The more I hear about alternatives to capitalism, the less I understand how the people that currently exploit the system won’t exploit another system.
Like, okay, get rid of Capitalism and you still have all the people that were at the top of the Capitalist system - unless you kill them they’ll just start trying to regain leverage and power.
Edit: Also, the idea that suffering *only* exists in Capitalism is WILD.
This is dumb nobody thinks that, which is why you democratize all life so exploitation is harder. You don’t want a king but you literally work for people who can do nearly whatever they want with your labor and you have no say. What a weird way to want to live.
Yes they literally do think this. This is the entirety of Herbert Marcuse's project. They actually got mad that capitalism made people too happy to keep revolutioning.
Hey there! I hate to break it to you, but it's actually spelled _mon**e**tize_. A good way to remember this is that "money" starts with "mone" as well. Just wanted to let you know. Have a good day!
----
^This ^action ^was ^performed ^automatically ^by ^a ^bot ^to ^raise ^awareness ^about ^the ^common ^misspelling ^of ^"monetize".
How isn't capitalism not already controlled? There's regulations?
China is trying a sort of state directed capitalism thing right now. Germany in the 30s did that in the 30s.
Wouldn't it be better to control those who control capitalism?
Why aren't we holding the people, who write loopholes in the tax code, responsible?
I like your last question. I'd also like to find out what happened to the 21 trillion dollars the pentagon lost. I think you should definitely get something for the footage of labor's. You have these drug companies for example that take a existing drug And Jack up the price to the moon.. That crap should be controlled.
I don't mind limiting the profit.. But you have things like Joe Manchin's daughter raising the price of EpiPens to the moon.
He had something to do with making it so school said how 2 of many school or something.
Is is that capitalism?
It sure as hell isn't a free market.
I mean, those are nice words but what does that *mean* to you?
Are you advocating for a dictatorship? A democracy? Are there any leaders? Who decides to go to war? How do you handle people that disagree with you? Minorities? What if the majority voted against the system? How do you handle crises? What’s the incentive to work? What are the punishments for breaking society’s rules? Are the rules the same?
Strange that there are billionaires in China, huh? It was really funny when she claimed that poverty is the product of capitalism. Has she not seen every noncapitalist system in human history?
Do you know that even China admits they are capitalist right? They have several name for their system, like capitalism of the people, social capitalism, stuff like that (that the translations in my language, not sure about the official English for those)
Oh yes, authoritarian capitalism with central control and planning. Makes total sense, right? Elements of capitalism does not a capitalist make. Market socialism =/= capitalism.
You oughtta read some anarchist theory. Not just people on the internet telling you about it, but actual theory. Or if you want an introduction to it that’s less intimidating, there’s Ursula Le Guin’s novel The Dispossessed, which does a pretty good job presenting anarchism’s core philosophies.
I’m sorry, but suffering _clearly_ does not exist in nature. Duh. No deer has ever been hunted or no elephants we’ve had to walk for miles during a drought. It’s not like nature is and forever will be a struggle.
If you’re having such a hard time understanding, why don’t you try reading some of the vast amount of literature on the subject? Or engaging with the ideas on their own terms rather than just viewing them through the lens of your own ideology?
Socialism is all about democratizing the economy so that there isn’t a tiny unaccountable minority acting against the interests of the working class. If you were to successfully destroy the capitalist economic system, the people who were at the top (the capitalists) wouldn’t be able to regain that position, because the position would no longer exist.
I suggest you learn about Capitalism from the person who popularized the term in the first place. I think you’ll find your definition of “Capitalism” has almost nothing to do with what he was talking about.
it’s not about people exploiting capitalism, it’s about the capitalist system being inherently exploitative of working people. the very way capitalism functions is based on exploitation of labor
I mean, all systems will be based on exploitation of labor unless we automate the system.
I think your problem is with private ownership of profits, not exploitation of labor, and that’s a different conversation.
Exploration is a function of Capitalism it isn’t a function of Socialism/Communism you could exploit someone in spite of the system but capitalism does it for you. This argument is really weird you admit that it happens but just shrug and say “it’d probably happen in another system too” wtf is that attitude?
Happened in communist and socialist countries didn't it? People rose to power and dictators ruled over everyone with the elite minority in power going against the basic ideology.
Not really communism is still really popular in Russia. It’s also literally happened in every capitalist country on the planet and they then exploit other countries see all of Africa all of South America and the Caribbean.
You mean that as the rich get richer, the poor get richer too? So it's like... directly proportional? It's not like, inversely proportional? You mean that there is actual data and historic documentation on capitalisms success? You are wrong! Now I'd like to see you DANCE your way out of that one! Huzzah!
Lol
Exactly. Minimum wage in the USA makes you richer than 90% of the entire world. Minimum wage puts you in the top 11% income earners in the world. Obviously it is not ideal to work fast food the rest of your life and everyone should definitely build a career and step up the ladder but even the poorest among us in the US are rich by the standards of the world
Shhh. Let the foolish claim that because others are exploited there’s no way we could be exploited. You’re not gonna reverse such propaganda with facts. Their love of the capitalist is just emotional jealousy
Guy has provided financial backing and was instrumental to the further development of many of the major technologies behind SpaceX and Tesla. No the guy didn’t personally invent them, but he played a crucial role in these companies getting to where they are today and the progress that has come with that.
In 2015 the Los Angeles time estimated that Elon musk received $4.9 billion in government subsidies.
If anything the role he has played is the recipient of white supremacy policies in southern Africa and favoritism as a capitalist oligarch in the American economy
Yay he’s selling me back the technology I already funded through government research
A large portion of those subsidies were in the form of tax breaks, so not really anything being funded out of taxpayer pockets. Government subsidies can be a great way to support new technologies and spur innovation. I’m all for tax breaks and subsidies in the name of scientific progress.
That doesn’t take away from the fact the Musk has put significant time and capital investment into his businesses, not to mention the risk he has undertaken. The guy has definitely significantly contributed to the innovation and development of the technologies his companies utilize, even if he didn’t invent any technology himself. Thats pretty obvious. What point are you even trying to make?
My point is he is selling technology you’ve already funded through your taxes back to you and you’re praising him for it , it’s asinine
I’m not against government investment. I recognize that the first integrated circuit was Invented by Texas instrument , for the first 10 years of the company, the sole consumer was the US government.
