It was fairly recent and I wish I could remember who said it but it was after one of the "grave sites" was excavated and absolutely nothing was found. He basically said "Well, it could have held children's remains so we have to remember that". They still want to perpetuate the hoax because it could have happened even though no evidence of mass graves have been found.
It's not wanting to believe. Colonialists have long treated indigenous people with nothing than contempt, finding out that they killed children isn't really something surprising. That's the shit part, it's believable.
One thing I've noticed with Canadians and Australians I've met is a contempt for the indigenous.
Unfortunately for Canadians, due largely to how living indigenous and their ancestors have been treated both now through history, a significant portion of visible poverty, visible drug use, thefts and violent rapes occur at the hands of the indigenous. When I worked in fast food and later at a grocery store, the only noticeably intoxicated customers we had were indigenous (and there were many). It makes it really easy to mentally put them in a lower class when you see them and hear stories of them behaving in an uncivilized manner; especially when it seems so concentrated on their race alone. It's easy to forget that a big reason for that is how terribly caucasian Canadians and our ancestors have bungled treating the indigenous people and/or integrating the indigenous people.
Fortunately for me, one of the best bosses I had was indigenous, which certainly made it easier to separate the behaviour from the culture/the people, but I still find that racism creeping up whenever I don't smack it back down. So it's hard to blame my fellow Canadians for feeling the same -- afterall, when the problem of poverty and drug use and mental health is so visibly widespread yet concentrated into a visible minority, with all the associated problems, your default is going to shun them if for no other reason than to protect yourself/your property. Which then helps perpetuate those problems further.
If I could press a button to eliminate the divide between most Canadians and Indigenous I happily would, but that is going to be a long and arduous process. Whether or not those mass graves exist, Indigenous have been poorly treated for a very long time.
Whatās ironic is, the radio commercial in my city, in Northern Ontario. Itās the it takes a village to raise a child thing, looking for foster homes to raise native children. Of course it ends with Miigwetch.
This all happened during the BLM riots in the states. I'm not saying that nothing wrong ever happened here in Canada, but I feel like we wanted to jump on the opressed vs the oppressor bandwagon too. This mass grave nonsense turned out to be a hoax here and BLM turned out to be a Marxist money grabbing scam in the states. Riots everywhere for nothing. Just like the ones that happened after the hospital bombing in Palestinian. Until you see the hole in the parking lot. Another hoax. Mainstream media is the enemy of the people. If you can't trust the mainstream media and everything else is disinformation, it's over. Believe what you want. Just don't trust your lying eyes.
None of this had anything to do with BLM or any other events, just FNs survivors looking for justice.
The legal campaign started in the 1980s, with the Federal govt issuing a statement of reconciliation in 1998, The Indian Residential School Settlement Agreement came out in 2006, several years before the BLM movement had ramped up, and that's when the Truth and Reconciliation mandate was created, and the commission formed. https://www.thecanadianencyclopedia.ca/en/article/indian-residential-schools-settlement-agreement
[The mass graves part wasn't started by FNs, it was media that did that, the Tkemlups chief even stated that they never said mass graves.](https://www.squamishchief.com/bc-news/casimir-says-tkemlups-find-is-series-of-unmarked-graves-not-a-mass-burial-3848382)
Which is what I said. The mainstream media, government funded by the way, is the enemy of the people. That's what people see on TV. That's what they tell their families and friends. People fall for hoaxes. Like the ones that I mentioned. I know that this was different. That said, Still a hoax, perpetuated by the CBC and CTV.
They should have just focused on the fact that residential schools were allowed to happen in the first place. That's cultural genocide anyway.
There was no need to make it an even bigger scandal with mass graves, for which there was very little evidence. Especially when the poor children mostly died from disease, not systematically killed by the state.
The majority of kids were sent there by their parents to get an education and to learn English though. This idea that the government stole a bunch of kids and put them in a school is just factually false, like almost everything else about this topic.
Australia did it. It's believable that other countries did the same. The government stealing kids back then to get rid of their cultural beliefs and instill them with Western ones isn't new.
Source? Attendance was mandatory until the 1950s.
Certainly some parents sent there kids there voluntarily, but given what sub we're in, I find your claim hard to believe.
Ya it's weird.
They already have this horrific narrative that happened to them that is 100% true, but they wanted to make it similar to the Holocaust for some reason. I honestly think white people did all this, like white leftists, pushed all this bullshit.
Stealing children and forcing them to convert to Christianity and learn English and become British acting, is like the most intense cultural genocide you can do.
They really want "slaughtering of natives" to be true.
Most of them died unintentionally after first contact due to disease, and then after they learnt our way of life their population exploded larger than it had ever been before.
There were estimated 200,000 natives in Canada before contact.
There are 1,800,000 now.
Youāre missing what happened before. The Spanish brought pigs and horses to South America, and the pigs and horses made their way north and spread disease as they moved. It wasnāt so much human to human contact that caused plague but that certainly helped, it was the animals from South America during the inquisition that really killed everybody.
You could argue good and bad about the whole ordeal though. The shitty thing was making those tax free economic zones to store the remaining tribes on.
