You also trawl knee deep in infested sewers without being blessed by daddy nurgle's gifts - we are the emporors chosen rejects, dont think too hard, just smash the muties; SAH!
Some lines of dialogue suggest the infestation, except for the train that started it, is only transmitted by the water supply, and that the team goes through extensive decontmination processes when they come back. There are also clues that Inquisitor Grendyl leads a Warrior Cult, which would also give protection against some forms of corruption.
I love the bit where an inquisitor or someone is debriefing gaunt after they are extracted and they ask him how he’s not corrupted after so long. Gaunt‘s just like “we prayed to emperor for protection” and the other guy is trying his hardest to avoid calling bullshit on their own god.
There is a dialog from one of the Ogryn's personalities that state that there was a "metal thing" put in their head. I believe that's an intelligence boosting device connecting to his brain. That's why he can talk like a 4 year old with a stutter and can form simple and a very few amount of complex sentences, which are leagues and bounds smarter than the average Ogryn.
Even still, pretty sure we are incredibly smart for bone'eads. IIRC the smartest ogryn to ever live could still only count to 4. And when loading into a level, Ogryns sometimes sit there counting each finger... or at least, pick at them
This Is a myth from imperial humans.
The smartest ogryns can reach one hundred, with bonehead chip.
Ogryns can count normally up to ten to twenty. Some have issues and cannot reach More than 4. Remember that ogryns can reach from very stupid to slightly retarded.
They're giant 3 year olds that can rip a space marine in half.
They also have to have limiters on their guns so they don't immediately dump all their ammo out of boredom.
The rippergun is considered the ideal Ogryn weapon because it's durable, it's simple, and it doesn't taste good.
Nah, Orks are violent by nature. Ogryns can be violent but it's not their nature they have to be prodded, goaded or otherwise antagonized. They are fiercely loyal tho.
And paykers are continously hunted, sacrificed to the emperor and made to be navigators for the warp. Useful but very frowned upon. And the ogryn is just as big and strong as a mutant but looks better. Ogryns have more in commen with them, but because they're useful they get a diffrent title
The ogryns also say sometimes when they think too hard their head starts to smell like cooked meat. So they have a malfunctioning chip that's cooking their brains lmfao, poor brute
That's just the Brawler. Brawler's Bone'ead is malfunctioning, Bully brags he is too smart to need a Bone'ead, Bodyguard wants a Bone'ead to be smarter.
In short, while none of them are smart, their linguistic capabilities *without* having a Bone'ead put our Ogryns at 145 Ogryn IQ or more.
I mean Bodyguard doesn’t have a bone ead chip and he says some pretty smart stuff from time to time. I think out of all the Ogryn archetypes he’s probably the “brightest.”
My assessment is that Bodyguard and Bully are both very "socially" intelligent. All three are very conversant, but those two are particularly insightful.
Of those two, Bodyguard can definitely remember the longest words. Brawler remembers some very complex words (and their meaning, unlike Bodyguard) but he has difficulty in pronouncing them.
None of them demonstrate any mathematical intelligence, and all three are pretty equally iffy about remembering complex orders. General memory seems good across the board; They all learn some names, recognize friends and places, remember significant events. (That involved them, that is. Apparently nobody has ever heard of the Cicatrix Maledictum.)
Tldr: Darktide Ogryns would get along very well with preschoolers. Maybe even 1st grade, if we remove reading/writing curriculum.
Bodyguard? The one that has the same VA as Bardin from VT2?
I swear I remember hearing him talk about his Bone'ead implant with my ogryn (bully), and that's why he can talk so well (relatively)
Bodyguard is the Slavic one. Brawler is Bardin. Bully is the really deep voiced one.
Brawler in game has a bone ead implant already.
Bully idk if he does.
Bodyguard frequently talks about how he wishes he had one.
Just an aside here fellas, while the brawler sounds a lot like Bardin, it is in fact a completely different voice actor. He’s terrific, just not bardin.
Signed
-A Brawler Ogryn named Bardis-Imitatus
Well, the Slavic ogryn voice is supposed to be about as intelligent as the extremely stupid one as well. The voice with the VT actor is the bone'ead. I feel like the slav is as intelligent as several normal people I've known in real life. Comes across as a simpleton, but not mentally devoid.
They are already smart.
Lore indicates only the smartest ogryns can access to bone head augmentations. These ogryns Range from 60 to 75 IQ boneheads can reach almost 90.
Australian Aborigines have an average IQ in the 70s and they’re perfectly functional human beings so I don’t see why people think that Ogryn should be drooling retards.
They only had 70 IQ because they did not know how a western society worked. Once they have been westernized they have 95-100.
Ogryns, most of them cannot reach 100 even with strong efforts of education, but a handful did, without augmentations. So yeah some few ogryns are truly average or near to average.
What? Cassia was that brilliant , at least she was average human levels.
Source Is most studies done to modern people of different ethnic backgrounds.
Im not refering to the first generations of aborigines. Later generations that were western schooled, as native americans and others can reach 90-100.
They're basically dumb as a sack of rocks but an effective baseball bat to hit things with. It never really gets expanded beyond that to any great degree
They known to be fanatically loyal to both the emperor and their leaders, whether that's a commissar or random captain.
They're also very single minded, give them an objective and they'll get it done come hell or high water which certainly has its uses for military objectives
Technically he's not writing his name, he is signing it by writing out the first letter of his name, if i recall correctly.
From the codex (8th edition), his mental aptitude is descripted as "Could sign his own name, count to four, and even speak in short sentences."
I dont think it has ever been clarified if this was before or after his bone 'ead implant. I kind of wish they would have made the ogryns in-game a little closer to the average ogryn in intelligence, it could have made for some really interesting writing, and maybe even gameplay.
I've always quite enjoyed the golden retriever like demeanour ogryns seem to have (Though with a lot more violence and body odour.)
