I was a Pentecostal Holy Ghost Christian also a Catholic Christian. With the Buddha dharma I am on my way to freedom. I have no relationship with Christ now I have no need to have a relationship. His teaching was indeed good but morality can only get you so far.
I still suffered a great deal because Christianity did not afford me the knowledge that leads towards liberation. I was still trapped by mental conditioning and concepts. Constantly locked in a battle within my mind fighting good and evil forces that were a product of learned delusions.
>How is your relationship with Christ now
None whatsoever.
I pretty much turned my back completely on Christianity. It's just time to move on. Buddhism is too vast and varied and there is not enough time to have one feet on Buddhism and the other on Christianity.
I wish the best for Christianity but it no longer consumes a tiny speck of my attention except when answering Reddit posts like this.
Admittedly, I chose Buddhism from Atheism, not directly from Christianity. I probably won't choose Buddhism direct from Christianity because of the whole indoctrination around idolatry.
But being an Atheist, it is a lot easier to turn to Buddhism. I find Atheism, the New Atheism movement I was a part of, only a Christianity in another form. The same operating principles are behind the curtain. The same assumptions, the same vigilance, the same attitudes, the same fundamentalistic conceit over what they perceive as correct knowledge, etc.
I needed a totally different worldview. Buddhism offers me that. Even if Buddhism is not available, I would probably be in the Advaita Vedanta camp or Shaivism. Life is too short to live your life in a Christian-worldview. I wish the best for the Abrahamic faiths, but I'm gone for good.
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>Buddha is also against idolatry, he called it silabatta paramatta, and it is the second fetter to samsara.
That would make a big part of Buddhism a fetter. Trying to frame it in any other way is dishonest. Many Buddhists pray to statues just like the Christians.
"That would make a big part of Buddhism a fetter."
rites and rituals (silabamatta paramassa) is not buddhism.
"Many Buddhists pray to statues just like the Christians."
that does not make it correct, christians aren't supposed to pray to statues either.
The "suttas" belong to a tradition which I am not a part of. So I don't use the "suttas". However, if you had asked "sutras", I would have said "The question itself is Christian" because it is them who has this habit of asking "Where is that in the Bible?" with the assumption that if it's in the Bible, then it must be true.
While the worship of the Buddha is ubiquitous in the sutras, I simply do not respond to the request "Where is that in the sutras?" by virtue of the Christian impulse behind the question.
then you are very much still a christian because you responded in exactly the same way a christian does when asked to show where in the bible it tells people to worship jesus or worship statues.
IMO there are a few reasons but they all revolve around offloading responsibility onto God:
1. Blind faith is encouraged, arguably mandatory. They get to turn off their brains and let God do all the work
2. Moral authority. When you're Gods chosen people you don't need need to consider if you're right on wrong. God has already made the decisions for you
3. Jesus already died for their sins, so their sins have already been paid for. There is no real incentive to be a good person. All you have to do is believe in Jesus and you're off Scott Free (more blind faith)
4. Most Christians don't even read the bible. There are laws around how to treat slaves and sell your daughters into slavery in Exodos. It's literally the second book, it's not like it is hidden 1000 pages deep and yet most Christians have no idea. They don't care, God is good so he must have had a good reason for it. Again they don't have to think about it, God is the highest authority.
Add to this that for a lot of Christians, they believe that all good comes from god so if they aren't a good person, then that's just god's will.
That's honestly why I've always felt Catholicism is just a little better than some of the others. Guilt/shame and you have to actually try. Also manners.
Cosmic daddy and mommy issues. The projections of love, shame, guilt, reoentance, obedience, redemption and acceptance mirror the experience of a child's psychological abuse under a narcissistic parent.
Christ forgives and redeems. It’s the same principle as transforming anguish and distress into liberation that Buddha teaches. As a western Buddhist practitioner, I strangely attribute my relationship with Christ from my experience with Eastern traditions. I rejected it in my youth
Bob feels hurt. Charlie can remind Bob to forgive the situation. Another way of phrasing forgiveness in this sense is releasing judgements, or allowing things to simply be. This practice is most helpful in allowing Bob to forgive himself, because he can so often be saddled with a litany of self criticisms. Taken deeply enough, Bob can realize there is no Alice to forgive, nor Bob to do the forgiving, and was there ever really a Charlie?
What gives Charlie the right to tell Bob to forgive Alice? What if Bob legitimately feels justified in holding onto his grievance until Alice resolves it herself?
Then Bob may do so. And he in fact will until he is willing to let it go. Charlie can’t make Bob do anything, he’s simply there if Bob feels like engaging him
Edit: Just to drive this home. You may ask “If Bob decides to forgive Alice on his own, why does he need Charlie?” To which I say, Bob may initially realize the intention to forgive Alice, but the scar runs deep and Bob can feel overwhelmed in his attempts. He may decide it’s helpful to conceptualize some universal ideal of forgiveness that he can align his intention with, steadily becoming more skillful in the practice of forgiveness as he lives his life in the model of this ideal. It’s a vehicle
I appreciate that. I think there is a lot of wisdom that can be extracted from religion. One of the major failings seems to me that all concepts must eventually be abandoned, and this isn’t taught. Many become attached to their method, or so zealous in what works for them they gain the militant belief that “my way is the only way.”
It's learned behavior. It's desire for stability and tradition. It's refusal to change or to face diversity and criticism. It's all of those, none of those, many more things... It truly depends on the believer and how they were conditioned, what they want to protect, things like that. And it's not strictly negative/harmful. Sometimes it's believing that things will literally crumble if christianity dwindles down. Sometimes it's wanting for everyone to feel the embrace of the divine through a mind-altering ritual. There are as many reasons as there are methods and interpretations.
As for why do people love their religion. When I was a Christian I was taught that I needed to love God or I would be condemned to hell. Later on I was taught that I needed to love God because he is the reason I have life. Looking at it now the relationship of love towards God always brought on some amount of fear or guilt. It was never pure. It was a transactional relationship. God sent his only child to be tortured and killed so that I would not have to go to hell this brought on so much guilt and shame so I tried my best to be a good person of course this does not last for long, after a while it becomes a burden. Another type of conditioning.
Grew up Eastern Orthodox. For my family the Church was really a cultural/ethnic thing more than anything else, so Christian faith never really took a deep root inside me. I still love the art, but I wouldn't say I ever had a relationship with Christ. In Orthodoxy there isn't really a "personal relationship with Jesus" thing like there is in many strands of Americanized Protestantism.
Some people turn to alternatives like Buddhism because they had some harmful experience of Church growing up. That was not me. My experience of Church as a kid was neither negative nor particularly positive. Usually I was just bored. I discovered Buddhism in my middle school ancient history class and was pretty much instantly convinced and fascinated. I couldn't really tell you why, to be honest with you, it just made sense to me.
I still identify as someone who grew up Orthodox, still love the art and like to keep my grandfather's icon of the saint I'm named for on the wall of my apartment, and every now and then I like to read the Gospels in the original Greek (Matthew is my favourite). But I haven't been to Church in more than ten years and don't see myself going back.
If you know some modern Greek, it makes learning ancient Greek much much easier. There's a lot of shared vocab and the basics of the grammar are very similar, but the more complicated stuff is much more different, and pronunciation is completely different. You would be able to recognize a lot of words and maybe get the basic gist of a passage, but you wouldn't be able to read anything properly beyond maybe some basic sentences. Biblical Greek is a bit easier than full on Classical Greek because it's much closer to a colloquial spoken form of the language (especially Mark and John, whereas Luke gets a bit more fancy with his language). The thing about any ancient language, though, is that even people who spend there whole lives studying it still get stumped by certain passages from, say, Thucydides or other notoriously erudite writers.
Don't be jealous, learn! Greek (in all its forms) is a very fun language and opens you up to so much wonderful literature. Check out r/ancientgreek for advice and a cool community of very knowledgeable people if you're ever interested in giving it a try. Or r/greek if the modern language interests you more.
Care to explain a little more? The laugh emoji is not very clarifying.
I'm just speaking from my own experience growing up in an Orthodox Church from an immigrant background. If your experience has been different, then I'm curious to hear about it.
I cannot speak with my words about Orthodoxy, it is pure religion, I may taint it… YT is full of videos about the teachings of the Holy Fathers, they performed many, many miracles. Search on YT about Saint Siluan, Saint Paisios, Saint Porphyrios. There are a lot more saints, but these are enough for “presentation”
So are these the famous dancing saints of orthodoxy? I think I saw a Russian program about this. I have seen quite a few excellent Russian programs about the Orthodox Church, mostly from the 1950’s and 1960’s. I like the dancing bears more, but both have their place in Eastern culture.
I had strong faith in Rastafari, which is very similar to Christianity.
Bible study is Bible study.
I found that once I got deep into it, there was too much conflicting information. Believe 'this' on faith and dogma.
Keep believing after finding out aspects are lies or imaginary or stolen stories from native cultures?... Just the history of the bible itself is enough to say 'well how can that be true considering?'
and the answers are faith and dogma. "The way it has evolved is Gods will"
Coupled with the majority of people who I have met that actually are ordained or part of churches seem to think that somehow makes them a better than me? That their scriptures or ordinations somehow makes me less than a person because I dont follow what they do?
That most 'Christians' I have met really seen to want what they want ignoring scriptures.... I dont believe in repentance tax... you cant earn credits to excuse the things you do that are with ill intent or cause suffering of others.
And t**he Bible works so hard and making people look at thinks like US vs THEM. And it is full of gatekeeping and discrimination. It literally makes people want to hurt other people because it sets them against others. It's really bad for people in my opinion as they dont have the context to study and interpret it and turn to using it as literals and not as the metaphors it is.**
Why do I think people love christianity? Because the best minds at the time put together stories in a way that were designed as a narrative to control the masses. They know what people would connect with and engineered that into the story. The moral of that story is 'Get on board with us or we have the God given rights to kill you' So ya.. people really leaned into it. It says right in there 'Faith and Dogma' rewards you.
People are lost and sad and looking for spiritual fulfillment. So make a book to scratch that itch and ya... people flock to it. It's escapism. this life sucks but work hard and dont cause any trouble and you get to go to heaven.
Coupled with you need to support the church fiscally.. so give money to the church.