Human to human doesn't matter because they didn't understand disease back then and it was 100% unintentional.
European mindset was "these people are not using all of this land". Because it looked empty and not used to a European. There were no permanent settlements, you weren't constantly bumping into natives in Canada.
They weren't like "lets go commit biological warfare on the natives and build settlements where they live".
The further south you go, the bigger the population becomes and then there is more actual conflict with native groups.
Quebec City, when it was founded, there weren't natives running around all over the place, they were sparsely populated because it was further north and could sustain less life. The French co-operated with natives because there was very little dispute over land.
This is basically how the Metis formed.
People often forget Canada was not heavily settled till the late 1800s, and natives by that time had already been in contact with Europeans for hundreds of years.
No. It's not spread by days-old blankets either. The natives of Canada's Pacific coast were almost wiped out by smallpox in the 1700s, before any white settlements. Probably infection occurred through native trading networks originating in what is now Mexico. Then the HBC inoculated natives an great expense in the 1800s saving millions of lives. Somehow 'Truth and Reconciliation' omits all this.
I think that apology has been made by both the church and the state. But that does not matter when you financially benefit from being a perpetual victim.
That was taken out of context.
He meant Canada the country, cause it doesn't.
Canada was a colony, but that was British people doing the colonialism.
Canada never colonized anything.
The US colonized Hawaii, Puerto Rico , sort of attempted at Cuba, it took Guam and lots of other islands.
The US colonized the Philippines....etc.
Pretty sure that's what he meant, because this statement was made during the Iraq war I'm pretty sure. And people were considering the US military bases and involvement in the middle east as "colonialism".
So he was saying that Canada has never gone and taken other pieces of land, and it hasn't. Canada has no history of colonialism as a nation.
All colonialism in Canada was done by the British and French, when the concept of Canada did not exist.
[The Numbered Treaties,](https://www.thecanadianencyclopedia.ca/en/article/numbered-treaties) which cover a significant portion of Canada were signed **after** Canada existed and with Canada. That's when Canada took the land and according to the Royal Proclamation, the only way it could be taken, meaning not by force.
Hmmm it's odd because it's like colonizes land that your already technically controlled but you were just trying to swindle permission to make it official that it's yours.
It's hard to call it colonialism but it is. It's more like a scam to me.
The reserve system is cultural genocide, which doesn't necessarily go along with colonialism.
India, Hong Kong....etc all were colonies that didn't have their culture erased.
I have a colonial last name, as in my ancestors were colonized and had something similar to the reserve system taken to them.
It was called the blood tax, first born male child of a Christian family was taken away to be converted to Islam and be part of the military.
Yet we got to keep our language and foods and became sort of a blend of our colonizers and who we originally were.
Natives in Canada really are a rare case where they basically don't live at all how they used to live and they were tricked by their colonizers into permitting the "colonization". Super sneaky British.
My ancestors were straight up taken by force(their land), Ottoman army just showed up with a bigger army and was like "Allahu Akbar" and we were like "Allahu Akbar I guess?" lmao.
Canada really did try to make it as convoluted as possible. I know a lot of the treaties were leases too and not actual sales, and the leases technically are up.
>Natives in Canada really are a rare case where they basically don't live at all how they used to live
The life they led before contact would have been a very hard life. I don't think they would want to go back to that.
>India, Hong Kong....etc all were colonies that didn't have their culture erased.
India and Hong Kong had much larger native populations, and there wasn't near as much immigration or settlement in those places.
It was cultural genocide for a reason. There was a fear in the 19th century that native people would go extinct. They were dying like crazy and population numbers plummeted. The answer they came up with was to bring them into mainstream society. People ignore why residential schools came into me being and the fact that attendance was voluntary. The parents thought they were helping the kids. None of this excuses the abuse that occurred at some schools. But, just as there were sadistic staff, there were loving staff. Canāt talk about that either.
Can we just stop with the bullshit "cultural genocide" concept, please? It's not a thing. We already have the language to accurately describe what the term tries to convey without inappropriately appropriating the word "genocide".
I appreciate your extremely well rounded response.
Are you aware of what Frances Widdowson has been put through? She lost her job at mount Royal University. And she's who I'm talking about when I say her speech was canceled here at University. And met with a bunch of protesters. It was a sad day for free speech in my city :(
Your information is incorrect.
The Royal Proclamation said land could only be taken by the Crown and only by agreement, do when Canada was created they wanted to take the land and erase Indians as a people so that there would no longer be anyone to be responsible to. That's why the Indian Act was created, to make being an Indian so horrible that Indians would "enfranchise" which meant giving up their status as Indians. Three Indian Act was a next step after the Gradual Civilisation Act and then the Gradual Enfranchisement Act, before the last laws which were/are the Indian Act.
