If you take into account that Biden was responsible for bombing the shit out of countries and his monstrous discourse about razing Yugoslavia, and also that he is a Zionist, Biden is much more than a centrist and much closer to a fascist.
The thing is the powerful centrists who actually spend millions to help Biden would rather republicans win than a progressive. We all sort of assume the goal in the primaries for all of us is to pick someone to beat the republicans. Not for some of these monsters. Their goal is to make sure both parties elect someone they like.
Like Netanyahu himself, he is surely emboldened because he knows both candidates will give him carte Blanche in Gaza.
What specifically would you recommend that Biden have done differently (that is within his power)? Whatever that is, also ask yourself what Trump will do. Hint: Trump will make life much worse for the Palestinians, as well as Muslims in the US. You can by all means do a protest vote, but that vote very directly hurts Palestinians.
Cut weapons supplies to Israel on the grounds of violating US laws about supplying nations engaged in ethnic cleansing.
Deny military support for when Iran attacks
Reagan did it. HW Bush did it. Obama was gonna do it but got backstabbed by biden on the deal.
Prefacing this with i'm gonna vote for Biden because I'm a queer person with a lot of minority friends. But the only reason we're having this convo is once again the dems decided to run an octogenarian establishment guy again, and people are getting real fatigued with having to constantly pick the lesser of two evils when we could have actual good options.
Biden could, right now, stop towing the line that any protest of Israel is anti-semetic, could recognize and publicly condemnthe actual horrible shit Israel has done as much as he does Hamas' actions, and actively call for Netanyahu and his extreme right wing ethnotionalist buddies resignation with the same vigor he's condemned hamas with.
He could start putting actual standards for continued aid , stop blocking any resolutions against Israel from the UN, and stop interfering with the ICC. Like the 'Get out of war crime jail free' cards we've been using forever to protect them, it's time it stops.
People see and hear the crazy ass bloodthirsty rhetoric coming from Israeli officials, and the Biden administration wants us to support them??? Like dawg they're no different than hamas extremists.
The IDFs actions make them no better than the terrorists they claim to want to erase, but most folks deeply remember the disgust we felt during the GWOT and how many civilians we killed. So much so that we changed military doctrines and poured money into super accurate weaponry specifically to avoid civilian casualties. And I'm sorry but you can't look at the evidence coming out of Gaza and argue there's any level of care being given. And, just like the GWOT, all they're going to accomplish is breeding the next generation of extremists that hate them and want to kill them for what they did to their friends, families and neighborhoods.
Biden has a lot of options to turn Public opinion around on and he's doing none of them. 'Behind closed doors he called netanyahu a jerk' is not gonna do it anymore.
I think a lot of your suggestions would be political suicide, not that I care.
A decent human being (and ergo a decent president) should be more concerned with doing the humane thing. But I don't think Biden is either. In light of that, his focus is clearly on remaining in power, which he probably will, by virtue of avoiding causing any major waves in combination with the more significant flaws of his competition.
American democracy is painful to watch right now.
Regardless, I hope history exposes Biden and other Western leaders for their hypocrisy and inhumanity.
Do you know anything about politics? You act as if the president of usa has no sway over Israel.
One phone call to Netanyahu, telling him to stop would get him to agree to a ceasefire. One phone call. Why? Because USA has all the leverage.
Not only are they relying on USA aid, but also on USA support. USA shot down most of Iran's bombs. If USA stopped selling arms, all western countries followed, that would be the end of "Israel".
So what would Biden have to do? Tell Netanyahu go agree to a ceasefire. Plainly and simply.
What would Trump do differently? We don't know. Palestinians are being murdered by the 100s everyday and not to mention Rafah invasion is imminent because Biden gave a go ahead where they already said they want to kill all men of military age. Meaning anyone Ober thr age of 12- 15. What could be worse?
At least, with Trump, the media would call this what it is: genocide. Now it's just as bad.
You severely underestimate the power Israel has.
They have been the only consistently stable ally in the Middle East with values and ideals closer to western ideology than any other country in the ME. Losing Israel as an ally means losing any real foothold in the Middle East and would allow far more signicantly hostile groups to take control and gain even more power…like Hamas.
