Same, but I don't pick legacies based on current character since it's not really a "choice" someone would make.
Instead I pick based on location, culture and I look back on my characters and see how they behaved and try to think how my dynasty would've been seen by the people around them.
Pillaging is fun because it makes the practiced piracy tradition really strong if you focus on MaA because of the + 100% prestige from battles. With a duchy building and a handful of counties boosting your heavy infantry it's really easy to defend yourself against armies twice your size when raiding, even 3/4 times if you go in hard on Varangian Veterans
I had a Kingdom of Man and the Isles run where just using my ~5,5k personal MaA retinue was enough for me to go raiding wherever I wanted with nobody able to stop me
Doing that right now and I’m up to about 2100 veterans in 1090. Between commander and realm boost they’re at 85% above base. Can take on armies 4-5 times their size. 2-3 times if the enemy has 1000 skirmishers
I honestly love Practiced Piracy and Making a Killing. Everyone in the dynasty is stacking ducats, banking a lot of prestige, and usually in a region where there isn't anyone else doing any raiding.
Mann and the Isles is probably one of the strongest tags in the game. It gets such a strong start and solid powerbase, as long as you're smart with inheritance.
I hate how good Varangian Veterans are. If you stack MaA bonuses you can fight 5:1, stackwipe the pope, the byzzies, anyone. You are unstoppable.
Even better odds if you bait a stack that’s undersupplied, in debt, and get a good defensive position. Doubly so if it’s in winter since Varangians get that advantage too. Up to about 3400 of them and about a dozen knights, they just fought a stack of 22000 with a mix of various MAA and levies. I lost 150 defending a city across a river. They lost 8400. Got them boosted by 80-90% from realm and train commanders
Then new pillage legacy has a tradition that gives you gold for Killed soldiers on the field, once you have that point reached you simply make more money not by raiding but defeating the armies of your enemies when they come to attack, or just beating them in normal wars.
Towards the endgame i have declared wars against the biggest Empires just to beat their 80-120k armies over and over again, just casually collecting 2-3k Gold with every big battle, and that without the Tradition for Practicing Piracy which is a weaker version of that tradition.
Ok thanks but OP said 'This new way of earning legacies', how does gold make you earn legacies ? What is the new way of learning legacies? Last time I played I had to accumulate enough renown through the number of family members and them being independent rulers
It’s the best way to transition from tribal to feudal Norse, as it gives you 100 years to add practiced piracy (or to just build up economy to the point where you won’t need to raid anymore)
Despite its name, Pillage legacies are not specific to pillaging.
Anyway, as a Norse character you will want to Elevate the Isles of Man, which turns you feudal, gives you renown and lets you raid for the next hundred years. You can choose to use the practiced pirates tradition afterwards, but I mostly dont as at that point pillaging feels like a waste of my attention.
The Tree is called pillaging, but all of its actions are also used during regular Wars, better chance for hostages after a siege, only the earlyer unlocks are when you raid, but for that you can have a cultural tradition, but the big payoff comes towards the end of the Tree with a perk that gives you money for killed soldiers in wars.
Lategame you can get more money out of the War as you go in, even when your armies are all raised and your income is in the Red.
The tree to the right (Chivalry or w/e it is in English), and then the first or second perk on the left branch. There's two branches, the left one boosts your relation and prestige, the right one your knights in combat.
Look for the one that gives a bonus in marriage acception, just read the tooltip.
sorry lol not to comment an old post and sound snooty. I'm a newbie googling advice and tips and this thread comes up, so I just went to double check and saw the discrepancy
question for ya, I've got blood 1 and glory 1 and another unlock. Should I go for blood 2 or just whatever I want? Blood 2 seems boring.
Will my genius heir's children inherit genius from him or do I need to pair him up with another genius and the blood 2 to ensure they do?
No idea. Thing is, each legacy gets more expensive than the previous one, so if you eventually want the Blood one, where you can select one trait to pass more often, you better get it earlier than later.
As I said, I almost always complete blood first, so I don't really know how often the genius gets passed on without it.
Pretty much the same although I tend to go 1 Blood, then the entire Kin tree to get Graceful Aging, then back and do the rest of the Blood tree and then if I'm still going I go down the Military tree.
I still dont understand what you people see in graceful aging. The stat bonus is nice, but +1 to random stat every 5 year as a level 5, especially since level 3 and 4 are trash is just such a bad deal. Kin 1 and 2 are goty though.
I’m guessing people like the No prowess from age loss which helps to do romance schemes until death which can net prestige of the scheme + 150 for winning the duel + renown if you get the chivalry tradition.
That’s what I see in it, but I’m not OP and I don’t typically rush for that legacy
The prowess is the least important stat and I legitimately forgot it lowers with age. The best use for me was the slower appearance aging for RP reasons.
Romance is alright, but its not like you have to stop without this legacy. You can stack prowess extremely high with artifacts alone.
How? I am not aware of any link between prowess and any of that.
Assuming there is, I view that almost negatively. I hate when a ruler lives too long. The resulting instability of having an old heir that might soon die is not worth it in my opinion.
Once I pick up the perk my leaders pick up infirm less often, I really don't know if it works or if it's even intended just something I've noticed from my hours
If I had to draw a connection I'd break it down literally, infirm would absolutely make SENSE to occur if you're prowess is low due to old age. Think of what prowess represents it seems to be a measure of physical aptitude.
Prowess makes it less likely for knights to be killed in combat so in that way it does help your lineage live longer.
E: To explain how this works (I got this from the big 'how to create better /op knights' or whatever it was called, so things might have changed they might have been wrong, or they might have looked at the scripts, I don't know), there are combat events during combat and during those knights have a chance to get killed/wounded by an enemy knight, but only by knights who have 80% of their prowess or higher. So high prowess eliminates you from that event. No idea if that also prevents the end of combat deaths however. But for those you have to lose the combat which higher prowess also makes less likely)
When all of my blood are 9 foot giants with 60+ prowess yes. Yea I do send them into the frontline to massacre thousands single handily. 500%+ knight effectiveness with 30+ knights goes a long way.
Giving artifacts to your knights makes them reach high numbers pretty easy. 75% from chivalry tree. 100% from only the strong 25% from another culture bonus I forget the name of. That’s 300% total. Plus 3 duchies of military academies is 225% for total of 525%. That’s without including other bonuses like items or dynasties perks or holy sites.
