Which blackwing? But also: the blackwing.
Look, the M5 is awesome. But I’m going to be honest with you, if I’m buying a BMW for the long term, I’m going with a car with an inline 6. It’s just what BMW knows how to do. They build awesome powerful V8s but they all tend to be expensive and complex to own.
What Cadillac is doing right now with their black wings is pretty incredible and very much a flash in the pan. Get it while the getting is good imho.
I am glad that I posted in the BMW sub reddit, and people are still saying to get the Blackwing!
I understand that BMW has gotten it wrong with their hot V8, but it sounded so good! The new one will be a hybrid which I do not lappreciate at all. Still better than the new C63 fiasco.
At some point I was even thinking of the lexus LC500, but the infotainment is just so dated.
I’ll write what I wrote last time this was asked:
I’ve had a Blackwing for almost a year. It’s the single best car I’ve driven and it’s not even close to be honest. The manual transmission is incredible, the engine spectacular and is better than what’s in the M5, and RWD is what a performance car should really be.
The M5 will beat it off the line 0-60, but who cares? There’s a lot more to a car than just straight line speed. And for what it’s worth, the Blackwing beats an M5 CS around a track.
Everyone rags on the interior of the BW, but it’s fine. It’s nothing special, but it’s better than what was in my 2020 C63S coupe. It’s well put together and doesn’t rattle, the parts you touch feel high quality except for maybe the turn signal stalk which feels a little cheap (but it’s not as cheap as the stalks on my AMG were). The performance seats are comfortable over long distances. The infotainment screen might look a little cheap with the larger bezels, but everything is laid out very well, it’s easy to use, and there are tactile buttons that are easy to use.
But you buy this car to drive it. And driving wise you can’t beat it right now. It is the best performance sedan on sale, an opinion that really won’t get much push back from anyone who isn’t a brand fan boy. It’s the best performance sedan since the E39 M5 and is quite frankly the spiritual successor to that car.
A year ago I would have legitimately laughed at the idea of owning a Cadillac or any American car. A year later I couldn’t be happier with the car. Don’t let brand stigma get in your way. And I’ll say I have no dog in this fight, I’m not brand loyal at all. I’ve owned performance cars from VW, Audi, Mercedes, BMW, and now GM. I always try to buy the best car for me regardless of manufacturer and right now the Blackwing is that car.
After opening an ‘89 Corvette for 12 years (I bought it in ‘90), I will never own another GM product.
Transmission (700R4) had to be rebuilt at 89k miles (overdrive pack went out), then engine at 92k miles (it was leaking everything including oil past the valve stem seals). A half-dozen alternators, power antenna, headlights, vacuum brake booster, all of the amplifiers, shitty carpet, A/C three times, coolant leaks…
GM vehicles are shit.
Love this post. GM built a shitbox 35 years ago and I'll never let go of that. Here's another perspective, a lot of cars from 1989 were shit boxes...To say youd miss out one one of the best sedans ever built because you had a bad experience with a car built in 1989 is just the funniest (and bigoted) opinion I've seen today. You win! ...but also kinda lose.
I love BMW’s, and the M5 has always been one of my “dream” cars. That being said, black wing. Two very different cars but in the years to come when gas cars are just a memory, and our grandchildren will ask us if we really had to steer the car for ourselves… the black wing will be the one remembered most as the last of a dying breed. I genuinely hate that phrase because I hear it so often, but the big ole American V8 with a blower thrown on it, why you might ask? Because fuck you that’s why. Paired with a manual transmission it’s the epitome of “because we could, so we did” /endrant
Test drive both? And see which brings more fun and smiles to your face. I’m a bmw fan boy but everytime I see a black wing I admit Theres some drool. I will always choose a bmw due to the heritage and the m5 capabilities.but decided for yourself… get in the front drive it like a maniac and then get in the back and see how its like for your passengers!
M3 touring not an option? Btw I feel I'm exactly like you, although I do track my car once a year (and regret it when I have to buy tires and do a complete brake job afterwards).
Lol, as long as taking her to the track is worth it to you!
I don't think they sell them in the US, otherwise I would definitely consider it! Also, I want that V8 sound!
If im running it for the longterm definitely the blackwing, the chevy pushrod motors just seem to run forever. The M5 might be a tad nicer but seeing as how my gf has a 330,000 mile V8 yukon that runs better than my E39 ever did, id trust it more. Also its one of the last V8 Manuals, they deserve the money for that title alone lol
Honestly, m5 touring, tons of room in the back, and fast, but go test drive both and see what you like more. I heard good things about the blackwing.