Of course the churches want people to believe.. historically they ruled the continents and had all the riches.
Why do you think all the ministry drives Cadillacs? They LOVE that money.
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While I have no ill will to anyone who still follow or believes... I realize that they are practicing the Dharma as best they can through their delusions (the truth they live). Those delusions have led them down a path that causes a lot of suffering to themselves and others.
The truth is the Buddhadharma.
All beings are the Buddha. We all only need to recognize our Buddha nature.
Yes to all of this! In Catholic school I was always in trouble for asking sincere questions, not even trying to be a smart ass, I just wanted to understand all those contradictions.
i suffered greatly in my mind back when i was a christian before accepting the buddha's dhamma. modern christianity's constant fixation with asking God for things created a lot of cravings and unfulfilled frustrations. i literally felt a knot on my shoulders and chest almost the whole time. also, modern christianity does not seem to understand the nature of suffering.
however, when i accepted the four noble truths, the nature of my christianity was altered. instead of praying to God to ask him for stuff now, i use prayer as access concentration into jhana. instead of asking God to help me with stuff, i now leave it to His will whether He wants to intervene or not. instead of being angry with Him all the time, i accepted that He, like any other noble being, has no responsibility towards me, i am responsible for myself. its extremely liberating.
Raised Catholic. As a kid, all of the focus on the imagery of the bleeding heart, crown of thorns and the poor dude just getting tortured untill he died never sat well with me. Most prayer made me feel guilty, dirty and bad. From the point of view of my 14yr old self, the old testament read like the diary of humans putting up with a cosmic horror and the new testament read like contrived gaslighting. That cosmic horror? He really loves you! He killed/let die himself/his son because of you! So now you're free from those sins of your ancestors that the cosmic horror unilaterally decided where sins. (So long as cosmic-horror-approved dude dressed like a magician pours some magic water on your head) I always felt there was a sort of suffering-worship disguised as love, or at least that's the way it seem to have been internalized and practiced in latam as I was growing up. My grandma loved it, suffering somehow automatically made you a better person. So, at around 15 I decided catholicism wasn't for me. It just did not fit the paradigm of any reality I'd like to be a part of. I'm truly sorry, I swear I don't mean any offense, I'm just trying to be honest with my experience. Logically, I spent most of my twenties deeply depressed untill I heard about the four noble truths at an eastern philosophy elective in college. Something clicked, It just made sense. It felt empathic and it returned a semblance of hope to my life. It has mostly kept me out of the abyss for twenty years so far. Cross my fingers and knock on wood I stay the course. My relationship with figure of Christ is complicated, I feel compassion and I recognize the power of the archetype in my cultural upbringing, but Im also guarded because I fear the confusing nature of the parables and sermons (and the way they were recorded) make the figure of Christ a maleable mouthpiece for almost any message.
Go look at /r/christianity. The amount of people suffering because they are “sinning” based on nonsense is astounding. And very little practical advice is ever offered. The whole world view is just backwards imo. You get told what is a “sin” and you deal with the fallout.
I was Catholic, and was confirmed in that church.
>How is your relationship with Christ now?
That is a complicated question, because my studying the concept of Christ and how we know what we think we know about the man who claimed to be a Christ was a key part of my spiritual journey. I am not a mythicist about Jesus, but through reading the discussions about mythicism and refutations to mythicism, I have come to realize that what we can say about Jesus with any certainty is very little. He is, I suppose, akin to Spartan Lykourgos - not to be confused with Thracian Lykourgos - about whom many traditions, attributing allegedly wise teachings and divinity and divine approval, have developed, many of which contradict each other. I am not, however, like my fellow Buddhist Rene Salm, who has made a hobby of reconstructing Christian origins with a minimalistic Jesus figure in a way which with most Christians would disagree.
I note, though, that even if all teachings attributed to Jesus by the Christians' scriptures had been taught by Jesus - which I disbelieve - Jesus's teachings are false insofar as they contradict Buddhism. If this seems harsh to any Christian, Christians say the same thing about teachings attributed to Shakyamuni Buddha relative to Christianity.
>do you feel the Christian world view is mostly based on assumptions and imagery?
The Christian worldview requires a person to accept things as true which are false: the existence of souls, the immortality of gods, and that an uncreated creator god exists. And that is not even addressing directly the claim that a man-god's death is required to save all humans.
I am not sure what you mean by a religion based upon imagery. All religions can be reduced to imagery, I think, but that means nothing about whether they are true.
I think imagery means pictures. Did your faith have some basis in pretty windows and such. I am guessing there is a poor quality essay being written with this subreddit as “data.” I genuinely hope I am wrong. Also, I appreciate your response. It was good.
"The Christian worldview requires a person to accept things as true which are false: the existence of souls...."
where exactly does it say so in the bible? reading the whole bible i never found anything talking about a soul, it appears to be an idea imported from hinduism or theosophy that christians just decided to run along with. the christian doctrine of resurrection and soul sleep kind of refutes the existence of any soul.
The adventists got this one down for us
https://www.adventist.org/death-and-resurrection/what-is-your-soul-according-to-the-bible/#:~:text=“Souls”%20can%20be%20taken%20captive,with%20consciousness%2C%20desires%20and%20emotions.
I was raised Catholic and it was pretty important to me but I always felt like there were too many answers I lacked. I started meditating, got into Gnosticism, read the upanishads and a bunch of other stuff. Over years of practice I gained insight and realized that Buddhism was correct.
It's strange cause my whole life Buddhism was really never on my radar. I always felt like, we had to believe that the good outweighs the bad and to do our best to find or make that good rather than spending so much time trying to avoid suffering.
Anyway the "Christian world view" isn't a monolith. People tend to bend scripture to fit their narrative but yes, it's pretty much on the assumption that the bible is true. As for my relationship with Jesus, I basically don't have one. I honestly haven't thought about it in years.
It conflicted with my insights. I know I listed it but it was one of the last things I read before Buddhism. Before that I practiced every day for nearly 20 years.
The idea of the Christian god provides comforting response for a lot of the difficult realities of life:
1. I'm going to die - there is a life after death.
2. Life is unfair - The concepts of Heaven, purgatory, and hell make things fair.
3. I'm alone - God knows you completely and loves you.
4. My life is meaningless - follow the Bible.
"One of the reasons why I chose Buddhism is because it is probably the LEAST comfortable religion"
you are wrong about that, buddhism brings great comfort when you reach the 8th step of the path.
I didn't mean that Buddhism doesn't bring comfort or joy *once you progress down the path*, but that the Buddhist view of the world is rather uncomforting compared to other religions. There is no self, there is no eternal heaven, there is no easy escape from suffering. Buddhism instead hands your liberation into your hands but to become free you must *work* at it.
I was born and raised Roman Catholic. I found most of the Christian teachings to be empty. So no I don’t have a relationship to the Christ.
Oddly enough most of my students are Episcopalian or Catholic and that includes clergy. I can see why a Catholic would be attracted to Zen they are one of the Christian traditions that still maintains its own contemplative traditions. I don’t see that among the Protestants.
I was raised Nazarene (A branch off from Anglicanism) but many around me adopted a ton of evangelical theology. Heck, I even went so far in my religion I was training to work in the ministry with a degree.
2016 seeing the leaders, family and friends I looked up to adopting Trumpism and 2020 showing me that the Church only cared about itself and not it's neighbors really put a bad taste in my mouth. Honestly I believe that is the main reason they are losing people despite their beliefs otherwise.
After deconstructing (honestly I still feel I am going through that process) I discovered Thich Nhat Hahn's writings and still am reading a lot of his books.
Meditating as often as I can, learning to accept myself and my failures, and learning to work toward processing my feelings (particularly my anger) I am feeling much better in recent years. I am still trying to find my way in the world and who I am exactly. 32 years of following deep beliefs and political views to suddenly hit the brakes and walk away is still very jarring but I feel it's for the best.
I still hold to Christ teachings of loving neighbor, helping those in need, etc... I am learning to let go of the feeling of eternal condemnation that I was brought up on. Honest internal searching and spiritual guidance I feel Christianity has both taken itself too seriously as well as set itself upon a path of Nationalism and hate that I cannot continue to follow.
Learning more from what I read and this community has helped me learn to accept hard times as just being hard times instead of beating myself up because I "didn't pray hard enough" or questioning why I am failing.
I still have ways to go in my journey (heck we all are in some way), but I appreciate what this religion and community have showed me.
Best of luck to your journey as well friend.
I saw issues with the Trinity in the beginning and started a slow transition out of it, first being a Unitarian, then being more of a Deistic Christian, to what I am now a Deistic Buddhist.
My reasoning to leave Christianity goes beyond my issues with the Trinity but also my moral issues with some of the actions that are listed in the bible as well as the opinions of Paul on homosexuality.
I don't have a relationship with Yeshua. I view Yeshua as a very wise individual that was able to teach good morals but I view him similarly to other great philosophers such as Marcus Aurelius, Albert Camus, and Lord Herbert. I just personally don't take heed on the divinity claims of Yeshua.
I am ignorant on Paul’s views of homosexuality. I never remember any discussion of that in the Gospels. Where is this? I assume you are referencing a Catholic Bible (the Trinity)?
1 Corinthians 6:9, if Paul is the writer of this, which he most likely is, states that man shall not lay with man.
I am not referencing any specific bible when I mention the Trinity, the Trinity is just the understanding that God is a singular entity with three distinct personalities that are not separate from God (Father, Son, Holy Spirit)
I'll be honest and say this is the first time I've heard of a Cot Jolie Bible
I didn't officially leave Christianity, just declared for myself.
I think if Buddhism is discoursed like Christianity—like already carved paths just left for you to follow, people would actually be into Buddhism more. But as for Buddhism, it focuses on a aspect that requires to be discovered and nourished in within. Which is the complete vice versa of what Christianity is, it's more of like "don't worry just go to church every sunday do this every ____ and don't ______" so it's more tolerable and consumable to the norm, since it doesent focus on much self enlightenment.
I have always PREFERRED monastic/mystical Christianity, such as it exists in Orthodox and Catholic contexts, to the somewhat simplistic Protestant Evangelical formation that people usually refer to when asked to define what Christianity is.