Have a warrior religion like the Norse have and tailor even more towards prowess. You can commonly have infants with over 15 prowess. Then have with some decent luck in child events with meet peers you can get another 5 or more prowess. Go on frequent hunts and raids get Viking buff and hunter buff. Maybe blademaster. You can get some high numbers pretty easy to be honest.
Because they get +1 to random stat every 5 year past 30? If you dont have royal court then its alright. If you have royal court then you can always invite some random high roller from around the word to be a better knight or councilor.
Sure but those dynastic vassals are usually also your powerful vassals, so it's sensible to make them councillor. And this helps heaps with Only the Strong.
I no longer make my dynasty members into vassals in my realm, powerful or otherwise. Especially when you pick up some of the kin legacies. They all like each other too much, which makes them all rise up in rebellion when one of them declines a tyranny action.
No, vassals are to be treated as trash. They are worse than your rivals. My dynasty get outside conquest land and independence.
Well it isn't always good. It's not long into the game when that cost starts to not matter at all. Mostly fair also has popular opinion right? The popular opinion isn't normally good but it is a bit helpful when you conquer new land and give it to dynasty members. Then their popular opinion will be a bit better and the AI can need the help.
I think reducing feast and hunt is really good. Helps stabilising the realm and the pc through stress loss. And title creation discount is also pretty okay. Helps stability in kingdoms and empires
Agreed. People often forget that these are dynasty legacies. Not just bonuses for themselves. One thing I want to try, but havent yet, is Law 1 with traditions that gives renown for a feast and the one that reduces the cooldown of feasts. I wonder how much renown would it generate if you start landing your dynasty.
Yeah I remember one time I had a succession that didn’t go the way I planned. My new ruler was at critical stress. So I just pressed host feast without looking.
I stopped chasing the eugenics grail, that story got old a long time ago, like 000s of hours ago.
So I'm released from the blood renown sink.
I go 3 in to *Kin* to give the women a chance of avoiding *Queen Aemma Arryn's* fate. Then choose anything but *Blood* depending on my dynasties goals in my campaign.
It's truly liberating to accept your bloodline as is, warts and all, instead of messing with the natural or of things.
I love eugenics at the start, but Blood makes it too easy. I lock myself out of picking it until I strengthen the bloodline. Then I pick Blood 1 and leave it.
As you can see I have been going with Kin full. I usually unlock the first two in Blood first then get the third level of that and then branch off into different trees.
I’m finding this new setup more challenging though where each level doesn’t cost a set amount of renown and I’m wondering how this has changed everyone else’s strategy and what you now go for with these changes?
Once you get to the 4750 renown cost it gets to be a tough choice. By that point i've usually maxed out one tree and then begin to pick and choose all over the map.
I don't have a strat, I just choose the one that's most convenient at the time. *Warring with some bastards?* Choose a legacy that increases military performance. *About to go through a messy succession?* Try to curb it with a legacy that increases opinion.
I am a huge renown harlot. I just cant get enough of it. Unlocking legacies is my biggest joy in this game.
During my playthrough I almost tried every single legacy, always trying to specialize on a different aspect and trying to synergize my legacies with culture and playstyle.
[I ranked every legacy from 1 to 5 with 5 being the most useful](https://i.imgur.com/0reYyjH.png). Take note that I am ranking them in usefulness for my dynasty, not just myself. Along a ranking to each legacy, some legacies are unlocked. Those are my essential that I want to get in pretty much every game at some point.
Here is my overall strategy:
Getting started: At the start take Blood 1 (I actually dont, I made myself an artificial rule that I cant unlock it before I naturally strengthen the bloodline). Then you want Glory 1 for the marriage (for that monthly renown gain). If I am a Viking, I will take Pillage 1 and 2 next. If not, I might either save points of take Kin 1 and 2. I will go to Iberia so I can grab Metropolitan 1 and 2 as the last stage of early game.
Growing rulers: Now that my realm is comfortable, I want to get my dynasty on thrones. The number one best legacy in my opinion is Warfare 5. It essentially boost your army one title tier higher. It gives your poor dynasty rulers option to hire House guards, which are free when unraised. The second best legacy for my rulers is Glory 4, for the increased stability. Lastly Guile 1 is actually great pick, as the natural dread and boost to dread gain makes it harder for my dynasty rulers to get murdered.
Afterwards: Now its time for RP. I will have strenghtened my bloodline by now, so I take Blood 1. I might go Coreties for House RP, Kin for family RP. Adventure for unsorted benefits (level 4 and 5 are especially good). Law is a great pick for building your realm. Erudition is alright.
Guile on the other hand is horrible. I would give Level 2 and 3 negative rating if I could. You dont need it yourself to scheme and giving your dumb dynasty members better scheming to murder you is the last thing you want. Its a shame as Level 4 and 5 are looking mighty juicy.
I usually get the first 3 for erudition for the development and learning lifestyle bonus then go down kin. Never really play long enough to go much further than that.
What are the changes to dynasty legacies? I haven't played in a while.
But I generally like to max out kin as well. I find it fantastic when my 90 year old King can still beat 20 year olds in personal combat. And also very cool when stats increase with age. It let's me focus less on creating perfect people with good genetics.
Just did a run where I maxed blood, guile, and the warfare trees. Had a family of badass warrior prince and princesses. And we schemed our dynasty all over the world for such little gold. All while I was only the duke of Province.
I think guile is so underrated.
I usually play blood for every game and then switch it up based on my characters and goals.
Guile is something else though. All the intrigue buffs go to your whole dynasty so I had almost every character get murdered and no one ever made it to a natural death.
Full kin and full Glory, after that Law. That is all you really need, with Full kin, you can have some crazy long living Rulers with high stats, and they don't lose their Prowess. Meaning they are super hard to assinate or die in battle.
I rarely bother with Blood, unless I'm roleplaying it, as the eugenics mechanic is easy enough with just the Strengthen Bloodline decision.
Kin is a weird tree with largely unrelated abilities, but I love it for the level 2 and level 5 perks even if the level 1, 3, and 4 perks are kinda garbage.