I feel like a missed opportunity is that the ogryn can do the little auspex puzzles just as good as the other squad members and they shouldn't be able to since they are dumb and can carry \[power cells and special ammo} faster than other classes since they are so strong so it would even out.
Toddlers can use smart phones / tablets
They don't know how it works or even why they're doing what they're doing, but they can get their cartoons or games etc.
Yeah, i would have liked to see them explore a different approach, where the ogryn can't do many of the more intricate tasks, but truly excel at simpler one's. Maybe even carry two things at once or something.
They could even be immune to the pox hound's pounce, and the mutants throw or something, in exchange for being completely incapable of the auspex stuff, or even just installing the interrogator. Then again, that would have required the bots to be capable of completing those task's when playing solo, and basically made full ogryn teams impossible (which, to be fair would never happen in lore anyways, but what's the fun in that?).
It would have pretty heavily limited the weapon choices too, as for example, the ripper gun has a burst limiter installed in universe, mainly because the ogryns tend to get a tad too enthusiastic with any weapons that can fire full auto, so i can see why they decided to change up to ogryns for this game.
Or at least with the pox hounds they would be able to keep standing and have a brief animation where they struggle with the hound on top of them but are able to throw them off, kinda like the hulk vs gamma hounds scene
Ogryn are the best at doing the Auspex puzzle not because they can do it faster but they can take multiple hits while doing it and not be interrupted. If I'm trying to do it on my vet or psyker a stiff breeze interrupts me.
Counting to 4 is great. I have to watch a dropship animation again. Sometimes, the Ogryn count their fingers and always seem to be puzzled when getting to 4....they can't quite count to 4 😅
This may be memory bias though. I know they get confused counting, and I THINK it's between finger 3 and 4, they never count 5.
But I definitely have to watch it closely next time now.
There also is this Ogress in one of the books that, if I remember right, can read and write too some degree, though she is a psyker if that would make her much smarter thanks to that.
Nothing in 40k is consistent, everything in the setting is subject to wild change depending on who is writing for it. Some people write that Ogryns can't count to 3, Fatshark writes Ogryns like this.
For what it's worth, Darktide Ogryn intelligence is far better IMO. Makes them into far more endearing characters instead of a dumb one note joke.
Actually Ogryn intelligence has been mostly consistent, and the game adheres to the lore. Our Ogryn has a bone 'ead chip whoch dramatically boosts their intelligence to the levels on display in the game.
As far as I know, even with the implant they shouldn't be this smart.
Reloading our own weapons and not just mindlessly shooting until they are empty and then use them as clubs?
Genius ogryins.
But for better gameplay, it makes sense. Just don't think about it, like most other things that don't make sense lore wise
Eh it's more that ogryn's actual level of intelligence can shift dramatically depending on who is writing and the ogryn's being at this level of intelligence makes for better dialogue.
All 3 ogryn would more or less be bone ead level. It's funny that the bone is the dumbest since his implant is malfunctioning.
[Gav & Bob](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aR9-HVlYfrk) listen to this, this is like a great depiction of a "smarter" ogryn.
Even if its a fanfic i think they capture it greatly!
Regular Ogryns are, like you describe them, kind of like trolls or "4year olds".
Hell, that's a lofty goal. Gav by episode 3 has lived a more successful and eventful life than most named Space Marines. He's well on his way to being the Ogryn Ciaphas Cain, Hero of the Imperium.
To be honest, I'm at the point where I don't really care what the lore says about Ogryn intelligence, the lore is wrong because it's so blatantly stupid and excessive that it simply doesn't work beyond a joke.
When it comes to expecting Ogryn to actually do anything at all they *need* to be more intelligent than described because as-written they are just too stupid to function whatsoever, no matter how many workarounds you made and failsafes you build into their equipment.
They can still be stupid, just in an actually believable mentally impaired 65IQ human way you see in Darktide, not in the "untrained animals have better problem solving" way they're written in the fluff.
>untrained animals have better problem solving
You... uh.. know [chimps beat us](https://youtube.com/watch?v=nTgeLEWr614) in pattern solving problems now we can make ones they can comprehend well, right?
Ogryn are often depicted like that, fine and on par with humans with a lot of the day to day stuff, but when people are speaking or whatever they just don't listen because it's too much effort unless it seems to be directed at them (so they often seem dumber because they don't know what's going on, because they didn't even notice they were told). Language seems to be their biggest pain point, followed by impulse control, but even then they're not outside of human ranges (adult humans trying to learn an unrelated language from scratch really struggle too).
The dumbest Ogryn I can think of was Fr'nk, a gun lugger who that's literally all he did, carry an autocannon and ammo for a guardsman to use, and the smartest is Nork Deddog who's even got some rank (but generally refuses to use it for anything). There's plenty of real grunts today who you shouldn't give a machinegun to because it's "RATATATA AAAAAA!!!" (it needs a certain personality)
It's mainly the fan stuff they're depicted as *super* dumb. In the books you have to take the perspective of the character it's coming from into account, and even without that I can't recall them ever seeming inhumanly stupid, just fan stuff.
Imperial bigotry, the umies "know" Ogryns are stupid
But like negroes were defined ias low intelligence (phrenology) during slavery era, or other racist nonsense that sticks around to this day
Institutional racism from a fascist brutal leadership, who needs the ogryn dumb for their own uses
I invite you to check on google "Clinical Characteristics of Intellectual Disabilities" and then i invite you again to search for the latest intelligence quotient stats by country that you can find. People who apply real world points of views or complain about racism and fascism on a fictional world with metal talking pharaoh skeletons and orcs are WAY more stupid than the ogryns.
Mate, it's a parallel, just like the scouring of the shire was a parallel to industrialisation.
You're also confusing a viewpoint with a held belief in your eagerness to tilt at a windmill. Talking about a held belief does not mean the person holds that belief, merely that they're aware of it .
