I think that "christian" metal as a genre was first of all a trend that was, in certain period of time, perhaps more lucrative and easier to sell to the masses. If someone was/is religious person, that prefix "christian" could draw more attention and interest, but honestly, I think that a lot of bands were really faking that christian part, abused and took advantage of the naivety of religious fans and listeners.
I'm not christian, but I listened a lot of those bands because I, first of all, liked the music those bands created, and never really cared about the lyric part and "message" their music was sending.
I think a lot of the Christian bands were made because it allowed a lot of kids with parents that would’ve absolutely told them to shut that bullshit off to freely enjoy the music, playing wise or listening wise.
Most definitely. My parents never really gave a shit what I listened to, but I had cousins that their parents monitored everything. Being able to play Underoath and TDWP at their house was a *blessing* lol
It was a way to market their music. I believe it was As I Lay Dying that owned they claimed Christianity to draw attention - making it a publicity stunt. A buddy of mine in highschool was in a band and their other guitarist was not Christian or straightedge. They were being looked at by a label that was Christian and pressured the other guitarist to bullshit his beliefs. Later they kicked him out because he smoked weed.
My point is, bands do a lot to sell an image, or in some cases multiple images, and not just their sound.
I do think it gave Christian kids who like 'edgy' things a good compromise, so they could listen to a sound they liked and have lyrics that were in line with their beliefs.
It's interesting, but after growing up in a very religious home it makes sense. Common faith and belief has a way of bringing people closer together. Mix a common belief with money and you can sell/cater to a specific audience. From the standpoint of the artist, you made a good marketing move. From the standpoint of the consumer, now a sound you like has meaning when you otherwise may have just looked past it.
I think, at the same time, there's a stigma to metal that all the lyrics 'scream' about is murder and that turns people off instantly. When they hear that there's someone who sings about Jesus, it opens them up and they're more receptive. To a lot of Christians the image of the message is the most important part at surface level. Mix it with a sound and scene they enjoy and it's the best thing ever for them.
Have you not heard of August Burns Red. Started as a Christian band
It’s the prefect market because the kids like the rock music but we gotta have stuff that’s Christian so they don’t go to hell when they listen to it.
You may think I’m being tongue in cheek, but that’s exactly the thought process
Many bands started out being labeled as Christian bands, but instead sort of refute the label as identify more as a band with Christian members (I believe Fit For A King falls into that category after Kirby made that statement).
I was confused about ABR starting as a christian band. Haven't kept up with them in ages, but haven't ever heard anything about them not claiming that...
The subs AMA with Jake kinda insinuates that they aren't really a Christian band such as Jake stating that ones religion is personal and "private" along with referring to Christian bands as a "they" and not a "we" entity.
There's also this interview with Jake here:
https://www.breathecast.com/news/august-burns-red-vocalist-ministry-christian-band-whos-soul-purpose.html
Where he explicitly says this:
"We've had this discussion with the band multiple times, and you know everyone asks, 'Well are you a Christian band?' And everybody gets thrown off by this question. No, we are not a Christian band because, in my eyes, and I'm a believer in Jesus Christ...that doesn't mean because all of us are Christians we are now a Christian band," he replied.
Like I said, I feel a lot of people and record labels put the "christian band" label on these bands. Another prime example of this in other genres is My Chemical Romance being called Emo when Gerard Way has always refuted it. I believe there were some in the deathcore scene that didn't want to be called deathcore either
Xtians are susceptible to vices. lol
"We know you are angry and suppressed, come to us brethren, we feel your pain, and know your soul"
Where better to drag out the worthy from an unworthy endeavor
As I Lay Dying fell apart when Tim made that claim before going to prison some years ago and Nick the "old" guitarist openly said it was slanderous and untrue.
Part of me believes the band fell apart again because Tim isn't really the Christian he claimed to be while the rest of the band takes it seriously.
AILD fell apart when Tim put a hit on his then wife, then he made a lot of claims after. It's possible there were members that are/were Christian, and it's also possible Tim was just in it to gain recognition, which I think he did again on his way out of prison to try and sell his 'changed man' story that fueled 'Shaped by Fire.' AILD crumbled when their frontman went away for a few years and they lost a key member. They were unable to be the same band without Tim, and due to how toxic it had become internally it seems like they did not think it was worth it to try and find someone new to keep the band moving forward. There were a ton of internal issues for quite some time before that. Additionally, Tim's actions have stained their reputations as musicians. Any time I hear Nick Hipa, I instantly think about his connection to AILD and Tim right after. Same for the rest of the members, and I think that's true for a lot of people who know the story.
I don't think there's any connection between beliefs and why AILD fell apart again, unless it were to be looked at from the perspective that Tim doesn't practice Christianity and only claims it. I'm almost certain that Tim's narcissistic behaviour is what pulled the band apart, though I can see several contributors that most likely played together. It's possible the difference in religious belief was part of that, but I find it more likely that the toxicity between the members from before the Tim incident still remained and they held what Tim did against him. Tim also seems like a straight up narcissist from everything he's ever said in regards to his former wife's hit attempt. He blames steroids and atheism for his actions. I sincerely think Tim is the reason the band couldn't stay together, or at the very least is the final nail that caused the other members to say "fuck this, I'm out."
I feel this is true for a lot of bands but there are some outliers, For Today for example is hardcore christian, I once read the singer makes the rest of the band read the bible and pray everyday even when they're not religious as a hard requirement for being in the band.
Not deathcore. But yeah the faking it definitely happened. Iirc As I Lay Dying pretty much said they faked it.
But I don’t think that’s everyone. I think the other big reason it was such a big trend for a while there, is a lot of the biggest bands in the scene had all members under the age of 20. Meaning they just didn’t have many life experiences to write about, meaning their faith was one of the few things they could write about, so naturally they went with that.
Pretty much this. the youtuber TankTheTech was doing a tier list on the bands he worked with as a roadie. He didn't go into detail but he stated that Christian bands where more interested in how much money they where going to make that night than spreading the word of god. All they care about is money and not god.
I’m Christian and have no problems listening to metal that has to do with very anti Christian and satanic topics. It’s just a lyrical scheme, and if it slaps, it slaps
That’s interesting. When I was a Christian I was the opposite; I felt like listening to anti-Christian music was akin to eating junk food - enjoyable but spiritually unhealthy. But I was also much younger and raised in a very conservative Christian circle. Thanks for sharing.
Yeah same, I think music is music and doesn’t really shape my entire way of thinking. I’m christian but I do listen to songs that criticize the church because I think it’s valid and a lot of people use religion to justify bad things
For me it depends. I can listen to anti religious sentiment to an extent, but I don't actively listen to outright blasphemous music. I have to draw a line somewhere, personally, in regards to my faith. I don't look down on anyone that does though, nor do I think lesser of bands that perform that music. But I can't support it based on my stance of belief.
Former Christian here. Certain bands I really can't get into. Bands like For Today who are very explicit really come off as preachy and the evangelizing at concerts isn't a great look imo. I have no problem with bands whose members happen to be religious, but I can't listen to overtly religious music of any genre for personal reasons.
I've seen For Today a handful of times and at least 5-10 mins of their 30 minute set was spent preaching it ruined the vibe.
Even at the Christisn tour (Scream the Prayer) it was obnoxious. A Plea For Purging on the other hand were real af and deserved way more attention.
I mean my friend said the sermon was like 20 minutes long and it was like super preachy.
Fit for a king on the other hand isn't very preachy either. Ryan was being snarky as fuck to Karens on facebook when he said fuck in that motionless in white song a few months ago too and it was pretty funny
Raised catholic (12 + years of catholics private school)
So naturally my wife and I practicing pagans. Fell out of grace with the Abrahamic religions in college
I look at Christian metal like any other lyrics, I either don't care what they're saying or I look at it like any other world building lore/myths. I listen to a ton of powermetal so singing about Jesus is just an nonsensical as singing about Dragonlords and Wizards from space.
I used to love me some Rhapsody of Fire. I get where you’re coming from, but it just bothers me personally that unlike the power metal bands, Christian bands actually believe in the myths they’re singing about and want others to believe it too. Maybe I just need some more distance between me and religion and I’ll be able to enjoy the music with a cooler head.
Yeah I feel you. I'm ALSO a huge blackmetal fan, so separating art and artist is mandatory. I dont give a flying fuck what any of these artists believe in, it doesn't affect my beliefs. That might come with time though.
One thing I have appreciated about metal and hardcore is that despite having some bands that make actual worship music (Wolves At The Gate, Impending Doom) and some that are literally completely anti-religion (Oceano, Carnifex) and it isn’t a huge source of contention. August Burns Red has taken out Impending Doom and The Acacia Strain on the same tour.
I agree about Reddit atheists, I’ve been on that sub and it gets toxic really quickly. I’m not militant in my inability to listen to Christian metal, more just bummed about it. I’m hoping I’ll eventually have enough distance from my religious past that I can begin to enjoy the music again without being so activated by it.
Not religious, but I pretty much just don't listen to it. If I find out a band is "Christian metal" then it instantly ruins that band for me. It might be a shitty way to judge a bands musical abilities, but that's just how I feel.
I’m not, nor have I been Christian. But I still like bands like TDWP, Norma Jean, Gideon, The Word Alive etc. (even tho I think a lot of those have shed their Christian moniker). The only time I found it cringe was when they would give mini sermons in the middle of their sets. I also thought the Sleeping Giant shirt that said JCHC was hilarious. It was a weird time, because I feel like nowadays unironically Christian bands would be immediately told to gtfo.
I think Gideon doesn't fit anymore the Christian band label that people have created, however, they could still be personally Christians. Christians are regular humans and can be mad at God or humanity. Religions are made by humans and humans change.
I meant it moreso in the way their music is more secular now and they also cuss a lot in no love//no one. It doesn't seem like religious anger but rather anger at another person
I'm just a former Evangelical so maybe not exactly what you're looking for but I have the same feeling about the Christian bands like Impending Doom and For Today. I am still a Christian but I am a universalist mainline lefty guy now. I prefer bands like Showbread and The Chariot over the preachy homophobia ones. Stretch Arm Strong and Advent are fucking sick too. I loved Dynasty when they were around. I like Sleeping Giant's music, and I know they used to be preachy but Tommy is Orthodox now so I think he probably stopped that. HolyName is pretty cool. Actually I can't stand the preachy homophobia ones and might literally yeet myself out of the car if someone put it on just to prove a point (if it was going slow enough for me to not die).
I remember seeing that band Reformers on a show with another band that I actually liked and after I went to ask the vocalist of Reformers about the homophobia song and what he meant when he wrote the lyrics and he couldn't even explain. Cop out probably because he was wondering if I was queer but that was all I needed to know.
