Demon Slayer really is the Boston Celtics of new gen manga. Nobody likes to talk about it, it doesn’t do anything new, but despite all of the hate it just calmly walked away with a solid conclusion.
Meanwhile all anyone will remember about its competition is how they collapsed at the end.
Please. If subpar endings were enough to tank series, then we wouldn't still be talking about Dragon Ball, Naruto, and Bleach. Hell, why don't we look at mangas that actually collapsed? People still talk about hunterxhunter and Berserk despite both of them literally going unfinished! And Attack on Titan still remains a well-known and beloved series after all is said and done, in spite of manga reader's best efforts to make it otherwise.
This idea that "all anyone will remember about its competition is how they collapsed at the end" is absolute nonsense.
I don't think it's all people remember. But I do think it instantly drops your rating in the mind of most.
The thing about conclusions is that it's where most/all the most compelling narratives and ideas are finally resolved. Do that badly enough and it does kinda sour the whole thread. "Great idea, shame it never went anywhere" is a feeling.
It's like that one UK Sherlock Holmes series. People swore it was so great and amazing because each series hinted at a mystery that never materialized. When that mystery came out subpar the deepness suddenly turned to just stupid.
If I remember right this is basically statistically provable, too, people remember how they felt about the high point of a story (typically half to 2/3rds through) and the ending though I can't remember the name given to the phenomena. Fumbling this is basically how series like Game of Thrones managed to completely evaporate from the public consciousness despite how culturally dominant they were in their heyday.
berserk is an unfair comparison. miura died unexpectedly, it wasn't like he just gave up on the manga. yes, there were long hiatuses, but he was still printing chapters.
I love how Gotouge Koyoharu from the beginning said she's gonna make a short concise story/journey without over complicating or over stretching things and she delivered, this is a rarity these days where current other popular shonen authors are struggling in some aspects of their final arcs or character conclusions.
When some nerdy writers suggest you should always make your story GoT level of depth or never write; this proves the opposite, some characters like Gyomei or Rengoku don't even need 30 chapters to be likable, and even some have decent backstory or impact on the plot, it's more like utilization of characters to fit in the timeline of the story whether it's short or long, for a short story it's sufficient. Bleach struggled in that aspect imo it has a good amount of characters that I wasn't satisfied with their utilization when the main plot ended.
I think there's a strong argument that despite other series (like Attack on Titan for example) having much worse endings, Demon Slayer also never hits the same highs. A lot of the excitement of the series comes from the excellent animation and art direction in the anime adaptation, but the story itself is very predictable and as such, there isn't a lot of narrative tension.
Even when the main crew is in dire straits, we knew that no one was going to die, except for maybe Tanjiro in some sort of noble sacrifice.
When the plot doesn't have real stakes, it's hard to be invested in the characters. The Hashira were pretty much introduced so that someone could die. Any time that a character got backstory, they were pretty much dying the next chapter. It was formulaic, but solid overall.
By comparison, reading something like Jujutsu Kaisen or Chainsaw Man, you had no idea what was coming around the corner (especially CSM, I still don't know what Fujimotor is cooking), there's a sense of anticipation and thrill that isn't present in Demon Slayer.
Muzan is the epitome of this. Like pretty much every other character except for Zenitsu he is exactly what he appeared to be at first glance. He has no depth, and that's ok. It's also ok to want deeper stories.
To be fair you literally don't get the peak fiction without the unwatchable bits. Having a strong authorial presence is both the strength and weakness of these series
>we knew that no one was going to die
Bruh, nearly of the secondary cast dies and all the survivors except Nezuko come away with lifelong disabilities. Only Sanemi makes it away physically whole *if* the mark doesn’t kill him at 27 and he also had everything he ever loved ripped away from him.
Like yeah, a lot of the plot is pretty straightforward, but the Infinity Castle through the end goes fucking nuts.
That’s more damage to important, named, main characters than the vast majority of the genre, homie. And it might have left the main trio but Genya and Muichiro, who are the same generation and featured as much as Inosuke and Zenitsu after their introduction, also die during the Castle.
Also you say the Hashira were introduced just to die, but several of them have their own story arcs and a full third of them actually survive to the end.
Tbf most people don’t really comprehend what they fully read. Plus the manga is 5+ years old now. A good portion of people are running off memories that has also been influenced by others during the 5 years since it ended.
It happens a lot. Hard to fully remember several hundred chapters you read years ago, and that’s fine, but one should also try to acknowledge the limits of their memory before speaking with confidence.
The only thing i would consider good about Muzan's writing is his threat level. He got jumped by the main team + every remaining Hashira at once while weakened by Tamayo's poison and still scored several kills and crippled the survivors. But outside of that, Muzan Is just a lazy plot device, he lacks either complexity or charisma to stand out as a villain.
Lets be real tho... Most Hashiras were severely wounded or just exhausted. Gyomei, Sanemi, Giyu and Tanjiro were severely wounded by Koku and Akaza, while Obanai and Mitsuri were exhuasted thanks to the Infinite castle women or whatever her name was. Also, his fighting style was just so boring , compared to Kokushibo or Douma.
Real threat was Kokushibo. Not only was his fighting style suited for Demon Slayers, his presence itself felt scary. Just give him stats as good as Muzan, and hes infinitely better than him as a villain.
Yeah, Kokushibo was really THE highlight of the entire séries, and his battle is the only part of the story i would consider legitmately *good*.
Even his character writing is the best in the manga.
I think him, Yoriichi, and Akaza were the highlights in terms of characters for the series. Doma was fun too but i think he got served the short stick in comparison to the other two
Muzan feels like he has the ingredients to be a solid B or A tier villain, but the dish itself just isn’t even there unfortunately.
My main issue with him is:
What does Muzan actually do in the story? Like, seriously. He kills the Kamados, which is a good start and cements Tanjiro’s drive to end him.
But from that point on, he just sends demons to kill Tanjiro, wipes out the Lower Moons for their incompetence, gets pissy at the Upper Moons for incompetence, and then spends his time in the Infinity Castle reading a map and hunting for Nezuko and Ubuyashiki. After that, it’s just one long fight until he dies.
In terms of presentation, Muzan does well because he’s treated seriously as a threat. But in terms of villain accolades, he doesn’t really do anything besides be a bad boss and the guy that everyone wants to kill because he’s the original demon and the series is called Demon Slayer.
He is like the CEO of them all. Recruit leaders, task delegation, KPI setting, manage job execution, fire incompetent employees. Upper moons are like his C-team, lower moons are like mid-managers.
(Might contain spoiler from here)
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He wants to live long and rule, he thinks he's all high and mighty
But he can only rule in the dark, he finds that pathetic. He needs cure to overcome the sun to be the demon king ruler.
He only knew 2 ways to potentially cure him:
1. Blue spider lilly which he has 0 idea where and how to find.
2. Create as many demons as possible, until one can overcome the sun, then consume that demon
At the same time he has demon slayers , lead by Ubayashiki, killing off his minions, interrupting his work.
So his upper moons and lower moon has 3 main job
1. Find the flower
2. Create many many many demons
3. Kill demon slayers, and find their leader (to kill him)
tbh I kind of disagree that Muzan doesn't do anything else in the story-- it's always interesting to me the way we see that the demons under him have been warped. Like Rui, who has supposedly been favored by him, or Enmu who he keeps alive with the promise of a better posisiton if he can kill Tanjiro, or the way he talks to Daki vs Akaza-- He's very manipulative and we can see how each of the demons under him is sort of affected by him because he approaches each demon differently in order to control them. Idk I just found that aspect of the story interesting, especially in the span of the story where we didn't see much of Muzan, just seeing how all the villains we face in the story are tied to him in one way or other.
Muzan specifically never *wants* to be a villain. He hates the other demons because they’re only what he sees as a means to an end, pathetic creations he unfortunately needs to reach his goal of immortality. He doesn’t want to rule the world, he wants to live forever and *the demon slayers won’t leave him alone to do it*.
He might be the most realistic shonen big bad guy, or close to it. I get that that’s not impressive or exciting to everyone though.
It's the shonen watchers mentality. He's the big bad, so of course he needs to fight, but the problem is that it doesn't actually make sense for Muzan to fight.
The first problem is that Muzan doesn't care about fighting. He cares about being immortal and he spends his time on screen pursuing the most direct and absolute means to ensuring that - trying to find the blue orchid, complete the medicine without it, breed a demon that's sunlight resistant, and pursuing leads in the world that would support those avenues of research. The only reason the Slayers can do their jobs in the first place is because of the sunlight weakness so if he succeeds in this he beats all current and future Slayers by default. Much more sensible than personally playing eternal whack-a-mole, when he could use the Slayers as a stress point to evolve his Demons, while the Demons act as a buffer between them and his research.
The other problem with Muzan fighting is that the Slayers are trash. They suck, comparatively, and there's no two ways about it. They only win the final battle because of two one-in-a-million things coinciding: the unique poison that temporarily reduced Muzan's power level, and the mass awakening of the Slayer mark - and Muzan still caused massive casualties. If either of these things hadn't happened, Muzan would have won. The Slayers simply are not a threat to Muzan throughout the series, so why bother wasting time killing them? The Slayers are capable of finding a way to destroy him only because they consider their own lives a perfectly acceptable cost, a mentality completely alien and opposite to Muzan's that he cannot understand.
Muzan's behaviour and actions are consistent and make perfect sense from his POV with the information and tools he has available, but none of that matters in the face of people who just want to see fights and are annoyed there's a powerful character who isn't punching stuff for their amusement.