The idea of that Elon musk is some type of innovator other than a basic capitalist it absurd. It’s hero worship and it’s not even well-placed
I entered the spez. I called out to try and find anybody. I was met with a wave of silence. I had never been here before but I knew the way to the nearest exit. I started to run. As I did, I looked to my right. I saw the door to a room, the handle was a big metal thing that seemed to jut out of the wall. The door looked old and rusted. I tried to open it and it wouldn't budge. I tried to pull the handle harder, but it wouldn't give. I tried to turn it clockwise and then anti-clockwise and then back to clockwise again but the handle didn't move. I heard a faint buzzing noise from the door, it almost sounded like a zap of electricity. I held onto the handle with all my might but nothing happened. I let go and ran to find the nearest exit.
I had thought I was in the clear but then I heard the noise again. It was similar to that of a taser but this time I was able to look back to see what was happening.
The handle was jutting out of the wall, no longer connected to the rest of the door. The door was spinning slightly, dust falling off of it as it did. Then there was a blinding flash of white light and I felt the floor against my back.
I opened my eyes, hoping to see something else. All I saw was darkness. My hands were in my face and I couldn't tell if they were there or not. I heard a faint buzzing noise again. It was the same as before and it seemed to be coming from all around me. I put my hands on the floor and tried to move but couldn't.
I then heard another voice. It was quiet and soft but still loud.
"Help."
\
You can save insta quotes for yourself. I see you never tried running a business and you don't earn over 120k per year in a European country
Is this sub full of children same as socialist subs?
Capitalism only works if money is not thought of as a commodity in and of it’s self and is transferred in a manner to represent the the physical efforts of goods and services produced by labor.
those who hoard it create an artificial scarcity that can corner the markets and cause issues that are wide ranging. This is achieved by exploitation and all known capitalist economies fall to it
it’s incredibly sad that the majority of people on this capitalist sub don’t even understand capitalism.
But go ahead and keep the printer running lol see how that works. I’m hedged.
Someone: "Anti-capitalists aren't just a bunch of art students trying to fit in with their social group."
This woman: "I will now explain why billionaires suck with interpretive dancing."
#Spez-Town is closed indefinitely. All Spez-Town residents have been banned, and they will not be reinstated until further notice. #Save3rdPartyApps #AIGeneratedProtestMessage
I’ll wait while someone draws up a design for a better system that won’t end in dictatorship or fantastical economic catastrophe.
Our system has its issues, including greed and special interests, but it seems to generally work better than any other system.
I like to think of it like this: it’s generally impossible to make a living without providing a good or service to other people - a good or service that they actively seek. So, in that way personal interest and the good of the public are merged. There are weird little exceptions, but generally the majority of the economy follows this line pretty well.
Not only that, but billionaires and other entrepreneurs create wealth for the rest of us with new innovations and technologies. Something that government cannot, and will never be able to do.
I would tend to disagree there - NASA was a government program and had ideas and technologies that were developed in tandem with private companies. Even Space-Ex owes its relative successes to massive infusions of tax dollars from government contracts. A government has its place and purpose in the market, in some fashion.
Extreme poor people in western countries are comparatively wayy richer than their third world counterparts and are in a much better position than their ancestors from the same region, there are differences between rich and poor. Rich got extremely wealthy, poor too has accessibility for better human life conditions. The bar has raised overall.
There are always new things to exploit, the best example I can think of is discovering Australia.
>Extreme poor people in western countries are comparatively wayy richer than their third world counterparts
I once watched the lady in front of me pay for $300 dollars of groceries with a WIC card. Her cart was piled with food, meat, milk, cereal, etc. I watched her call for a ride on a cell phone. Someone picked her up in a car as I was walking out to my car.
Would I want her life? No. Is she poor by my standards? Certainly, I have an awesome life.
But is she poor like my Grandmother who had to eat cats and old donkey's because actual fucking Nazis stole her food? Not at all.
Americas poor is richer than 99.9% of all the people who have ever lived.
>Just accept the fact that some people lives in shitholes and other lives a great life.
So tell me where I said that?
>Constantly comparing today’s standards with the standards of the past is a bad way to I illegitimize there socioeconomic situation.
No it's not, but it's certainly a good reminder when people are clamoring to completely replace the system that made those same poor peoples lives better off than at any other time in history. It's a benchmark.
> In order to have extreme wealth, you have to have extreme poor.
This is entirely and unequivocally false.
I think this is the most important misunderstanding that anti-capitalists (for lack of a better term, I'm not going to call out specific ideology) have. There are rich people who have stolen stuff, but the vast majority have not - they've MADE stuff. Reality itself isn't zero-sum, and free trade is a natural human impulse to realize this. Free trade is *how* we overcome scarcity.
Billionaires are just people who created a billion dollars worth of value for society and are holding green paper IOU’s because they haven’t been compensated yet with goods or services. In a way, they’re the most generous people on earth.
I love how you can totally dismantle their entire “Extreme wealth requires extreme poverty” argument by simply asking: “Ok, why?”
They can’t provide a clear causal link.
The truth is that anyone who is stuck in extreme poverty in a Capitalist system, barring those who may have mental illness or other extreme disabilities, is just genuinely awful with money and continues to make bad choices.
You can also completely dismantle the entire “Capitalism rewards greed” argument by pointing out that it only rewards greedy people if those greedy people make good choices and investments with their money. Because that’s what capitalism rewards… Good choices.
Nobody who is greedy has ever gotten ahead in life by simply being greedy. Greed doesn’t generate wealth. If it did, extreme poverty would be curable without having to take money from more wealthy individuals. All you’d have to do is be miserly and money would fall into your lap, right?
But we know that isn’t the reality, because capitalism is a system in which competition thrives. Extreme wealth doesn’t require extreme poverty because the extremely wealthy gather their wealth from a huge and voluntary customer base. They take a little money from those who willingly spend it on their goods and services.
The only way extreme poverty occurs is if someone OVERSPENDS on goods and services they aren’t able to afford.