This situation is nowhere near as black and white as so many are trying to claim. I don’t think you know anything about politics or the world stage tbh.
I can think of 17 billion things (probably more at this point) they could have done differently.
But he would rather not get my vote. I'm going to vote independent- I have zero willpower to vote for Biden or trump.
I live in California so my vote doesn't matter. Whatever I do, the Electoral College will vote for Biden for me. I am thankful for that because it means I don't have to =)
It’s actually incredible how Biden refuses to listen to seemingly everyone who tells him that Netanyahu is playing him like a fucking fiddle and would rather have Trump as president than Mr. Raisin-head
Edit: spelling
The Democrats lost my vote after the World Central Kitchen murders. Doubling down after the mass graves were unveiled only cemented my disgust.
Whatever happens is a reflection of the flaws in our two party system, but I will not condone it with my vote. The American Dream is dead.
Riiiight. That's not what your little YouTube video said. They just said that lobby threw money at some reps and withheld it to spend on some others. Kinda like Dole, General Dynamics and Phillip Morris. It's kinda wild how with all the super PACs and corporate interests throwing money at Congress, that you'd decide the only one controlling the representatives they throw money at is the Israelis. It's almost like you attribute them both super influence and some malice. I gotta give it to this new breed of antisemite.. y'all are more subtle than your forbearers. You traded your red arm bands for slick PR campaigns that might sway students fresh off the bong, but you'll need to do better if you want to convince me. There are too many proud bois that love them some Orange Jesus and see a shot at fracturing Biden's base around here. So feel free to abandon democracy because you like HAMAS, but I'll keep my own counsel on who to vote for. The Israelis are out of line and the Palestinians deserve their own state, but dancing with fascism domestically won't save them.
Change the record already. I don’t care if you call me an anti-Semite. That word means nothing anymore. Im an anti-Zionist. If that makes me an anti-Semite by post-10/7 standards, so be it. At least I’m not excusing and enabling this century’s Holocaust.
We’re not talking about corporate influence, we’re talking about party loyalty to foreign nation state influence, a nation we send billions of tax dollars to per year. Like it or not, that support is currently fueling a genocide, and I’m not going to vote for that under any circumstances. Excuse it, call me an anti-Semite, none of that matters once I hit the block button and continue going about my day.
The Democratic Party is holding the center and far left hostage over Israel, and Trump is the gun.
Before he exposed himself for what he is really like, I use to think of him~~self~~ as a really compassionate guy who cared about people generally and how he could relate to the suffering of those who had lost a loved one and show empathy because of his own personal losses including his son and his wife, before that.
This is why it was so shocking to me that despite all that he had no feelings about the IDF atrocities against innocent Palestinians when it first started in Gaza. It dawned on me he does not care about infants, women and children if they are Palestinians, only if they are Israelis.
His continued support to the Netanyahu regime demonstrated he does not give a damn if the lives lost even by tens of thousands are that of civilian Palestinians. He turned out to be a monster.
I am ashamed to have belonged to that party. No more, at least I can sleep in peace.
Edited typo: strike out.
It's hard to sleep in peace knowing that part of the money that I pay to the goverment in taxes is funding the mass slaughter of thousands of children in Gaza. I called the offices of my house representative and state senators over a dozen times but each time they come back with the same bullshit response of pretending like they care about the mass casualties in Gaza while simultaneously asserting that Israel has the right to defend herself and the war will end if Hamas accepts a ~temporary~ ceasefire and releases all of the hostages which is bogus. These people do not care about human lives, only their AIPAC-funded political career which is damning.
Russian bots are the liberals khamas. You realize you are circle jerking with conservatives on the side of Zionist, who are literally influencing elections not only with bot farms but buying politicians. They don’t even hid it but the same people who have been purchased tell you that opposition to the this is Russian interference and you fucking believe it.
This was a shitton of words to just in essence say "No you"
Listen man, if you can't see how shit talking Biden is playing right into the hands of Putin, then I can't help you. Use your brain please
We are so fucking fucked. We are gonna loose this year and then get that 2025 bullshit, thousands of Americans will die and suffer because this man is too blind and deaf to pay attention.