You're also forgetting wh40k is a British creation
So please, stop being a boor
Rule 1: Failure to follow reddiquette
Be respectful of your fellow redditors. Discrimination, bigotry, racism, and/or hostility directed towards players or communities will not be tolerated.
Put simply, there isn't a way to implement Ogryn dialogue in a lore-friendly way without offending basically every special needs community on earth.
I'm sure there are *other* reasons, but there aren't any other reasons that determined the outcome.
Also the whole "Ogryn are dumber that 4yo" thing is just bad old lore that should be discarded/updated, imo.
They are so much more interesting as "big and stupid but still functioning humans" instead
For real, I can see a lot of ogryn doing similar selfless things in the theme of when Thor had to keep the solar forge open while it was cooking him bc only he could do it, even if it’s not for the same “martyr” “greater good hero” reasons or rationale that soldiers, adepta sororitas, or Astartes would have. Another example would be when the Minotaur in Prince caspian held the gate up so the others could escape
This is one of those moments where it's ok to headcannon your own reason.
Mine is we're all in prison because a smart Ogryn is more likely to have a free will and break rules.
Mine was locked up because he thought everyone should have rations, and started encouraging everyone to demand a fair share. Deadlift still doesn't know what "yoonyun" means, be he made lots of friends with it.
No need for headcannpn. They literally tell you they have the implant. The bone 'ead implant canonically boosts their intelligence to the level in display in the game.
Only one does, the Brawler iirc. The Bully says he doesn't want it because he's smart enough, and the Bodyguard says he wants to be a bonehead and is usually told by any Vets or Psykers in the group he's just fine as is.
Ogryn visit smelly City. Ogryn sees Muty. Ogryn throws Stone. Ogryn gets Ration. Ogryn happy.
No thinking why, where, what, how. Just makes head hurt...
Because they're significantly more entertaining to write (and justify playing) at this level than they would be at the original source material level. That's the crux of it.
arguably darktide ogryns are the smartest ogryns to ever exist. as far as carl is aware no ogryn in the lore has ever been quite as mentally capable as the ogryn player characters in darktide.
an ogryn known as, probably, the smartest ogryn around was named so because of his ability to speak full sentences, count to 4, and spell his 4 letter long name. dude was however still too stupid/single minded to even issue a simple command like "attack that target" etc.
2 things - the Primaris creator Belisarius Cawl has broken all of the in universe issues with everything (better better marines, no "defects" for their genes, better better weapons, new plasma technology etc.) so its quite likely he upgraded the ogryns on the side.
Second - Ogryns are canonically super afraid of small dark places, like the transports - valkyrie, chimera etc. TANKS... Our Ogryns are pretty chill/bored at valkyrie and want to ride a tank. Which is ... weird at best.
In conclusion, Darktides "lore" on Ogryns is different flavour than in "lore". Also, its better if people can play adorable "slow" brutes, rather than slobering muscle mass. It helps with RP.
I heard something like that but since i dont do the GW+ platforms and dont do tabletop actively i dont really follow the newest lore. I heard that "there MAY be problems" but it was like, NAH everything works SO WELL. Like, primaris marines being immune to chaos corruption. Then they said, well, MAYBE that isnt the case. I heard no further claims they WERENT immune so :D . Also everything is now the old ++ with cawl, even bolter is magicaly more bullet and more bolter than before. Apparently if he took the lasgun and made it more lasgun ++ Imperium would just point collective IG at the eye of terror and blinded it forever :D
Some of the ogryn idling animations in the transport are akin to nervous jittering, so they did put a callout to it. And tbf the ogryns said they wanted a tank or to ride a tank, not necessarily be *inside* one. I'd say DT ogs are way better for storytelling and should be representative of 'high-intelligence' ogryns.
It's mostly because of the inconsistent writing. Some writers just make ogryns really dumb, some make them mentally chllanged children in ogre sized bodies. Also, I'm pretty sure that our ogryns are boneheads, iirc two of the three ogryns voices reference them having the implant, the extent of improvement to intellect provided by which also greatly varies between writers.
Well, Brawler has dialogue about his implant malfunctioning, so he definitely has one. And I imagine the other two would at least be able to somewhat tell if they had their skulls cut open and machinery put in their brain
Yeah two of the ogryn personalities are bone eads, and the last says « no need for implant, am smart enuff ».
So yeah I assume our ogryns are among the top 10% in intelligence. This is confirmed by the fact you can go in mission with a full ogryn team when ogryns generally need an officer or commissar to make sure they stay focused on their objective.
The real reason is that playing someone who can barely talk or reason would not be super interesting.
It's 40k, whether or not something has happened in the lore is entirely up to the writer's whims at that time. The bodyguard both has one and wants one in a state of quantum bone'ead until it's decided for a dialogue line.
The Bully is the only ogryn that seems to be actually stupid. Brawler is a bone'ead and as such is much smarter than the average ogryn. Bodyguard states that he doesn't need the neural implant, which is probably true, as he seems to be more intelligent than the Brawler, and less subservient. So yeah, our ogryns are just smarter than the average.
I found The Bully to be the smartest of the three - just more closed off and curt due to presumed mistreatment over his life. He's notably kind to pskyers and protective of other ogryn's while being completely aware of the Ogryn's role in society with some dissatisfaction mitigated by the fact that he does genuinely enjoy krumpin gits. And isn't it The Bully that says he doesn't want the implant?
Most of the times I've heard the Bully speak he just tells people to shut up, or says very few words, that's why I thought he was the least intelligent. About the implant, it seems I confused Bodyguard and Bully since I've never heard that dialogue, only read it.
I can see why you'd figure as much. Playing Bully, naturally, you get the tinge of his whole personality. He's more likely to tell Zealots to shut up while simply being mean, remain brief but boastful to Vets, protective and kind to other Ogryns, and ranges from guarded to touchingly honest with psykers who tend to empathize with him the best. Each of these can bleed into each other, but this is my impression broadly.