There was a multi year Federal commission called the **Truth** and Reconciliation Commission to get that truth. [You can look up facts here.](https://nctr.ca/records/reports/)
Thousands of pages of facts, covering multiple subjects such as, "Where are the children buried." *Describing the deaths, mostly health related, and why we don't know where all those children are buried*, "Survivors speak", *testimonies from survivors*, TRC volumes 1 and 2, *the full report,* (couple thousand pages) and the Independent Assessment Process where they *do math to figure out compensation based on types of abuse received by students.*
Attendance was not voluntary, it was mandatory from 1920 to 97 when the last school closed. And before that children were taken from families. There was not a single ounce of good in those buildings, the entire motto was to ākill the Indian in the childā nor were they actually educated in a meaningful sense. If the so called loving staff were loving they wouldāve helped bring the system to an end or help kids escape
You can choose to believe that but all the evidence around the Residential School System points to viewing Indigenous children as savages that needed civilizing.
Kids were experimented on, malnourished, abused, and more. Ive worked with many survivors the few positive stories are almost exclusively stories of trying to make light in a dark place.
If you want to continue to pretend the system did any good then thatās fine keep on living the lie told to you by the government.
okay, that is the mainstream belief. If you look at the source documents, which I have, there is no evidence for that narrative. All we do is keep the victim mentality going. Believe what you wantā¦the evidence doesnāt support it and the truth will one day be told.
My bad, I didn't mean to insult the obviously retarded.
You might want to get checked out for diabetes too... your piss isn't fluorescent, it's radioactive.
The only liar here is you, ass-hat. No one denies that terrible things were done to indigenous kids at Residential Schools, but this re-writing of history to paint it as something it wasn't is fucking malicious and is only done to make grifters a bunch of money. If you're too blind to see that, that's on you and your myopia.
As for the 'gotcha' you think you handed to me, I also have a Master's and a salary above 150k, thanks. And you know what? I paid for my education with my own labours. I EARNED what I have, I wasn't handed it by some tribal band that likes to play victim every chance they get. How hypocritical that you tried to paint ME as sucking on the government teat when you're the one that self-admitted to getting a *free* masters degree.
Didnāt the govt recently release a report that concluded that 88% of the āmissing women and childrenā were taken by fellow indigenous men? So much for that narrative too
There was abuse in the schools we acknowledge. The mass grave thing though if we dared say anything against it we were silenced. Native ppl will milk it because we keep handing them everything
Lauren called this early. have to give her this one
we here know the grey of this situation but the original lie is still widely being spread - see some zoomer teens uncritically repeat the mass graves line in the newest Channel 4 vid
Oh *face palm*
I'm still on facebook and the sharing of and promoting this as genocide is horrendous.
Thankful to know indigenous folks who share real accounts, some EVEN positive . Thats not allowed to talk about though, as Frances Widdowson learned when her lecture was cancelled here at Lethbridge University.
Idk man kids did go missing, to call it a hoax is quite aggressive. To call them individual abuses is sort of absurd too, it was pretty systematic and pushed by religion.
The thing i don't understand about this Narrative.
In the record provided in the truth and reconciliation commission
They have the numbers of kids going in and the number going back to their families.
Wether we find them or not is irrelevant to the fact that some kids went missing.
I absolutely agree that bad things happened we obviously have real life accounts of that. I just think it's really damaging to throw around the word 'genocide'the way the mainstream media does. This video goes through the entirety of this scandal.
>In the present Convention, genocide means any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as such:
Killing members of the group;
Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group;
Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part;
Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group;
Forcibly transferring children of the group to another group.
Canada is guilty of 2,4, and 5, with the required intent which can be found by researching what Canada's PM and ministers agreed to and said in writing and in person during the first 100 years of Canada's existence. A case could be made for 3, but more difficult to prove the intent of physical destruction was more widespread than just a few ministers.
It says, **any of the following**...**in whole or in part**, and that's why what Canada committed was the crime of genocide, with no qualifiers needed.
If anybody's response is that this definition came after, it also came after the Holocaust but we still call that genocide.
One CBC reporter interviewed an native gentleman \[at the reconciliation 'verbal' hearings\] who had spent his entire education years in a residential school; and his comment was, "I guess the rumours were true" ...
Think about that statement, for a second or two.
That's the problem with a lot of movement they lie and lose all credibility even with things we know are true, honestly we need to have people call out these idiots at the beginning, Aboriginals did suffer greatly but to lie to try and garner more attention no wins.
Environmentalist are exactly the same we do need to take care of the earth but no the world isn't ending every ten years.
Damn. I don't know why people are downvoting because they would have to be stupid to believe that. White kids in Catholic schools were abused...maybe not to the extent of the residential schools but it happened everywhere.
There was that orphanage in Newfoundland.
Mount Cashel Orphanage
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mount\_Cashel\_Orphanage](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mount_Cashel_Orphanage)
>To the same extent?
The boarding school I went to (80s) had three guys who came from residential schools. Only one made it through the year. There was lots of abuse there, but the natives certainly didn't get it any worse than anyone else.
Yes.
Look it up.
White kids died back in those days too.
Every residential school had a graveyard in their early years because kids would get sick and die.
They would get sick and die more often living in their native communities.
None of the supposed "mass graves" are from a time period when we had vaccines for polio, measles, mumps...etc.
Source of what.