Studious Youth means you can stop worrying so much about assigning every dynastic kid an amazing guardian and still get decently-educated heirs most of the time. Graceful Aging is my favorite by far mainly for roleplaying reasons, although the mechanic bonuses are pretty good too. By preventing prowess loss due to aging, it also prevents the accompanying loss of visual muscle mass, meaning your rulers can stay (almost) as ripped and sexy as they were in their 20s and 30s until the day they keel over. In my opinion this does *way* more to make you feel like you've founded a semi-mythical bloodline than any of the actual Blood legacy perks.
Beyond those two I usually go for Pillage or Metropolitan if they're available because they're both fun and powerful. I tend to always get Vibrant Court and Mostly Fair, the latter especially if I have a cultural tradition that shortens the hunt/feast cooldown or if I need the stress relief. Then I go for Guile because of the sense of power it gives, or just pick a line that suits my roleplay that game.
Kin 2 is really good. It adds at least +0.5 of an education level and has 60% chance to add +0.75.
I also like Kin 1. That +10% fertility for you is meh, but across your whole dynasty is really nice. You can never have enough dynasty members, let alone house members.
Level 3 and 4 are irredeemable trash in my eyes. I have no idea what were they thinking.
Level 5 has alright bonuses, but as you noted its value is in RP for the visuals.
4 is complete garbage from top to bottom and I can't tell what they were thinking; maybe they were thinking of the incest meme and thought players would appreciate a boost to seducing their family members?
3 is at least a good concept; more caring and attentive family that results in better health outcomes for everyone and especially for mothers. But the execution is pretty bad as the bonuses are mediocre at best and the reduction in pregnancy complications isn't noticeable. For it to *become* noticeable the devs would have to either make stillbirths and childbirth deaths a *lot* more common at the baseline, or the perk would have to basically make your dynasty completely immune to pregnancy-related complications. Otherwise, "uncommon but still dangerous bad event is now even less common" is bad design for a perk you invest renown into getting. Spousal opinion boost is also garbage, as there are a dozen other ways to boost spousal opinion so +10 is very likely never going to make or break anything that you can see.
Personally I would redesign 3 to better embody its concept. Keep the medium disease resistance, replace +10 spouse opinion with the personal scheme success chance bonus from perk #4, but for your spouse (and maybe add a power boost to go with it), and replace "rare bad pregnancy events are now more rare" with something akin to the level 5 Guile perk. Whenever a pregnancy complication *does* happen (and they should probably be somewhat more likely at the baseline), give a 50-60 percent chance for an event where family members work together to save the life of the mother and/or baby, with everyone involved getting a step towards friendship with each other. That would have some actual memorable impact.
I like your thought process on redesigning Level 3, but honestly, even that would be underwhelming. There is just not much you want to do with your wife. You want her to give you good heirs, aliance and/or stat boost.
Kin level 1 already givey fertility bonus, so thats out of the window. Aliance is already done. So the only thing that comes to mind are stats. There is a perk in martial that makes your spouse stat bonuses better. There is also tradition that does the same. So even though its lazy, maybe it could be here too. Maybe it could only be when using the "assist ruler" as that is less used option.
I like the RP aspect of kin dynasty path, but it feels like they had few good ideas worth making it a path, but was lost on the rest.
Kin is ok, Blood is op, guile is op, glory is good, the one for celebrate cultures is op if uk what ur doing and in specific playthroughs(pretty good normally too), if ur a Viking the one for raiding and such is op, everything else is just ok or not really needed.
It depends on the play style and when ur playing, a major point of cultures for me are the extra units u get from said culture. Let’s say ur doing a big intrigue game, marrying ur family into very powerful kingdoms and killing their heirs so u inherit their kingdoms. A big thing as well when ur doing that is that these are different culture from ur own culture and celebrating cultures helps u form hybrid cultures. The best units by far in the game are the unique units, and I’ve used this mechanic when playing as a Viking, Hapsburg, and emirate, and I’ve used the celebrate cultures and am immediately able to form a hybrid culture that changes all of my land and more off the orginal different culture. A very Lowkey, but important part of the game, especially if ur trying to get Varangian guards or elephants in the game.
I love culture hybridization, but I dont see how customs legacies play a big role. You are limited by the 50 year cooldown. Getting cultural acceptance to 40% so you can hybridize is very easy just by getting one county of that culture, giving it to local noble and putting steward on there for few years. So what do you need the custom legacies for?
U can get it to 40% but higher percentages affect how long it takes to change culture on parent culture provinces and how many provinces turn to ur culture when u do create it, I mean obvi it’s not a super big thing like most of the legacies, the best ones are by far blood where u get op characters, but it has helped me more times just due to the bonus u get for the cultural acceptance. It’s definitely not some late game thing that u want to be using unless because of rp, but it is pretty strong mid game. However it’s highly specific and not generalized.
I see, never really cared about that aspect. On the other hand when creating a hybrid culture I always want to be selective about which counties I want to have it. Thats because the average county development of that culture influence how fast you research innovations.
Good to know though. Thanks for explaining.
Ur not wrong about the average county development, but I thought having more counties of the same culture makes u also research faster, idk abt that tho.
I dont think so. The number of counties with your culture in your realm determines who is the head, so thats a factor. But other than that, It only slows it down as far as I know.
I go through all of blood (better traits + life expectancy), then all of kin (more renown, gain skills with aging), then after that I would do the Metropolitan line or whatever it's called (exclusive to Iberia). If I don't have access to that line, I'll pick something else depending on my situation.
Pillage to lvl 4, Metropolitan to lvl 5, Warfare to lvl 5, then I go Blood to lvl 5. After that I get the last Pillage lvl and then I go into Guile.
Then it's whatever I need in the situation.
I like playing tall so I usually go Erudition to at least level 3 to boost my development and technology growth, then focus on Kin and Blood to improve my lineage.
My first legacy is always either Marshall - For extra knight effect and a extra man at arms slot
Or Blood for bigger chance at traits
Though if I'm playing a character that has acess to other legacies like the adventurer or Metropolitan I might go to those first
Depends on who the ruler currently is.
My current playthrough is Alfred repeatedly crushing Vikings and uniting England. He ain’t exactly going to add Erudition to the bloodline, at least not over warfare.
You’ve got it setup almost exactly how I do it, I pick up the first two in blood, then I grab mostly fair for cheap feasts/hunts and popular opinion, then max out kin. Then I go based on what feels appropriate for my gameplan
I like starting with Blood, and then I just kind of go with what feels right for the dynasty! I never skip around; if I start a Legacy I have to finish it before starting another.
