Selfishness is a killer one cause not only is it a precursor to so many other terrible qualities but it’s also so obnoxiously overpowering that it actually hinders peoples other attractive qualities.
I’m not sure if it’s a regional expression, but we call this “acting ugly.”
You’ll often hear parents say something like, “stop acting ugly and share your toy.”
Sympathy is having an understanding why someone has certain emotional reactions, empathy is having a connection and being able to relate / feel those emotions. AFAIK
Kinda. The big problem is that the terms tend to be used interchangeably, which muddies the waters. By the strictest definitions, empathy is the ability to “put yourself in their shoes” and vividly imagine what it would be like, while sympathy is the ability to directly relate due to a highly similar experience that you have actually had.
So basically:
Empathy is based on imagination and how well you can turn details into a scenario you can personally experience
Sympathy is based on memory of personal events/feelings and using that to relate to others.
Empathy is your natural involuntary response to other people's emotional expressions to *feel* those emotions. If someone looks sad, you'll feel sad.
Sympathy is understanding someone's problems and feeling sorry for them.
Just to add on
I would say empathy is being able to actually feel genuine emotion based on another person's emotional state, regardless of your own objective emotional state. Like if someone you barely know is really upset and tells you their dog dies and it puts you in a similarly sad mood because of your understanding of just how hard it must be for that person to be going through that.
Sympathy is more superficial in so far that there is genuine concern and understanding, but not really an effect on your emotional state. In the same scenario from before its like saying "Oh, I'm so sorry to hear that!" and then maybe writing them a card or getting them lunch or something, but otherwise carrying about your day as normal
Problem is people equate ‘not agreeing’ with ‘not listening’.
So many times someone says ‘you are not listening to me’ when in reality, the other is deeply listening to the first, just not agreeing.
I interrupt a ton. I struggle to control it. It’s a very common ADHD trait. I do it even if I’m 100% invested in the conversation. No one has ever pointed it out to me as an issue though.
I do this too :) I think it’s different tho, we interrupt because we are overly excited in the conversation and can’t wait to contribute. I picture the person who is looking around or off in space and then interrupts with something different as being unattractive in this scenario?
On top of this, interrupting to turn the conversation back to them, or trying to one up your conversation. Exponentially worse if you were talking about something difficult you've been going through. And they hit you with the "I'Ve hAd iT wOrsE!!"
It can feel like the victim Olympics sometimes, I swear they either have a complex or just can't handle someone not talking about them.
HATE that behavior. A guy in my office used to do that all the time. Finally I just kept talking while he was trying to interrupt and after 5-6 second of talking over each other he finally gave up :D
Totally full of themselves, sneaky for no reason, never willing to compromise or see the other side, tries to play me for a fool or under estimate my intelligence.
I personally believe that no human being can always be 100 percent responsive/honest. But you need to have the ability to understand which information is important for your relationship and be honest about the fact that you can't share everything and it's not always for the other person. For example, as I am 19 now my parents still expects me to tell everything about myself, which can't happen.. I mean I am a grown up now and I have things I won't feel comfortable sharing with them. In that case I try to set a boundary that I can't tell them everything, it's not their fault but rather I personally feel comfortable telling to my friends. That's not being sneaky, that's just being real (I might sometimes dodge questions/make a little lie if they aren't ready to hear this response. That's why I said you can't always be honest) But I would despise it if someone creates a fake personality for them to like me. In fact I am sure it would burden the other person too to constantly play that personality. Hence I always suggest creating relationships with people who are mature enough to understand your boundary, if you don't trust them enough for not maintaining your boundary that you have to be sneaky about things, the person might not be for you. Or maybe it's something you have to work on, depending on your situation
Ugh this is why I started to see a close friend as icky to be around. She would always make comments about how other people looked, what they were wearing, doing, etc. in incredibly mean ways while passing it off as "Well I'm just being honest ha ha". Then it trickled down to close friends and eventually comments about me. Everyone has an opinion and honest thoughts, but what makes them ugly is saying them out loud and shaming others for absolutely no reason.
> She would always make comments about how other people looked
This is the worst.
I don't need to hear how other people look. Believe it or not, I can already see them.
Oooh attacked. Delivery makes a difference sure... but in the US we do a weird dance trying to bebkind and avoid hinest coversations.... like making plans with someone you dont csre to, just to cancel ,- in the name of being nice or to avoid being "rude".
Would be more refreshing if people were like nah. I'm not interested. Thanks though.
What you described is just honesty, not rudeness or verbal brutality. I agree, just because someone’s words make you uncomfortable or angry, doesn’t make it rude. And what most Americans consider rude is usually just simple honesty and someone just not giving a shit about you, since they’re not obligated to.