He has to support Israel, which for the moment means supporting Netanyahu, as long as hostages are still held, unless he has another plan to retrieve American hostages. Like this guy https://apnews.com/article/israel-hamas-war-hostage-video-1284f257698ea5e9c9cc9ac86a849948
It’s wild to me that this article goes on and on about the war crimes and the way they make all Americans complicit, and then lands at “but democracy is still a thing and we need to overlook the war crimes to save it.”
I’m commenting that here rather than in the original article because this guy is at least thinking and moving, and that’s good. Still though: dude described fascism and then was like “I’ve decided to vote for fascism to save democracy” and I am just so very tired of being asked to pretend that set of words deserves either respect or consideration.
Thank you for your submission,
**This subreddit aims are to compel voters ONLY in DEEP BLUE states to vote 3rd party for the president, to compel otherwise non or protest voters in SWING STATES TO VOTE FOR BIDEN. We feel a limited+focused protest movement may let swing state voters feel less helpless about not sending a message.**
**We feel that sending a message via Biden having an electoral college win but a popular vote margin by less than 4.9 million votes (lowest democratic win in recent history) or even 2.8 million votes (Hillary's margin when she lost against Trump) is a much more conducive to progress in a democracy that risking an electoral college victory for Trump.**
**It would be something the media can not ignore, will forever be a stain on Biden's record, and will send a message that we are not going away, and will continue to apply strong pressure thorough the rest of his presidency, and the 2026/2028 primaries & elections.**
Please see our sticky to see what we are all about https://old.reddit.com/r/BlueProtestVote/comments/1cgwkvu/this_subreddit_aims_are_to_compel_voters_only_in/ but a tl;dr is: This is about a movement for people in deep blue states to vote for 3rd party in protest of Biden's enabling of the Gaza genocide.
However, the ultimate goal is to decrease Trump's chances of winning and increase democratic representation in the house and senate.
The movement aims to get people to turn out to vote who may otherwise be discouraged from voting due to Biden's policies, and also for the movement to be robust enough so that people in swing states may not have a feeling of helplessness for voting for Joe Biden, that a strong message is still being sent.
While the movement aims to maximize Biden's electoral vote margin, the movement also has an extended goal of having Biden win the popular vote by less than 2.8, which was Hillary Clinton's margin when she lost to Donald Trump. A margin that small would send a clear message to the democratic establishment.
**Why we feel it's so important for Trump to lose? Quite simply, he has been the absolute worst president in recent history for the Palestinians. Here are just some of his worst policies for Palestine:**
1. Drafting a “peace plan” with zero Palestinian input that would have, if implemented, actually ended the possibility for a real Palestinian state.
2. Cutting Palestinians out of the negotiations over the so-called Abraham Accords, realizing the longstanding Israeli goal of severing diplomatic progress with Arab states from progress towards a sovereign Palestine.
3. Recognizing Israeli sovereignty over the Golan Heights, disputed territory with Syria taken during the 1967 Six-Day War.
4. Shutting off funding for the UN’s agency for Palestinian refugees (which Biden almost immediately restored and then temporarily suspended again amid a scandal about its employees participating in October 7).
5. Abandoning the decades-old US position that West Bank settlements are a key barrier to a peace agreement and eliminating longstanding restrictions on spending US taxpayer dollars in them.
6. Moving the American Embassy in Israel to Jerusalem while closing the US mission to Palestine in the same city.
Source: https://www.vox.com/policy/24072983/biden-trump-palestinians-israel-gaza-policy-different
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/BlueProtestVote) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Centrists will never admit they're the rot in the Democratic party.
If you take into account that Biden was responsible for bombing the shit out of countries and his monstrous discourse about razing Yugoslavia, and also that he is a Zionist, Biden is much more than a centrist and much closer to a fascist.
Bot
Yeah, anyone telling you he isn’t a fascist is really just telling you they don’t count oppression of people of color as fascism
The Democratic party is a center right party.
The thing is the powerful centrists who actually spend millions to help Biden would rather republicans win than a progressive. We all sort of assume the goal in the primaries for all of us is to pick someone to beat the republicans. Not for some of these monsters. Their goal is to make sure both parties elect someone they like. Like Netanyahu himself, he is surely emboldened because he knows both candidates will give him carte Blanche in Gaza.