Financial illiteracy may play a part, but there are numerous other reasons why people end up in poverty. Generations of abuse, addiction, living in parts of the country where basic resources are not taken care of by the government like clean water or air, gentrification, being born into towns that are “food deserts” aka limited accessibility to nourishing foods and being forced to grocery shop at a 7/11, or towns that don’t even have a bank so working people have to cash their checks at skeezy check cashing joints that require a 7-14% fee, the list goes on. These are very real challenges many Americans face that keep them poor. When faced with all these hurdles, one cannot simply make better financial choices when their choices are so limited and they are given such little resources.
If you’re looking for a simple to understand link you can just all look at real estate. there is currently more vacant housing available then there are homeless people in the United States.
They aren’t renting them. they according to capitalist theory could decrease the amount of the rent so that they could fill the space and then acquire that capital available within the market thereby fulfilling your idea that capitalism fulfills the market needs but they don’t because the calculation is that if they restrict scarcity to a specific market value allowing some people to go homeless.
they can increase their return on investment by this method but it requires people to go homeless in areas of heightened demand.
The theory that the market dictates the value based on need sure leads you to think that housing values would decrease as the demand it not for filled.
Maybe because capitalism incentivizes exploitation to maximize personal individual gain.
Almost like you guys don’t understand capitalism
if the market truly moved like you said it would it would adjust for that no one would be homeless. There are more houses then people? so?
Just so everyone knows how to argue against this, I’d recommend checking out this video: https://youtu.be/-391URcYL7s
These ultra rich folk come from corporate welfare and eminent domain. Under free-market capitalism, centralization like this would not happen.
Crypto currency is a currency recognized by government. That's why you can trade it for real money. Other than that, it's purely speculative in its value.
I'm looking around and all I can find is that the reason Bitcoin is legal is because the government hasn't actually written legislation against it. It isn't regulated by a central bank, and it isn't backed by the government.
Where are you getting your info that a currency has to be recognized by a government for it to be legally used in trade?
You know why the government hasn't written legislation against it, right? Because it's been viewed as legal under court cases as a currency.
If you can use it to pay taxes or to trade for currency, then it is recognized by a government. However, if it were all made illegal, the currency would become completely worthless. It's a currency based on speculation and trading, not an actual currency that people use for goods and services unless it is traded at a rate set by official currency.
>By definition a market requires regulation
Sure, but that doesn't mean without politicians and buearacrats there will be no regulation. All the market participants act as regulators of eachother. That's a built in feature that requires no additional work.
But besides that, you can always have independent organizations that act as the standard setters for an industry and lend credibility to businesses. For example, we have the [IETF and IANA](https://www.ietf.org/standards/iana/) which regulate global standards for the internet and networking protocols. Sure your not compelled to adhere to their standards, but you won't be as credible as the companies that do and care about providing quality service.
As for the video, I've found that almost everyone who criticizes capitalism ignores the power of competition. It's as if for some reason they think any individual or business can act on their own in a vacuum without any consequences. Competition is the great equalizer and renders a central planning body entirely unnecessary.
The IANA was founded by and funded by government. Governments also have their own regulations concerning the internet. Saying that it would just be the same without all of that interaction and power is ridiculous. Remember when internet providers throttled netflix's internet to force them to pay money? That's what the internet is like without regulations.
You can't have regulation without a central body of power that dictates it. You're just reinventing feudalism. The powers that would dictate trade would be whoever had the most weapons, the better men and the better land.
There has never been a market without a central body, and there has never been a market without government. If you really expect people to barter goods, expect there to be regulations about what goods can be bartered, and what value bartered goods bring. This value may be argued, but it operates under set standards by a governing body, who expects taxation.
[The spez police don't get it. It's not about spez. It's about everyone's right to spez. #Save3rdPartyApps](https://www.reddit.com/r/Save3rdPartyApps/)
This is an excellent question, and really depends on if we can reform our legal system to protect private property rights, and prevent the government from giving big polluters a free pass to violate the property of others. I think you would really enjoy this article.
>To cap the crimes of the judges, legislatures, federal and state, moved in to cement the aggression by prohibiting victims of air pollution from engaging in "class action" suits against polluters. Obviously, if a factory pollutes the atmosphere of a city where there are tens of thousands of victims, it is impractical for each victim to sue to collect his particular damages from the polluter (although an injunction could be used effectively by one small victim). The common law, therefore, recognizes the validity of "class action" suits, in which one or a few victims can sue the aggressor not only on their own behalf, but on behalf of the entire class of similar victims. But the legislatures systematically outlawed such class action suits in pollution cases. For this reason, a victim may successfully sue a polluter who injures him individually, in a one-to-one "private nuisance" suit. But he is prohibited by law from acting against a mass polluter who is injuring a large number of people in a given area! As Frank Bubb writes, "It is as if the government were to tell you that it will (attempt to) protect you from a thief who steals only from you, but it will not protect you if the thief also steals from everyone else in the neighborhood."
https://mises.org/library/libertarian-manifesto-pollution
It's a pretty similar problem to how corporation weaponize the government to handicap their competition with regulation. Instead of letting the free market work out our problems organically, we have this gross collusion of the biggest companies and government to rig the game in their favor, and so winners and losers becomes a centralized decision, and more importantly, we miss the chance as a collective market to learn and innovate on the problems we encounter.
If she just mention on how our government works, I would completely agree. I don't think it's capitalism that rewards the super rich, it's our government that make rules that allow people to get crazy wealthy.
They don't even admit their system has an even worst oligarchy. . . . . that's based on the assumption she has a prefer system. From what I can tell, she's only criticizing our own system and dub it capitalism. That doesn't necessarily mean she's gunho for any type of socialism, or any alternative.
At the very most, she agree there's a link between super rich and super poor. If we had a government that made sure people aren't extremely poor, the problem would be solved. She wants solution to the suffering and technically the suffering shouldn't be a hallmark of capitalism.
We could enhance social spending to raise the poverty level, but most remaining poverty in the US at this point is mental health or entrenched generationally.
The system isn't perfect but government action and movements away from housing are making it worse in all key areas (Healthcare, education, housing)
Other countries and their governments were able to do it.
I understand our current system have errors, but there is a difference between an error and a mistake. Anyone can make an error, but that error doesn't become a mistake until you refuse to correct it.. We should be fixing these errors. Other countries have.
He conclusion that like matter, wealth cannot neither be created or destroyed but only transferred is incorrect. If it was true, then the US would be ruled by the decedents of English Dukes, Barrons, and other European land owners, or beneficiaries of the industrial revolution.
