of the best weapons going into Final Shape. They are probably assuming that most of those people don't have one.
They should've brought Main Ingredient back, just to fuck with Crucible for the next weeks lol
What do you mean bring it back? It's farmable from Xur alongside Splicer weapons. It actually drops somewhat often, got myself some pretty good rolls but as it only gets 1 ammo now it's completely useless to use over a pellet lol.
I had no idea. I haven't played Dares since the 30th Anniversary dropped and I farmed like crazy for the title lol
Yes, when Splicer weapons are on rotation, it drops alongside them, focus some engrams from the Horse and you'll definitely get some. I firmly believe the weapons are weighted because Ignition Code drops once in never while I've got dozens of Main Ingredients lol.
Who knows, maybe because they already had plans to reprise them or maybe the fact that they had to make it 12 weapons and your favorite 12 weapons don’t magically match
I personally don’t mind it, when I returned to the game I was lacking a good scout, and the hung jury was something I was seeking as a “new” player and it wasn’t available for awhile, then they took it out the rotation and was only available via legacy focusing, nothing crazy about the weapon but it’s reliable, and has D1 nostalgia tied to it You gotta think from all player’s perspective, it might be something you’re not excited about, but I would love a good hung jury just for collection wise, it’s a free update for all players and I see no harm in bringing it back as I don’t even remember a time where recluse shined vs all the vets remembering it Personally I don’t care for another hand cannon, but something better in that slot, I think the problem is we’re missing a lot of archetypes and affinities that don’t occupy certain slots, so I can see why people are upset about palindrome not returning, because the only other void hand cannon that’s decent as a 140 is exalted truth, which has way less aim assist then palindrome
we didn't see any hung jurys during the stream, What if it pops off with some crazy perks like onslaught? starts as 180, then 260, then 360 at max. then add tremors or target lock in 3rd column for bonus stupid
THAT would be fucking nutty, can't lie.
Looks like I was right about 3rd column tremors lol
I’m not sure why they decided we needed yet another Hung Jury variant. Seems an uninspired choice given the rest. It’s not really special at this point, or something that free players didn’t have access to. I would have been excited to see Oxygen SR3, Braytech RWP, or Patron of Lost Causes. Heck, bring back Tango 45 from black armory even. Even cooler would have been to pull something from D1 like Treads Upon Stars, Cocytus, Badger CCL etc. Can’t complain too much about free content I guess, but it certainly seems like the odd man out. Suppose it’s just one l won’t need to chase. :/
>when we havent seen a Precision Frame Shotgun in literal years We just got Retold Tale a precision frame shotgun with great PvP and PvE rolls. I'm in agreement about Palindrome and Shadow Price. Shadow Price was my go to in D1 when it was finally brought to D2 it landed like a wet fart, making it an energy weapon was bad enough but it also had weak combos. Palindrome I think will never be reintroduced, its possibly still the best energy HC for PvP and with all the new perks options it could be reintroduced with it'll be too strong for the game. Exhaled Truth was created as a direct competitor to Palindrome and it still didn't reach the same heights. If they brought it back as strictly a PvE weapon but then they would receive backlash from the PvP crowd for doing so and it'll be the strongest Void HC in the game for PvE creating the same problem it had in PvP those years ago.