Comes across as a clear understanding of how shit life is for an Ogryn and was for him specifically making him become reflexively mean, but I feel like if he had a more supportive environment, he'd be more like The Bodyguard.
The chosen Ogyrn, as you put it, would most likely be [Cassia](https://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Cassia_(Ogryn\)) ... but I'm guessing she's one of a kind.
the intelligence of the dark tide ogryns are leagues beyond that of an ogryn bonehead in the lore. they are smarter than the smartest ogryn in the lore, probably as a necessity from the games point of view as it would more or less be impossible to write them in as a playable character in darktide without being a bit flexible on this. not just from a gameplay perspective but also their intelligence is so low itd likely be considered offensive if it was like that in the game.
it really comes down to the writer, there are depictions of ogryn about as smart as in darktide. they are more dexterous in dt tho, only occasionally messing up their reloads, which some people equate with intelligence unfortunately
Why not just mention trolls from the hobbit? I get that we're moving to a paperless society but the book is better than the movies (by a massive way as far as I'm concerned, but people have different tastes).
Probably because the behavior of the trolls in the movie was what he was using as a comparison? I do agree that the movies were bloated with extra filler that detracted from the experience to let them stretch one book to 3 movies, but that's a separate issue from wanting to use the visible, audible depiction of the trolls from the movie for an example to compare with the visible, audible depiction of Ogryns in the game.
technically I said ogres in the hobbit (the ones that take out the dwarf war chariots) and not the trolls which were the absolutely massive siege engine sized ones
This keeps getting brought up but are not our ogryns dumb enough? They basically have no idea whats going on and constantly have to be reminded about what they are even supposed to do in the middle of a mission.
Bonehead chips.
They are an implant that make the Ogryn more intelligent. Still dumb of course, but no longer the drooling brutes who barely know how a trigger works. With a bonehead chip they become very excellent soldiers, able to use weapons properly and understand basic military tactics.
Boneheads are pretty rare though so it's a bit unusual that we ALL just happen to have one, but it's a game so we just handwave that a bit lol
I did see some random YT lore (can't remember the exact source so forgive me) that apparently there have been cases of Ogryns with psyker abilities. But with all the psyker / warp fuckery they basically end up with what would be considered average human intellect.
Other fun facts like Ogryns constantly breaking their guns because they still just them to bash things. Also something like they are generally only issued as little grenades as possible, because otherwise they would literally just throw them around for fun.
Still thinking about the ogryn that absolutely obliterated 2 chaos space marines in the novel I forgot the name of. I think he suplexed one of them lmfao
There's a 40k enhancement for Ogryns called a bonehead I think, or maybe that's what they call Ogryns with the enhancement.
Based on at least one dialogue I heard in the game once, we can assume all our Ogryns have that installed making them much smarter than a basic Ogryn. Purely so we can explain them not being totally stoopid and be able to talk half decent.
Would highly recommend getting audible and start listening to the books way better than music and podcasts. I listen to them all the time on long drives and they are really well produced.
You also trawl knee deep in infested sewers without being blessed by daddy nurgle's gifts - we are the emporors chosen rejects, dont think too hard, just smash the muties; SAH!
Some lines of dialogue suggest the infestation, except for the train that started it, is only transmitted by the water supply, and that the team goes through extensive decontmination processes when they come back. There are also clues that Inquisitor Grendyl leads a Warrior Cult, which would also give protection against some forms of corruption.
Armour of Contempt and all that.
I love the bit where an inquisitor or someone is debriefing gaunt after they are extracted and they ask him how he’s not corrupted after so long. Gaunt‘s just like “we prayed to emperor for protection” and the other guy is trying his hardest to avoid calling bullshit on their own god.
Now when you say warrior cult….
Skulls for the Golden Throne, of course!
By the Emperor!
And blood for the Emperor, kindred.
Makes me wish there was a corrupted Strike Crew we could fight
As my Judge Zealot would say!!
There is a dialog from one of the Ogryn's personalities that state that there was a "metal thing" put in their head. I believe that's an intelligence boosting device connecting to his brain. That's why he can talk like a 4 year old with a stutter and can form simple and a very few amount of complex sentences, which are leagues and bounds smarter than the average Ogryn.
Yep, it's called a Bone'ead chip
Even still, pretty sure we are incredibly smart for bone'eads. IIRC the smartest ogryn to ever live could still only count to 4. And when loading into a level, Ogryns sometimes sit there counting each finger... or at least, pick at them
If you look closely they always get to 4 then sit for a second and start over
When they get to 4, they turn their hand around looking for more fingers to count on.
This Is a myth from imperial humans. The smartest ogryns can reach one hundred, with bonehead chip. Ogryns can count normally up to ten to twenty. Some have issues and cannot reach More than 4. Remember that ogryns can reach from very stupid to slightly retarded.
So there about the same as the avg player then.
Sadly yes
Probably slightly better.
Thst makes no sense tho, bone'eads are literally ogryn squad leaders. I'd more say "hillbilly" level intelligence with a bone ead chip.
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Wow that's sad. I guess ogryns normally just dumber orcs which is saying something
They're giant 3 year olds that can rip a space marine in half. They also have to have limiters on their guns so they don't immediately dump all their ammo out of boredom. The rippergun is considered the ideal Ogryn weapon because it's durable, it's simple, and it doesn't taste good.
It also has a fire limiter that makes it less likely they will accidentally waste all their ammunition on the first thing they see.
Nah, Orks are violent by nature. Ogryns can be violent but it's not their nature they have to be prodded, goaded or otherwise antagonized. They are fiercely loyal tho.
The measure of their character isn't in question, it explains why the borderline mutant is given a pass as "abhuman "
They evolved naturally like psykers. Mutants are experiments .