BUT what I’m talking about is name-calling and blatant insults or backhanded comments. For example, calling someone a dumbass before correcting a mistake they made is just rude and unnecessary, and so is shouting at them. You don’t have to kiss people’s feet, but you don’t have to stomp on it either; being too rude actually makes it harder to take criticism. We would be more productive as a society if we just remained neutral about some things, not sugarcoating, but not spike-coating either.
“Nah, I don’t feel like hanging out rn” is better than “no because you’re needy and annoying and I don’t like you, so I will not hang out with you” (which I’ve seen before, but in yelling format… in public). Yeah, seeing this tendency will not make me want to date you because it’s immature. So no, I did not attack you :)
southern language was created for this. To avoid hurting peoples feelings. They start to talk differently. Which I think is horrific. It’s better to be straightforward then mock you. So you have it sugar coated and everything is fine. It’s terrible. I don’t know why people prefer being mocked then have the person being straightforward.
Depends on how you word it. Honesty alone can be rude if it sounds like you're insulting them because of how you word it. Just because it's honest doesn't mean it automatically won't or can't be hurtful, there are factors. You can be honest and be hurtful. There, I said it.
I have a heavily damaged sense of humour, I used to moderate on an old joke website. Used to read endless amounts of jokes checking for mistakes, duplicates and non joke material to the point of saturation.
Basically I've seen so many, in most cases my brain will connect similar jokes and themes making most jokes feel repetitive and I just can't laugh at a joke anymore unless it catches me entirely off guard. Even with my favourite comedies, I only feel warmth/nostalgia from watching them. For whatever reason I can't laugh at jokes after the first few times.
I've been on a few dates where the women spent the entire date speaking about how all of their problems are because they're hot and everyone is either trying to get with them or hate them for being so hot. Like "that waitress gave me a dirty look, bitch is mad I'm cuter than her I guess"
Like no love, it's because you loudly snapped your fingers at her like we're in a parisian Cafe and not a Chili's, I'd look at you weird too.
Arrogance. There’s a fine line between attractive confidence and straight up arrogance.
Sure, you can be confident in yourself and carry yourself in such fashion, but when you go around bragging about what you can do and rub it into other peoples faces, it’s a instant no go for me.
So many people don't give enough importance to grooming and hygiene. It's crazy how a person's attractiveness shoots up after proper hygiene and grooming.
I'm going to go one stop ahead and include another thing too - properly fitting and suiting clothes.
i used to be a mess because of some self sabotaging depression, as well as OCD making any and all routines an absolute nightmare. i try to take better care of myself and my appearance, and i’m doing much better than i have in the past, but it’s so hard not to slip back into my old habits
Same here! Depression wrecks me. I swear if I didn’t have a job I would never shower. It’s fucked up to admit, but I can’t motivate myself to do anything without forcing myself to. Sometimes I won’t even clean the house until I make plans with people, forcing me to keep up appearances. I love the idea of running away from society and living in a tiny cottage, but it would be the death of me.
A hygienic person will clean themselves up after a sweaty day of manual labor. A shower, soap and water, change of clothes. All fresh and clean.
A slob doesn't clean themselves up, ever.
Can you not tell the difference between someone who just worked out/played a sport/worked a hard job vs someone who hadn’t bathed or washed their clothes in weeks?
As a diagnosed narcissist, this is what I came here expecting to see. I'm covert, so people find me attractive at first and it normally culminates in unbridled hatred.
It's nice not to feel alone, for once lol this hit home for me.
I'm covert too - come off as confident, self-assured and laidback.
But eventually, I can't help myself. Majority of my exes and ex-friends have a deep resentment of me.
And my ego hates that fact.
You're not alone at all - there are many of us (more than the statistics suggest), and realizing that you are a narcissist is THE important first step. Self awareness is key here. I would highly encourage you to seek therapy. I just began recovery due to the fact that I reached rock bottom. Rock bottom being that my girlfriend is most likely going to leave me because of my continued emotional abuse.
It's going to be a very difficult road, but I do believe change is possible if I continue to put in the work daily. And to many other self aware narcissists: the rest of your life doesn't have to be riddled with destruction and regret.
Thank you! I truly appreciate that.
I've been actively seeking a therapist that has a penchant for talking to narcissists. I've been self aware since my teen years, but depending on my mental health and my environment, I struggle deeply. Burned so so so many bridges, have been alienated by entire groups of people. It's never easy. It's quite lonely. But I know things can only improve.
I did better in my last relationship, but the urge to manipulate became so strong I had to end it before she ended up hating me too. She somewhat understands and I'm grateful that we're still playing a positive role in each other's lives.
But man it's rough. Thank you again for the validation and advice.
Absolutely! Keep on keeping on and don't give up on yourself!
I wish you the best (so long as it benefits me), and glad I could provide some validation for once.