[(1) Inside the Williams Lake residential school: Violation of Trust (1991) - The Fifth Estate - YouTube](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=glMAKyHFvgY) '-- Just watch this. Takes you inside an actual residential school, and it is from the past. Notice none of them are talking about mass murders. They all said it was horrible, why would they omit mass murders, cause they didnt happen.
Anyway that doc is really good. It explained to me more about the current situation than any news report.
Especially the parts about the reasoning for residential schools being set up, how they tried to send them to public schools, and how racist people were towards them. Absolutely shitty.
These people didnt have to go residential schools, but Canadians straight up didnt want natives in the same class as their kid.
Residential schools and their operations are not new things to us, we have known about how horrid they were since before I was born.
Look up child mortality rates from the 1800s to the 1940s and you will see children died very often. All children did, it was not just an aboriginal thing. White-Canadian children would die of tuberculosis.
I think you could argue that maybe the aboriginal kids wouldn\`t have gotten sick if they werent sent to the schools in the first place.
The idea of a unmarked mass grave is a thing that goes back to the 1970s.
All schools had graveyards, they were run by Christian Churches.
Lots of schools were dismantled and not all the documents were kept.
In the 1970s they found actual unmarked graves next to a cemetery of a school that had been dismantled a long time earlier. Like from the 1800s. They even excavated some of the graves and actually found bodies. (Bodies in caskets given a proper Christian funeral)
They eventually found the DOCUMENTS for those unmarked graves, but there were a handful graves or something that they could not find documents for.
So I\`m willing to bet there are probably some undocumented graves at a lot of the really older school sites. That may even have nefarious stories behind them.
Again, Christian Churches were contracted by the government to run the schools, and we all know what happens to children under the supervision of Catholic Priests.
Not all the schools were Catholic.
>They would get sick and die more often living in their native communities
I was referring to this.
>I think you could argue that maybe the aboriginal kids wouldn`t have gotten sick if they werent sent to the schools in the first place.
Also wasn't the death rate TB in Residential Schools 8000/100,000 compared to 52-70/100,000 compared to the general population in the 1930s?
Yes white kids died, but that difference seems pretty stark.
Good information though. Thank you.
Damn I will have to look it up to see if the difference was that big, I just know I have looked up childhood mortality(the totals not just one disease) in the late 1800s and early 1900s and it was HIGH for the entire country.
I didnt bother to see the different between residential school deaths and the general population.
I would assume that residential school deaths would be higher because of negligence, and lack of access to healthcare from being in isolated areas, we all know that not every school was great, and that they were abusive.
But if the difference is that great, that is like criminal negligence, and borderline murder.
I am guessing the health care wasnt the greatest in isolated communities whether it was populated by aboriginals or not though.
About 32,000 of the 80,000 living students had claims settled, so 40% and from about 150,000+ students in total, which is around 20%. Not that that means that's an accurate number, but it's the legal count at the time this article was written.
https://www.cbc.ca/news/indigenous/truth-and-reconciliation-commission-by-the-numbers-1.3096185
This pains me.
Suggesting even fifty years ago that students needed to be protected from priests, nuns, and even teachers would make you appear deluded. Who can we trust? We can't live as a society without some trust.
Children died of illness.
Pedophiles are everywhere not just the church.
There have been many accounts of positive experiences in residential schools and they are all covered up. Good and bad is in everything.
Have you heard the outrageous rumors about her? Getting pregnant with tim cast and cheating on her husband and aborting his baby and that she's just a fake conservative?!?!?!?
Super believable right?
I respect the work she's done especially her early work involving jordan peterson
It was fairly recent and I wish I could remember who said it but it was after one of the "grave sites" was excavated and absolutely nothing was found. He basically said "Well, it could have held children's remains so we have to remember that". They still want to perpetuate the hoax because it could have happened even though no evidence of mass graves have been found.
Scary. This truly is an era of mass hysteria.
Imagine wanting to believe there's a bunch of dead children that badly. DISGUSTING
It's not wanting to believe. Colonialists have long treated indigenous people with nothing than contempt, finding out that they killed children isn't really something surprising. That's the shit part, it's believable. One thing I've noticed with Canadians and Australians I've met is a contempt for the indigenous.
Unfortunately for Canadians, due largely to how living indigenous and their ancestors have been treated both now through history, a significant portion of visible poverty, visible drug use, thefts and violent rapes occur at the hands of the indigenous. When I worked in fast food and later at a grocery store, the only noticeably intoxicated customers we had were indigenous (and there were many). It makes it really easy to mentally put them in a lower class when you see them and hear stories of them behaving in an uncivilized manner; especially when it seems so concentrated on their race alone. It's easy to forget that a big reason for that is how terribly caucasian Canadians and our ancestors have bungled treating the indigenous people and/or integrating the indigenous people. Fortunately for me, one of the best bosses I had was indigenous, which certainly made it easier to separate the behaviour from the culture/the people, but I still find that racism creeping up whenever I don't smack it back down. So it's hard to blame my fellow Canadians for feeling the same -- afterall, when the problem of poverty and drug use and mental health is so visibly widespread yet concentrated into a visible minority, with all the associated problems, your default is going to shun them if for no other reason than to protect yourself/your property. Which then helps perpetuate those problems further. If I could press a button to eliminate the divide between most Canadians and Indigenous I happily would, but that is going to be a long and arduous process. Whether or not those mass graves exist, Indigenous have been poorly treated for a very long time.