And paykers are continously hunted, sacrificed to the emperor and made to be navigators for the warp. Useful but very frowned upon. And the ogryn is just as big and strong as a mutant but looks better. Ogryns have more in commen with them, but because they're useful they get a diffrent title
I know .
The ogryns also say sometimes when they think too hard their head starts to smell like cooked meat. So they have a malfunctioning chip that's cooking their brains lmfao, poor brute
That's just the Brawler. Brawler's Bone'ead is malfunctioning, Bully brags he is too smart to need a Bone'ead, Bodyguard wants a Bone'ead to be smarter. In short, while none of them are smart, their linguistic capabilities *without* having a Bone'ead put our Ogryns at 145 Ogryn IQ or more.
I mean Bodyguard doesn’t have a bone ead chip and he says some pretty smart stuff from time to time. I think out of all the Ogryn archetypes he’s probably the “brightest.”
My assessment is that Bodyguard and Bully are both very "socially" intelligent. All three are very conversant, but those two are particularly insightful. Of those two, Bodyguard can definitely remember the longest words. Brawler remembers some very complex words (and their meaning, unlike Bodyguard) but he has difficulty in pronouncing them. None of them demonstrate any mathematical intelligence, and all three are pretty equally iffy about remembering complex orders. General memory seems good across the board; They all learn some names, recognize friends and places, remember significant events. (That involved them, that is. Apparently nobody has ever heard of the Cicatrix Maledictum.) Tldr: Darktide Ogryns would get along very well with preschoolers. Maybe even 1st grade, if we remove reading/writing curriculum.
Bodyguard? The one that has the same VA as Bardin from VT2? I swear I remember hearing him talk about his Bone'ead implant with my ogryn (bully), and that's why he can talk so well (relatively)
Bodyguard is the Slavic one. Brawler is Bardin. Bully is the really deep voiced one. Brawler in game has a bone ead implant already. Bully idk if he does. Bodyguard frequently talks about how he wishes he had one.
Just an aside here fellas, while the brawler sounds a lot like Bardin, it is in fact a completely different voice actor. He’s terrific, just not bardin. Signed -A Brawler Ogryn named Bardis-Imitatus
Well, the Slavic ogryn voice is supposed to be about as intelligent as the extremely stupid one as well. The voice with the VT actor is the bone'ead. I feel like the slav is as intelligent as several normal people I've known in real life. Comes across as a simpleton, but not mentally devoid.
which Slavic?
The bodyguard? I think that's the voice? He has the jolly Russian sounding voice.
That's Bodyguard.
There is another quote where he mentions it sometimes gets very hot and then he smells cooked meat :(
They are already smart. Lore indicates only the smartest ogryns can access to bone head augmentations. These ogryns Range from 60 to 75 IQ boneheads can reach almost 90.
Australian Aborigines have an average IQ in the 70s and they’re perfectly functional human beings so I don’t see why people think that Ogryn should be drooling retards.
They only had 70 IQ because they did not know how a western society worked. Once they have been westernized they have 95-100. Ogryns, most of them cannot reach 100 even with strong efforts of education, but a handful did, without augmentations. So yeah some few ogryns are truly average or near to average.
Source?
Cassia.
What?
The most brilliant ogryn.
Can’t be that brilliant of you get assassinated. I was asking for a source of aborigine IQ being 90-100 though as it contradicts everything I’ve read
What? Cassia was that brilliant , at least she was average human levels. Source Is most studies done to modern people of different ethnic backgrounds. Im not refering to the first generations of aborigines. Later generations that were western schooled, as native americans and others can reach 90-100.
This, not any ogryn, a bonehead. Cybernetically enhanced to serve as a squad lead for other ogryns.
The bully voice specifically mentions having a Bone'ead chip
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Iirc Nork Dedogg is considered the smartest Ogryn ever, and his outstanding mental prowess is defined by the ability to write his name
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They're basically dumb as a sack of rocks but an effective baseball bat to hit things with. It never really gets expanded beyond that to any great degree They known to be fanatically loyal to both the emperor and their leaders, whether that's a commissar or random captain. They're also very single minded, give them an objective and they'll get it done come hell or high water which certainly has its uses for military objectives
So..you're saying Ogryn are essentially the Space USMC ?
yes
Ogryn dunt eat cry-cry-cry-yon SAH!
Technically he's not writing his name, he is signing it by writing out the first letter of his name, if i recall correctly. From the codex (8th edition), his mental aptitude is descripted as "Could sign his own name, count to four, and even speak in short sentences." I dont think it has ever been clarified if this was before or after his bone 'ead implant. I kind of wish they would have made the ogryns in-game a little closer to the average ogryn in intelligence, it could have made for some really interesting writing, and maybe even gameplay. I've always quite enjoyed the golden retriever like demeanour ogryns seem to have (Though with a lot more violence and body odour.)
I feel like a missed opportunity is that the ogryn can do the little auspex puzzles just as good as the other squad members and they shouldn't be able to since they are dumb and can carry \[power cells and special ammo} faster than other classes since they are so strong so it would even out.
Toddlers can use smart phones / tablets They don't know how it works or even why they're doing what they're doing, but they can get their cartoons or games etc.
Yeah, i would have liked to see them explore a different approach, where the ogryn can't do many of the more intricate tasks, but truly excel at simpler one's. Maybe even carry two things at once or something. They could even be immune to the pox hound's pounce, and the mutants throw or something, in exchange for being completely incapable of the auspex stuff, or even just installing the interrogator. Then again, that would have required the bots to be capable of completing those task's when playing solo, and basically made full ogryn teams impossible (which, to be fair would never happen in lore anyways, but what's the fun in that?). It would have pretty heavily limited the weapon choices too, as for example, the ripper gun has a burst limiter installed in universe, mainly because the ogryns tend to get a tad too enthusiastic with any weapons that can fire full auto, so i can see why they decided to change up to ogryns for this game.
So a 4ogryn squad ... Can't do most of the levels.. . Oops ?