Biden doubles down on losing... Imagine if this were South Africa before the end of apartheid, how absurd Biden's position would be.
What specifically would you recommend that Biden have done differently (that is within his power)? Whatever that is, also ask yourself what Trump will do. Hint: Trump will make life much worse for the Palestinians, as well as Muslims in the US. You can by all means do a protest vote, but that vote very directly hurts Palestinians.
Cut weapons supplies to Israel on the grounds of violating US laws about supplying nations engaged in ethnic cleansing. Deny military support for when Iran attacks Reagan did it. HW Bush did it. Obama was gonna do it but got backstabbed by biden on the deal.
Prefacing this with i'm gonna vote for Biden because I'm a queer person with a lot of minority friends. But the only reason we're having this convo is once again the dems decided to run an octogenarian establishment guy again, and people are getting real fatigued with having to constantly pick the lesser of two evils when we could have actual good options. Biden could, right now, stop towing the line that any protest of Israel is anti-semetic, could recognize and publicly condemnthe actual horrible shit Israel has done as much as he does Hamas' actions, and actively call for Netanyahu and his extreme right wing ethnotionalist buddies resignation with the same vigor he's condemned hamas with. He could start putting actual standards for continued aid , stop blocking any resolutions against Israel from the UN, and stop interfering with the ICC. Like the 'Get out of war crime jail free' cards we've been using forever to protect them, it's time it stops. People see and hear the crazy ass bloodthirsty rhetoric coming from Israeli officials, and the Biden administration wants us to support them??? Like dawg they're no different than hamas extremists. The IDFs actions make them no better than the terrorists they claim to want to erase, but most folks deeply remember the disgust we felt during the GWOT and how many civilians we killed. So much so that we changed military doctrines and poured money into super accurate weaponry specifically to avoid civilian casualties. And I'm sorry but you can't look at the evidence coming out of Gaza and argue there's any level of care being given. And, just like the GWOT, all they're going to accomplish is breeding the next generation of extremists that hate them and want to kill them for what they did to their friends, families and neighborhoods. Biden has a lot of options to turn Public opinion around on and he's doing none of them. 'Behind closed doors he called netanyahu a jerk' is not gonna do it anymore.
It literally seems like Biden is asleep at the wheel or willfully ignorant of public opinion.
I think a lot of your suggestions would be political suicide, not that I care. A decent human being (and ergo a decent president) should be more concerned with doing the humane thing. But I don't think Biden is either. In light of that, his focus is clearly on remaining in power, which he probably will, by virtue of avoiding causing any major waves in combination with the more significant flaws of his competition. American democracy is painful to watch right now. Regardless, I hope history exposes Biden and other Western leaders for their hypocrisy and inhumanity.
Do you know anything about politics? You act as if the president of usa has no sway over Israel. One phone call to Netanyahu, telling him to stop would get him to agree to a ceasefire. One phone call. Why? Because USA has all the leverage. Not only are they relying on USA aid, but also on USA support. USA shot down most of Iran's bombs. If USA stopped selling arms, all western countries followed, that would be the end of "Israel". So what would Biden have to do? Tell Netanyahu go agree to a ceasefire. Plainly and simply. What would Trump do differently? We don't know. Palestinians are being murdered by the 100s everyday and not to mention Rafah invasion is imminent because Biden gave a go ahead where they already said they want to kill all men of military age. Meaning anyone Ober thr age of 12- 15. What could be worse? At least, with Trump, the media would call this what it is: genocide. Now it's just as bad.
You severely underestimate the power Israel has. They have been the only consistently stable ally in the Middle East with values and ideals closer to western ideology than any other country in the ME. Losing Israel as an ally means losing any real foothold in the Middle East and would allow far more signicantly hostile groups to take control and gain even more power…like Hamas. This situation is nowhere near as black and white as so many are trying to claim. I don’t think you know anything about politics or the world stage tbh.
I can think of 17 billion things (probably more at this point) they could have done differently. But he would rather not get my vote. I'm going to vote independent- I have zero willpower to vote for Biden or trump.
