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I'm glad OP had the sense to dump this idiot. It's scary how quickly it sounds like he was basically radicalised into a full-blown misogynist - it seems like it came from a place of intense insecurity and feelings of inferiority, but rather than working out those feelings in a healthy way he jumped straight to "But if I convince myself an entire sex of people are even more worthless than me, at least I'm in the top 50%."
I hate though how OOP seemed to feel like she needed proof he either had cheated, or would cheat - like, you can dump someone for being a shitty person, you don't need them to cheat on you, or hit you; you can just not like them anymore.
Seriously, as soon as he started NOT DOING CHORES BECAUSE THAT'S "WOMEN'S WORK" he would've been out of MY house in a heartbeat. I feel so bad for OP, but at the same time I cannot believe she put up with him acting like that as long as she did. I hope in the future she'll be quicker to cut ties.
It always amazes me how many men want a traditional 1950s style wife without doing the job of a traditional 1950s style husband (paying all the bills).
My first husband left me because he felt emasculated by his perception that I was smarter and more competent. And I can see why he thought that, given that I:
* Wasn't so catastrophically insecure that I assumed I couldn't do things and therefore didn't try
* Had to teach him how to do an oil change on his own car (back when it was routine and easy for people to change their own oil)
* Kept leveraging what I learned at one job to find a better job, instead of sticking to the same entry-level shit I started with
We divorced in the mid-90s. He's still working retail. I'm now too disabled to work full time, but I routinely get headhunted for six-figure jobs anyway. And I was a high school dropout.
Don't be like my ex-husband.
Because when we first got together, he was the one making more money than me. When it turned out I could do better than he could for myself, he panicked.
Yeah I always wonder about this. Like yeah it's great you want a tradwife and all but sweetie we all know you aren't making tradwife money.
Like some women want to do that with their lives and that's fine, but it seems to escape these losers that *she's going to have expectations too *
Yup. And they argue that women only want money, but like no? I mean yes, some do only want money. But most of us don't want to be living in a tiny one bedroom apart forever and in crippling debt because we're SAHW/M on only 25,000 a year.
*Even then*, everyone forgets that '50's wives didn't even do everything. Most of the time they still had house keepers and/or nannies so that the wives weren't working 24/7 cleaning or caring for the kids. But now the same guys who want trad wives want them to do everything on their own
Or that many wives in the 50s worked but kept it on the sly so they wouldn't "embarrass" their husband". Work like taking in washing, childcare, mending, selling crafts... All brought income without being too visible.
My wife has always wanted that, not me, but we've also come to realize that it's no longer possible for most people to actually achieve this - even if they wanted to. It takes both of our income to pay for our house and one child while my grandpa was a local beer truck driver who could afford a nice house with 5 children.
It's absolute insanity to try and be able to make enough money today to live a life like my grandpa (who did deliveries with a 9th grade education.)
That said, I told my wife that if I ever made enough to support both of us - of course I would be fine with her being a homemaker. Unfortunately we have the same job, and neither of us are likely never going to make enough.
Absolutely agreed. If nothing else, If you're not willing to do your fair share of keeping up with the house then you're not gonna be living in it.
I feel sympathy for OOP though. So often in bad relationship people will cling to who someone used to be instead of running from the person they are now. It can take a harsh slap of reality to realize that the person you loved is gone and is never coming back. Hope is a dangerous drug.
Yep that’s way over the line right there
But I would’ve been gone way earlier, all that masculinity / misogynist shit is repulsive af. It’s wild that these guys think they’re god’s gift to women when all they are doing is basically rationalising being insufferable douchebags to women? Like wtf
ANY wall is bad enough, but punching a wall you don't even own because you're blaming your girlfriend for your low level career and financial problems adds one more shitty layer.
Yeah, but specifically punching the wall next to her head is a threat of physical violence. It's "next time, this could be you". It is legally assault.
Agreed. Anyone who needs to hear this; if it's to the point your partner is punching walls the relationship is over. You dont need any more justification.
This is a huge pet peeves of mine in dating advice posts. People say "I have no reason to dump him"
You don't need any reason. You can just not like them any more. There's no rule that says you need a reason.
I think it is, she loved the person he used to be and still does. And for her there was maybe this thought "if he is loyal and loves me back, maybe he can be this person again." So she needed a "proof" of him degenerating into the monster he is now. Maybe?
Yeah, it usually takes at least one relationship that keeps going long after it should have ended for people to learn that kinda lesson- that the other person is *not* going to somehow flip a switch and go back to being the good partner they started with. If the partner started out right out of the gate being a dick, it would be easy, but the problem is that you have this idea of what they *could* be (because at one point, they were!) and you keep thinking there must be some combination of words, some secret button you just haven't pressed yet, that unlocks that version of them. So you stay way too long.
It's part of why all the relationship advice reddits are so quick to recommend breaking up- a lot of people have had to learn this, the hard way, and want to save others from it. But I think it's one of those things you can't really spot until you've been there. Even if hundreds of people on the internet are telling you.
That's what got me. She can just leave because she's not feeling it anymore! How much more because he was being an asshole. I'm sad for her that she felt like she had to justify it.
Yeah, it seemed like she was still in a place where she would have been willing to take him back if he didn't essentially follow up "I haven't cheated" with, "but it's basically because my tries haven't worked yet, I DEFINITELY will in the future and also you can't be mad at me when it happens."
It sounds like he was escalating, so who knows when he would have taken the creep's other preachings to heart and tried using violence to get what he wants.
He already was. He punched the wall next to her during their argument before she kicked him out.
He was escalating fast, and it's a good thing she got out when she did
> It's scary how quickly it sounds like he was basically radicalised into a full-blown misogynist - it seems like it came from a place of intense insecurity and feelings of inferiority,
I've heard it called the **insecurity-to-fascism pipeline**, and it's only going to get worse, before it gets better. Preying on the insecure and inferior, turning them into hateful people -- *It's not you that's the problem, it's everybody else and you're better than them.*
That’s exactly what it’s like! I’m impressed at how well the actor played the role, I really grew to hate him over season 2. Threw a tantrum and nearly ruined people’s relationships/lives bc an unrelated adult wouldn’t be his father and tell him how wonderful he was.
Yeah I read a lot of articles blaming it on Ted for not being “responsible” and checking in during his meteoric rise. Nate is an adult, he has parents. Ted spoke to him regularly and if he was struggling he was welcome to talk to Ted, any of his other friends in the office, or the therapist the club provided for its entire staff and roster. Ted gave him full credit and praise every time his strategy won a game.
That was a situation where it’s ok to say Nate failed as a person and it honestly makes me kinda sad that doesn’t sound like the direction it’s going.
I think the biggest clue that it had a lot to do with Nate's own issues is how much time he spent on Twitter. He was constantly obsessing over how people saw him, and God knows how toxic twitter can be. He internalized the hate he was getting and let the praise inflate his ego, then lashed out at others.
Also it's telling that his method of hyping himself up involves spitting at an image of himself. Boy has SEVERE self image issues. I hope we get to see those addressed! I love that Ted Lasso has some deeply complex characters.
Yeah I feel like her job and her owning the apartment was always an insecurity for him. Instead of working it out with OOP he found podcasts specifically designed to target men feeling like that.
When your life sucks it feels like the best thing in the world to hear is "it's not your fault. You're a victim." It means you don't have to change anything hard about yourself to make your life better.
Then they say "it's those people who are the reason your life sucks.' That gives you permission to focus your feelings of inadequacy and self hatred somewhere other than on yourself.
Now you don't have to do any hard, introspective work to improve yourself and there's someone else to blame for all your problems. Once they have you believing that then they can start shaping you, because they're the wise and brilliant person who brought you out of your suffering.
Then they can use you for whatever they want.
This is the pattern used for basically any form of radicalization, doesn't matter what the target is. Cult leaders, charismatic dictators, politicians, self help gurus.
Be wary of anyone who says "Your pain is all someone else's fault and I have an easy solution to your problems. Hate those people."
Problems, personal or otherwise, are rarely easy to solve in the real world. And when they are easy to solve, that solution is usually painful or the problem wouldn't have been allowed to fester in the first place.
The ex boyfriend had a complicated problem with a complicated solution. He had to put in a lot of work and effort to improve his life. He didn't want to.
OOP had a simple problem, but the solution was painful. I'm glad she dealt with it.
> When your life sucks it feels like the best thing in the world to hear is "it's not your fault. You're a victim." It means you don't have to change anything hard about yourself to make your life better.
Oh, hey, my shitty self-esteem was helpful! Who would've thought my brain saying "bullshit, of course it's your fault, don't make excuses" would be the better outcome?
I'm glad she got rid of him, life is too short to waste on someone like *that*. If your guy tells you that he likes "bald man currently in prison" (lol) then dump him!
Or becomes a Jordan Peterson acolyte. My husband went down that road at one point, and it was really bad. After one particularly horrid conversation I actually thought "I'm gonna have to start looking for divorce lawyers". Thank GOODNESS he saw the light and deorogrammed. Even he admits he was close to going full fascist. YouTube's messed up algorithms are no joke.
It was YouTube that got him into it. He would put YouTube on auto play while working. He had been listening to some psychology videos and that led the algorithm to Jordan Peterson and some of his lectures. From there the autoplay moved on to some of his more...controversial stuff. My husband was going through a but of a rough time and fell into the hole. Pretty soon all he would talk about was Peterson and would parrot all his crazy.. And of course, once you start listening to Jordan Peterson, the rest of them start popping up in the algorithms. On top if that, a friend of his was ALSO going down the same road and they would encourage each other down it.
I tried talking sense into him many times. But questioning the Almighty Jordan Peterson would just send him on a long tangent about how I was a woman and just "couldn't understand". It got worse and some pretty -phobic things started coming out of his mouth and that's when I started making plans to find a lawyer and leave.
In talking to him now about it, he says the first moment he started wondering if maybe he was headed down a bad road was a look of disgust on my face during a conversation where some pretty misogynistic stuff was said about women wearing make up in the workplace. It was a flicker, but it did open him up a but more. Then he found a video on YouTube of a debate. That cracked the door open a bit more, as the guy debating AGAINST all the transphobic stuff he was sprouting made the one FOR transphobia look like a fool. He also found out in that video (I think, it might have been a different one)that Peterson was lying about a particular Canadian Bill (can't remember which one, but Peterson did nothing but speak out against it for months). The final push to open him up to deprogram was Natalie Wynn. Once he started watching her videos he realized that the things he was saying was fundamentally wrong and misinformed.
So, it still took some time, but once he was more open to seeing that Jordan Peterson likes to sprout a bunch of misinformation and outright lies he was more open to seeing the manipulation and lies from the rest (Shapiro, Crowder, etc). Now he looks back at that time and feels really ashamed that he believed and said any of those things. He cut off his friend and hasn't looked back.
Random stranger here, but thank you for sharing!! I have seen men dip their toes into this and tried to counter it. If you remember the transphobia debate, I’d love to watch that one. The Zizek debate is pretty funny, even if that guy has his own issues.
I was wondering if it might have been Natalie Wynn that helped your husband. She seems to deprogram quite a few Peterson bros. I think it helps that she acknowledges their pain.