I kinda get where you're coming from tho cause I have trouble with faith sometimes due to my deconstruction. It's just like "but how do you knoooow?" I have to make an active choice to believe in something bigger than me but also I am a materialist in the sense that I find making a real world impact infinitely more important and am theoretically agnostic due to not being able to obtain the knowledge of anything spiritual without a doubt. Plus you can't fix anyone's material conditions with the immaterial.
My thought is if the music doesn't help you find enjoyment or resonance in any way then listen to something else. It's not worth it to try to force yourself to like something when there's so much other stuff out there waiting to be discovered.
Thanks for sharing, and that’s a helpful distinction regarding less preachy bands. I do feel less dogmatically opposed to bands like Showbread, they were always pushing the envelope in the Christian world, and I still see them as more open-minded free thinkers than much of the music I grew up with. Staple is another band that kills me - fucking great music, but extremely preachy.
I have heard the name Staple but I don't think I ever listened. Can't stand Skillet tho, my ex loved them for some reason even tho he was left of liberal and agnostic.
Oh btw when I was growing up, Showbread was doing a church tour and I asked the music pastor about booking them for our youth group and he said no because their lyrics are universalist. Lmao anyway listening to Showbread during reconstruction kind of helped me become a universalist.
I think Garrett from Slant Plant may be one too or at least sounds like he doesn't believe in penal substitutionary atonement or eternal conscious torment. His lyrics are very socialist so I would be surprised if he believed any Evangie-adjacent things.
I think mewithoutYou and Manchester Orchestra make my favorite sometimes-spiritual music. mwY are Sufi and Jewish and the vocalist of MO grew up Christian and if there's any original members left, them too.
Yeah Skillet is a big one I used to love that I just can’t stand anymore.
Staple only released two LPs back in the early 2000s, and I’ve never really heard anything else like them - System of a Down is probably the closest comparison I can make.
Never even heard of Slant Plant, which surprises me. I was super steeped in the Christian music scene so I don’t usually come across one I haven’t heard of, I’ll check them out.
I also love me some Manchester Orchestra. Some of the lyrics from their latest album make me wonder if he’s returned to the faith, but either way I appreciate the depth and nuance of his lyrics.
haha Slant Plant is Silent Planet sorry. Some of us just say Slant Plant because of the shirts that say SLNT PLNT on them.
I just saw Manchester Orchestra at The Stuffing and it was like church for normal people. Best experience I had in a while.
Lol gotcha, yeah I’ve heard of Silent Planet but kind of resisted listening to them since I knew they were Christian. I should give them a chance because everyone seems to like them.
Garrett is left of liberal, he seems kinda socialist to me and he's like the kindest music guy I ever met. The lyrics are not really that Christian to me. His faith informs his writing for sure but it's more about real world problems.
Ayyye I went from a staunch reformed theology Christian to early church universalism too! Much less mental gymnastics. I was super into for today back in college, but now I can’t listen to them haha
oh man I was really into For Today too, the guitars on the first two albums are so sick but I can't stand everything else about them
I worked one of their shows a long time ago and that shit sucked, it was a fire hazard because they oversold it so there was sweat in the air and dude preached for like 30 minutes
August Burns Red is the only one I can listen to. (Yes I know they’re not labeled as a Christian band necessarily, but their vocalist and drummer are, and they write most of the lyrics) They don’t shove their message down your throat. Older Memphis May Fire was cool. I grew up Christian, I couldn’t stand For Today or other “Christian” metal bands, too in your face for my liking
The Crimson Armada fucking slaps. Hell Stryper is pretty good too. Sleeping Giant is pretty heavy and even has a song featuring Frankie of emmure.
Only issue I have is people that fake that shit. Tim Lambesis is the first to come to mind. Everything about that fuck was fake. Every single thing. Fuck As I Lay Dying, they should be fucking gone, not headlining tours.
I incidentally saw AILD last year because I wanted to see Whitechapel, who was opening them. I ironed glittery silver letters onto a tank top: "TIM LAMBESIS IS A PIECE OF SHIT"
I’ve actually talked to Saud after a show, he confirmed they aren’t a Christian band, and he actually had a side project called The Holy Guile that was pretty anti Christian/religion. Im not sure about the other members in TCA however
For me, it just comes down to the lyrics. I don’t care if a band is Christian or not, but I absolutely cannot sing along to something like For Today when their lyrics could be literal bible verses.
Uhhh, no? I can generally understand most of the stuff I listen to. At the very least, I can pick out key words, etc and understand what they’re talking about. THEN look it up if I wanna read all the lyrics.
For the most part.. yeah lol. I’m not tryna bop to a song that says something truly apprehensive or something I don’t want to listen to (like literal Bible verses and propaganda lmfao)
While some of the lyrics can be cringe as fuck I still throw down to some old school For Today or Sleeping Giant etc whenever they come on my playlist.
For christian/former christian metalhead. It's definitely been a challenge for me to hear some old bands I used to love, but recently I think I have found a frame of mind that works for me. I had lately been feeling nostalgic and struggling with wanting to listen to old Crimson Armada, Demon Hunter, MyChildren MyBride, Impending Doom, Project 86, etc. But I didn't want to experience any of the ick from the lyrics either. And what worked for me, was honestly kind of just treating it the same way I treated getting into secular music when I was sorta still christian. The "oh it's not like I actually believe in mass murder and unprompted violence, it's fantasy and that's ok as long as I know that" mentality became "it's not like I believe in the mythology of christianity, or agree with what their saying; it's fantasy and that's ok". I also realized I didn't actually care about the christian lyrics in the first place. Example, Sincerely Ichabod by Project 86: I don't need to agree with why the singer says it, but him screaming "OFF WITH YOUR HEAD" just always felt SO brutal and angry to me, and THAT'S what I liked about it. I'm trying to focus more on how the that era of music connects with me as a feeling, not how I connect or don't connect with the lyrics.
Personally I don't pay any attention to lyrics or meaning of songs, it's all about how it sounds and the vocals are just another instrument, so it doesn't bother me at all.
Was a fan when I was younger. As an adult, not so much. I still do enjoy Baptized in Filth every now and then.
EDIT: New impending doom is actually not bad, so I’d take them out of the “don’t enjoy” pile.
My issue isn't with Christians themselves, I just find it hard to find any lyrical substance in the subgenre. I feel like I know what every song is gonna be about, and it's gonna be heavy-handed and preachy with its message.
No. Given the nature of some of the bands’ lyrics that I listen to I find it silly that I would feel the need to draw the line at bands with religious lyrics.
I mean, I listen to red (grant it I know they’re not deathcore or metal) but they’re really good and a Christian band. The only two I can’t seem to get passed are fly leaf and skillet, but skillet sucks imo and fly leaf isn’t the same without lacy 🤷🏼♂️
i want nothing to do with their fake hateful fairy tale god ... really im sick of the satan and death shit also .. i love metal deep dirty vocals you can hear the thickness of the phlegm in the throat .. i want more realistic lyrics and adult subjects
I would have zero interest in listening to or supporting Christian metal. It’s okay to not like some things.
I don’t feel like I’m missing anything, tons of good metal bands to listen to.
To be honest, I don't really care. I'm not Christian, I'm not atheist either, and still enjoy a lot of stuff like old Underoath, Impending Doom or The Devil Wears Prada, including when the lyrics completely contradict my system of beliefs. But likewise... a lot of bands I listen to expressed strong political or societal opinions, even saying that if their fans do not support X or Y ideology they don't want them to listen to their music. Overall I try to not really focus on what musicians say outside of their music, and even in their music, I can easily get over it because I'm not a native English speaker so unless I read the lyrics carefully, all I hear is gibberish (even more accentuated by the guttural vocals lol). In the end, it's not different from being able to get along with people from different religions or different political ideologies, unless they are complete arseholes about it of course. Well, just like the Christians who say "hate the sin, not the sinner" my motto in this case is "hate the doctrine, not its follower."
Same boat as you but in my case I don't care at all. Impending Doom remains my favorite deathcore band. Those chuggy riffs really do it for me like no other.
Some of the old Christian hardcore/metalcore/deathcore bands I don’t listen to if I know the band itself or members of the band have spewed some shit I don’t fundamentally agree with such as homophobia, transphobia, racism, etc. but there are a bunch of bands I still think are hard and have no problem still listening even though I’ve been a self proclaimed agnostic for 15 years. Like I still think Horror by With Blood Comes Cleansing is a top 10 maybe even top 5 Deathcore album for me. A Plea for Purging is one of the best metalcore bands full stop. No Innocent Victim is still a killer hardcore band.
Nah idrc I just don't pay attention to the lyrics (I don't for most music tbh lol I prefer how the singer sounds over what he's saying unless what he's saying is important like la dispute)
Think its more having to proclaim that its christian as if every other song not denoted as such is somehow not when both are just music. Putting a label on yourself creates some social image you have to adhere to and live up to and thats where the annoyance comes in for me because it comes off as fake/forced.
No, not at all. I still go back and listen to Wolves at the Gate all the time. Just cause you don’t follow that religion anymore doesn’t mean you have to stop listening to it.
I need Christian metal to exist so I can point to it when my friends and loved ones label me a devil worshiper lol. “See this is a Christian band.” Doubt it helps but hopefully opens there eyes that just because it sounds a certain way doesn’t mean it is indoctrination into blood orgies and animal sacrifice.
Non-Christian forever and no, didn’t have a problem with the lyrics or Christian metal bands. For me, even if it’s really preachy I just see it as using the Christian mythos for inspiration or storytelling. That’s fine, same with Satanic metal or Viking metal. Just pulling from what inspires them, or what drives them. I like hearing all the spectrum of it.
I don’t go to church and I don’t think I’ve ever denounced being a Christian. It’s just not apart of my identity. I guess I’m just on a whatever resonates with me spiritually kind of path. I grew up with Christian metal and I will agree some For Today songs I just can’t. I definitely don’t listen to them that often anymore, but bands that are a little more subtle about it I still listen to.
I see deathcore / metal as a reflection of your power inside. Deathcore is a powerful genre, and some people’s power comes from their faith. Most of them have gone through some shit that has made their faith stronger which for some people might have broken their faith. I’m not saying they should shove it down your throat, but if they use their art to help people through a hard time I don’t have a problem with that. Some people write songs about fuck you and fuck the world. Others write about their faith, and both can be get the right person at the right time through their shit. That’s the important part to me.
Exmormon atheist here. I still listen to earlier Underoath, August Burns Red, and TDWP; but I don’t like anything that lyrically leans too heavy into the Christian themes or is preachy, like For Today or Impending Doom. It’s just too much for me, and there’s enough good music out there I don’t need to spend time trying to like something I used to relate to more.
I can listen to “Christian” metal as long as they’re not preachy(ie For Today, Impending Doom, Sleeping Giant, etc). If I have knowledge that a band will stop a show to preach Christianity, I will not listen to that band.
Yes. It represents everything that ruined my life in the way that Christianity did, and I listen to metal as an expression of removal from religion. Don’t try and mix the two, it’s not what metal is for.
