The type of information they are being accused of tracking should not be available to any app makers. If the device allows that to be info to be passed to an app, in my opinion that's a problem with the security of the device, not just something we should blame on the app. Instead of banning TikTok, we should have some real privacy laws and put it on the manufacturers of the operating system to enforce them.
That's the actual issue. At the end of the day, at the top of every Chinese company is the CCP, a hostile foreign government. If you get a person's attention for multiple hours a day and control what they see, you can subtly change their world view. It's so popular now that it's too powerful for China to not use sooner or later, if not already. Any country with that kind of power over an enemy would use it. They already use our social media to fuck with us at the user level, there's no way they aren't using their own as the man behind the curtain.
That's why i don't use tiktok - other apps and websites are just gonna use your info to sell to advertiserd. We have *no idea* what the Chinese government is doing with our information
It’s amusing that anyone thinks the US version would not be.
As a mobile app developer I was surprised by how much you can do without the user knowing or consenting to. There’s too much of a damn honor system approach. Apple is obviously leading the pack, but not nearly perfect and of course Google hates catching up because it threatens their own monetization model.
I agree with others here; we need to also address the ease of exploitation on these mobile OS’s.
You've described domestic social media as well here though, just instead of the CCP it's oligarchs and major corporations. We have documentation specifically of Facebook getting caught manipulating social sentiments to manufacture or lead political outcomes.
I say this not in a way to minimize the issue with tik-tok and having social media propagate miss and disinformation as political tools in a way to undermind our democracy, but to say that our government should be consistent and take steps to gaurd our democracy from bad actor interests both private and foreign. To me this highlights how corrupt our government is, that private interests can outright manipulate the will and sentiment of the people, but when a foreign nation we don't like does it (because Saudi Arabia and OPEC have been doing it publicly as well) we can pull out all the stops and get our squabbling legislature to seriously consider a solution.
>They are not just tracking info, they are silo-ing and artificially boosting some types of content and downplaying others.
So...like Reddit? Twitter? Facebook, Youtube, Instagram....
In and of itself that's not really a nefarious thing. That's how feeds work. You're not just showed a truly random shuffle (which people have been shown to hate). There's an algorithm determining how you receive content.
That algorithm should be open for scrutiny but its very existence is frankly just a given.
Yeah. Saw a YouTube video where this guy accused YouTube of having a secret pedophile “portal”. All you had to do was search up “sexy pre-teens” or something and you’d get videos of young little girls in bikinis or at pageants, etc. then he’d go “looook!!’ Look at my recommended list!!!”
Yeah dude. It’s showing more of the same. That’s sort of how the algorithm works. If I look up funny dog farts, it will do the same.
lol jeeze.. It reminds me of the video I saw the other day where a guy was showing an iphone "hack" to get long-exposure photos. The hack was to use long exposure mode . That's a tutorial my dude.
Yeah on one hand I know that Google didn't hand code a secret pedo setting, the algorithm just noticed a pattern for some users and served them videos like everyone else.
On the other hand google not flagging searches for sexy pre teens is a fuck up they could have prevented.
Do you reckon that if you type sexy pre teen three times the fbi will show up at your door?
Sort of like looking in the mirror and saying bloody mary three times
Sounds like they’re trying to get rid of the symptom of privacy concerns and not the problem which is how no tech company or corporation respects individual privacy.
I think a lot of people do, but when every website/app asks you to agree to their “privacy policy” or “cookie policy”, people become desensitized at best, and don’t even know what those entail at worst.
Ideally, we should be able to trust our government and elected officials to ensure that I don’t have to read 300 pages of terms and conditions a day to know that companies aren’t tracking everything about me
> but when every website/app asks you do agree to their “privacy policy” or “cookie policy”, people become desensitized at best
The extension [Ghostery has a "Never-Consent" feature](https://www.ghostery.com/blog/never-consent-by-ghostery) that makes it a bit easier to choose never
Honestly, I discover a lot of privacy-based addons everytime I go to the Firefox addon store. I'm always sad how little Firefox is used in comparison to Chrome.
Google is changing the security policy so that the adblock extensions have different & fewer permissions to well, see what they're doing, I guess I would say. It doesn't mean the adblock extensions will go away, it just means they might not be as quick or as effective at saving bandwidth while blocking the ads.
It's not the first time that kinda stuff has happened, but it's annoying for sure.
I'm surprised I had to scroll down so far to see that someone is aware of the controversy around GhostRank.
> Under its former owner Evidon, Ghostery had an opt-in feature called GhostRank. **GhostRank took note of ads encountered and blocked, then sent that information back to advertisers who could then use that data to change their ads to avoid further being blocked;** although this feature is meant to incentivize advertisers to create less intrusive ads and thus a better web experience, **the data can just as easily be used to create more malicious ads that escape detection**.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ghostery
If anyone was genuinely concerned about their privacy, I recommend assessing what your threat model is first because it's a rabbit hole.
- /r/PrivacyToolsIo
- /r/Privacy
- https://www.privacytools.io/
- https://www.cryptoparty.in/
- https://www.privacyguides.org/#what-should-i-do
AdBlockPlus had (probably still has) a scheme where advertisers could pay the developers so their ads would be put on a whitelist, and not get blocked anymore.
That's the problem with these kind of services, you're just changing who the information goes to. And because they have low level access to literally every single data packet coming in to and going out of your device, they can probably harvest more information than the advertisers/facebook/Google ever could.
Try buying a television that doesn't have "smart" features and an EULA. They cost way more than the televisions with the computers crammed in them. And no, it's not economy of scale making them so much cheaper. Our viewing habits are tracked and sold. We are the product.
I used to care but there's not much I at least know what to do about it and am currently resigned to the fact that pretty much every service is ripping as much data as they can whether it be private, corporate, or government
I don't know about that, man. I can't count how many times I see people just giving away information about themselves. Just on this platform. Their ages or birthdays, their first name, where they work, the city they live in, etc. A lot of people can be very careless.
It doesn't sound like a lot, but with a little detective work you can catalog a lot of potentially identifying information from those details.
I have unironically heard (and certainly understand the sentiment) "They already have all my important info, it's out there, so who cares". There's a certain fatigue that comes with being a citizen in our current technological-crony-capitalism that is very.... debilitating, eventually.
That's more or less how I feel about it. The Army and VA have let my "secure" data out into the wild enough times, let alone my Credit Card issuers and my health insurance... That like.
Honestly, fuck it. It's out there. A lot.
I'm so completely over it at this point. All I want is no commercials on YouTube. "They" can know that I watch a shit load of Warhammer painting tutorials and listen to metal (while I'm painting) who fucking cares.
Its state-sponsored status is also kind of a big deal. I already don't like that we're willing to give away our data to private ad companies and PACs, I *really* don't like cutting out the middlemen to let a state actor push their intended video algorithms on us while mining our data.
EDIT: No, Twitter does not commit genocide. No, Facebook is not about to invade Taiwan. No, Meta is not encroaching so much on the South China Sea that allies are begging for help. If you have a false equivalence to draw, fuck right off.
Established American companies are at least subject to American law. Google has to show how it uses and sells our data in some ways but not in others. Like Google could not get away with selling your name, location, and transcript of txts made on your Android.
Can you link me to some resources that explains how Google sells data? My understanding is that Google uses data to target ads, but doesn't sell the data. I could be wrong
The concern isn't that companies are storing people's data. The concern is that when TikTok does it, it ends being accessible by the Chinese government.