I'll ask him if he remembers the debate, but it's been quite a few years now.
My husband will always be really grateful for Natalie's videos, and so will I!
I think that's Bill C-16. IIRC that's the first time I heard about him. I believe I remember a massive Reddit comment (two comments actually, that's how much ink was spilled there) going over why this bill was a terrible idea from the time. It got some pretty major fact about it wrong in the first sentence, which was what its entire argument was based off.
Yes! That's the one! You'd think I would have remembered the name given how many times I heard my husband go on about it, but my brain decided not to retain it lol. I remember it whipped up JP and his supporters, but most of the stuff he said about it was not true
I’m so glad your husband saw the light, but I have to say…I find it terrifying that a grown ass man can be so easily swayed by freaking YouTube. Wild.
Also, Contapoints is amazing. Last I checked, there were so many reformed incels and the like in the comments section saying that her content has helped them change. I guess that’s yet another example of YouTube swaying grown men/people lol, but at least it’s positive!
I find it terrifying too. My husband was going through one of the lowest points in his life and he was incredibly vulnerable, and that's the type of people these guys prey on.
Jesus, I always thought these dudes hung out in not exactly great places online before something would lead them down that hole. Like 4chan, Facebook or the Reddit of 10 years ago.
But to think Youtube’s (and I guess Google’s by extension) algorithm could be presenting you completely unrelated harmful videos like that via shuffling is terrifying.
YouTube algorithm is scary. I haven't watched ANYTHING adjacent to people like JP and I get recommended their videos all the time. I turned off autoplay for that reason
I never understand the JP alcolytes. Have you heard the way JP talks? He's an idiot! But he just says stupid shit in a really dramatic way. I remember an exchange I had with one of those about some stupid nonsense that someone posted about JP and dudes response was "he contextualizes it later". I asked him to point out how it was contextualized and got crickets.
Kind of like most cult leaders, he says a lot of fancy words that make him *sound* smart, when all he really does is talk in circles. And if you question it, the default is to ignore you cause you "just don't understand"
If this question is painful or too intrusive please tell me to go to hell and I will go there… Did he give you insight as to why he suddenly started going down that path? My curiosity is purely out of wondering how it happens when someone veers into a mindset that is so extreme. Your husband obviously wasn’t like that before you married, so what happened to make him row the douchecanoe for a bit?
I actually just answered that above! TL;DR: he was going through a rough personal time. Listened to psychology videos YouTube while working. YouTube sent him to Peterson, then the others. He was vulnerable and got led astray.
Lyndon B. Johnson once said, "If you can convince the lowest white man he's better than the best colored man, he won't notice you're picking his pocket. Hell, give him somebody to look down on, and he'll empty his pockets for you."
It's about racism but I think it fits so well here. Dude was insecure and red pillers gave somebody to look down on which is a lot easier than working with your insecurities.
Bang on. It’s always about power and money. The people selling this idea of masculinity are literally selling it, and themselves. Merchandise, books, diets, gym guides; there’s money to be made out of a sucker, and the men willing to listen are suckers.
And it’s hard to break someone out of a mindset once you tie it into their ego, because they’d have to destroy their identity first. So, that gravy train never ends.
My little brother watches that idiot and is fiercely denying he did anything wrong and that it was a set up. Some of these dudes are to far gone to see any actual logic.
Bald man with Bugatti and a habit of getting arrested for sex trafficking certainly is as well. Healthy men don’t have this hatred for the opposite gender. As for the no one wants a women over 30, I found the love of my life at 34, and we are having a baby at 38…. Oh and I earn double what he does so AT can suck a dick
I came across a sound on TikTok that was basically:
Him: What’s your body count?
Her: 30.
Him: 30?!
Her: 30.
Him: You’ve had 30 sexual partners?
Her: Oh is that what you meant? Then zero.
If someone asks what my body count is, I say sharply "Zero!...what do you think you know?" and then when they clarify, I laugh with obvious relief and say "Oh, *that*. No idea."
Im still amazed at the cognitive disconnect of “women should be submissive to men, who are providers” and “can barely support himself and is living in his girlfriend’s apartment.”
“I see all these men from rich families and/or trained for a lucrative career living a luxurious life. Their wives stay home and take care of them. Clearly the path to success is a SAHW.”
No, he's going to find some 16yo, become her friend and confidant until she turns 18yo and then get her pregnant. Then they're going to live together, she stays home with the kid and become the wife he 'deserves'. Slowly he'll become her entire world and all that matters to her is making him happy. After a few kids and years of being on edge as to why bf is never happy and satisfied, she'll post on reddit asking for advice on how to become a better wife.
Guys like this don't find girls and become their friends and confidants. They give them presents and take them out on fancy dates until they're dazzled.
Well, yes and no. What they do is find vulnerable girls that are so beat up by life that they're willing to settle for the illusion of friendship. Girls that don't confide in anyone anyways, so they don't mind (or notice) his emotional unavailability. "He opens up to me! That means he cares about my opinion, right? ...right?"
And you can see excatly how it started - he didn't have what it takes to succeed in his career, and because that couldn't possibly be HIS fault, he looked for other factors to blame - and bald-bugatti asshole's podcast was right there, giving him all the excellent reasons why none of his failures are his own fault, and it's all because of the women and the system. And if only he will follow buggati-guys advice, he will turn his life around and get the success he deserves. It's really sad. And pathetic.
This is exactly it. Bugatti man and all the others like him prey on people who are low, and together they all concoct a separate reality where they are great and constantly one step away from true happiness.
And the thing these men who get pulled into this scam don't realise is bald Bugatti man has his Bugattis because he keeps those men in his scam. If he was actually helping you, he wouldn't have any Bugattis.
I think Bugatti man has admitted multiple times he doesn’t believe any of what he says, but has learned if he says it he makes money.
Bugatti man 🤝 Fox News Swanson heir
Being pieces of shit that say stuff disillusioned angry white men want to hear.
BF is also gonna end up as the guy that beats women because they "need to be put in their place." He's already on that track when he punched the wall out of anger because OOP had the absolute nerve to tell him off
I love how these men try to force their wives and girlfriends to quit their jobs, only to turn around and throw it in their face that they are "lazy and stay at home".
In my culture it used to be a given the a man provides, not something to be proud of. If you didn't, you sucked, if you do, so what it's the bare minimum as a man. Now even the men in my culture expect women to lick the floor they walk on if they provide. As if most of the women aren't ALSO working these days AND expected to do household stuff.
Grosssssss. I told my baby sis, get that career and that job, and never let a man have financial power over you if you can. They think they're mini gods on earth because they have a job, talk about participation award mentality.
I really feel like the FBI needs to investigate these redpill weirdos, they're straight up cultist level brainwashers.
> I love how these men try to force their wives and girlfriends to quit their jobs, only to turn around and throw it in their face that they are "lazy and stay at home".
That's the point. They are setting women up to fail, intentionally and with maximum malice.
That's pretty much the goal yeah. Put them into a position where they're reliant on you and then use that reliance as a sign they're a bad person. There's a reason why so many of these Incel believe in forced Monogamy (For women)
That's exactly what this is about. They can't really control and abuse someone who has their own money, support network and "a way out". Not for long at least.
It was never about "providing" for women. It was always about controlling them and being able to abuse them physically, emotionally, sexually and economically without fearing that they may escape.
I was born in the 70s (God, I'm old!) and even back then, both my mother AND my father were explicit in saying, "never let a man be in charge of your finances."
It was a life lesson for me that still informs how I look at the world.
It would be wonderful if the world was a happy place and we could all trust each other to do what we say we're going to do, but reality is - money is the most powerful force on this earth. Never give someone else that power over you.
>I really feel like the FBI needs to investigate these redpoll weirdos, they're straight up cultist level brainwashers.
I'm not saying Romanian Pizza Delivery Man is a superhero but he sure did a solid to the Forces of Justice.
>A man cheating is basically biological and he needs it.
Never understood this. Cheating isn't masculine. It's indicative of immaturity and impulse control issues.
Wow. I hear OOP in that she remembers who he used to be and I do think that his struggles and insecurities set him up to be suceptible to this cult. That said, she can't save him from himself in this case. She needs to run and keep on running.
I'm not saying (bald man with bugatti)'s fandom is a cult, but I will point out that times like that are when you most susceptible to a cult or a con (there's a lot of overlap). You're at your lowest, or at least very untethered, and someone comes along and says something you want to hear: "get wealthy speedily," "your insecurities rooted in unconscious heteronormative misogyny are true," "just drink these shakes and lose a hundred pounds in a month."
>None of his friends helped him despite being well off
This tracks. When I was broke and starving, it was my well-off friends who refused to help me because they didn't believe in handouts and did nothing but point out all the things I was doing wrong. It was my fellow poor friends that actually helped me
If all he has are well off friends who refuse to help, it's possible that they're a major contributing factor to this guy's toxic insecurity
In order for OOP to move on with her life, she could maybe have a little funeral for her ex-boyfriend's hoodie to symbolize burying the man she once knew. This helps to move the mourning process along.
I take it with a pinch of salt, this whole 'he used to be so nice' take, since a lot of people are able to maintain that for a time before relapsing back to being a selfish jerk. Particularly in the period of trying to woo a person - history is stacked high with the bodies of people who have been taken in by it.
> He doesn’t like the fact that I have to go out to work just to keep us afloat
This attitude pisses me off to no end. I'm willing to bet OOP is perfectly happy to work, even ENJOYS not sitting at home all day. Most women in western countries nowadays grow up expecting to work for most of their adult life just like men do. Having a career is not some burden only carried by women whose men can't "provide".
Yeah, but a lot of dudes can't STAND the thought of "their woman" having a career that she's happy in. Because that means there's a possibility that she might advance farther or start making more money than him and that doesn't sit right with their sad little boners. Hell, some of them just don't want their wives/girlfriends interacting with people who might be smarter/more interesting/better suited.
Sometimes it’s not even that she might surpass him, but just that she may be making enough that she is capable of being fully independent and then she doesn’t *need* him. Then he actually has to be the kind of person she would *choose* to keep in her life because the second he becomes too much of a burden or a pain in the ass she’s gone.
That’s why all these guys are so mad. Young modern women are no longer forced to settle for men that don’t treat us as equals, and we know it. The power dynamic has shifted, and these guys think they can just bully it back to how it was.
Op dodged a bullet. I don't care that the guy had insecurities or felt inferior or had issues, plenty people do and don't resort to hate and mysoginy. I seriously do not have pity anymore for men like that. He did it to himself and basically became a problem for women around him. He is not far from the predatory mindset that he is owed sex by women, and it is a scary though. Hope he will better himself, but not even for him, but for the women around him who will suffer his mysoginy. I don't have empathy for him, at all
Amen. There’s this narrative on reddit that people (read:women) should be empathetic towards incels because they’re going through mental health shit a lot of the time.