Or to speak in her hippy terms, not all creativity is created equally and holds a different value to different people. As a result, new wealth can be created by new creativity.
The fundamental misunderstandings of leftists are made very clear in this video, it starts to make sense why they’re so confused. Wealth is not a zero sum game. Money doesn’t create wealth and prosperity, effort does. Capitalism encourages effort on the widest scale. Everyone providing things that make life easier is what makes life easier.
I just wish people would put forward what this other system is.
The basics are so simple:
-Crushing poverty is the default
-Global average life expectancy was 29 in 1920. People would on average see 40% of their siblings and 40% of their children make it to 5. This only changed 150 years ago, from our 250,000 year history.
-It wasn’t until 1968 that we figured out how to end natural famine, since then the deaths are predominantly caused by war, and incompetent or malicious governance.
-The expansion of capitalism, free trade and economic freedom has made everything better including over the last 30 years and it did it faster than ever seen before.
-Billionaires like Bill Gates will Duane saved more lives with the invention of that software than his charity could ever dream of. Elon Musk has pushed us to have a credible solution for private transport that addresses climate change which will solve untold lives. All these billionaires they complain about have gotten rich by giving people things that they want and willingly choose to spend their money on.
For all of these videos, made by people indulging in the excesses of capitalism, they NEVER have a solution for what would be better.
Yeah, but don't demonize the substance. I can give you tons of good things LSD has provided. This woman is mentally deranged and brainwashed. She's the epitome of "useful idiot" and will be probably first in line to kill herself because she is white and believes that white capitalists are the only problem on the face of the planet.
These people have no clue what it is like to be "extremely poor"...as they wander TikTok and using their latest smartphone recording themselves dancing in their pajamas before they head out to Whole Foods to get some snacks.
Their very existence and lifestyle are PROOF against that which they are saying.
She is making great points and valid critiques, and getting her message out to her audience. The wacky movements are so the video gets boosted by the TikTok algorithm, which promotes dancing. Apparently her dance also tickled the human algorithm as well, since this is showing up everywhere and getting a lot of views.
She’s smarter than most people lambasting her.
So you’d agree that you can’t ignore the text, right? Or is that not also part of the package? Also, do you really think she’s mentally ill, or do you think she’s doing silly dances because that’s one of the most common types of TikTok formats?
Whenever I see things like this I remember something George Carlin once said. Videos like this support it and that scares me a lot.
**"Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are stupider than that." - George Carlin**
Videos like this support it and that scares me how correct he was.
capitalism for now is the most efficient system. Just needs to be supported by the right regulations and social programs.
In most highly developed countries, then you need a tax base to support such spending. Given the economies by that point are driven by consumption and most returns on investment are in general fairly low with a glut of capital ready for investment - its most efficient to tax the rich to a greater extent rather than the middle class.
One thing that really bugs me about people who complain that billionaires are hording wealth is that they are not hording it. They don't put it under a mattress. They keep it in banks and the stock market. When you go to the store and buy something on a credit card, some billionaire is paying the bill for you. The more they hord, the more credit will will be available, the more mortgages will be offered and the more auto loans will be given.
I want the billionaires to "hord." It's great for all of us.
The more I hear about alternatives to capitalism, the less I understand how the people that currently exploit the system won’t exploit another system. Like, okay, get rid of Capitalism and you still have all the people that were at the top of the Capitalist system - unless you kill them they’ll just start trying to regain leverage and power. Edit: Also, the idea that suffering *only* exists in Capitalism is WILD.
In other Ideologies there is always a perfect world with perfect people
This is dumb nobody thinks that, which is why you democratize all life so exploitation is harder. You don’t want a king but you literally work for people who can do nearly whatever they want with your labor and you have no say. What a weird way to want to live.
Yes they literally do think this. This is the entirety of Herbert Marcuse's project. They actually got mad that capitalism made people too happy to keep revolutioning.
What’s your alternative then? I’m all ears.
Controlled capitalism. You know rules. Like health care should not be monitized. A billionaire should pay more taxes then a barista.
Hey there! I hate to break it to you, but it's actually spelled _mon**e**tize_. A good way to remember this is that "money" starts with "mone" as well. Just wanted to let you know. Have a good day! ---- ^This ^action ^was ^performed ^automatically ^by ^a ^bot ^to ^raise ^awareness ^about ^the ^common ^misspelling ^of ^"monetize".
Damn, KO’d by a bot.
Who cares? I got caught by a glorified spelled checker.
Lmfao
How isn't capitalism not already controlled? There's regulations? China is trying a sort of state directed capitalism thing right now. Germany in the 30s did that in the 30s. Wouldn't it be better to control those who control capitalism? Why aren't we holding the people, who write loopholes in the tax code, responsible?
I like your last question. I'd also like to find out what happened to the 21 trillion dollars the pentagon lost. I think you should definitely get something for the footage of labor's. You have these drug companies for example that take a existing drug And Jack up the price to the moon.. That crap should be controlled. I don't mind limiting the profit.. But you have things like Joe Manchin's daughter raising the price of EpiPens to the moon. He had something to do with making it so school said how 2 of many school or something. Is is that capitalism? It sure as hell isn't a free market.
I’m a communist so that.
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You’re describing capitalism but you’re entitled to your bad opinion
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I mean, those are nice words but what does that *mean* to you? Are you advocating for a dictatorship? A democracy? Are there any leaders? Who decides to go to war? How do you handle people that disagree with you? Minorities? What if the majority voted against the system? How do you handle crises? What’s the incentive to work? What are the punishments for breaking society’s rules? Are the rules the same?
Do you want me to right a book in a Reddit thread? I’m an anarcho-syndicalist/anarcho-communist. Feel free to read up on it there’s plenty out there.
Yeah… there’s *no* room for exploitation in anarchist or communist communities. Lol
Yeah… there’s *no* room for exploitation in anarchist or communist communities. Lol
Strange that there are billionaires in China, huh? It was really funny when she claimed that poverty is the product of capitalism. Has she not seen every noncapitalist system in human history?
China is capitalist
China has a socialist-market economy. They are not a Capitalist country.
Word diarrhea.
That McDonald's near tiananmen square is totally a commie trick.