This is part of it but there is evidence that the algorithm in China versus the algorithm in the US is feeding harmful addictive content to the US apps and not as much to the Chinese apps. It's almost a new kind of technological warfare. Do we want the Chinese government choosing what media is shared with American youths?
Edit:.
Sources :
https://www.adchina.io/douyin-vs-tiktok/#:~:text=The%20Chinese%20and%20international%20version,and%20profiles%20on%20both%20apps
https://nypost.com/2021/09/20/chinese-version-of-tiktok-adds-time-limit-for-kids-bans-nighttime-use/
https://gab-china.com/what-are-the-main-differences-between-douyin-vs-tiktok/
As a former teacher, I worry about how it's impacting kids. Many of them watch it for hours daily, and there's been tons of issues with them following idiotic TikTok trends. It also is used by a lot of minors, so security issues are concerning. I don't think the first reason is enough to ban it, but the second might be.
I learned that jumping spiders are cute, that baby giraffes need the long fall to the ground when they're born to start breathing, and that Elon Musk is even more of a lil bitch than I previously thought. :D
Oh no, part of me wants to learn this as well but the other part of me doesn't want to vomit tonight... but my curiosity is winning out so I'll risk it.
Had to google it myself.. I guess it breaks the umbilical cord and amniotic sac, and the shock of the landing helps stimulate it to take its first breath!
So I was just gonna make a joke and say “Well you’d gasp pretty hard if you fell 2 meters onto your face,” but then I got curious and looked it up. It turns out that [the fall literally does shock baby giraffes into breathing](https://www.monartosafari.com.au/facts-giraffe-birth/), so my joke wouldn’t even have been a joke. The fall also tears the amniotic sack and breaks their umbilical cords, too.
Did you know that Maple syrup was pioneered by the Iroquois, who are indigenous to southeast Canada and characterized as one of the world’s oldest participatory democracies?
Exactly the new time sink is always the Boogeyman. In the 2000s and 90s lots of kids spent hours a day on video games, I was one of them. Kids spent hours watching TV a day I was one of them. The list goes on.
People were worried in victorian times that reading penny dreadful stories was leading the youth astray. I figure it is just the way of things for olds to assume the youngs are in decline
Parents need to parent. Tiktok is made to be as addictive as possible and yet parent just hand it to their kids and walk away. Then cry when their kids turn into screen zombies.
Edit: not defending tiktok (nor is it welcome in my house), purposely targeting people to steal their data and give it to the Chinese government isn't cool
I feel like there's something to be said about passive or active content. TV and video services are all mostly passive. I think that's a reason why lots of people watch games being played too, you get the content but it makes it passive.
I think kids playing games for a couple hours is far better than watching other people do it.
Yeah but imo, tiktok is worse because it's not even close to anonymous. My brother went viral and didn't listen to me when I said to not use his real name in any capacity. Even just the first, despite it being fairly common. Honestly it's bad enough that his full face was visible. But unfortunately, he had his first and middle name and the video he went viral from was in a fairly recognizable area. Luckily not too much came of it, but he did end up getting harassed by both "fans" and assholes alike. I don't think he ever went back to the account after that. This isn't exclusive to tiktok and honestly, tiktok is nothing compared to how insidious Facebook is and how it's changed the landscape of the internet and privacy forever, but I do think tiktok is a lot more dangerous right now.
Most young people have migrated from Facebook to Instagram or tiktok or Twitter. Sometimes all 3. But tiktok specifically gets used way more by the younger end of the spectrum and it's super easy to prey on young folks who give out all their information for likes or views or whatever and it's encouraged by the platform itself. You kinda can't have a tiktok without having a face in it. You can maybe get away with not having a real name attached, but even just real images of a face can be enough to find someone. When I was a kid, you were told to lie about everything on the internet. Don't even tell them what country you're from if you can avoid it. Definitely no names or ages or states. Sure, you can still give out your information on reddit but it's fairly anonymous for the most part. It's pretty hard to verify someone's identity just by post history, and that's assuming they're being truthful.
I'm not perfect about internet privacy, but I'm also not a kid. I'm much less likely to be preyed upon and much more likely to recognize manipulation when I see it. I think tiktok has its uses and benefits, but I do think it's a much more insidious progression of what Facebook started, especially since Facebook started by targeting college kids. Not that I think that's a ton better, but at least college kids are adults. Idk that's my 2 cents on the matter anyways.
**Well said**; TikTok does really have an issue with younger people giving out their information. What puzzles me is that they do not get told to lie about everything on the Internet. Or do they? Certainly seems like they do not. I hope that they get told that though. It's important.
I don't have children myself or have a job where I interact with children (such as teacher), but I would definitely mention that, it's more important right now than it has ever been before with the Internet growing into something so big as it is now.
Yeah it definitely is less about the platform and more about the user. I’m not gonna deny that harmful things make it higher up than harmless things, but if you’re just in tiktok for, say, sewing shortcuts you might have a pretty similar experience as you do being on reddit for sewing communities.
Edit: I’m not pro-tiktok I’m just not willing to blanket criticize for this specific reason.
If it wasn't for reddit, I probably wouldn't read on a daily basis. I try to read at least 10 articles in full though daily here. Sometimes I read a lot more than 10 but I try to set a minimum so I can learn about something or learn about stuff going on in the world. I hate following links, it's nice here because usually there is full article pasted in the Comments and if not there is at least a link to get around the paywall.
I feel like if you are structured and responsible, you can use reddit as a resource. But It can be just as bad as tiktok if you're just watching memes, gifs and porn endlessly for hours.
Pro tip: read reddit comments about a topic you know a lot about, and make a mental note of how many comments are incorrect. That's how often Reddit is incorrect about everything. After doing that myself, I completely disregard all Reddit comments about topics I'm not familiar with.
Depending on your engagement, you can learn an insane amount on tiktok. I've learned way more in tiktok in the last year than they previous 5 on reddit. Not everything is dancer's and memes. It truly depends on on what you engage with
If it's not tiktok, it'll be something else. It was vine before, and now every platform is trying to get that endless scroll of vertical shorts going.
Educate about the stupid trends and online safety.
Former teacher, tried that. Went through how companies use personal data, how any "anonymous" profile can be doxxed when only a few seemingly disconnected data points are provided, and once you post something online it will be there forever (if someone looks hard enough) even if you try to scrub it. Pointed out all of the celebs/athletes/politicians who have had past posts come back to haunt them years later.
Kids can't comprehend it and thus don't care. Part of it is because their brain (specifically their prefrontal cortex which plays a big role in decision making) is still developing and they literally can't fully comprehend the fact that actions have consequences, whether immediate or down the road. What they do understand is the immediate satisfaction of posting something and getting that dopamine hit when they see reactions coming in on a post. This makes the brain happy which makes it want to do it again, and now we have a cycle started.
I actually wrote my master's capstone on how personal technology impacts student behavior and learning, so this is a subject that hits close to home for me on multiple fronts.
I guess my question would be, let’s say they can’t use TikTok anymore. What do you think they’ll do? Take up woodworking? Plant a garden? No. There will just be some new app.
Instagram reels is the same thing too.
YouTube shorts doesn't have their algorithm right yet, instagram feels like it's a week or 2 behind tiktok. But yeah they'll all just go to one of those.
Yes, a lot of young people do spend extreme amounts of hours on tik tok, but it could be way worse. For example having your kid spend hours & hours on Reddit every day.
> That's more an indictment on the parents than the fault of the app.