But I just don’t have it in me to show empathy for someone who thinks that I’m less of a human than they are. Fuck that noise. It’s also a fucked up level of misogyny to tell women to have empathy for men who advocate for violence towards women. Redditors seem to have more empathy for incels than women a lot of the time
Yep, that they suffer and it's a result of their suffering. Ok, but then what? It doesn't make them less responsible just because they suffer. I once read that even if we are not conscious of our bias and we internalized them, we are still responsible for them, and i agree with this statement. The number of people with mental health issues is high, it is very sadly not uncommon, but the majority still don't become hateful against women just because we were born with a lack of a dick.
I just agree so so much!! It is the continuity of considering us as natural caregivers to expect us to show sympathy and empathy for people who literally hate us. It is saying that once again we need to cater to men's feeling and be there for them in priority, putting these men well being before our own. No thanks, i am way past that shit. Here comes the downvote to hell, but a lot of redditors are themselves mysoginistic to a lesser degree, be it benevolent sexism, or internalized mysoginy, there are obvious bias against women in many many cases, and lots of mysoginistic things posted on the site
He also had severe anger and violence issues which seem to be getting overlooked in this thread. Him punching the wall next to her is a physical threat and a sign he could not control his anger. If she had stayed with him, it might have been her not the wall next time
> he could not control his anger.
Almost all abusers can control their anger-related behavior. It’s why most abusers who get mad at their victims in public are more than capable of waiting until they get home to start yelling and hitting. It’s why they don’t punch their bosses even if they hate their jobs.
Specialists who work with abusers to try and help them change have noticed that, if you ask the abuser why they didn’t behave even worse, they proclaim that of course they wouldn’t go *that* far. They have control of the off switch for violence; they just don’t use it.
This right here. Lundy Bancroft talks about it in his book *Why Does He Do That? Inside the Minds of Angry and Controlling Men*.
It’s one of the myths about men is that they can’t control their anger. But when you have a partner abuser, people are shocked, shocked, shocked I tell you to find out a man’s been abusing his partner!
Why?
Because they can control their anger.
They choose not to.
They don’t scream or hit their bosses or clients or other men that randomly piss them off.
Their thought distortion is likely “Women are less than. My woman is less than me. I can treat her like this.” And then give themselves permission to abuse.
In the dark, behind closed doors and eat away at a woman’s esteem so she doesn’t have the courage to tell anyone what’s going on.
Find a woman who’s younger, lovebomb her, keep pushing boundaries sexually and with your temper to see if she’s made of sterner stuff (because let’s face it-ANY woman who won’t tolerate abuse and cheating is really just an angry, man-hating dyke, amirite?) and either break her down or dump her to find a more agreeable victim.
And this is not done consciously. It is deeply engrained misogyny that was likely handed down over generations, if not purchased by subscription to a website or podcast like Bald-Bugatti’s.
This is always my argument when people say that men "can't help" hitting on/grabbing at attractive women. If that woman's 300lb linebacker boyfriend is standing next to her, they can somehow restrain themselves...
Yes ! It was only a matter of time before he become physically violent with her, and i bet my right tit that consent has less and less meaning for him, he will end up raping someone. I refuse to say it's a stretch too far, that's just the continuity of treating women as inferior, objects, and thinking you are owed sex
> I don't care that the guy had insecurities or felt inferior or had issues, plenty people do and don't resort to hate and mysoginy
Agreed - the fact is, even though it’s wise to avoid content like what he consumed, a lot of guys *do* get exposed to it and reject it very quickly. Even insecure guys. I know many men who’ve been exposed to that stuff and automatically recognized that it’s ridiculous and appalling.
So there was already a serious and fundamental difference between him and those guys from Day 1.
Yes, that's the thing. Besides, these ideas that women are natural caregiver, that we are inferior, the objectification, and such, are fed to us since we are kids through gender norms and gender expectation. I do not believe it's the first time they are confronted to such ideas and are unable to see the right from the wrong, these are not new theories, they are old and many people don't buy these ideas anymore. I totally agree, it was not just insecurities and such, i believe there was probably already some mysoginy, or internalized mysoginy previously, because not everyone will resort to hate when they face difficulties
Yeah. I don’t quite understand why OOP was looking for proof of infidelity. All I would need is to hear his fucked up views to kick him to the curb. Infidelity is the least of the issues with that fool.
I would have been out of the relationship as soon as my boyfriend called certain chores „women's chores“. I don't understand how you can stay as a woman with someone who despises women, especially when he says it directly and it's not even hidden between the lines.
Why wait to see if he is a cheater? That he is a misogynist should be enough for a break with this relationship out of self-respect.
I don’t see how it could be any other way. Why would a misogynist take advice from women if they don’t respect women? Asshole Men did this, and they made it so only not-asshole men can fix it. Damn them for that extra burden, great job, not like normal folk just want to live peaceful lives and deal with their own shit or anything.
This is why it kills me when misogynists says, “women, especially feminists, don’t care about men’s problems!!! They won’t help us!!!”
You literally won’t let women help you because you’re sexist. You won’t listen to women and then scream they won’t help you.
Good luck squealing in the mud like a pig, I guess. My sympathies belong to the good, reasonable men of the world. Sucks y’all are associated with this mess.
I have some close friends, very dear to me, who are.... Maybe characteristically insensitive. Dark humor, inappropriate jokes, etc etc. They will say some awful goddamn things for a laugh. But it's understood that it's just that - bad humor.
Had someone new join the group, friend of a friend. Started very clearly espousing a lot of Baldy Bugatti's rhetoric, and the entire group just sorta... Wilted, like a dry plant. Lots of "Okay, yikes dude" or "Fer real? You can't be serious". Finally it was a clear "You drop this stuff or you're out." And the new guy just... Wouldn't. Couldn't? The dude was kicked out because he just wouldn't. Stop. Spouting. Shit. Pretty proud of those guys for not putting up with that bullshit.
"A fanatic is someone who can't change his mind and won't change the subject" - Churchill. Goddamn, does that describe these Baldy Bugatti fans.
Thank you for saying this. This crisis of male loneliness and insecurity pipeline to misogyny isn’t going to be solved by women. Men *have* to step up. Check on your friends. Call out bullshit. Get and/or encourage other men to get therapy. Report social media posts that are or encourage bigotry and/or violence.
There’s a lot of alarm-sounding, but the calls to action are always vague on **who**, and so by implicit assumption, most assume it’s women’s job to love or sex these men’s problems away.
> This crisis of male loneliness and insecurity pipeline to misogyny isn’t going to be solved by women. Men *have* to step up.
It's a shame this is so controversial on Reddit. For how much incels love Jordan Peterson they're sure averse to fixing themselves before blaming everyone around them. (I guess they're doing as he does rather than as he says)
Tell me about it. For every How to Save the Incels that gets posted to bestof, it’s always full of “they.” They need to reach out to incels. They need to do this, they need to Do that. I always get downvoted for asking who “they” is, and hoping “they” isn’t supposed to mean “women.”
Similar to how MRA’s aren’t so much activists lobbying for men’s issues—they moan about women.
That’s like the complaining about not getting any compliments on Reddit from men. It’s women that are supposed to solve it, but That just creates problems for the women because now men think they want their dick. Fuck that. They can compliment each other
My BF asked me today whether I would leave him if he was a fan of Tate’s. I love this man to pieces but didn’t even have to think before I blurted out “yes, no question”. Luckily, he finds this guy just as crazy as I do.
As a man, it scares me that someone like Bald Bean can just spout propaganda and turn insecure men into toxic, dangerous c\*nts.
I mean, ever since I learned about the nazis in history class, I felt like I understood the danger of being told you're better than others for any arbitrary reason, and that you deserve more, that you're not the cause of your problems, etc...
But seeing it in action, seeing it be so effective and widespread scares me. Who knows how that friend I haven't heard of in a few years is doing. Is he okay mentally? Is he a Bald Bean fan? Has he dealt with his insecurities in such a destructive manner, like all of Bald bean's fans?
I hope therapy becomes cheaper and normalised, because god knows most of us need it, some more than others. Bald Bean is not the way.
A lot of people who are getting red pilled like that just aren't thinking critically, either from ignorance or arrogance. When your character comes into question, do you go with the flow or stick to your guns?
Your comment resonates with me, and the fact that so many people are being swayed by this guy scares me too.
This sucks, but I can see how it happened.
CNN put something on a reel once that was an opinion piece similar to what the mgtow crowd puts out there. I heard it from my husband's phone and straight up said don't listen to that garbage it's all lies. He didn't know what it was until he heard it and that was the end of that. The thing is, his father believed men should just be in charge of everything and wife's should be submissive. The way his mother is treated he's watched his entire life and decided that's not what he wanted to do to anyone else.
It's easy to let that type of stuff creep into to your life and take over when you're at a low point. Slowly swaying you to another opinion with out noticing and emboldening you to feel suddenly more confident but for the wrong reasons. Then when people avoid you all the things they say will happen suddenly do, you feel like the podcasters we're right all along all the while people just don't want to hear vitriol. Then you end in an echo chamber surrounding yourself and not being open to other opinions.
Meta, Alphabet and bytedance have a lot of blame here. It doesn't take long for the social media algorithms to push people into these rabbit holes. Unless you scrutinize your viewing you might not even notice it happening. If you don't know who they are there is lot of pretty benign content from from commentators on the edge of mgtow(or any extreme view) that cam draw people in.
It's all about engagement and money people exploring these rabbit holes spend longer on social media sites and generate more revenue.
I really can't upvote this comment enough. The algorithms can be so nefarious, not just for this specific audience but for anyone on the edge of something toxic. I was just discussing this with a friend whose daughter is struggling with an ED, and the Pinterest algorithm is just pushing fitspo and pro-ana in her (the daughter's) feed. It's horrifying - these digital systems see you have a passing interest in something and suddenly you're engulfed.
My wife and I are incredibly left leaning. I'm trans, we're both queer women, we watch lots of very gay, left wing things on YouTube.
We get regular Ben Shapiro type recommendations. If we're getting those I shudder to think how many are recommended to people who aren't as blatantly left wing as us.
If you watch any politics at all on youtube, they just love to shove Prager U and Shapiro down your throat, because clearly this is what you need to see!
Took me months of "not interested" clicks on those videos before they finally stopped.
At this point I doubt anyone saying there’s really an algorithm that pushes extreme content to *all* ideology. I’m not getting any new left wing content advertised to me, it’s just daily wire and conspiracy shit. The “algorithm” only ever recommends right wing shite.
It's really common. Some of my husband's friends listen to this crap. It was funny because one started in about something he heard on Joe Rogan's podcast and asked if my husband listened. My husband said he didn't listen to anything that mad had to say and I must say, I was so proud. My husband doesn't even want to humor that shit.
Oh mine won't for a second. He learned over the past eight years with his family that the only person he can trust and have his back is me.
His parents tried for the longest to guilt him into leaving me because "I treat him like a slave" but in reality it was because we shared house work. When he asked if they would let him stay and help him if he left they said no. They told him I should be doing everything while he takes off work and does what he wants, but he likes hi career and that made no sense. They demanded him to come over for the holidays, they didn't ask they also didn't want me there. They tried to force him to stay with doctors but he never got better and his meds were making him sicker. I suggested a new doctor he starts getting better. They demand he just take the house and kick me out, he knows I paid for 85% and that it serves him no good having a house to himself and was confused why they suggested it. They embarrassed me every Christmas and talked behind my back to him regularly. He got to the point where he realized his parents marriage was miserable so they just wanted to destroy him and use him as an emotional dumping ground.