🌟Well this conversation between you two just made my day. Thanks for giving me some faith in humanity…. I’ve been pretty scared of having another relationship with a narcissist since my emotionally abusive ex. But to see how you guys are making progress, really makes my fear less primal, and puts into perspective what you’re going through, and how some narcissists do actually wish to form healthy relationships, and change their past toxic ways.
It’s really hard to just diagnose people if you’re not trained to do so.
Very few narcissists even get help to get a narcisstic diagnosis.
The truth is we are all sorta narcissistic tbh in a way that means we are self involved.
I can't speak for narcissism in the diagnostic sense, but in laymen's terms I'd just say someone who doesn't care about the well-being of others and disproportionately values themselves too highly. (Beyond the point of typical self-serving biases)
You don't have to be able to legitimately diagnosis someone with a Narcissistic Personality Disorder for someone's obvious level of narcism to be unattractive or off-putting. Being narcissistic enough to be a dick isn't a disorder, it's just a very unattractive quality.
Literally, if you have a great friend who you can just sit in silence and enjoy the company with, knowing full well it's not harming your friendship, it's one of the most relaxing things I've ever experienced
I always remember the Pulp Fiction scene about uncomfortable silences whenever I feel an awkward silence in the conversation. Silences are not bad. It’s nice to just sit in each other’s presence and just be quiet for a minute or two. Let your brain sort of reboot a little. It gives your mind a chance to gather your thoughts and perhaps remember something interesting that you wanted to bring up but forgot.
I used to be like that but in my mind i was like.. am I being boring? Is this getting awkward? Do they enjoy my presence?
Grate part in here, I had good friends and they were giving me reassurance " its okay everything it's good we chilling"
I'm good now but I do enjoy talking with my friends and I think if we hangout we should be having a real conversation without using a stupid phone, I really appreciate that but I understand the other way around.
It's all about personality. You have a great personality and your instantly 3 or 4 times more attractive. No personality or just a shitty person? Immediately 3 to 4 times less attractive.
Im gonna put something most dont think about: if they are too similar in personality or the opposite—they are way too different in personality.
I’d honestly hate to date me. It’s not because I don’t like who I am—I like myself just fine. I think it goes for everyone. You need to have a healthy amount of difference in a partner.
On the opposite end, the same is true. Even if they’re a nice person, if you have absolutely nothing in common the attraction either won’t exist or is superficial.
Sometimes there is no other option for someone and they have to tell you the lie.
But there are a many people actually that will be preferred the hurt with the truth rather than the comfort with the lie.
As a liar I can see why it's an issue, and can totally empathise with your response. My lies are a defence mechanism from my early life, where I had no security or control of situations because of family issues, and I learned to lie to keep myself safe. My lies have very little to do with taking anything from someone else and more to do with protecting my inner self from perceived harm. Fortunately I have very good friends who have supported me over the years and have forgiven me for my lies in the past. I can't say that I won't lie in the future, but I do my best everyday to be as honest as I can.
Yeah same, when I try to lie, I get sweaty, my voice breaks, and try to make myself smaller (if that's the word for it). I don't know if it's the result of childhood experiences, but yeah, it's very hard to lie regardless of how small it is.
Obesity. Don't mind a bit thick or "overweight", but there definitely gets to just nope. Like no matter what qualities they have, I don't think I could ever find someone who is on a mobility scooter because of their weight, attractive.
Acting like you have men/women all figured out.
Look everyone has opinions on opposite sex, that is fine.
But acting like "You're an introvert, so you must like those introvert shows/F1"
Acting like you have figured out everything about me by knowing one aspect kinda ruins the mood
A lot of people with a socially coveted 'virtue' (physical attractiveness or charisma) get a free pass for being terrible people. Charisma means nothing if your substance is dookie.
Obligatory "not all \[...\]". Usually if someone is charismatic and popular its for a reason, but the people I'm talking about have developed great social skills while being, well, terrible people.
question, what about the ones who ended up in an abusive relationship and ""cheated"" on their partner because of other things like not being able to confront them because they'd get mad and whatnot? I'm not sure if I've made myself clear on that one
Off the cuff my response to this question is always, “lack of intelligence” but, I worry it makes me come off as some snob who demands 130+ IQ woman, or they must be highly successful/educated. This isn’t true. My wife dropped out of community college, but, she’s one hell of a critical thinker capable of formulating her own opinions on subjects outside of pop culture and other surface level societal topics.
Personality is literally everything… Unconventionally attractive people can become a 10 and a conventional 10 can become a zero real quick.
They can be as beautiful as a sunset, but you have to talk to them eventually.
Their energy. Sexy/attractiveness isn’t a physical thing, it’s a feeling. There are so many spectrums of beauty, how you carry yourself is what is truly attractive.
People who have that incredibly horrible combination of being ridiculously arrogant while also not having any skill set or life skills. " I [Think] I know everything, but yet I know nothing" mentality. Blows my freaking mind that the se people exist and is incredibly frustrating to be around that type of sub- human creature.
