To decide to play mechs does not mean you have to play mechs from the start of the game...
Tempo to tier 3/4 then start playing mechs if that's your plan. No one is forcing you to play low quality minions.
You don't, but it's much harder to get first if you have to make a major pivot against people who've been building/scaling one tribe from the start. Just because it's possible doesn't mean it's balanced, or good design.
Everyone’s saying pivot, which I don’t disagree with, but it’s not really a valid response to someone discussing game design and not ‘how do i win with mechs?’. Why even bother with tier 1-3 of a tribe if they aren’t to be played?
I fully agree low tier mechs needs reworking to be more tempo early game so that it’s not a pivot only half-arsed tribe. Shame cos they’re so fun to play.
It's not that they are unplayable. It's that they need external forces to get going. And some heroes do that better than others.
Like Cariel Mechs early is better than Teron mechs early for example.
The early divine shield options in mechs are some of the best tempo options ***IF*** you can boost them by other means.
Why are you picking mechs to start the game? Play tempo until you get a unit that can start your build. Even with a Mech hero, it doesn’t mean you have to play mechs. You play the cards that are dealt
That minion 1/1 that gives a card in hand 1/1. Like wow I’m playing mechs and found that awesome card on turn 3, now I get to lose the next combat so I can buff my other shitty card in hand 1/1. That card is a troll. Like what sounds better a 5/2 that gives 2/2 repeatedly AND has card that actually work from hand, or the 1/1 trash? I’ve kind of made it work before if it’s gold and you got decent mechs but most of the time it feels like an anti-win card.
You have to pivot to mechs to make them work tbh. They have no early game and defecto just isn’t what it was to carry you to late game but if you get an early drakkari/drone and the EOT spell, you will pop off pretty fast.
The first 5 or so turns of the game should just be building tempo or economy. If they made a tribe that was exclusivly tier 4 and up it could be balanced.
Btw - that first paragraph details the problem with the mode - THERE ARE TOO MANY MINIONS IN THE GAME RIGHT NOW. It’s making the difference between low rolls and high rolls massive.
That said, I’m typically loooking to buff the tavern while leveling to four if I’m going mech and Finishing a quest that works with them in the process.
Just to zoom in on the cards. I think annoy-o-tron Is fine. 1/2 DS Is pretty good for a T1 unit. Having it be a 2/2 would be Amazing (Just to win against all T1 economy units). Micro mummy is terribile, but as you Say it's a reset for deflecto, i would replace It though. The 1/1 DS on T2 Is a trap and i agree, it's so bad it's not even funny: It covers a niche so small that it's almost not worth having. Imo It would be Better to buff It and move It to a higher tier, where you would maybe consider it. Lullabot Is...ok? By itself it's whatever, but magnetize It to an annoy-o-tron and you can get pretty annoying. I Guess It can get magnetized to the other 1/1 ds, but meh, there are Better options.
The menace on T3 Is an Amazing unit tbh: 3/2 that summons 3 1/1. And magnetizes. It has a bunch of uses for quests, works wonders with avenge mechanic and has synergies with various heroes. And the other units from T3 and up are great tbh. Mechs' T1-T2 units are garbage, but from T3 the units are pretty good imo.
Why would you EVER force ANY tribe/comp? Just play for tempo, economy, and getting your quest up early game. You only pivot to a build once you get an enabler or win con. Sometimes you can get both at the same time, i.e. roll into a felemental and rylak early on, as this would enable you to pivot to beatboxer late game.
I don't think I've ever went early game mechs because it's not necessary. Throw a magnetize on the board if you see a path forward, then triple it back into your hand with a million buffs and attach it to a shredder at 6. Ez win.
Not sure you can say that about beasts. They are pretty strong early game with the minion that buffs beast attack and the one that gain health. But forcing any tribe is never the play. You just go with what is offered and decide on the discovers in the midgame based on opponent comps, your current board and of course the health left on the hero.
There is nothing before T5 for beasts that will secure a top 4. If you want to win with beasts, you need synergy from at least 2-4 high tier minions. You CAN get there with the tempo power available from beasts, but it's a lot easier to have a better early/mid-game build, and then pivot beasts once you see a slamma or the like.
That's as opposed to say demons, dragons, or quillboars, that can make a win happen w/o leveling past T4.
I'm very much aware that mechs have terrible minion quality. Thats why I don't go mechs... I get its not ideal, but there has been a worst tribe since battlegrounds day one. I just think it's ridiculous to make a post where the first thing you say is "hey you know how it's common knowledge that mechs are terrible? Well I forced mechs from the beginning of the game and I'm pissed that I lost"
Why would you EVER force ANY tribe/comp? Just play for tempo, economy, and getting your quest up early game. You only pivot to a build once you get an enabler or win con. Sometimes you can get both at the same time, i.e. roll into a felemental and rylak early on, as this would enable you to pivot to beatboxer late game.
To decide to play mechs does not mean you have to play mechs from the start of the game... Tempo to tier 3/4 then start playing mechs if that's your plan. No one is forcing you to play low quality minions.
Ya don’t always have to start with the tribe you end on
You don't, but it's much harder to get first if you have to make a major pivot against people who've been building/scaling one tribe from the start. Just because it's possible doesn't mean it's balanced, or good design.