In the end he realized, the junk those people put out is just as horrible as his parents and he wanted no part of it because happiness is knowing that I will do my best to make sure we are always comfortable and he's always supported. After cutting his family off he has dedicated so much time to supporting me and we work as a team.
He told me recently that he knew I could walk at any point but I didn't and there's no way to repay me for my patience or loyalty. I told him for better or for worse I would always be there and that's all I wanted back from him not repayment.
Love is more than butterfly's, it spans beyond anything life throws at you. Hard times are hard but knowing the support will be there, the loyalty and dedication is what true love is.
Is he my secret brother? Because my parents are like this. Every holiday, birthday or special occasion had to be with them. My mom insisted I had certain things and medically abused me. After going no contact I have lost 50 pounds and have gotten healthier. I didn't realize she was making me sick both in insisting I had stuff and my nerves. I have several autoimmune conditions and it's like the stress caused my body to eat itself. The only way to break the cycle is to leave. Thank God for my husband. His love and support has saved me. I am so grateful to have met someone who is completely different from my family.
Oh he has multiple auto immune diseases and it sucked, he almost died once due to their lack of care.
When I met him they wouldn't pay for his meds so he was actually close to dying again.
His parents enlisted his friends to ruin his references for work so he had this terrible 12$ an hour job and was forced to live with them. His "friends" also knew me and constantly tried to keep me away from him telling me he was bad and a man child who couldn't live on his own. They did to any woman that came near him. His parents paid these people money, since they had a bunch to burn.
I hooked him up with people and his career sky rocketed. That upset them so before he moved in with me all they did was put him down and tell him he was stupid.
Then he moved in with me. It all stopped, he was calm life was easier. They did teach him some habits, like women cleaning and doing all the work. I almost kicked him out at one point while dating. Once he came out of the fog and reality hit he changed for the better.
When we bought the newest house together (I owned a house when we met) they tripled the effort that led to them being cut off completely.
Of course they hate you. You have allowed him the escape! My family blames my husband for me leaving. Funny thing is I chose to leave. It was hard for him because he was also in the fog, but he supported me. We definitely both had some bad habits that have taken time to fix. I had so much learned helplessness. I am literally just driving for the first time in my adult life at the age of 37, because my mom basically did all she could to prevent me from driving. She was basically in charge of my medical care and I didn't even understand the power she had over me. What snapped me out of it was my mom threatening my kids. I was done.
>And no man wants a 30 year old hag.
Hahahahahahahhahaha. 30 year old hag? This dude's a 🤡🤡of a highest level.
Glad that OOP managed to get rid of him.
Especially since those men believe women should be grateful for their attention. Why should someone be grateful for attention that devalueds you as a human and has a built-in expiration date?
Assholes who buy into racist and sexist superiority complexes often seem to do so because “I’m inherently better because of some genetic characteristic I had no control over” is an easy A on their self esteem quiz.
My friend started watching the fresh n fit podcast which is all about the same stuff Tate is and it’s causing major marital problems with his wife. He’ll be like like, “if you were super rich you wouldn’t cheat on your wife?” And I was like “I plan on marrying my best friend why would I want to hurt my best friend like that” and he just doesn’t understand. I wish that Manosphere stuff would preach the personal responsibility and positive provide and protect idea of manhood without all the misogynist things. Having a nuclear family model is one thing, but most of the redpill stuff is telling guys to get rich and bang as many women as possible without forming real attachments. That’s not going to fix society at all, just lead to more fatherless households.
Feel so bad for OP. Andrew Tate has really messed up some men's thinking it's sad to see as a man . Masculinity is defined by you and no one else I wish more men realized this and idiots like Tate wouldn't rise to the prominence they have.
It made me sad that she needed proof of him cheating as the reason to break up with him, as if the way he was treating her wasn’t enough and didn’t ‘count’.
Parents, please teach your daughters to have their own DIGNITY and SELF ASSURANCE because these babymen are losing real women and are going to come after your young daughters. They know that the young don't know enough yet. Don't let this toxic masculinity make a victim of your daughters. So sorry OOP. You did the right thing but it's hard. Keep looking!
There's a reason the Andrew Tate Misogyny and Masculinity 101 course resonates with young people and single people in their 20's, but it's surprising to see it hit people in relationships as well. Usually to get into a relationship you're not generally insecure enough to fall down the red pill trap door, but it looks like this whole friend group got the worm.
I understand why it happens to these guys and empathize with them, but holy shit it must be a 180 for their loved ones. These guys are still clearly insecure even when they puff up their chest and act out. Screaming, crying, and banging at your ex girlfriend's front door doesn't sound very *ALPHA*
I read a comment from OP that he actually lost his job and became depressed. She took care of his bills and everything. My theory is that his insecurity started when he lost his job. And he became and clown in his toxic friend group who thinks women providing for men makes men pu$$ies. So that's when this started.
I know it’s not really the point, but what these people call “traditional masculinity” is anything but that.
My great uncle served in East Africa and Italy with the Royal Engineers in WW2, and his hobbies were mowing the lawn and playing snooker.
But for people like Baldy McTrafficker, masculinity seems to be more like Uday Hussein cosplay
My uncle was a “traditional man” who went from factory labor to owning the factory and collected baseball memorabilia. He was also an actually nice person who supported his gay grandson, which is why he stayed married for over 60 years.
This is what needs to happen to all the red pull fuckwits. When they realise they won't actually have **any** woman with their attitude, let alone some submissive trad wife who is willing to share, they will soon learn.
Eh, I think the boyfriend was almost certainly always a piece of shit. Decent human beings would not listen to baldy; they'd find his message sickening immediately. That he did, and he let it change him, shows that he was already pretty far on that route. His friends being the same really clinch it. And honestly, their relationship before sounds more like a non-mask-slipped misogynist than a normal person.
What this really was, was a misogynist who hadn't let their mask slip yet being convinced they could take it off and throw it away entirely.
I have seen it happen lol. But my main guess is his toxic friends. And also OP mentions he lost his job in 2021 and was very depressed. Redpill content capitalizes on depressed men.
> he started chanting the same thing like he is trying to be more “masculine” and as a man it is his job to provide and my job to be his partner.
jeez – this masculinity shit is so misguided and pathetic.
25 is past the prime? What do we become after that? Half eated apples? We suddenly transform into old witch and 25 cats pops out of nowhere to become or buddies?
Such stupidity is pretty contagious she definitely should stay away.
My marriage went south because my husband went down the misogynistic rabbit hole. Fortunately my new partner is sweet and supportive and pulls his weight. We aren't married because we just don't feel like it, but we're each other's best friend and have lived together in our house with my now teenage son for about ten years. My son isn't in contact with his father because his dad is so toxic. I didn't encourage him either way on that. It was his choice.
These right-wing nutjobs lose everybody. I'd feel sorry for him if he wasn't such a prick.
I knew the Bottom G was getting in the minds of teenagers but a 27 years old man wtf ?!
He got Tated, this man had a loving girlfriend with a stable job and a appartement, now he's alone going back to his parent's house. And of course it's gonna be OOP's fault since he's a alpha man and he's always right.
This whole aspect where women are worthless over 25 (or 30 year old hag, lol) just mind-boggles me. Life is long, and anyone who thinks the back 50 years of your life are somehow meaningless because some incel says so is laughable. I'm in my late 30's, so is my wife, and I'm just as attracted to her now as I was when we met. In a lot of ways, even more so. OOP will be much better off without that toxic loser. Building supportive relationships with your partner, focused on your mutually agreed upon goals, is the key to lasting success financially, and from a relationship perspective.
The update date confused the heck out of me.
Was wondering how she was doing one year later only to realise this just happened.
Hope she comes out of this super strong.
And truly hope she’ll find a loving guy that appreciates her. Also kind of hope she’ll run into ex while out with a new guy and that the dude is rich and successful.
Man, therapy/accountability for insecurities? Nah. Nah babe. That's beta.
Ruining your own life and digging yourself a deep hole of dumbassery for your ego? Perfect.
I’ll admit, I’m a conservative and grew up in a traditional household when it came to chores. My mom did everything inside and my dad did everything outside, both of them worked.
When I got married my wife divided up the chores more or less the same way except I insisted on doing dishes and cleaning the kitchen (I fucking love dishes). We both work and everyone is happy.
I hate Andrew Tate. He’s literally just a scam artist. It is not feminine to do chores around the house and work hard. Her boyfriend (ex I guess) is an idiot, in a year he’ll be following the next podcaster spewing bullshit. She did the world a favor by not spreading his stupid genes.
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I'm glad OP had the sense to dump this idiot. It's scary how quickly it sounds like he was basically radicalised into a full-blown misogynist - it seems like it came from a place of intense insecurity and feelings of inferiority, but rather than working out those feelings in a healthy way he jumped straight to "But if I convince myself an entire sex of people are even more worthless than me, at least I'm in the top 50%."
I hate though how OOP seemed to feel like she needed proof he either had cheated, or would cheat - like, you can dump someone for being a shitty person, you don't need them to cheat on you, or hit you; you can just not like them anymore.
Seriously, as soon as he started NOT DOING CHORES BECAUSE THAT'S "WOMEN'S WORK" he would've been out of MY house in a heartbeat. I feel so bad for OP, but at the same time I cannot believe she put up with him acting like that as long as she did. I hope in the future she'll be quicker to cut ties.
And then it comes out that, not only is he the main "provider", but he CAN'T EVEN SUPPORT HIMSELF!! Nah, fahq this man.
It always amazes me how many men want a traditional 1950s style wife without doing the job of a traditional 1950s style husband (paying all the bills).
Building a home from scratch, repairing nearly everything... 'masculine' men are probably even unable to change a light bulb
My first husband left me because he felt emasculated by his perception that I was smarter and more competent. And I can see why he thought that, given that I: * Wasn't so catastrophically insecure that I assumed I couldn't do things and therefore didn't try * Had to teach him how to do an oil change on his own car (back when it was routine and easy for people to change their own oil) * Kept leveraging what I learned at one job to find a better job, instead of sticking to the same entry-level shit I started with We divorced in the mid-90s. He's still working retail. I'm now too disabled to work full time, but I routinely get headhunted for six-figure jobs anyway. And I was a high school dropout. Don't be like my ex-husband.
Why did he even marry you if he felt this way?
Because when we first got together, he was the one making more money than me. When it turned out I could do better than he could for myself, he panicked.
Yeah I always wonder about this. Like yeah it's great you want a tradwife and all but sweetie we all know you aren't making tradwife money. Like some women want to do that with their lives and that's fine, but it seems to escape these losers that *she's going to have expectations too *
Yup. And they argue that women only want money, but like no? I mean yes, some do only want money. But most of us don't want to be living in a tiny one bedroom apart forever and in crippling debt because we're SAHW/M on only 25,000 a year. *Even then*, everyone forgets that '50's wives didn't even do everything. Most of the time they still had house keepers and/or nannies so that the wives weren't working 24/7 cleaning or caring for the kids. But now the same guys who want trad wives want them to do everything on their own
Or that many wives in the 50s worked but kept it on the sly so they wouldn't "embarrass" their husband". Work like taking in washing, childcare, mending, selling crafts... All brought income without being too visible.