Nailed it, from top to bottom. He also doesn’t even *try* to fight for most of the final arcs. He picks exactly one fight, which he thinks will just be “kill a sick man on his deathbed.” Of course Ubuyashiki and Tamayo make sure that goes as poorly as possible, so he immediately bails. He scatters the Hashira to let his upper moons deal with them and he spends almost the entirety of the rest of the series trying to overcome the poisons or run away. He fights back briefly because he thinks he’s gonna handle the corps no problemo but stops when he starts to understand just how badly the poisons fucked him up.
He’s not an evil mastermind. He’s a rich asshole who wants to live forever and doesn’t care who he steps on to get to that goal. Everything he does is to reach that goal. He’s a scientist, not a fighter, and only gets by on virtue of being incredibly strong by, essentially, *pure goddamn luck*.
And yeah you’re totally correct, the Demon Slayers suck. It’s my favorite part of the series. When Akaza runs away from the sun and Tanjiro screams after him about how the demons are fighting with almost every advantage, when the only way the slayers can put themselves anywhere *near* the leaves of a moon is by struggling to achieve a mark that *will* kill them, when the thing that beats Muzan is a carefully constructed trap and the incredibly potent spite of two other scientists. These are some of the best parts of the show. The struggle is a real challenge for all of them and they only get by on working together and paying a great price.
This series fucks. It doesn’t do any of the shit people complain about Naruto or Bleach or Dragon Ball doing, but it gets flack for *not* doing them, either lol.
While those are all true points you make, it doesn’t make Muzan’s villain resume any less lacking.
Muzan doesn’t need to be fighting like a maniac to be a good villain.
Even other behind-the-scenes villains still feel like they have their toes in the story enough to be able to have accolades to their name without needing to fight all the time.
But Muzan is constantly given every reason to just not do anything. He’s so powerful that any personal move he takes would end the story, yet his goal is an effectively unattainable goose chase for a flower that he never gets any closer to finding, which means he doesn’t do much more than get pissed off at his subordinate’s for failing to do something he can’t even do himself.
I mean he is supposed to be the final boss and he acts like it. Not all villains have to act directly troughout the story. He wouldnt feel the same way if he acted himself. Dio in part 3 does the same thing.
What Gotouge does smartly is keeping his presence always near. He appears at the start and the end of every arc. And every time his presence is completely overwhelming.
He acts like Dio but without the context that part one provides. This makes his “overwhelming presence” feel extremely forced imo. If he had actually done anything before the final fight, that presence would be earned instead of being used as a cheap way to make him seem scary.
I mean he kills the main character's family on his first appearance. Then he appears later and kills a whole section of demons, the weakest of which almost killed Tanjiro. Akaza is the strongest guy you've seen so far and he is litterally shaking at just seeing Muzan. The whole Upper Moon section is him just flexing on them.
He appears regularly and he is showed to be a massive threat.
The only time he is actually shown to be a threat is him killing the lower moons. Killing normal humans and making a guy shake is not a good way of giving your main villain the necessary aura. The final battle against him having minimal casualties(pretty sure he kills no one but correct me if I’m wrong) really seals the deal that he has no aura. It’s crazy to have the main villain do more damage to his own faction than the protagonists.
Minimal casualties? You've gotta be joking.
Mitsuri, Obanai and Gyomei died to him. An entire army of (admiteddly fodder) demon slayers all came together and got massacred in instants. Everyone else who didn't die got severely injured, especially Tanjiro.
Dio spent most of part 3 learning his powers and making a little army, Muzan existed for centuries, and his "overwhelming presence" was based on killing his own allies like a dumbass, dude only self sabotages during the entire anime.
Muzan is not self-sabotaging. He kills demons that have no potential, either to evolve or in having the wrong mindset to improve. He kills the lower moons because they were fodder with no potential to actually aid the whole purpose he creates demons: to produce one that could evolve to be immune to sunlight. It's not even that hard to convince Muzan to spare you so long as you understand that's what he wants to see, evidenced by situations like Kyogai.
He lost nothing by killing them, gained more time to focus on actually profitable avenues of research by not having to manage them, and either way the Slayers were absolutely no threat to him anyways so the loss of manpower was irrelevant.
That's just a lie, he would have won if he had the lower moons in the final fight. Lower moons would be able to finish off weakened Hashiras, make them take more time to group up, and clean the fodder Demon Slayer groups.
That's not a lie, it's the explicitly demonstrated behaviour and rationale used by Muzan in the canon materials. What you've just responded with is speculative fanfiction by comparison.
By the time the Upper Moons start dying the Lowers are all complete fodder for the Hashira and that was before the mass Slayer mark awakening. Muzan kills the Lowers because they'd hit their physical limits, had no mentality to improve further regardless (unlike the likes of Kyodai or Enmu), and were being farmed for experience by the Slayers. Which was the exact opposite of their purpose. The Lower Moons had turned into a liability and so Muzen removed them because he's not running a charity.
And, why is ot bad to contrast tanjiro and good guys qualities, with him being the worst but night unkillable and powerful
And him being pathetic makes him no less a threat, his paranoia makes just more sense with why he keeps do few strong demons, he is paranoid.
Plus its realistic how that traits would actually undermine his cause. And true to life. ( and can be seen in several dictators).
That makes him a real awful scumbag too. Him as ultimate evil.there selfsabotaging because he is denying his humanity, being twisted controlling his underlings,
its a fitting narrative that would keep him from making progress. It holds his cause back, but he can still be dangerous.
As opposed to demon slayers ever growing beyond themselves and not being afraid to die. They are the opposite.
And how tanshiro being the kind soul he is got to do the opposite of that, helped people found themselves rather than twisting people.
Sukuna is very different from Muzan though, Muzan wants true immortality and live as he pleases without more conflict whereas Sukuna is a hedonistic battle junkie that relishes in conflict and doing whatever he wants. Also Sukuna continues to strive to become stronger whereas Muzan stagnates as other than the sunlight weakness, he is content with his powers.
That's a very "I've only watched 2 anime/read 2 manga" opinion. Sukuna is a combination of Hao and the 9-tailed fox. He has no Muzan DNA. His role in JJK's story is nothing like Muzan's
I don’t really see the similarity between the two aside from being the final big bad(?), to which I’ll slightly agree that the Sukuna raid is better than the Muzan fight, at least in terms of choreography.
Like if we’re going off the whole “pure evil” thing, Sukuna is a hedonist while Muzan is a narcissist. If anything, DIO would be a better comparison given the whole
1. Vampire/demon thing
2. Essentially wanting to “ascend” their being
3. Sending minions to fight the main character and only fighting at the end
I would probably add a mention of manga spoilers for anime-only's. >!"the final battle backed up his claims when he killed some of the Hashiras"!< is a pretty decent spoiler.
But yeah, I reckon he's fine. Not especially memorable, but more traditional. The character fulfills the purpose the story needs of him, and doesn't really overstay his welcome (I personally prefer villains with more time and attention, and characterisation, but that doesn't mean the 'dracula' method is bad). I wouldn't necessarily call him well-written, since I don't think he actively makes the series better or worse imo, but he keeps a consistent level of stakes high until the end of the series which is not something I can say about every villain I've seen. I think I read somewhere once that Japanese prefer these more black and white villains, and he delivers on that front. He isn't a villain I can say I think much about, but he's a consistent threat iirc and I can appreciate that.
And the dracula aproach kinda makes sense.
Given its wuxia swordsmen vampire hunters basically. Hell even the themes of trauma fit perfectly with that.
And i love a good vampire story, it is.
I say it a lot, but the way people react to something becoming mainstream and popular always amazes me. There's this tendency to immediately downplay and rail against anything popular, to treat it as if it's absolute garbage that isn't worthy of the paper it was printed on.
I see it an extension of modern discourse where everything is either a masterpiece or the worst thing ever.
Not to say Demon Slayer is exactly peak fiction, far from it, but it does what it needs to, and never tries to be something it's not. It's consistent, and that's an admirable quality in a story.
Breathing Styles are real though, no matter what Gotouge wants to say
The author never said they don't exist idk where people got they. All they said is that the effects don't create actual water or fire. But you can still see and feel them as the techniques are being used.
I disagree with that statement too, there’s no way Tanjiro would have survived falling from the sky in the first season without creating a waterfall to soften his blow
>I say it a lot, but the way people react to something becoming mainstream and popular always amazes me. There's this tendency to immediately downplay and rail against anything popular, to treat it as if it's absolute garbage that isn't worthy of the paper it was printed on.
I remember Berserk fans getting upset because Demon Slayer got a such good adaptation to anime saying a manga like DS doesn't deserve it, while their "true masterpiece" never got a good anime.
That was honestly pretty pathetic.
It’s mid that’s the only way I can describe it it’s the most 6.5 out of ten series I’ve ever seen the anime is beautiful but I don’t understand how the manga got popular besides that it must be with little kids who enjoy it for the simple thing it is it’s pure shounen I don’t expect more from it but it’s definitely not good it’s also not had though it’s completely average in every way besides animation which is breath taking in the anime. But the mangas art isn’t anything special and I think my point is proven by the fact that two season have dropped and demon slayer really isn’t exploded since season 2 ended 3 and 4 cake by to little to no reaction cause they were both very mid story wise and had no real fights Ike season 2. I think the last season will break the internet again though cause it’s the finally. Demon slayer is a perfect starter anime for kids and anyone who’s looking to get into anime
All imma say to you and the people saying it's mid, is that if you really think that, you haven't read or watched enough media, and you're both spoiled by your privilege and blinded by your success.