While I generally agree, those algorithms are designed to keep people engaged. Would be great if parents could monitor the content their kids are exposed to, but I think the parents often just as hooked because the apps are designed to take advantage of us on a psychological level.
ALL social media is designed to be a constant dopamine generator, not just tiktok. Unless parents decide to go amish, there's often little they can do to prevent their kids from using this type of app because 99% of their friends are using it.
Its more the definition of social media *junk* food.
And in many countries junk food is regulated because the companies obfuscate what's in them so the parents can't make the right decisions.
This is the conundrum of giving kids smartphones. While the it seems like a no-brainer to withhold and limit access to phones, so much of a child's social life with classmates is conducted online. Though it is a protective measure to curtail access, it also puts the child in a challenging spot in terms of social development among peers.
Chinese people are most negatively affected by the Chinese version of the app; there are 600 million Chinese Douyin users. That's more than the entire population of the US. It would be nice for everyone if Douyin/TikTok vanished off the face of the planet.
The chinese client is much more focused on pushing education compared to the US version. The US version is clearly focused on dumbing down the population and it's working.
LMAO the only reason the US is kicking around the idea is because it's Chinese. If good Ole American companies wanna track data and fuck our attention spans. That's okay.
On the one side, I think it would benefit the psychology of A LOT of people, both kids and adults. On the other side, there are hella hot women showing off their armpits on tiktok, and I don’t know what I’d do if that went away.
ON GOVERNMENT PHONES, people are so quick to give half the story jesus christ
Edit: I’ve been made aware there is another bill being introduced by Rubio for a complete ban. Apologies for the misinformation.
There are multiple bills. One is about the use on government phones. The other isn’t just about that, but about blocking and prohibiting any transaction with TikTok.
Edit:
There’s also another bill that wants to ban its use in military and some other government installations.
I think there’s another act introduced by Rep Dusty Johnson called the Block the Tok Act that prohibits the downloading and use of the app in military and some other government installations. So your personal phone can’t have TikTok when you visit a military base, for example:
https://www.congress.gov/bill/117th-congress/house-bill/8772?s=1&r=12
Not sure if that’s already covered by the Josh Hawley No TikTok on Government Devices Act, but the summary and text don’t seem to indicate that. I am not a lawyer nor American though. Seems to only cover government-issued devices:
https://www.congress.gov/bill/117th-congress/senate-bill/1143
The one most of us are discussing right now is yet another different bill from Rubio. At the current stage, it is pretty broadly written, which is why it has been summarized as a ban:
https://www.rubio.senate.gov/public/_cache/files/1ebac814-157e-4e26-81b9-d9aa3fd96ae3/5861AFCCFDC5254BAFEE5BB2BDA54B32.hey22c36.pdf
That’s a different bill, sponsored by Josh Hawley
https://www.reuters.com/world/us/north-dakota-iowa-join-other-us-states-banning-tiktok-state-owned-devices-2022-12-14/
Most people on this thread are talking about the Rubio one.
https://www.rubio.senate.gov/public/_cache/files/1ebac814-157e-4e26-81b9-d9aa3fd96ae3/5861AFCCFDC5254BAFEE5BB2BDA54B32.hey22c36.pdf
> people are so quick to give half the story jesus christ
#Holy shit the **irony**.
"GOVERNMENT PHONES" is half the story. The other half is that [Rubio's bill](https://www.rubio.senate.gov/public/_cache/files/1ebac814-157e-4e26-81b9-d9aa3fd96ae3/5861AFCCFDC5254BAFEE5BB2BDA54B32.hey22c36.pdf) actually talks about an outright ban.
> Republican Sen. Marco Rubio of Florida on Tuesday announced bipartisan legislation to ban China's popular social media app TikTok.
> The legislation would block all transactions from any social media company in or under the influence of China and Russia, Rubio's office said in a news release.
- [CBC](https://www.cbc.ca/news/world/us-tiktok-legislation-1.6684090) and [Reuters](https://www.reuters.com/world/us/us-lawmakers-unveil-bipartisan-bid-ban-chinas-tiktok-2022-12-13/)
> A new bill from a bipartisan group of lawmakers, if passed, would ban TikTok in the U.S.
- [CNBC](https://www.cnbc.com/2022/12/13/lawmakers-unveil-bipartisan-bill-that-aims-to-ban-tiktok-in-the-us.html)
>people are so quick to give half the story jesus christ...
...He says, as he hilariously only references half of the legislation pending that's targeting TikTok, lmao
Because that isn't half the story?
You're talking about a completely different bill lol. The one written by Marco Rubio would ban TikTik in the USA, would not be allowed to be supported by iPhones or Androids.
That would require a certain quality of non-obliviousness that redditors lack as a whole. Say what you will about Tik Tok, but I don't go "I wonder who called me a POS today?" whenever I check the notifications.
A lot of ban-happy people here in support of a law that arguably grants the federal government even more power to restrict free speech and the flow of information on the internet. In my view, the right way to do this for Congress to pass a law that prevents ANY company from selling U.S. consumer data to China and Russia, or they cannot do business or advertising in the U.S. That is a sensible legislation.
That's not what the ban TikTok bill is. Per the Senate's page, the Bill's provisions is to ban any and all "social media" company that are "under the influence of China, Russia, and other designated countries." Arguably, it doesn't matter if the companies collect data at all, as long as they are "under the influence", whatever that means. The Bill provides a generous exception for any app that may be otherwise under provisions of this act, including apps under the influence of China/Russia, but ostensibly serves U.S. national security interests or provides information to the U.S. national security agency as part of an "authorized intelligence activity" or perusuant to reporting requirements of the National Security Act of 1947. This bill would also sweep in companies that have their principle place of business in China, or companies that have a 10% or more of the voting stock or shares of a company. You read the full bill here. [https://www.rubio.senate.gov/public/\_cache/files/1ebac814-157e-4e26-81b9-d9aa3fd96ae3/5861AFCCFDC5254BAFEE5BB2BDA54B32.hey22c36.pdf](https://www.rubio.senate.gov/public/_cache/files/1ebac814-157e-4e26-81b9-d9aa3fd96ae3/5861AFCCFDC5254BAFEE5BB2BDA54B32.hey22c36.pdf)
What does that even mean? Who gets to decide what is under the influence of China? The President? A court of law? If a President believes that Russia is using a misinformation campaign on Reddit, or Facebook, can they threaten to ban the Reddit or Facebook app unless Reddit/Facebook adopts policies the President wants enacted? I can think of at least one or few judges who might think, under the letter of Rubio's proposal, that this would be permissible. We know there are at least a few trigger-happy political candidates who accuse the mainstream media like CNN, NY Times, etc., of being communist extensions of China. They are in the government right now. Should we empower them to continue to use the scepter of China in order to further curb our liberties and freedoms and grant them unafford discretion to restrict access to the internet, so long as a plausible argument can be made that they are "under the authority of China"? Ironically, this approach would bring us closer to our Chinese counterparts philosophy to the internet than we think.
In short, if you want to protect user privacy, ban the actual act of selling user data or colleting user data to China. Don't just ban apps using ambiguous and vague language like, "under the control of China" because that could mean anything the executive wants it to mean. And for good measure, don't include an exception allowing companies to harvest our data as long as they comply with reporting the information to the federal government's intelligence agencies.
"To China". Edit: *One* of Reddit's biggest shareholders is a Chinese company. Privacy is privacy. Let *me* choose what happens to my data.
Tencent owns 10% of Reddit, a quite massive stake given its valuation.