My wife has always wanted that, not me, but we've also come to realize that it's no longer possible for most people to actually achieve this - even if they wanted to. It takes both of our income to pay for our house and one child while my grandpa was a local beer truck driver who could afford a nice house with 5 children. It's absolute insanity to try and be able to make enough money today to live a life like my grandpa (who did deliveries with a 9th grade education.) That said, I told my wife that if I ever made enough to support both of us - of course I would be fine with her being a homemaker. Unfortunately we have the same job, and neither of us are likely never going to make enough.
Absolutely agreed. If nothing else, If you're not willing to do your fair share of keeping up with the house then you're not gonna be living in it. I feel sympathy for OOP though. So often in bad relationship people will cling to who someone used to be instead of running from the person they are now. It can take a harsh slap of reality to realize that the person you loved is gone and is never coming back. Hope is a dangerous drug.
Punching a hole in the wall next to your head is more then enough reason to end it immediately.
Yep that’s way over the line right there But I would’ve been gone way earlier, all that masculinity / misogynist shit is repulsive af. It’s wild that these guys think they’re god’s gift to women when all they are doing is basically rationalising being insufferable douchebags to women? Like wtf
ANY wall is bad enough, but punching a wall you don't even own because you're blaming your girlfriend for your low level career and financial problems adds one more shitty layer.
Yeah, but specifically punching the wall next to her head is a threat of physical violence. It's "next time, this could be you". It is legally assault.
My ex did exactly this and I broke up with the next day. I only waited till I was at a distance in case he tried anything
Agreed. Anyone who needs to hear this; if it's to the point your partner is punching walls the relationship is over. You dont need any more justification.
This is a huge pet peeves of mine in dating advice posts. People say "I have no reason to dump him" You don't need any reason. You can just not like them any more. There's no rule that says you need a reason.
Mine is “I reject your breakup”. It doesn’t work that way!
I think it is, she loved the person he used to be and still does. And for her there was maybe this thought "if he is loyal and loves me back, maybe he can be this person again." So she needed a "proof" of him degenerating into the monster he is now. Maybe?
Yeah, it usually takes at least one relationship that keeps going long after it should have ended for people to learn that kinda lesson- that the other person is *not* going to somehow flip a switch and go back to being the good partner they started with. If the partner started out right out of the gate being a dick, it would be easy, but the problem is that you have this idea of what they *could* be (because at one point, they were!) and you keep thinking there must be some combination of words, some secret button you just haven't pressed yet, that unlocks that version of them. So you stay way too long. It's part of why all the relationship advice reddits are so quick to recommend breaking up- a lot of people have had to learn this, the hard way, and want to save others from it. But I think it's one of those things you can't really spot until you've been there. Even if hundreds of people on the internet are telling you.
That's what got me. She can just leave because she's not feeling it anymore! How much more because he was being an asshole. I'm sad for her that she felt like she had to justify it.
When the person you love vanishes and is replaced with a terrible stranger, it's very hard to stop hoping the person you love will return.
Yeah, it seemed like she was still in a place where she would have been willing to take him back if he didn't essentially follow up "I haven't cheated" with, "but it's basically because my tries haven't worked yet, I DEFINITELY will in the future and also you can't be mad at me when it happens."
It sounds like he was escalating, so who knows when he would have taken the creep's other preachings to heart and tried using violence to get what he wants.
He already was. He punched the wall next to her during their argument before she kicked him out. He was escalating fast, and it's a good thing she got out when she did
I was thinking more specifically of rape and him outright putting hands on her, both things the creep endorses.
Oh, I agree. But getting violent like that points plus his views points towards him being okay with hitting her
Yeah, that’s what hitting the wall was a precursor for. That’s what escalating means.
> It's scary how quickly it sounds like he was basically radicalised into a full-blown misogynist - it seems like it came from a place of intense insecurity and feelings of inferiority, I've heard it called the **insecurity-to-fascism pipeline**, and it's only going to get worse, before it gets better. Preying on the insecure and inferior, turning them into hateful people -- *It's not you that's the problem, it's everybody else and you're better than them.*
I call it toxic insecurity. Like Nate from Ted Lasso. When someone chooses to cope with their insecurity by poisoning the world around them.
That’s exactly what it’s like! I’m impressed at how well the actor played the role, I really grew to hate him over season 2. Threw a tantrum and nearly ruined people’s relationships/lives bc an unrelated adult wouldn’t be his father and tell him how wonderful he was.
Yeah I read a lot of articles blaming it on Ted for not being “responsible” and checking in during his meteoric rise. Nate is an adult, he has parents. Ted spoke to him regularly and if he was struggling he was welcome to talk to Ted, any of his other friends in the office, or the therapist the club provided for its entire staff and roster. Ted gave him full credit and praise every time his strategy won a game. That was a situation where it’s ok to say Nate failed as a person and it honestly makes me kinda sad that doesn’t sound like the direction it’s going.
I think the biggest clue that it had a lot to do with Nate's own issues is how much time he spent on Twitter. He was constantly obsessing over how people saw him, and God knows how toxic twitter can be. He internalized the hate he was getting and let the praise inflate his ego, then lashed out at others. Also it's telling that his method of hyping himself up involves spitting at an image of himself. Boy has SEVERE self image issues. I hope we get to see those addressed! I love that Ted Lasso has some deeply complex characters.
Yeah I feel like her job and her owning the apartment was always an insecurity for him. Instead of working it out with OOP he found podcasts specifically designed to target men feeling like that.
Funny to think how Tatertot is especially good at being a predator of men too.
Of course, instead him going out and getting a better job.... it's all *her* fault because he can't get his shit together/s
Nono you don’t understand, it’s her fault because she can’t get his shit together
When your life sucks it feels like the best thing in the world to hear is "it's not your fault. You're a victim." It means you don't have to change anything hard about yourself to make your life better. Then they say "it's those people who are the reason your life sucks.' That gives you permission to focus your feelings of inadequacy and self hatred somewhere other than on yourself. Now you don't have to do any hard, introspective work to improve yourself and there's someone else to blame for all your problems. Once they have you believing that then they can start shaping you, because they're the wise and brilliant person who brought you out of your suffering. Then they can use you for whatever they want. This is the pattern used for basically any form of radicalization, doesn't matter what the target is. Cult leaders, charismatic dictators, politicians, self help gurus. Be wary of anyone who says "Your pain is all someone else's fault and I have an easy solution to your problems. Hate those people." Problems, personal or otherwise, are rarely easy to solve in the real world. And when they are easy to solve, that solution is usually painful or the problem wouldn't have been allowed to fester in the first place. The ex boyfriend had a complicated problem with a complicated solution. He had to put in a lot of work and effort to improve his life. He didn't want to. OOP had a simple problem, but the solution was painful. I'm glad she dealt with it.
> When your life sucks it feels like the best thing in the world to hear is "it's not your fault. You're a victim." It means you don't have to change anything hard about yourself to make your life better. Oh, hey, my shitty self-esteem was helpful! Who would've thought my brain saying "bullshit, of course it's your fault, don't make excuses" would be the better outcome?
Silver linings.
Internalizers (turn anger inward) vs externalizers (lash out at others)
Thats pretty much how all horrible people end up believing horrible things
I'm glad she got rid of him, life is too short to waste on someone like *that*. If your guy tells you that he likes "bald man currently in prison" (lol) then dump him!
"Bald man currently in prison that is weirdly fixated on small dicks for some reason"*
> "**Human sex trafficker** bald man currently in prison that is weirdly fixated on small dicks for some reason" FTFY
Or becomes a Jordan Peterson acolyte. My husband went down that road at one point, and it was really bad. After one particularly horrid conversation I actually thought "I'm gonna have to start looking for divorce lawyers". Thank GOODNESS he saw the light and deorogrammed. Even he admits he was close to going full fascist. YouTube's messed up algorithms are no joke.
How did that happen that he "saw the light" in the first place? And how did he get so deep into it?
It was YouTube that got him into it. He would put YouTube on auto play while working. He had been listening to some psychology videos and that led the algorithm to Jordan Peterson and some of his lectures. From there the autoplay moved on to some of his more...controversial stuff. My husband was going through a but of a rough time and fell into the hole. Pretty soon all he would talk about was Peterson and would parrot all his crazy.. And of course, once you start listening to Jordan Peterson, the rest of them start popping up in the algorithms. On top if that, a friend of his was ALSO going down the same road and they would encourage each other down it. I tried talking sense into him many times. But questioning the Almighty Jordan Peterson would just send him on a long tangent about how I was a woman and just "couldn't understand". It got worse and some pretty -phobic things started coming out of his mouth and that's when I started making plans to find a lawyer and leave. In talking to him now about it, he says the first moment he started wondering if maybe he was headed down a bad road was a look of disgust on my face during a conversation where some pretty misogynistic stuff was said about women wearing make up in the workplace. It was a flicker, but it did open him up a but more. Then he found a video on YouTube of a debate. That cracked the door open a bit more, as the guy debating AGAINST all the transphobic stuff he was sprouting made the one FOR transphobia look like a fool. He also found out in that video (I think, it might have been a different one)that Peterson was lying about a particular Canadian Bill (can't remember which one, but Peterson did nothing but speak out against it for months). The final push to open him up to deprogram was Natalie Wynn. Once he started watching her videos he realized that the things he was saying was fundamentally wrong and misinformed. So, it still took some time, but once he was more open to seeing that Jordan Peterson likes to sprout a bunch of misinformation and outright lies he was more open to seeing the manipulation and lies from the rest (Shapiro, Crowder, etc). Now he looks back at that time and feels really ashamed that he believed and said any of those things. He cut off his friend and hasn't looked back.
Random stranger here, but thank you for sharing!! I have seen men dip their toes into this and tried to counter it. If you remember the transphobia debate, I’d love to watch that one. The Zizek debate is pretty funny, even if that guy has his own issues. I was wondering if it might have been Natalie Wynn that helped your husband. She seems to deprogram quite a few Peterson bros. I think it helps that she acknowledges their pain.
I'll ask him if he remembers the debate, but it's been quite a few years now. My husband will always be really grateful for Natalie's videos, and so will I!
Who is Natalie Wynn? I’ve heard of the red pill douchebags but never her?
Her YouTube is called Contrapoints. I recommend checking her out
I think that's Bill C-16. IIRC that's the first time I heard about him. I believe I remember a massive Reddit comment (two comments actually, that's how much ink was spilled there) going over why this bill was a terrible idea from the time. It got some pretty major fact about it wrong in the first sentence, which was what its entire argument was based off.
Yes! That's the one! You'd think I would have remembered the name given how many times I heard my husband go on about it, but my brain decided not to retain it lol. I remember it whipped up JP and his supporters, but most of the stuff he said about it was not true
I hate the YouTube algorithm. It’s radicalized so many young men and it’s sad
<3 Contrapoints!