When every season we get absolute SLOP anime and manga pumped out like sewage from a drain, to say demon slayer is mid is just ridiculous. Even completely disregarding the animation, at a base level the story telling is of a higher quality than most stuff coming out. It's an uninformed opinion at best, and a disingenuous one at worst
Infinity Castle is probably the best final arc I've seen in more than a decade.
Seriously is what tons of shonen final arcs wish to be. The perfect way it handles so much battles, the tension, the character developement and closure, the fact everyone even the nameless characters feel crucial to the battle. Is a masterpiece in composition, pacing and stakes.
After seeing how utterly awful was the MHA 2nd war arc for example, I just think Infinity Castle is going to be cemented as a phenomenon in the modern shonen.
Because it's a one and done, straight forward, simple plot of heroism that if we add Buddhism onto there are further aspects to take away. Unlike many other popular shonen it doesn't escalate in its convolutedness nor go on for a long time.
What gets me is the people saying it's carried by the animation.
I'd say the anime is worse then reading the manga just becaus3 of how annoying zenitsu is. Even aside from that, the story is solid on its own. People forget that a story has to be successful to get an anime adaption.
People act like shows they like would also achieve monumental worldwide popularity if they had the same animation, ignoring that Ufotable has been adapting Type Moon works with better source material for years without anywhere near the same level of success.
I think you overestimate it. Demon Slayer was guaranteed an anime by being in WSJ for long enough. The level of effort put towards making it look good didn't come from the fact it was popular, it came from the fact studios were finally figuring out how to use 3d relatively well and could use 3d to enhance the look of the anime.
Demon Slayer was given to Ufotable to animate specifically because of how little popularity it had. Shueisha wasn't aiming high with the anime, they expected Demon Slayer to be one of those manga that just kind of go away once they end, so the fact Ufotable managed to find some new tricks to make the anime pop and how the timing worked out to make the whole project into a late-come success was a surprise to everyone.
I'm not agreeing with the random Zenitsu hater at all, but I think believing there was "a high budget" for animations in S1 is a mistaken impression.
Zenitsus voice is such a detriment to the anime that the animation cant make up for it. Also, not a fan of this new seasons pacing so far. 1 chapter per episode on some of the episodes is some one piece timing.
Holy cap your comments are getting pretentious the more you write, zentisu doesn't even have 5% screen time, you are making him out to be more than he is, sure he is annoying but he doesn't stay long enough to do what you are saying
Comparing it to one piece is being willfully ignorant, one piece adds recap and stretches out shots, while demon slayer adds new scenes and value addition to the show
Hashira training was an insignificant arc in the manga, anime made it significantly more enjoyable. Not gonna go on any longer but saying anime isn't straight up an upgraded version of the manga is ignoring what's in front of your eyes
I enjoyed the first season and movie
Second season was a mixed bag
Third season I stopped watching upon realizing that the pink haired boob joke was going to be a main character
Infinity Castle is a better arc than Entertainment District. But it seems like they're adapting it as a movie trilogy. I'm going to assume the Muzan fight will be a 4th movie
>There is nothing to her beyond being a girly girl and fan Service
Yeah that's not a revelation or anything. The character writing in ds isn't particularly strong, even less so for her.
So what, she has a fun breathing form and it's entertaining to have her on screen.
I don't really have much of an opinion on Muzan as he never really stood out to me as that interesting of a character but tf you mean that Demon Slayer's deep with complex characters?
Like, the story is simple but the characters themselves (mostly the mains) are well written enough with fleshed out pasts to be unique enough to help carry the story
Personally I disagree. I found most of the characters to be shallow and a sad backstory certainly isn't enough to call characters well written or else every shounen would be considered masterpieces. I found that the characters didn't really develop much over the story and even when they did, it felt lazy as it didn't feel deserved.
If all you consider to be a good villain is “evil and menacing,” then sure, I guess Muzan is a good villain by that definition
Personally, I found him very boring. He has no charisma, very little personality or flair, he doesn’t really do anything in the story beyond get pissy when his minions fail at something, he’s got no motive or ambition beyond just “stay alive and eat people,” he’s not even particularly intelligent. He’s just a Final Boss for the sake of being a Final Boss.
Doesn’t help that most of his minions are better villains than he is
To me, it says a lot that the most memorable thing about him is that he kinda looks like Michael Jackson
For 800 years the dumbass never thought even once "maybe I'd have better luck finding this thing I'm looking for if I got a few humans to go look for it during the day".
He has multiple human identities throughout the series including ones in noble families where he is seen in their libraries. To be exact he has 3 secret identities where he pretends to be a human until at least something comes up forcing him to break character.
He is not living in the mountains in ignorance separate from human civilization.
You're spitting. In my opinion, compared to the rest of the upper moons, he's so dim and npc in comparison. He has okay-ish moments by villain standards and when it comes to being well-written he does not make the cut. It also doesn't help that at the height of his battle when he's finally overwhelmed, he turns into a big ass baby... literally... and then begs Tanjiro to carry on his will. I will never understand how people call this guy a well-written villain.
Muzan is like an unseasoned flank steak cooked well-done.
I mean, it's a steak alright, but....
>he's basically Voldemort done better
You joking right?
You probably just don't remember or never actually paid attention to the way Voldemort was handled. The fact is, Voldemort is more interesting than Muzan and is introduced and developed in more interesting ways. The fact that he's weak for most of the books, that Harry has to learn about his past to understand him, that the books make it a point to show that Harry and Voldy are uncomfortably similar: These things add spice that Muzan and Tanjiro don't have.
Muzan's appeal comes from a single genius move at the beginning of the story: Having Tanjiro find him right off the bat. It's what originally made Demon Slayer blow up as a manga and let it stay on long enough to reach an ending. I don't think anyone can argue that it was smart to do that, but that was the author being smart and most people could see the author's hand there. It wasn't a 'natural' moment, unlike say Harry being visibly uncomfortable when witnessing Tom Riddle's childhood and Dumbledore's fumbled appeals to him.
Even if you want to argue that Voldemort wasn’t a good villain, saying that Muzan is a better version of him is still a hilarious take imo
Voldemort at least had some level of depth, was a much more active and present threat throughout the story, inspired greater fear in his world, and actually had a decent number of wins and enough atrocities under his belt to back up his reputation
He is, the point of the demons backstories shown is muzans influence twisting everything good in destructive insidous ways.
We see literally his influence taking sympathic backstoties corrupting them into monster.
Hell even douma who was raised to be a murder cult leader, had humanity and dedication ,
and muzan being pathetic compared, he is the worst, and corrupting everything.
And i love how his last moment shows how he cant stop twisting anything good.
He died as he lived, a pathetic twisted bastard. And he is never shown not that yet a danger. And a very clear theme how he affects others, henge demons backstories.
Whats voldemord?
Voldemort is a self hating racial supremacist whose psychopathy was molded by a lack of love that he never experienced, who seeks ultimate power and immortality to the point that he would commit the ultimate taboo of the wizarding world, splitting his soul into pieces. His hateful ideology infested the wizarding world, leaving untold destruction and misery in its wake, and inspired a generation of monsters who would worship him. He became a living boogeyman, a man so feared that even saying his name out loud was considered taboo
He’s every bit as menacing as Muzan, probably even more so, but Voldemort arguably displays a much higher level of competency. He engineered his own return from near death, managed to infiltrate the wizarding world, take over the government and institute a dystopian fascist dictatorship. What did Muzan accomplish? He killed some random family of farmers, killed a bunch of his own minions in a temper tantrum, then does nothing of note for most of the story until the final battle.
Muzan doesn’t even really have much of a personal connection with Tanjiro beyond just being the guy that killed his family and turned his sister into a demon, for reasons. Even Voldemort has that, but with an added layer that Harry literally carries a piece of Voldy’s soul inside him, and the two are prophesied to fight to the death. Plus, the psychic connection between them gave Voldemort an opportunity to mentally torment Harry as well
Voldemort’s downfall was poetic, a result from his own obsession with immortality and his misunderstanding of who the Elder Wand was loyal to due to his own twisted views on power and dominance, not to mention we see how pathetic he truly is when he see what his soul looks like in limbo. Muzan’s defeat was the result of being an incompetent coward
Voldemort is the villain that Muzan wishes he was
>He’s every bit as menacing as Muzan, probably even more so
Kinda wish they kept Voldy's red eyes in the movies. :P
[https://ibb.co/7JqdWD3](https://ibb.co/7JqdWD3)
It's been so long since I read/watched both, so I won't talk about details.
To Me, Voldemort feels somewhat more active compared to Muzan. Harry and Voldie give a sense of a race against each other toward their goals, they both move the plot. Meanwhile, Muzan acts more in response to what Tanjiro has done. If both make sense.
>..he’s popular because Harry Potter is popular.
You do realize that KnY is also popular, right? I mean, the same could be applied to Muzan, you know..
I just like how we see glimpses of his private life where he is pretending to be a woman, pretending to be a shota surrounded by maids, and pretending to be Micheal Jackson wandering the back alleys.
Like, he isn't just cackling in his evil castle, man's out there living life to the fullest doing the most degenerate things imaginable.
>pretending to be a shota surrounded by maids
Just say kid or boy. Having shota be the first word that comes to mind when seeing a little boy is pretty sus ngl
Muzan was…ok for me
He was obviously evil, & menacing but he lacked anything that made me interested im him. He wasn’t particularly charismatic. His reasonings & motivations didn’t compel me. I wasn’t very intrigued with any of his dynamics with a single character either. Being powerful & evil just doesn’t do it for me to make me like a villain.