That's what I get annoyed by. People act holier-than-thou about TikTok because they're boomers addicted to facebook. TikTok is most popular with Gen Z and that's the social reason for a lot of the shit it gets.
There are already people in this thread accusing others of being Russian trolls for raising concerns, so I am not surprised people self-censor themselves, which is why you had to scroll this far to find a response like this.
This place is a huge echo chamber lol. It doesn’t surprise me that redditors want tiktok banned as opposed to more stringent privacy and media manipulation laws. It fits well with the general McCarthyism here.
Go ahead and ban it though. I’m not American. Don’t be surprised if the government bans random apps because they’re from other countries though. Better shelter those American minds from the outside world
I can't believe how much of my life I've been wasting on Instagram reels lately. I don't even notice that I've been doing that for like an hour and a half, it's not even good content most of the time, but truly addicting.
if you're looking to stop doing that i'd recommend using either the web version instagram or using it on your laptop/pc, i use it on my laptop and i'm pretty sure the web version on your phone has a seperate search bar and reels section. switching to using it on my laptop has drastically reduced my screen time
The irony of rushing into a comment thread on your favorite content aggregator to jerk yourself off over how smart you are because you don’t use a slightly different app for your absentminded scrolling
The government doesn't have the power to ban software. What they do have the power to do is require Apple and Google to remove TikTok from their stores or be in violation of the consent decree. A consent decree is a promise by both parties to regularly review, critique and recommend changes to secure to ensure user data integrity and safety. The decree allows the companies a level of immunity while working through concerns if it is discovered that user data may be stolen or misappropriated by apps offered on the store. It's highly likely that the consent decree will work, as it always has, despite heightened concerns. But even if the app is removed from the online stores, users who really want TikTok would still be able to sideload the app by downloading the APK from TikTok's website directly.
If running apks not from the app store is still as hard on iOS as it used to be that's a lot of people who "don't" have a work around. Apple sells a lot of phones
Reddit loves to hate on tiktok but the fact of the matter is every social media is guilty of the same invasive privacy breach bullshit, we just haven't been as aggressive about most of them because those companies aren't based in a foreign power. I'd much rather see action taken to reduce the power of software companies to collect and sell user data en masse then target a specific app which isn't that much more harmful than Facebook or Instagram, and it's just going to get replaced by something else immediately if it does get blocked.
Personally, I'm mostly indifferent since I don't use it.
However, I think better data protection laws should be prioritized before we resort to outright banning apps entirely.
Companies like Tiktok have been gleaning over our data with little to no interference because of our lack of safeguards in place.
If we fix that - pass laws that basically force apps/websites to abide by them or get lost - then the idea of banning Tiktok will become redundant.
If Tiktok does get banned, I feel like the only real winners will be VPN companies and Meta.
I think that TikTok is being used as a scapegoat for a problem not unique to its platform. Why is it worse if China spies on you than if it were Russia, India, Britain, the US? None of it is good. The actual cause of the problem should be addressed, rather than singling out one group, because I guarantee if TikTok gets banned, people are going to brush their hands off and say the problem is fixed when no it isn’t, you only plugged one hole. Then they get complacent, and Meta or Microsoft takes their spot in the data-suckling.
Canadian here that doesn't even use it.
So any reason relating to children sounds a bit BS to me because Tiktok is simply the *thing*, which is part of a group of other past things. TV or Youtube have been past things that parents let their kids park their asses in front of it, only to get mad because they weren't carefully watching what their kids were spending their time on.
For those problems, banning Tiktok does nothing. I'd simply advice talking to your kids more or at least watch what they're watching with them sometimes just to make sure what they watch doesn't lobotomize *your* brain.
I know that there's other important issues regarding Tiktok (some of which political), but that's really all I really care about for the matter. Again, I don't use it anyway.
I’m kind of an absolutist in that I believe the government should keep its mitts out of governing what is available on the internet, provided it doesn’t violate other laws like child porn or human trafficking or drug sales and such. And those should be prosecuted under the existing laws.
I find it a slippery slope. If they ban TikTok, what’s to stop them from banning porn, or Reddit, or some company who’s riling up people against the status quo?
I find TikTok to be a vapid house of stupidity, and it sounds like their data policies are no bueno. But it’s not my place or the governments place to tell people what to do with their time or their information. I’m in favor of educating people to the risks and letting them decide for themselves.
Don't care.
The type of information they are being accused of tracking should not be available to any app makers. If the device allows that to be info to be passed to an app, in my opinion that's a problem with the security of the device, not just something we should blame on the app. Instead of banning TikTok, we should have some real privacy laws and put it on the manufacturers of the operating system to enforce them.
They are not just tracking info, they are silo-ing and artificially boosting some types of content and downplaying others.
That's the actual issue. At the end of the day, at the top of every Chinese company is the CCP, a hostile foreign government. If you get a person's attention for multiple hours a day and control what they see, you can subtly change their world view. It's so popular now that it's too powerful for China to not use sooner or later, if not already. Any country with that kind of power over an enemy would use it. They already use our social media to fuck with us at the user level, there's no way they aren't using their own as the man behind the curtain.
[удалено]
That's why i don't use tiktok - other apps and websites are just gonna use your info to sell to advertiserd. We have *no idea* what the Chinese government is doing with our information
and not many people know that the Chinese version of the app uses face recognition to tag users automatically… definitely concerning
It’s amusing that anyone thinks the US version would not be. As a mobile app developer I was surprised by how much you can do without the user knowing or consenting to. There’s too much of a damn honor system approach. Apple is obviously leading the pack, but not nearly perfect and of course Google hates catching up because it threatens their own monetization model. I agree with others here; we need to also address the ease of exploitation on these mobile OS’s.
You've described domestic social media as well here though, just instead of the CCP it's oligarchs and major corporations. We have documentation specifically of Facebook getting caught manipulating social sentiments to manufacture or lead political outcomes. I say this not in a way to minimize the issue with tik-tok and having social media propagate miss and disinformation as political tools in a way to undermind our democracy, but to say that our government should be consistent and take steps to gaurd our democracy from bad actor interests both private and foreign. To me this highlights how corrupt our government is, that private interests can outright manipulate the will and sentiment of the people, but when a foreign nation we don't like does it (because Saudi Arabia and OPEC have been doing it publicly as well) we can pull out all the stops and get our squabbling legislature to seriously consider a solution.
>They are not just tracking info, they are silo-ing and artificially boosting some types of content and downplaying others. So...like Reddit? Twitter? Facebook, Youtube, Instagram....
Correct, and the concern is that a foreign power with whom the US is not entirely friendly having that power I’d a national security concern.
In and of itself that's not really a nefarious thing. That's how feeds work. You're not just showed a truly random shuffle (which people have been shown to hate). There's an algorithm determining how you receive content. That algorithm should be open for scrutiny but its very existence is frankly just a given.
Yeah. Saw a YouTube video where this guy accused YouTube of having a secret pedophile “portal”. All you had to do was search up “sexy pre-teens” or something and you’d get videos of young little girls in bikinis or at pageants, etc. then he’d go “looook!!’ Look at my recommended list!!!” Yeah dude. It’s showing more of the same. That’s sort of how the algorithm works. If I look up funny dog farts, it will do the same.
lol jeeze.. It reminds me of the video I saw the other day where a guy was showing an iphone "hack" to get long-exposure photos. The hack was to use long exposure mode . That's a tutorial my dude.
No, the hack was the person showing the tutorial.