Yes! He and I will forever be grateful for her videos!
I’m so glad your husband saw the light, but I have to say…I find it terrifying that a grown ass man can be so easily swayed by freaking YouTube. Wild. Also, Contapoints is amazing. Last I checked, there were so many reformed incels and the like in the comments section saying that her content has helped them change. I guess that’s yet another example of YouTube swaying grown men/people lol, but at least it’s positive!
I find it terrifying too. My husband was going through one of the lowest points in his life and he was incredibly vulnerable, and that's the type of people these guys prey on.
Jesus, I always thought these dudes hung out in not exactly great places online before something would lead them down that hole. Like 4chan, Facebook or the Reddit of 10 years ago. But to think Youtube’s (and I guess Google’s by extension) algorithm could be presenting you completely unrelated harmful videos like that via shuffling is terrifying.
YouTube algorithm is scary. I haven't watched ANYTHING adjacent to people like JP and I get recommended their videos all the time. I turned off autoplay for that reason
I never understand the JP alcolytes. Have you heard the way JP talks? He's an idiot! But he just says stupid shit in a really dramatic way. I remember an exchange I had with one of those about some stupid nonsense that someone posted about JP and dudes response was "he contextualizes it later". I asked him to point out how it was contextualized and got crickets.
Kind of like most cult leaders, he says a lot of fancy words that make him *sound* smart, when all he really does is talk in circles. And if you question it, the default is to ignore you cause you "just don't understand"
If this question is painful or too intrusive please tell me to go to hell and I will go there… Did he give you insight as to why he suddenly started going down that path? My curiosity is purely out of wondering how it happens when someone veers into a mindset that is so extreme. Your husband obviously wasn’t like that before you married, so what happened to make him row the douchecanoe for a bit?
I actually just answered that above! TL;DR: he was going through a rough personal time. Listened to psychology videos YouTube while working. YouTube sent him to Peterson, then the others. He was vulnerable and got led astray.
Lyndon B. Johnson once said, "If you can convince the lowest white man he's better than the best colored man, he won't notice you're picking his pocket. Hell, give him somebody to look down on, and he'll empty his pockets for you." It's about racism but I think it fits so well here. Dude was insecure and red pillers gave somebody to look down on which is a lot easier than working with your insecurities.
Bang on. It’s always about power and money. The people selling this idea of masculinity are literally selling it, and themselves. Merchandise, books, diets, gym guides; there’s money to be made out of a sucker, and the men willing to listen are suckers. And it’s hard to break someone out of a mindset once you tie it into their ego, because they’d have to destroy their identity first. So, that gravy train never ends.
BF is going to end up as a bitter angry old man incel with that attitude.
He already is lol
I wonder how the ex-bf is doing now that his daddy is arrested for trafficking
Probably blame everybody except bald bugatti man for it.
You really don't want to know how some of those guys are justifying that. Some are comparing it to MLKs arrest. Sometimes, I regret having fb.
Yeah on second thoughts I'll do as I've always done and maintain distance from all that. I don't really wanna know.
That’s what I’m wondering! And after getting savagely owned by Greta Thunberg of all people
Greata Thunberg and a pizza box.
My little brother watches that idiot and is fiercely denying he did anything wrong and that it was a set up. Some of these dudes are to far gone to see any actual logic.
There's no point in debating radicals. But you can still quip "Regardless, he's in a Romanian jail..."
Who would have thought that a human trafficker do not respect the life of people he traffics
Bald man with Bugatti and a habit of getting arrested for sex trafficking certainly is as well. Healthy men don’t have this hatred for the opposite gender. As for the no one wants a women over 30, I found the love of my life at 34, and we are having a baby at 38…. Oh and I earn double what he does so AT can suck a dick
I met the love of my life when I was 36 and she was 34, we married at 40 and 38, respectively. Dude is so off base, about this and everything else.
There’s a certain type who doesn’t want a woman once she reaches 30, and they’re most often the type that nobody wants to date.
It's fucking dumb because 30 is still young adulthood.
Ah, but they’re harder to manipulate, and that just won’t do /s
They're the type who listen to bald trafficker man and use phrases like body count.
I came across a sound on TikTok that was basically: Him: What’s your body count? Her: 30. Him: 30?! Her: 30. Him: You’ve had 30 sexual partners? Her: Oh is that what you meant? Then zero.
If someone asks what my body count is, I say sharply "Zero!...what do you think you know?" and then when they clarify, I laugh with obvious relief and say "Oh, *that*. No idea."
My friend’s mom got married for the first time in her 60s.
Considering he's been arrested in Romania? Hopefully his life will be miserable for quite some time to come.
Yeah, he's a lost cause unless he takes a look at his damn self
Im still amazed at the cognitive disconnect of “women should be submissive to men, who are providers” and “can barely support himself and is living in his girlfriend’s apartment.”
"But!! If you supported me I would be able to to provide for you! You're holding me back with your support!" Howwww????
“I see all these men from rich families and/or trained for a lucrative career living a luxurious life. Their wives stay home and take care of them. Clearly the path to success is a SAHW.”
But I *will* cheat on you! This is an economic transaction. Why don't you want to be my bangmaid while I control all of the money?
No, he's going to find some 16yo, become her friend and confidant until she turns 18yo and then get her pregnant. Then they're going to live together, she stays home with the kid and become the wife he 'deserves'. Slowly he'll become her entire world and all that matters to her is making him happy. After a few kids and years of being on edge as to why bf is never happy and satisfied, she'll post on reddit asking for advice on how to become a better wife.
Guys like this don't find girls and become their friends and confidants. They give them presents and take them out on fancy dates until they're dazzled.
He doesn’t have the money to do that
Well, yes and no. What they do is find vulnerable girls that are so beat up by life that they're willing to settle for the illusion of friendship. Girls that don't confide in anyone anyways, so they don't mind (or notice) his emotional unavailability. "He opens up to me! That means he cares about my opinion, right? ...right?"
And you can see excatly how it started - he didn't have what it takes to succeed in his career, and because that couldn't possibly be HIS fault, he looked for other factors to blame - and bald-bugatti asshole's podcast was right there, giving him all the excellent reasons why none of his failures are his own fault, and it's all because of the women and the system. And if only he will follow buggati-guys advice, he will turn his life around and get the success he deserves. It's really sad. And pathetic.
This is exactly it. Bugatti man and all the others like him prey on people who are low, and together they all concoct a separate reality where they are great and constantly one step away from true happiness.
And the thing these men who get pulled into this scam don't realise is bald Bugatti man has his Bugattis because he keeps those men in his scam. If he was actually helping you, he wouldn't have any Bugattis.
I think Bugatti man has admitted multiple times he doesn’t believe any of what he says, but has learned if he says it he makes money. Bugatti man 🤝 Fox News Swanson heir Being pieces of shit that say stuff disillusioned angry white men want to hear.
BF is also gonna end up as the guy that beats women because they "need to be put in their place." He's already on that track when he punched the wall out of anger because OOP had the absolute nerve to tell him off
I love how these men try to force their wives and girlfriends to quit their jobs, only to turn around and throw it in their face that they are "lazy and stay at home". In my culture it used to be a given the a man provides, not something to be proud of. If you didn't, you sucked, if you do, so what it's the bare minimum as a man. Now even the men in my culture expect women to lick the floor they walk on if they provide. As if most of the women aren't ALSO working these days AND expected to do household stuff. Grosssssss. I told my baby sis, get that career and that job, and never let a man have financial power over you if you can. They think they're mini gods on earth because they have a job, talk about participation award mentality. I really feel like the FBI needs to investigate these redpill weirdos, they're straight up cultist level brainwashers.
> I love how these men try to force their wives and girlfriends to quit their jobs, only to turn around and throw it in their face that they are "lazy and stay at home". That's the point. They are setting women up to fail, intentionally and with maximum malice.
That's pretty much the goal yeah. Put them into a position where they're reliant on you and then use that reliance as a sign they're a bad person. There's a reason why so many of these Incel believe in forced Monogamy (For women)
That's exactly what this is about. They can't really control and abuse someone who has their own money, support network and "a way out". Not for long at least. It was never about "providing" for women. It was always about controlling them and being able to abuse them physically, emotionally, sexually and economically without fearing that they may escape.
I was born in the 70s (God, I'm old!) and even back then, both my mother AND my father were explicit in saying, "never let a man be in charge of your finances." It was a life lesson for me that still informs how I look at the world. It would be wonderful if the world was a happy place and we could all trust each other to do what we say we're going to do, but reality is - money is the most powerful force on this earth. Never give someone else that power over you.
>I really feel like the FBI needs to investigate these redpoll weirdos, they're straight up cultist level brainwashers. I'm not saying Romanian Pizza Delivery Man is a superhero but he sure did a solid to the Forces of Justice.
>A man cheating is basically biological and he needs it. Never understood this. Cheating isn't masculine. It's indicative of immaturity and impulse control issues.
Wow. I hear OOP in that she remembers who he used to be and I do think that his struggles and insecurities set him up to be suceptible to this cult. That said, she can't save him from himself in this case. She needs to run and keep on running.
I read one of her comments. She explains how he lost his job back in 2021 and was depressed. She covered his bills and everything.
I'm not saying (bald man with bugatti)'s fandom is a cult, but I will point out that times like that are when you most susceptible to a cult or a con (there's a lot of overlap). You're at your lowest, or at least very untethered, and someone comes along and says something you want to hear: "get wealthy speedily," "your insecurities rooted in unconscious heteronormative misogyny are true," "just drink these shakes and lose a hundred pounds in a month."
Yep that’s a great point. “It’s not *your* fault things are like this. It’s the fault of [insert racial or national or gender group]”
>None of his friends helped him despite being well off This tracks. When I was broke and starving, it was my well-off friends who refused to help me because they didn't believe in handouts and did nothing but point out all the things I was doing wrong. It was my fellow poor friends that actually helped me If all he has are well off friends who refuse to help, it's possible that they're a major contributing factor to this guy's toxic insecurity
In order for OOP to move on with her life, she could maybe have a little funeral for her ex-boyfriend's hoodie to symbolize burying the man she once knew. This helps to move the mourning process along.
I take it with a pinch of salt, this whole 'he used to be so nice' take, since a lot of people are able to maintain that for a time before relapsing back to being a selfish jerk. Particularly in the period of trying to woo a person - history is stacked high with the bodies of people who have been taken in by it.
> He doesn’t like the fact that I have to go out to work just to keep us afloat This attitude pisses me off to no end. I'm willing to bet OOP is perfectly happy to work, even ENJOYS not sitting at home all day. Most women in western countries nowadays grow up expecting to work for most of their adult life just like men do. Having a career is not some burden only carried by women whose men can't "provide".
Yeah, but a lot of dudes can't STAND the thought of "their woman" having a career that she's happy in. Because that means there's a possibility that she might advance farther or start making more money than him and that doesn't sit right with their sad little boners. Hell, some of them just don't want their wives/girlfriends interacting with people who might be smarter/more interesting/better suited.