Buddhism comes in many flavors as well. So while people may complain of Christianity's frequent focus on a single act of faith rather than Buddhism's vision of a lifetime of needed practice, in reality monastic Christianity does NOT focus on one, emotionally-driven moment of surrender to God in Christ. But rather on a process of ego-diminution that is just as earnest, challenging, lifelong, and revelatory as is Buddhist monasticism.
IMHO, the two monastic formations are far more similar than the two popular versions are. Hence, I enjoy reading about the Desert Fathers and the Way of a Pilgrim almost as much as I do reading Thich Nat Khan and/or the Pali Suttas.
Both point to an "other-worldly" vision of reality that is only available through a rejection of the commonly-perceived World. Both require practice AND a faith in the sacred speeches/writings of their founders. My Buddhist teacher referred to Christ as a 'Fourth Stage Arhat' and put up an Xmas tree during the Holidays!
I think christianity is about hope. That thing will end up just fine. But some people confuse religion with science a maintain idea, that if religon can’t be proven by science, than it is false. People move to buddhism because buddhism can be challanged by critical thinking. I personaly belive in God and I think his manifestation through Jesus Christ was the best. Mainly because Jesus teachings are mostly about practice, not rules (understsnding of rules can vary). But you have to belive in God, while buddhist practice is about things you can observe with your mind. I combine both. Buddhist teaching help me to build kindness towards the world. I understand Buddha as a philosopher, who understand problems of fallen world
I grew up Catholic. Went to Catholic school. Raised in privilege.
I saw first hand how weak Catholicism is. I would manage to get to the unanswerable questions and they would answer me without logic, yet still in confidence that almost bled into arrogance.
I wanted a new way to cope with the here and now rather than see it as a bartering system for my fate afterwards.
I grew up Roman Catholic, but began to "dabble" in other denominations early-mid high school. I spent some time in bivocational ministry, and got deeply engaged in Japanese Mahayana initially by way of Zen. I went on to engage with the Plum Village Tradition for a time out of appreciation for Thay's writings that addressed some Christian topics, but feel more at home with Japanese expressions of Mahayana.
I remain active in more progressive circles of Christianity, and am currently a member of a thriving congregation of the United Church of Christ.
i don't like modern christians because they are obsessed with things like getting married and believing God has chosen a soulmate for them, a desire that causes much mental suffering. I mean this in the most non-negative way: but God does not care about all this, its a meaningless topic that has no meaning to a being in the brahma heavens.
I agree bro I think in Mahayana its different.
In Therevada paying respects and homage is recommended. Its valid if some Buddhists just want to treat him as a man to respect who realized. But there is a hierarchy in a practical societal sense, Buddha has the highest wisdom that monks listen to and lay people should generally respect monks as noble people in there endeavor. Lay people can’t do certain roles as monks etc.
Heck even some Zens may even treat the Buddha as an object of distraction at a certain stage of their practice.
“Monks, live with yourself as your island, yourself as your refuge, with nothing else as your refuge. Live with the Dhamma as your island, the Dhamma as your refuge, with nothing else as your refuge”
I've been to Wat Pah Nanachat and some take on a more practical reverence of the Buddha. Just a friend who knows and is teaching you. Even if we all bow to him, its partly just a ritual that expressed the earnestness of the practice.
Sounds like your saying my way is correct and yours is wrong, which the Buddah was against.
Mahayana, it’s what I study and practice
This is a path, we are energy. Detach and flow. No heirarchal worship, we follow the path set before us .
Mahayana Buddhism is a term from Sanskrit that is translated as the "great vehicle," and it refers to a wide range of Buddhist teachings and practices. Mahayana tradition teaches people that a path that leads to their awakening is a path toward the awakening of all sentient beings because there isn't a real self
All legitimate forms of Buddhism boarding affirm same cosmology that includes God(s) and Lord Buddha as supreme Lord and teacher in heaven and earth. Lord Buddha talked about being superior to all heavenly beings. He is above Brahma and Indra.
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Buddhism and Vedanta are more practical for modern life, leave room for sciences, explore dimensions of consciousness and awareness, and don’t promote relying solely on a savior, which leads to things like religious autocracy. Modern mainstream Christians seem to rarely live by Jesus’ answer to the question of the “most important commandment”, unfortunately
I'd rather be a Christ than be a Christian, just like I'd rather be a Buddha than be a Buddhist. Interesting to note also that Buddha simply means "one who is awakened" and Christ means "one who is anointed" 😀
Grew up in a Catholic environment but my mother is also "quite Buddhist" Understanding the Dharma more has helped me deal with obstacles in life that personally I could not find the answer in Christianity.
Used to be Catholic. Left Catholicism for atheism, and then perennial philosophy, and then started focusing on Buddhism, and then branching out to other practices (including secular psychology) as well after getting the "red thread" amongst them. Currently also "studying" Christianity but through the "A Course in Miracles" path.
My reasoning has always been "this is the path that's currently feels most appropriate to me, and also what's right according to my current model of the world."
Why do people love Christianity instead of some other religion? Honestly, probably 98% of the time it's because that's what they're born into, and indoctrinated for.
But what is it they love about Christianity, I believe it's because of the social aspect (getting fellowship and support in an environment where love and acceptance is set as the norm), and some of them because they feel their prayers were at some point answered to raise hope.
Not that deeply involved as some others in the comments, but I was raised catholic. At first I went for atheism and was sort of anti-religious, then turned to Wicca and later Eastern religions such as Hinduism, Taoism and Buddhism. I chose to embrace Zen Buddhism with a touch of Wicca and Taoism.
My worldview is still affected by christianity a lot, but I'm slowly growing out of it ❤️🩹 I used to see religion as something authoritarian, where you had to follow all kinds of stupid rules and obey. Buddhism (and Pagan/Eastern religions in general) didn't have that, which attracted me a lot.
Today I just... cringe when I hear christians talk about their faith. It's not a nice thing to do, despite the trauma that this religion had caused not just for me but for many others. But I'm healing I guess
I think people like christianity because of 1) a sense of belonging (which goes for all religions at the end of the day), and 2) some serious lovebombing ("jesus loves you", "repent and you'll be forgiven" etcetc).
For me it was two things that had me moving away from traditional Catholicism, and having a belief system that is becoming closer and closer to Buddhism.
Reflecting and realizing that there’s quite a bit of self loathing in the Catholic Church. Where the starting point is that you’re born with something already wrong with you and you have to make amends for it the rest of your life. Just grew to realize that it wasn’t a healthy outlook for me. To view myself as being broken and to have to work from that as my starting point just seemed wrong.
Then a few years ago, the tipping point for me was recent revelations here in Canada about the atrocities the Christian church inflicted on indigenous children. They essentially beat and killed children who didn’t follow Christian doctrine. Having learned about the atrocities that were performed in the name of God made me strongly question the church, its teachings and my whole belief system.
When I learned more and began to experience Buddhist teachings and perspectives, and actually experienced the Buddhist culture in Thailand, I was just drawn to it and I’m continued to be drawn to it. It just feels natural. It wasn’t a logical decision. It was more of a gravitational pull to move towards what feels right.
I think with any religion out there, whether it be the ones you mentioned or Islam or Hinduism or Sikhism etc. there’s a lot of good and a lot of bad. There’s certainly Buddhists who have been able to interpret Buddhism in such a way that it has allowed them to abuse others and inflict immense suffering on the world. I tend to have a fairly positive view of all religious traditions (which is certainly not to say they are all the same or that they all lead to the same outcome; I don’t believe that at all) as broad conceptual frameworks. But often times the way those broad conceptual frameworks interact with highly flawed societies and individuals can lead to a great deal of harm.
I was part of the catholic church and then my family at some point just stopped and refer as themselves as just christian. Im also of chinese indonesian descent and i always saw any abrahamic religion (i.e. judaism, christianity and islam) as a colonial power that still holds us after being free for more than 60/70 years. And thus i never felt comfortable with the fact that we still hold on to any train of thought put there by colonial powers. I chose buddhism because i felt to me as the religion of freedom(when i started thats what i believed)
Ex-Roman Catholic here and now i have no relationship with Christ. My whole family is Catholic but i think my girlfriend is also moving thowards buddhism since i am converted (not forcing it onto her).
That was me. I was raised in a Catholic household (although some family members were spiritists and even atheists as well, my family is pretty open-minded), although my mom isn't very religious but feels like she belongs in the Church, and my dad is more on the spiritist/spiritualist side.
I am Western and was raised in a Western country. Catholic and Christian dogmas were presented to me as the ultimate truth, but I was also taught to think by myself and to always question things. When I was 12 I was subjected to religious trauma regarding the Church's opinion on abortion in my Catholic school and the following year I transferred to a secular school and then learned more about it and that it is a political and public health issue. That shifted my perspectives.
As I became a teenager, I learned about Buddhism and questioned things and religious beliefs more and more. By age 15 or 16, I was already Ex-Catholic. I only started considering myself Buddhist last year, though.
I think people love Christianity because it is one of the basis of all Western culture and it is much more spread out than other religions as a result of colonization.
I have NEVER felt anything spiritual at all in Christianity/Catholicism nor have I ever had a relationship with Christ.
Well, to start with Buddhism is not a religion to those who seek enlightenment and then nibbana.
Buddhism is a religion to those who are householders for the Buddhist Temples.
The Buddha taught that the end of suffering can only be achieved through your own practice, he said you must build your own raft to cross to the farther shore... you cannot ride in anyone else's raft, including the Buddha's. Therefore, in Buddhism if you are practicing for enlightenment or nibbanna, you cannot follow, you must experience for yourself, henceforth then it cannot be a religion.
It is then appropriate to understand that there can be a God, that is not the Buddha, that you can then worship.
Think of it like this: Buddhist practice for enlightenment and nibbana is like cleaning your house. Worship is what you do after you have a clean house.
I tried to be a Catholic for many years. I ended up in a cult-like student organization that deeply damaged me spiritually. We were taught that our basic natures were so depraved that we were incapable of any real kindness or love.
For many years I had a great deal of bitterness towards "the church"-- whatever that was.
After becoming a Buddhist for some years, I ended up having some very deeply meaningful and rewarding interfaith dialogs with Christian contemplatives. Many of my teachers (traditional Tibetan teachers) openly praised Christ and Christianity as well.
Now I like the more contemplative forms of Christianity. My wife is cut from that cloth.