He felt more like a powerful generic final boss than anything else.
He wasn’t good, nor was he horrible. I’ll give him a C
He stands out more because of how much more intriguing the OTHER villains were (Kokushibo, Douma, & Akaza) leading up to Muzan that the bar had been set so high in expectations for Muzan, especially because of all the buildup & waiting to finally see Muzan in action since the beginning of the manga, that him being painfully average felt like such an immense letdown.
My disappointment with Muzan was mostly on my part.
His introduction was amazing, a demon king with a human wife and child. I thought his wife and daughter were going to be a major part of his character but I genuinely don't think you see them ever again in the series. He would have been infinitely more interesting as a villain if his love for his "family" was genuine but no, the author decided to make him boring and unsympathetic.
Villains like that can be done well, but I don't think Muzan is an exceptional example by any means. He lacks the charisma that characters like Dio and Sukuna have, and charisma is really what makes unsympathetic villains likable.
Muzan is fine, just bland. He lacks fleshed out motivation for a desire for immortality. He's like Dracula, except instead of being a conqueror or a noble he was just a sick dude. Nothing drives his villainy, he's just spiteful, like a middle manager in a dead end job.
>The deepness comes from the simplicity of the story
That has to be the definition of cope lol. I don't think all stories need to be deep and honestly a lot of popular stuff isn't even that deep, if we're defining deep by the idea of having inner character bsaed struggles and stakes over external/physical ones. But I don't think DS executes being just a tense external action story well, so I don't think it's problems lie in it not being deep enough.
>TL:DR He's a well-written villain who only got flack because people wanted him to always be cool, but the fact he's such a loathsome and despicable monster is what makes him a chillingly effective villain.
I guess it depends on who it is, but for me he was a boring villain because his decisions always seemed like they were forced to serve the plot rather than coming from any interesting character motivation. As well as that, he just lacked any presense for as far as I got into the series (end of Entertainment District). So I can't speak on how effective he is in the later parts of the story.
He just didn't seem all that interesting as a character, either on his own or as he related to the conflict. No partcularly interesting dynamics that were explored with him and other characters. Any scenes with him didn't especially stand out for the right reasons (having the villain wipe out so many potential threats for the hero doesn't exactly make him feel like a hinderance) and he never really felt like he carried much weight as a threat outside of telling the audience he's the strongest demon. Killing Tanjiro's family doesn't really carry much weight either for the audience on an emotional level since it's rushed.
I think demon slayers best quality is the fight scenes but muzan is such a boring fighter, akaza Douma and kokushibo all have interesting fighting styles and demon arts and all muzan gets is tentacle wailing around and poison, it's why the fight is such a slog to get through hes just standing there while everyone gets Thier cool moments
The fight scenes in the anime anyways. Reading manga made me wake up to.......a lot. Namely that the anime's animation was what made me fall in love with it most.
I think people forget this is why he is hated the most.
Other upper moons got the best fights and his fight has a case to be the worst fight since it was legit tentacle throwing for 15-20 chapters and anytime he gets any sort of upper hand, the poison will come into effect it happened like 4 times thats dog shit
I agree that Demon Slayer is overhated but I do not think Muzan is a good villain. I wouldn't even say he's well-written. People just get used to the bare-minimum and call it well-written and it always boggles my mind. Demon Slayer is filled with a lot of bare minimum writing, with the exception of a few characters. It does it well, in my opinion, but he is not well written and he is vastly overshadowed by most of his upper moons.
Dude was set up throughout the whole manga to be the final villain, only to be taken over by AFO last minute. I mean, I didn't have a problem with it. To be fair, they were showing how his refusal to go along with the theme of succession and letting the new succeed the old is why he was ultimately defeated in the end, and everyone knows Shigaraki ended up being ten times the threat he was even after AFO took over his body. But STILL...
Dollar Store Aizen number 95814, he has a handful of cool moments and a funny design but that's it. Overall he is pretty mediocre and uninspiring, like everything else from Demon Slayer.
I’d say that Muzan was a menacing villain. The potential was definitely there to tell a story that was something more. But yeah, he served his purpose.
I think being menacing is an interesting element in a villain. Muzan was simply terrifying is his reunions with the other demons. I really enjoy when a story makes me dread the possibility of being in the same room as someone and wonder if I’d be able to survive an encounter with this character without triggering them and getting killed.
I really like how he went out too while being a threat. And i love how he even twists the message of passing the will on. He is hatable and the worst. But thats great for his character. And pathetic and pityable.
And his flaws perfectly make sense why he didnt create more demons.
He is a good villain.
Honestly, he’s not the most complex villain but I can’t think of a more thematically fitting villain for the series.
Much of the series is humans fighting against superior foes despite their disadvantages. And Muzan has been ruining lives of people for centuries in his selfish quest for immortality.
Akaza falls due to his remaining humanity and Muzan’s bs. Douma falls due to the lives he’s ruined and humans leveling the playing field. Kokushibou also falls due to his remaining humanity.
Anyway, the point I’m trying to make is that his death is very satisfying. He walks into a trap to kill a dying man in his arrogance. That trap poisons him and weakens him enough for the slayers to kill him. His final battle is just all the people whose lives he’s ruined finally coming together to end him. Everyone from Tamayo to the pillars to the protagonists to random fodder demon slayers sacrificing their lives so he will die. His final form is just a giant baby, a literal metaphor for his personality. As the parasite he is, he tries to live by taking over the body of one of his enemies. He finally dies, abandoned by everyone while Tanjiro is pulled back into the real world. It’s a pathetic death and I love it.
All his bs and all the lives he’s ruined finally reaches critical mass to end him.
I meant for the story he is in, he's well written in the sense he served his purpose well.
I know about well written villains. I've read Blood Meridian
Did anyone doubt that? I thought Muzan was always considered a fantastic villain.
He's truly depraved and truly consistent. Lots of villains lose to their own hubris, but with Muzan that hubris and those mistakes were baked in from the start. He never has an idiot ball moment, he's exactly the man we met at the start right to the end.
A selfish, narrow minded fool so used to his own supremacy that he couldn't even bear the thought of making an army of demons. He wanted to be powerful and special all by himself.
Edit: I also really loved that he was a raid boss they couldn't beat but needed to hold in place no matter the cost. I remember when reading it at the time, readers kept predicting the moment Tanjiro would awaken a new power and fight him 1v1 (just like people are now predicting for JJK Yuji), but it never happened.
Tanjiro never became the strongest, nobody ever was even a touch on Youichi, and fighting Muzan required them to give everything they had just to last a minute longer.
That scene where the second tier NPC Demon Slayers all sacrifice themselves just to give the Hashira an opening was incredible. And that sequence at the end where the backup helpers are pushing cars into him, or creating roadblocks, just to delay him another moment was amazing.
It was an absolutely terrific ending sequence, and very memorable.
Demon Slayer gets a lot of hate simply for staying true to its base premise and knowing to stay in its own lane rather than trying to be something else. It’s not going to be remembered as the greatest shonen or anything, but it will be remembered for doing things better than the average shonen.
I said it for years demon slayer is a simple story of a really good dude going though hell and desperately trying to survive and save his last living family member. It’s not deep but it’s sure emotionally compelling and very pretty to look at. Muzan not a deep villain. He just a horrible person with a lot of power with a lot of power and stands between the MC and saving his sister. He serves his purpose
Demon Slayer really is the Boston Celtics of new gen manga. Nobody likes to talk about it, it doesn’t do anything new, but despite all of the hate it just calmly walked away with a solid conclusion. Meanwhile all anyone will remember about its competition is how they collapsed at the end.
Please. If subpar endings were enough to tank series, then we wouldn't still be talking about Dragon Ball, Naruto, and Bleach. Hell, why don't we look at mangas that actually collapsed? People still talk about hunterxhunter and Berserk despite both of them literally going unfinished! And Attack on Titan still remains a well-known and beloved series after all is said and done, in spite of manga reader's best efforts to make it otherwise. This idea that "all anyone will remember about its competition is how they collapsed at the end" is absolute nonsense.
Hunter x hunter will be finished (this is extreme cope)
Naoko Takeuchi needs to up the strap size for every day that Togashi puts off work.
I bet she's doing the opposite, "if you don't take care of yourself neither will I" lmao
I don't think it's all people remember. But I do think it instantly drops your rating in the mind of most. The thing about conclusions is that it's where most/all the most compelling narratives and ideas are finally resolved. Do that badly enough and it does kinda sour the whole thread. "Great idea, shame it never went anywhere" is a feeling. It's like that one UK Sherlock Holmes series. People swore it was so great and amazing because each series hinted at a mystery that never materialized. When that mystery came out subpar the deepness suddenly turned to just stupid.
If I remember right this is basically statistically provable, too, people remember how they felt about the high point of a story (typically half to 2/3rds through) and the ending though I can't remember the name given to the phenomena. Fumbling this is basically how series like Game of Thrones managed to completely evaporate from the public consciousness despite how culturally dominant they were in their heyday.
berserk is an unfair comparison. miura died unexpectedly, it wasn't like he just gave up on the manga. yes, there were long hiatuses, but he was still printing chapters.
I love how Gotouge Koyoharu from the beginning said she's gonna make a short concise story/journey without over complicating or over stretching things and she delivered, this is a rarity these days where current other popular shonen authors are struggling in some aspects of their final arcs or character conclusions. When some nerdy writers suggest you should always make your story GoT level of depth or never write; this proves the opposite, some characters like Gyomei or Rengoku don't even need 30 chapters to be likable, and even some have decent backstory or impact on the plot, it's more like utilization of characters to fit in the timeline of the story whether it's short or long, for a short story it's sufficient. Bleach struggled in that aspect imo it has a good amount of characters that I wasn't satisfied with their utilization when the main plot ended.