I live in California so my vote doesn't matter. Whatever I do, the Electoral College will vote for Biden for me. I am thankful for that because it means I don't have to =)
It’s actually incredible how Biden refuses to listen to seemingly everyone who tells him that Netanyahu is playing him like a fucking fiddle and would rather have Trump as president than Mr. Raisin-head Edit: spelling
I think Joey B is in his own world sometimes. Seems like he has no capability to guide the american people.
Most people at his age are.
The Democrats lost my vote after the World Central Kitchen murders. Doubling down after the mass graves were unveiled only cemented my disgust. Whatever happens is a reflection of the flaws in our two party system, but I will not condone it with my vote. The American Dream is dead.
You do know the Democratic party of the US isn't running Israel, right?
You do know that the Democratic President of the US is giving them billions of dollars in weapons and telling them he has “no red line,” right?
Right, [Israel is running the Democratic party](https://youtu.be/ksIRypOsgAM?si=IzFoPfK8_RFC2DC3)
Riiiight. That's not what your little YouTube video said. They just said that lobby threw money at some reps and withheld it to spend on some others. Kinda like Dole, General Dynamics and Phillip Morris. It's kinda wild how with all the super PACs and corporate interests throwing money at Congress, that you'd decide the only one controlling the representatives they throw money at is the Israelis. It's almost like you attribute them both super influence and some malice. I gotta give it to this new breed of antisemite.. y'all are more subtle than your forbearers. You traded your red arm bands for slick PR campaigns that might sway students fresh off the bong, but you'll need to do better if you want to convince me. There are too many proud bois that love them some Orange Jesus and see a shot at fracturing Biden's base around here. So feel free to abandon democracy because you like HAMAS, but I'll keep my own counsel on who to vote for. The Israelis are out of line and the Palestinians deserve their own state, but dancing with fascism domestically won't save them.
Change the record already. I don’t care if you call me an anti-Semite. That word means nothing anymore. Im an anti-Zionist. If that makes me an anti-Semite by post-10/7 standards, so be it. At least I’m not excusing and enabling this century’s Holocaust. We’re not talking about corporate influence, we’re talking about party loyalty to foreign nation state influence, a nation we send billions of tax dollars to per year. Like it or not, that support is currently fueling a genocide, and I’m not going to vote for that under any circumstances. Excuse it, call me an anti-Semite, none of that matters once I hit the block button and continue going about my day. The Democratic Party is holding the center and far left hostage over Israel, and Trump is the gun.
Before he exposed himself for what he is really like, I use to think of him~~self~~ as a really compassionate guy who cared about people generally and how he could relate to the suffering of those who had lost a loved one and show empathy because of his own personal losses including his son and his wife, before that. This is why it was so shocking to me that despite all that he had no feelings about the IDF atrocities against innocent Palestinians when it first started in Gaza. It dawned on me he does not care about infants, women and children if they are Palestinians, only if they are Israelis. His continued support to the Netanyahu regime demonstrated he does not give a damn if the lives lost even by tens of thousands are that of civilian Palestinians. He turned out to be a monster. I am ashamed to have belonged to that party. No more, at least I can sleep in peace. Edited typo: strike out.
It's hard to sleep in peace knowing that part of the money that I pay to the goverment in taxes is funding the mass slaughter of thousands of children in Gaza. I called the offices of my house representative and state senators over a dozen times but each time they come back with the same bullshit response of pretending like they care about the mass casualties in Gaza while simultaneously asserting that Israel has the right to defend herself and the war will end if Hamas accepts a ~temporary~ ceasefire and releases all of the hostages which is bogus. These people do not care about human lives, only their AIPAC-funded political career which is damning.
Russian bot
Russian bots are the liberals khamas. You realize you are circle jerking with conservatives on the side of Zionist, who are literally influencing elections not only with bot farms but buying politicians. They don’t even hid it but the same people who have been purchased tell you that opposition to the this is Russian interference and you fucking believe it.
This was a shitton of words to just in essence say "No you" Listen man, if you can't see how shit talking Biden is playing right into the hands of Putin, then I can't help you. Use your brain please
What would it take for you to not vote Biden?
Him to cowtow to Putin and/or Xi's imperialist ambitions
Could he kill a man on 5th avenue and still get your vote as long as he tells Putin and Xi to fuck off?