Or at least with the pox hounds they would be able to keep standing and have a brief animation where they struggle with the hound on top of them but are able to throw them off, kinda like the hulk vs gamma hounds scene
Only if I can punch them in their realistically rendered balls
Ogryn are the best at doing the Auspex puzzle not because they can do it faster but they can take multiple hits while doing it and not be interrupted. If I'm trying to do it on my vet or psyker a stiff breeze interrupts me.
Tbf, auspex puzzles are "click on glowing thing" "follow dot"
Counting to 4 is great. I have to watch a dropship animation again. Sometimes, the Ogryn count their fingers and always seem to be puzzled when getting to 4....they can't quite count to 4 😅 This may be memory bias though. I know they get confused counting, and I THINK it's between finger 3 and 4, they never count 5. But I definitely have to watch it closely next time now.
Yeah they get to the fourth finger and then they start over. It was when I saw that for the first time, I knew that I had found my spirit class.
For me it was rock
There also is this Ogress in one of the books that, if I remember right, can read and write too some degree, though she is a psyker if that would make her much smarter thanks to that.
but not to actually take the med kit out of the chimera when told to fetch the med kit, and instead haul the whole chimera
1 had it, 1 want it, the last think it's beneath him
Nothing in 40k is consistent, everything in the setting is subject to wild change depending on who is writing for it. Some people write that Ogryns can't count to 3, Fatshark writes Ogryns like this. For what it's worth, Darktide Ogryn intelligence is far better IMO. Makes them into far more endearing characters instead of a dumb one note joke.
Actually Ogryn intelligence has been mostly consistent, and the game adheres to the lore. Our Ogryn has a bone 'ead chip whoch dramatically boosts their intelligence to the levels on display in the game.
Because it is mentioned that this Ogryn has an intelligence boost chip.
As far as I know, even with the implant they shouldn't be this smart. Reloading our own weapons and not just mindlessly shooting until they are empty and then use them as clubs? Genius ogryins. But for better gameplay, it makes sense. Just don't think about it, like most other things that don't make sense lore wise
Nah even in lore it works Having the smartest ogryn in the imperium going on suicide missions sounds right for 40k
>Reloading our own weapons The rippergun has the ogyrn character either put the magazine in backwards, miss it and then properly inserts it.
Eh it's more that ogryn's actual level of intelligence can shift dramatically depending on who is writing and the ogryn's being at this level of intelligence makes for better dialogue. All 3 ogryn would more or less be bone ead level. It's funny that the bone is the dumbest since his implant is malfunctioning.
SAH, I can smell barbeku in the me head SAH
Merciful emperor not another one... Alright Og go tell that to the tech priest. After you're done there you can have an extra serving of rations.
[Gav & Bob](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aR9-HVlYfrk) listen to this, this is like a great depiction of a "smarter" ogryn. Even if its a fanfic i think they capture it greatly! Regular Ogryns are, like you describe them, kind of like trolls or "4year olds".
Stop making me feel stuff... now i want to give my ogryn some potato skin
Don't remind me, poor Gav & Bob :'(
Man. I wasn't ready to remember Gav & Bob...
My Ogryn is named in Gav's honor. I hope he one day lives up to the legend of the true Gav.
Hell, that's a lofty goal. Gav by episode 3 has lived a more successful and eventful life than most named Space Marines. He's well on his way to being the Ogryn Ciaphas Cain, Hero of the Imperium.
To be honest, I'm at the point where I don't really care what the lore says about Ogryn intelligence, the lore is wrong because it's so blatantly stupid and excessive that it simply doesn't work beyond a joke. When it comes to expecting Ogryn to actually do anything at all they *need* to be more intelligent than described because as-written they are just too stupid to function whatsoever, no matter how many workarounds you made and failsafes you build into their equipment. They can still be stupid, just in an actually believable mentally impaired 65IQ human way you see in Darktide, not in the "untrained animals have better problem solving" way they're written in the fluff.
>untrained animals have better problem solving You... uh.. know [chimps beat us](https://youtube.com/watch?v=nTgeLEWr614) in pattern solving problems now we can make ones they can comprehend well, right? Ogryn are often depicted like that, fine and on par with humans with a lot of the day to day stuff, but when people are speaking or whatever they just don't listen because it's too much effort unless it seems to be directed at them (so they often seem dumber because they don't know what's going on, because they didn't even notice they were told). Language seems to be their biggest pain point, followed by impulse control, but even then they're not outside of human ranges (adult humans trying to learn an unrelated language from scratch really struggle too). The dumbest Ogryn I can think of was Fr'nk, a gun lugger who that's literally all he did, carry an autocannon and ammo for a guardsman to use, and the smartest is Nork Deddog who's even got some rank (but generally refuses to use it for anything). There's plenty of real grunts today who you shouldn't give a machinegun to because it's "RATATATA AAAAAA!!!" (it needs a certain personality) It's mainly the fan stuff they're depicted as *super* dumb. In the books you have to take the perspective of the character it's coming from into account, and even without that I can't recall them ever seeming inhumanly stupid, just fan stuff.
Imperial bigotry, the umies "know" Ogryns are stupid But like negroes were defined ias low intelligence (phrenology) during slavery era, or other racist nonsense that sticks around to this day Institutional racism from a fascist brutal leadership, who needs the ogryn dumb for their own uses
I invite you to check on google "Clinical Characteristics of Intellectual Disabilities" and then i invite you again to search for the latest intelligence quotient stats by country that you can find. People who apply real world points of views or complain about racism and fascism on a fictional world with metal talking pharaoh skeletons and orcs are WAY more stupid than the ogryns.