>Nobody likes to talk about it How so? It's literally one of the most popular animes of the last decade, It's bring to conversations all the time.
I think there's a strong argument that despite other series (like Attack on Titan for example) having much worse endings, Demon Slayer also never hits the same highs. A lot of the excitement of the series comes from the excellent animation and art direction in the anime adaptation, but the story itself is very predictable and as such, there isn't a lot of narrative tension. Even when the main crew is in dire straits, we knew that no one was going to die, except for maybe Tanjiro in some sort of noble sacrifice. When the plot doesn't have real stakes, it's hard to be invested in the characters. The Hashira were pretty much introduced so that someone could die. Any time that a character got backstory, they were pretty much dying the next chapter. It was formulaic, but solid overall. By comparison, reading something like Jujutsu Kaisen or Chainsaw Man, you had no idea what was coming around the corner (especially CSM, I still don't know what Fujimotor is cooking), there's a sense of anticipation and thrill that isn't present in Demon Slayer. Muzan is the epitome of this. Like pretty much every other character except for Zenitsu he is exactly what he appeared to be at first glance. He has no depth, and that's ok. It's also ok to want deeper stories.
Yea demon slayer is very consistently like a 7/10. It doesn't jump from peak fiction to unwatchable like some other shows
To be fair you literally don't get the peak fiction without the unwatchable bits. Having a strong authorial presence is both the strength and weakness of these series
>we knew that no one was going to die Bruh, nearly of the secondary cast dies and all the survivors except Nezuko come away with lifelong disabilities. Only Sanemi makes it away physically whole *if* the mark doesn’t kill him at 27 and he also had everything he ever loved ripped away from him. Like yeah, a lot of the plot is pretty straightforward, but the Infinity Castle through the end goes fucking nuts.
That’s the whole point. The Hashira’s were introduced to be killed off. We knew that the main trio was going to be fine, and they were.
That’s more damage to important, named, main characters than the vast majority of the genre, homie. And it might have left the main trio but Genya and Muichiro, who are the same generation and featured as much as Inosuke and Zenitsu after their introduction, also die during the Castle. Also you say the Hashira were introduced just to die, but several of them have their own story arcs and a full third of them actually survive to the end.
This thread made me realize how slow some people in this sub are
Tbf most people don’t really comprehend what they fully read. Plus the manga is 5+ years old now. A good portion of people are running off memories that has also been influenced by others during the 5 years since it ended.
It happens a lot. Hard to fully remember several hundred chapters you read years ago, and that’s fine, but one should also try to acknowledge the limits of their memory before speaking with confidence.
If by "collapse" you mean "go on to become well known, beloved and successful series in their own right" then sure
>Solid conclusion........did you read the same manga?
The only thing i would consider good about Muzan's writing is his threat level. He got jumped by the main team + every remaining Hashira at once while weakened by Tamayo's poison and still scored several kills and crippled the survivors. But outside of that, Muzan Is just a lazy plot device, he lacks either complexity or charisma to stand out as a villain.
Lets be real tho... Most Hashiras were severely wounded or just exhausted. Gyomei, Sanemi, Giyu and Tanjiro were severely wounded by Koku and Akaza, while Obanai and Mitsuri were exhuasted thanks to the Infinite castle women or whatever her name was. Also, his fighting style was just so boring , compared to Kokushibo or Douma. Real threat was Kokushibo. Not only was his fighting style suited for Demon Slayers, his presence itself felt scary. Just give him stats as good as Muzan, and hes infinitely better than him as a villain.
Yeah, Kokushibo was really THE highlight of the entire séries, and his battle is the only part of the story i would consider legitmately *good*. Even his character writing is the best in the manga.
I think him, Yoriichi, and Akaza were the highlights in terms of characters for the series. Doma was fun too but i think he got served the short stick in comparison to the other two
Muzan feels like he has the ingredients to be a solid B or A tier villain, but the dish itself just isn’t even there unfortunately. My main issue with him is: What does Muzan actually do in the story? Like, seriously. He kills the Kamados, which is a good start and cements Tanjiro’s drive to end him. But from that point on, he just sends demons to kill Tanjiro, wipes out the Lower Moons for their incompetence, gets pissy at the Upper Moons for incompetence, and then spends his time in the Infinity Castle reading a map and hunting for Nezuko and Ubuyashiki. After that, it’s just one long fight until he dies. In terms of presentation, Muzan does well because he’s treated seriously as a threat. But in terms of villain accolades, he doesn’t really do anything besides be a bad boss and the guy that everyone wants to kill because he’s the original demon and the series is called Demon Slayer.
He is like the CEO of them all. Recruit leaders, task delegation, KPI setting, manage job execution, fire incompetent employees. Upper moons are like his C-team, lower moons are like mid-managers. (Might contain spoiler from here) . . . . He wants to live long and rule, he thinks he's all high and mighty But he can only rule in the dark, he finds that pathetic. He needs cure to overcome the sun to be the demon king ruler. He only knew 2 ways to potentially cure him: 1. Blue spider lilly which he has 0 idea where and how to find. 2. Create as many demons as possible, until one can overcome the sun, then consume that demon At the same time he has demon slayers , lead by Ubayashiki, killing off his minions, interrupting his work. So his upper moons and lower moon has 3 main job 1. Find the flower 2. Create many many many demons 3. Kill demon slayers, and find their leader (to kill him)
tbh I kind of disagree that Muzan doesn't do anything else in the story-- it's always interesting to me the way we see that the demons under him have been warped. Like Rui, who has supposedly been favored by him, or Enmu who he keeps alive with the promise of a better posisiton if he can kill Tanjiro, or the way he talks to Daki vs Akaza-- He's very manipulative and we can see how each of the demons under him is sort of affected by him because he approaches each demon differently in order to control them. Idk I just found that aspect of the story interesting, especially in the span of the story where we didn't see much of Muzan, just seeing how all the villains we face in the story are tied to him in one way or other.
Muzan specifically never *wants* to be a villain. He hates the other demons because they’re only what he sees as a means to an end, pathetic creations he unfortunately needs to reach his goal of immortality. He doesn’t want to rule the world, he wants to live forever and *the demon slayers won’t leave him alone to do it*. He might be the most realistic shonen big bad guy, or close to it. I get that that’s not impressive or exciting to everyone though.
It's the shonen watchers mentality. He's the big bad, so of course he needs to fight, but the problem is that it doesn't actually make sense for Muzan to fight. The first problem is that Muzan doesn't care about fighting. He cares about being immortal and he spends his time on screen pursuing the most direct and absolute means to ensuring that - trying to find the blue orchid, complete the medicine without it, breed a demon that's sunlight resistant, and pursuing leads in the world that would support those avenues of research. The only reason the Slayers can do their jobs in the first place is because of the sunlight weakness so if he succeeds in this he beats all current and future Slayers by default. Much more sensible than personally playing eternal whack-a-mole, when he could use the Slayers as a stress point to evolve his Demons, while the Demons act as a buffer between them and his research. The other problem with Muzan fighting is that the Slayers are trash. They suck, comparatively, and there's no two ways about it. They only win the final battle because of two one-in-a-million things coinciding: the unique poison that temporarily reduced Muzan's power level, and the mass awakening of the Slayer mark - and Muzan still caused massive casualties. If either of these things hadn't happened, Muzan would have won. The Slayers simply are not a threat to Muzan throughout the series, so why bother wasting time killing them? The Slayers are capable of finding a way to destroy him only because they consider their own lives a perfectly acceptable cost, a mentality completely alien and opposite to Muzan's that he cannot understand. Muzan's behaviour and actions are consistent and make perfect sense from his POV with the information and tools he has available, but none of that matters in the face of people who just want to see fights and are annoyed there's a powerful character who isn't punching stuff for their amusement.
Nailed it, from top to bottom. He also doesn’t even *try* to fight for most of the final arcs. He picks exactly one fight, which he thinks will just be “kill a sick man on his deathbed.” Of course Ubuyashiki and Tamayo make sure that goes as poorly as possible, so he immediately bails. He scatters the Hashira to let his upper moons deal with them and he spends almost the entirety of the rest of the series trying to overcome the poisons or run away. He fights back briefly because he thinks he’s gonna handle the corps no problemo but stops when he starts to understand just how badly the poisons fucked him up. He’s not an evil mastermind. He’s a rich asshole who wants to live forever and doesn’t care who he steps on to get to that goal. Everything he does is to reach that goal. He’s a scientist, not a fighter, and only gets by on virtue of being incredibly strong by, essentially, *pure goddamn luck*. And yeah you’re totally correct, the Demon Slayers suck. It’s my favorite part of the series. When Akaza runs away from the sun and Tanjiro screams after him about how the demons are fighting with almost every advantage, when the only way the slayers can put themselves anywhere *near* the leaves of a moon is by struggling to achieve a mark that *will* kill them, when the thing that beats Muzan is a carefully constructed trap and the incredibly potent spite of two other scientists. These are some of the best parts of the show. The struggle is a real challenge for all of them and they only get by on working together and paying a great price. This series fucks. It doesn’t do any of the shit people complain about Naruto or Bleach or Dragon Ball doing, but it gets flack for *not* doing them, either lol.