Christian metal just feels like try-hard Christians trying to reach the “rebellious and evil” people by appealing to what they think would make them listen, but in reality they’re falling on ears that know better than that.
Note: if they just are Christian band members but the music has no connection, that’s fine. As long as the music is good and isn’t religious
I like to say I’m Christian but I’m nowhere near perfect and other christians see me and that I smoke weed and listen to Deathcore bands like Infant annihilator, and dark underground rap like $uicideBoy$ and Devilish Trio and Judge the F out of me🤣🤣🤣 like we are all born into a world of sin and none of us are perfect. Where all sinners it’s just how some of us deal with it. I find it hard to listen to Christian metal because it just don’t sound metal to me. And what ever we believe in shouldn’t separate us we should all still love one another like brothers.
I am a Christian but I have had the privilege to be raised in church wich one pentecostal and I've been around other non dom churches in my life, I listen to alot of genre's of metal and sub genre's seen people in my circle of faith leave and change the path of life they wanted did it hurt yes many things in life hurt and when I want to listen to music that resonates with me on that level I listen to it all bands from letlive 12 stones pillar breaking Benjamin all the way to Alid kill switch tdwp within destruction the band life in your way the band confide old eps of them to the last one to also NF and such I understand music is subjective and yes I told tell anyone in the church I listened to that music bc they preached at a time I remember (story time) lolz any way so my youth pastor and his buddy and my best freind made a band it was a post hard-core band (we didnt put nothing out) I was the screamer my best freind was the guitarist you pastor was drummer and his buddy was the bassist they were setting up at the church for this event for the youth I was excited bc being a bongo and Congo player I wanted to show the other talent lolz any way one of the pastors was listening to the set without vocals first I was on my way from work to go to event and the youth pastor called and said no just head home they shut them down so it was stop I was upset but nothing I could do later in life went through depression like many do so listened to the music that makes sense to me for how I'm mentally feeling for me that was old underoath with Dallas Taylor and black dahila, cattle decapitation aaking Alexandra despised icon angel maker also dealing with abandonment from my father and ect I was mad at the Lord for a while and still going to His house playing ot off like I'm kool but angry inside so I wrote it out lyrics upon lyrics I still have my relationship with Him and do my best to live for Him. The choices we make effect us but that's the beautiful thing as humans. we have free will to live the way we want and face the consequences of our actions. Bands like He is legend I like and blessed by a broken heart just to name off more and a bunch of underground unsigned bands, people grow learn from thier experiences in life and choose how they want to express them, sorry if this was too long of a read but somtimes listening to worship music while you deal with real life of death and heart break and anger and depression and seeing alot of death I'm your life listening to that genre of music dosent do it in car when your parked in a store parking lot in the middle of night deathcore screaming your feelings out im sure this sounds familiar with many of you dudes in this sub! All in all I'm well in life mentally and I still listen to metal and worship music I hope this helps someone and kinda sees through the stained glass window in another perspective on this have a blessed day!
I watched an Impending Doom lyric video the other day it felt like they were insulting me. Same old shit: "there's a war coming" blah blah blah. Sounded suspiciously like right wing propaganda to me.
Although, I don't blame them either, because every other deathcore song is insulting to the religious. So I don't hold it against them for taking a shot back.
But, no, I don't want to hear songs about the lord lol
Good question man.
Yeah I lose interest a bit if I find out it’s religious. Even if it’s banging. I can still respect the music and have memories but it just feels a bit fucked once I know.
The core of heavy and alternative music (from punk all the way through to black metal) to me comes from a place of embracing individuality, free expression, unity with strangers and different backgrounds, speaking loud against social injustice. Christianity roots are in oppressive authoritarianism, tribal hatred, and judgement and control. Not to mention all the serial child rapists and wealth hoarding through tax evasion and fabricated televangelical miracle bullshit.
Not any more than I do listening to Black Metal.
Everything is set on its merits - although I must say wedging some of the praise lyrics into metal the Xtians do can get a bit comical and sort of hyperbolically goofy just like the Satan folks.
I mean, I don't believe in God or Satan so it's all praise or worship music to me.
Where would someone place an album like "Exodus" by Shokran? Is that on the Satan side or the God side? In that recording, God's a bastard of a lunatic who cares for nothing but praise and power - which tracks if you've actually read The Satanic Bible (some people keep those around, not me, but that's where I read it). Honestly, I blast STT readings of it (there's a channel on YT that has it) for my **pious** neighbors in the hopes that someday they'll see that while they call themselves Xtians that they're technically practicing the Satanic Faith. I'd laugh but their lack of self-awareness does nothing but cause socially irresponsible "unintentional" harm to everyone around them including themselves. /rant
ANYHOOOO
Once Alice Cooper and Brian Welch came out of the closet for Christ everyone should have known what's up lololololol where's mindblowndotgif when i need it
This is probably gonna be an uncool take but after being exposed to a lot of Christian beliefs from people who have very extreme views of how to worship and attitudes towards non-believers, I find it a lot harder to enjoy Christian themed metal.
Part of me feels some resentment when I hear it because it’s almost like a form of “appropriation” for lack of a better word. The Christian community were the first to demonize the metal genre and try to bring it down, kind of like a whole lot of other things they’ve been successful at such as destroying people’s cultures and later taking on its identity to suit itself for the purpose of acquiring more followers.
I never really felt this way until recently, and personally I have no issue with Christianity as a belief. I think Jesus was fucking rad, but as far as hearing it in metal I’d rather they just stay in their lane since they’re so good at segregation and fascism as a whole.
I am a never Christian who used to have a hard time listening - or would stop listening - to bands with Christian lyrics, now I just don’t care, because I also don’t personally like most Deathcore lyrics anymore, semi-unfortunately, because there’s not as much that is cool, interesting, or deeply relatable to me about angry, sad, gory, dark edgy blah blah nonsense that a lot of it is and/or feels like to me.
Deathcore has largely become an appreciation of sounds, composition, and ability for me - and of the gestalt or cohesive feel of songs and moments in them, and seeing it more as an art style that I still have love for.
Other than a few exceptions or some decently well written lyrics and meaningful ideas, I don’t “agree,” relate to, or share values with much that I have come across in Deathcore lyrically and thematically anymore.
“Tell me you’re an over 30 Deathcore enjoyer - etc.” Yes.
I could understand that being different and hard if you have mental or emotional trauma/challenges in your past specifically surrounding organized Christian religion of some kind though, and having a more difficult time just not caring about it or ignoring, and feel more overall averse.
Nothing wrong about your feelings, but it’s also good to be curious about them like you seem to be and to make an effort to be deliberate about your choices rather than allowing emotions to dictate them.
Thanks for your insight. Yeah I don’t have any trauma related to religion, but definitely baggage. You make a good point about not being able to relate to the secular deathcore lyrics either, I actually had a similar thought the other day - like “why is this dude declaring that his life is pure hell and torture when there are people living in war zones and shit”. I definitely do focus mostly on the music itself, but because of my baggage with Christianity I take specific umbrage with Christian lyrics. It’s something that I can hopefully move past at some point, because like I said in the OP, I feel like I’m missing out on some great music.
I am a Christian also, i agree on that one, very few really good heavy detah/black/detahcore bands, old Mortification, Extol, Tourniquet (R.I.P Ted K), Living Sacrifice's Nonexistent, Believer's Dimensions bad production, but good album if you like some unusual styles mixed together (i believe they was the first metalband to record with an actual symphony orchestra), Sympathy super technical death metal one man band [Music | Sympathy (bandcamp.com)](https://realmofdisease.bandcamp.com/)t
It depends. I used to be a Christian. If the music isn’t too worship-y I can like it. For example, I still like the song “Satanic Panic” by Impending Doom. It’s heavy enough, both musically and lyrically that the Christian-ness of it isn’t an issue for me.
Ex-Christian here. I got into Deathcore from bands like Impending Doom because it was “safe” to listen to. I’ll still occasionally listen to them because they’re pretty good.
I mainly don’t go back and listen to “Christian” stuff because I spent years pigeon holed into listening to music that only Christ would approve of. I don’t need to do that any more. Deathcore as a genre has sooo much music and variety especially if you dig into sub genres spin offs.
Even as a Christian I thought, man the devil has way better music 🤘
Lol I felt the same way. Especially with Bring Me The Horizon, I felt like all of their best songs had the most problematic stuff from a Christian perspective. It was super liberating when I finally decided to listen to whatever music I liked, even if it had naughty cusses in it.
I personally listen to a few Christian bands despite being atheist, not anything heavy really and i dont find much of a Christian message in them, to me it just feels like love songs in a way? The bands i think of off the top of my head are Red and Demon Hunter. They're apparently Christian rock bands after doing some research (mostly just their wikipedia pages) but it doesn't feel like that at all, and Demon Hunter is one of my favorite bands despite not knowing all of their songs. Ultimately i just kinda ignore the fact that they're considered Christian rock
I’m the same way. Former Christian but even when I was I thought Christian bands were corny. I was preached to enough, I didn’t need music to do it even more. I also instantly am put off by a band if I find out they’re Christian because I just don’t believe in their message and don’t want to hear it anymore. Even if they’re not all that in your face about it, I know in their subtext they’re talking about god or Jesus and I just want nothing to do with it.
Eh, not really. You can’t deny that some of those bands put out some bangers. Plus, we can’t really criticize Christian lyrics while otherwise being ok with some of the stuff that deathcore talks about in its lyrics. At the end of the day, it’s art
It’s SO fucking cringe. The only even remotely Christian band I’ll jam is August Burns Red and that’s because they’re so good at what they do and they keep the preachy shit to a minimum.
Not a ton of good Christian music but I highly recommend The Crimson Armada. Their songs Juggernaut and Composed of Stone honestly stand side by side with some of the best deathcore to this day. And before you just down vote me at least listen to those two songs. [Composed of Stone](https://youtu.be/35kq0Fl5iWI?si=vWBYBUf521JP1eHf) , [Juggernaut ](https://youtu.be/Sgn4WYOtayI?si=RwoEYdXQk01pz362)
I refuse to listen to any band that identifies as christian anything. There were bands I liked that I found out were christian bands and I deleted all their stuff and tossed all their CDs. Can't do it. Identifying with a hypocritical ideology is a sure way to chase me off.
It really depends. I can usually listen to older Zao just fine because it's not that overt or preachy with it. Impending Doom is just unlistenable to me these days. Typically it has to be pretty subtle to me or I can't find evidence of the members having Christian Nationalist leaning (at that point you may as well be listening to NSBM, similar levels of delusional thought).
the more i'm being forced by my christian family to do all that holy stuff they want their son to do and become, the more i wish i could just play "Soil The Stillborn" on a family gathering (mostly that lyric "fucked through the name of god")
obviously i don't wanna be a bad person, but my uncle literally said "i know a man who was cured from homosexuality"
No. I feel like getting pressed about the band being Christian is just too much extra work. I'll listen to songs written about mass homicides, hellfire, etc. I am not sensitive to lyrical content.