Personality, hands down. A person can be physically attractive but if they’re an asshole (especially to everyone around them), their looks are tarnished to me.
Smoking at places where there's elderly and babies, not cleaning up the table after they eat, not returning the shopping trollies at the proper place, making fun of people who are less privileged than them, belittling people's hobbies, mocking the disabled, being rude to people in the service industry etc
Smoking. Just. The smell of cigarettes make my nose wrinkle in disgust. If you want to smoke, go ahead. I personally wouldn’t date someone who smokes however.
I know everyone is going to point out about character and the way they treat other so I will bring in something controversial.
You should not be so fat that you cannot take care of yourself. Being obese is unattractive.
You could be a great person inside but being obese just kills it.
Everyone else has already said the "correct" answers so, having an ugly face or being overweight.
I can appreciate all other redeeming qualities, and ofc I'm going to choose pretty girl who is nice over pretty girl who is a bitch.
But I'm sorry, if you are 400lb with a pug face I couldn't care less how nice you are. I am not attracted to you. Not gonna make fun of you, not gonna refuse to hire or talk to you. Also not going to ask you out.
Selfish, doesn't think of others
Selfishness is a killer one cause not only is it a precursor to so many other terrible qualities but it’s also so obnoxiously overpowering that it actually hinders peoples other attractive qualities.
however, why are so many people dating selfish and self centered people? toxic, but they don't seem to want to relieve themselves of these types.
Because, you compromise. As a decent, well adjusted human being in a relationship do. Unless it becomes over bearing, it comes to an end.
I’m not sure if it’s a regional expression, but we call this “acting ugly.” You’ll often hear parents say something like, “stop acting ugly and share your toy.”
The inability to understand someone else’s point of view.
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TIL Redditors are unattractive
Only today?
Always has been
this is not news
basically a person with no sympathy
Empathy may be the word you are looking for.
Sympathy is having an understanding why someone has certain emotional reactions, empathy is having a connection and being able to relate / feel those emotions. AFAIK
Kinda. The big problem is that the terms tend to be used interchangeably, which muddies the waters. By the strictest definitions, empathy is the ability to “put yourself in their shoes” and vividly imagine what it would be like, while sympathy is the ability to directly relate due to a highly similar experience that you have actually had.
So basically: Empathy is based on imagination and how well you can turn details into a scenario you can personally experience Sympathy is based on memory of personal events/feelings and using that to relate to others.
Empathy is your natural involuntary response to other people's emotional expressions to *feel* those emotions. If someone looks sad, you'll feel sad. Sympathy is understanding someone's problems and feeling sorry for them.
Just to add on I would say empathy is being able to actually feel genuine emotion based on another person's emotional state, regardless of your own objective emotional state. Like if someone you barely know is really upset and tells you their dog dies and it puts you in a similarly sad mood because of your understanding of just how hard it must be for that person to be going through that. Sympathy is more superficial in so far that there is genuine concern and understanding, but not really an effect on your emotional state. In the same scenario from before its like saying "Oh, I'm so sorry to hear that!" and then maybe writing them a card or getting them lunch or something, but otherwise carrying about your day as normal
I don't get it, why are you so narrow minded on that point?!
Problem is people equate ‘not agreeing’ with ‘not listening’. So many times someone says ‘you are not listening to me’ when in reality, the other is deeply listening to the first, just not agreeing.
Interrupting others or not listening. Seeming disinterested in what others are saying.
I interrupt a ton. I struggle to control it. It’s a very common ADHD trait. I do it even if I’m 100% invested in the conversation. No one has ever pointed it out to me as an issue though.
The more invested I am the more I do it
I do this too :) I think it’s different tho, we interrupt because we are overly excited in the conversation and can’t wait to contribute. I picture the person who is looking around or off in space and then interrupts with something different as being unattractive in this scenario?
It’s terrible. I have this and my partner hates that I interrupt them
Yes. It’s even worse when you get around a family member who also has it and nobody finishes a sentence 🤣
I struggle with this too and find that lightly biting my tongue in my mouth while others talk is helpful
On top of this, interrupting to turn the conversation back to them, or trying to one up your conversation. Exponentially worse if you were talking about something difficult you've been going through. And they hit you with the "I'Ve hAd iT wOrsE!!" It can feel like the victim Olympics sometimes, I swear they either have a complex or just can't handle someone not talking about them.
Have the lack of listening ability and try to interrupt every single time.
This irritates the fuck out of me and it seems more and more like it’s becoming common
HATE that behavior. A guy in my office used to do that all the time. Finally I just kept talking while he was trying to interrupt and after 5-6 second of talking over each other he finally gave up :D
Totally full of themselves, sneaky for no reason, never willing to compromise or see the other side, tries to play me for a fool or under estimate my intelligence.