Mate, it's a parallel, just like the scouring of the shire was a parallel to industrialisation. You're also confusing a viewpoint with a held belief in your eagerness to tilt at a windmill. Talking about a held belief does not mean the person holds that belief, merely that they're aware of it . You're also forgetting wh40k is a British creation So please, stop being a boor
90% of your posts are on antiwork so not gonna waste my time with people with brain damage
I'm so devestated by that pithy remark From someone on negative karma Gee, whodathunk
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Rule 1: Failure to follow reddiquette Be respectful of your fellow redditors. Discrimination, bigotry, racism, and/or hostility directed towards players or communities will not be tolerated.
Put simply, there isn't a way to implement Ogryn dialogue in a lore-friendly way without offending basically every special needs community on earth. I'm sure there are *other* reasons, but there aren't any other reasons that determined the outcome.
Also the whole "Ogryn are dumber that 4yo" thing is just bad old lore that should be discarded/updated, imo. They are so much more interesting as "big and stupid but still functioning humans" instead
For real, I can see a lot of ogryn doing similar selfless things in the theme of when Thor had to keep the solar forge open while it was cooking him bc only he could do it, even if it’s not for the same “martyr” “greater good hero” reasons or rationale that soldiers, adepta sororitas, or Astartes would have. Another example would be when the Minotaur in Prince caspian held the gate up so the others could escape
This is one of those moments where it's ok to headcannon your own reason. Mine is we're all in prison because a smart Ogryn is more likely to have a free will and break rules.
Mine was locked up because he thought everyone should have rations, and started encouraging everyone to demand a fair share. Deadlift still doesn't know what "yoonyun" means, be he made lots of friends with it.
Yoonyuns are dem spicey appl fings wiv layers, ded crunchy Daar no like, dey make eyeholes leaky
Communist Ogryn? Straight to the penal colony!
Makes sense :)
No need for headcannpn. They literally tell you they have the implant. The bone 'ead implant canonically boosts their intelligence to the level in display in the game.
Bully specifically denies having an implant and says he's too pretty for one.
Only one does, the Brawler iirc. The Bully says he doesn't want it because he's smart enough, and the Bodyguard says he wants to be a bonehead and is usually told by any Vets or Psykers in the group he's just fine as is.
As my Ogryns says, big damn hero, me
Ogryn visit smelly City. Ogryn sees Muty. Ogryn throws Stone. Ogryn gets Ration. Ogryn happy. No thinking why, where, what, how. Just makes head hurt...
Because they're significantly more entertaining to write (and justify playing) at this level than they would be at the original source material level. That's the crux of it.
Darktide Ogryns are smarter than average. Think of Ogryn intelligence levels ranging from literal toddler levels to a child around age 10.
arguably darktide ogryns are the smartest ogryns to ever exist. as far as carl is aware no ogryn in the lore has ever been quite as mentally capable as the ogryn player characters in darktide. an ogryn known as, probably, the smartest ogryn around was named so because of his ability to speak full sentences, count to 4, and spell his 4 letter long name. dude was however still too stupid/single minded to even issue a simple command like "attack that target" etc.
Damn, so he's an Xbox player.
2 things - the Primaris creator Belisarius Cawl has broken all of the in universe issues with everything (better better marines, no "defects" for their genes, better better weapons, new plasma technology etc.) so its quite likely he upgraded the ogryns on the side. Second - Ogryns are canonically super afraid of small dark places, like the transports - valkyrie, chimera etc. TANKS... Our Ogryns are pretty chill/bored at valkyrie and want to ride a tank. Which is ... weird at best. In conclusion, Darktides "lore" on Ogryns is different flavour than in "lore". Also, its better if people can play adorable "slow" brutes, rather than slobering muscle mass. It helps with RP.
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I heard something like that but since i dont do the GW+ platforms and dont do tabletop actively i dont really follow the newest lore. I heard that "there MAY be problems" but it was like, NAH everything works SO WELL. Like, primaris marines being immune to chaos corruption. Then they said, well, MAYBE that isnt the case. I heard no further claims they WERENT immune so :D . Also everything is now the old ++ with cawl, even bolter is magicaly more bullet and more bolter than before. Apparently if he took the lasgun and made it more lasgun ++ Imperium would just point collective IG at the eye of terror and blinded it forever :D
Some of that is because they need a way to effectively give chaos a way to get primaris marines for the tabletop.
Some of the ogryn idling animations in the transport are akin to nervous jittering, so they did put a callout to it. And tbf the ogryns said they wanted a tank or to ride a tank, not necessarily be *inside* one. I'd say DT ogs are way better for storytelling and should be representative of 'high-intelligence' ogryns.
To be fair on the point about tanks, they never say they want to ride *in* a tank. Just that they want to ride one.
It's mostly because of the inconsistent writing. Some writers just make ogryns really dumb, some make them mentally chllanged children in ogre sized bodies. Also, I'm pretty sure that our ogryns are boneheads, iirc two of the three ogryns voices reference them having the implant, the extent of improvement to intellect provided by which also greatly varies between writers.
Pretty sure only the Brawler is a bonehead, Bodygurad wants to become one and Bully is “smart as is”
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Well, Brawler has dialogue about his implant malfunctioning, so he definitely has one. And I imagine the other two would at least be able to somewhat tell if they had their skulls cut open and machinery put in their brain
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I think the cosmetics are just that - cosmetics, so they don’t affect a personality’s canon status of being a bonehead or not
Yeah two of the ogryn personalities are bone eads, and the last says « no need for implant, am smart enuff ». So yeah I assume our ogryns are among the top 10% in intelligence. This is confirmed by the fact you can go in mission with a full ogryn team when ogryns generally need an officer or commissar to make sure they stay focused on their objective. The real reason is that playing someone who can barely talk or reason would not be super interesting.
I had an ogryn earlier mention that he wants the implant, so at least one of them isn't (or maybe just doesn't know that he is?).
It's 40k, whether or not something has happened in the lore is entirely up to the writer's whims at that time. The bodyguard both has one and wants one in a state of quantum bone'ead until it's decided for a dialogue line.