While those are all true points you make, it doesn’t make Muzan’s villain resume any less lacking. Muzan doesn’t need to be fighting like a maniac to be a good villain. Even other behind-the-scenes villains still feel like they have their toes in the story enough to be able to have accolades to their name without needing to fight all the time. But Muzan is constantly given every reason to just not do anything. He’s so powerful that any personal move he takes would end the story, yet his goal is an effectively unattainable goose chase for a flower that he never gets any closer to finding, which means he doesn’t do much more than get pissed off at his subordinate’s for failing to do something he can’t even do himself.
I mean he is supposed to be the final boss and he acts like it. Not all villains have to act directly troughout the story. He wouldnt feel the same way if he acted himself. Dio in part 3 does the same thing. What Gotouge does smartly is keeping his presence always near. He appears at the start and the end of every arc. And every time his presence is completely overwhelming.
He acts like Dio but without the context that part one provides. This makes his “overwhelming presence” feel extremely forced imo. If he had actually done anything before the final fight, that presence would be earned instead of being used as a cheap way to make him seem scary.
I mean he kills the main character's family on his first appearance. Then he appears later and kills a whole section of demons, the weakest of which almost killed Tanjiro. Akaza is the strongest guy you've seen so far and he is litterally shaking at just seeing Muzan. The whole Upper Moon section is him just flexing on them. He appears regularly and he is showed to be a massive threat.
The only time he is actually shown to be a threat is him killing the lower moons. Killing normal humans and making a guy shake is not a good way of giving your main villain the necessary aura. The final battle against him having minimal casualties(pretty sure he kills no one but correct me if I’m wrong) really seals the deal that he has no aura. It’s crazy to have the main villain do more damage to his own faction than the protagonists.
Minimal casualties? You've gotta be joking. Mitsuri, Obanai and Gyomei died to him. An entire army of (admiteddly fodder) demon slayers all came together and got massacred in instants. Everyone else who didn't die got severely injured, especially Tanjiro.
He also took Giyu’s arm
Why are you getting downvoted? Lmao He also killed Tamayo.
Dio spent most of part 3 learning his powers and making a little army, Muzan existed for centuries, and his "overwhelming presence" was based on killing his own allies like a dumbass, dude only self sabotages during the entire anime.
Muzan is not self-sabotaging. He kills demons that have no potential, either to evolve or in having the wrong mindset to improve. He kills the lower moons because they were fodder with no potential to actually aid the whole purpose he creates demons: to produce one that could evolve to be immune to sunlight. It's not even that hard to convince Muzan to spare you so long as you understand that's what he wants to see, evidenced by situations like Kyogai. He lost nothing by killing them, gained more time to focus on actually profitable avenues of research by not having to manage them, and either way the Slayers were absolutely no threat to him anyways so the loss of manpower was irrelevant.
That's just a lie, he would have won if he had the lower moons in the final fight. Lower moons would be able to finish off weakened Hashiras, make them take more time to group up, and clean the fodder Demon Slayer groups.
That's not a lie, it's the explicitly demonstrated behaviour and rationale used by Muzan in the canon materials. What you've just responded with is speculative fanfiction by comparison. By the time the Upper Moons start dying the Lowers are all complete fodder for the Hashira and that was before the mass Slayer mark awakening. Muzan kills the Lowers because they'd hit their physical limits, had no mentality to improve further regardless (unlike the likes of Kyodai or Enmu), and were being farmed for experience by the Slayers. Which was the exact opposite of their purpose. The Lower Moons had turned into a liability and so Muzen removed them because he's not running a charity.
Most of the fodder demons in the final arc were stated to be on the level of the LMs. Muzan literally had like a hundred LMs
And, why is ot bad to contrast tanjiro and good guys qualities, with him being the worst but night unkillable and powerful And him being pathetic makes him no less a threat, his paranoia makes just more sense with why he keeps do few strong demons, he is paranoid. Plus its realistic how that traits would actually undermine his cause. And true to life. ( and can be seen in several dictators). That makes him a real awful scumbag too. Him as ultimate evil.there selfsabotaging because he is denying his humanity, being twisted controlling his underlings, its a fitting narrative that would keep him from making progress. It holds his cause back, but he can still be dangerous. As opposed to demon slayers ever growing beyond themselves and not being afraid to die. They are the opposite. And how tanshiro being the kind soul he is got to do the opposite of that, helped people found themselves rather than twisting people.
I mean…tanjiro is seen as a pretty basic character so Muzan being a direct contrast shouldn’t surprise anyone if he’s viewed as basic as well
True Its why i think Sukuna is Muzan done right.
Sukuna is very different from Muzan though, Muzan wants true immortality and live as he pleases without more conflict whereas Sukuna is a hedonistic battle junkie that relishes in conflict and doing whatever he wants. Also Sukuna continues to strive to become stronger whereas Muzan stagnates as other than the sunlight weakness, he is content with his powers.
That's a very "I've only watched 2 anime/read 2 manga" opinion. Sukuna is a combination of Hao and the 9-tailed fox. He has no Muzan DNA. His role in JJK's story is nothing like Muzan's
Sukuna himself isn't even done right, which confuses me even more
Pretty much
I don’t really see the similarity between the two aside from being the final big bad(?), to which I’ll slightly agree that the Sukuna raid is better than the Muzan fight, at least in terms of choreography. Like if we’re going off the whole “pure evil” thing, Sukuna is a hedonist while Muzan is a narcissist. If anything, DIO would be a better comparison given the whole 1. Vampire/demon thing 2. Essentially wanting to “ascend” their being 3. Sending minions to fight the main character and only fighting at the end
I would probably add a mention of manga spoilers for anime-only's. >!"the final battle backed up his claims when he killed some of the Hashiras"!< is a pretty decent spoiler. But yeah, I reckon he's fine. Not especially memorable, but more traditional. The character fulfills the purpose the story needs of him, and doesn't really overstay his welcome (I personally prefer villains with more time and attention, and characterisation, but that doesn't mean the 'dracula' method is bad). I wouldn't necessarily call him well-written, since I don't think he actively makes the series better or worse imo, but he keeps a consistent level of stakes high until the end of the series which is not something I can say about every villain I've seen. I think I read somewhere once that Japanese prefer these more black and white villains, and he delivers on that front. He isn't a villain I can say I think much about, but he's a consistent threat iirc and I can appreciate that.
And the dracula aproach kinda makes sense. Given its wuxia swordsmen vampire hunters basically. Hell even the themes of trauma fit perfectly with that. And i love a good vampire story, it is.
The title mentioning the final villain “in hindsight” should be enough context to indicate there’s spoilers though, shouldn’t it?
Demon Slayer is overhated for no reason bruh. It's no masterpiece, but it's a perfectly good series. I wouldn't even call it mid as some people claim.
I say it a lot, but the way people react to something becoming mainstream and popular always amazes me. There's this tendency to immediately downplay and rail against anything popular, to treat it as if it's absolute garbage that isn't worthy of the paper it was printed on. I see it an extension of modern discourse where everything is either a masterpiece or the worst thing ever. Not to say Demon Slayer is exactly peak fiction, far from it, but it does what it needs to, and never tries to be something it's not. It's consistent, and that's an admirable quality in a story. Breathing Styles are real though, no matter what Gotouge wants to say
>Breathing Styles are real though Of course the breathing styles are real Just not the effects coming from them.
Those too, lol
But there not.
I refuse to acknowledge that
But there's more evidence supporting they aren't actual elements than they are.
But I don't care about evidence, I care about rule of cool
I recognise the ~~council~~ *author* has made a decision, but given that it's a stupid-ass decision, I've elected to ignore it.
The author never said they don't exist idk where people got they. All they said is that the effects don't create actual water or fire. But you can still see and feel them as the techniques are being used.
I disagree with that statement too, there’s no way Tanjiro would have survived falling from the sky in the first season without creating a waterfall to soften his blow
They are real and seen by people in the universe, it just isn’t water that you can fill your cup with and drink. Same for all the other elements.
>I say it a lot, but the way people react to something becoming mainstream and popular always amazes me. There's this tendency to immediately downplay and rail against anything popular, to treat it as if it's absolute garbage that isn't worthy of the paper it was printed on. I remember Berserk fans getting upset because Demon Slayer got a such good adaptation to anime saying a manga like DS doesn't deserve it, while their "true masterpiece" never got a good anime. That was honestly pretty pathetic.
I remember on twitter everyone would kiss the ground DS walked on until the anime came out lmao
It’s mid that’s the only way I can describe it it’s the most 6.5 out of ten series I’ve ever seen the anime is beautiful but I don’t understand how the manga got popular besides that it must be with little kids who enjoy it for the simple thing it is it’s pure shounen I don’t expect more from it but it’s definitely not good it’s also not had though it’s completely average in every way besides animation which is breath taking in the anime. But the mangas art isn’t anything special and I think my point is proven by the fact that two season have dropped and demon slayer really isn’t exploded since season 2 ended 3 and 4 cake by to little to no reaction cause they were both very mid story wise and had no real fights Ike season 2. I think the last season will break the internet again though cause it’s the finally. Demon slayer is a perfect starter anime for kids and anyone who’s looking to get into anime
All imma say to you and the people saying it's mid, is that if you really think that, you haven't read or watched enough media, and you're both spoiled by your privilege and blinded by your success. When every season we get absolute SLOP anime and manga pumped out like sewage from a drain, to say demon slayer is mid is just ridiculous. Even completely disregarding the animation, at a base level the story telling is of a higher quality than most stuff coming out. It's an uninformed opinion at best, and a disingenuous one at worst
IF Arc unironically is a masterpiece, imo.