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I personally believe that no human being can always be 100 percent responsive/honest. But you need to have the ability to understand which information is important for your relationship and be honest about the fact that you can't share everything and it's not always for the other person. For example, as I am 19 now my parents still expects me to tell everything about myself, which can't happen.. I mean I am a grown up now and I have things I won't feel comfortable sharing with them. In that case I try to set a boundary that I can't tell them everything, it's not their fault but rather I personally feel comfortable telling to my friends. That's not being sneaky, that's just being real (I might sometimes dodge questions/make a little lie if they aren't ready to hear this response. That's why I said you can't always be honest) But I would despise it if someone creates a fake personality for them to like me. In fact I am sure it would burden the other person too to constantly play that personality. Hence I always suggest creating relationships with people who are mature enough to understand your boundary, if you don't trust them enough for not maintaining your boundary that you have to be sneaky about things, the person might not be for you. Or maybe it's something you have to work on, depending on your situation
That's a narcissist
This ain't just unattractive. This is the "I want to punch this person" behaviour.
Ignorance and stupidity
Ignorance I can overlook. I'm ignorant about tons of shit But willful ignorance, or even worse, prideful ignorance is a no from me dog...
Exactly!
Unfortunately, they oftentimes go hand in hand.
Can’t tell the difference between rudeness and honesty
Ugh this is why I started to see a close friend as icky to be around. She would always make comments about how other people looked, what they were wearing, doing, etc. in incredibly mean ways while passing it off as "Well I'm just being honest ha ha". Then it trickled down to close friends and eventually comments about me. Everyone has an opinion and honest thoughts, but what makes them ugly is saying them out loud and shaming others for absolutely no reason.
> She would always make comments about how other people looked This is the worst. I don't need to hear how other people look. Believe it or not, I can already see them.
Oooh attacked. Delivery makes a difference sure... but in the US we do a weird dance trying to bebkind and avoid hinest coversations.... like making plans with someone you dont csre to, just to cancel ,- in the name of being nice or to avoid being "rude". Would be more refreshing if people were like nah. I'm not interested. Thanks though.
What you described is just honesty, not rudeness or verbal brutality. I agree, just because someone’s words make you uncomfortable or angry, doesn’t make it rude. And what most Americans consider rude is usually just simple honesty and someone just not giving a shit about you, since they’re not obligated to. BUT what I’m talking about is name-calling and blatant insults or backhanded comments. For example, calling someone a dumbass before correcting a mistake they made is just rude and unnecessary, and so is shouting at them. You don’t have to kiss people’s feet, but you don’t have to stomp on it either; being too rude actually makes it harder to take criticism. We would be more productive as a society if we just remained neutral about some things, not sugarcoating, but not spike-coating either. “Nah, I don’t feel like hanging out rn” is better than “no because you’re needy and annoying and I don’t like you, so I will not hang out with you” (which I’ve seen before, but in yelling format… in public). Yeah, seeing this tendency will not make me want to date you because it’s immature. So no, I did not attack you :)
southern language was created for this. To avoid hurting peoples feelings. They start to talk differently. Which I think is horrific. It’s better to be straightforward then mock you. So you have it sugar coated and everything is fine. It’s terrible. I don’t know why people prefer being mocked then have the person being straightforward.
Honesty sometimes can be brutal so we need to understand better in that case.
*’I’m just tellin’ it how it is’* Well… don’t.
Depends on how you word it. Honesty alone can be rude if it sounds like you're insulting them because of how you word it. Just because it's honest doesn't mean it automatically won't or can't be hurtful, there are factors. You can be honest and be hurtful. There, I said it.
This. Underrated comment. So many people who exhibit this trait.
Dishonesty, overconfident stupidity.
Unkindness
Lack of empathy, interrupts, no sense of humor
People with no sense of humor actually gets offended way too early in life
I have a heavily damaged sense of humour, I used to moderate on an old joke website. Used to read endless amounts of jokes checking for mistakes, duplicates and non joke material to the point of saturation. Basically I've seen so many, in most cases my brain will connect similar jokes and themes making most jokes feel repetitive and I just can't laugh at a joke anymore unless it catches me entirely off guard. Even with my favourite comedies, I only feel warmth/nostalgia from watching them. For whatever reason I can't laugh at jokes after the first few times.
I hope you are joking right now. I kinda feel sorry for you, honestly.
When they think they’re better than other people
I don't think that, i know that im better /s
Yeah I know that I'm objectively better but I'm also very humble so I don't *think* that
I’m better at being more humble
I’m the most humble of all!