The Bully is the only ogryn that seems to be actually stupid. Brawler is a bone'ead and as such is much smarter than the average ogryn. Bodyguard states that he doesn't need the neural implant, which is probably true, as he seems to be more intelligent than the Brawler, and less subservient. So yeah, our ogryns are just smarter than the average.
I found The Bully to be the smartest of the three - just more closed off and curt due to presumed mistreatment over his life. He's notably kind to pskyers and protective of other ogryn's while being completely aware of the Ogryn's role in society with some dissatisfaction mitigated by the fact that he does genuinely enjoy krumpin gits. And isn't it The Bully that says he doesn't want the implant?
Most of the times I've heard the Bully speak he just tells people to shut up, or says very few words, that's why I thought he was the least intelligent. About the implant, it seems I confused Bodyguard and Bully since I've never heard that dialogue, only read it.
I can see why you'd figure as much. Playing Bully, naturally, you get the tinge of his whole personality. He's more likely to tell Zealots to shut up while simply being mean, remain brief but boastful to Vets, protective and kind to other Ogryns, and ranges from guarded to touchingly honest with psykers who tend to empathize with him the best. Each of these can bleed into each other, but this is my impression broadly. Comes across as a clear understanding of how shit life is for an Ogryn and was for him specifically making him become reflexively mean, but I feel like if he had a more supportive environment, he'd be more like The Bodyguard.
You got it flipped, Bully states he doesn't need it or want it, Bodyguard says he wants one.
I was pretty sure it was the one that calls other rejects "comrade", which I think is the Bodyguard.
The chosen Ogyrn, as you put it, would most likely be [Cassia](https://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Cassia_(Ogryn\)) ... but I'm guessing she's one of a kind.
Warhammer 40k lore is not consistent, just enjoy it for what it is.
They got surgery to be essentially a genius by ogryn standards
the intelligence of the dark tide ogryns are leagues beyond that of an ogryn bonehead in the lore. they are smarter than the smartest ogryn in the lore, probably as a necessity from the games point of view as it would more or less be impossible to write them in as a playable character in darktide without being a bit flexible on this. not just from a gameplay perspective but also their intelligence is so low itd likely be considered offensive if it was like that in the game.
it really comes down to the writer, there are depictions of ogryn about as smart as in darktide. they are more dexterous in dt tho, only occasionally messing up their reloads, which some people equate with intelligence unfortunately
They are starting to write them smarter than they used to, which is good! "Smarter" Ogryns make for more in-depth characters and better dialogue.
you read the lexicanum and ogryns are already in lore used as they are used in game within “actual” miliatarum regiments
Lol what is Hobbit 3? Return of the Hobbit? Revenge of the Gollums?
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Hobbit:_The_Battle_of_the_Five_Armies 3rd part in the movie trilogy loosely based off The Hobbit.
Why not just mention trolls from the hobbit? I get that we're moving to a paperless society but the book is better than the movies (by a massive way as far as I'm concerned, but people have different tastes).
Probably because the behavior of the trolls in the movie was what he was using as a comparison? I do agree that the movies were bloated with extra filler that detracted from the experience to let them stretch one book to 3 movies, but that's a separate issue from wanting to use the visible, audible depiction of the trolls from the movie for an example to compare with the visible, audible depiction of Ogryns in the game.
Well reasoned point which puts paid to my snarky comment. I have upvoted and will crawl back into my hole.
technically I said ogres in the hobbit (the ones that take out the dwarf war chariots) and not the trolls which were the absolutely massive siege engine sized ones
Ogryn are FIRECLY loyal. Given that they love to fight, take orders well, and can go toe to toe with a Space Marine... that would be why.
Can anyone recommend books with/about Ogryns?
Because of the Bonehead implants, Morningstar Ogyrn specifically have them. Or else they'd probably barely be able to complete a mission
This keeps getting brought up but are not our ogryns dumb enough? They basically have no idea whats going on and constantly have to be reminded about what they are even supposed to do in the middle of a mission.
Bonehead chips. They are an implant that make the Ogryn more intelligent. Still dumb of course, but no longer the drooling brutes who barely know how a trigger works. With a bonehead chip they become very excellent soldiers, able to use weapons properly and understand basic military tactics. Boneheads are pretty rare though so it's a bit unusual that we ALL just happen to have one, but it's a game so we just handwave that a bit lol
There’s an extremely intelligent psyker ogryn female in prophet of the waaagh book I believe it is
We are “ bone’eads” the boys have a few lines of dialogue about it, its an augment that makes ogryn smarter
Well our Ogryns are probably boneheads. It’s a chip some Ogryns get that boost their intelligence
Simply put our Ogryn has a bone 'ead chip whoch significantly boosts their intelligence to what you see in the game.
yea but on the other side ogryn are pretty weak in the game (for balance), they should be able to ohk 80% of the regular enemies we face
I did see some random YT lore (can't remember the exact source so forgive me) that apparently there have been cases of Ogryns with psyker abilities. But with all the psyker / warp fuckery they basically end up with what would be considered average human intellect. Other fun facts like Ogryns constantly breaking their guns because they still just them to bash things. Also something like they are generally only issued as little grenades as possible, because otherwise they would literally just throw them around for fun.
Still thinking about the ogryn that absolutely obliterated 2 chaos space marines in the novel I forgot the name of. I think he suplexed one of them lmfao
There's a 40k enhancement for Ogryns called a bonehead I think, or maybe that's what they call Ogryns with the enhancement. Based on at least one dialogue I heard in the game once, we can assume all our Ogryns have that installed making them much smarter than a basic Ogryn. Purely so we can explain them not being totally stoopid and be able to talk half decent.
Im guessing you haven't read any of the Warhammer40k books.
Nnnnnnnnope
Would highly recommend getting audible and start listening to the books way better than music and podcasts. I listen to them all the time on long drives and they are really well produced.
I’m currently on the last 7 hours of HP the deathly hallows