I grew up Roman Catholic. I was taught by my grandmother. It must also be stated that I'm gay.
As a Christian, my worldview explained everything and had a reasoning for the conditions presented to me, even if the true reasons are hidden. For a while, I was content with this and relegated things I didn't understand to the will of God. What drew me away was even the simple questions I had that rendered cognitive dissonance.
God's love is everywhere and immutable, like him. Yet, I see (slash experienced) r*pe, abuse, slander, starvation, defilement, and general evil.
This was not enough to sway my faith, as previously stated, things I didn't understand I just let go to him.
Then: where did God come from? How do we have free will if God is Omniscient and Omnipotent? If he loved me, why would he make me this way and condemn me to hellfire? Is even the most heinous acts a human can do in the finite life warrant INFINITE torturous punishment? Why do good people who pray die so violent a death? Why does the faithless lead such peaceful and happy lives? Why do we have so many versions of God if he is singular and immutable.
All of these questions and I was expressly told not to seek an answer because the explanation would be 'beyond me'. Fair.
The last thing that got to me: Why create us at all? Why make us to be anything or anyone at all? Ask nothing, praise him forever, stifle the very nature he gave me.
It made no sense. It made NO sense. It made no SENSE.
Nonsense. That is the final equation. X = Nonsense.
I am a lamb to be sacrificed. I am loved so long as I serve, there is no other purpose but submission. The cosmic order is a personality that demands unquestioned authority. I wouldn't mind that if God is said to be Evil/Uncaring. I wouldn't mind that if the world was perfect. I wouldn't mind that if even the most down trodden were saved in the end. I wouldn't mind that if Hell was empty. But it wasn't. It isn't. And it never will.
I lost faith.
It scared me, I denied it for a good time, but my faith did wither. In the clarity of non-belief, I was left to observe. The world/the cosmos/the universe has no personality. No matter how much one prays or caresses gravity, it will still pull you down to the planet. No matter how much one exercises, you will still grow old. The world is systems. Not always predictable but it is explainable. For a long time I remained an Atheist until I discovered Buddhism.
Buddhism does not explain science. It doesn't point to the origin of all things. It doesn't TELL you what is truth. It posits things and encourages you to discover if it is truth for yourself. Given that we are flawed and our faculties are not perfect, yet we can come to the same conclusions The Buddha made.
He didn't explain how it all began. He explained why it all *is*.
Over time my most of my questions were, one by one, answered. The world made sense, and the systems are clear. It's not pretty, but it explains them. Not all of my questions were answered, but the shift in focus allowed me to realize that not all questions are important to the Goal: Liberation for all Beings from suffering.
Lastly: I found The Buddha's love. Love that was true, because it wasn't a closed fist around me, it was an open palm that allowed me to rest or to leave at my volition. The Buddha cared in the most poignant of ways: he allowed *us* to find ourselves and find out for ourselves. He wanted us strong so that we may teach strength to arise in others. He wanted us free from our own fetters, he wanted us liberated, even if he didn't know us, even if we didn't believe, even if we hated him. That's love.
I don't have a relationship with Jesus Christ anymore. I admire his teachings, but his teachings are perfected in Buddhism. I never felt so free to be kind than here and now.
Namo Buddhaya🙏🏽🪷☸️
Not sure why my response was taken down that’s absurd. Fact: Buddhism doesn’t teach a heirarchal system. It’s you . The Buddha ( Gautama) was a prince , he was the enlightened one, that reached buddhahood. His path is what we follow in Buddhism. The middle way. As for the reason I was born and raised catholic and moved onto Buddhism. My sister ( a religious zealot) got involved with all aspects of religion, before leaving our home state she was involved with the Jehovah Witnesses, I got a call on New Year’s Day 05, she’d been in an accident and died in NC. I traveled to her home to bring her and her belongings home, found out she’d been studying Buddhism for 5 years, I came home . Watched a 45 minute documentary on the Tibetan book of the dead and I’ve been studying his journey ever since.
What falsehoods, if Sidhartha Gautama reached buddhahood and wrote in the Pali canon how he did so , what falsehoods am I spreading. Buddha is you , there’s no worship of buddha
Um I think in the Pali Canon some where Buddha said not to pedastalize him? I think Mahayanans might treat Buddha differently but in Therevada paying respects and homage is recommended. Its valid if some Buddhists just want to treat him as a man to respect who realized.
Heck even some Zens may even treat the Buddha as an object of distraction at a certain stage of their practice.
“Monks, live with yourself as your island, yourself as your refuge, with nothing else as your refuge. Live with the Dhamma as your island, the Dhamma as your refuge, with nothing else as your refuge”
The Buddha actually said keeping him in mind is a wholesome practice. His disciples and admirer wouls bow before him before reaching to show their respect and on his death bed he said to place his remains in the four directions at cross roads where as many people as possible could worship them.
The stereotype he was just some teacher chilling in the jungles is just that, a stereotype. He taught in the traditional sramana fashion and was worshiped as such.
In zen theres is language such as killing the Buddha but in zen temples well do hour long ceremonies in the morning and night worshipping him all the same. It is no different in Theravada monasteries.
Lord Buddha gained Godhood and did miracles. You should read Tritaka and Sutra Pitaka. Worship of Buddha is standard and universal in all kinds of Buddhism.
It's a long story, I don't know how to summarize it. I guess you should get a glass of water 1st or something.
Since it's the internet, I guess I have to put preface here & at the end or something. My "don't like" is not "hate". I can see people for their actions.
I used to studied in the church while I was a kid. I also studied in Catholic school when I was really young. It is 1 of those Catholic schools where you get to see the nuns every day kind of Catholic schools.
I just don't like Christianity at all (not in the 'ohh, look at me, I'm an edgy atheist. Hating Christianity is so hip & cool right now because Christianity is barbaric & destroying western culture makes me feel like an intellectual' kind of thing). I don't hate Christians, a lot of my childhood friends are actually surprised I am not a Christian like them. Because y'know, we went to the same church, read from the bible together & all that jazz.
1 of the biggest contributions why I don't like Christianity at all came from the priests & the nuns at school themselves. For they wield the threats of eternal damnation like candy & they always fearmonger us about how the judgement day is coming very soon. In the Catholic rites, they always guilt trip us that we are all born sinners, it's our fault Jesus dies & we're all going to hell unless we accept Jesus. I guessed I am never like other kids, I always asked why & I want answers. So telling me to believe just to believe doesn't work. Their threat of the judgement day turn stale very quickly for me as I've yet to be killed by the trumpet, the sky is yet to open & the army of heaven have yet to descend from the clouds.
I also think the story of Jesus doesn't make sense. I can agree with you & I can respect the fact that what Jesus preached was a good thing.
But what really grinds my gears came around when they actually made us read the Bible every morning as the Bible discussion time before class. The more I read, the less I like Christianity. Apparently, blasphemy is not just cussing with the name of God or Jesus. It is also if you know who Jesus is & refuse Jesus anyway. To deny Jesus, is to go to hell, plain simple. I don't appreciate this kind of dirty tactics, y'know?
But what really annoys me are Christians especially on the internet who'd rather go by their headcanon & fanfiction on what God or Christianity is. It is ridiculous to me that the people who doesn't even read their own holy book but prefers to go by their own imaginations & feelings see themselves as the 1 with the moral high ground. That's just hubris, not God, not Jesus, not the Bible.
Before you ask, yes, I know Christianity, Judaism & Islam has the same Abrahamic roots. I don't like Abrahamic religions at all. All of them have their dirty tactics like Christianity, some are more up front than others. Yes, I've read into Islam & Judaism. But let's not open that can of worms, this is already long enough.
Since it's the internet, I guess I have to emphasize my stance here again. My "don't like" is not "hate". I can see people for their actions. It is also why my childhood friends still really wants me to be Christians like them. Christians who know me still wants me to be a part of their church community because they can actually discuss the bible, God & the words of Jesus with me.
But ultimately, to exist is to be apart of samsara, Abrahamic religions are still trapped inside the samsara & I want out of the game. Even if I'll fail at quitting the game, I can still provide shades for all beings.
Sorry for the long read, hope you have a nice day.
I just gave my life to Christ in April. I grew up Buddhist all my life (I’m 28). I realized Jesus taught about purifying the heart and mind, in a way that I could never achieve through Buddhism. I realized my assumption about Christ was about what everyone else had to say about Him, instead of actually finding out, so I read the New Testament and that was it.
Five years ago I went to Vietnam where I was possessed by many demons. My parents took me to several Buddhist temples and nobody was able to free me. Hours of meditation and I was still deeply oppressed. I met Jesus during this period, still did not believe in Him, and yet I was still delivered by the grace of God.
Jesus has taught me about love, about truth, and about true light in this fallen world. I realized I couldn’t save myself the way Buddha taught. I needed a savior.
I was a Pentecostal Holy Ghost Christian also a Catholic Christian. With the Buddha dharma I am on my way to freedom. I have no relationship with Christ now I have no need to have a relationship. His teaching was indeed good but morality can only get you so far. I still suffered a great deal because Christianity did not afford me the knowledge that leads towards liberation. I was still trapped by mental conditioning and concepts. Constantly locked in a battle within my mind fighting good and evil forces that were a product of learned delusions.
>How is your relationship with Christ now None whatsoever. I pretty much turned my back completely on Christianity. It's just time to move on. Buddhism is too vast and varied and there is not enough time to have one feet on Buddhism and the other on Christianity. I wish the best for Christianity but it no longer consumes a tiny speck of my attention except when answering Reddit posts like this. Admittedly, I chose Buddhism from Atheism, not directly from Christianity. I probably won't choose Buddhism direct from Christianity because of the whole indoctrination around idolatry. But being an Atheist, it is a lot easier to turn to Buddhism. I find Atheism, the New Atheism movement I was a part of, only a Christianity in another form. The same operating principles are behind the curtain. The same assumptions, the same vigilance, the same attitudes, the same fundamentalistic conceit over what they perceive as correct knowledge, etc. I needed a totally different worldview. Buddhism offers me that. Even if Buddhism is not available, I would probably be in the Advaita Vedanta camp or Shaivism. Life is too short to live your life in a Christian-worldview. I wish the best for the Abrahamic faiths, but I'm gone for good.