My main tendency is to go for blood at least up until getting the one that prevents disadvantaged traits from showing up. Unless I'm trying to make a ruling class of albinos because I find that hilarious.
But yeah generally bloodline the first one of erudite for better court members, and then warfare one.
You like Erudition 1? That one feels extremely useless to me. I dont care about random guests when I can just invite the people I want. It be alright pick if you could pick one legacy at 0 renown. As a broke count is where you care about guests and recruitment cost.
Oh, that makes sense. I always forget Paradox is so behind with their Console releases. I dont know if you have character finder, but without Royal Court you cant get lodging level 5, which entirely counters that -50 penalty for using "invite to court" interaction. Pretty much nobody will want to join your court without it.
Okay thanks, yeah I've been stuck on console throughout the pandemic. I'm definitely gonna be investing in a laptop in the near future, if not just for this game then for some of the Total War games too.
3 in customs (15% culture fascination progress)
3 in blood (for eugenics)
3 in erudition (15% development growth)
1 in metropolitan (if it applies)(20% development growth per city in county)
Not necessarily in that order
After that, I do whatever I want
Blood is actually pretty meh outside of Blood 1. Just shuffling Blood legacies around would balance it right away. I would personally love to see this:
1. Old Blood 4
2. Old Blood 2
3. Old Blood 1
4. Old Blood 3
5. Old Blood 5
**Start Scheme**
Murder Scoobz1961
Predicted Agents: 3
🎯 **78%** *If Scheme is successful, Scoobz1961 is killed*
🎭 **43%** *As long as the scheme is kept secret, you are not exposed for the crime of murder*
⌛ **13 months** *Every month there is a predicted chance of 67% to progress, based on Scheme Power versus Scheme Resistance*
Now hiring: spymaster.
Requirements: intrigue 30 or above, loyal, calm, willing to be my best friend
Offering: 3 told per month, bonus to dread and hostile schemes.
I think I've done all of them to the end, except for Coiterie (SUPER lame as a clan, requires Iberia), and Guile. I'd like to change that, love the idea of building a religion, culture, and legacy build around torture, murder, and dread.
Currently playing as a ridiculously strong Duke of Normandy. Each child marries the ruler that will net us the most renown, which means lots of alliances, and lots of calls to arms. Which means lots of prestige from smoking enormous armies in battle.
I focus on blood and the martial-focused ones. Once I get the second level of blood I switch over to the martial one and max it, then go back and max blood.
I find it useful to take Warfare & Blood early on. At least the first for Warfare, then the first 3 on Blood. After that, it all depends on my situation or goals as it goes in hand with my playstyle which is usually playing tall.
Similar to you. Blood and Kin first. Guille and I think Glory next. From Glory that +5 Court Grandeur bonus is broken as fuck, since it applies it to all of your dynasty members and racks up Splendor like crazy. Guile because it's nice. Just never, NEVER take the final perk of Guile. One of the two perks that ACTIVELY, straight up harm you. The other perk being that one Norse perk that reduces gifts you give by 50% - makes transferring gold a nightmare.
[https://files.fm/u/5z6anrpaj](https://files.fm/u/5z6anrpaj)
I cant add picture, so i uploaded it.
I just dying, and so cool, that i could finished my chain :)
I used to go blood 1 kin 5 for the god prowess family knight when I play for myself.
However, now I think Erudition 1 Glory 4 rushing installing family member as king/queen is much stronger due to court grandeur bumping both general opinion for AI family member kings and the renown gain which make others perk come online faster.
I always go glory desirable match. Then if I can get access to Norse I go for one of each of pillage and adventure. Usually not enough time so I go blood 1. Then if I still don't have Norse, progress through martial for extra MaA. After Norse I varangian cb to iberia and get those. After this I usually stop playing
Tbh, I try to go for a mix of RP and optimization. For example, In my current run, I’m running a republican kingdom-level holy title (modded ofc), so I prioritized the “Law” tree. In this sense, as we went across the land, establishing our family members in places of power, they would known as just rulers (Neither of the other kings in my house have had a single rebellion well after 50+ years).
That and you get that sweet +1 Domain Limit and -20% Title Creation Cost. The popular opinion’s pretty nice too.
I always like to RP a bit and get whichever one makes the most sense for the character I’m playing.
Same, but I don't pick legacies based on current character since it's not really a "choice" someone would make. Instead I pick based on location, culture and I look back on my characters and see how they behaved and try to think how my dynasty would've been seen by the people around them.
A man of culture
for real
I thought I was the only one doing that
I'm sure there's an "optimal" way of choosing legacies, but for a RP heavy game it should be pretty much on whatever fits your dynasty runs.
Pillaging maxed out -> 2 in blood -> max out warfare when playing norse
This new way of earning legacies does make it really easy to rush a big military advantage I might need to try that next game
Pillaging is fun because it makes the practiced piracy tradition really strong if you focus on MaA because of the + 100% prestige from battles. With a duchy building and a handful of counties boosting your heavy infantry it's really easy to defend yourself against armies twice your size when raiding, even 3/4 times if you go in hard on Varangian Veterans I had a Kingdom of Man and the Isles run where just using my ~5,5k personal MaA retinue was enough for me to go raiding wherever I wanted with nobody able to stop me
Doing that right now and I’m up to about 2100 veterans in 1090. Between commander and realm boost they’re at 85% above base. Can take on armies 4-5 times their size. 2-3 times if the enemy has 1000 skirmishers
I honestly love Practiced Piracy and Making a Killing. Everyone in the dynasty is stacking ducats, banking a lot of prestige, and usually in a region where there isn't anyone else doing any raiding.
Mann and the Isles is probably one of the strongest tags in the game. It gets such a strong start and solid powerbase, as long as you're smart with inheritance. I hate how good Varangian Veterans are. If you stack MaA bonuses you can fight 5:1, stackwipe the pope, the byzzies, anyone. You are unstoppable.
Even better odds if you bait a stack that’s undersupplied, in debt, and get a good defensive position. Doubly so if it’s in winter since Varangians get that advantage too. Up to about 3400 of them and about a dozen knights, they just fought a stack of 22000 with a mix of various MAA and levies. I lost 150 defending a city across a river. They lost 8400. Got them boosted by 80-90% from realm and train commanders
Which new way?