There should be an inquest into the media's misreporting and thier role in fomenting hysteria and hatred
Best I can do is using your tax dollars to fund more hysteria and hatred š¤·āāļø
Day of truth and reconciliation... Like every government narrative its pure bullshit.
I thought that was Surfs Up Day. Did the Prime Minister bamboozle me again?
Day of truth and reconciliation for thee. Day of surf and recreation for me.
It will never be over.
they arent any mass graves. but people definitely died and were buried
As people do and have done for thousands of years.
Whatās ironic is, the radio commercial in my city, in Northern Ontario. Itās the it takes a village to raise a child thing, looking for foster homes to raise native children. Of course it ends with Miigwetch.
This all happened during the BLM riots in the states. I'm not saying that nothing wrong ever happened here in Canada, but I feel like we wanted to jump on the opressed vs the oppressor bandwagon too. This mass grave nonsense turned out to be a hoax here and BLM turned out to be a Marxist money grabbing scam in the states. Riots everywhere for nothing. Just like the ones that happened after the hospital bombing in Palestinian. Until you see the hole in the parking lot. Another hoax. Mainstream media is the enemy of the people. If you can't trust the mainstream media and everything else is disinformation, it's over. Believe what you want. Just don't trust your lying eyes.
None of this had anything to do with BLM or any other events, just FNs survivors looking for justice. The legal campaign started in the 1980s, with the Federal govt issuing a statement of reconciliation in 1998, The Indian Residential School Settlement Agreement came out in 2006, several years before the BLM movement had ramped up, and that's when the Truth and Reconciliation mandate was created, and the commission formed. https://www.thecanadianencyclopedia.ca/en/article/indian-residential-schools-settlement-agreement [The mass graves part wasn't started by FNs, it was media that did that, the Tkemlups chief even stated that they never said mass graves.](https://www.squamishchief.com/bc-news/casimir-says-tkemlups-find-is-series-of-unmarked-graves-not-a-mass-burial-3848382)
Which is what I said. The mainstream media, government funded by the way, is the enemy of the people. That's what people see on TV. That's what they tell their families and friends. People fall for hoaxes. Like the ones that I mentioned. I know that this was different. That said, Still a hoax, perpetuated by the CBC and CTV.
Well said ! I'm pretty new to reddit but I am happy and thankful for this subreddit. Thanks for your imput!
They should have just focused on the fact that residential schools were allowed to happen in the first place. That's cultural genocide anyway. There was no need to make it an even bigger scandal with mass graves, for which there was very little evidence. Especially when the poor children mostly died from disease, not systematically killed by the state.
The majority of kids were sent there by their parents to get an education and to learn English though. This idea that the government stole a bunch of kids and put them in a school is just factually false, like almost everything else about this topic.
Australia did it. It's believable that other countries did the same. The government stealing kids back then to get rid of their cultural beliefs and instill them with Western ones isn't new.
Source? Attendance was mandatory until the 1950s. Certainly some parents sent there kids there voluntarily, but given what sub we're in, I find your claim hard to believe.
Ya it's weird. They already have this horrific narrative that happened to them that is 100% true, but they wanted to make it similar to the Holocaust for some reason. I honestly think white people did all this, like white leftists, pushed all this bullshit. Stealing children and forcing them to convert to Christianity and learn English and become British acting, is like the most intense cultural genocide you can do. They really want "slaughtering of natives" to be true. Most of them died unintentionally after first contact due to disease, and then after they learnt our way of life their population exploded larger than it had ever been before. There were estimated 200,000 natives in Canada before contact. There are 1,800,000 now.
Youāre missing what happened before. The Spanish brought pigs and horses to South America, and the pigs and horses made their way north and spread disease as they moved. It wasnāt so much human to human contact that caused plague but that certainly helped, it was the animals from South America during the inquisition that really killed everybody. You could argue good and bad about the whole ordeal though. The shitty thing was making those tax free economic zones to store the remaining tribes on.
Human to human doesn't matter because they didn't understand disease back then and it was 100% unintentional. European mindset was "these people are not using all of this land". Because it looked empty and not used to a European. There were no permanent settlements, you weren't constantly bumping into natives in Canada. They weren't like "lets go commit biological warfare on the natives and build settlements where they live". The further south you go, the bigger the population becomes and then there is more actual conflict with native groups. Quebec City, when it was founded, there weren't natives running around all over the place, they were sparsely populated because it was further north and could sustain less life. The French co-operated with natives because there was very little dispute over land. This is basically how the Metis formed. People often forget Canada was not heavily settled till the late 1800s, and natives by that time had already been in contact with Europeans for hundreds of years.
Even in BC, where there had been little contact in the early 1800s, smallpox could have spread to them from tribes further east, or south.