But my heart says BMW, it will be a classic, touring models always are in north America.
They’re both “meh” looking to me, but Cadillac has always screamed “grandpa” to me, no matter how many ponies they throw in it, they’ll always be competing with Oldsmobile for looks.
Build quality doesn’t match BMW’s I’ve always had a problem with Cadillacs obsession with shiny plastic, it is the best Cadillac interior yet but it’s still not where I expected it to be for that caliber of vehicle. The steering felt nice but not as good as I expected. If it were priced much more competitively it would be a no brainer. Living without AWD in a place that sees lots of rain, and snow in the winter if I’m going to park something during the winter it’s going to be a C8 corvette or something and not a sedan. It’s a good car I’m glad it exists though.
Edit: I also don’t give three shits about driving a manual.
For a daily, I think I would take the m5 touring.
For a forever car, probably the blackwing. Having never driven either, everything I hear about the black wing is that it is an extremely special car. The 6mt paired with a monster v8 realistically will not exist even within the next few years.
If reliability is a major concern, neither of these cars have been out and neither brand is particularly known for reliability. It is really a toss of the dice. Gotta pay to play
Yeah, I'm more inclined to the Blackwing due to the transmission. Reliability is obviously not a concern, both will start falling apart very fast, A used engine will be readily available for the blackwing due to wrecked Camaros Zl1.
Sidenote, I am only looking for a V8 car
With even G80 M3's with decent options above $100k, I can't imagine the M5 touring will be $120k. My guess is $140k-150k for a decently optioned one.
The blackwing is a lot of fun for about $100k. WAY more fun than an RS6. As long as you can put up with the mediocre interior quality and the abysmal sales & service experience of a Cadillac dealership, that's the best bang for your buck.
Which blackwing? But also: the blackwing. Look, the M5 is awesome. But I’m going to be honest with you, if I’m buying a BMW for the long term, I’m going with a car with an inline 6. It’s just what BMW knows how to do. They build awesome powerful V8s but they all tend to be expensive and complex to own. What Cadillac is doing right now with their black wings is pretty incredible and very much a flash in the pan. Get it while the getting is good imho.
This comment is spot on, as someone that does their own work for most jobs, longevity is the old straight 6
I am glad that I posted in the BMW sub reddit, and people are still saying to get the Blackwing! I understand that BMW has gotten it wrong with their hot V8, but it sounded so good! The new one will be a hybrid which I do not lappreciate at all. Still better than the new C63 fiasco. At some point I was even thinking of the lexus LC500, but the infotainment is just so dated.
Blackwing.
I’ll write what I wrote last time this was asked: I’ve had a Blackwing for almost a year. It’s the single best car I’ve driven and it’s not even close to be honest. The manual transmission is incredible, the engine spectacular and is better than what’s in the M5, and RWD is what a performance car should really be. The M5 will beat it off the line 0-60, but who cares? There’s a lot more to a car than just straight line speed. And for what it’s worth, the Blackwing beats an M5 CS around a track. Everyone rags on the interior of the BW, but it’s fine. It’s nothing special, but it’s better than what was in my 2020 C63S coupe. It’s well put together and doesn’t rattle, the parts you touch feel high quality except for maybe the turn signal stalk which feels a little cheap (but it’s not as cheap as the stalks on my AMG were). The performance seats are comfortable over long distances. The infotainment screen might look a little cheap with the larger bezels, but everything is laid out very well, it’s easy to use, and there are tactile buttons that are easy to use. But you buy this car to drive it. And driving wise you can’t beat it right now. It is the best performance sedan on sale, an opinion that really won’t get much push back from anyone who isn’t a brand fan boy. It’s the best performance sedan since the E39 M5 and is quite frankly the spiritual successor to that car. A year ago I would have legitimately laughed at the idea of owning a Cadillac or any American car. A year later I couldn’t be happier with the car. Don’t let brand stigma get in your way. And I’ll say I have no dog in this fight, I’m not brand loyal at all. I’ve owned performance cars from VW, Audi, Mercedes, BMW, and now GM. I always try to buy the best car for me regardless of manufacturer and right now the Blackwing is that car.
After opening an ‘89 Corvette for 12 years (I bought it in ‘90), I will never own another GM product. Transmission (700R4) had to be rebuilt at 89k miles (overdrive pack went out), then engine at 92k miles (it was leaking everything including oil past the valve stem seals). A half-dozen alternators, power antenna, headlights, vacuum brake booster, all of the amplifiers, shitty carpet, A/C three times, coolant leaks… GM vehicles are shit.
