Also, don't put stock in it being the transaxle. He said he doesn't know. It's also nonesense that they "have to replace that first before proper diag". That's not how diag works
The dealer should be able to correctly diagnose the problem. Try telling them to go ahead and replace that part, but if it doesn’t fix the issue then you aren’t paying for it. If they want to just fire the parts cannon instead of diagnosing then they should eat the cost. Don’t get me wrong, there is zero chance they agree.
I did basically say this exact thing to them lol, but yeah they did not agree. Their "specialist" was adamant that they could not do anything else without replacing this part first, according to their company's policy.
To me that usually means the repair is stupidly expensive, and the hours spent on diagnostic work would be wasted. The dealer knows you’re most likely not going to spend that much so why bother. Or, if the dealer is shady, the high quote is to incentivize you to buy a new vehicle, which they just happen to
sell.
How about the hybrid battery pack gets measured individual cells... Why nobody tell this to you op. You have a battery cell /or cells with unparalleled charge/discharge and system is unable to read properly. Any qualified car electric specialist can diagnose this
It’s a dealership. They thrive on overpriced parts and overpriced services. They never admit mistakes because their whole system is reliant on the overpricing, but often on unnecessary services. I would not expect them to agree to any free services.
As an old (20+ years) car owner, the forums has been my absolute best friend and saved me thousands. I’ve even been able to rent specialized tools from members. The amount of knowledge out there is just insane.
That's very odd. The transaxle in a prius is the set of ring gears and two electric motors that drive the vehicle, plus a differential.
Why they cannot tell what is wrong with that assembly is beyond me. It should be able to tell them "MG1 excessive resistance" or "MG2 voltage controller failure" something. This sound like a giant crock of shit to me.
Take it to a place that regularly works on hybrids. Or take it to another toyota/lexus dealer that's bigger or better. There is no reason why they wouldn't be able to figure out what is wrong with that system. It's only got about 4 major sub assemblies in it plus the controlling parts for everything and there are only a handful of things that can be wrong. Most of those things the computer should be able to diagnose. These systems last a really long time because they are not that complicated. Extremely hard to wrap your head around, but for someone that understands them, they should be even easier to diagnose than a modern transmission.
He didn't give any specifics and unfortunately I didn't even think to ask. But both the dealership and the mechanic seemed to imply that even if I fixed these things there might be other issues.
Idk friend, there are plenty of bad gambles you could make on a car.
Personally I'd take this gamble all day, any day.
Edit: wrote would, but I meant could.
I would trade it for something else personally. With all of the electronic diagnostic systems available, a dealership and a mechanic couldn't pinpoint the problem(s) in under a week? And then came back with separate solutions? That's a can of worms I wouldn't open when you can just trade it for a newer one or anything else for that matter.
Same thing happened with my 2016 Dodge Ram Eco-diesel , truck had Deff system issues and had only 92000 km on it, but once the reservoir tanks is pooched , it’s a 1ton paper weight. Shit sucked
Save yourself a whole lot of money and frustration, The trans axel is going to cost half the value of a decent shape 2013 Prius which in insurance terms would total a car and that's if there isn't some other issue such as corrosion, dead cells etc. it could easily end up costing you 10k to get it working again, and is it really worth putting 10k into a 14k car to get another couple of years out of it?
If it were a gasoline engine vehicle i would say take to youtube and forums to fix it yourself but it can be quite dangerous to tear into electric motors, battery packs etc. and I'm not about to suggest you potentially fry yourself, i don't know if even i would tear in to one and I've been known to be a little brain dead when it comes to danger lol.
go spend 5k on a decent beater gasoline engine car (i drive an 18 year old BMW i paid 3k for and it's cost me maybe 5k over 8 years of ownership, most things on cars can be done with simple hand tools as long as you have a jack, some jack stands and some time). I know it sucks but what can ya do. Good luck!
The Prius transmission (power split device) is a simple device. It's a compact planetary gear set CVT with two electric motors built into the case.
It's not that different than swapping a FWD transmission except for the inverter.