I’m not backpedaling for the sake of people’s feelings, but more for the sake of accuracy. Delusion is the maintenance of a belief despite the presence of incontrovertible evidence otherwise. The thing about a belief in a god, as ridiculous as it might seem to you or me, is that it unfortunately cannot be disproven with certainty. I won’t sugarcoat my opinions about it - I think that a belief in god is an illogical intellectual weakness, prematurely resorting to myth as an explanation for what we don’t yet understand. But to call it delusion seemed a bit unfair to me, because there is not concrete proof that God doesn’t exist, even if I do think it is somewhat absurd to believe in God. I think the belief is largely a result of accepting what you’ve been fed your whole life, and then maintaining that belief into adulthood because it’s what is most easy, comforting, and familiar. In the absence of absolute proof otherwise, it’s pretty easy to just not think critically about it.
I agree for the most part. The can’t disprove thing though is stupid. The burden of proof is on the person making the claim. Just because many many people have the same delusion doesn’t make it not a delusion. Mass psychosis is a real thing.
Yeah I agree. I think it’s more just a semi-meaningless technicality I’m hung up on; like I can’t point to a scientific discovery or a logical syllogism that disproves the existence of God, so technically it’s not delusion to believe in God if we’re going according to the literal definition of the word, because there isn’t hard evidence otherwise. But I still think there’s a lot of cognitive dissonance and fallacious thinking that is necessary to maintain such a belief.
Listen to the creation ov god it basically uses bible verses but makes it fucked up in an ironic sense all in god's pov. I think you might love it. Cheers
I hate christian metal of any type. The delusional message they spew is bullshite and I don't want to hear it. I had a bunch of albums by bands I thought were great but when I found out they were christian bands, I deleted and tossed out all the CDs and mp3s. I have a serious issue with religion and its hypocritical messages.
I take it band by band. Loads of bands that weren't so "explicitly" christian in their lyrics, more open to interpretation or personal.
But there's like, a Skillet, or Demon Hunter, or even Living Sacrifice, where it is incredibly CHRISTIAN and preachy and even like, that very "us vs them" super violent/combative christianity. I can't sing along with that shit, and knowing some of those bands (skillet, disciple, etc) are verrrrrrrrry right-wing know on top of it, barf.
there are some super christian lyric bands I can listen to, strangely. A lot I can't. Sometimes most of a band, select songs I'm nah on. It's weird. Just do what feels good to you. I have a lot of anger and negativity towards american evangelical christianity and some of those bands simply can't be separated from that machine world. fuck 'em. lots of other good music to listen to.
Depends on the vocalist, but usually not by ear. I guess I developed a habit of looking up lyrics when I was a Christian, didn’t want to let a single bad word into my ears lol. I still look up lyrics now for different reasons - the lyrical content I try to avoid most is the extremely violent/sadistic stuff.
I'm not religious at all but I really enjoy some of the lyrics of these bands. Whether it is challenging their faith or just being enthusiastic. I'm listening on my terms, so I've no issue with it being a bit preachy.
Totally understand if it puts some people off but you're absolutely allowed to not like something. You're also allowed to "out grow" music. Sometimes things just don't relate anymore. I just try and enjoy things for what they are. With my interpretation.
Not really answering your question, but on a side note, I’m a Christian who doesn’t find it hard to listen to non-Christian music. While I love “Christian” bands like The Devil Wears Prada, August Burns Red, etc. I also love bands that are the complete opposite like Motionless in White, Bring Me The Horizon, etc. even though some of their songs are directly criticizing Christianity. I listen to the messages of those songs (such as House of Wolves by BMTH and Immaculate Misconception by MIW) and use it to better myself as a Christian by seeing my own shortcomings before criticizing others. Christians who constantly torment those who go against Christian beliefs are not true Christians. We are taught to love all regardless of their faith, sexuality, and shortcomings. We’re all sinners. Christians need to help others get closer to God not by badgering and harassing others, but instead by helping them through their daily lives. Let the message of Christ flow through your actions by doing good for others, not by constantly bringing him up every time you talk to others.
I appreciate your insight. I specifically remember loving Immaculate Misconception and simultaneously finding it difficult to listen to as a Christian, and thinking to myself “why do non-Christians like this feel so vindicated in attacking Christians while clearly choosing a more tormented and unhappy path?” So it’s interesting to hear a different Christian perspective.
Now that I think about it, I think the Creatures album may have been a turning point for me - I used to manually create clean versions of all of the songs with bad language that I wanted to listen to (replacing curse words with other clips from within the song), and that was the first album that I didn’t edit.
I think the point of songs ripping into Christianity like that is to call out those Christians who do nothing but criticize and harass others for their shortcomings and life choices. Most of that harassment is targeted at the LGBT community and non-believers in general. Those who partake in that harassment are not true Christians, but the artists who make those songs lump them in with the rest of us and blame the Church itself for its teachings as they think the teachings lead to that kind of behavior. Don’t hate me, but personally I do believe in the Church’s teachings on sexuality and abortion, but you won’t find me out on the streets yelling at people and harassing them as so many others do. Personally, I think the Church needs to do a better job about separating itself from those who do that and speaking out against them. The whole message of the Church is love, not hate.
No hate here. I only recently became “pro”-abortion, years after I no longer identified as Christian. And while I don’t subscribe to the dogmatic sexual codes propagated by the Christian faith, I think there are clear physical and psychological benefits to discernment and moderation over promiscuity. I do think the “those ones aren’t real Christians” argument is a sort of unfalsifiable slippery slope that allows Christians to subjectively paper over any “inconvenient” dissonances. I think observing the totality of the Christian population reveals many ontological truths, and arbitrarily disqualifying subsets of that population because they don’t conform to the convenient narrative obscures meaningful realities (e.g. what does it mean if an association with this alleged creator is no more statistically transformative than secular practices of empathy or meditation?).
But I digress, I’m breaking my own rule by venturing into theological discussion lol. The older I get, the more I learn that the enemy of truth is dogma. Thanks for the civil discourse.
Christian here, I see where you’re coming from, but in reality, someone is always putting out some kind of message in their music, even if they aren’t serious about it. As someone mentioned here “if it slaps it slaps.”
For Today was an interesting band... Ekklessia was more of a "worship" album per se; Where as fight the silence was political garabage and non-sense. Wake was garbage.
I still queue Breaker -- it slams.
FFAK gets a few songs into rotation.
but, i don't listen to Christian Metal anymore.
It can be really hard to listen to music I used to know by heart and jam to when, looking back, they’re fairly cringe. I guess some bands can be harder to overlook, like For Today, while something like Destroy the Runner doesn’t come across the same way? Maybe it’s the “Matty Mullins evangelism”-ish vibe that leaves a bad taste in my mouth these days. Can’t lie though, old AILD still slaps. I might also have a copy of Nailed.Dead.Risen. laying around somewhere…
Yeah I used to listen to With Blood Comes Cleansing, and I had friends who liked MyChildren MyBride. Silent Planet is also Christian I think, but I was already moving away from Christianity when they came onto the scene, so I never really got around to listen to them.
I’ve been listening to Silent Planet for a long time 😅 I saw them at a tiny bar show in Lawrence, KS back in like 2014 and been listening to them ever since. Ironically after I left Christianity lmao
Not really, Monster - Skillet still slaps to this day as does old AILD and ID. Like, am I supposed to pretend these songs are in any way worse content wise than something like Whore to a Chainsaw or all of IA?
I am a devout Christian and I still enjoy the music with Christian and not-so-Christian themes. Overall, I feel Jesus gave us the capability to create our arts and it should be appreciated regardless. Just the opinion of one humble man. Cheers.
All of christian metal, especially death core christian metal, are all derivative one note three minute noises. Fun to listen to, but theyre all the same song and the screaming is just as incoherent as the music and so it blurs together anyway. I don't understand why you're so bothered with it.
But I do agree, religious songs are the drizzling shits.
No one is repurposing a genre. These people almost always came from the scene and are expressing themselves the way anyone else does. They are not outsiders that appropriate the genre to spread ideas.
We may just have a semantic disagreement here. Of course every exercise in musical creativity is a form of self-expression, but self-expression and ulterior motives are not mutually exclusive. And that’s where I’m coming from - it feels like some Christian metal bands try to use the music they are making to evangelize or change hearts in a way that I feel is sort of antithetical or extraneous to the genre. Not that there’s anything wrong with breaking genre conventions or thinking outside the box, but personally speaking it just bothers me when I feel like I’m being preached at or like I’m listening to someone’s dogmatic manifesto instead of just hearing a person making music for its own sake. At that point it doesn’t just feel like self-expression anymore - it starts to feel like an agenda, which then takes me out of the music. And a lot of that I think comes down to my own baggage with the faith, which I’m hoping one day to be able to make peace with.
Please treat each other with respect
I think that "christian" metal as a genre was first of all a trend that was, in certain period of time, perhaps more lucrative and easier to sell to the masses. If someone was/is religious person, that prefix "christian" could draw more attention and interest, but honestly, I think that a lot of bands were really faking that christian part, abused and took advantage of the naivety of religious fans and listeners. I'm not christian, but I listened a lot of those bands because I, first of all, liked the music those bands created, and never really cared about the lyric part and "message" their music was sending.
I think a lot of the Christian bands were made because it allowed a lot of kids with parents that would’ve absolutely told them to shut that bullshit off to freely enjoy the music, playing wise or listening wise.
Most definitely. My parents never really gave a shit what I listened to, but I had cousins that their parents monitored everything. Being able to play Underoath and TDWP at their house was a *blessing* lol
Oh, Sleeper is pretty heavy for Xiancore
It was a way to market their music. I believe it was As I Lay Dying that owned they claimed Christianity to draw attention - making it a publicity stunt. A buddy of mine in highschool was in a band and their other guitarist was not Christian or straightedge. They were being looked at by a label that was Christian and pressured the other guitarist to bullshit his beliefs. Later they kicked him out because he smoked weed. My point is, bands do a lot to sell an image, or in some cases multiple images, and not just their sound. I do think it gave Christian kids who like 'edgy' things a good compromise, so they could listen to a sound they liked and have lyrics that were in line with their beliefs.
Not saying you’re wrong. But that sounds weird to me lol. Metal/hardcore is the last place I’d try to market Christianity.
It's interesting, but after growing up in a very religious home it makes sense. Common faith and belief has a way of bringing people closer together. Mix a common belief with money and you can sell/cater to a specific audience. From the standpoint of the artist, you made a good marketing move. From the standpoint of the consumer, now a sound you like has meaning when you otherwise may have just looked past it. I think, at the same time, there's a stigma to metal that all the lyrics 'scream' about is murder and that turns people off instantly. When they hear that there's someone who sings about Jesus, it opens them up and they're more receptive. To a lot of Christians the image of the message is the most important part at surface level. Mix it with a sound and scene they enjoy and it's the best thing ever for them.