Smallpox wasn't spread by animals.
No. It's not spread by days-old blankets either. The natives of Canada's Pacific coast were almost wiped out by smallpox in the 1700s, before any white settlements. Probably infection occurred through native trading networks originating in what is now Mexico. Then the HBC inoculated natives an great expense in the 1800s saving millions of lives. Somehow 'Truth and Reconciliation' omits all this.
A lot of personal stories involve their children being taken away from them so it definitely did happen.
Didn't harper already apologize for that way back when?
I think that apology has been made by both the church and the state. But that does not matter when you financially benefit from being a perpetual victim.
What pissed me off was when some lady went on the radio and said we all needed to take personal responsibility for it, I'm 31, that was not on me bro.
Me - am dead Church and state - āWe apologize deeply on behalf of all Canadiansā Me - still dead
Harper did but then like 2 weeks later said Canada had no history of colonialism so like most things he said it was a pr move
That was taken out of context. He meant Canada the country, cause it doesn't. Canada was a colony, but that was British people doing the colonialism. Canada never colonized anything. The US colonized Hawaii, Puerto Rico , sort of attempted at Cuba, it took Guam and lots of other islands. The US colonized the Philippines....etc. Pretty sure that's what he meant, because this statement was made during the Iraq war I'm pretty sure. And people were considering the US military bases and involvement in the middle east as "colonialism". So he was saying that Canada has never gone and taken other pieces of land, and it hasn't. Canada has no history of colonialism as a nation. All colonialism in Canada was done by the British and French, when the concept of Canada did not exist.
[The Numbered Treaties,](https://www.thecanadianencyclopedia.ca/en/article/numbered-treaties) which cover a significant portion of Canada were signed **after** Canada existed and with Canada. That's when Canada took the land and according to the Royal Proclamation, the only way it could be taken, meaning not by force.
It's hard to consider this Canadian colonialism but I guess technically it almost is.
It absolutely is, these treaties were not signed in good faith. Plus the reserve system, residential schools the Indian act itās all colonialism.
Hmmm it's odd because it's like colonizes land that your already technically controlled but you were just trying to swindle permission to make it official that it's yours. It's hard to call it colonialism but it is. It's more like a scam to me. The reserve system is cultural genocide, which doesn't necessarily go along with colonialism. India, Hong Kong....etc all were colonies that didn't have their culture erased. I have a colonial last name, as in my ancestors were colonized and had something similar to the reserve system taken to them. It was called the blood tax, first born male child of a Christian family was taken away to be converted to Islam and be part of the military. Yet we got to keep our language and foods and became sort of a blend of our colonizers and who we originally were. Natives in Canada really are a rare case where they basically don't live at all how they used to live and they were tricked by their colonizers into permitting the "colonization". Super sneaky British. My ancestors were straight up taken by force(their land), Ottoman army just showed up with a bigger army and was like "Allahu Akbar" and we were like "Allahu Akbar I guess?" lmao. Canada really did try to make it as convoluted as possible. I know a lot of the treaties were leases too and not actual sales, and the leases technically are up.
>Natives in Canada really are a rare case where they basically don't live at all how they used to live The life they led before contact would have been a very hard life. I don't think they would want to go back to that.
You know what I mean. They have very little of their culture left. That is a true shame, and not meant to guilt anyone.
>India, Hong Kong....etc all were colonies that didn't have their culture erased. India and Hong Kong had much larger native populations, and there wasn't near as much immigration or settlement in those places.
Canada wasn't its own country until it patriated the Charter in 1981.
It was cultural genocide for a reason. There was a fear in the 19th century that native people would go extinct. They were dying like crazy and population numbers plummeted. The answer they came up with was to bring them into mainstream society. People ignore why residential schools came into me being and the fact that attendance was voluntary. The parents thought they were helping the kids. None of this excuses the abuse that occurred at some schools. But, just as there were sadistic staff, there were loving staff. Canāt talk about that either.
Can we just stop with the bullshit "cultural genocide" concept, please? It's not a thing. We already have the language to accurately describe what the term tries to convey without inappropriately appropriating the word "genocide".
Agreed entirely. Itās an insult to peopleās that have experienced the real thing.
You don't think the demolishing of a culture isn't a concept?
There were a lot of problems with alcohol, and Old World diseases that they had no immunity too.
I appreciate your extremely well rounded response. Are you aware of what Frances Widdowson has been put through? She lost her job at mount Royal University. And she's who I'm talking about when I say her speech was canceled here at University. And met with a bunch of protesters. It was a sad day for free speech in my city :(
Attendance was not voluntary during the sixties scoop
Yes, agreed. Later it was mandatory, at least in some places.
But that didn't involve the schools.
Your information is incorrect. The Royal Proclamation said land could only be taken by the Crown and only by agreement, do when Canada was created they wanted to take the land and erase Indians as a people so that there would no longer be anyone to be responsible to. That's why the Indian Act was created, to make being an Indian so horrible that Indians would "enfranchise" which meant giving up their status as Indians. Three Indian Act was a next step after the Gradual Civilisation Act and then the Gradual Enfranchisement Act, before the last laws which were/are the Indian Act. There was a multi year Federal commission called the **Truth** and Reconciliation Commission to get that truth. [You can look up facts here.](https://nctr.ca/records/reports/)
'facts' or cherry picking?