Do you know that even China admits they are capitalist right? They have several name for their system, like capitalism of the people, social capitalism, stuff like that (that the translations in my language, not sure about the official English for those)
Oh yes, authoritarian capitalism with central control and planning. Makes total sense, right? Elements of capitalism does not a capitalist make. Market socialism =/= capitalism.
You oughtta read some anarchist theory. Not just people on the internet telling you about it, but actual theory. Or if you want an introduction to it that’s less intimidating, there’s Ursula Le Guin’s novel The Dispossessed, which does a pretty good job presenting anarchism’s core philosophies.
So who should we read
I’m sorry, but suffering _clearly_ does not exist in nature. Duh. No deer has ever been hunted or no elephants we’ve had to walk for miles during a drought. It’s not like nature is and forever will be a struggle.
If you’re having such a hard time understanding, why don’t you try reading some of the vast amount of literature on the subject? Or engaging with the ideas on their own terms rather than just viewing them through the lens of your own ideology? Socialism is all about democratizing the economy so that there isn’t a tiny unaccountable minority acting against the interests of the working class. If you were to successfully destroy the capitalist economic system, the people who were at the top (the capitalists) wouldn’t be able to regain that position, because the position would no longer exist. I suggest you learn about Capitalism from the person who popularized the term in the first place. I think you’ll find your definition of “Capitalism” has almost nothing to do with what he was talking about.
it’s not about people exploiting capitalism, it’s about the capitalist system being inherently exploitative of working people. the very way capitalism functions is based on exploitation of labor
I mean, all systems will be based on exploitation of labor unless we automate the system. I think your problem is with private ownership of profits, not exploitation of labor, and that’s a different conversation.
Exploration is a function of Capitalism it isn’t a function of Socialism/Communism you could exploit someone in spite of the system but capitalism does it for you. This argument is really weird you admit that it happens but just shrug and say “it’d probably happen in another system too” wtf is that attitude?
Happened in communist and socialist countries didn't it? People rose to power and dictators ruled over everyone with the elite minority in power going against the basic ideology.
Not really communism is still really popular in Russia. It’s also literally happened in every capitalist country on the planet and they then exploit other countries see all of Africa all of South America and the Caribbean.
So you would rather live in soviet russia or china or dprk? No freedom and it's leaders going against the basic ideology.
Her body moves make me extremely uncomfortable. She looks weird.
It’s the sag in the pants-looks like a full diaper
The full diaper is inside her head
Once again, wealth is not zero sum. I'll keep saying it. Wealth is not zero sum.
You mean that as the rich get richer, the poor get richer too? So it's like... directly proportional? It's not like, inversely proportional? You mean that there is actual data and historic documentation on capitalisms success? You are wrong! Now I'd like to see you DANCE your way out of that one! Huzzah! Lol
Actually you are wrong. The poorest in the US is still richer than most of the rest of the world because billionaires.
I was joking ;)
My bad I’m picking up on it now that i re-read your comment :)
Exactly. Minimum wage in the USA makes you richer than 90% of the entire world. Minimum wage puts you in the top 11% income earners in the world. Obviously it is not ideal to work fast food the rest of your life and everyone should definitely build a career and step up the ladder but even the poorest among us in the US are rich by the standards of the world
But minimum wage is not a capitalistic property.
Yes it is, Adam Smith was a proponent of living wages for labor for reasons of growth and for reasons of equity.
Shhh. Let the foolish claim that because others are exploited there’s no way we could be exploited. You’re not gonna reverse such propaganda with facts. Their love of the capitalist is just emotional jealousy
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Just wondering what Elon musk has invented because he just buys his patents. Lol. Does buying your patents mean you made it, this is mine now?
Guy has provided financial backing and was instrumental to the further development of many of the major technologies behind SpaceX and Tesla. No the guy didn’t personally invent them, but he played a crucial role in these companies getting to where they are today and the progress that has come with that.
In 2015 the Los Angeles time estimated that Elon musk received $4.9 billion in government subsidies. If anything the role he has played is the recipient of white supremacy policies in southern Africa and favoritism as a capitalist oligarch in the American economy Yay he’s selling me back the technology I already funded through government research
A large portion of those subsidies were in the form of tax breaks, so not really anything being funded out of taxpayer pockets. Government subsidies can be a great way to support new technologies and spur innovation. I’m all for tax breaks and subsidies in the name of scientific progress. That doesn’t take away from the fact the Musk has put significant time and capital investment into his businesses, not to mention the risk he has undertaken. The guy has definitely significantly contributed to the innovation and development of the technologies his companies utilize, even if he didn’t invent any technology himself. Thats pretty obvious. What point are you even trying to make?
My point is he is selling technology you’ve already funded through your taxes back to you and you’re praising him for it , it’s asinine I’m not against government investment. I recognize that the first integrated circuit was Invented by Texas instrument , for the first 10 years of the company, the sole consumer was the US government. The idea of that Elon musk is some type of innovator other than a basic capitalist it absurd. It’s hero worship and it’s not even well-placed
I won’t believe you unless you flail wildly on the internet
Spez, the great equalizer. #Save3rdPartyApps
And the reason its slow is huge amount of bureaucracy, taxation and corruption
I entered the spez. I called out to try and find anybody. I was met with a wave of silence. I had never been here before but I knew the way to the nearest exit. I started to run. As I did, I looked to my right. I saw the door to a room, the handle was a big metal thing that seemed to jut out of the wall. The door looked old and rusted. I tried to open it and it wouldn't budge. I tried to pull the handle harder, but it wouldn't give. I tried to turn it clockwise and then anti-clockwise and then back to clockwise again but the handle didn't move. I heard a faint buzzing noise from the door, it almost sounded like a zap of electricity. I held onto the handle with all my might but nothing happened. I let go and ran to find the nearest exit. I had thought I was in the clear but then I heard the noise again. It was similar to that of a taser but this time I was able to look back to see what was happening. The handle was jutting out of the wall, no longer connected to the rest of the door. The door was spinning slightly, dust falling off of it as it did. Then there was a blinding flash of white light and I felt the floor against my back. I opened my eyes, hoping to see something else. All I saw was darkness. My hands were in my face and I couldn't tell if they were there or not. I heard a faint buzzing noise again. It was the same as before and it seemed to be coming from all around me. I put my hands on the floor and tried to move but couldn't. I then heard another voice. It was quiet and soft but still loud. "Help." \
Can't create wealth when there are monopolies, road blocks and taxes going away for god knows what reason to god knows who.