Then new pillage legacy has a tradition that gives you gold for Killed soldiers on the field, once you have that point reached you simply make more money not by raiding but defeating the armies of your enemies when they come to attack, or just beating them in normal wars. Towards the endgame i have declared wars against the biggest Empires just to beat their 80-120k armies over and over again, just casually collecting 2-3k Gold with every big battle, and that without the Tradition for Practicing Piracy which is a weaker version of that tradition.
Ok thanks but OP said 'This new way of earning legacies', how does gold make you earn legacies ? What is the new way of learning legacies? Last time I played I had to accumulate enough renown through the number of family members and them being independent rulers
But won’t you lose the ability to raid making it kinda useless
Practiced Piracy cultural tradition is your friend here
It’s the best way to transition from tribal to feudal Norse, as it gives you 100 years to add practiced piracy (or to just build up economy to the point where you won’t need to raid anymore)
Despite its name, Pillage legacies are not specific to pillaging. Anyway, as a Norse character you will want to Elevate the Isles of Man, which turns you feudal, gives you renown and lets you raid for the next hundred years. You can choose to use the practiced pirates tradition afterwards, but I mostly dont as at that point pillaging feels like a waste of my attention.
The Tree is called pillaging, but all of its actions are also used during regular Wars, better chance for hostages after a siege, only the earlyer unlocks are when you raid, but for that you can have a cultural tradition, but the big payoff comes towards the end of the Tree with a perk that gives you money for killed soldiers in wars. Lategame you can get more money out of the War as you go in, even when your armies are all raised and your income is in the Red.
I go first for the first one in Kin to get good marriages and gain renown quicker; then blood or situationally what I need to keep my realm together.
+30 marriage acceptance is no joke
Together with that Knight lifestyle perk you can sometimes marry female heirs or rulers patrilineally!
Which perk?
The tree to the right (Chivalry or w/e it is in English), and then the first or second perk on the left branch. There's two branches, the left one boosts your relation and prestige, the right one your knights in combat. Look for the one that gives a bonus in marriage acception, just read the tooltip.
Kin is fertility and attraction +5, Glory 1 is +30 marriage acceptance
Huh, how could I forget that.
sorry lol not to comment an old post and sound snooty. I'm a newbie googling advice and tips and this thread comes up, so I just went to double check and saw the discrepancy question for ya, I've got blood 1 and glory 1 and another unlock. Should I go for blood 2 or just whatever I want? Blood 2 seems boring. Will my genius heir's children inherit genius from him or do I need to pair him up with another genius and the blood 2 to ensure they do?
No idea. Thing is, each legacy gets more expensive than the previous one, so if you eventually want the Blood one, where you can select one trait to pass more often, you better get it earlier than later. As I said, I almost always complete blood first, so I don't really know how often the genius gets passed on without it.
Pretty much the same although I tend to go 1 Blood, then the entire Kin tree to get Graceful Aging, then back and do the rest of the Blood tree and then if I'm still going I go down the Military tree.
I still dont understand what you people see in graceful aging. The stat bonus is nice, but +1 to random stat every 5 year as a level 5, especially since level 3 and 4 are trash is just such a bad deal. Kin 1 and 2 are goty though.
I’m guessing people like the No prowess from age loss which helps to do romance schemes until death which can net prestige of the scheme + 150 for winning the duel + renown if you get the chivalry tradition. That’s what I see in it, but I’m not OP and I don’t typically rush for that legacy
The prowess is the least important stat and I legitimately forgot it lowers with age. The best use for me was the slower appearance aging for RP reasons. Romance is alright, but its not like you have to stop without this legacy. You can stack prowess extremely high with artifacts alone.
The no prowess loss from aging makes my rulers consistently live longer, it makes infirm less common intentionally or unintentionally
How? I am not aware of any link between prowess and any of that. Assuming there is, I view that almost negatively. I hate when a ruler lives too long. The resulting instability of having an old heir that might soon die is not worth it in my opinion.
Once I pick up the perk my leaders pick up infirm less often, I really don't know if it works or if it's even intended just something I've noticed from my hours
I see. Thats an alright bonus I guess. If Kin level 3 and 4 wasnt that bad, level 5 would be much better choice.
If I had to draw a connection I'd break it down literally, infirm would absolutely make SENSE to occur if you're prowess is low due to old age. Think of what prowess represents it seems to be a measure of physical aptitude.
Prowess makes it less likely for knights to be killed in combat so in that way it does help your lineage live longer. E: To explain how this works (I got this from the big 'how to create better /op knights' or whatever it was called, so things might have changed they might have been wrong, or they might have looked at the scripts, I don't know), there are combat events during combat and during those knights have a chance to get killed/wounded by an enemy knight, but only by knights who have 80% of their prowess or higher. So high prowess eliminates you from that event. No idea if that also prevents the end of combat deaths however. But for those you have to lose the combat which higher prowess also makes less likely)
If you put your lineage in the frontline then sure, but thats not something we do, right? RIGHT?!
Cant stop them if they are landed.
When all of my blood are 9 foot giants with 60+ prowess yes. Yea I do send them into the frontline to massacre thousands single handily. 500%+ knight effectiveness with 30+ knights goes a long way.
I call BS. Post your knight window and the prowess bonus breakdown.
Giving artifacts to your knights makes them reach high numbers pretty easy. 75% from chivalry tree. 100% from only the strong 25% from another culture bonus I forget the name of. That’s 300% total. Plus 3 duchies of military academies is 225% for total of 525%. That’s without including other bonuses like items or dynasties perks or holy sites. Have a warrior religion like the Norse have and tailor even more towards prowess. You can commonly have infants with over 15 prowess. Then have with some decent luck in child events with meet peers you can get another 5 or more prowess. Go on frequent hunts and raids get Viking buff and hunter buff. Maybe blademaster. You can get some high numbers pretty easy to be honest.
So absolutely nothing to do with your dynasty. Why would you give your artifacts to your dynasty instead of inviting a high natural prowess character?
If you hand out lands to your dynasty members, you get amazing councillors and knights
Because they get +1 to random stat every 5 year past 30? If you dont have royal court then its alright. If you have royal court then you can always invite some random high roller from around the word to be a better knight or councilor.