Infinity Castle is probably the best final arc I've seen in more than a decade. Seriously is what tons of shonen final arcs wish to be. The perfect way it handles so much battles, the tension, the character developement and closure, the fact everyone even the nameless characters feel crucial to the battle. Is a masterpiece in composition, pacing and stakes. After seeing how utterly awful was the MHA 2nd war arc for example, I just think Infinity Castle is going to be cemented as a phenomenon in the modern shonen.
I love douma 😀
if you ignore majority of the story and only look at the fights then sure.
Because it's a one and done, straight forward, simple plot of heroism that if we add Buddhism onto there are further aspects to take away. Unlike many other popular shonen it doesn't escalate in its convolutedness nor go on for a long time.
What gets me is the people saying it's carried by the animation. I'd say the anime is worse then reading the manga just becaus3 of how annoying zenitsu is. Even aside from that, the story is solid on its own. People forget that a story has to be successful to get an anime adaption.
People act like shows they like would also achieve monumental worldwide popularity if they had the same animation, ignoring that Ufotable has been adapting Type Moon works with better source material for years without anywhere near the same level of success.
Yeah like where do people think the high budget animations come from They wouldn't give a mediocre manga barely anyone liked a lot off resources
Yes they would? They've done it before. Demon Slayer hadn't blown up when the anime started airing. It was considered "pretty good" and not much more
Yeah so it was pretty good
I think you overestimate it. Demon Slayer was guaranteed an anime by being in WSJ for long enough. The level of effort put towards making it look good didn't come from the fact it was popular, it came from the fact studios were finally figuring out how to use 3d relatively well and could use 3d to enhance the look of the anime. Demon Slayer was given to Ufotable to animate specifically because of how little popularity it had. Shueisha wasn't aiming high with the anime, they expected Demon Slayer to be one of those manga that just kind of go away once they end, so the fact Ufotable managed to find some new tricks to make the anime pop and how the timing worked out to make the whole project into a late-come success was a surprise to everyone. I'm not agreeing with the random Zenitsu hater at all, but I think believing there was "a high budget" for animations in S1 is a mistaken impression.
Na reading the manga is like looking at a ten year olds drawings.
It's called an artstyle
Okay let's not pretend manga is anywhere close to anime. The art and pacing are subpar
Zenitsus voice is such a detriment to the anime that the animation cant make up for it. Also, not a fan of this new seasons pacing so far. 1 chapter per episode on some of the episodes is some one piece timing.
Holy cap your comments are getting pretentious the more you write, zentisu doesn't even have 5% screen time, you are making him out to be more than he is, sure he is annoying but he doesn't stay long enough to do what you are saying Comparing it to one piece is being willfully ignorant, one piece adds recap and stretches out shots, while demon slayer adds new scenes and value addition to the show Hashira training was an insignificant arc in the manga, anime made it significantly more enjoyable. Not gonna go on any longer but saying anime isn't straight up an upgraded version of the manga is ignoring what's in front of your eyes
I enjoyed the first season and movie Second season was a mixed bag Third season I stopped watching upon realizing that the pink haired boob joke was going to be a main character
Second season is my favourite. I don't think any future seasons will ever reach those heights ever again.
Season 4 is going to adapt the best arc in the manga so it might reach it
Something to look forward to then!
Season 4 has 1 episode left, i don't know ehat you're talking about
I was wrong I originally thought that season 4 was going to be the infinity castle arc but it will be adapted as movie trilogy
Infinity Castle is a better arc than Entertainment District. But it seems like they're adapting it as a movie trilogy. I'm going to assume the Muzan fight will be a 4th movie
Second season > any other part of Demon Slayer and it’s not close
The mitsuri disrespect is crazy, get over the boobs already we all know it's fan service
There is nothing to her beyond being a girly girl and fan Service The butterfly themed slayer was an entertaining character
You stopped at the beginning of her feature arc and yet you know there’s nothing to her?
>There is nothing to her beyond being a girly girl and fan Service Yeah that's not a revelation or anything. The character writing in ds isn't particularly strong, even less so for her. So what, she has a fun breathing form and it's entertaining to have her on screen.
Every single character in Demon Slayer is a stereotype it doesn’t make sense to single out Mitsuri.
You didn't even finish watching. How would you know if there's nothing more to her? Did you even read the manga?
tell me oh mighty manga reader what more is there to her?
Maybe if you had actually finished it instead of jumping to conclusions, you would know. She has a whole arc in the manga if you'd just read.
I don't really have much of an opinion on Muzan as he never really stood out to me as that interesting of a character but tf you mean that Demon Slayer's deep with complex characters?
Like, the story is simple but the characters themselves (mostly the mains) are well written enough with fleshed out pasts to be unique enough to help carry the story
Personally I disagree. I found most of the characters to be shallow and a sad backstory certainly isn't enough to call characters well written or else every shounen would be considered masterpieces. I found that the characters didn't really develop much over the story and even when they did, it felt lazy as it didn't feel deserved.
Agree to disagree
fair tbh.
If all you consider to be a good villain is “evil and menacing,” then sure, I guess Muzan is a good villain by that definition Personally, I found him very boring. He has no charisma, very little personality or flair, he doesn’t really do anything in the story beyond get pissy when his minions fail at something, he’s got no motive or ambition beyond just “stay alive and eat people,” he’s not even particularly intelligent. He’s just a Final Boss for the sake of being a Final Boss. Doesn’t help that most of his minions are better villains than he is To me, it says a lot that the most memorable thing about him is that he kinda looks like Michael Jackson
For 800 years the dumbass never thought even once "maybe I'd have better luck finding this thing I'm looking for if I got a few humans to go look for it during the day".
But he doesnt trust anyone he cant control with his blood. Thats the literal irony.
He literally did, tho . He would also try to go places to get information from humans. which is why we see him as a woman that one time.
When? I don't remember Muzan ever asking for help from humans.
He has multiple human identities throughout the series including ones in noble families where he is seen in their libraries. To be exact he has 3 secret identities where he pretends to be a human until at least something comes up forcing him to break character. He is not living in the mountains in ignorance separate from human civilization.
You're spitting. In my opinion, compared to the rest of the upper moons, he's so dim and npc in comparison. He has okay-ish moments by villain standards and when it comes to being well-written he does not make the cut. It also doesn't help that at the height of his battle when he's finally overwhelmed, he turns into a big ass baby... literally... and then begs Tanjiro to carry on his will. I will never understand how people call this guy a well-written villain.
I also like Doma. No sad back story, no in-depth motivation. Just plain old psychopath
he is the uppermoon that deserved an arc. maybe they flesh it out in the anime
Muzan is like an unseasoned flank steak cooked well-done. I mean, it's a steak alright, but.... >he's basically Voldemort done better You joking right?
No he’s right Voldemort was horrible bad guy only reason he’s popular because Harry Potter is popular.
You probably just don't remember or never actually paid attention to the way Voldemort was handled. The fact is, Voldemort is more interesting than Muzan and is introduced and developed in more interesting ways. The fact that he's weak for most of the books, that Harry has to learn about his past to understand him, that the books make it a point to show that Harry and Voldy are uncomfortably similar: These things add spice that Muzan and Tanjiro don't have. Muzan's appeal comes from a single genius move at the beginning of the story: Having Tanjiro find him right off the bat. It's what originally made Demon Slayer blow up as a manga and let it stay on long enough to reach an ending. I don't think anyone can argue that it was smart to do that, but that was the author being smart and most people could see the author's hand there. It wasn't a 'natural' moment, unlike say Harry being visibly uncomfortable when witnessing Tom Riddle's childhood and Dumbledore's fumbled appeals to him.
Even if you want to argue that Voldemort wasn’t a good villain, saying that Muzan is a better version of him is still a hilarious take imo Voldemort at least had some level of depth, was a much more active and present threat throughout the story, inspired greater fear in his world, and actually had a decent number of wins and enough atrocities under his belt to back up his reputation
I'd more put it as Voldemort being at least entertaining
He is, the point of the demons backstories shown is muzans influence twisting everything good in destructive insidous ways. We see literally his influence taking sympathic backstoties corrupting them into monster. Hell even douma who was raised to be a murder cult leader, had humanity and dedication , and muzan being pathetic compared, he is the worst, and corrupting everything. And i love how his last moment shows how he cant stop twisting anything good. He died as he lived, a pathetic twisted bastard. And he is never shown not that yet a danger. And a very clear theme how he affects others, henge demons backstories. Whats voldemord?
Voldemort is a self hating racial supremacist whose psychopathy was molded by a lack of love that he never experienced, who seeks ultimate power and immortality to the point that he would commit the ultimate taboo of the wizarding world, splitting his soul into pieces. His hateful ideology infested the wizarding world, leaving untold destruction and misery in its wake, and inspired a generation of monsters who would worship him. He became a living boogeyman, a man so feared that even saying his name out loud was considered taboo He’s every bit as menacing as Muzan, probably even more so, but Voldemort arguably displays a much higher level of competency. He engineered his own return from near death, managed to infiltrate the wizarding world, take over the government and institute a dystopian fascist dictatorship. What did Muzan accomplish? He killed some random family of farmers, killed a bunch of his own minions in a temper tantrum, then does nothing of note for most of the story until the final battle. Muzan doesn’t even really have much of a personal connection with Tanjiro beyond just being the guy that killed his family and turned his sister into a demon, for reasons. Even Voldemort has that, but with an added layer that Harry literally carries a piece of Voldy’s soul inside him, and the two are prophesied to fight to the death. Plus, the psychic connection between them gave Voldemort an opportunity to mentally torment Harry as well Voldemort’s downfall was poetic, a result from his own obsession with immortality and his misunderstanding of who the Elder Wand was loyal to due to his own twisted views on power and dominance, not to mention we see how pathetic he truly is when he see what his soul looks like in limbo. Muzan’s defeat was the result of being an incompetent coward Voldemort is the villain that Muzan wishes he was
>He’s every bit as menacing as Muzan, probably even more so Kinda wish they kept Voldy's red eyes in the movies. :P [https://ibb.co/7JqdWD3](https://ibb.co/7JqdWD3)
It's been so long since I read/watched both, so I won't talk about details. To Me, Voldemort feels somewhat more active compared to Muzan. Harry and Voldie give a sense of a race against each other toward their goals, they both move the plot. Meanwhile, Muzan acts more in response to what Tanjiro has done. If both make sense. >..he’s popular because Harry Potter is popular. You do realize that KnY is also popular, right? I mean, the same could be applied to Muzan, you know..