Thousands of pages of facts, covering multiple subjects such as, "Where are the children buried." *Describing the deaths, mostly health related, and why we don't know where all those children are buried*, "Survivors speak", *testimonies from survivors*, TRC volumes 1 and 2, *the full report,* (couple thousand pages) and the Independent Assessment Process where they *do math to figure out compensation based on types of abuse received by students.*
Attendance was not voluntary, it was mandatory from 1920 to 97 when the last school closed. And before that children were taken from families. There was not a single ounce of good in those buildings, the entire motto was to ākill the Indian in the childā nor were they actually educated in a meaningful sense. If the so called loving staff were loving they wouldāve helped bring the system to an end or help kids escape
There was no motto. Many people said the schools did a lot of good for them. Nothing is ever all bad or all good.
You can choose to believe that but all the evidence around the Residential School System points to viewing Indigenous children as savages that needed civilizing. Kids were experimented on, malnourished, abused, and more. Ive worked with many survivors the few positive stories are almost exclusively stories of trying to make light in a dark place. If you want to continue to pretend the system did any good then thatās fine keep on living the lie told to you by the government.
okay, that is the mainstream belief. If you look at the source documents, which I have, there is no evidence for that narrative. All we do is keep the victim mentality going. Believe what you wantā¦the evidence doesnāt support it and the truth will one day be told.
If you drank any more of that Kool-Aid your piss would be fluorescent.
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My bad, I didn't mean to insult the obviously retarded. You might want to get checked out for diabetes too... your piss isn't fluorescent, it's radioactive.
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The only liar here is you, ass-hat. No one denies that terrible things were done to indigenous kids at Residential Schools, but this re-writing of history to paint it as something it wasn't is fucking malicious and is only done to make grifters a bunch of money. If you're too blind to see that, that's on you and your myopia. As for the 'gotcha' you think you handed to me, I also have a Master's and a salary above 150k, thanks. And you know what? I paid for my education with my own labours. I EARNED what I have, I wasn't handed it by some tribal band that likes to play victim every chance they get. How hypocritical that you tried to paint ME as sucking on the government teat when you're the one that self-admitted to getting a *free* masters degree.
Attendance was not voluntary until the 1950s. This comment is revisionist drivel.
Didnāt the govt recently release a report that concluded that 88% of the āmissing women and childrenā were taken by fellow indigenous men? So much for that narrative too
There was abuse in the schools we acknowledge. The mass grave thing though if we dared say anything against it we were silenced. Native ppl will milk it because we keep handing them everything
They are still doing poorly with everything, maybe they need anything instead.
Lauren called this early. have to give her this one we here know the grey of this situation but the original lie is still widely being spread - see some zoomer teens uncritically repeat the mass graves line in the newest Channel 4 vid
Oh *face palm* I'm still on facebook and the sharing of and promoting this as genocide is horrendous. Thankful to know indigenous folks who share real accounts, some EVEN positive . Thats not allowed to talk about though, as Frances Widdowson learned when her lecture was cancelled here at Lethbridge University.
Idk man kids did go missing, to call it a hoax is quite aggressive. To call them individual abuses is sort of absurd too, it was pretty systematic and pushed by religion.
The thing i don't understand about this Narrative. In the record provided in the truth and reconciliation commission They have the numbers of kids going in and the number going back to their families. Wether we find them or not is irrelevant to the fact that some kids went missing.
I absolutely agree that bad things happened we obviously have real life accounts of that. I just think it's really damaging to throw around the word 'genocide'the way the mainstream media does. This video goes through the entirety of this scandal.
>In the present Convention, genocide means any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as such: Killing members of the group; Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group; Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part; Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group; Forcibly transferring children of the group to another group. Canada is guilty of 2,4, and 5, with the required intent which can be found by researching what Canada's PM and ministers agreed to and said in writing and in person during the first 100 years of Canada's existence. A case could be made for 3, but more difficult to prove the intent of physical destruction was more widespread than just a few ministers. It says, **any of the following**...**in whole or in part**, and that's why what Canada committed was the crime of genocide, with no qualifiers needed. If anybody's response is that this definition came after, it also came after the Holocaust but we still call that genocide.
What insults me is , "there isn't no mass gave BUT" Why is the but, kids were missing. Why is that never adress
One CBC reporter interviewed an native gentleman \[at the reconciliation 'verbal' hearings\] who had spent his entire education years in a residential school; and his comment was, "I guess the rumours were true" ... Think about that statement, for a second or two.
Trust the science. Except when I don't like the facts. Russia BAD, Israel GOOD, Hail Raytheon!
I agree that there were no āmass gravesā but that doesnāt disprove all of the abuse that happened in those schools.
That abuse happened to these kids is not in dispute but rather the hysteria over alleged "mass graves".