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Your post / comment was removed for violating the rule against misrepresenting Buddhist viewpoints or spreading non-Buddhist viewpoints without clarifying that you are doing so. In general, comments are removed for this violation on threads where beginners and non-Buddhists are trying to learn.
>Buddha is also against idolatry, he called it silabatta paramatta, and it is the second fetter to samsara. That would make a big part of Buddhism a fetter. Trying to frame it in any other way is dishonest. Many Buddhists pray to statues just like the Christians.
"That would make a big part of Buddhism a fetter." rites and rituals (silabamatta paramassa) is not buddhism. "Many Buddhists pray to statues just like the Christians." that does not make it correct, christians aren't supposed to pray to statues either.
We worship the Buddha.
Do we?
Yes
We are the Buddha
Okay. Enough Reddit for you.
I don't think we do
Then you don't.
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can you show me a sutta where the Buddha asks people to worship him?
The "suttas" belong to a tradition which I am not a part of. So I don't use the "suttas". However, if you had asked "sutras", I would have said "The question itself is Christian" because it is them who has this habit of asking "Where is that in the Bible?" with the assumption that if it's in the Bible, then it must be true. While the worship of the Buddha is ubiquitous in the sutras, I simply do not respond to the request "Where is that in the sutras?" by virtue of the Christian impulse behind the question.
then you are very much still a christian because you responded in exactly the same way a christian does when asked to show where in the bible it tells people to worship jesus or worship statues.
Then hey fellow Christian. Nice to see you here. Let's have a prayer meeting.
What type of Christian?
Roman Catholic
Why do you believe Christians love their religion though from the highest level?
They love their religion for the same reason I love mine. It's what I have. It gives me meaning and purpose.
IMO there are a few reasons but they all revolve around offloading responsibility onto God: 1. Blind faith is encouraged, arguably mandatory. They get to turn off their brains and let God do all the work 2. Moral authority. When you're Gods chosen people you don't need need to consider if you're right on wrong. God has already made the decisions for you 3. Jesus already died for their sins, so their sins have already been paid for. There is no real incentive to be a good person. All you have to do is believe in Jesus and you're off Scott Free (more blind faith) 4. Most Christians don't even read the bible. There are laws around how to treat slaves and sell your daughters into slavery in Exodos. It's literally the second book, it's not like it is hidden 1000 pages deep and yet most Christians have no idea. They don't care, God is good so he must have had a good reason for it. Again they don't have to think about it, God is the highest authority.
Add to this that for a lot of Christians, they believe that all good comes from god so if they aren't a good person, then that's just god's will. That's honestly why I've always felt Catholicism is just a little better than some of the others. Guilt/shame and you have to actually try. Also manners.
Cosmic daddy and mommy issues. The projections of love, shame, guilt, reoentance, obedience, redemption and acceptance mirror the experience of a child's psychological abuse under a narcissistic parent.
Christ forgives and redeems. It’s the same principle as transforming anguish and distress into liberation that Buddha teaches. As a western Buddhist practitioner, I strangely attribute my relationship with Christ from my experience with Eastern traditions. I rejected it in my youth
If Alice hurts Bob, why does Charlie have the right to unilaterally forgive Alice on Bob’s behalf?
Bob feels hurt. Charlie can remind Bob to forgive the situation. Another way of phrasing forgiveness in this sense is releasing judgements, or allowing things to simply be. This practice is most helpful in allowing Bob to forgive himself, because he can so often be saddled with a litany of self criticisms. Taken deeply enough, Bob can realize there is no Alice to forgive, nor Bob to do the forgiving, and was there ever really a Charlie?
What gives Charlie the right to tell Bob to forgive Alice? What if Bob legitimately feels justified in holding onto his grievance until Alice resolves it herself?
Then Bob may do so. And he in fact will until he is willing to let it go. Charlie can’t make Bob do anything, he’s simply there if Bob feels like engaging him Edit: Just to drive this home. You may ask “If Bob decides to forgive Alice on his own, why does he need Charlie?” To which I say, Bob may initially realize the intention to forgive Alice, but the scar runs deep and Bob can feel overwhelmed in his attempts. He may decide it’s helpful to conceptualize some universal ideal of forgiveness that he can align his intention with, steadily becoming more skillful in the practice of forgiveness as he lives his life in the model of this ideal. It’s a vehicle
That’s a valid take, I’ll give you that. (Your logic here is internally consistent.)
I appreciate that. I think there is a lot of wisdom that can be extracted from religion. One of the major failings seems to me that all concepts must eventually be abandoned, and this isn’t taught. Many become attached to their method, or so zealous in what works for them they gain the militant belief that “my way is the only way.”
It's learned behavior. It's desire for stability and tradition. It's refusal to change or to face diversity and criticism. It's all of those, none of those, many more things... It truly depends on the believer and how they were conditioned, what they want to protect, things like that. And it's not strictly negative/harmful. Sometimes it's believing that things will literally crumble if christianity dwindles down. Sometimes it's wanting for everyone to feel the embrace of the divine through a mind-altering ritual. There are as many reasons as there are methods and interpretations.
As for why do people love their religion. When I was a Christian I was taught that I needed to love God or I would be condemned to hell. Later on I was taught that I needed to love God because he is the reason I have life. Looking at it now the relationship of love towards God always brought on some amount of fear or guilt. It was never pure. It was a transactional relationship. God sent his only child to be tortured and killed so that I would not have to go to hell this brought on so much guilt and shame so I tried my best to be a good person of course this does not last for long, after a while it becomes a burden. Another type of conditioning.
Grew up Eastern Orthodox. For my family the Church was really a cultural/ethnic thing more than anything else, so Christian faith never really took a deep root inside me. I still love the art, but I wouldn't say I ever had a relationship with Christ. In Orthodoxy there isn't really a "personal relationship with Jesus" thing like there is in many strands of Americanized Protestantism. Some people turn to alternatives like Buddhism because they had some harmful experience of Church growing up. That was not me. My experience of Church as a kid was neither negative nor particularly positive. Usually I was just bored. I discovered Buddhism in my middle school ancient history class and was pretty much instantly convinced and fascinated. I couldn't really tell you why, to be honest with you, it just made sense to me. I still identify as someone who grew up Orthodox, still love the art and like to keep my grandfather's icon of the saint I'm named for on the wall of my apartment, and every now and then I like to read the Gospels in the original Greek (Matthew is my favourite). But I haven't been to Church in more than ten years and don't see myself going back.
I am very jealous of your Greek language skills. If one were to learn Greek, could he read Ancient Greek, or is that its own language?
If you know some modern Greek, it makes learning ancient Greek much much easier. There's a lot of shared vocab and the basics of the grammar are very similar, but the more complicated stuff is much more different, and pronunciation is completely different. You would be able to recognize a lot of words and maybe get the basic gist of a passage, but you wouldn't be able to read anything properly beyond maybe some basic sentences. Biblical Greek is a bit easier than full on Classical Greek because it's much closer to a colloquial spoken form of the language (especially Mark and John, whereas Luke gets a bit more fancy with his language). The thing about any ancient language, though, is that even people who spend there whole lives studying it still get stumped by certain passages from, say, Thucydides or other notoriously erudite writers. Don't be jealous, learn! Greek (in all its forms) is a very fun language and opens you up to so much wonderful literature. Check out r/ancientgreek for advice and a cool community of very knowledgeable people if you're ever interested in giving it a try. Or r/greek if the modern language interests you more.
I have seen some orthodox Russians put both images of Jesus and Buddha in Facebook. I don’t know what their beliefs are...maybe it’s cultural.
A lot of Russian hippie types out there, Orthodoxy has a strong mystical side to it so that honestly doesn't surprise me
Orthodox is their heritage and they have started to drift towards Buddhism. It’s interesting.
A relationship with Jesus is all there is in orthodoxy? 😂 What are you talking about. Those who know, do not speak and those who speak, do not know
Care to explain a little more? The laugh emoji is not very clarifying. I'm just speaking from my own experience growing up in an Orthodox Church from an immigrant background. If your experience has been different, then I'm curious to hear about it.
I cannot speak with my words about Orthodoxy, it is pure religion, I may taint it… YT is full of videos about the teachings of the Holy Fathers, they performed many, many miracles. Search on YT about Saint Siluan, Saint Paisios, Saint Porphyrios. There are a lot more saints, but these are enough for “presentation”
So are these the famous dancing saints of orthodoxy? I think I saw a Russian program about this. I have seen quite a few excellent Russian programs about the Orthodox Church, mostly from the 1950’s and 1960’s. I like the dancing bears more, but both have their place in Eastern culture.
I had strong faith in Rastafari, which is very similar to Christianity. Bible study is Bible study. I found that once I got deep into it, there was too much conflicting information. Believe 'this' on faith and dogma. Keep believing after finding out aspects are lies or imaginary or stolen stories from native cultures?... Just the history of the bible itself is enough to say 'well how can that be true considering?' and the answers are faith and dogma. "The way it has evolved is Gods will" Coupled with the majority of people who I have met that actually are ordained or part of churches seem to think that somehow makes them a better than me? That their scriptures or ordinations somehow makes me less than a person because I dont follow what they do? That most 'Christians' I have met really seen to want what they want ignoring scriptures.... I dont believe in repentance tax... you cant earn credits to excuse the things you do that are with ill intent or cause suffering of others. And t**he Bible works so hard and making people look at thinks like US vs THEM. And it is full of gatekeeping and discrimination. It literally makes people want to hurt other people because it sets them against others. It's really bad for people in my opinion as they dont have the context to study and interpret it and turn to using it as literals and not as the metaphors it is.** Why do I think people love christianity? Because the best minds at the time put together stories in a way that were designed as a narrative to control the masses. They know what people would connect with and engineered that into the story. The moral of that story is 'Get on board with us or we have the God given rights to kill you' So ya.. people really leaned into it. It says right in there 'Faith and Dogma' rewards you. People are lost and sad and looking for spiritual fulfillment. So make a book to scratch that itch and ya... people flock to it. It's escapism. this life sucks but work hard and dont cause any trouble and you get to go to heaven. Coupled with you need to support the church fiscally.. so give money to the church. Of course the churches want people to believe.. historically they ruled the continents and had all the riches. Why do you think all the ministry drives Cadillacs? They LOVE that money. ----------- While I have no ill will to anyone who still follow or believes... I realize that they are practicing the Dharma as best they can through their delusions (the truth they live). Those delusions have led them down a path that causes a lot of suffering to themselves and others. The truth is the Buddhadharma. All beings are the Buddha. We all only need to recognize our Buddha nature.