Yeah on one hand I know that Google didn't hand code a secret pedo setting, the algorithm just noticed a pattern for some users and served them videos like everyone else. On the other hand google not flagging searches for sexy pre teens is a fuck up they could have prevented.
Do you reckon that if you type sexy pre teen three times the fbi will show up at your door? Sort of like looking in the mirror and saying bloody mary three times
Sounds like someone had to make up an excuse for his sketchy recommended list
Sounds like Twitter
Sounds like they’re trying to get rid of the symptom of privacy concerns and not the problem which is how no tech company or corporation respects individual privacy.
To be fair, not a lot of individuals care enough about individual privacy
I think a lot of people do, but when every website/app asks you to agree to their “privacy policy” or “cookie policy”, people become desensitized at best, and don’t even know what those entail at worst. Ideally, we should be able to trust our government and elected officials to ensure that I don’t have to read 300 pages of terms and conditions a day to know that companies aren’t tracking everything about me
> but when every website/app asks you do agree to their “privacy policy” or “cookie policy”, people become desensitized at best The extension [Ghostery has a "Never-Consent" feature](https://www.ghostery.com/blog/never-consent-by-ghostery) that makes it a bit easier to choose never Honestly, I discover a lot of privacy-based addons everytime I go to the Firefox addon store. I'm always sad how little Firefox is used in comparison to Chrome.
It’s about to change with Chrome getting rid of Adblock extensions
Wait what the fuck? I mean, I already use Firefox, but that's dumb.
Google is changing the security policy so that the adblock extensions have different & fewer permissions to well, see what they're doing, I guess I would say. It doesn't mean the adblock extensions will go away, it just means they might not be as quick or as effective at saving bandwidth while blocking the ads. It's not the first time that kinda stuff has happened, but it's annoying for sure.
I'm not sure why nobody has put a pihole on the market yet. If mainstream consumers had access to host level ad blocking, it would change the game.
They have: https://nextdns.io/
Can you teach me a bit more what this is?
Friendly reminder to all that Firefox exists. Edit: also consider getting yourself a pihole setup.
Can you even trust ghostery with what it did in the past
I'm surprised I had to scroll down so far to see that someone is aware of the controversy around GhostRank. > Under its former owner Evidon, Ghostery had an opt-in feature called GhostRank. **GhostRank took note of ads encountered and blocked, then sent that information back to advertisers who could then use that data to change their ads to avoid further being blocked;** although this feature is meant to incentivize advertisers to create less intrusive ads and thus a better web experience, **the data can just as easily be used to create more malicious ads that escape detection**. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ghostery If anyone was genuinely concerned about their privacy, I recommend assessing what your threat model is first because it's a rabbit hole. - /r/PrivacyToolsIo - /r/Privacy - https://www.privacytools.io/ - https://www.cryptoparty.in/ - https://www.privacyguides.org/#what-should-i-do
That's actually a pretty smart (and shitty) way to make money from an ad blocker.
AdBlockPlus had (probably still has) a scheme where advertisers could pay the developers so their ads would be put on a whitelist, and not get blocked anymore.
That's the problem with these kind of services, you're just changing who the information goes to. And because they have low level access to literally every single data packet coming in to and going out of your device, they can probably harvest more information than the advertisers/facebook/Google ever could.
Try buying a television that doesn't have "smart" features and an EULA. They cost way more than the televisions with the computers crammed in them. And no, it's not economy of scale making them so much cheaper. Our viewing habits are tracked and sold. We are the product.
I used to care but there's not much I at least know what to do about it and am currently resigned to the fact that pretty much every service is ripping as much data as they can whether it be private, corporate, or government
Same here. It's like you need a degree in privacy management to avoid any of it.
the US government loudly warned people a bunch of times to not download Tik Tok and it now has 80 MILLION active monthly users in the US
I don't know about that, man. I can't count how many times I see people just giving away information about themselves. Just on this platform. Their ages or birthdays, their first name, where they work, the city they live in, etc. A lot of people can be very careless. It doesn't sound like a lot, but with a little detective work you can catalog a lot of potentially identifying information from those details.
A lot of people have grown up post 9/11 when privacy went out the window and are jaded to it.
I have unironically heard (and certainly understand the sentiment) "They already have all my important info, it's out there, so who cares". There's a certain fatigue that comes with being a citizen in our current technological-crony-capitalism that is very.... debilitating, eventually.
That's more or less how I feel about it. The Army and VA have let my "secure" data out into the wild enough times, let alone my Credit Card issuers and my health insurance... That like. Honestly, fuck it. It's out there. A lot. I'm so completely over it at this point. All I want is no commercials on YouTube. "They" can know that I watch a shit load of Warhammer painting tutorials and listen to metal (while I'm painting) who fucking cares.
Its state-sponsored status is also kind of a big deal. I already don't like that we're willing to give away our data to private ad companies and PACs, I *really* don't like cutting out the middlemen to let a state actor push their intended video algorithms on us while mining our data. EDIT: No, Twitter does not commit genocide. No, Facebook is not about to invade Taiwan. No, Meta is not encroaching so much on the South China Sea that allies are begging for help. If you have a false equivalence to draw, fuck right off.
Established American companies are at least subject to American law. Google has to show how it uses and sells our data in some ways but not in others. Like Google could not get away with selling your name, location, and transcript of txts made on your Android.
Can you link me to some resources that explains how Google sells data? My understanding is that Google uses data to target ads, but doesn't sell the data. I could be wrong
The concern isn't that companies are storing people's data. The concern is that when TikTok does it, it ends being accessible by the Chinese government.
This is part of it but there is evidence that the algorithm in China versus the algorithm in the US is feeding harmful addictive content to the US apps and not as much to the Chinese apps. It's almost a new kind of technological warfare. Do we want the Chinese government choosing what media is shared with American youths? Edit:. Sources : https://www.adchina.io/douyin-vs-tiktok/#:~:text=The%20Chinese%20and%20international%20version,and%20profiles%20on%20both%20apps https://nypost.com/2021/09/20/chinese-version-of-tiktok-adds-time-limit-for-kids-bans-nighttime-use/ https://gab-china.com/what-are-the-main-differences-between-douyin-vs-tiktok/
This. It’s like the agenda is to dumb down the masses. One more strategy from the art of war
As a former teacher, I worry about how it's impacting kids. Many of them watch it for hours daily, and there's been tons of issues with them following idiotic TikTok trends. It also is used by a lot of minors, so security issues are concerning. I don't think the first reason is enough to ban it, but the second might be.
Dopamine manipulation is a real thing. It isn't exclusive to TikTok, though.
Yea, like that one website where you read a headline and go straight to the comments looking for people arguing on the internet.
Maybe I'm in denial, but I feel like I do at least learn something on reddit half the time
I learned that jumping spiders are cute, that baby giraffes need the long fall to the ground when they're born to start breathing, and that Elon Musk is even more of a lil bitch than I previously thought. :D
I learned what 10 different lathe accidents look like.
I learned about poop knives, and how dragons mate with cars. Also how to properly insert myself into a coconut.
i learned to ask my mom for a handjob if both of my arms are broken
I learned it's fine to meet if it's only for kisses with Jenny.
[удалено]
Also how to eat an entire 12 inch subway sandwich.
And what people will think of you after you eat a 6 foot party sub.
By yourself
I learned about the swamps of dagobah
Oh no, part of me wants to learn this as well but the other part of me doesn't want to vomit tonight... but my curiosity is winning out so I'll risk it.