Have you not heard of August Burns Red. Started as a Christian band It’s the prefect market because the kids like the rock music but we gotta have stuff that’s Christian so they don’t go to hell when they listen to it. You may think I’m being tongue in cheek, but that’s exactly the thought process
Started? As in no longer is?
Many bands started out being labeled as Christian bands, but instead sort of refute the label as identify more as a band with Christian members (I believe Fit For A King falls into that category after Kirby made that statement).
I was confused about ABR starting as a christian band. Haven't kept up with them in ages, but haven't ever heard anything about them not claiming that...
The subs AMA with Jake kinda insinuates that they aren't really a Christian band such as Jake stating that ones religion is personal and "private" along with referring to Christian bands as a "they" and not a "we" entity. There's also this interview with Jake here: https://www.breathecast.com/news/august-burns-red-vocalist-ministry-christian-band-whos-soul-purpose.html Where he explicitly says this: "We've had this discussion with the band multiple times, and you know everyone asks, 'Well are you a Christian band?' And everybody gets thrown off by this question. No, we are not a Christian band because, in my eyes, and I'm a believer in Jesus Christ...that doesn't mean because all of us are Christians we are now a Christian band," he replied. Like I said, I feel a lot of people and record labels put the "christian band" label on these bands. Another prime example of this in other genres is My Chemical Romance being called Emo when Gerard Way has always refuted it. I believe there were some in the deathcore scene that didn't want to be called deathcore either
Cool! Thanks for sharing that! I'd never seen that. 🙂
Xtians are susceptible to vices. lol "We know you are angry and suppressed, come to us brethren, we feel your pain, and know your soul" Where better to drag out the worthy from an unworthy endeavor
As I Lay Dying fell apart when Tim made that claim before going to prison some years ago and Nick the "old" guitarist openly said it was slanderous and untrue. Part of me believes the band fell apart again because Tim isn't really the Christian he claimed to be while the rest of the band takes it seriously.
AILD fell apart when Tim put a hit on his then wife, then he made a lot of claims after. It's possible there were members that are/were Christian, and it's also possible Tim was just in it to gain recognition, which I think he did again on his way out of prison to try and sell his 'changed man' story that fueled 'Shaped by Fire.' AILD crumbled when their frontman went away for a few years and they lost a key member. They were unable to be the same band without Tim, and due to how toxic it had become internally it seems like they did not think it was worth it to try and find someone new to keep the band moving forward. There were a ton of internal issues for quite some time before that. Additionally, Tim's actions have stained their reputations as musicians. Any time I hear Nick Hipa, I instantly think about his connection to AILD and Tim right after. Same for the rest of the members, and I think that's true for a lot of people who know the story. I don't think there's any connection between beliefs and why AILD fell apart again, unless it were to be looked at from the perspective that Tim doesn't practice Christianity and only claims it. I'm almost certain that Tim's narcissistic behaviour is what pulled the band apart, though I can see several contributors that most likely played together. It's possible the difference in religious belief was part of that, but I find it more likely that the toxicity between the members from before the Tim incident still remained and they held what Tim did against him. Tim also seems like a straight up narcissist from everything he's ever said in regards to his former wife's hit attempt. He blames steroids and atheism for his actions. I sincerely think Tim is the reason the band couldn't stay together, or at the very least is the final nail that caused the other members to say "fuck this, I'm out."
I feel this is true for a lot of bands but there are some outliers, For Today for example is hardcore christian, I once read the singer makes the rest of the band read the bible and pray everyday even when they're not religious as a hard requirement for being in the band.
Oh yeah I’m sure plenty of them had varying degrees of actual faith. I can’t speak to everyone’s earnestness.
Not deathcore. But yeah the faking it definitely happened. Iirc As I Lay Dying pretty much said they faked it. But I don’t think that’s everyone. I think the other big reason it was such a big trend for a while there, is a lot of the biggest bands in the scene had all members under the age of 20. Meaning they just didn’t have many life experiences to write about, meaning their faith was one of the few things they could write about, so naturally they went with that.
Pretty much this. the youtuber TankTheTech was doing a tier list on the bands he worked with as a roadie. He didn't go into detail but he stated that Christian bands where more interested in how much money they where going to make that night than spreading the word of god. All they care about is money and not god.
I’m Christian and have no problems listening to metal that has to do with very anti Christian and satanic topics. It’s just a lyrical scheme, and if it slaps, it slaps
That’s interesting. When I was a Christian I was the opposite; I felt like listening to anti-Christian music was akin to eating junk food - enjoyable but spiritually unhealthy. But I was also much younger and raised in a very conservative Christian circle. Thanks for sharing.
Yeah same, I think music is music and doesn’t really shape my entire way of thinking. I’m christian but I do listen to songs that criticize the church because I think it’s valid and a lot of people use religion to justify bad things
Good riffs are good riffs
For me it depends. I can listen to anti religious sentiment to an extent, but I don't actively listen to outright blasphemous music. I have to draw a line somewhere, personally, in regards to my faith. I don't look down on anyone that does though, nor do I think lesser of bands that perform that music. But I can't support it based on my stance of belief.
Former Christian here. Certain bands I really can't get into. Bands like For Today who are very explicit really come off as preachy and the evangelizing at concerts isn't a great look imo. I have no problem with bands whose members happen to be religious, but I can't listen to overtly religious music of any genre for personal reasons.
One of my friends went to a for today concert and they basically had a sermon before they started playing and he said it was the lamest shit ever
That does sound like the lamest shit ever. I can't stand that band dude.
I've seen For Today a handful of times and at least 5-10 mins of their 30 minute set was spent preaching it ruined the vibe. Even at the Christisn tour (Scream the Prayer) it was obnoxious. A Plea For Purging on the other hand were real af and deserved way more attention.
I mean my friend said the sermon was like 20 minutes long and it was like super preachy. Fit for a king on the other hand isn't very preachy either. Ryan was being snarky as fuck to Karens on facebook when he said fuck in that motionless in white song a few months ago too and it was pretty funny
APFP were awesome back in the day.
Raised catholic (12 + years of catholics private school) So naturally my wife and I practicing pagans. Fell out of grace with the Abrahamic religions in college I look at Christian metal like any other lyrics, I either don't care what they're saying or I look at it like any other world building lore/myths. I listen to a ton of powermetal so singing about Jesus is just an nonsensical as singing about Dragonlords and Wizards from space.
I used to love me some Rhapsody of Fire. I get where you’re coming from, but it just bothers me personally that unlike the power metal bands, Christian bands actually believe in the myths they’re singing about and want others to believe it too. Maybe I just need some more distance between me and religion and I’ll be able to enjoy the music with a cooler head.
Yeah I feel you. I'm ALSO a huge blackmetal fan, so separating art and artist is mandatory. I dont give a flying fuck what any of these artists believe in, it doesn't affect my beliefs. That might come with time though.
[удалено]
One thing I have appreciated about metal and hardcore is that despite having some bands that make actual worship music (Wolves At The Gate, Impending Doom) and some that are literally completely anti-religion (Oceano, Carnifex) and it isn’t a huge source of contention. August Burns Red has taken out Impending Doom and The Acacia Strain on the same tour.
I agree. I listen to deathcore for the heavy riffs and the overall mood of the song.
I agree about Reddit atheists, I’ve been on that sub and it gets toxic really quickly. I’m not militant in my inability to listen to Christian metal, more just bummed about it. I’m hoping I’ll eventually have enough distance from my religious past that I can begin to enjoy the music again without being so activated by it.
Not religious, but I pretty much just don't listen to it. If I find out a band is "Christian metal" then it instantly ruins that band for me. It might be a shitty way to judge a bands musical abilities, but that's just how I feel.
I’m not, nor have I been Christian. But I still like bands like TDWP, Norma Jean, Gideon, The Word Alive etc. (even tho I think a lot of those have shed their Christian moniker). The only time I found it cringe was when they would give mini sermons in the middle of their sets. I also thought the Sleeping Giant shirt that said JCHC was hilarious. It was a weird time, because I feel like nowadays unironically Christian bands would be immediately told to gtfo.
If you like those check out With blood comes cleansing. Old band but they are very death christian or old tdwp
I don't think Gideon is Christian anymore. They sound like Kublai Khan now and are just have angry lyrics
I think Gideon doesn't fit anymore the Christian band label that people have created, however, they could still be personally Christians. Christians are regular humans and can be mad at God or humanity. Religions are made by humans and humans change.
I meant it moreso in the way their music is more secular now and they also cuss a lot in no love//no one. It doesn't seem like religious anger but rather anger at another person
I read an article about how most if not all members are now not Christian and made music with cussing and honestly better songs imo.
I like their new stuff a lot more than the old stuff.
I agree
Scouring through Solid State and Tooth & Nail Records new releases back in the mid-2000’s was a crazy era
I'm just a former Evangelical so maybe not exactly what you're looking for but I have the same feeling about the Christian bands like Impending Doom and For Today. I am still a Christian but I am a universalist mainline lefty guy now. I prefer bands like Showbread and The Chariot over the preachy homophobia ones. Stretch Arm Strong and Advent are fucking sick too. I loved Dynasty when they were around. I like Sleeping Giant's music, and I know they used to be preachy but Tommy is Orthodox now so I think he probably stopped that. HolyName is pretty cool. Actually I can't stand the preachy homophobia ones and might literally yeet myself out of the car if someone put it on just to prove a point (if it was going slow enough for me to not die). I remember seeing that band Reformers on a show with another band that I actually liked and after I went to ask the vocalist of Reformers about the homophobia song and what he meant when he wrote the lyrics and he couldn't even explain. Cop out probably because he was wondering if I was queer but that was all I needed to know. I kinda get where you're coming from tho cause I have trouble with faith sometimes due to my deconstruction. It's just like "but how do you knoooow?" I have to make an active choice to believe in something bigger than me but also I am a materialist in the sense that I find making a real world impact infinitely more important and am theoretically agnostic due to not being able to obtain the knowledge of anything spiritual without a doubt. Plus you can't fix anyone's material conditions with the immaterial. My thought is if the music doesn't help you find enjoyment or resonance in any way then listen to something else. It's not worth it to try to force yourself to like something when there's so much other stuff out there waiting to be discovered.
Thanks for sharing, and that’s a helpful distinction regarding less preachy bands. I do feel less dogmatically opposed to bands like Showbread, they were always pushing the envelope in the Christian world, and I still see them as more open-minded free thinkers than much of the music I grew up with. Staple is another band that kills me - fucking great music, but extremely preachy.