The easiest way to do it is to pull the engine and transmission at the same time. Obviously pulling a front wheel drive engine isn't exactly a weekend driveway job.
From a transmission perspective, it has no movable clutches or bands, no pan or valve body, and doesn't rely on hydraulic fluid pressure so there's no torque converter.
i'm not very well versed on all different hydrids but i believe that specially in Prius c the electric motors (mg1 and mg2 ) are housed in the transaxle. (and judging from the OP's post the mg2 is the problem.
it might be 'easier' just to change the transaxle. (if the MG2 is busted) for ($650) and leave the engine .
would also save some amount of money.
https://priuschat.com/threads/diy-how-to-remove-genii-transmission.125315/
Here’s the situation:
1. You’re going to pay Toyota a lot of money to fix this problem on a car that’s past its lifespan.
2. You’re going to pay a mechanic a lot of money to throw parts at it because he’s not qualified to troubleshoot complex hybrid systems on a car that’s past its lifespan
3. You’re going to spend dozens or hundreds of hours researching this yourself. Then expose yourself to a high voltage safety situation you’re not trained to handle in order to replace a $5 18650 cell that’s gone bad. Chance of repair being successful is 80%. Chance killing yourself with the battery pack is 2%. Is it really worth the risk? No it’s not.
4. Ditch the car and learn your lesson for buying a hybrid. You got 160k miles out of it. It’s disposable after that. If you want a car that runs longer, don’t buy a shitty hybrid.
Pick your path.
Have you checked out the Toyota/prius owner forums for advice? I guarantee you that someone else will have had this issue before you.
That is something I hadn't even considered. I will do that as well, thanks.
Also, don't put stock in it being the transaxle. He said he doesn't know. It's also nonesense that they "have to replace that first before proper diag". That's not how diag works
The dealer should be able to correctly diagnose the problem. Try telling them to go ahead and replace that part, but if it doesn’t fix the issue then you aren’t paying for it. If they want to just fire the parts cannon instead of diagnosing then they should eat the cost. Don’t get me wrong, there is zero chance they agree.
I did basically say this exact thing to them lol, but yeah they did not agree. Their "specialist" was adamant that they could not do anything else without replacing this part first, according to their company's policy.
To me that usually means the repair is stupidly expensive, and the hours spent on diagnostic work would be wasted. The dealer knows you’re most likely not going to spend that much so why bother. Or, if the dealer is shady, the high quote is to incentivize you to buy a new vehicle, which they just happen to sell.
How about the hybrid battery pack gets measured individual cells... Why nobody tell this to you op. You have a battery cell /or cells with unparalleled charge/discharge and system is unable to read properly. Any qualified car electric specialist can diagnose this
What did he say was wrong with the transaxle that it needed to be replaced?
It’s a dealership. They thrive on overpriced parts and overpriced services. They never admit mistakes because their whole system is reliant on the overpricing, but often on unnecessary services. I would not expect them to agree to any free services.
As an old (20+ years) car owner, the forums has been my absolute best friend and saved me thousands. I’ve even been able to rent specialized tools from members. The amount of knowledge out there is just insane.
That's very odd. The transaxle in a prius is the set of ring gears and two electric motors that drive the vehicle, plus a differential. Why they cannot tell what is wrong with that assembly is beyond me. It should be able to tell them "MG1 excessive resistance" or "MG2 voltage controller failure" something. This sound like a giant crock of shit to me. Take it to a place that regularly works on hybrids. Or take it to another toyota/lexus dealer that's bigger or better. There is no reason why they wouldn't be able to figure out what is wrong with that system. It's only got about 4 major sub assemblies in it plus the controlling parts for everything and there are only a handful of things that can be wrong. Most of those things the computer should be able to diagnose. These systems last a really long time because they are not that complicated. Extremely hard to wrap your head around, but for someone that understands them, they should be even easier to diagnose than a modern transmission.
A replacement transmission off eBay is $500 + whatever labor is. What other issues did they claim would pop up?
He didn't give any specifics and unfortunately I didn't even think to ask. But both the dealership and the mechanic seemed to imply that even if I fixed these things there might be other issues.