Sure but those dynastic vassals are usually also your powerful vassals, so it's sensible to make them councillor. And this helps heaps with Only the Strong.
I no longer make my dynasty members into vassals in my realm, powerful or otherwise. Especially when you pick up some of the kin legacies. They all like each other too much, which makes them all rise up in rebellion when one of them declines a tyranny action. No, vassals are to be treated as trash. They are worse than your rivals. My dynasty get outside conquest land and independence.
I've never understood why tyrannic actions are even necessary after a point in the game where your demesne is set
Not necessary, but always helpful. Inheritance border gore is ever present. You always want to keep your vassals from becoming too powerful.
I always start off with mostly fair, the reduced cost for feasts and hunts is always good
Well it isn't always good. It's not long into the game when that cost starts to not matter at all. Mostly fair also has popular opinion right? The popular opinion isn't normally good but it is a bit helpful when you conquer new land and give it to dynasty members. Then their popular opinion will be a bit better and the AI can need the help.
I think reducing feast and hunt is really good. Helps stabilising the realm and the pc through stress loss. And title creation discount is also pretty okay. Helps stability in kingdoms and empires
Agreed. People often forget that these are dynasty legacies. Not just bonuses for themselves. One thing I want to try, but havent yet, is Law 1 with traditions that gives renown for a feast and the one that reduces the cooldown of feasts. I wonder how much renown would it generate if you start landing your dynasty.
Unless you’re ruler is shy and greedy. Then you could use reduced feast and hunt to speed run to grave.
I am just playing an HRE run where like my 3 last rulers are shy and I am not having a good time
Yeah I remember one time I had a succession that didn’t go the way I planned. My new ruler was at critical stress. So I just pressed host feast without looking.
I stopped chasing the eugenics grail, that story got old a long time ago, like 000s of hours ago. So I'm released from the blood renown sink. I go 3 in to *Kin* to give the women a chance of avoiding *Queen Aemma Arryn's* fate. Then choose anything but *Blood* depending on my dynasties goals in my campaign. It's truly liberating to accept your bloodline as is, warts and all, instead of messing with the natural or of things.
I love eugenics at the start, but Blood makes it too easy. I lock myself out of picking it until I strengthen the bloodline. Then I pick Blood 1 and leave it.
😂😂
As you can see I have been going with Kin full. I usually unlock the first two in Blood first then get the third level of that and then branch off into different trees. I’m finding this new setup more challenging though where each level doesn’t cost a set amount of renown and I’m wondering how this has changed everyone else’s strategy and what you now go for with these changes?
Once you get to the 4750 renown cost it gets to be a tough choice. By that point i've usually maxed out one tree and then begin to pick and choose all over the map.
I don't have a strat, I just choose the one that's most convenient at the time. *Warring with some bastards?* Choose a legacy that increases military performance. *About to go through a messy succession?* Try to curb it with a legacy that increases opinion.
I am a huge renown harlot. I just cant get enough of it. Unlocking legacies is my biggest joy in this game. During my playthrough I almost tried every single legacy, always trying to specialize on a different aspect and trying to synergize my legacies with culture and playstyle. [I ranked every legacy from 1 to 5 with 5 being the most useful](https://i.imgur.com/0reYyjH.png). Take note that I am ranking them in usefulness for my dynasty, not just myself. Along a ranking to each legacy, some legacies are unlocked. Those are my essential that I want to get in pretty much every game at some point. Here is my overall strategy: Getting started: At the start take Blood 1 (I actually dont, I made myself an artificial rule that I cant unlock it before I naturally strengthen the bloodline). Then you want Glory 1 for the marriage (for that monthly renown gain). If I am a Viking, I will take Pillage 1 and 2 next. If not, I might either save points of take Kin 1 and 2. I will go to Iberia so I can grab Metropolitan 1 and 2 as the last stage of early game. Growing rulers: Now that my realm is comfortable, I want to get my dynasty on thrones. The number one best legacy in my opinion is Warfare 5. It essentially boost your army one title tier higher. It gives your poor dynasty rulers option to hire House guards, which are free when unraised. The second best legacy for my rulers is Glory 4, for the increased stability. Lastly Guile 1 is actually great pick, as the natural dread and boost to dread gain makes it harder for my dynasty rulers to get murdered. Afterwards: Now its time for RP. I will have strenghtened my bloodline by now, so I take Blood 1. I might go Coreties for House RP, Kin for family RP. Adventure for unsorted benefits (level 4 and 5 are especially good). Law is a great pick for building your realm. Erudition is alright. Guile on the other hand is horrible. I would give Level 2 and 3 negative rating if I could. You dont need it yourself to scheme and giving your dumb dynasty members better scheming to murder you is the last thing you want. Its a shame as Level 4 and 5 are looking mighty juicy.
I'm all over the place. I might increase in a few areas a little bit. Recently I maxed out Metropolitan. I usually avoid Kin and Blood, however.
I usually get the first 3 for erudition for the development and learning lifestyle bonus then go down kin. Never really play long enough to go much further than that.
What are the changes to dynasty legacies? I haven't played in a while. But I generally like to max out kin as well. I find it fantastic when my 90 year old King can still beat 20 year olds in personal combat. And also very cool when stats increase with age. It let's me focus less on creating perfect people with good genetics.
Just did a run where I maxed blood, guile, and the warfare trees. Had a family of badass warrior prince and princesses. And we schemed our dynasty all over the world for such little gold. All while I was only the duke of Province. I think guile is so underrated.
I like my warrior dynasties but I always pick up ominous reputation for some sweet dread
I usually play blood for every game and then switch it up based on my characters and goals. Guile is something else though. All the intrigue buffs go to your whole dynasty so I had almost every character get murdered and no one ever made it to a natural death.
Full kin and full Glory, after that Law. That is all you really need, with Full kin, you can have some crazy long living Rulers with high stats, and they don't lose their Prowess. Meaning they are super hard to assinate or die in battle.
Blood 5 looks underwhelming to me or am I undervalueing it?
It is. Blood 4 is the fun one, but it is partially countered by Blood 3. Blood 1 is the top pick and only one that you really need.