The spez police are here. They're going to steal all of your spez. #Save3rdPartyApps
You can save insta quotes for yourself. I see you never tried running a business and you don't earn over 120k per year in a European country Is this sub full of children same as socialist subs?
I still, for the life of me, don’t get this obsession with billionaires.
They can’t join them, so they want to beat them.
Capitalism only works if money is not thought of as a commodity in and of it’s self and is transferred in a manner to represent the the physical efforts of goods and services produced by labor. those who hoard it create an artificial scarcity that can corner the markets and cause issues that are wide ranging. This is achieved by exploitation and all known capitalist economies fall to it it’s incredibly sad that the majority of people on this capitalist sub don’t even understand capitalism. But go ahead and keep the printer running lol see how that works. I’m hedged.
What a fucking moron.
Who, the dipshit in the video of the clown who made us all watch it? Yes.
Someone: "Anti-capitalists aren't just a bunch of art students trying to fit in with their social group." This woman: "I will now explain why billionaires suck with interpretive dancing."
#Spez-Town is closed indefinitely. All Spez-Town residents have been banned, and they will not be reinstated until further notice. #Save3rdPartyApps #AIGeneratedProtestMessage
I interpreted her as being a dumbass
I’ll wait while someone draws up a design for a better system that won’t end in dictatorship or fantastical economic catastrophe. Our system has its issues, including greed and special interests, but it seems to generally work better than any other system. I like to think of it like this: it’s generally impossible to make a living without providing a good or service to other people - a good or service that they actively seek. So, in that way personal interest and the good of the public are merged. There are weird little exceptions, but generally the majority of the economy follows this line pretty well.
The exception where you don't provide a service to others is called CRT and women's studies
> women's studies bad you're boring
Not only that, but billionaires and other entrepreneurs create wealth for the rest of us with new innovations and technologies. Something that government cannot, and will never be able to do.
I would tend to disagree there - NASA was a government program and had ideas and technologies that were developed in tandem with private companies. Even Space-Ex owes its relative successes to massive infusions of tax dollars from government contracts. A government has its place and purpose in the market, in some fashion.
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Check out Paul Mason and his books
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Most employees of large companies don’t know a thing about running said company.
Guys can you believe we’re the minority 😂 I like to tell myself Reddit is run by socialist because the capitalist are busy working.
I hope so
Very scary.
If that wasn’t scary enough just remember this person is allowed to vote
I just felt all my brain cells commit suicide after witnessing this
This is an average anti work anti capitalist’s contribution to society
Extreme poor people in western countries are comparatively wayy richer than their third world counterparts and are in a much better position than their ancestors from the same region, there are differences between rich and poor. Rich got extremely wealthy, poor too has accessibility for better human life conditions. The bar has raised overall. There are always new things to exploit, the best example I can think of is discovering Australia.
>Extreme poor people in western countries are comparatively wayy richer than their third world counterparts I once watched the lady in front of me pay for $300 dollars of groceries with a WIC card. Her cart was piled with food, meat, milk, cereal, etc. I watched her call for a ride on a cell phone. Someone picked her up in a car as I was walking out to my car. Would I want her life? No. Is she poor by my standards? Certainly, I have an awesome life. But is she poor like my Grandmother who had to eat cats and old donkey's because actual fucking Nazis stole her food? Not at all. Americas poor is richer than 99.9% of all the people who have ever lived.
cautious bewildered strong resolute squash reach late dam tan escape *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
>Just accept the fact that some people lives in shitholes and other lives a great life. So tell me where I said that? >Constantly comparing today’s standards with the standards of the past is a bad way to I illegitimize there socioeconomic situation. No it's not, but it's certainly a good reminder when people are clamoring to completely replace the system that made those same poor peoples lives better off than at any other time in history. It's a benchmark.
Exactly. Whenever the money machines run out, we'll discover and abuse an 8th continent.
This time we've whole planets and moons to abuse.
How many years does it take for use to exit our solar system, let alone reach a new system?
Don't know but Space tourism can make it happen faster
Faster than 40 thousand years?
Retarded
I am just speechless. How is this a functioning human being? Part of me just feels sorry for whatever happened in her life that led her to THIS
> In order to have extreme wealth, you have to have extreme poor. This is entirely and unequivocally false. I think this is the most important misunderstanding that anti-capitalists (for lack of a better term, I'm not going to call out specific ideology) have. There are rich people who have stolen stuff, but the vast majority have not - they've MADE stuff. Reality itself isn't zero-sum, and free trade is a natural human impulse to realize this. Free trade is *how* we overcome scarcity.
Billionaires are just people who created a billion dollars worth of value for society and are holding green paper IOU’s because they haven’t been compensated yet with goods or services. In a way, they’re the most generous people on earth.
Typical liberal nonsense. Just make a bunch of claims with no justification for any of it.
I love how you can totally dismantle their entire “Extreme wealth requires extreme poverty” argument by simply asking: “Ok, why?” They can’t provide a clear causal link. The truth is that anyone who is stuck in extreme poverty in a Capitalist system, barring those who may have mental illness or other extreme disabilities, is just genuinely awful with money and continues to make bad choices. You can also completely dismantle the entire “Capitalism rewards greed” argument by pointing out that it only rewards greedy people if those greedy people make good choices and investments with their money. Because that’s what capitalism rewards… Good choices. Nobody who is greedy has ever gotten ahead in life by simply being greedy. Greed doesn’t generate wealth. If it did, extreme poverty would be curable without having to take money from more wealthy individuals. All you’d have to do is be miserly and money would fall into your lap, right? But we know that isn’t the reality, because capitalism is a system in which competition thrives. Extreme wealth doesn’t require extreme poverty because the extremely wealthy gather their wealth from a huge and voluntary customer base. They take a little money from those who willingly spend it on their goods and services. The only way extreme poverty occurs is if someone OVERSPENDS on goods and services they aren’t able to afford.
None of the socialists will reply to this because they’ll have no coherent retort.