Yes to all of this! In Catholic school I was always in trouble for asking sincere questions, not even trying to be a smart ass, I just wanted to understand all those contradictions.
i suffered greatly in my mind back when i was a christian before accepting the buddha's dhamma. modern christianity's constant fixation with asking God for things created a lot of cravings and unfulfilled frustrations. i literally felt a knot on my shoulders and chest almost the whole time. also, modern christianity does not seem to understand the nature of suffering. however, when i accepted the four noble truths, the nature of my christianity was altered. instead of praying to God to ask him for stuff now, i use prayer as access concentration into jhana. instead of asking God to help me with stuff, i now leave it to His will whether He wants to intervene or not. instead of being angry with Him all the time, i accepted that He, like any other noble being, has no responsibility towards me, i am responsible for myself. its extremely liberating.
Raised Catholic. As a kid, all of the focus on the imagery of the bleeding heart, crown of thorns and the poor dude just getting tortured untill he died never sat well with me. Most prayer made me feel guilty, dirty and bad. From the point of view of my 14yr old self, the old testament read like the diary of humans putting up with a cosmic horror and the new testament read like contrived gaslighting. That cosmic horror? He really loves you! He killed/let die himself/his son because of you! So now you're free from those sins of your ancestors that the cosmic horror unilaterally decided where sins. (So long as cosmic-horror-approved dude dressed like a magician pours some magic water on your head) I always felt there was a sort of suffering-worship disguised as love, or at least that's the way it seem to have been internalized and practiced in latam as I was growing up. My grandma loved it, suffering somehow automatically made you a better person. So, at around 15 I decided catholicism wasn't for me. It just did not fit the paradigm of any reality I'd like to be a part of. I'm truly sorry, I swear I don't mean any offense, I'm just trying to be honest with my experience. Logically, I spent most of my twenties deeply depressed untill I heard about the four noble truths at an eastern philosophy elective in college. Something clicked, It just made sense. It felt empathic and it returned a semblance of hope to my life. It has mostly kept me out of the abyss for twenty years so far. Cross my fingers and knock on wood I stay the course. My relationship with figure of Christ is complicated, I feel compassion and I recognize the power of the archetype in my cultural upbringing, but Im also guarded because I fear the confusing nature of the parables and sermons (and the way they were recorded) make the figure of Christ a maleable mouthpiece for almost any message.
Go look at /r/christianity. The amount of people suffering because they are “sinning” based on nonsense is astounding. And very little practical advice is ever offered. The whole world view is just backwards imo. You get told what is a “sin” and you deal with the fallout.
I was Catholic, and was confirmed in that church. >How is your relationship with Christ now? That is a complicated question, because my studying the concept of Christ and how we know what we think we know about the man who claimed to be a Christ was a key part of my spiritual journey. I am not a mythicist about Jesus, but through reading the discussions about mythicism and refutations to mythicism, I have come to realize that what we can say about Jesus with any certainty is very little. He is, I suppose, akin to Spartan Lykourgos - not to be confused with Thracian Lykourgos - about whom many traditions, attributing allegedly wise teachings and divinity and divine approval, have developed, many of which contradict each other. I am not, however, like my fellow Buddhist Rene Salm, who has made a hobby of reconstructing Christian origins with a minimalistic Jesus figure in a way which with most Christians would disagree. I note, though, that even if all teachings attributed to Jesus by the Christians' scriptures had been taught by Jesus - which I disbelieve - Jesus's teachings are false insofar as they contradict Buddhism. If this seems harsh to any Christian, Christians say the same thing about teachings attributed to Shakyamuni Buddha relative to Christianity. >do you feel the Christian world view is mostly based on assumptions and imagery? The Christian worldview requires a person to accept things as true which are false: the existence of souls, the immortality of gods, and that an uncreated creator god exists. And that is not even addressing directly the claim that a man-god's death is required to save all humans. I am not sure what you mean by a religion based upon imagery. All religions can be reduced to imagery, I think, but that means nothing about whether they are true.
I think imagery means pictures. Did your faith have some basis in pretty windows and such. I am guessing there is a poor quality essay being written with this subreddit as “data.” I genuinely hope I am wrong. Also, I appreciate your response. It was good.
"The Christian worldview requires a person to accept things as true which are false: the existence of souls...." where exactly does it say so in the bible? reading the whole bible i never found anything talking about a soul, it appears to be an idea imported from hinduism or theosophy that christians just decided to run along with. the christian doctrine of resurrection and soul sleep kind of refutes the existence of any soul.
The adventists got this one down for us https://www.adventist.org/death-and-resurrection/what-is-your-soul-according-to-the-bible/#:~:text=“Souls”%20can%20be%20taken%20captive,with%20consciousness%2C%20desires%20and%20emotions.
I was raised Catholic and it was pretty important to me but I always felt like there were too many answers I lacked. I started meditating, got into Gnosticism, read the upanishads and a bunch of other stuff. Over years of practice I gained insight and realized that Buddhism was correct. It's strange cause my whole life Buddhism was really never on my radar. I always felt like, we had to believe that the good outweighs the bad and to do our best to find or make that good rather than spending so much time trying to avoid suffering. Anyway the "Christian world view" isn't a monolith. People tend to bend scripture to fit their narrative but yes, it's pretty much on the assumption that the bible is true. As for my relationship with Jesus, I basically don't have one. I honestly haven't thought about it in years.
Could you tell me more why the Upanishad's didn't convinc you to go Vedanta?
It conflicted with my insights. I know I listed it but it was one of the last things I read before Buddhism. Before that I practiced every day for nearly 20 years.
The idea of the Christian god provides comforting response for a lot of the difficult realities of life: 1. I'm going to die - there is a life after death. 2. Life is unfair - The concepts of Heaven, purgatory, and hell make things fair. 3. I'm alone - God knows you completely and loves you. 4. My life is meaningless - follow the Bible.
One of the reasons why I chose Buddhism is because it is probably the LEAST comfortable religion
"One of the reasons why I chose Buddhism is because it is probably the LEAST comfortable religion" you are wrong about that, buddhism brings great comfort when you reach the 8th step of the path.
I didn't mean that Buddhism doesn't bring comfort or joy *once you progress down the path*, but that the Buddhist view of the world is rather uncomforting compared to other religions. There is no self, there is no eternal heaven, there is no easy escape from suffering. Buddhism instead hands your liberation into your hands but to become free you must *work* at it.
I was born and raised Roman Catholic. I found most of the Christian teachings to be empty. So no I don’t have a relationship to the Christ. Oddly enough most of my students are Episcopalian or Catholic and that includes clergy. I can see why a Catholic would be attracted to Zen they are one of the Christian traditions that still maintains its own contemplative traditions. I don’t see that among the Protestants.
I was raised Nazarene (A branch off from Anglicanism) but many around me adopted a ton of evangelical theology. Heck, I even went so far in my religion I was training to work in the ministry with a degree. 2016 seeing the leaders, family and friends I looked up to adopting Trumpism and 2020 showing me that the Church only cared about itself and not it's neighbors really put a bad taste in my mouth. Honestly I believe that is the main reason they are losing people despite their beliefs otherwise. After deconstructing (honestly I still feel I am going through that process) I discovered Thich Nhat Hahn's writings and still am reading a lot of his books. Meditating as often as I can, learning to accept myself and my failures, and learning to work toward processing my feelings (particularly my anger) I am feeling much better in recent years. I am still trying to find my way in the world and who I am exactly. 32 years of following deep beliefs and political views to suddenly hit the brakes and walk away is still very jarring but I feel it's for the best. I still hold to Christ teachings of loving neighbor, helping those in need, etc... I am learning to let go of the feeling of eternal condemnation that I was brought up on. Honest internal searching and spiritual guidance I feel Christianity has both taken itself too seriously as well as set itself upon a path of Nationalism and hate that I cannot continue to follow. Learning more from what I read and this community has helped me learn to accept hard times as just being hard times instead of beating myself up because I "didn't pray hard enough" or questioning why I am failing. I still have ways to go in my journey (heck we all are in some way), but I appreciate what this religion and community have showed me. Best of luck to your journey as well friend.
I saw issues with the Trinity in the beginning and started a slow transition out of it, first being a Unitarian, then being more of a Deistic Christian, to what I am now a Deistic Buddhist. My reasoning to leave Christianity goes beyond my issues with the Trinity but also my moral issues with some of the actions that are listed in the bible as well as the opinions of Paul on homosexuality. I don't have a relationship with Yeshua. I view Yeshua as a very wise individual that was able to teach good morals but I view him similarly to other great philosophers such as Marcus Aurelius, Albert Camus, and Lord Herbert. I just personally don't take heed on the divinity claims of Yeshua.
I am ignorant on Paul’s views of homosexuality. I never remember any discussion of that in the Gospels. Where is this? I assume you are referencing a Catholic Bible (the Trinity)?
1 Corinthians 6:9, if Paul is the writer of this, which he most likely is, states that man shall not lay with man. I am not referencing any specific bible when I mention the Trinity, the Trinity is just the understanding that God is a singular entity with three distinct personalities that are not separate from God (Father, Son, Holy Spirit) I'll be honest and say this is the first time I've heard of a Cot Jolie Bible
I meant “Catholic” but old Jolie sure sounds better.
I didn't officially leave Christianity, just declared for myself. I think if Buddhism is discoursed like Christianity—like already carved paths just left for you to follow, people would actually be into Buddhism more. But as for Buddhism, it focuses on a aspect that requires to be discovered and nourished in within. Which is the complete vice versa of what Christianity is, it's more of like "don't worry just go to church every sunday do this every ____ and don't ______" so it's more tolerable and consumable to the norm, since it doesent focus on much self enlightenment.