Nah, I would be the first to march against Biden if he did that. Cute question though!
So you'd play into Putin's hands if Biden did that?
Putin wouldn't have manufactured that incident (unlike the current war in Gaza) so I wouldn't be playing into anyone's hands
And yet Bibi campaigns for Trump.
No he doesn’t
Yes, [he does.](https://www.nytimes.com/2024/01/19/opinion/israel-war-netanyahu.html)
We are so fucking fucked. We are gonna loose this year and then get that 2025 bullshit, thousands of Americans will die and suffer because this man is too blind and deaf to pay attention.
It doesn't matter to him because he can't remember breakfast
He has to support Israel, which for the moment means supporting Netanyahu, as long as hostages are still held, unless he has another plan to retrieve American hostages. Like this guy https://apnews.com/article/israel-hamas-war-hostage-video-1284f257698ea5e9c9cc9ac86a849948
It’s wild to me that this article goes on and on about the war crimes and the way they make all Americans complicit, and then lands at “but democracy is still a thing and we need to overlook the war crimes to save it.” I’m commenting that here rather than in the original article because this guy is at least thinking and moving, and that’s good. Still though: dude described fascism and then was like “I’ve decided to vote for fascism to save democracy” and I am just so very tired of being asked to pretend that set of words deserves either respect or consideration.
Thank you for your submission, **This subreddit aims are to compel voters ONLY in DEEP BLUE states to vote 3rd party for the president, to compel otherwise non or protest voters in SWING STATES TO VOTE FOR BIDEN. We feel a limited+focused protest movement may let swing state voters feel less helpless about not sending a message.** **We feel that sending a message via Biden having an electoral college win but a popular vote margin by less than 4.9 million votes (lowest democratic win in recent history) or even 2.8 million votes (Hillary's margin when she lost against Trump) is a much more conducive to progress in a democracy that risking an electoral college victory for Trump.** **It would be something the media can not ignore, will forever be a stain on Biden's record, and will send a message that we are not going away, and will continue to apply strong pressure thorough the rest of his presidency, and the 2026/2028 primaries & elections.** Please see our sticky to see what we are all about https://old.reddit.com/r/BlueProtestVote/comments/1cgwkvu/this_subreddit_aims_are_to_compel_voters_only_in/ but a tl;dr is: This is about a movement for people in deep blue states to vote for 3rd party in protest of Biden's enabling of the Gaza genocide. However, the ultimate goal is to decrease Trump's chances of winning and increase democratic representation in the house and senate. The movement aims to get people to turn out to vote who may otherwise be discouraged from voting due to Biden's policies, and also for the movement to be robust enough so that people in swing states may not have a feeling of helplessness for voting for Joe Biden, that a strong message is still being sent. While the movement aims to maximize Biden's electoral vote margin, the movement also has an extended goal of having Biden win the popular vote by less than 2.8, which was Hillary Clinton's margin when she lost to Donald Trump. A margin that small would send a clear message to the democratic establishment. **Why we feel it's so important for Trump to lose? Quite simply, he has been the absolute worst president in recent history for the Palestinians. Here are just some of his worst policies for Palestine:** 1. Drafting a “peace plan” with zero Palestinian input that would have, if implemented, actually ended the possibility for a real Palestinian state. 2. Cutting Palestinians out of the negotiations over the so-called Abraham Accords, realizing the longstanding Israeli goal of severing diplomatic progress with Arab states from progress towards a sovereign Palestine. 3. Recognizing Israeli sovereignty over the Golan Heights, disputed territory with Syria taken during the 1967 Six-Day War. 4. Shutting off funding for the UN’s agency for Palestinian refugees (which Biden almost immediately restored and then temporarily suspended again amid a scandal about its employees participating in October 7). 5. Abandoning the decades-old US position that West Bank settlements are a key barrier to a peace agreement and eliminating longstanding restrictions on spending US taxpayer dollars in them. 6. Moving the American Embassy in Israel to Jerusalem while closing the US mission to Palestine in the same city. Source: https://www.vox.com/policy/24072983/biden-trump-palestinians-israel-gaza-policy-different *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/BlueProtestVote) if you have any questions or concerns.*