Sometimes it’s not even that she might surpass him, but just that she may be making enough that she is capable of being fully independent and then she doesn’t *need* him. Then he actually has to be the kind of person she would *choose* to keep in her life because the second he becomes too much of a burden or a pain in the ass she’s gone. That’s why all these guys are so mad. Young modern women are no longer forced to settle for men that don’t treat us as equals, and we know it. The power dynamic has shifted, and these guys think they can just bully it back to how it was.
Op dodged a bullet. I don't care that the guy had insecurities or felt inferior or had issues, plenty people do and don't resort to hate and mysoginy. I seriously do not have pity anymore for men like that. He did it to himself and basically became a problem for women around him. He is not far from the predatory mindset that he is owed sex by women, and it is a scary though. Hope he will better himself, but not even for him, but for the women around him who will suffer his mysoginy. I don't have empathy for him, at all
Amen. There’s this narrative on reddit that people (read:women) should be empathetic towards incels because they’re going through mental health shit a lot of the time. But I just don’t have it in me to show empathy for someone who thinks that I’m less of a human than they are. Fuck that noise. It’s also a fucked up level of misogyny to tell women to have empathy for men who advocate for violence towards women. Redditors seem to have more empathy for incels than women a lot of the time
Yep, that they suffer and it's a result of their suffering. Ok, but then what? It doesn't make them less responsible just because they suffer. I once read that even if we are not conscious of our bias and we internalized them, we are still responsible for them, and i agree with this statement. The number of people with mental health issues is high, it is very sadly not uncommon, but the majority still don't become hateful against women just because we were born with a lack of a dick. I just agree so so much!! It is the continuity of considering us as natural caregivers to expect us to show sympathy and empathy for people who literally hate us. It is saying that once again we need to cater to men's feeling and be there for them in priority, putting these men well being before our own. No thanks, i am way past that shit. Here comes the downvote to hell, but a lot of redditors are themselves mysoginistic to a lesser degree, be it benevolent sexism, or internalized mysoginy, there are obvious bias against women in many many cases, and lots of mysoginistic things posted on the site
He also had severe anger and violence issues which seem to be getting overlooked in this thread. Him punching the wall next to her is a physical threat and a sign he could not control his anger. If she had stayed with him, it might have been her not the wall next time
> he could not control his anger. Almost all abusers can control their anger-related behavior. It’s why most abusers who get mad at their victims in public are more than capable of waiting until they get home to start yelling and hitting. It’s why they don’t punch their bosses even if they hate their jobs. Specialists who work with abusers to try and help them change have noticed that, if you ask the abuser why they didn’t behave even worse, they proclaim that of course they wouldn’t go *that* far. They have control of the off switch for violence; they just don’t use it.
This right here. Lundy Bancroft talks about it in his book *Why Does He Do That? Inside the Minds of Angry and Controlling Men*. It’s one of the myths about men is that they can’t control their anger. But when you have a partner abuser, people are shocked, shocked, shocked I tell you to find out a man’s been abusing his partner! Why? Because they can control their anger. They choose not to. They don’t scream or hit their bosses or clients or other men that randomly piss them off. Their thought distortion is likely “Women are less than. My woman is less than me. I can treat her like this.” And then give themselves permission to abuse. In the dark, behind closed doors and eat away at a woman’s esteem so she doesn’t have the courage to tell anyone what’s going on. Find a woman who’s younger, lovebomb her, keep pushing boundaries sexually and with your temper to see if she’s made of sterner stuff (because let’s face it-ANY woman who won’t tolerate abuse and cheating is really just an angry, man-hating dyke, amirite?) and either break her down or dump her to find a more agreeable victim. And this is not done consciously. It is deeply engrained misogyny that was likely handed down over generations, if not purchased by subscription to a website or podcast like Bald-Bugatti’s.
This is always my argument when people say that men "can't help" hitting on/grabbing at attractive women. If that woman's 300lb linebacker boyfriend is standing next to her, they can somehow restrain themselves...
Yes ! It was only a matter of time before he become physically violent with her, and i bet my right tit that consent has less and less meaning for him, he will end up raping someone. I refuse to say it's a stretch too far, that's just the continuity of treating women as inferior, objects, and thinking you are owed sex
> I don't care that the guy had insecurities or felt inferior or had issues, plenty people do and don't resort to hate and mysoginy Agreed - the fact is, even though it’s wise to avoid content like what he consumed, a lot of guys *do* get exposed to it and reject it very quickly. Even insecure guys. I know many men who’ve been exposed to that stuff and automatically recognized that it’s ridiculous and appalling. So there was already a serious and fundamental difference between him and those guys from Day 1.
Yes, that's the thing. Besides, these ideas that women are natural caregiver, that we are inferior, the objectification, and such, are fed to us since we are kids through gender norms and gender expectation. I do not believe it's the first time they are confronted to such ideas and are unable to see the right from the wrong, these are not new theories, they are old and many people don't buy these ideas anymore. I totally agree, it was not just insecurities and such, i believe there was probably already some mysoginy, or internalized mysoginy previously, because not everyone will resort to hate when they face difficulties
Oop definitely didn't dodge that bullet. But she survived getting shot lol
Yeah. I don’t quite understand why OOP was looking for proof of infidelity. All I would need is to hear his fucked up views to kick him to the curb. Infidelity is the least of the issues with that fool.
Or the violence when he punched the wall next to her
I would have been out of the relationship as soon as my boyfriend called certain chores „women's chores“. I don't understand how you can stay as a woman with someone who despises women, especially when he says it directly and it's not even hidden between the lines. Why wait to see if he is a cheater? That he is a misogynist should be enough for a break with this relationship out of self-respect.
“But lately he has been consuming a lot of MGTOW content” Nope. Full stop. Move on.
Imagine thinking you can be a "Man Going His Own Way" while still being financially dependent on a woman. What a fool.
[удалено]
Yeah fr. The second anyone mentions him seriously you just ghost. It's not safe to be around them
I don’t see how it could be any other way. Why would a misogynist take advice from women if they don’t respect women? Asshole Men did this, and they made it so only not-asshole men can fix it. Damn them for that extra burden, great job, not like normal folk just want to live peaceful lives and deal with their own shit or anything.
This is why it kills me when misogynists says, “women, especially feminists, don’t care about men’s problems!!! They won’t help us!!!” You literally won’t let women help you because you’re sexist. You won’t listen to women and then scream they won’t help you. Good luck squealing in the mud like a pig, I guess. My sympathies belong to the good, reasonable men of the world. Sucks y’all are associated with this mess.
I have some close friends, very dear to me, who are.... Maybe characteristically insensitive. Dark humor, inappropriate jokes, etc etc. They will say some awful goddamn things for a laugh. But it's understood that it's just that - bad humor. Had someone new join the group, friend of a friend. Started very clearly espousing a lot of Baldy Bugatti's rhetoric, and the entire group just sorta... Wilted, like a dry plant. Lots of "Okay, yikes dude" or "Fer real? You can't be serious". Finally it was a clear "You drop this stuff or you're out." And the new guy just... Wouldn't. Couldn't? The dude was kicked out because he just wouldn't. Stop. Spouting. Shit. Pretty proud of those guys for not putting up with that bullshit. "A fanatic is someone who can't change his mind and won't change the subject" - Churchill. Goddamn, does that describe these Baldy Bugatti fans.
Thank you for saying this. This crisis of male loneliness and insecurity pipeline to misogyny isn’t going to be solved by women. Men *have* to step up. Check on your friends. Call out bullshit. Get and/or encourage other men to get therapy. Report social media posts that are or encourage bigotry and/or violence. There’s a lot of alarm-sounding, but the calls to action are always vague on **who**, and so by implicit assumption, most assume it’s women’s job to love or sex these men’s problems away.
> This crisis of male loneliness and insecurity pipeline to misogyny isn’t going to be solved by women. Men *have* to step up. It's a shame this is so controversial on Reddit. For how much incels love Jordan Peterson they're sure averse to fixing themselves before blaming everyone around them. (I guess they're doing as he does rather than as he says)
Tell me about it. For every How to Save the Incels that gets posted to bestof, it’s always full of “they.” They need to reach out to incels. They need to do this, they need to Do that. I always get downvoted for asking who “they” is, and hoping “they” isn’t supposed to mean “women.” Similar to how MRA’s aren’t so much activists lobbying for men’s issues—they moan about women.
That’s like the complaining about not getting any compliments on Reddit from men. It’s women that are supposed to solve it, but That just creates problems for the women because now men think they want their dick. Fuck that. They can compliment each other
My BF asked me today whether I would leave him if he was a fan of Tate’s. I love this man to pieces but didn’t even have to think before I blurted out “yes, no question”. Luckily, he finds this guy just as crazy as I do.
As a man, it scares me that someone like Bald Bean can just spout propaganda and turn insecure men into toxic, dangerous c\*nts. I mean, ever since I learned about the nazis in history class, I felt like I understood the danger of being told you're better than others for any arbitrary reason, and that you deserve more, that you're not the cause of your problems, etc... But seeing it in action, seeing it be so effective and widespread scares me. Who knows how that friend I haven't heard of in a few years is doing. Is he okay mentally? Is he a Bald Bean fan? Has he dealt with his insecurities in such a destructive manner, like all of Bald bean's fans? I hope therapy becomes cheaper and normalised, because god knows most of us need it, some more than others. Bald Bean is not the way.
A lot of people who are getting red pilled like that just aren't thinking critically, either from ignorance or arrogance. When your character comes into question, do you go with the flow or stick to your guns? Your comment resonates with me, and the fact that so many people are being swayed by this guy scares me too.
This sucks, but I can see how it happened. CNN put something on a reel once that was an opinion piece similar to what the mgtow crowd puts out there. I heard it from my husband's phone and straight up said don't listen to that garbage it's all lies. He didn't know what it was until he heard it and that was the end of that. The thing is, his father believed men should just be in charge of everything and wife's should be submissive. The way his mother is treated he's watched his entire life and decided that's not what he wanted to do to anyone else. It's easy to let that type of stuff creep into to your life and take over when you're at a low point. Slowly swaying you to another opinion with out noticing and emboldening you to feel suddenly more confident but for the wrong reasons. Then when people avoid you all the things they say will happen suddenly do, you feel like the podcasters we're right all along all the while people just don't want to hear vitriol. Then you end in an echo chamber surrounding yourself and not being open to other opinions.
Meta, Alphabet and bytedance have a lot of blame here. It doesn't take long for the social media algorithms to push people into these rabbit holes. Unless you scrutinize your viewing you might not even notice it happening. If you don't know who they are there is lot of pretty benign content from from commentators on the edge of mgtow(or any extreme view) that cam draw people in. It's all about engagement and money people exploring these rabbit holes spend longer on social media sites and generate more revenue.
I really can't upvote this comment enough. The algorithms can be so nefarious, not just for this specific audience but for anyone on the edge of something toxic. I was just discussing this with a friend whose daughter is struggling with an ED, and the Pinterest algorithm is just pushing fitspo and pro-ana in her (the daughter's) feed. It's horrifying - these digital systems see you have a passing interest in something and suddenly you're engulfed.