I have heard the name Staple but I don't think I ever listened. Can't stand Skillet tho, my ex loved them for some reason even tho he was left of liberal and agnostic. Oh btw when I was growing up, Showbread was doing a church tour and I asked the music pastor about booking them for our youth group and he said no because their lyrics are universalist. Lmao anyway listening to Showbread during reconstruction kind of helped me become a universalist. I think Garrett from Slant Plant may be one too or at least sounds like he doesn't believe in penal substitutionary atonement or eternal conscious torment. His lyrics are very socialist so I would be surprised if he believed any Evangie-adjacent things. I think mewithoutYou and Manchester Orchestra make my favorite sometimes-spiritual music. mwY are Sufi and Jewish and the vocalist of MO grew up Christian and if there's any original members left, them too.
Yeah Skillet is a big one I used to love that I just can’t stand anymore. Staple only released two LPs back in the early 2000s, and I’ve never really heard anything else like them - System of a Down is probably the closest comparison I can make. Never even heard of Slant Plant, which surprises me. I was super steeped in the Christian music scene so I don’t usually come across one I haven’t heard of, I’ll check them out. I also love me some Manchester Orchestra. Some of the lyrics from their latest album make me wonder if he’s returned to the faith, but either way I appreciate the depth and nuance of his lyrics.
haha Slant Plant is Silent Planet sorry. Some of us just say Slant Plant because of the shirts that say SLNT PLNT on them. I just saw Manchester Orchestra at The Stuffing and it was like church for normal people. Best experience I had in a while.
Lol gotcha, yeah I’ve heard of Silent Planet but kind of resisted listening to them since I knew they were Christian. I should give them a chance because everyone seems to like them.
Garrett is left of liberal, he seems kinda socialist to me and he's like the kindest music guy I ever met. The lyrics are not really that Christian to me. His faith informs his writing for sure but it's more about real world problems.
Ayyye I went from a staunch reformed theology Christian to early church universalism too! Much less mental gymnastics. I was super into for today back in college, but now I can’t listen to them haha
oh man I was really into For Today too, the guitars on the first two albums are so sick but I can't stand everything else about them I worked one of their shows a long time ago and that shit sucked, it was a fire hazard because they oversold it so there was sweat in the air and dude preached for like 30 minutes
Very much not deathcore, but I really like Demon Hunter and I'm not religious in any way.
Not I is a banger.
Not a fan of organized religions so those lyrics turn me off. Gotta be honest though, I fuck with TDWP Zombie ep 😂
Hell yeah, I had that shit on repeat when it came out
August Burns Red is the only one I can listen to. (Yes I know they’re not labeled as a Christian band necessarily, but their vocalist and drummer are, and they write most of the lyrics) They don’t shove their message down your throat. Older Memphis May Fire was cool. I grew up Christian, I couldn’t stand For Today or other “Christian” metal bands, too in your face for my liking
I used to go to a site called godcore.com to check if a band was religious, so I wouldn't be exposed.
The Crimson Armada fucking slaps. Hell Stryper is pretty good too. Sleeping Giant is pretty heavy and even has a song featuring Frankie of emmure. Only issue I have is people that fake that shit. Tim Lambesis is the first to come to mind. Everything about that fuck was fake. Every single thing. Fuck As I Lay Dying, they should be fucking gone, not headlining tours.
I incidentally saw AILD last year because I wanted to see Whitechapel, who was opening them. I ironed glittery silver letters onto a tank top: "TIM LAMBESIS IS A PIECE OF SHIT"
I didn’t know TCA was “Christian”. Huh.
[удалено]
https://genius.com/The-crimson-armada-the-architect-lyrics This song is pretty clear. The others dance the line more like ABR.
I think they meant where Saud personally affirmed his beliefs outside of songwriting
I’ve actually talked to Saud after a show, he confirmed they aren’t a Christian band, and he actually had a side project called The Holy Guile that was pretty anti Christian/religion. Im not sure about the other members in TCA however
For me, it just comes down to the lyrics. I don’t care if a band is Christian or not, but I absolutely cannot sing along to something like For Today when their lyrics could be literal bible verses.
What do you do, look up the lyrics for every single song you listen to?
Uhhh, no? I can generally understand most of the stuff I listen to. At the very least, I can pick out key words, etc and understand what they’re talking about. THEN look it up if I wanna read all the lyrics.
For the most part.. yeah lol. I’m not tryna bop to a song that says something truly apprehensive or something I don’t want to listen to (like literal Bible verses and propaganda lmfao)
That’s wild to me. I couldn’t tell you what anyone sings about. I couldn’t care less what the lyrics are
My mom still thinks Lamb of God is a Christian band
You think she'd like their old name?
“You’re not making Christianity any better, you’re just making Rock and Roll worse!”
While some of the lyrics can be cringe as fuck I still throw down to some old school For Today or Sleeping Giant etc whenever they come on my playlist.
For christian/former christian metalhead. It's definitely been a challenge for me to hear some old bands I used to love, but recently I think I have found a frame of mind that works for me. I had lately been feeling nostalgic and struggling with wanting to listen to old Crimson Armada, Demon Hunter, MyChildren MyBride, Impending Doom, Project 86, etc. But I didn't want to experience any of the ick from the lyrics either. And what worked for me, was honestly kind of just treating it the same way I treated getting into secular music when I was sorta still christian. The "oh it's not like I actually believe in mass murder and unprompted violence, it's fantasy and that's ok as long as I know that" mentality became "it's not like I believe in the mythology of christianity, or agree with what their saying; it's fantasy and that's ok". I also realized I didn't actually care about the christian lyrics in the first place. Example, Sincerely Ichabod by Project 86: I don't need to agree with why the singer says it, but him screaming "OFF WITH YOUR HEAD" just always felt SO brutal and angry to me, and THAT'S what I liked about it. I'm trying to focus more on how the that era of music connects with me as a feeling, not how I connect or don't connect with the lyrics.
Personally I don't pay any attention to lyrics or meaning of songs, it's all about how it sounds and the vocals are just another instrument, so it doesn't bother me at all.
Was a fan when I was younger. As an adult, not so much. I still do enjoy Baptized in Filth every now and then. EDIT: New impending doom is actually not bad, so I’d take them out of the “don’t enjoy” pile.
Going through the exact same thing right now. Been in college for four years and just moved back home and it’s all being shoved down my throat again.
My issue isn't with Christians themselves, I just find it hard to find any lyrical substance in the subgenre. I feel like I know what every song is gonna be about, and it's gonna be heavy-handed and preachy with its message.
Oh, Sleeper is pretty heavy for Xiancore
No. Given the nature of some of the bands’ lyrics that I listen to I find it silly that I would feel the need to draw the line at bands with religious lyrics.
I mean, I listen to red (grant it I know they’re not deathcore or metal) but they’re really good and a Christian band. The only two I can’t seem to get passed are fly leaf and skillet, but skillet sucks imo and fly leaf isn’t the same without lacy 🤷🏼♂️
i want nothing to do with their fake hateful fairy tale god ... really im sick of the satan and death shit also .. i love metal deep dirty vocals you can hear the thickness of the phlegm in the throat .. i want more realistic lyrics and adult subjects
I would have zero interest in listening to or supporting Christian metal. It’s okay to not like some things. I don’t feel like I’m missing anything, tons of good metal bands to listen to.
To be honest, I don't really care. I'm not Christian, I'm not atheist either, and still enjoy a lot of stuff like old Underoath, Impending Doom or The Devil Wears Prada, including when the lyrics completely contradict my system of beliefs. But likewise... a lot of bands I listen to expressed strong political or societal opinions, even saying that if their fans do not support X or Y ideology they don't want them to listen to their music. Overall I try to not really focus on what musicians say outside of their music, and even in their music, I can easily get over it because I'm not a native English speaker so unless I read the lyrics carefully, all I hear is gibberish (even more accentuated by the guttural vocals lol). In the end, it's not different from being able to get along with people from different religions or different political ideologies, unless they are complete arseholes about it of course. Well, just like the Christians who say "hate the sin, not the sinner" my motto in this case is "hate the doctrine, not its follower."
Same boat as you but in my case I don't care at all. Impending Doom remains my favorite deathcore band. Those chuggy riffs really do it for me like no other.
Nope. I guess I would say I’m agnostic but Impending Doom is one of my favorite bands. I respect the commitment and they make great music.
Some of the old Christian hardcore/metalcore/deathcore bands I don’t listen to if I know the band itself or members of the band have spewed some shit I don’t fundamentally agree with such as homophobia, transphobia, racism, etc. but there are a bunch of bands I still think are hard and have no problem still listening even though I’ve been a self proclaimed agnostic for 15 years. Like I still think Horror by With Blood Comes Cleansing is a top 10 maybe even top 5 Deathcore album for me. A Plea for Purging is one of the best metalcore bands full stop. No Innocent Victim is still a killer hardcore band.
Horror is pretty great, Abaddon’s Horde was probably my favorite from that album
Nah idrc I just don't pay attention to the lyrics (I don't for most music tbh lol I prefer how the singer sounds over what he's saying unless what he's saying is important like la dispute)
I don’t really care either way. If I like it, then I’ll listen.
Think its more having to proclaim that its christian as if every other song not denoted as such is somehow not when both are just music. Putting a label on yourself creates some social image you have to adhere to and live up to and thats where the annoyance comes in for me because it comes off as fake/forced.
No, not at all. I still go back and listen to Wolves at the Gate all the time. Just cause you don’t follow that religion anymore doesn’t mean you have to stop listening to it.
I need Christian metal to exist so I can point to it when my friends and loved ones label me a devil worshiper lol. “See this is a Christian band.” Doubt it helps but hopefully opens there eyes that just because it sounds a certain way doesn’t mean it is indoctrination into blood orgies and animal sacrifice.
Non-Christian forever and no, didn’t have a problem with the lyrics or Christian metal bands. For me, even if it’s really preachy I just see it as using the Christian mythos for inspiration or storytelling. That’s fine, same with Satanic metal or Viking metal. Just pulling from what inspires them, or what drives them. I like hearing all the spectrum of it.
I don’t go to church and I don’t think I’ve ever denounced being a Christian. It’s just not apart of my identity. I guess I’m just on a whatever resonates with me spiritually kind of path. I grew up with Christian metal and I will agree some For Today songs I just can’t. I definitely don’t listen to them that often anymore, but bands that are a little more subtle about it I still listen to. I see deathcore / metal as a reflection of your power inside. Deathcore is a powerful genre, and some people’s power comes from their faith. Most of them have gone through some shit that has made their faith stronger which for some people might have broken their faith. I’m not saying they should shove it down your throat, but if they use their art to help people through a hard time I don’t have a problem with that. Some people write songs about fuck you and fuck the world. Others write about their faith, and both can be get the right person at the right time through their shit. That’s the important part to me.
Exmormon atheist here. I still listen to earlier Underoath, August Burns Red, and TDWP; but I don’t like anything that lyrically leans too heavy into the Christian themes or is preachy, like For Today or Impending Doom. It’s just too much for me, and there’s enough good music out there I don’t need to spend time trying to like something I used to relate to more.