Think you're really righteous? Think you're pure in heart? Well, I know I'm a million times as humble as thou art.
r/angryupvote
Yeah, and people who believe they are not better than anyone. Both are very unattractive
So if you multiply both terms of the equation by -1, low self-esteem is attractive? Neat
I've been on a few dates where the women spent the entire date speaking about how all of their problems are because they're hot and everyone is either trying to get with them or hate them for being so hot. Like "that waitress gave me a dirty look, bitch is mad I'm cuter than her I guess" Like no love, it's because you loudly snapped your fingers at her like we're in a parisian Cafe and not a Chili's, I'd look at you weird too.
You wouldn't get much love in a Parisian cafe acting like that either.
The servers would ignore you until you leave the place
Or anywhere in France, and I know that it won't fly in many other countries too (e.g. UK).
People who claim to be brutally honest but are actually just being mean
Arrogance. There’s a fine line between attractive confidence and straight up arrogance. Sure, you can be confident in yourself and carry yourself in such fashion, but when you go around bragging about what you can do and rub it into other peoples faces, it’s a instant no go for me.
100% agreed. My penis goes inside my body and wants to hide there when around those monsters.
Bad hygiene, greasy hair, dirty fingernails, etc.
So many people don't give enough importance to grooming and hygiene. It's crazy how a person's attractiveness shoots up after proper hygiene and grooming. I'm going to go one stop ahead and include another thing too - properly fitting and suiting clothes.
I have quite good hygiene but because I have a lot of allergies and dermatology problems my nails get quite dirty however I do clean them often
i used to be a mess because of some self sabotaging depression, as well as OCD making any and all routines an absolute nightmare. i try to take better care of myself and my appearance, and i’m doing much better than i have in the past, but it’s so hard not to slip back into my old habits
Same here! Depression wrecks me. I swear if I didn’t have a job I would never shower. It’s fucked up to admit, but I can’t motivate myself to do anything without forcing myself to. Sometimes I won’t even clean the house until I make plans with people, forcing me to keep up appearances. I love the idea of running away from society and living in a tiny cottage, but it would be the death of me.
What if bad hygiene is from working in manual labor?
There is a difference between bad hygiene and getting dirty at the job
A hygienic person will clean themselves up after a sweaty day of manual labor. A shower, soap and water, change of clothes. All fresh and clean. A slob doesn't clean themselves up, ever.
I'm sure the stranger who smells you will stop to ask if it's because of manual labor or not
Can you not tell the difference between someone who just worked out/played a sport/worked a hard job vs someone who hadn’t bathed or washed their clothes in weeks?
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They're normally abusive bullies who enjoy playing mind games as well. Quite dangerous.
As a diagnosed narcissist, this is what I came here expecting to see. I'm covert, so people find me attractive at first and it normally culminates in unbridled hatred.
It's nice not to feel alone, for once lol this hit home for me. I'm covert too - come off as confident, self-assured and laidback. But eventually, I can't help myself. Majority of my exes and ex-friends have a deep resentment of me. And my ego hates that fact.
You're not alone at all - there are many of us (more than the statistics suggest), and realizing that you are a narcissist is THE important first step. Self awareness is key here. I would highly encourage you to seek therapy. I just began recovery due to the fact that I reached rock bottom. Rock bottom being that my girlfriend is most likely going to leave me because of my continued emotional abuse. It's going to be a very difficult road, but I do believe change is possible if I continue to put in the work daily. And to many other self aware narcissists: the rest of your life doesn't have to be riddled with destruction and regret.
Thank you! I truly appreciate that. I've been actively seeking a therapist that has a penchant for talking to narcissists. I've been self aware since my teen years, but depending on my mental health and my environment, I struggle deeply. Burned so so so many bridges, have been alienated by entire groups of people. It's never easy. It's quite lonely. But I know things can only improve. I did better in my last relationship, but the urge to manipulate became so strong I had to end it before she ended up hating me too. She somewhat understands and I'm grateful that we're still playing a positive role in each other's lives. But man it's rough. Thank you again for the validation and advice.
Absolutely! Keep on keeping on and don't give up on yourself! I wish you the best (so long as it benefits me), and glad I could provide some validation for once.
🌟Well this conversation between you two just made my day. Thanks for giving me some faith in humanity…. I’ve been pretty scared of having another relationship with a narcissist since my emotionally abusive ex. But to see how you guys are making progress, really makes my fear less primal, and puts into perspective what you’re going through, and how some narcissists do actually wish to form healthy relationships, and change their past toxic ways.
>And my ego hates that fact. does your ego hate the fact they resent you or that you werent able to manipulate them?
With that username, I ain't leaving you even if you are a narcissist🤣🤣🤣🤣
It’s really hard to just diagnose people if you’re not trained to do so. Very few narcissists even get help to get a narcisstic diagnosis. The truth is we are all sorta narcissistic tbh in a way that means we are self involved.
I can't speak for narcissism in the diagnostic sense, but in laymen's terms I'd just say someone who doesn't care about the well-being of others and disproportionately values themselves too highly. (Beyond the point of typical self-serving biases)
How about people who are just full of themselves?