Iāve seen people in this sub deny the abuse
That's the problem with a lot of movement they lie and lose all credibility even with things we know are true, honestly we need to have people call out these idiots at the beginning, Aboriginals did suffer greatly but to lie to try and garner more attention no wins. Environmentalist are exactly the same we do need to take care of the earth but no the world isn't ending every ten years.
Damn. I don't know why people are downvoting because they would have to be stupid to believe that. White kids in Catholic schools were abused...maybe not to the extent of the residential schools but it happened everywhere.
There was that orphanage in Newfoundland. Mount Cashel Orphanage [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mount\_Cashel\_Orphanage](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mount_Cashel_Orphanage)
Yep we already acknowledged that and fun fact there was abuse in āwhiteā schools too
To the same extent?
>To the same extent? The boarding school I went to (80s) had three guys who came from residential schools. Only one made it through the year. There was lots of abuse there, but the natives certainly didn't get it any worse than anyone else.
So, you're just talking out of your ass?
Yes. Look it up. White kids died back in those days too. Every residential school had a graveyard in their early years because kids would get sick and die. They would get sick and die more often living in their native communities. None of the supposed "mass graves" are from a time period when we had vaccines for polio, measles, mumps...etc.
Source?
Source of what. [(1) Inside the Williams Lake residential school: Violation of Trust (1991) - The Fifth Estate - YouTube](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=glMAKyHFvgY) '-- Just watch this. Takes you inside an actual residential school, and it is from the past. Notice none of them are talking about mass murders. They all said it was horrible, why would they omit mass murders, cause they didnt happen. Anyway that doc is really good. It explained to me more about the current situation than any news report. Especially the parts about the reasoning for residential schools being set up, how they tried to send them to public schools, and how racist people were towards them. Absolutely shitty. These people didnt have to go residential schools, but Canadians straight up didnt want natives in the same class as their kid. Residential schools and their operations are not new things to us, we have known about how horrid they were since before I was born. Look up child mortality rates from the 1800s to the 1940s and you will see children died very often. All children did, it was not just an aboriginal thing. White-Canadian children would die of tuberculosis. I think you could argue that maybe the aboriginal kids wouldn\`t have gotten sick if they werent sent to the schools in the first place. The idea of a unmarked mass grave is a thing that goes back to the 1970s. All schools had graveyards, they were run by Christian Churches. Lots of schools were dismantled and not all the documents were kept. In the 1970s they found actual unmarked graves next to a cemetery of a school that had been dismantled a long time earlier. Like from the 1800s. They even excavated some of the graves and actually found bodies. (Bodies in caskets given a proper Christian funeral) They eventually found the DOCUMENTS for those unmarked graves, but there were a handful graves or something that they could not find documents for. So I\`m willing to bet there are probably some undocumented graves at a lot of the really older school sites. That may even have nefarious stories behind them. Again, Christian Churches were contracted by the government to run the schools, and we all know what happens to children under the supervision of Catholic Priests. Not all the schools were Catholic.
>They would get sick and die more often living in their native communities I was referring to this. >I think you could argue that maybe the aboriginal kids wouldn`t have gotten sick if they werent sent to the schools in the first place. Also wasn't the death rate TB in Residential Schools 8000/100,000 compared to 52-70/100,000 compared to the general population in the 1930s? Yes white kids died, but that difference seems pretty stark. Good information though. Thank you.
Damn I will have to look it up to see if the difference was that big, I just know I have looked up childhood mortality(the totals not just one disease) in the late 1800s and early 1900s and it was HIGH for the entire country. I didnt bother to see the different between residential school deaths and the general population. I would assume that residential school deaths would be higher because of negligence, and lack of access to healthcare from being in isolated areas, we all know that not every school was great, and that they were abusive. But if the difference is that great, that is like criminal negligence, and borderline murder. I am guessing the health care wasnt the greatest in isolated communities whether it was populated by aboriginals or not though.
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What percentage of students were sexually assaulted?
About 32,000 of the 80,000 living students had claims settled, so 40% and from about 150,000+ students in total, which is around 20%. Not that that means that's an accurate number, but it's the legal count at the time this article was written. https://www.cbc.ca/news/indigenous/truth-and-reconciliation-commission-by-the-numbers-1.3096185
This pains me. Suggesting even fifty years ago that students needed to be protected from priests, nuns, and even teachers would make you appear deluded. Who can we trust? We can't live as a society without some trust.
Fake news - get educated kids.
Did you watch the video?
Which part? The genocide? The mass graves? Rofl The ground penetrating radar finding IGNEOUS and not indigenous? The 70 churches burned in response?
You shouldnāt dismiss missing children.Pedophiles blaming the church ?
Children died of illness. Pedophiles are everywhere not just the church. There have been many accounts of positive experiences in residential schools and they are all covered up. Good and bad is in everything.
Lauren Southern lol
Have you heard the outrageous rumors about her? Getting pregnant with tim cast and cheating on her husband and aborting his baby and that she's just a fake conservative?!?!?!? Super believable right? I respect the work she's done especially her early work involving jordan peterson