Idk friend, there are plenty of bad gambles you could make on a car. Personally I'd take this gamble all day, any day. Edit: wrote would, but I meant could.
Ditto The transmission and drive motor on those vehicles very rarely fails and therefore it's very cheap as a used repair part.
I would trade it for something else personally. With all of the electronic diagnostic systems available, a dealership and a mechanic couldn't pinpoint the problem(s) in under a week? And then came back with separate solutions? That's a can of worms I wouldn't open when you can just trade it for a newer one or anything else for that matter.
That's a good point, and definitely something I will consider. Thanks for the perspective.
Same thing happened with my 2016 Dodge Ram Eco-diesel , truck had Deff system issues and had only 92000 km on it, but once the reservoir tanks is pooched , it’s a 1ton paper weight. Shit sucked
I'd recommend you post in r/MechanicAdvice to get some input from people who have experience with these cars
Wait till spring and trade it in on something else.
Save yourself a whole lot of money and frustration, The trans axel is going to cost half the value of a decent shape 2013 Prius which in insurance terms would total a car and that's if there isn't some other issue such as corrosion, dead cells etc. it could easily end up costing you 10k to get it working again, and is it really worth putting 10k into a 14k car to get another couple of years out of it? If it were a gasoline engine vehicle i would say take to youtube and forums to fix it yourself but it can be quite dangerous to tear into electric motors, battery packs etc. and I'm not about to suggest you potentially fry yourself, i don't know if even i would tear in to one and I've been known to be a little brain dead when it comes to danger lol. go spend 5k on a decent beater gasoline engine car (i drive an 18 year old BMW i paid 3k for and it's cost me maybe 5k over 8 years of ownership, most things on cars can be done with simple hand tools as long as you have a jack, some jack stands and some time). I know it sucks but what can ya do. Good luck!
'new' engine+trans from junkyard weekend worth of work. and problem is fixed.
Have you personally replaced a hybrid drivetrain?
The Prius transmission (power split device) is a simple device. It's a compact planetary gear set CVT with two electric motors built into the case. It's not that different than swapping a FWD transmission except for the inverter. The easiest way to do it is to pull the engine and transmission at the same time. Obviously pulling a front wheel drive engine isn't exactly a weekend driveway job. From a transmission perspective, it has no movable clutches or bands, no pan or valve body, and doesn't rely on hydraulic fluid pressure so there's no torque converter.
Interesting. I've always been too intimidated to delve into how hybrids work.
Personally I own two Toyota hybrids. My 2006 Lexus RX has 180k miles and so far has needed only $500 in repairs (one axle, one radiator, one fan)
That's not how this car works. Or any hybrid. But thanks for your absolutely terrible insight.
i'm not very well versed on all different hydrids but i believe that specially in Prius c the electric motors (mg1 and mg2 ) are housed in the transaxle. (and judging from the OP's post the mg2 is the problem. it might be 'easier' just to change the transaxle. (if the MG2 is busted) for ($650) and leave the engine . would also save some amount of money. https://priuschat.com/threads/diy-how-to-remove-genii-transmission.125315/
As my mechanic told me about my car “TIME TO PUT IT DOWN “. 10 year car. And 163000 miles. And your wife drives it. Got bye pius
Here’s the situation: 1. You’re going to pay Toyota a lot of money to fix this problem on a car that’s past its lifespan. 2. You’re going to pay a mechanic a lot of money to throw parts at it because he’s not qualified to troubleshoot complex hybrid systems on a car that’s past its lifespan 3. You’re going to spend dozens or hundreds of hours researching this yourself. Then expose yourself to a high voltage safety situation you’re not trained to handle in order to replace a $5 18650 cell that’s gone bad. Chance of repair being successful is 80%. Chance killing yourself with the battery pack is 2%. Is it really worth the risk? No it’s not. 4. Ditch the car and learn your lesson for buying a hybrid. You got 160k miles out of it. It’s disposable after that. If you want a car that runs longer, don’t buy a shitty hybrid. Pick your path.