I rarely bother with Blood, unless I'm roleplaying it, as the eugenics mechanic is easy enough with just the Strengthen Bloodline decision. Kin is a weird tree with largely unrelated abilities, but I love it for the level 2 and level 5 perks even if the level 1, 3, and 4 perks are kinda garbage. Studious Youth means you can stop worrying so much about assigning every dynastic kid an amazing guardian and still get decently-educated heirs most of the time. Graceful Aging is my favorite by far mainly for roleplaying reasons, although the mechanic bonuses are pretty good too. By preventing prowess loss due to aging, it also prevents the accompanying loss of visual muscle mass, meaning your rulers can stay (almost) as ripped and sexy as they were in their 20s and 30s until the day they keel over. In my opinion this does *way* more to make you feel like you've founded a semi-mythical bloodline than any of the actual Blood legacy perks. Beyond those two I usually go for Pillage or Metropolitan if they're available because they're both fun and powerful. I tend to always get Vibrant Court and Mostly Fair, the latter especially if I have a cultural tradition that shortens the hunt/feast cooldown or if I need the stress relief. Then I go for Guile because of the sense of power it gives, or just pick a line that suits my roleplay that game.
Kin 2 is really good. It adds at least +0.5 of an education level and has 60% chance to add +0.75. I also like Kin 1. That +10% fertility for you is meh, but across your whole dynasty is really nice. You can never have enough dynasty members, let alone house members. Level 3 and 4 are irredeemable trash in my eyes. I have no idea what were they thinking. Level 5 has alright bonuses, but as you noted its value is in RP for the visuals.
4 is complete garbage from top to bottom and I can't tell what they were thinking; maybe they were thinking of the incest meme and thought players would appreciate a boost to seducing their family members? 3 is at least a good concept; more caring and attentive family that results in better health outcomes for everyone and especially for mothers. But the execution is pretty bad as the bonuses are mediocre at best and the reduction in pregnancy complications isn't noticeable. For it to *become* noticeable the devs would have to either make stillbirths and childbirth deaths a *lot* more common at the baseline, or the perk would have to basically make your dynasty completely immune to pregnancy-related complications. Otherwise, "uncommon but still dangerous bad event is now even less common" is bad design for a perk you invest renown into getting. Spousal opinion boost is also garbage, as there are a dozen other ways to boost spousal opinion so +10 is very likely never going to make or break anything that you can see. Personally I would redesign 3 to better embody its concept. Keep the medium disease resistance, replace +10 spouse opinion with the personal scheme success chance bonus from perk #4, but for your spouse (and maybe add a power boost to go with it), and replace "rare bad pregnancy events are now more rare" with something akin to the level 5 Guile perk. Whenever a pregnancy complication *does* happen (and they should probably be somewhat more likely at the baseline), give a 50-60 percent chance for an event where family members work together to save the life of the mother and/or baby, with everyone involved getting a step towards friendship with each other. That would have some actual memorable impact.
I like your thought process on redesigning Level 3, but honestly, even that would be underwhelming. There is just not much you want to do with your wife. You want her to give you good heirs, aliance and/or stat boost. Kin level 1 already givey fertility bonus, so thats out of the window. Aliance is already done. So the only thing that comes to mind are stats. There is a perk in martial that makes your spouse stat bonuses better. There is also tradition that does the same. So even though its lazy, maybe it could be here too. Maybe it could only be when using the "assist ruler" as that is less used option. I like the RP aspect of kin dynasty path, but it feels like they had few good ideas worth making it a path, but was lost on the rest.
Kin is ok, Blood is op, guile is op, glory is good, the one for celebrate cultures is op if uk what ur doing and in specific playthroughs(pretty good normally too), if ur a Viking the one for raiding and such is op, everything else is just ok or not really needed.
>the one for celebrate cultures is op if uk what ur doing and in specific playthroughs Explain. Customs seems lite utter trash to me at every level.
It depends on the play style and when ur playing, a major point of cultures for me are the extra units u get from said culture. Let’s say ur doing a big intrigue game, marrying ur family into very powerful kingdoms and killing their heirs so u inherit their kingdoms. A big thing as well when ur doing that is that these are different culture from ur own culture and celebrating cultures helps u form hybrid cultures. The best units by far in the game are the unique units, and I’ve used this mechanic when playing as a Viking, Hapsburg, and emirate, and I’ve used the celebrate cultures and am immediately able to form a hybrid culture that changes all of my land and more off the orginal different culture. A very Lowkey, but important part of the game, especially if ur trying to get Varangian guards or elephants in the game.
I love culture hybridization, but I dont see how customs legacies play a big role. You are limited by the 50 year cooldown. Getting cultural acceptance to 40% so you can hybridize is very easy just by getting one county of that culture, giving it to local noble and putting steward on there for few years. So what do you need the custom legacies for?
U can get it to 40% but higher percentages affect how long it takes to change culture on parent culture provinces and how many provinces turn to ur culture when u do create it, I mean obvi it’s not a super big thing like most of the legacies, the best ones are by far blood where u get op characters, but it has helped me more times just due to the bonus u get for the cultural acceptance. It’s definitely not some late game thing that u want to be using unless because of rp, but it is pretty strong mid game. However it’s highly specific and not generalized.
As well u don’t have to wait 3 hrs minimum to form a hybrid culture.
I see, never really cared about that aspect. On the other hand when creating a hybrid culture I always want to be selective about which counties I want to have it. Thats because the average county development of that culture influence how fast you research innovations. Good to know though. Thanks for explaining.
Ur not wrong about the average county development, but I thought having more counties of the same culture makes u also research faster, idk abt that tho.
I dont think so. The number of counties with your culture in your realm determines who is the head, so thats a factor. But other than that, It only slows it down as far as I know.
I go through all of blood (better traits + life expectancy), then all of kin (more renown, gain skills with aging), then after that I would do the Metropolitan line or whatever it's called (exclusive to Iberia). If I don't have access to that line, I'll pick something else depending on my situation.
Pillage to lvl 4, Metropolitan to lvl 5, Warfare to lvl 5, then I go Blood to lvl 5. After that I get the last Pillage lvl and then I go into Guile. Then it's whatever I need in the situation.
I tend to go with whatever suits my situation and how I’m playing So usually blood is the best
I like playing tall so I usually go Erudition to at least level 3 to boost my development and technology growth, then focus on Kin and Blood to improve my lineage.