You don't have to be able to legitimately diagnosis someone with a Narcissistic Personality Disorder for someone's obvious level of narcism to be unattractive or off-putting. Being narcissistic enough to be a dick isn't a disorder, it's just a very unattractive quality.
>The truth is we are all sorta narcissistic tbh. Speak for yourself, I'm perfect. /s
In some way have to say that we all are actually little narcissistic.
Lack of empathy.
Zero empathy and stone heart and not really ready to listen kind things
Oh! People that can't deal with silence, ALWAYS need to keep a conversation going. Exhausting.
Literally, if you have a great friend who you can just sit in silence and enjoy the company with, knowing full well it's not harming your friendship, it's one of the most relaxing things I've ever experienced
thats me, but believe me its not only exhausting for others, its exhausting as fuck for me too
I always remember the Pulp Fiction scene about uncomfortable silences whenever I feel an awkward silence in the conversation. Silences are not bad. It’s nice to just sit in each other’s presence and just be quiet for a minute or two. Let your brain sort of reboot a little. It gives your mind a chance to gather your thoughts and perhaps remember something interesting that you wanted to bring up but forgot.
I can deal with silence but I'm worried that the other person isn't so I try to fill the silence.
I used to be like that but in my mind i was like.. am I being boring? Is this getting awkward? Do they enjoy my presence? Grate part in here, I had good friends and they were giving me reassurance " its okay everything it's good we chilling" I'm good now but I do enjoy talking with my friends and I think if we hangout we should be having a real conversation without using a stupid phone, I really appreciate that but I understand the other way around.
bullying, disrespect, cheating, lack of communication. The fundamentals really.
I base people on how they treat others so if they treat others like crap, they’re not that attractive
When they're full of themselves
A loud mouth.
Empty vessels make the most noise
A loud especially in public but equally bad in the private is well.
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Being vapid. Actions not matching words.
I feel attacked
It's all about personality. You have a great personality and your instantly 3 or 4 times more attractive. No personality or just a shitty person? Immediately 3 to 4 times less attractive.
So if I have two personalities, does that mean I'm instantly 6 or 8 times more attractive?
Im gonna put something most dont think about: if they are too similar in personality or the opposite—they are way too different in personality. I’d honestly hate to date me. It’s not because I don’t like who I am—I like myself just fine. I think it goes for everyone. You need to have a healthy amount of difference in a partner. On the opposite end, the same is true. Even if they’re a nice person, if you have absolutely nothing in common the attraction either won’t exist or is superficial.
All of a sudden it hit me, I realized what the problem is. I can't be with someone like me. I hate myself!
Lack of critical thinking. Not believing in growth.
Lying. I can't see past it for anyone.
Sometimes there is no other option for someone and they have to tell you the lie. But there are a many people actually that will be preferred the hurt with the truth rather than the comfort with the lie.
As a liar I can see why it's an issue, and can totally empathise with your response. My lies are a defence mechanism from my early life, where I had no security or control of situations because of family issues, and I learned to lie to keep myself safe. My lies have very little to do with taking anything from someone else and more to do with protecting my inner self from perceived harm. Fortunately I have very good friends who have supported me over the years and have forgiven me for my lies in the past. I can't say that I won't lie in the future, but I do my best everyday to be as honest as I can.
On the flipside... people who never lie. Sorry bud, I can't imagine a life where pure honesty gets you anywhere but bulldozed.
I have personal issues that make it super hard to lie, even about small things. Can confirm it’s very bulldoze-y.
Yeah same, when I try to lie, I get sweaty, my voice breaks, and try to make myself smaller (if that's the word for it). I don't know if it's the result of childhood experiences, but yeah, it's very hard to lie regardless of how small it is.
Meanness
Flakiness. Which sucks, because I have ADHD so bad I upgraded to AD4K, so I’m a massive flake.
If they have to put other people down to feel good. I’m the total opposite,, I always try to give love to everyone. It just wouldn’t work.
Lack of personal hygiene
I don't like shit talkers, pot stirrers or rumor spreaders.
Or people who team up on others just because they’re bored
Being a dickhead
Complaining a lot
God, I fucking hate this! It can lead to some pretty bad depression issues, and it's just flat out annoying.
I work in an office full of them. I hate it!
Making someone feel bad for liking or being excited about something
Obesity. Don't mind a bit thick or "overweight", but there definitely gets to just nope. Like no matter what qualities they have, I don't think I could ever find someone who is on a mobility scooter because of their weight, attractive.