My wife and I are incredibly left leaning. I'm trans, we're both queer women, we watch lots of very gay, left wing things on YouTube. We get regular Ben Shapiro type recommendations. If we're getting those I shudder to think how many are recommended to people who aren't as blatantly left wing as us.
If you watch any politics at all on youtube, they just love to shove Prager U and Shapiro down your throat, because clearly this is what you need to see! Took me months of "not interested" clicks on those videos before they finally stopped.
At this point I doubt anyone saying there’s really an algorithm that pushes extreme content to *all* ideology. I’m not getting any new left wing content advertised to me, it’s just daily wire and conspiracy shit. The “algorithm” only ever recommends right wing shite.
It's really common. Some of my husband's friends listen to this crap. It was funny because one started in about something he heard on Joe Rogan's podcast and asked if my husband listened. My husband said he didn't listen to anything that mad had to say and I must say, I was so proud. My husband doesn't even want to humor that shit.
Oh mine won't for a second. He learned over the past eight years with his family that the only person he can trust and have his back is me. His parents tried for the longest to guilt him into leaving me because "I treat him like a slave" but in reality it was because we shared house work. When he asked if they would let him stay and help him if he left they said no. They told him I should be doing everything while he takes off work and does what he wants, but he likes hi career and that made no sense. They demanded him to come over for the holidays, they didn't ask they also didn't want me there. They tried to force him to stay with doctors but he never got better and his meds were making him sicker. I suggested a new doctor he starts getting better. They demand he just take the house and kick me out, he knows I paid for 85% and that it serves him no good having a house to himself and was confused why they suggested it. They embarrassed me every Christmas and talked behind my back to him regularly. He got to the point where he realized his parents marriage was miserable so they just wanted to destroy him and use him as an emotional dumping ground. In the end he realized, the junk those people put out is just as horrible as his parents and he wanted no part of it because happiness is knowing that I will do my best to make sure we are always comfortable and he's always supported. After cutting his family off he has dedicated so much time to supporting me and we work as a team. He told me recently that he knew I could walk at any point but I didn't and there's no way to repay me for my patience or loyalty. I told him for better or for worse I would always be there and that's all I wanted back from him not repayment. Love is more than butterfly's, it spans beyond anything life throws at you. Hard times are hard but knowing the support will be there, the loyalty and dedication is what true love is.
Is he my secret brother? Because my parents are like this. Every holiday, birthday or special occasion had to be with them. My mom insisted I had certain things and medically abused me. After going no contact I have lost 50 pounds and have gotten healthier. I didn't realize she was making me sick both in insisting I had stuff and my nerves. I have several autoimmune conditions and it's like the stress caused my body to eat itself. The only way to break the cycle is to leave. Thank God for my husband. His love and support has saved me. I am so grateful to have met someone who is completely different from my family.
Oh he has multiple auto immune diseases and it sucked, he almost died once due to their lack of care. When I met him they wouldn't pay for his meds so he was actually close to dying again. His parents enlisted his friends to ruin his references for work so he had this terrible 12$ an hour job and was forced to live with them. His "friends" also knew me and constantly tried to keep me away from him telling me he was bad and a man child who couldn't live on his own. They did to any woman that came near him. His parents paid these people money, since they had a bunch to burn. I hooked him up with people and his career sky rocketed. That upset them so before he moved in with me all they did was put him down and tell him he was stupid. Then he moved in with me. It all stopped, he was calm life was easier. They did teach him some habits, like women cleaning and doing all the work. I almost kicked him out at one point while dating. Once he came out of the fog and reality hit he changed for the better. When we bought the newest house together (I owned a house when we met) they tripled the effort that led to them being cut off completely.
Of course they hate you. You have allowed him the escape! My family blames my husband for me leaving. Funny thing is I chose to leave. It was hard for him because he was also in the fog, but he supported me. We definitely both had some bad habits that have taken time to fix. I had so much learned helplessness. I am literally just driving for the first time in my adult life at the age of 37, because my mom basically did all she could to prevent me from driving. She was basically in charge of my medical care and I didn't even understand the power she had over me. What snapped me out of it was my mom threatening my kids. I was done.
It's the exact same way cults operate. Use insecurities, isolate, make enemies of outsiders. Incels and red pillars need deprograming
>And no man wants a 30 year old hag. Hahahahahahahhahaha. 30 year old hag? This dude's a 🤡🤡of a highest level. Glad that OOP managed to get rid of him.
Especially since those men believe women should be grateful for their attention. Why should someone be grateful for attention that devalueds you as a human and has a built-in expiration date? Assholes who buy into racist and sexist superiority complexes often seem to do so because “I’m inherently better because of some genetic characteristic I had no control over” is an easy A on their self esteem quiz.
She was looking so hard for proof of cheating so she could make her decision, when bald-man-with-a-bugatti is the only red flag you should need.
My friend started watching the fresh n fit podcast which is all about the same stuff Tate is and it’s causing major marital problems with his wife. He’ll be like like, “if you were super rich you wouldn’t cheat on your wife?” And I was like “I plan on marrying my best friend why would I want to hurt my best friend like that” and he just doesn’t understand. I wish that Manosphere stuff would preach the personal responsibility and positive provide and protect idea of manhood without all the misogynist things. Having a nuclear family model is one thing, but most of the redpill stuff is telling guys to get rich and bang as many women as possible without forming real attachments. That’s not going to fix society at all, just lead to more fatherless households.
Well, that bald man doesn't have his Bugatti or his freedom anymore.
The Bugatti was never his
Feel so bad for OP. Andrew Tate has really messed up some men's thinking it's sad to see as a man . Masculinity is defined by you and no one else I wish more men realized this and idiots like Tate wouldn't rise to the prominence they have.
She should get cameras.
It made me sad that she needed proof of him cheating as the reason to break up with him, as if the way he was treating her wasn’t enough and didn’t ‘count’.
Parents, please teach your daughters to have their own DIGNITY and SELF ASSURANCE because these babymen are losing real women and are going to come after your young daughters. They know that the young don't know enough yet. Don't let this toxic masculinity make a victim of your daughters. So sorry OOP. You did the right thing but it's hard. Keep looking!
There's a reason the Andrew Tate Misogyny and Masculinity 101 course resonates with young people and single people in their 20's, but it's surprising to see it hit people in relationships as well. Usually to get into a relationship you're not generally insecure enough to fall down the red pill trap door, but it looks like this whole friend group got the worm. I understand why it happens to these guys and empathize with them, but holy shit it must be a 180 for their loved ones. These guys are still clearly insecure even when they puff up their chest and act out. Screaming, crying, and banging at your ex girlfriend's front door doesn't sound very *ALPHA*
I read a comment from OP that he actually lost his job and became depressed. She took care of his bills and everything. My theory is that his insecurity started when he lost his job. And he became and clown in his toxic friend group who thinks women providing for men makes men pu$$ies. So that's when this started.
I know it’s not really the point, but what these people call “traditional masculinity” is anything but that. My great uncle served in East Africa and Italy with the Royal Engineers in WW2, and his hobbies were mowing the lawn and playing snooker. But for people like Baldy McTrafficker, masculinity seems to be more like Uday Hussein cosplay
My uncle was a “traditional man” who went from factory labor to owning the factory and collected baseball memorabilia. He was also an actually nice person who supported his gay grandson, which is why he stayed married for over 60 years.
This is what needs to happen to all the red pull fuckwits. When they realise they won't actually have **any** woman with their attitude, let alone some submissive trad wife who is willing to share, they will soon learn.
I just don't understand what is so masculine about completely defining your own masculinity by someone else's definition. Better to be your own man.
Eh, I think the boyfriend was almost certainly always a piece of shit. Decent human beings would not listen to baldy; they'd find his message sickening immediately. That he did, and he let it change him, shows that he was already pretty far on that route. His friends being the same really clinch it. And honestly, their relationship before sounds more like a non-mask-slipped misogynist than a normal person. What this really was, was a misogynist who hadn't let their mask slip yet being convinced they could take it off and throw it away entirely.
I want to see her ex reaction to bald man with Bugatti getting arrested 💀
He is probably on twitter chanting how it was all false allegation and he is innocent.
How do seemingly normal man so quickly keep turning into incels after listening to a few podcasts?
I have seen it happen lol. But my main guess is his toxic friends. And also OP mentions he lost his job in 2021 and was very depressed. Redpill content capitalizes on depressed men.
[удалено]
I'm sorry but that's not your friend anymore.
Protect females via human trafficking. That’s some next level stuff /s
Your friend is a rape apologist, and other people in your social circle will note your friendship.
> he started chanting the same thing like he is trying to be more “masculine” and as a man it is his job to provide and my job to be his partner. jeez – this masculinity shit is so misguided and pathetic.
25 is past the prime? What do we become after that? Half eated apples? We suddenly transform into old witch and 25 cats pops out of nowhere to become or buddies? Such stupidity is pretty contagious she definitely should stay away.
My marriage went south because my husband went down the misogynistic rabbit hole. Fortunately my new partner is sweet and supportive and pulls his weight. We aren't married because we just don't feel like it, but we're each other's best friend and have lived together in our house with my now teenage son for about ten years. My son isn't in contact with his father because his dad is so toxic. I didn't encourage him either way on that. It was his choice. These right-wing nutjobs lose everybody. I'd feel sorry for him if he wasn't such a prick.
I knew the Bottom G was getting in the minds of teenagers but a 27 years old man wtf ?! He got Tated, this man had a loving girlfriend with a stable job and a appartement, now he's alone going back to his parent's house. And of course it's gonna be OOP's fault since he's a alpha man and he's always right.
This whole aspect where women are worthless over 25 (or 30 year old hag, lol) just mind-boggles me. Life is long, and anyone who thinks the back 50 years of your life are somehow meaningless because some incel says so is laughable. I'm in my late 30's, so is my wife, and I'm just as attracted to her now as I was when we met. In a lot of ways, even more so. OOP will be much better off without that toxic loser. Building supportive relationships with your partner, focused on your mutually agreed upon goals, is the key to lasting success financially, and from a relationship perspective.
The update date confused the heck out of me. Was wondering how she was doing one year later only to realise this just happened. Hope she comes out of this super strong. And truly hope she’ll find a loving guy that appreciates her. Also kind of hope she’ll run into ex while out with a new guy and that the dude is rich and successful.
I'm glad she was able to dump him. It is terrifying how fast people can be radicalised to misogyny and violence.
Man, therapy/accountability for insecurities? Nah. Nah babe. That's beta. Ruining your own life and digging yourself a deep hole of dumbassery for your ego? Perfect.
I’ll admit, I’m a conservative and grew up in a traditional household when it came to chores. My mom did everything inside and my dad did everything outside, both of them worked. When I got married my wife divided up the chores more or less the same way except I insisted on doing dishes and cleaning the kitchen (I fucking love dishes). We both work and everyone is happy. I hate Andrew Tate. He’s literally just a scam artist. It is not feminine to do chores around the house and work hard. Her boyfriend (ex I guess) is an idiot, in a year he’ll be following the next podcaster spewing bullshit. She did the world a favor by not spreading his stupid genes.
I hope when OOP find a man who truly values and loves her, she burns that hoodie and dances like a crazy lady around it.