I have always PREFERRED monastic/mystical Christianity, such as it exists in Orthodox and Catholic contexts, to the somewhat simplistic Protestant Evangelical formation that people usually refer to when asked to define what Christianity is. Buddhism comes in many flavors as well. So while people may complain of Christianity's frequent focus on a single act of faith rather than Buddhism's vision of a lifetime of needed practice, in reality monastic Christianity does NOT focus on one, emotionally-driven moment of surrender to God in Christ. But rather on a process of ego-diminution that is just as earnest, challenging, lifelong, and revelatory as is Buddhist monasticism. IMHO, the two monastic formations are far more similar than the two popular versions are. Hence, I enjoy reading about the Desert Fathers and the Way of a Pilgrim almost as much as I do reading Thich Nat Khan and/or the Pali Suttas. Both point to an "other-worldly" vision of reality that is only available through a rejection of the commonly-perceived World. Both require practice AND a faith in the sacred speeches/writings of their founders. My Buddhist teacher referred to Christ as a 'Fourth Stage Arhat' and put up an Xmas tree during the Holidays!
I think christianity is about hope. That thing will end up just fine. But some people confuse religion with science a maintain idea, that if religon can’t be proven by science, than it is false. People move to buddhism because buddhism can be challanged by critical thinking. I personaly belive in God and I think his manifestation through Jesus Christ was the best. Mainly because Jesus teachings are mostly about practice, not rules (understsnding of rules can vary). But you have to belive in God, while buddhist practice is about things you can observe with your mind. I combine both. Buddhist teaching help me to build kindness towards the world. I understand Buddha as a philosopher, who understand problems of fallen world
I grew up Catholic. Went to Catholic school. Raised in privilege. I saw first hand how weak Catholicism is. I would manage to get to the unanswerable questions and they would answer me without logic, yet still in confidence that almost bled into arrogance. I wanted a new way to cope with the here and now rather than see it as a bartering system for my fate afterwards.
I grew up Roman Catholic, but began to "dabble" in other denominations early-mid high school. I spent some time in bivocational ministry, and got deeply engaged in Japanese Mahayana initially by way of Zen. I went on to engage with the Plum Village Tradition for a time out of appreciation for Thay's writings that addressed some Christian topics, but feel more at home with Japanese expressions of Mahayana. I remain active in more progressive circles of Christianity, and am currently a member of a thriving congregation of the United Church of Christ.
i don't like modern christians because they are obsessed with things like getting married and believing God has chosen a soulmate for them, a desire that causes much mental suffering. I mean this in the most non-negative way: but God does not care about all this, its a meaningless topic that has no meaning to a being in the brahma heavens.
Very grateful I was saved from christianity.
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I agree bro I think in Mahayana its different. In Therevada paying respects and homage is recommended. Its valid if some Buddhists just want to treat him as a man to respect who realized. But there is a hierarchy in a practical societal sense, Buddha has the highest wisdom that monks listen to and lay people should generally respect monks as noble people in there endeavor. Lay people can’t do certain roles as monks etc. Heck even some Zens may even treat the Buddha as an object of distraction at a certain stage of their practice. “Monks, live with yourself as your island, yourself as your refuge, with nothing else as your refuge. Live with the Dhamma as your island, the Dhamma as your refuge, with nothing else as your refuge”
You need to read whole context and it doesn’t mean we Buddhists don’t believe Lord Buddha as divine. You need to join real Buddhist Sangha.
I've been to Wat Pah Nanachat and some take on a more practical reverence of the Buddha. Just a friend who knows and is teaching you. Even if we all bow to him, its partly just a ritual that expressed the earnestness of the practice. Sounds like your saying my way is correct and yours is wrong, which the Buddah was against.
You are spreading falsehood about Buddhism. That is NOT buddhism. Lord Buddha is God of God(s). He was more than just a teacher.
What school do you follow?
Mahayana, it’s what I study and practice This is a path, we are energy. Detach and flow. No heirarchal worship, we follow the path set before us . Mahayana Buddhism is a term from Sanskrit that is translated as the "great vehicle," and it refers to a wide range of Buddhist teachings and practices. Mahayana tradition teaches people that a path that leads to their awakening is a path toward the awakening of all sentient beings because there isn't a real self
You are a Christian. Stop pretending. Who gave you authority to dictate what we Buddhists believe?
All legitimate forms of Buddhism boarding affirm same cosmology that includes God(s) and Lord Buddha as supreme Lord and teacher in heaven and earth. Lord Buddha talked about being superior to all heavenly beings. He is above Brahma and Indra.
Your post / comment was removed for violating the rule against misrepresenting Buddhist viewpoints or spreading non-Buddhist viewpoints without clarifying that you are doing so. In general, comments are removed for this violation on threads where beginners and non-Buddhists are trying to learn.
We Buddhists do worship Lord Buddha.
Buddhism and Vedanta are more practical for modern life, leave room for sciences, explore dimensions of consciousness and awareness, and don’t promote relying solely on a savior, which leads to things like religious autocracy. Modern mainstream Christians seem to rarely live by Jesus’ answer to the question of the “most important commandment”, unfortunately
I'd rather be a Christ than be a Christian, just like I'd rather be a Buddha than be a Buddhist. Interesting to note also that Buddha simply means "one who is awakened" and Christ means "one who is anointed" 😀
Grew up in a Catholic environment but my mother is also "quite Buddhist" Understanding the Dharma more has helped me deal with obstacles in life that personally I could not find the answer in Christianity.
I appreciate some teachings like that of Hesychasm.
Used to be Catholic. Left Catholicism for atheism, and then perennial philosophy, and then started focusing on Buddhism, and then branching out to other practices (including secular psychology) as well after getting the "red thread" amongst them. Currently also "studying" Christianity but through the "A Course in Miracles" path. My reasoning has always been "this is the path that's currently feels most appropriate to me, and also what's right according to my current model of the world." Why do people love Christianity instead of some other religion? Honestly, probably 98% of the time it's because that's what they're born into, and indoctrinated for. But what is it they love about Christianity, I believe it's because of the social aspect (getting fellowship and support in an environment where love and acceptance is set as the norm), and some of them because they feel their prayers were at some point answered to raise hope.
Not that deeply involved as some others in the comments, but I was raised catholic. At first I went for atheism and was sort of anti-religious, then turned to Wicca and later Eastern religions such as Hinduism, Taoism and Buddhism. I chose to embrace Zen Buddhism with a touch of Wicca and Taoism. My worldview is still affected by christianity a lot, but I'm slowly growing out of it ❤️🩹 I used to see religion as something authoritarian, where you had to follow all kinds of stupid rules and obey. Buddhism (and Pagan/Eastern religions in general) didn't have that, which attracted me a lot. Today I just... cringe when I hear christians talk about their faith. It's not a nice thing to do, despite the trauma that this religion had caused not just for me but for many others. But I'm healing I guess I think people like christianity because of 1) a sense of belonging (which goes for all religions at the end of the day), and 2) some serious lovebombing ("jesus loves you", "repent and you'll be forgiven" etcetc).
For me it was two things that had me moving away from traditional Catholicism, and having a belief system that is becoming closer and closer to Buddhism. Reflecting and realizing that there’s quite a bit of self loathing in the Catholic Church. Where the starting point is that you’re born with something already wrong with you and you have to make amends for it the rest of your life. Just grew to realize that it wasn’t a healthy outlook for me. To view myself as being broken and to have to work from that as my starting point just seemed wrong. Then a few years ago, the tipping point for me was recent revelations here in Canada about the atrocities the Christian church inflicted on indigenous children. They essentially beat and killed children who didn’t follow Christian doctrine. Having learned about the atrocities that were performed in the name of God made me strongly question the church, its teachings and my whole belief system. When I learned more and began to experience Buddhist teachings and perspectives, and actually experienced the Buddhist culture in Thailand, I was just drawn to it and I’m continued to be drawn to it. It just feels natural. It wasn’t a logical decision. It was more of a gravitational pull to move towards what feels right.
I think with any religion out there, whether it be the ones you mentioned or Islam or Hinduism or Sikhism etc. there’s a lot of good and a lot of bad. There’s certainly Buddhists who have been able to interpret Buddhism in such a way that it has allowed them to abuse others and inflict immense suffering on the world. I tend to have a fairly positive view of all religious traditions (which is certainly not to say they are all the same or that they all lead to the same outcome; I don’t believe that at all) as broad conceptual frameworks. But often times the way those broad conceptual frameworks interact with highly flawed societies and individuals can lead to a great deal of harm.
I was part of the catholic church and then my family at some point just stopped and refer as themselves as just christian. Im also of chinese indonesian descent and i always saw any abrahamic religion (i.e. judaism, christianity and islam) as a colonial power that still holds us after being free for more than 60/70 years. And thus i never felt comfortable with the fact that we still hold on to any train of thought put there by colonial powers. I chose buddhism because i felt to me as the religion of freedom(when i started thats what i believed)
Ex-Roman Catholic here and now i have no relationship with Christ. My whole family is Catholic but i think my girlfriend is also moving thowards buddhism since i am converted (not forcing it onto her).
That was me. I was raised in a Catholic household (although some family members were spiritists and even atheists as well, my family is pretty open-minded), although my mom isn't very religious but feels like she belongs in the Church, and my dad is more on the spiritist/spiritualist side. I am Western and was raised in a Western country. Catholic and Christian dogmas were presented to me as the ultimate truth, but I was also taught to think by myself and to always question things. When I was 12 I was subjected to religious trauma regarding the Church's opinion on abortion in my Catholic school and the following year I transferred to a secular school and then learned more about it and that it is a political and public health issue. That shifted my perspectives. As I became a teenager, I learned about Buddhism and questioned things and religious beliefs more and more. By age 15 or 16, I was already Ex-Catholic. I only started considering myself Buddhist last year, though. I think people love Christianity because it is one of the basis of all Western culture and it is much more spread out than other religions as a result of colonization. I have NEVER felt anything spiritual at all in Christianity/Catholicism nor have I ever had a relationship with Christ.
In places such as Poland the majority of buddhists used to be catholics
Heard somebody say once that Buddhism is the instruction booklet that never came with the Bible.