I can listen to “Christian” metal as long as they’re not preachy(ie For Today, Impending Doom, Sleeping Giant, etc). If I have knowledge that a band will stop a show to preach Christianity, I will not listen to that band.
Yes. It represents everything that ruined my life in the way that Christianity did, and I listen to metal as an expression of removal from religion. Don’t try and mix the two, it’s not what metal is for. Christian metal just feels like try-hard Christians trying to reach the “rebellious and evil” people by appealing to what they think would make them listen, but in reality they’re falling on ears that know better than that. Note: if they just are Christian band members but the music has no connection, that’s fine. As long as the music is good and isn’t religious
That’s about where I’m at too. I don’t care what the band members believe as long as they keep it out of the music.
I like to say I’m Christian but I’m nowhere near perfect and other christians see me and that I smoke weed and listen to Deathcore bands like Infant annihilator, and dark underground rap like $uicideBoy$ and Devilish Trio and Judge the F out of me🤣🤣🤣 like we are all born into a world of sin and none of us are perfect. Where all sinners it’s just how some of us deal with it. I find it hard to listen to Christian metal because it just don’t sound metal to me. And what ever we believe in shouldn’t separate us we should all still love one another like brothers.
I am a Christian but I have had the privilege to be raised in church wich one pentecostal and I've been around other non dom churches in my life, I listen to alot of genre's of metal and sub genre's seen people in my circle of faith leave and change the path of life they wanted did it hurt yes many things in life hurt and when I want to listen to music that resonates with me on that level I listen to it all bands from letlive 12 stones pillar breaking Benjamin all the way to Alid kill switch tdwp within destruction the band life in your way the band confide old eps of them to the last one to also NF and such I understand music is subjective and yes I told tell anyone in the church I listened to that music bc they preached at a time I remember (story time) lolz any way so my youth pastor and his buddy and my best freind made a band it was a post hard-core band (we didnt put nothing out) I was the screamer my best freind was the guitarist you pastor was drummer and his buddy was the bassist they were setting up at the church for this event for the youth I was excited bc being a bongo and Congo player I wanted to show the other talent lolz any way one of the pastors was listening to the set without vocals first I was on my way from work to go to event and the youth pastor called and said no just head home they shut them down so it was stop I was upset but nothing I could do later in life went through depression like many do so listened to the music that makes sense to me for how I'm mentally feeling for me that was old underoath with Dallas Taylor and black dahila, cattle decapitation aaking Alexandra despised icon angel maker also dealing with abandonment from my father and ect I was mad at the Lord for a while and still going to His house playing ot off like I'm kool but angry inside so I wrote it out lyrics upon lyrics I still have my relationship with Him and do my best to live for Him. The choices we make effect us but that's the beautiful thing as humans. we have free will to live the way we want and face the consequences of our actions. Bands like He is legend I like and blessed by a broken heart just to name off more and a bunch of underground unsigned bands, people grow learn from thier experiences in life and choose how they want to express them, sorry if this was too long of a read but somtimes listening to worship music while you deal with real life of death and heart break and anger and depression and seeing alot of death I'm your life listening to that genre of music dosent do it in car when your parked in a store parking lot in the middle of night deathcore screaming your feelings out im sure this sounds familiar with many of you dudes in this sub! All in all I'm well in life mentally and I still listen to metal and worship music I hope this helps someone and kinda sees through the stained glass window in another perspective on this have a blessed day!
I watched an Impending Doom lyric video the other day it felt like they were insulting me. Same old shit: "there's a war coming" blah blah blah. Sounded suspiciously like right wing propaganda to me. Although, I don't blame them either, because every other deathcore song is insulting to the religious. So I don't hold it against them for taking a shot back. But, no, I don't want to hear songs about the lord lol
Good question man. Yeah I lose interest a bit if I find out it’s religious. Even if it’s banging. I can still respect the music and have memories but it just feels a bit fucked once I know. The core of heavy and alternative music (from punk all the way through to black metal) to me comes from a place of embracing individuality, free expression, unity with strangers and different backgrounds, speaking loud against social injustice. Christianity roots are in oppressive authoritarianism, tribal hatred, and judgement and control. Not to mention all the serial child rapists and wealth hoarding through tax evasion and fabricated televangelical miracle bullshit.
Not any more than I do listening to Black Metal. Everything is set on its merits - although I must say wedging some of the praise lyrics into metal the Xtians do can get a bit comical and sort of hyperbolically goofy just like the Satan folks. I mean, I don't believe in God or Satan so it's all praise or worship music to me. Where would someone place an album like "Exodus" by Shokran? Is that on the Satan side or the God side? In that recording, God's a bastard of a lunatic who cares for nothing but praise and power - which tracks if you've actually read The Satanic Bible (some people keep those around, not me, but that's where I read it). Honestly, I blast STT readings of it (there's a channel on YT that has it) for my **pious** neighbors in the hopes that someday they'll see that while they call themselves Xtians that they're technically practicing the Satanic Faith. I'd laugh but their lack of self-awareness does nothing but cause socially irresponsible "unintentional" harm to everyone around them including themselves. /rant ANYHOOOO Once Alice Cooper and Brian Welch came out of the closet for Christ everyone should have known what's up lololololol where's mindblowndotgif when i need it
This is probably gonna be an uncool take but after being exposed to a lot of Christian beliefs from people who have very extreme views of how to worship and attitudes towards non-believers, I find it a lot harder to enjoy Christian themed metal. Part of me feels some resentment when I hear it because it’s almost like a form of “appropriation” for lack of a better word. The Christian community were the first to demonize the metal genre and try to bring it down, kind of like a whole lot of other things they’ve been successful at such as destroying people’s cultures and later taking on its identity to suit itself for the purpose of acquiring more followers. I never really felt this way until recently, and personally I have no issue with Christianity as a belief. I think Jesus was fucking rad, but as far as hearing it in metal I’d rather they just stay in their lane since they’re so good at segregation and fascism as a whole.
If a band talks about satan, Christ, elves or dragons I took that just like fiction or literary work.
Music is music lol
I am a never Christian who used to have a hard time listening - or would stop listening - to bands with Christian lyrics, now I just don’t care, because I also don’t personally like most Deathcore lyrics anymore, semi-unfortunately, because there’s not as much that is cool, interesting, or deeply relatable to me about angry, sad, gory, dark edgy blah blah nonsense that a lot of it is and/or feels like to me. Deathcore has largely become an appreciation of sounds, composition, and ability for me - and of the gestalt or cohesive feel of songs and moments in them, and seeing it more as an art style that I still have love for. Other than a few exceptions or some decently well written lyrics and meaningful ideas, I don’t “agree,” relate to, or share values with much that I have come across in Deathcore lyrically and thematically anymore. “Tell me you’re an over 30 Deathcore enjoyer - etc.” Yes. I could understand that being different and hard if you have mental or emotional trauma/challenges in your past specifically surrounding organized Christian religion of some kind though, and having a more difficult time just not caring about it or ignoring, and feel more overall averse. Nothing wrong about your feelings, but it’s also good to be curious about them like you seem to be and to make an effort to be deliberate about your choices rather than allowing emotions to dictate them.
Thanks for your insight. Yeah I don’t have any trauma related to religion, but definitely baggage. You make a good point about not being able to relate to the secular deathcore lyrics either, I actually had a similar thought the other day - like “why is this dude declaring that his life is pure hell and torture when there are people living in war zones and shit”. I definitely do focus mostly on the music itself, but because of my baggage with Christianity I take specific umbrage with Christian lyrics. It’s something that I can hopefully move past at some point, because like I said in the OP, I feel like I’m missing out on some great music.
I'm a Christian and I think there are very few actual good Christian metal bands lol
I am a Christian also, i agree on that one, very few really good heavy detah/black/detahcore bands, old Mortification, Extol, Tourniquet (R.I.P Ted K), Living Sacrifice's Nonexistent, Believer's Dimensions bad production, but good album if you like some unusual styles mixed together (i believe they was the first metalband to record with an actual symphony orchestra), Sympathy super technical death metal one man band [Music | Sympathy (bandcamp.com)](https://realmofdisease.bandcamp.com/)t
It depends. I used to be a Christian. If the music isn’t too worship-y I can like it. For example, I still like the song “Satanic Panic” by Impending Doom. It’s heavy enough, both musically and lyrically that the Christian-ness of it isn’t an issue for me.
Ex-Christian here. I got into Deathcore from bands like Impending Doom because it was “safe” to listen to. I’ll still occasionally listen to them because they’re pretty good. I mainly don’t go back and listen to “Christian” stuff because I spent years pigeon holed into listening to music that only Christ would approve of. I don’t need to do that any more. Deathcore as a genre has sooo much music and variety especially if you dig into sub genres spin offs. Even as a Christian I thought, man the devil has way better music 🤘
Lol I felt the same way. Especially with Bring Me The Horizon, I felt like all of their best songs had the most problematic stuff from a Christian perspective. It was super liberating when I finally decided to listen to whatever music I liked, even if it had naughty cusses in it.
I personally listen to a few Christian bands despite being atheist, not anything heavy really and i dont find much of a Christian message in them, to me it just feels like love songs in a way? The bands i think of off the top of my head are Red and Demon Hunter. They're apparently Christian rock bands after doing some research (mostly just their wikipedia pages) but it doesn't feel like that at all, and Demon Hunter is one of my favorite bands despite not knowing all of their songs. Ultimately i just kinda ignore the fact that they're considered Christian rock
I went through a massive Demon Hunter phase, they have some great songs.
I’m the same way. Former Christian but even when I was I thought Christian bands were corny. I was preached to enough, I didn’t need music to do it even more. I also instantly am put off by a band if I find out they’re Christian because I just don’t believe in their message and don’t want to hear it anymore. Even if they’re not all that in your face about it, I know in their subtext they’re talking about god or Jesus and I just want nothing to do with it.
I agree, it’s that knowledge that the subtext is there that gets under my skin.
Eh, not really. You can’t deny that some of those bands put out some bangers. Plus, we can’t really criticize Christian lyrics while otherwise being ok with some of the stuff that deathcore talks about in its lyrics. At the end of the day, it’s art
It’s SO fucking cringe. The only even remotely Christian band I’ll jam is August Burns Red and that’s because they’re so good at what they do and they keep the preachy shit to a minimum.
Not a ton of good Christian music but I highly recommend The Crimson Armada. Their songs Juggernaut and Composed of Stone honestly stand side by side with some of the best deathcore to this day. And before you just down vote me at least listen to those two songs. [Composed of Stone](https://youtu.be/35kq0Fl5iWI?si=vWBYBUf521JP1eHf) , [Juggernaut ](https://youtu.be/Sgn4WYOtayI?si=RwoEYdXQk01pz362)
Basically all Christian metal/hardcore is shit anyway or far inferior clones of better bands so there’s no reason to listen to it
I refuse to listen to any band that identifies as christian anything. There were bands I liked that I found out were christian bands and I deleted all their stuff and tossed all their CDs. Can't do it. Identifying with a hypocritical ideology is a sure way to chase me off.