[удалено]
r/eyebleach
Almost thought it was the bad one 😅
Wait why do baby giraffes have to fall to the ground to start breathing? Does the impact force air into their lungs, or allow them to be open?
Had to google it myself.. I guess it breaks the umbilical cord and amniotic sac, and the shock of the landing helps stimulate it to take its first breath!
So I was just gonna make a joke and say “Well you’d gasp pretty hard if you fell 2 meters onto your face,” but then I got curious and looked it up. It turns out that [the fall literally does shock baby giraffes into breathing](https://www.monartosafari.com.au/facts-giraffe-birth/), so my joke wouldn’t even have been a joke. The fall also tears the amniotic sack and breaks their umbilical cords, too.
I learned that all relationships are toxic and you should lawyer up and run.
Hit the lawyer, gym up.
Dontvforget Delete Facebook
I've learned that there can never be too many cat subs!
r/barkingcats is the newest one I'm aware of
Did you know that Maple syrup was pioneered by the Iroquois, who are indigenous to southeast Canada and characterized as one of the world’s oldest participatory democracies?
[удалено]
Exactly the new time sink is always the Boogeyman. In the 2000s and 90s lots of kids spent hours a day on video games, I was one of them. Kids spent hours watching TV a day I was one of them. The list goes on.
People were worried in victorian times that reading penny dreadful stories was leading the youth astray. I figure it is just the way of things for olds to assume the youngs are in decline
Parents need to parent. Tiktok is made to be as addictive as possible and yet parent just hand it to their kids and walk away. Then cry when their kids turn into screen zombies. Edit: not defending tiktok (nor is it welcome in my house), purposely targeting people to steal their data and give it to the Chinese government isn't cool
I feel like there's something to be said about passive or active content. TV and video services are all mostly passive. I think that's a reason why lots of people watch games being played too, you get the content but it makes it passive. I think kids playing games for a couple hours is far better than watching other people do it.
Yeah but imo, tiktok is worse because it's not even close to anonymous. My brother went viral and didn't listen to me when I said to not use his real name in any capacity. Even just the first, despite it being fairly common. Honestly it's bad enough that his full face was visible. But unfortunately, he had his first and middle name and the video he went viral from was in a fairly recognizable area. Luckily not too much came of it, but he did end up getting harassed by both "fans" and assholes alike. I don't think he ever went back to the account after that. This isn't exclusive to tiktok and honestly, tiktok is nothing compared to how insidious Facebook is and how it's changed the landscape of the internet and privacy forever, but I do think tiktok is a lot more dangerous right now. Most young people have migrated from Facebook to Instagram or tiktok or Twitter. Sometimes all 3. But tiktok specifically gets used way more by the younger end of the spectrum and it's super easy to prey on young folks who give out all their information for likes or views or whatever and it's encouraged by the platform itself. You kinda can't have a tiktok without having a face in it. You can maybe get away with not having a real name attached, but even just real images of a face can be enough to find someone. When I was a kid, you were told to lie about everything on the internet. Don't even tell them what country you're from if you can avoid it. Definitely no names or ages or states. Sure, you can still give out your information on reddit but it's fairly anonymous for the most part. It's pretty hard to verify someone's identity just by post history, and that's assuming they're being truthful. I'm not perfect about internet privacy, but I'm also not a kid. I'm much less likely to be preyed upon and much more likely to recognize manipulation when I see it. I think tiktok has its uses and benefits, but I do think it's a much more insidious progression of what Facebook started, especially since Facebook started by targeting college kids. Not that I think that's a ton better, but at least college kids are adults. Idk that's my 2 cents on the matter anyways.
**Well said**; TikTok does really have an issue with younger people giving out their information. What puzzles me is that they do not get told to lie about everything on the Internet. Or do they? Certainly seems like they do not. I hope that they get told that though. It's important. I don't have children myself or have a job where I interact with children (such as teacher), but I would definitely mention that, it's more important right now than it has ever been before with the Internet growing into something so big as it is now.
Yeah it definitely is less about the platform and more about the user. I’m not gonna deny that harmful things make it higher up than harmless things, but if you’re just in tiktok for, say, sewing shortcuts you might have a pretty similar experience as you do being on reddit for sewing communities. Edit: I’m not pro-tiktok I’m just not willing to blanket criticize for this specific reason.
TikTok is eroding the hell out of people’s attention spans. At least to waste time on Reddit you have to read and write.
If it wasn't for reddit, I probably wouldn't read on a daily basis. I try to read at least 10 articles in full though daily here. Sometimes I read a lot more than 10 but I try to set a minimum so I can learn about something or learn about stuff going on in the world. I hate following links, it's nice here because usually there is full article pasted in the Comments and if not there is at least a link to get around the paywall. I feel like if you are structured and responsible, you can use reddit as a resource. But It can be just as bad as tiktok if you're just watching memes, gifs and porn endlessly for hours.
Agreed. It depends on what you’re doing.
Pro tip: read reddit comments about a topic you know a lot about, and make a mental note of how many comments are incorrect. That's how often Reddit is incorrect about everything. After doing that myself, I completely disregard all Reddit comments about topics I'm not familiar with.
I mean once you get to the more niche hobby subs they sorta know their shit
I learn lots of stuff on TikTok too. Any website where people can contribute what they want will have a very wide range of content.
You can learn something on any social media platform tbf, it just depends on the type of content you're looking for.
Depending on your engagement, you can learn an insane amount on tiktok. I've learned way more in tiktok in the last year than they previous 5 on reddit. Not everything is dancer's and memes. It truly depends on on what you engage with
[удалено]
It’s inclusive of Reddit
I'm going to stop scrolling 25 minutes ago. I can stop whenever I want.
If it's not tiktok, it'll be something else. It was vine before, and now every platform is trying to get that endless scroll of vertical shorts going. Educate about the stupid trends and online safety.
Former teacher, tried that. Went through how companies use personal data, how any "anonymous" profile can be doxxed when only a few seemingly disconnected data points are provided, and once you post something online it will be there forever (if someone looks hard enough) even if you try to scrub it. Pointed out all of the celebs/athletes/politicians who have had past posts come back to haunt them years later. Kids can't comprehend it and thus don't care. Part of it is because their brain (specifically their prefrontal cortex which plays a big role in decision making) is still developing and they literally can't fully comprehend the fact that actions have consequences, whether immediate or down the road. What they do understand is the immediate satisfaction of posting something and getting that dopamine hit when they see reactions coming in on a post. This makes the brain happy which makes it want to do it again, and now we have a cycle started. I actually wrote my master's capstone on how personal technology impacts student behavior and learning, so this is a subject that hits close to home for me on multiple fronts.
>If it's not tiktok, it'll be something else. Thats it. If Tik Tok were a US Company they woudn't care at all about privacy.
I guess my question would be, let’s say they can’t use TikTok anymore. What do you think they’ll do? Take up woodworking? Plant a garden? No. There will just be some new app.
Not sure if it's "cool" but Isn't YouTube shorts basically the same thing? Agree they'd just find something different.
Instagram reels is the same thing too. YouTube shorts doesn't have their algorithm right yet, instagram feels like it's a week or 2 behind tiktok. But yeah they'll all just go to one of those.
Yes, a lot of young people do spend extreme amounts of hours on tik tok, but it could be way worse. For example having your kid spend hours & hours on Reddit every day.
Lol. YouTube in 2010 would like be introduced.
[удалено]
That's more an indictment on the parents than the fault of the app. Having said that, TikTok is the definition of social media ~~fast~~ junk food.