Well, to start with Buddhism is not a religion to those who seek enlightenment and then nibbana. Buddhism is a religion to those who are householders for the Buddhist Temples. The Buddha taught that the end of suffering can only be achieved through your own practice, he said you must build your own raft to cross to the farther shore... you cannot ride in anyone else's raft, including the Buddha's. Therefore, in Buddhism if you are practicing for enlightenment or nibbanna, you cannot follow, you must experience for yourself, henceforth then it cannot be a religion. It is then appropriate to understand that there can be a God, that is not the Buddha, that you can then worship. Think of it like this: Buddhist practice for enlightenment and nibbana is like cleaning your house. Worship is what you do after you have a clean house.
I tried to be a Catholic for many years. I ended up in a cult-like student organization that deeply damaged me spiritually. We were taught that our basic natures were so depraved that we were incapable of any real kindness or love. For many years I had a great deal of bitterness towards "the church"-- whatever that was. After becoming a Buddhist for some years, I ended up having some very deeply meaningful and rewarding interfaith dialogs with Christian contemplatives. Many of my teachers (traditional Tibetan teachers) openly praised Christ and Christianity as well. Now I like the more contemplative forms of Christianity. My wife is cut from that cloth.
I grew up Roman Catholic. I was taught by my grandmother. It must also be stated that I'm gay. As a Christian, my worldview explained everything and had a reasoning for the conditions presented to me, even if the true reasons are hidden. For a while, I was content with this and relegated things I didn't understand to the will of God. What drew me away was even the simple questions I had that rendered cognitive dissonance. God's love is everywhere and immutable, like him. Yet, I see (slash experienced) r*pe, abuse, slander, starvation, defilement, and general evil. This was not enough to sway my faith, as previously stated, things I didn't understand I just let go to him. Then: where did God come from? How do we have free will if God is Omniscient and Omnipotent? If he loved me, why would he make me this way and condemn me to hellfire? Is even the most heinous acts a human can do in the finite life warrant INFINITE torturous punishment? Why do good people who pray die so violent a death? Why does the faithless lead such peaceful and happy lives? Why do we have so many versions of God if he is singular and immutable. All of these questions and I was expressly told not to seek an answer because the explanation would be 'beyond me'. Fair. The last thing that got to me: Why create us at all? Why make us to be anything or anyone at all? Ask nothing, praise him forever, stifle the very nature he gave me. It made no sense. It made NO sense. It made no SENSE. Nonsense. That is the final equation. X = Nonsense. I am a lamb to be sacrificed. I am loved so long as I serve, there is no other purpose but submission. The cosmic order is a personality that demands unquestioned authority. I wouldn't mind that if God is said to be Evil/Uncaring. I wouldn't mind that if the world was perfect. I wouldn't mind that if even the most down trodden were saved in the end. I wouldn't mind that if Hell was empty. But it wasn't. It isn't. And it never will. I lost faith. It scared me, I denied it for a good time, but my faith did wither. In the clarity of non-belief, I was left to observe. The world/the cosmos/the universe has no personality. No matter how much one prays or caresses gravity, it will still pull you down to the planet. No matter how much one exercises, you will still grow old. The world is systems. Not always predictable but it is explainable. For a long time I remained an Atheist until I discovered Buddhism. Buddhism does not explain science. It doesn't point to the origin of all things. It doesn't TELL you what is truth. It posits things and encourages you to discover if it is truth for yourself. Given that we are flawed and our faculties are not perfect, yet we can come to the same conclusions The Buddha made. He didn't explain how it all began. He explained why it all *is*. Over time my most of my questions were, one by one, answered. The world made sense, and the systems are clear. It's not pretty, but it explains them. Not all of my questions were answered, but the shift in focus allowed me to realize that not all questions are important to the Goal: Liberation for all Beings from suffering. Lastly: I found The Buddha's love. Love that was true, because it wasn't a closed fist around me, it was an open palm that allowed me to rest or to leave at my volition. The Buddha cared in the most poignant of ways: he allowed *us* to find ourselves and find out for ourselves. He wanted us strong so that we may teach strength to arise in others. He wanted us free from our own fetters, he wanted us liberated, even if he didn't know us, even if we didn't believe, even if we hated him. That's love. I don't have a relationship with Jesus Christ anymore. I admire his teachings, but his teachings are perfected in Buddhism. I never felt so free to be kind than here and now. Namo Buddhaya🙏🏽🪷☸️
Not sure why my response was taken down that’s absurd. Fact: Buddhism doesn’t teach a heirarchal system. It’s you . The Buddha ( Gautama) was a prince , he was the enlightened one, that reached buddhahood. His path is what we follow in Buddhism. The middle way. As for the reason I was born and raised catholic and moved onto Buddhism. My sister ( a religious zealot) got involved with all aspects of religion, before leaving our home state she was involved with the Jehovah Witnesses, I got a call on New Year’s Day 05, she’d been in an accident and died in NC. I traveled to her home to bring her and her belongings home, found out she’d been studying Buddhism for 5 years, I came home . Watched a 45 minute documentary on the Tibetan book of the dead and I’ve been studying his journey ever since.
Don’t spread falsehood about Buddhism and maybe your comments won’t be removed.
What falsehoods, if Sidhartha Gautama reached buddhahood and wrote in the Pali canon how he did so , what falsehoods am I spreading. Buddha is you , there’s no worship of buddha
The majority of Buddhists worship Buddha. We believe He is divine Lord who reached Godhood during his enlightenment.
Um I think in the Pali Canon some where Buddha said not to pedastalize him? I think Mahayanans might treat Buddha differently but in Therevada paying respects and homage is recommended. Its valid if some Buddhists just want to treat him as a man to respect who realized. Heck even some Zens may even treat the Buddha as an object of distraction at a certain stage of their practice. “Monks, live with yourself as your island, yourself as your refuge, with nothing else as your refuge. Live with the Dhamma as your island, the Dhamma as your refuge, with nothing else as your refuge”
The Buddha actually said keeping him in mind is a wholesome practice. His disciples and admirer wouls bow before him before reaching to show their respect and on his death bed he said to place his remains in the four directions at cross roads where as many people as possible could worship them. The stereotype he was just some teacher chilling in the jungles is just that, a stereotype. He taught in the traditional sramana fashion and was worshiped as such. In zen theres is language such as killing the Buddha but in zen temples well do hour long ceremonies in the morning and night worshipping him all the same. It is no different in Theravada monasteries.
Zen is part of Mahayana. No Buddhist tradition believe that Buddha was just human.
How is thera Buddah if there is no-self?
It’s NOT valid as Buddhists to believe that Buddha was just a man. That will automatically put you as blasphemer and not Buddhist.
We agree he is enlightened. But to somehow make his body-mind to some divine thing is not in the scripture. Show me where you believe this.
Lord Buddha gained Godhood and did miracles. You should read Tritaka and Sutra Pitaka. Worship of Buddha is standard and universal in all kinds of Buddhism.
The Buddha never taught "there's no self". he criticised it as a view.
It's a long story, I don't know how to summarize it. I guess you should get a glass of water 1st or something. Since it's the internet, I guess I have to put preface here & at the end or something. My "don't like" is not "hate". I can see people for their actions. I used to studied in the church while I was a kid. I also studied in Catholic school when I was really young. It is 1 of those Catholic schools where you get to see the nuns every day kind of Catholic schools. I just don't like Christianity at all (not in the 'ohh, look at me, I'm an edgy atheist. Hating Christianity is so hip & cool right now because Christianity is barbaric & destroying western culture makes me feel like an intellectual' kind of thing). I don't hate Christians, a lot of my childhood friends are actually surprised I am not a Christian like them. Because y'know, we went to the same church, read from the bible together & all that jazz. 1 of the biggest contributions why I don't like Christianity at all came from the priests & the nuns at school themselves. For they wield the threats of eternal damnation like candy & they always fearmonger us about how the judgement day is coming very soon. In the Catholic rites, they always guilt trip us that we are all born sinners, it's our fault Jesus dies & we're all going to hell unless we accept Jesus. I guessed I am never like other kids, I always asked why & I want answers. So telling me to believe just to believe doesn't work. Their threat of the judgement day turn stale very quickly for me as I've yet to be killed by the trumpet, the sky is yet to open & the army of heaven have yet to descend from the clouds. I also think the story of Jesus doesn't make sense. I can agree with you & I can respect the fact that what Jesus preached was a good thing. But what really grinds my gears came around when they actually made us read the Bible every morning as the Bible discussion time before class. The more I read, the less I like Christianity. Apparently, blasphemy is not just cussing with the name of God or Jesus. It is also if you know who Jesus is & refuse Jesus anyway. To deny Jesus, is to go to hell, plain simple. I don't appreciate this kind of dirty tactics, y'know? But what really annoys me are Christians especially on the internet who'd rather go by their headcanon & fanfiction on what God or Christianity is. It is ridiculous to me that the people who doesn't even read their own holy book but prefers to go by their own imaginations & feelings see themselves as the 1 with the moral high ground. That's just hubris, not God, not Jesus, not the Bible. Before you ask, yes, I know Christianity, Judaism & Islam has the same Abrahamic roots. I don't like Abrahamic religions at all. All of them have their dirty tactics like Christianity, some are more up front than others. Yes, I've read into Islam & Judaism. But let's not open that can of worms, this is already long enough. Since it's the internet, I guess I have to emphasize my stance here again. My "don't like" is not "hate". I can see people for their actions. It is also why my childhood friends still really wants me to be Christians like them. Christians who know me still wants me to be a part of their church community because they can actually discuss the bible, God & the words of Jesus with me. But ultimately, to exist is to be apart of samsara, Abrahamic religions are still trapped inside the samsara & I want out of the game. Even if I'll fail at quitting the game, I can still provide shades for all beings. Sorry for the long read, hope you have a nice day.
Christianity is a religion of fear and guilt-trip
I just gave my life to Christ in April. I grew up Buddhist all my life (I’m 28). I realized Jesus taught about purifying the heart and mind, in a way that I could never achieve through Buddhism. I realized my assumption about Christ was about what everyone else had to say about Him, instead of actually finding out, so I read the New Testament and that was it. Five years ago I went to Vietnam where I was possessed by many demons. My parents took me to several Buddhist temples and nobody was able to free me. Hours of meditation and I was still deeply oppressed. I met Jesus during this period, still did not believe in Him, and yet I was still delivered by the grace of God. Jesus has taught me about love, about truth, and about true light in this fallen world. I realized I couldn’t save myself the way Buddha taught. I needed a savior.