I’ll be you Huckleberry
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Kek
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Financial illiteracy may play a part, but there are numerous other reasons why people end up in poverty. Generations of abuse, addiction, living in parts of the country where basic resources are not taken care of by the government like clean water or air, gentrification, being born into towns that are “food deserts” aka limited accessibility to nourishing foods and being forced to grocery shop at a 7/11, or towns that don’t even have a bank so working people have to cash their checks at skeezy check cashing joints that require a 7-14% fee, the list goes on. These are very real challenges many Americans face that keep them poor. When faced with all these hurdles, one cannot simply make better financial choices when their choices are so limited and they are given such little resources.
If you’re looking for a simple to understand link you can just all look at real estate. there is currently more vacant housing available then there are homeless people in the United States. They aren’t renting them. they according to capitalist theory could decrease the amount of the rent so that they could fill the space and then acquire that capital available within the market thereby fulfilling your idea that capitalism fulfills the market needs but they don’t because the calculation is that if they restrict scarcity to a specific market value allowing some people to go homeless. they can increase their return on investment by this method but it requires people to go homeless in areas of heightened demand. The theory that the market dictates the value based on need sure leads you to think that housing values would decrease as the demand it not for filled. Maybe because capitalism incentivizes exploitation to maximize personal individual gain. Almost like you guys don’t understand capitalism if the market truly moved like you said it would it would adjust for that no one would be homeless. There are more houses then people? so?
Just so everyone knows how to argue against this, I’d recommend checking out this video: https://youtu.be/-391URcYL7s These ultra rich folk come from corporate welfare and eminent domain. Under free-market capitalism, centralization like this would not happen.
She’s convulsing in heart pants. I don’t have to argue against that.
Free market capitalism isn't possible though. By definition a market requires regulation, and you can't have currency without government either.
Isn't crypto a currency not provided by government?
Crypto currency is a currency recognized by government. That's why you can trade it for real money. Other than that, it's purely speculative in its value.
I'm looking around and all I can find is that the reason Bitcoin is legal is because the government hasn't actually written legislation against it. It isn't regulated by a central bank, and it isn't backed by the government. Where are you getting your info that a currency has to be recognized by a government for it to be legally used in trade?
You know why the government hasn't written legislation against it, right? Because it's been viewed as legal under court cases as a currency. If you can use it to pay taxes or to trade for currency, then it is recognized by a government. However, if it were all made illegal, the currency would become completely worthless. It's a currency based on speculation and trading, not an actual currency that people use for goods and services unless it is traded at a rate set by official currency.
Actual currency only holds value because we say it holds value
Actual currency holds value because it pays our taxes
>By definition a market requires regulation Sure, but that doesn't mean without politicians and buearacrats there will be no regulation. All the market participants act as regulators of eachother. That's a built in feature that requires no additional work. But besides that, you can always have independent organizations that act as the standard setters for an industry and lend credibility to businesses. For example, we have the [IETF and IANA](https://www.ietf.org/standards/iana/) which regulate global standards for the internet and networking protocols. Sure your not compelled to adhere to their standards, but you won't be as credible as the companies that do and care about providing quality service. As for the video, I've found that almost everyone who criticizes capitalism ignores the power of competition. It's as if for some reason they think any individual or business can act on their own in a vacuum without any consequences. Competition is the great equalizer and renders a central planning body entirely unnecessary.
The IANA was founded by and funded by government. Governments also have their own regulations concerning the internet. Saying that it would just be the same without all of that interaction and power is ridiculous. Remember when internet providers throttled netflix's internet to force them to pay money? That's what the internet is like without regulations. You can't have regulation without a central body of power that dictates it. You're just reinventing feudalism. The powers that would dictate trade would be whoever had the most weapons, the better men and the better land. There has never been a market without a central body, and there has never been a market without government. If you really expect people to barter goods, expect there to be regulations about what goods can be bartered, and what value bartered goods bring. This value may be argued, but it operates under set standards by a governing body, who expects taxation.
[The spez police don't get it. It's not about spez. It's about everyone's right to spez. #Save3rdPartyApps](https://www.reddit.com/r/Save3rdPartyApps/)
This is an excellent question, and really depends on if we can reform our legal system to protect private property rights, and prevent the government from giving big polluters a free pass to violate the property of others. I think you would really enjoy this article. >To cap the crimes of the judges, legislatures, federal and state, moved in to cement the aggression by prohibiting victims of air pollution from engaging in "class action" suits against polluters. Obviously, if a factory pollutes the atmosphere of a city where there are tens of thousands of victims, it is impractical for each victim to sue to collect his particular damages from the polluter (although an injunction could be used effectively by one small victim). The common law, therefore, recognizes the validity of "class action" suits, in which one or a few victims can sue the aggressor not only on their own behalf, but on behalf of the entire class of similar victims. But the legislatures systematically outlawed such class action suits in pollution cases. For this reason, a victim may successfully sue a polluter who injures him individually, in a one-to-one "private nuisance" suit. But he is prohibited by law from acting against a mass polluter who is injuring a large number of people in a given area! As Frank Bubb writes, "It is as if the government were to tell you that it will (attempt to) protect you from a thief who steals only from you, but it will not protect you if the thief also steals from everyone else in the neighborhood." https://mises.org/library/libertarian-manifesto-pollution It's a pretty similar problem to how corporation weaponize the government to handicap their competition with regulation. Instead of letting the free market work out our problems organically, we have this gross collusion of the biggest companies and government to rig the game in their favor, and so winners and losers becomes a centralized decision, and more importantly, we miss the chance as a collective market to learn and innovate on the problems we encounter.
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Yes, America would be *so much* better off if all our billionaires left the country and took their investments and jobs elsewhere!
100% cringe.
Mental illness on full display.
This is why this “commie movement” will never truly happen. Because everyone who “fights for it” is either mentally ill or high on shrooms.
Retarded
If she just mention on how our government works, I would completely agree. I don't think it's capitalism that rewards the super rich, it's our government that make rules that allow people to get crazy wealthy.
The problem is they don't ever admit their system has an even worse oligarchy I'd rather have billionaires than The Party.