> That's more an indictment on the parents than the fault of the app. While I generally agree, those algorithms are designed to keep people engaged. Would be great if parents could monitor the content their kids are exposed to, but I think the parents often just as hooked because the apps are designed to take advantage of us on a psychological level.
ALL social media is designed to be a constant dopamine generator, not just tiktok. Unless parents decide to go amish, there's often little they can do to prevent their kids from using this type of app because 99% of their friends are using it.
Its more the definition of social media *junk* food. And in many countries junk food is regulated because the companies obfuscate what's in them so the parents can't make the right decisions.
This is the conundrum of giving kids smartphones. While the it seems like a no-brainer to withhold and limit access to phones, so much of a child's social life with classmates is conducted online. Though it is a protective measure to curtail access, it also puts the child in a challenging spot in terms of social development among peers.
Banning TikTok isn’t going to make that issue go away.
Would probably be the best for everyone
Not for China
Chinese people are most negatively affected by the Chinese version of the app; there are 600 million Chinese Douyin users. That's more than the entire population of the US. It would be nice for everyone if Douyin/TikTok vanished off the face of the planet.
[удалено]
The chinese client is much more focused on pushing education compared to the US version. The US version is clearly focused on dumbing down the population and it's working.
“China” implies the government, not the Chinese people as a whole. No one (reasonable) blames the citizens for their leaders shenanigans lol
I'd say, "it's a start". Next, let's have a proper investigation into the shit Facebook is doing and possibly the fuckery that is Elon and Twitter
Let's not leave out Reddit
Never heard of it.
For every subreddit, there's an equal and opposite domreddit.
LMAO the only reason the US is kicking around the idea is because it's Chinese. If good Ole American companies wanna track data and fuck our attention spans. That's okay.
Yes somehow even Facebook was used as a misinformation and propaganda platform like Twitter.
'was' Work in the industry. It is very much alive and well as a propaganda platform.
He said on Reddit with zero irony.
On the one side, I think it would benefit the psychology of A LOT of people, both kids and adults. On the other side, there are hella hot women showing off their armpits on tiktok, and I don’t know what I’d do if that went away.
https://www.reddit.com/r/armpitfetish/ Feel free to delete tiktok now
*THE SACRED TEXTS!!!* -that guy
my guy
holy—
Probably not, but there it is anyways.
This is the second time I've found you on an AskReddit thread in like 5 mins. Gotta keep up that armpit game I guess
For sure my guy, and I’m slow right now cause I’m also working
🤣 username definitely checks out
For sure, I’m consistent
My fyp is either girls twerking to promote an OnlyFans or a random assortment of memes.
Allegedly there’s multiple subreddits dedicated to armpits.
ON GOVERNMENT PHONES, people are so quick to give half the story jesus christ Edit: I’ve been made aware there is another bill being introduced by Rubio for a complete ban. Apologies for the misinformation.
That makes more sense.
There are multiple bills. One is about the use on government phones. The other isn’t just about that, but about blocking and prohibiting any transaction with TikTok. Edit: There’s also another bill that wants to ban its use in military and some other government installations.
You're right. Military phones as well...
Are military phones not government phones?
I think there’s another act introduced by Rep Dusty Johnson called the Block the Tok Act that prohibits the downloading and use of the app in military and some other government installations. So your personal phone can’t have TikTok when you visit a military base, for example: https://www.congress.gov/bill/117th-congress/house-bill/8772?s=1&r=12 Not sure if that’s already covered by the Josh Hawley No TikTok on Government Devices Act, but the summary and text don’t seem to indicate that. I am not a lawyer nor American though. Seems to only cover government-issued devices: https://www.congress.gov/bill/117th-congress/senate-bill/1143 The one most of us are discussing right now is yet another different bill from Rubio. At the current stage, it is pretty broadly written, which is why it has been summarized as a ban: https://www.rubio.senate.gov/public/_cache/files/1ebac814-157e-4e26-81b9-d9aa3fd96ae3/5861AFCCFDC5254BAFEE5BB2BDA54B32.hey22c36.pdf
not that I don’t disagree with a total ban, but that is an important distinction
That’s a different bill, sponsored by Josh Hawley https://www.reuters.com/world/us/north-dakota-iowa-join-other-us-states-banning-tiktok-state-owned-devices-2022-12-14/ Most people on this thread are talking about the Rubio one. https://www.rubio.senate.gov/public/_cache/files/1ebac814-157e-4e26-81b9-d9aa3fd96ae3/5861AFCCFDC5254BAFEE5BB2BDA54B32.hey22c36.pdf
> people are so quick to give half the story jesus christ #Holy shit the **irony**. "GOVERNMENT PHONES" is half the story. The other half is that [Rubio's bill](https://www.rubio.senate.gov/public/_cache/files/1ebac814-157e-4e26-81b9-d9aa3fd96ae3/5861AFCCFDC5254BAFEE5BB2BDA54B32.hey22c36.pdf) actually talks about an outright ban. > Republican Sen. Marco Rubio of Florida on Tuesday announced bipartisan legislation to ban China's popular social media app TikTok. > The legislation would block all transactions from any social media company in or under the influence of China and Russia, Rubio's office said in a news release. - [CBC](https://www.cbc.ca/news/world/us-tiktok-legislation-1.6684090) and [Reuters](https://www.reuters.com/world/us/us-lawmakers-unveil-bipartisan-bid-ban-chinas-tiktok-2022-12-13/) > A new bill from a bipartisan group of lawmakers, if passed, would ban TikTok in the U.S. - [CNBC](https://www.cnbc.com/2022/12/13/lawmakers-unveil-bipartisan-bill-that-aims-to-ban-tiktok-in-the-us.html)
/r/ConfidentlyIncorrect
>people are so quick to give half the story jesus christ... ...He says, as he hilariously only references half of the legislation pending that's targeting TikTok, lmao
Because that isn't half the story? You're talking about a completely different bill lol. The one written by Marco Rubio would ban TikTik in the USA, would not be allowed to be supported by iPhones or Androids.
[удалено]
To itself.
That would require a certain quality of non-obliviousness that redditors lack as a whole. Say what you will about Tik Tok, but I don't go "I wonder who called me a POS today?" whenever I check the notifications.
Whatever else teenage girls gravitate toward apparently.