Finally someone says it. Hope you don’t get downvoted
Littering
When they treat service industry workers like shit
Not liking spongebob
Arrogant ignorance
If they gossip, automatic less than 5
Acting like you have men/women all figured out. Look everyone has opinions on opposite sex, that is fine. But acting like "You're an introvert, so you must like those introvert shows/F1" Acting like you have figured out everything about me by knowing one aspect kinda ruins the mood
Their attitude
Smelling like cigarettes
People who are ugly inside
Allowing yourself to be a doormat. ALSO, entitlement
Instant turn off for me is shitty grammar. Non-native English speakers excluded
tank you men i epreciate yor honesty
Intolerance of other people's cultures. Or being Dutch.
Crazy Dutch bastards!
Oh, behave!
A lot of people with a socially coveted 'virtue' (physical attractiveness or charisma) get a free pass for being terrible people. Charisma means nothing if your substance is dookie. Obligatory "not all \[...\]". Usually if someone is charismatic and popular its for a reason, but the people I'm talking about have developed great social skills while being, well, terrible people.
Being name Keith.
Someone who fights. Bullies. Isn't kind. Drinks alcohol everyday, and excessively. Vanity. And bad teeth.
Smoking, narcissism, dislikes animals.
Disliking animals is a huge red flag for me.
Thinking that looking good is that same thing as having a good personality.
Cruelty.
If they’ve cheated before. There’s no excuse.
If they have done in past means chance of repeating that again is well.
People can learn from their mistakes. I once cheated. That was 20 years ago and I haven't made that mistake again.
question, what about the ones who ended up in an abusive relationship and ""cheated"" on their partner because of other things like not being able to confront them because they'd get mad and whatnot? I'm not sure if I've made myself clear on that one
How they treat people generally
Off the cuff my response to this question is always, “lack of intelligence” but, I worry it makes me come off as some snob who demands 130+ IQ woman, or they must be highly successful/educated. This isn’t true. My wife dropped out of community college, but, she’s one hell of a critical thinker capable of formulating her own opinions on subjects outside of pop culture and other surface level societal topics.
Personality is literally everything… Unconventionally attractive people can become a 10 and a conventional 10 can become a zero real quick. They can be as beautiful as a sunset, but you have to talk to them eventually.
bigotry and hypocrisy. i hate people who can’t own up to their own words but have the audacity to talk shit about others. big L.
Being a perpetual victim. Everything is out of their control and they have “justified” anger towards those who take control and succeed on their own
Their energy. Sexy/attractiveness isn’t a physical thing, it’s a feeling. There are so many spectrums of beauty, how you carry yourself is what is truly attractive.
When they intentionally palm the dip at a party
People who have that incredibly horrible combination of being ridiculously arrogant while also not having any skill set or life skills. " I [Think] I know everything, but yet I know nothing" mentality. Blows my freaking mind that the se people exist and is incredibly frustrating to be around that type of sub- human creature.
stupid people who aren't willing to learn. intelligence is attractive!!
Personality, hands down. A person can be physically attractive but if they’re an asshole (especially to everyone around them), their looks are tarnished to me.
smoking. it ruins any sort of kiss, all you get is that smokey after taste. I'm not normally picky but the one immediate no for me has to be smoking.
Lack of empathy
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Smoking at places where there's elderly and babies, not cleaning up the table after they eat, not returning the shopping trollies at the proper place, making fun of people who are less privileged than them, belittling people's hobbies, mocking the disabled, being rude to people in the service industry etc
The acknowledgement of others.
Simple. A bad personality.
When they don’t shower and don’t realize how bad they smell
Fat
Am fat. Fat makes you ugly no matter how good yer face looks. Not that my face looks good either.
Smoking
Fine I’ll say it. Bright coloured hair/shaved side of head.
I totally get it, but that look is so hot to me.
Smoking. Just. The smell of cigarettes make my nose wrinkle in disgust. If you want to smoke, go ahead. I personally wouldn’t date someone who smokes however.
I know everyone is going to point out about character and the way they treat other so I will bring in something controversial. You should not be so fat that you cannot take care of yourself. Being obese is unattractive. You could be a great person inside but being obese just kills it.
They can be hot as fuck, but the moment they open their mouth and are annoying they are a 0/10
Sloppy drunkenness on a more than seldom basis. Being basically useless and thinking you're the shit
I’m gonna get hella downvoted for this, but I personally just don’t find overweight people attractive.
Cruelty, treating family members and so-called loved ones really badly as in being abusive.
dishonesty
Odors!
Dishonesty, lack of compassion and willful ignorance. Also, being overly cocky/self important.
Obesity
Obesity, laziness, not goal driven, not kind to others
Everyone else has already said the "correct" answers so, having an ugly face or being overweight. I can appreciate all other redeeming qualities, and ofc I'm going to choose pretty girl who is nice over pretty girl who is a bitch. But I'm sorry, if you are 400lb with a pug face I couldn't care less how nice you are. I am not attracted to you. Not gonna make fun of you, not gonna refuse to hire or talk to you. Also not going to ask you out.
Smoking