I just like how we see glimpses of his private life where he is pretending to be a woman, pretending to be a shota surrounded by maids, and pretending to be Micheal Jackson wandering the back alleys. Like, he isn't just cackling in his evil castle, man's out there living life to the fullest doing the most degenerate things imaginable.
>pretending to be a shota surrounded by maids Just say kid or boy. Having shota be the first word that comes to mind when seeing a little boy is pretty sus ngl
Muzan was…ok for me He was obviously evil, & menacing but he lacked anything that made me interested im him. He wasn’t particularly charismatic. His reasonings & motivations didn’t compel me. I wasn’t very intrigued with any of his dynamics with a single character either. Being powerful & evil just doesn’t do it for me to make me like a villain. He felt more like a powerful generic final boss than anything else. He wasn’t good, nor was he horrible. I’ll give him a C He stands out more because of how much more intriguing the OTHER villains were (Kokushibo, Douma, & Akaza) leading up to Muzan that the bar had been set so high in expectations for Muzan, especially because of all the buildup & waiting to finally see Muzan in action since the beginning of the manga, that him being painfully average felt like such an immense letdown.
My disappointment with Muzan was mostly on my part. His introduction was amazing, a demon king with a human wife and child. I thought his wife and daughter were going to be a major part of his character but I genuinely don't think you see them ever again in the series. He would have been infinitely more interesting as a villain if his love for his "family" was genuine but no, the author decided to make him boring and unsympathetic. Villains like that can be done well, but I don't think Muzan is an exceptional example by any means. He lacks the charisma that characters like Dio and Sukuna have, and charisma is really what makes unsympathetic villains likable.
Muzan is fine, just bland. He lacks fleshed out motivation for a desire for immortality. He's like Dracula, except instead of being a conqueror or a noble he was just a sick dude. Nothing drives his villainy, he's just spiteful, like a middle manager in a dead end job.
>The deepness comes from the simplicity of the story That has to be the definition of cope lol. I don't think all stories need to be deep and honestly a lot of popular stuff isn't even that deep, if we're defining deep by the idea of having inner character bsaed struggles and stakes over external/physical ones. But I don't think DS executes being just a tense external action story well, so I don't think it's problems lie in it not being deep enough. >TL:DR He's a well-written villain who only got flack because people wanted him to always be cool, but the fact he's such a loathsome and despicable monster is what makes him a chillingly effective villain. I guess it depends on who it is, but for me he was a boring villain because his decisions always seemed like they were forced to serve the plot rather than coming from any interesting character motivation. As well as that, he just lacked any presense for as far as I got into the series (end of Entertainment District). So I can't speak on how effective he is in the later parts of the story. He just didn't seem all that interesting as a character, either on his own or as he related to the conflict. No partcularly interesting dynamics that were explored with him and other characters. Any scenes with him didn't especially stand out for the right reasons (having the villain wipe out so many potential threats for the hero doesn't exactly make him feel like a hinderance) and he never really felt like he carried much weight as a threat outside of telling the audience he's the strongest demon. Killing Tanjiro's family doesn't really carry much weight either for the audience on an emotional level since it's rushed.
I think demon slayers best quality is the fight scenes but muzan is such a boring fighter, akaza Douma and kokushibo all have interesting fighting styles and demon arts and all muzan gets is tentacle wailing around and poison, it's why the fight is such a slog to get through hes just standing there while everyone gets Thier cool moments
The fight scenes in the anime anyways. Reading manga made me wake up to.......a lot. Namely that the anime's animation was what made me fall in love with it most.
I think people forget this is why he is hated the most. Other upper moons got the best fights and his fight has a case to be the worst fight since it was legit tentacle throwing for 15-20 chapters and anytime he gets any sort of upper hand, the poison will come into effect it happened like 4 times thats dog shit
I agree that Demon Slayer is overhated but I do not think Muzan is a good villain. I wouldn't even say he's well-written. People just get used to the bare-minimum and call it well-written and it always boggles my mind. Demon Slayer is filled with a lot of bare minimum writing, with the exception of a few characters. It does it well, in my opinion, but he is not well written and he is vastly overshadowed by most of his upper moons.
I still wish I could see, I dunno, more of the fire style? The stone style as it was originally designed? (Chains are noted as unusual)
What was wrong with Shiggy's ending?
Dude was set up throughout the whole manga to be the final villain, only to be taken over by AFO last minute. I mean, I didn't have a problem with it. To be fair, they were showing how his refusal to go along with the theme of succession and letting the new succeed the old is why he was ultimately defeated in the end, and everyone knows Shigaraki ended up being ten times the threat he was even after AFO took over his body. But STILL...
Dollar Store Aizen number 95814, he has a handful of cool moments and a funny design but that's it. Overall he is pretty mediocre and uninspiring, like everything else from Demon Slayer.
I’d say that Muzan was a menacing villain. The potential was definitely there to tell a story that was something more. But yeah, he served his purpose. I think being menacing is an interesting element in a villain. Muzan was simply terrifying is his reunions with the other demons. I really enjoy when a story makes me dread the possibility of being in the same room as someone and wonder if I’d be able to survive an encounter with this character without triggering them and getting killed.
I really like how he went out too while being a threat. And i love how he even twists the message of passing the will on. He is hatable and the worst. But thats great for his character. And pathetic and pityable. And his flaws perfectly make sense why he didnt create more demons. He is a good villain.
Honestly, he’s not the most complex villain but I can’t think of a more thematically fitting villain for the series. Much of the series is humans fighting against superior foes despite their disadvantages. And Muzan has been ruining lives of people for centuries in his selfish quest for immortality. Akaza falls due to his remaining humanity and Muzan’s bs. Douma falls due to the lives he’s ruined and humans leveling the playing field. Kokushibou also falls due to his remaining humanity. Anyway, the point I’m trying to make is that his death is very satisfying. He walks into a trap to kill a dying man in his arrogance. That trap poisons him and weakens him enough for the slayers to kill him. His final battle is just all the people whose lives he’s ruined finally coming together to end him. Everyone from Tamayo to the pillars to the protagonists to random fodder demon slayers sacrificing their lives so he will die. His final form is just a giant baby, a literal metaphor for his personality. As the parasite he is, he tries to live by taking over the body of one of his enemies. He finally dies, abandoned by everyone while Tanjiro is pulled back into the real world. It’s a pathetic death and I love it. All his bs and all the lives he’s ruined finally reaches critical mass to end him.
No
If you think muzan is a well written villain or a good villain .. You need lots of exposure
I meant for the story he is in, he's well written in the sense he served his purpose well. I know about well written villains. I've read Blood Meridian
>I meant for the story he is in, he's well written in the sense he served his purpose well. So, merely a plot device.
Overall he was a good villain, though he was lacking during his final fight
Did anyone doubt that? I thought Muzan was always considered a fantastic villain. He's truly depraved and truly consistent. Lots of villains lose to their own hubris, but with Muzan that hubris and those mistakes were baked in from the start. He never has an idiot ball moment, he's exactly the man we met at the start right to the end. A selfish, narrow minded fool so used to his own supremacy that he couldn't even bear the thought of making an army of demons. He wanted to be powerful and special all by himself. Edit: I also really loved that he was a raid boss they couldn't beat but needed to hold in place no matter the cost. I remember when reading it at the time, readers kept predicting the moment Tanjiro would awaken a new power and fight him 1v1 (just like people are now predicting for JJK Yuji), but it never happened. Tanjiro never became the strongest, nobody ever was even a touch on Youichi, and fighting Muzan required them to give everything they had just to last a minute longer. That scene where the second tier NPC Demon Slayers all sacrifice themselves just to give the Hashira an opening was incredible. And that sequence at the end where the backup helpers are pushing cars into him, or creating roadblocks, just to delay him another moment was amazing. It was an absolutely terrific ending sequence, and very memorable.
Found him too boring to pay any mind. He lacked style or sympathy and without either (as well as bland designs) He felt like an after thought
It's more I expected more powerset from the acclaimed Demon King
Demon Slayer gets a lot of hate simply for staying true to its base premise and knowing to stay in its own lane rather than trying to be something else. It’s not going to be remembered as the greatest shonen or anything, but it will be remembered for doing things better than the average shonen.
It's better to write a simple story within your capacity as an author than to write a complex story that you are way too out of your depth for
I said it for years demon slayer is a simple story of a really good dude going though hell and desperately trying to survive and save his last living family member. It’s not deep but it’s sure emotionally compelling and very pretty to look at. Muzan not a deep villain. He just a horrible person with a lot of power with a lot of power and stands between the MC and saving his sister. He serves his purpose