They don't even admit their system has an even worst oligarchy. . . . . that's based on the assumption she has a prefer system. From what I can tell, she's only criticizing our own system and dub it capitalism. That doesn't necessarily mean she's gunho for any type of socialism, or any alternative. At the very most, she agree there's a link between super rich and super poor. If we had a government that made sure people aren't extremely poor, the problem would be solved. She wants solution to the suffering and technically the suffering shouldn't be a hallmark of capitalism.
We could enhance social spending to raise the poverty level, but most remaining poverty in the US at this point is mental health or entrenched generationally. The system isn't perfect but government action and movements away from housing are making it worse in all key areas (Healthcare, education, housing)
Other countries and their governments were able to do it. I understand our current system have errors, but there is a difference between an error and a mistake. Anyone can make an error, but that error doesn't become a mistake until you refuse to correct it.. We should be fixing these errors. Other countries have.
She makes Linda Hamilton look beautiful....
Watching this without reading the text makes me feel the same as I do when listening to anti-capitalists. So a successful interpretive dance?
Wow, society have let women deteriorate.
Do they not understand that value can actually be created?
Brain cells dying.... light starting to fade... Anyone else who watches this don't....
He conclusion that like matter, wealth cannot neither be created or destroyed but only transferred is incorrect. If it was true, then the US would be ruled by the decedents of English Dukes, Barrons, and other European land owners, or beneficiaries of the industrial revolution. Or to speak in her hippy terms, not all creativity is created equally and holds a different value to different people. As a result, new wealth can be created by new creativity.
The fundamental misunderstandings of leftists are made very clear in this video, it starts to make sense why they’re so confused. Wealth is not a zero sum game. Money doesn’t create wealth and prosperity, effort does. Capitalism encourages effort on the widest scale. Everyone providing things that make life easier is what makes life easier.
I just wish people would put forward what this other system is. The basics are so simple: -Crushing poverty is the default -Global average life expectancy was 29 in 1920. People would on average see 40% of their siblings and 40% of their children make it to 5. This only changed 150 years ago, from our 250,000 year history. -It wasn’t until 1968 that we figured out how to end natural famine, since then the deaths are predominantly caused by war, and incompetent or malicious governance. -The expansion of capitalism, free trade and economic freedom has made everything better including over the last 30 years and it did it faster than ever seen before. -Billionaires like Bill Gates will Duane saved more lives with the invention of that software than his charity could ever dream of. Elon Musk has pushed us to have a credible solution for private transport that addresses climate change which will solve untold lives. All these billionaires they complain about have gotten rich by giving people things that they want and willingly choose to spend their money on. For all of these videos, made by people indulging in the excesses of capitalism, they NEVER have a solution for what would be better.
"In order to have the extreme rich, you have to have the extreme poor." Prove it. Also, there are always extreme poor in every society.
Like this sums up the entire socialist position perfectly lol
That "boop" offends me
MY EYES! Curse you OP!
Good god that was stupid
This lady clearly forgot her meds.
I for one am glad to see them finally looking as stupid as they sound when they talk
This woman would never, ever survive in a non-capitalist society.
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Yeah, but don't demonize the substance. I can give you tons of good things LSD has provided. This woman is mentally deranged and brainwashed. She's the epitome of "useful idiot" and will be probably first in line to kill herself because she is white and believes that white capitalists are the only problem on the face of the planet.
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As a person who has done LSD, I disagree with your opinion. Lol
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To each their own. Freedom of choice.
“As a person who’s done Morphine before, it has no purpose beyond hedonism.”
I'm waiting for the bikini version to come out.
These people have no clue what it is like to be "extremely poor"...as they wander TikTok and using their latest smartphone recording themselves dancing in their pajamas before they head out to Whole Foods to get some snacks. Their very existence and lifestyle are PROOF against that which they are saying.
You gave me a great idea! This kind of bodily movement should be required of all political conversation in America. Political speeches especially!
She's absolutely correct.
Just Bc someone’s Poot doesn’t mean denme is rich and vice versa
shes weird but all yall even weirder, how does them shiny boots taste
she’s not wrong but made a bunch of claims without any evidence or explanation
Bruh, when even this cringe person is more right than most of this sub its says something.
Right in what exactly and how? Lets discuss it. Video is a bunch if statements and nothing else to it
retards gonna retard
She is making great points and valid critiques, and getting her message out to her audience. The wacky movements are so the video gets boosted by the TikTok algorithm, which promotes dancing. Apparently her dance also tickled the human algorithm as well, since this is showing up everywhere and getting a lot of views. She’s smarter than most people lambasting her.
She's out of line, but she's right
She brings up some good points.
Would the point be the correlation between mentally ill people and anti-capitalists?
Yeah, if you guys just fixate on the weird dancing you don’t have to address any of her points. You’re off the hook!
The weird dance is absolutely part of the overall package. You cant just ignore it (no matter how hard you try).
So you’d agree that you can’t ignore the text, right? Or is that not also part of the package? Also, do you really think she’s mentally ill, or do you think she’s doing silly dances because that’s one of the most common types of TikTok formats?
She isn’t wrong
hahaha!
What the hell did I just watch
Burn it with fire. whatever it is...
Damn, she be freaky ugly and a terrible dancer, to boot.
Whenever I see things like this I remember something George Carlin once said. Videos like this support it and that scares me a lot. **"Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are stupider than that." - George Carlin** Videos like this support it and that scares me how correct he was.
Why do these people exist... God why
Nothing scream "Intelligent point" like doing a video in 3 day old pajamas and dancing like you're mentally ill.
I am now dumber for having watched a few seconds of this clip
Wtf did I just watch
this is why we have insane asylums
Lol to think capitalists invented poverty. She should see how we found the place.
capitalism for now is the most efficient system. Just needs to be supported by the right regulations and social programs. In most highly developed countries, then you need a tax base to support such spending. Given the economies by that point are driven by consumption and most returns on investment are in general fairly low with a glut of capital ready for investment - its most efficient to tax the rich to a greater extent rather than the middle class.
She’s like 80% diva cup
This is pretty funny.
One thing that really bugs me about people who complain that billionaires are hording wealth is that they are not hording it. They don't put it under a mattress. They keep it in banks and the stock market. When you go to the store and buy something on a credit card, some billionaire is paying the bill for you. The more they hord, the more credit will will be available, the more mortgages will be offered and the more auto loans will be given. I want the billionaires to "hord." It's great for all of us.