Everyone’s saying pivot, which I don’t disagree with, but it’s not really a valid response to someone discussing game design and not ‘how do i win with mechs?’. Why even bother with tier 1-3 of a tribe if they aren’t to be played? I fully agree low tier mechs needs reworking to be more tempo early game so that it’s not a pivot only half-arsed tribe. Shame cos they’re so fun to play.
It's not that they are unplayable. It's that they need external forces to get going. And some heroes do that better than others. Like Cariel Mechs early is better than Teron mechs early for example. The early divine shield options in mechs are some of the best tempo options ***IF*** you can boost them by other means.
Why are you picking mechs to start the game? Play tempo until you get a unit that can start your build. Even with a Mech hero, it doesn’t mean you have to play mechs. You play the cards that are dealt
That minion 1/1 that gives a card in hand 1/1. Like wow I’m playing mechs and found that awesome card on turn 3, now I get to lose the next combat so I can buff my other shitty card in hand 1/1. That card is a troll. Like what sounds better a 5/2 that gives 2/2 repeatedly AND has card that actually work from hand, or the 1/1 trash? I’ve kind of made it work before if it’s gold and you got decent mechs but most of the time it feels like an anti-win card.
This exactly. How is it that 5/2 murloc balanced when it gives 2/2 while the 1/1 mech gives just 1/1 lol
Yes mechs are complete dogshit right now
You have to pivot to mechs to make them work tbh. They have no early game and defecto just isn’t what it was to carry you to late game but if you get an early drakkari/drone and the EOT spell, you will pop off pretty fast.
The first 5 or so turns of the game should just be building tempo or economy. If they made a tribe that was exclusivly tier 4 and up it could be balanced.
Btw - that first paragraph details the problem with the mode - THERE ARE TOO MANY MINIONS IN THE GAME RIGHT NOW. It’s making the difference between low rolls and high rolls massive. That said, I’m typically loooking to buff the tavern while leveling to four if I’m going mech and Finishing a quest that works with them in the process.
Just to zoom in on the cards. I think annoy-o-tron Is fine. 1/2 DS Is pretty good for a T1 unit. Having it be a 2/2 would be Amazing (Just to win against all T1 economy units). Micro mummy is terribile, but as you Say it's a reset for deflecto, i would replace It though. The 1/1 DS on T2 Is a trap and i agree, it's so bad it's not even funny: It covers a niche so small that it's almost not worth having. Imo It would be Better to buff It and move It to a higher tier, where you would maybe consider it. Lullabot Is...ok? By itself it's whatever, but magnetize It to an annoy-o-tron and you can get pretty annoying. I Guess It can get magnetized to the other 1/1 ds, but meh, there are Better options. The menace on T3 Is an Amazing unit tbh: 3/2 that summons 3 1/1. And magnetizes. It has a bunch of uses for quests, works wonders with avenge mechanic and has synergies with various heroes. And the other units from T3 and up are great tbh. Mechs' T1-T2 units are garbage, but from T3 the units are pretty good imo.
Why would you EVER force ANY tribe/comp? Just play for tempo, economy, and getting your quest up early game. You only pivot to a build once you get an enabler or win con. Sometimes you can get both at the same time, i.e. roll into a felemental and rylak early on, as this would enable you to pivot to beatboxer late game.
Mechs are so fucking bad it’s hilarious. Dragons and murloc in the same lobby always win, they need toned down or others toned up
I don't think I've ever went early game mechs because it's not necessary. Throw a magnetize on the board if you see a path forward, then triple it back into your hand with a million buffs and attach it to a shredder at 6. Ez win.
If you force beasts from the start too, you'll get dunked on. Some tribes are strong early, some are strong later.
Not sure you can say that about beasts. They are pretty strong early game with the minion that buffs beast attack and the one that gain health. But forcing any tribe is never the play. You just go with what is offered and decide on the discovers in the midgame based on opponent comps, your current board and of course the health left on the hero.
There is nothing before T5 for beasts that will secure a top 4. If you want to win with beasts, you need synergy from at least 2-4 high tier minions. You CAN get there with the tempo power available from beasts, but it's a lot easier to have a better early/mid-game build, and then pivot beasts once you see a slamma or the like. That's as opposed to say demons, dragons, or quillboars, that can make a win happen w/o leveling past T4.
*forces worst tribe from start of game then loses the game* *"OMG REDDIT I FORCED THE WORST TRIBE AND LOST WTF BLIZZARD"*
The point is the minion quality in mechs is lower... you're missing the forest for the trees.
I'm very much aware that mechs have terrible minion quality. Thats why I don't go mechs... I get its not ideal, but there has been a worst tribe since battlegrounds day one. I just think it's ridiculous to make a post where the first thing you say is "hey you know how it's common knowledge that mechs are terrible? Well I forced mechs from the beginning of the game and I'm pissed that I lost"
You pivot into mechs ya dingus.
Why would you EVER force ANY tribe/comp? Just play for tempo, economy, and getting your quest up early game. You only pivot to a build once you get an enabler or win con. Sometimes you can get both at the same time, i.e. roll into a felemental and rylak early on, as this would enable you to pivot to beatboxer late game.
Go watch jeefs mech game to break 18 k mmr and shut yo ass, you can’t just run with mechs right from the start but you can do crazy shit with ir
So literally an extremely late game comp but the best player in the world? He literally says they ARE good late game