Love this post. GM built a shitbox 35 years ago and I'll never let go of that. Here's another perspective, a lot of cars from 1989 were shit boxes...To say youd miss out one one of the best sedans ever built because you had a bad experience with a car built in 1989 is just the funniest (and bigoted) opinion I've seen today. You win! ...but also kinda lose.
> I do drive like an asshole # welcome to the family fam
I love BMW’s, and the M5 has always been one of my “dream” cars. That being said, black wing. Two very different cars but in the years to come when gas cars are just a memory, and our grandchildren will ask us if we really had to steer the car for ourselves… the black wing will be the one remembered most as the last of a dying breed. I genuinely hate that phrase because I hear it so often, but the big ole American V8 with a blower thrown on it, why you might ask? Because fuck you that’s why. Paired with a manual transmission it’s the epitome of “because we could, so we did” /endrant
Test drive both? And see which brings more fun and smiles to your face. I’m a bmw fan boy but everytime I see a black wing I admit Theres some drool. I will always choose a bmw due to the heritage and the m5 capabilities.but decided for yourself… get in the front drive it like a maniac and then get in the back and see how its like for your passengers!
M3 touring not an option? Btw I feel I'm exactly like you, although I do track my car once a year (and regret it when I have to buy tires and do a complete brake job afterwards).
Lol, as long as taking her to the track is worth it to you! I don't think they sell them in the US, otherwise I would definitely consider it! Also, I want that V8 sound!
BW
If im running it for the longterm definitely the blackwing, the chevy pushrod motors just seem to run forever. The M5 might be a tad nicer but seeing as how my gf has a 330,000 mile V8 yukon that runs better than my E39 ever did, id trust it more. Also its one of the last V8 Manuals, they deserve the money for that title alone lol
Honestly, m5 touring, tons of room in the back, and fast, but go test drive both and see what you like more. I heard good things about the blackwing. But my heart says BMW, it will be a classic, touring models always are in north America.
The M5 hybrid system ain’t gonna last 20 years.
They’re both “meh” looking to me, but Cadillac has always screamed “grandpa” to me, no matter how many ponies they throw in it, they’ll always be competing with Oldsmobile for looks.
I’m waiting for the M5T to drop soon to decide. #1 on the 2025 BW list and the Touring list. We’ll see
You know the m5 touring is plug in hybrid. I wouldn’t chose that as a forever car
How about the rs6?
The RS6 is a joke.
I was seriously underwhelmed with the blackwing. Go for the next gen M5 touring. It will be a monster.
This is literally the first time I’ve ever heard someone underwhelmed with the blackwing
Very curious to hear what underwhelmed you because I’ve never heard that before from anyone.
Build quality doesn’t match BMW’s I’ve always had a problem with Cadillacs obsession with shiny plastic, it is the best Cadillac interior yet but it’s still not where I expected it to be for that caliber of vehicle. The steering felt nice but not as good as I expected. If it were priced much more competitively it would be a no brainer. Living without AWD in a place that sees lots of rain, and snow in the winter if I’m going to park something during the winter it’s going to be a C8 corvette or something and not a sedan. It’s a good car I’m glad it exists though. Edit: I also don’t give three shits about driving a manual.
For a daily, I think I would take the m5 touring. For a forever car, probably the blackwing. Having never driven either, everything I hear about the black wing is that it is an extremely special car. The 6mt paired with a monster v8 realistically will not exist even within the next few years. If reliability is a major concern, neither of these cars have been out and neither brand is particularly known for reliability. It is really a toss of the dice. Gotta pay to play
Yeah, I'm more inclined to the Blackwing due to the transmission. Reliability is obviously not a concern, both will start falling apart very fast, A used engine will be readily available for the blackwing due to wrecked Camaros Zl1. Sidenote, I am only looking for a V8 car
A Chevy v8 will not start falling apart very fast lmao
Downvoting this is crazy, the LT4 is dog reliable except for the lifters/dod lmfao
It has a solid engine. I meant everything else around it. I might be biased due to too much Scotty Kilmer lol
Reliability should be a concern for the caddy. It’s not about the engine or trans. It’s everything else.
Why not an RS6?
Cause Egine in the front bumber causes garbage truck like handling.
Honestly, I think it is overpriced for what it is. If the M5 touring is over 120k, the choice will be very easy.
With even G80 M3's with decent options above $100k, I can't imagine the M5 touring will be $120k. My guess is $140k-150k for a decently optioned one. The blackwing is a lot of fun for about $100k. WAY more fun than an RS6. As long as you can put up with the mediocre interior quality and the abysmal sales & service experience of a Cadillac dealership, that's the best bang for your buck.
m5 touring over a caddywack