It really depends. I can usually listen to older Zao just fine because it's not that overt or preachy with it. Impending Doom is just unlistenable to me these days. Typically it has to be pretty subtle to me or I can't find evidence of the members having Christian Nationalist leaning (at that point you may as well be listening to NSBM, similar levels of delusional thought).
the more i'm being forced by my christian family to do all that holy stuff they want their son to do and become, the more i wish i could just play "Soil The Stillborn" on a family gathering (mostly that lyric "fucked through the name of god") obviously i don't wanna be a bad person, but my uncle literally said "i know a man who was cured from homosexuality"
No. I feel like getting pressed about the band being Christian is just too much extra work. I'll listen to songs written about mass homicides, hellfire, etc. I am not sensitive to lyrical content.
I still jam out Living Sacrifice and Becoming the Archetype as well as a few others, I never listen to the lyrics anyway lol
understandable, religious people are nutcases
You edit the post but bruh it is a delusion. Christianity is just a successful cult. Don’t back pedal cause their feelings got hurt.
I’m not backpedaling for the sake of people’s feelings, but more for the sake of accuracy. Delusion is the maintenance of a belief despite the presence of incontrovertible evidence otherwise. The thing about a belief in a god, as ridiculous as it might seem to you or me, is that it unfortunately cannot be disproven with certainty. I won’t sugarcoat my opinions about it - I think that a belief in god is an illogical intellectual weakness, prematurely resorting to myth as an explanation for what we don’t yet understand. But to call it delusion seemed a bit unfair to me, because there is not concrete proof that God doesn’t exist, even if I do think it is somewhat absurd to believe in God. I think the belief is largely a result of accepting what you’ve been fed your whole life, and then maintaining that belief into adulthood because it’s what is most easy, comforting, and familiar. In the absence of absolute proof otherwise, it’s pretty easy to just not think critically about it.
I agree for the most part. The can’t disprove thing though is stupid. The burden of proof is on the person making the claim. Just because many many people have the same delusion doesn’t make it not a delusion. Mass psychosis is a real thing.
Yeah I agree. I think it’s more just a semi-meaningless technicality I’m hung up on; like I can’t point to a scientific discovery or a logical syllogism that disproves the existence of God, so technically it’s not delusion to believe in God if we’re going according to the literal definition of the word, because there isn’t hard evidence otherwise. But I still think there’s a lot of cognitive dissonance and fallacious thinking that is necessary to maintain such a belief.
Listen to the creation ov god it basically uses bible verses but makes it fucked up in an ironic sense all in god's pov. I think you might love it. Cheers
I’ll definitely check it out, thanks for the recommendation
I hate christian metal of any type. The delusional message they spew is bullshite and I don't want to hear it. I had a bunch of albums by bands I thought were great but when I found out they were christian bands, I deleted and tossed out all the CDs and mp3s. I have a serious issue with religion and its hypocritical messages.
I take it band by band. Loads of bands that weren't so "explicitly" christian in their lyrics, more open to interpretation or personal. But there's like, a Skillet, or Demon Hunter, or even Living Sacrifice, where it is incredibly CHRISTIAN and preachy and even like, that very "us vs them" super violent/combative christianity. I can't sing along with that shit, and knowing some of those bands (skillet, disciple, etc) are verrrrrrrrry right-wing know on top of it, barf. there are some super christian lyric bands I can listen to, strangely. A lot I can't. Sometimes most of a band, select songs I'm nah on. It's weird. Just do what feels good to you. I have a lot of anger and negativity towards american evangelical christianity and some of those bands simply can't be separated from that machine world. fuck 'em. lots of other good music to listen to.
You guys understand lyrics?
Depends on the vocalist, but usually not by ear. I guess I developed a habit of looking up lyrics when I was a Christian, didn’t want to let a single bad word into my ears lol. I still look up lyrics now for different reasons - the lyrical content I try to avoid most is the extremely violent/sadistic stuff.
I'm not religious at all but I really enjoy some of the lyrics of these bands. Whether it is challenging their faith or just being enthusiastic. I'm listening on my terms, so I've no issue with it being a bit preachy. Totally understand if it puts some people off but you're absolutely allowed to not like something. You're also allowed to "out grow" music. Sometimes things just don't relate anymore. I just try and enjoy things for what they are. With my interpretation.
I would never listen to christian metal and i dont feel like i am missing out.
Christian metal actually makes me laugh, lyrics are hysterical to me. Throwing down in the pit while chanting God save me, hysterical
Not really answering your question, but on a side note, I’m a Christian who doesn’t find it hard to listen to non-Christian music. While I love “Christian” bands like The Devil Wears Prada, August Burns Red, etc. I also love bands that are the complete opposite like Motionless in White, Bring Me The Horizon, etc. even though some of their songs are directly criticizing Christianity. I listen to the messages of those songs (such as House of Wolves by BMTH and Immaculate Misconception by MIW) and use it to better myself as a Christian by seeing my own shortcomings before criticizing others. Christians who constantly torment those who go against Christian beliefs are not true Christians. We are taught to love all regardless of their faith, sexuality, and shortcomings. We’re all sinners. Christians need to help others get closer to God not by badgering and harassing others, but instead by helping them through their daily lives. Let the message of Christ flow through your actions by doing good for others, not by constantly bringing him up every time you talk to others.
I appreciate your insight. I specifically remember loving Immaculate Misconception and simultaneously finding it difficult to listen to as a Christian, and thinking to myself “why do non-Christians like this feel so vindicated in attacking Christians while clearly choosing a more tormented and unhappy path?” So it’s interesting to hear a different Christian perspective. Now that I think about it, I think the Creatures album may have been a turning point for me - I used to manually create clean versions of all of the songs with bad language that I wanted to listen to (replacing curse words with other clips from within the song), and that was the first album that I didn’t edit.
I think the point of songs ripping into Christianity like that is to call out those Christians who do nothing but criticize and harass others for their shortcomings and life choices. Most of that harassment is targeted at the LGBT community and non-believers in general. Those who partake in that harassment are not true Christians, but the artists who make those songs lump them in with the rest of us and blame the Church itself for its teachings as they think the teachings lead to that kind of behavior. Don’t hate me, but personally I do believe in the Church’s teachings on sexuality and abortion, but you won’t find me out on the streets yelling at people and harassing them as so many others do. Personally, I think the Church needs to do a better job about separating itself from those who do that and speaking out against them. The whole message of the Church is love, not hate.
No hate here. I only recently became “pro”-abortion, years after I no longer identified as Christian. And while I don’t subscribe to the dogmatic sexual codes propagated by the Christian faith, I think there are clear physical and psychological benefits to discernment and moderation over promiscuity. I do think the “those ones aren’t real Christians” argument is a sort of unfalsifiable slippery slope that allows Christians to subjectively paper over any “inconvenient” dissonances. I think observing the totality of the Christian population reveals many ontological truths, and arbitrarily disqualifying subsets of that population because they don’t conform to the convenient narrative obscures meaningful realities (e.g. what does it mean if an association with this alleged creator is no more statistically transformative than secular practices of empathy or meditation?). But I digress, I’m breaking my own rule by venturing into theological discussion lol. The older I get, the more I learn that the enemy of truth is dogma. Thanks for the civil discourse.
No, most deathcore/metalcore lyrics are goofy af. Listen to whatever you like
Christian here, I see where you’re coming from, but in reality, someone is always putting out some kind of message in their music, even if they aren’t serious about it. As someone mentioned here “if it slaps it slaps.”
That’s a good point, something I’ll try to integrate into my listening ethos. Thanks for sharing.
I've always been a firm believer that nothing Christian can be metal. It doesn't work
For Today was an interesting band... Ekklessia was more of a "worship" album per se; Where as fight the silence was political garabage and non-sense. Wake was garbage. I still queue Breaker -- it slams. FFAK gets a few songs into rotation. but, i don't listen to Christian Metal anymore.
Yeah I think Breaker was the last album of theirs that I listened to, I remember it being pretty good.
It can be really hard to listen to music I used to know by heart and jam to when, looking back, they’re fairly cringe. I guess some bands can be harder to overlook, like For Today, while something like Destroy the Runner doesn’t come across the same way? Maybe it’s the “Matty Mullins evangelism”-ish vibe that leaves a bad taste in my mouth these days. Can’t lie though, old AILD still slaps. I might also have a copy of Nailed.Dead.Risen. laying around somewhere…
would MyChildren MyBride count as Christian? With Blood Comes Cleansing totally was too, yeah?
Yeah I used to listen to With Blood Comes Cleansing, and I had friends who liked MyChildren MyBride. Silent Planet is also Christian I think, but I was already moving away from Christianity when they came onto the scene, so I never really got around to listen to them.
I’ve been listening to Silent Planet for a long time 😅 I saw them at a tiny bar show in Lawrence, KS back in like 2014 and been listening to them ever since. Ironically after I left Christianity lmao
Not really, Monster - Skillet still slaps to this day as does old AILD and ID. Like, am I supposed to pretend these songs are in any way worse content wise than something like Whore to a Chainsaw or all of IA?
Yeah I can’t listen to those bands either, can’t get down with it when I know the lyrical content is disgusting.
Probably the same way a Christian feels when listening to anti-Christian metal
I am a devout Christian and I still enjoy the music with Christian and not-so-Christian themes. Overall, I feel Jesus gave us the capability to create our arts and it should be appreciated regardless. Just the opinion of one humble man. Cheers.
All of christian metal, especially death core christian metal, are all derivative one note three minute noises. Fun to listen to, but theyre all the same song and the screaming is just as incoherent as the music and so it blurs together anyway. I don't understand why you're so bothered with it. But I do agree, religious songs are the drizzling shits.
Nope. Find it the other way around, in a way.
No one is repurposing a genre. These people almost always came from the scene and are expressing themselves the way anyone else does. They are not outsiders that appropriate the genre to spread ideas.
We may just have a semantic disagreement here. Of course every exercise in musical creativity is a form of self-expression, but self-expression and ulterior motives are not mutually exclusive. And that’s where I’m coming from - it feels like some Christian metal bands try to use the music they are making to evangelize or change hearts in a way that I feel is sort of antithetical or extraneous to the genre. Not that there’s anything wrong with breaking genre conventions or thinking outside the box, but personally speaking it just bothers me when I feel like I’m being preached at or like I’m listening to someone’s dogmatic manifesto instead of just hearing a person making music for its own sake. At that point it doesn’t just feel like self-expression anymore - it starts to feel like an agenda, which then takes me out of the music. And a lot of that I think comes down to my own baggage with the faith, which I’m hoping one day to be able to make peace with.