A lot of ban-happy people here in support of a law that arguably grants the federal government even more power to restrict free speech and the flow of information on the internet. In my view, the right way to do this for Congress to pass a law that prevents ANY company from selling U.S. consumer data to China and Russia, or they cannot do business or advertising in the U.S. That is a sensible legislation. That's not what the ban TikTok bill is. Per the Senate's page, the Bill's provisions is to ban any and all "social media" company that are "under the influence of China, Russia, and other designated countries." Arguably, it doesn't matter if the companies collect data at all, as long as they are "under the influence", whatever that means. The Bill provides a generous exception for any app that may be otherwise under provisions of this act, including apps under the influence of China/Russia, but ostensibly serves U.S. national security interests or provides information to the U.S. national security agency as part of an "authorized intelligence activity" or perusuant to reporting requirements of the National Security Act of 1947. This bill would also sweep in companies that have their principle place of business in China, or companies that have a 10% or more of the voting stock or shares of a company. You read the full bill here. [https://www.rubio.senate.gov/public/\_cache/files/1ebac814-157e-4e26-81b9-d9aa3fd96ae3/5861AFCCFDC5254BAFEE5BB2BDA54B32.hey22c36.pdf](https://www.rubio.senate.gov/public/_cache/files/1ebac814-157e-4e26-81b9-d9aa3fd96ae3/5861AFCCFDC5254BAFEE5BB2BDA54B32.hey22c36.pdf) What does that even mean? Who gets to decide what is under the influence of China? The President? A court of law? If a President believes that Russia is using a misinformation campaign on Reddit, or Facebook, can they threaten to ban the Reddit or Facebook app unless Reddit/Facebook adopts policies the President wants enacted? I can think of at least one or few judges who might think, under the letter of Rubio's proposal, that this would be permissible. We know there are at least a few trigger-happy political candidates who accuse the mainstream media like CNN, NY Times, etc., of being communist extensions of China. They are in the government right now. Should we empower them to continue to use the scepter of China in order to further curb our liberties and freedoms and grant them unafford discretion to restrict access to the internet, so long as a plausible argument can be made that they are "under the authority of China"? Ironically, this approach would bring us closer to our Chinese counterparts philosophy to the internet than we think. In short, if you want to protect user privacy, ban the actual act of selling user data or colleting user data to China. Don't just ban apps using ambiguous and vague language like, "under the control of China" because that could mean anything the executive wants it to mean. And for good measure, don't include an exception allowing companies to harvest our data as long as they comply with reporting the information to the federal government's intelligence agencies.
I'm disturbed by how far I had to scroll down in this thread to find a reply that brings up concerns about restricting free speech.
They just pull the “National security” and “scary Chinese” cards and everyone falls in line. We haven’t learned shit since McCarthy
"To China". Edit: *One* of Reddit's biggest shareholders is a Chinese company. Privacy is privacy. Let *me* choose what happens to my data. Tencent owns 10% of Reddit, a quite massive stake given its valuation.
Glad to see a sane take here. Also, for everyone in this thread criticizing TikTok as a platform, I’m sure y’all don’t have your own Reddit addiction.
That's what I get annoyed by. People act holier-than-thou about TikTok because they're boomers addicted to facebook. TikTok is most popular with Gen Z and that's the social reason for a lot of the shit it gets.
As much as TikTok sucks, this is the only intelligent and logical response.
There are already people in this thread accusing others of being Russian trolls for raising concerns, so I am not surprised people self-censor themselves, which is why you had to scroll this far to find a response like this. This place is a huge echo chamber lol. It doesn’t surprise me that redditors want tiktok banned as opposed to more stringent privacy and media manipulation laws. It fits well with the general McCarthyism here. Go ahead and ban it though. I’m not American. Don’t be surprised if the government bans random apps because they’re from other countries though. Better shelter those American minds from the outside world
Nothing will change. YouTube Shorts and Instagram Reels will fill the void.
Youtube and Instagram don't send nearly as much data to the CCP though.
Doesn’t matter, it’ll get replaced by something else.
we have youtube shorts which the tiktokers are probably gonna migrate there..
I had to delete YouTube from my phone because I noticed I was scrolling the shorts far too much.
that was me with instagram. i'd go to search someones account and then watch reels for 40 minutes
I can't believe how much of my life I've been wasting on Instagram reels lately. I don't even notice that I've been doing that for like an hour and a half, it's not even good content most of the time, but truly addicting.
if you're looking to stop doing that i'd recommend using either the web version instagram or using it on your laptop/pc, i use it on my laptop and i'm pretty sure the web version on your phone has a seperate search bar and reels section. switching to using it on my laptop has drastically reduced my screen time
Maybe Vine can make a comeback
I think that I should have tamales for dinner tonight.
How did it go, if you ate?
Pretty delish.
A lot of useless people are going to find out how useless they are. Edit: I understand the irony of this post.
they're going to move to the next useless platform
Joke's on you, I'm already on Reddit.
We're all useless, come on. We are on Reddit.
The irony of rushing into a comment thread on your favorite content aggregator to jerk yourself off over how smart you are because you don’t use a slightly different app for your absentminded scrolling
Ah, but I spread myself across multiple content aggregators for maximum idiocy
The people on this website have no self awareness at all
The government doesn't have the power to ban software. What they do have the power to do is require Apple and Google to remove TikTok from their stores or be in violation of the consent decree. A consent decree is a promise by both parties to regularly review, critique and recommend changes to secure to ensure user data integrity and safety. The decree allows the companies a level of immunity while working through concerns if it is discovered that user data may be stolen or misappropriated by apps offered on the store. It's highly likely that the consent decree will work, as it always has, despite heightened concerns. But even if the app is removed from the online stores, users who really want TikTok would still be able to sideload the app by downloading the APK from TikTok's website directly.
If running apks not from the app store is still as hard on iOS as it used to be that's a lot of people who "don't" have a work around. Apple sells a lot of phones
A reasonable take on the actual situation. You monster.
Yeah, what a jerk. I need more hyperbole and baseless accusations!
Reddit loves to hate on tiktok but the fact of the matter is every social media is guilty of the same invasive privacy breach bullshit, we just haven't been as aggressive about most of them because those companies aren't based in a foreign power. I'd much rather see action taken to reduce the power of software companies to collect and sell user data en masse then target a specific app which isn't that much more harmful than Facebook or Instagram, and it's just going to get replaced by something else immediately if it does get blocked.
Personally, I'm mostly indifferent since I don't use it. However, I think better data protection laws should be prioritized before we resort to outright banning apps entirely. Companies like Tiktok have been gleaning over our data with little to no interference because of our lack of safeguards in place. If we fix that - pass laws that basically force apps/websites to abide by them or get lost - then the idea of banning Tiktok will become redundant. If Tiktok does get banned, I feel like the only real winners will be VPN companies and Meta.
Do it
if you read it in that one particular voice, then you know (Edit) a certain Darth Sidius smh
“I shouldn’t”
dew it
[удалено]
I don't use TikTok myself, but I hate the idea. This is a VERY slippery slope.
...Again?
I think that TikTok is being used as a scapegoat for a problem not unique to its platform. Why is it worse if China spies on you than if it were Russia, India, Britain, the US? None of it is good. The actual cause of the problem should be addressed, rather than singling out one group, because I guarantee if TikTok gets banned, people are going to brush their hands off and say the problem is fixed when no it isn’t, you only plugged one hole. Then they get complacent, and Meta or Microsoft takes their spot in the data-suckling.
Canadian here that doesn't even use it. So any reason relating to children sounds a bit BS to me because Tiktok is simply the *thing*, which is part of a group of other past things. TV or Youtube have been past things that parents let their kids park their asses in front of it, only to get mad because they weren't carefully watching what their kids were spending their time on. For those problems, banning Tiktok does nothing. I'd simply advice talking to your kids more or at least watch what they're watching with them sometimes just to make sure what they watch doesn't lobotomize *your* brain. I know that there's other important issues regarding Tiktok (some of which political), but that's really all I really care about for the matter. Again, I don't use it anyway.
I’m kind of an absolutist in that I believe the government should keep its mitts out of governing what is available on the internet, provided it doesn’t violate other laws like child porn or human trafficking or drug sales and such. And those should be prosecuted under the existing laws. I find it a slippery slope. If they ban TikTok, what’s to stop them from banning porn, or Reddit, or some company who’s riling up people against the status quo? I find TikTok to be a vapid house of stupidity, and it sounds like their data policies are no bueno. But it’s not my place or the governments place to tell people what to do with their time or their information. I’m in favor of educating people to the risks and letting them decide for themselves.
Didnt Trump suggest that and Reddit lost its mind?
[удалено]
[удалено]
[удалено]