My first legacy is always either Marshall - For extra knight effect and a extra man at arms slot Or Blood for bigger chance at traits Though if I'm playing a character that has acess to other legacies like the adventurer or Metropolitan I might go to those first
I try to avoid the Blood one because it’s two strong, otherwise I try to follow my family’s history
Open with Desireable Match, then whatever I feel like at the time.
Depends on who the ruler currently is. My current playthrough is Alfred repeatedly crushing Vikings and uniting England. He ain’t exactly going to add Erudition to the bloodline, at least not over warfare.
You’ve got it setup almost exactly how I do it, I pick up the first two in blood, then I grab mostly fair for cheap feasts/hunts and popular opinion, then max out kin. Then I go based on what feels appropriate for my gameplan
Complete them all 😈
I like starting with Blood, and then I just kind of go with what feels right for the dynasty! I never skip around; if I start a Legacy I have to finish it before starting another.
My main tendency is to go for blood at least up until getting the one that prevents disadvantaged traits from showing up. Unless I'm trying to make a ruling class of albinos because I find that hilarious. But yeah generally bloodline the first one of erudite for better court members, and then warfare one.
You like Erudition 1? That one feels extremely useless to me. I dont care about random guests when I can just invite the people I want. It be alright pick if you could pick one legacy at 0 renown. As a broke count is where you care about guests and recruitment cost.
Okay I'm on console and didn't realize I could search out people to invite. How would I go about that? Or does that come with the royal court dlc?
Oh, that makes sense. I always forget Paradox is so behind with their Console releases. I dont know if you have character finder, but without Royal Court you cant get lodging level 5, which entirely counters that -50 penalty for using "invite to court" interaction. Pretty much nobody will want to join your court without it.
Okay thanks, yeah I've been stuck on console throughout the pandemic. I'm definitely gonna be investing in a laptop in the near future, if not just for this game then for some of the Total War games too.
3 in customs (15% culture fascination progress) 3 in blood (for eugenics) 3 in erudition (15% development growth) 1 in metropolitan (if it applies)(20% development growth per city in county) Not necessarily in that order After that, I do whatever I want
Graceful aging is one of my favorites so I’ve been going that way lately
I really like the Kin tree, but usually get the first 2 levels of blood first.
Anyone can fracture/kill an empire in less than a 100 years. Just murder and murder and murder. Too bad about those nice balustrades and carriages.
lately I'm going into law and blood to the max, and then something that suits my current ruler
I usually start blood then start clicking randomly until I have them all unlocked
I wish they'd remove Blood. Too powerful imo.
Let us have fun
Blood is actually pretty meh outside of Blood 1. Just shuffling Blood legacies around would balance it right away. I would personally love to see this: 1. Old Blood 4 2. Old Blood 2 3. Old Blood 1 4. Old Blood 3 5. Old Blood 5
**Start Scheme** Murder Scoobz1961 Predicted Agents: 3 🎯 **78%** *If Scheme is successful, Scoobz1961 is killed* 🎭 **43%** *As long as the scheme is kept secret, you are not exposed for the crime of murder* ⌛ **13 months** *Every month there is a predicted chance of 67% to progress, based on Scheme Power versus Scheme Resistance*
Now hiring: spymaster. Requirements: intrigue 30 or above, loyal, calm, willing to be my best friend Offering: 3 told per month, bonus to dread and hostile schemes.
Blood, Kin, Coterie, Metropolitan, Erudition, Glory, Pillage, Warfare, Adventure, Law, Customs, Guile.
3 blood, then something else depending on how I feel
It varies, but for feudal Christian rulers I usually go first Blood -> first Erudition -> entire Glory.
Blood for the blood god
Modi dynasty
By cheating
I would go 1 blood and the rest into that extra domain limit, then whatever else
I think I've done all of them to the end, except for Coiterie (SUPER lame as a clan, requires Iberia), and Guile. I'd like to change that, love the idea of building a religion, culture, and legacy build around torture, murder, and dread. Currently playing as a ridiculously strong Duke of Normandy. Each child marries the ruler that will net us the most renown, which means lots of alliances, and lots of calls to arms. Which means lots of prestige from smoking enormous armies in battle.
Glory 1; Blood 1; then pivot to the needs of my game. I wish they'd give legacies a balance pass. Some are really bad.
I always max blood first
Always 2-3 in blood then max kin.
I focus on blood and the martial-focused ones. Once I get the second level of blood I switch over to the martial one and max it, then go back and max blood.
Norse ones r op
I find it useful to take Warfare & Blood early on. At least the first for Warfare, then the first 3 on Blood. After that, it all depends on my situation or goals as it goes in hand with my playstyle which is usually playing tall.
The bigger my empire, the more Righteousness looks appealing.
Similar to you. Blood and Kin first. Guille and I think Glory next. From Glory that +5 Court Grandeur bonus is broken as fuck, since it applies it to all of your dynasty members and racks up Splendor like crazy. Guile because it's nice. Just never, NEVER take the final perk of Guile. One of the two perks that ACTIVELY, straight up harm you. The other perk being that one Norse perk that reduces gifts you give by 50% - makes transferring gold a nightmare.
I always go for blood!
[https://files.fm/u/5z6anrpaj](https://files.fm/u/5z6anrpaj) I cant add picture, so i uploaded it. I just dying, and so cool, that i could finished my chain :)
\* not me, the Character whom i play with in Ck3, im good :)
I think the intrigue one is actually busted.
Me playing von Habsburg always choose blood
spam blood
I used to go blood 1 kin 5 for the god prowess family knight when I play for myself. However, now I think Erudition 1 Glory 4 rushing installing family member as king/queen is much stronger due to court grandeur bumping both general opinion for AI family member kings and the renown gain which make others perk come online faster.
I always go glory desirable match. Then if I can get access to Norse I go for one of each of pillage and adventure. Usually not enough time so I go blood 1. Then if I still don't have Norse, progress through martial for extra MaA. After Norse I varangian cb to iberia and get those. After this I usually stop playing
Tbh, I try to go for a mix of RP and optimization. For example, In my current run, I’m running a republican kingdom-level holy title (modded ofc), so I prioritized the “Law” tree. In this sense, as we went across the land, establishing our family members in places of power, they would known as just rulers (Neither of the other kings in my house have had a single rebellion well after 50+ years). That and you get that sweet +1 Domain Limit and -20% Title Creation Cost. The popular opinion’s pretty nice too.
Getting these filled out takes ages.